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[twester]

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There are no jobs. Maybe you'll get lucky and land a pharmacist position - chances are you won't.

Don't assume this kind of debt thinking you'll get lucky. The schools are blowing smoke up your backside. There are no jobs. There are too many pharmacy schools with class sizes that are too large.

Go to medical school. Do what I did and go back to IT. The PharmD is worthless. There are no jobs.

 

[Jibby321]

There are no jobs. Maybe you'll get lucky and land a pharmacist position - chances are you won't.

Don't assume this kind of debt thinking you'll get lucky. The schools are blowing smoke up your backside. There are no jobs. There are too many pharmacy schools with class sizes that are too large.

Go to medical school. Do what I did and go back to IT. The PharmD is worthless. There are no jobs.

Not this again.

 

[AlPacino]

There are no jobs. Maybe you'll get lucky and land a pharmacist position - chances are you won't.

Don't assume this kind of debt thinking you'll get lucky. The schools are blowing smoke up your backside. There are no jobs. There are too many pharmacy schools with class sizes that are too large.

Go to medical school. Do what I did and go back to IT. The PharmD is worthless. There are no jobs.

 

[Integral7]

There are no jobs. Maybe you'll get lucky and land a pharmacist position - chances are you won't.

Don't assume this kind of debt thinking you'll get lucky. The schools are blowing smoke up your backside. There are no jobs. There are too many pharmacy schools with class sizes that are too large.

Go to medical school. Do what I did and go back to IT. The PharmD is worthless. There are no jobs.

Should I be taking this with a grain of salt? Where are your sources?

 

[PharmLife4Me]

There are no jobs. Maybe you'll get lucky and land a pharmacist position - chances are you won't.

Don't assume this kind of debt thinking you'll get lucky. The schools are blowing smoke up your backside. There are no jobs. There are too many pharmacy schools with class sizes that are too large.

Go to medical school. Do what I did and go back to IT. The PharmD is worthless. There are no jobs.

As long as there are old men needing viagra, there will be plenty of jobs for pharmacist.

 

[Corpseman]

There are no jobs. Maybe you'll get lucky and land a pharmacist position - chances are you won't.

Don't assume this kind of debt thinking you'll get lucky. The schools are blowing smoke up your backside. There are no jobs. There are too many pharmacy schools with class sizes that are too large.

Go to medical school. Do what I did and go back to IT. The PharmD is worthless. There are no jobs.

90% unemployment rate, amirite?

 

[714]

better just close up shop here. we won't need the pharmacy section of these boards anymore. do away with them admin.

 

[owlegrad]

better just close up shop here. we won't need the pharmacy section of these boards anymore. do away with them admin.

Hey I don't need anyone getting any ideas here!

 

[radio frequency]

No jobs is overblown, but there is truth behind it.

If I was heading to school soon, I would really want to read this article before jumping in. It's put out by the journal for ACPE, which accredits pharmacy schools:

A Looming Joblessness Crisis for New Pharmacy Graduates and the Implications It Holds for the Academy

Daniel L. Brown, PharmD

American Journal of Pharmaceutical Education

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3687123/

 

[rxtech2012]

There are no jobs. Maybe you'll get lucky and land a pharmacist position - chances are you won't.

Don't assume this kind of debt thinking you'll get lucky. The schools are blowing smoke up your backside. There are no jobs. There are too many pharmacy schools with class sizes that are too large.

Go to medical school. Do what I did and go back to IT. The PharmD is worthless. There are no jobs.

Awe, I'm sorry you didn't find that unicorn "clinical" pharmacist job you were promised in school. I wouldn't say medicine has "greener" grass.

 

[Sugoi Travis]

I swear with these kinds of threads popping up like weeds, the "there are no jobs" saying is going to turn into some form of meme here on the forums.

 

[radio frequency]

Clearly the students posting here aren't looking far into this. You should be scared. That's not to say you won't find a job; you may even find your dream job. But it's looking like more and more of a gamble, especially as tuition rises further toward fantasy-land.

My advice? Keep both eyes open when/if you make the jump.

 

[PharmLife4Me]

Or, just move to the south area.. From what I hear the east is "saturated" but down here there are MULTIPLE job openings and employers are dying for pharmacist because of the huge shortage.. My friend just graduated from Minnesota, came down here and applied, got a job with 115k a year starting out and a $25,000 signing bonus for 5 years (and knew absolutely nobody).. I would be VERY scared of becoming a pharmacist with this type of horrible job market.

 

[Sugoi Travis]

Clearly the students posting here aren't looking far into this. You should be scared. That's not to say you won't find a job; you may even find your dream job. But it's looking like more and more of a gamble, especially as tuition rises further toward fantasy-land.

My advice? Keep both eyes open when/if you make the jump.

Honestly, do we need these kinds of posts popping up every other freaking day? It's not so much that we're not "looking far into this" but more of a "omg not this thread again..."

I feel that I'm echoing a few other pre-pharmers when I say that we get it; pharmacy is in a bad position right now. I already got the message a month after I made my account and I'm sure other people have caught onto the idea already.

Seriously, we don't need a weekly reminder that we should get the hell out of the field. It's ridiculous to the point that it's almost amusing to see such threads come up.

I'm going to say this again: I, as well as a few other pre-pharmers, ALREADY GET THE IDEA that pharmacy is not what it used to be. I hope this makes a few people sleep better at night knowing that soon-to-be pharmacy students are aware of the reality of the field.

 

[Sugoi Travis]

-

 

[smercer]

Honestly, do we need these kinds of posts popping up every other freaking day? It's not so much that we're not "looking far into this" but more of a "omg not this thread again..."

I feel that I'm echoing a few other pre-pharmers when I say that we get it; pharmacy is in a bad position right now. I already got the message a month after I made my account and I'm sure other people have caught onto the idea already.

Seriously, we don't need a weekly reminder that we should get the hell out of the field. It's ridiculous to the point that it's almost amusing to see such threads come up.

I'm going to say this again: I, as well as a few other pre-pharmers, ALREADY GET THE IDEA that pharmacy is not what it used to be. I hope this makes a few people sleep better at night knowing that soon-to-be pharmacy students are aware of the reality of the field.

When I started visiting this thread a few years ago the posts were mostly useful and seemed to be about either random stuff (ie sports, cars, life in general) or actual useful pharmacy topics. Now, however, there are only a few threads about either of those and pretty much every other thread either bashes pre-pharms for wanting to do pharmacy or complainins about a lack of jobs/saturation.

I used to enjoy coming here and reading the posts, as I often got a good laugh or felt that I learned a bit more about the profession. Now when I come here I just skim the list of topics and see the same few posters saying the same thing over and over.

I am definitely gald that there are people who want to come here and be honest about how they veiw the profession, but we really do not need 2 new threads a day saying the exact same thing, just in different words.

 

[PharmLife4Me]

Maybe all of these threads are just applicants trying to use reverse psychology to get less people to pursue pharmacy school to increase their chances of getting in! O.O

Then again, I could be wrong haha.

 

[technician107]

When I started visiting this thread a few years ago the posts were mostly useful and seemed to be about either random stuff (ie sports, cars, life in general) or actual useful pharmacy topics. Now, however, there are only a few threads about either of those and pretty much every other thread either bashes pre-pharms for wanting to do pharmacy or complainins about a lack of jobs/saturation.

I used to enjoy coming here and reading the posts, as I often got a good laugh or felt that I learned a bit more about the profession. Now when I come here I just skim the list of topics and see the same few posters saying the same thing over and over.

I am definitely gald that there are people who want to come here and be honest about how they veiw the profession, but we really do not need 2 new threads a day saying the exact same thing, just in different words.

Agreed.

 

[radio frequency]

Seriously doods...reading comprehension, s'il vous plait.

I never said get out of the field. Only be aware and watch out for yourself. Additionally, do read the article posted above. It's actually really good and might help you figure out your own plans better if you choose to go down this road. It was just published in June, so it's nice and current.

 

[Sugoi Travis]

Seriously doods...reading comprehension, s'il vous plait.

I never said get out of the field. Only be aware and watch out for yourself. Additionally, do read the article posted above. It's actually really good and might help you figure out your own plans better if you choose to go down this road. It was just published in June, so it's nice and current.

You misunderstood me. I was referring to select people on the forums telling pre-pharmers to get out of the field. I was not even remotely targeting you with that comment.

 

[Angela1234]

Like PT Barnum said, there's a sucker born every minute. None of the pharmacy schools have to guarantee that you'll find a job afterwards, they just want your money! The best source of finding out how awful the job market is is to ask the job recruiters, etc. In fact, ask the recent graduates. I wish I would have known, I would have never majored in it. Pharmacists were in demand back in 2002 when I went to school.

Whatever, nomad339, had someone been kind enough to warn me about the job market like this, I would not have become a pharmacist. There are plenty of people I have spoken to who graduated this year without work, and believe it or not, some of the people who found work had to move thousands of miles away and be miserable. I don't care what you do with your money, nomad 339, as long as I don't have to be you.

I also wanted to add how much I dislike being online and even having time to read these forums. I would not even be online if I weren't busy scrambling trying to find phone numbers of places to call in vain that aren't even hiring. Of course I would rather be out working trying to pay back my loans and pay my rent rather than read people like nomad339's nonsense.

 

[nomad339]

Like PT Barnum said, there's a sucker born every minute. None of the pharmacy schools have to guarantee that you'll find a job afterwards, they just want your money! The best source of finding out how awful the job market is is to ask the job recruiters, etc. In fact, ask the recent graduates. I wish I would have known, I would have never majored in it. Pharmacists were in demand back in 2002 when I went to school.

Does any graduate program guarantee this? 🙄

EDIT: I promised myself I would stop responding to these types of threads, but I have seen you vent on here several times. I'm sorry you have been out of school for a decade and still have yet to solidify your career. I can tell you though (with confidence) that this is not the norm.

 

[297point1]

No jobs is overblown, but there is truth behind it.

If I was heading to school soon, I would really want to read this article before jumping in. It's put out by the journal for ACPE, which accredits pharmacy schools:

A Looming Joblessness Crisis for New Pharmacy Graduates and the Implications It Holds for the Academy

Daniel L. Brown, PharmD

American Journal of Pharmaceutical Education

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3687123/

Seriously doods...reading comprehension, s'il vous plait.

Reading comprehension, you say? I can't tell if you are a student or not, so I'll be nice. But AJPE is put out by AACP, not ACPE.

 

[Viccij01]

Seriously doods...reading comprehension, s'il vous plait.

I never said get out of the field. Only be aware and watch out for yourself. Additionally, do read the article posted above. It's actually really good and might help you figure out your own plans better if you choose to go down this road. It was just published in June, so it's nice and current.

I have read the article and it is a more in-depth look at what's going in the pharmacy job market right now. The only problem is that the over-saturation is happening in every field... nursing, rt, and so on.... I work in a very well known hospital and yes there were pharmacy interns that graduated from area schools that were not granted a job after interning for a number of years due to the fact that there were not enough FTE's, but that's life, some of them went off into retail as a result. The other side to this is there were nursing students that also worked in our pharmacy who did not receive offers after graduating either... why not enough FTE's and too many schools, that's just the way things are right now. The baby boomers are living longer and still working, that's another reason there isn't this great influx of jobs. I thought about going to med school,but I'm too old and is willing to take my chances with pharmacy, its not about the money. I actually like the role of the clinical pharmacist, which does not entail just looking at a screen and making sure the pill in the bottle looks the same.

 

[BMBiology]

Honestly, do we need these kinds of posts popping up every other freaking day? It's not so much that we're not "looking far into this" but more of a "omg not this thread again..."

I feel that I'm echoing a few other pre-pharmers when I say that we get it; pharmacy is in a bad position right now. I already got the message a month after I made my account and I'm sure other people have caught onto the idea already.

Seriously, we don't need a weekly reminder that we should get the hell out of the field. It's ridiculous to the point that it's almost amusing to see such threads come up.

I'm going to say this again: I, as well as a few other pre-pharmers, ALREADY GET THE IDEA that pharmacy is not what it used to be. I hope this makes a few people sleep better at night knowing that soon-to-be pharmacy students are aware of the reality of the field.

The job market should be discussed every day on this forum. It doesn't if it
is being discussed in a new thread or an old thread. It needs to be mentioned daily. That is how important this topic is to the profession. When there is a lack of job (note I used the word "lack", not "no job"), it doesn't matter if you worked your butt off, networked every single waking hour, graduated in the top of your class, worked as a tech and intern for the last 8 years, the odd is against you.

It doesn't matter to me if you decide to pursue pharmacy or not. It is obviously a personal decision and based on your options in life (or the lack of them). It also doesn't matter to me whether you read these threads or not but you shouldn't discourage others from posting about this topic. If threads like these bother so much then I can only imagine how you would do when it is time for you look for a pharmacist position.

You don't know how scary it is to graduate with 250 k student loan plus 6.8-7.9% annual interest and can't find a job. Fear is the word that describes it well.

 

[BMBiology]

The only problem is that the over-saturation is happening in every field... nursing, rt, and so on...

All due respect but so what if nurses can't find a job? What does that have to do with pharmacists? If anything their struggle is just another cautionary take

 

[Viccij01]

No respect is lost but I simply made the statement to point out that in almost every aspect of the medical field people are having difficulty finding a job....pharmacy is not the only department having the problem .... sorry you did not see the initial connection

 

[radio frequency]

Reading comprehension, you say? I can't tell if you are a student or not, so I'll be nice. But AJPE is put out by AACP, not ACPE.

Sorry; wrong acronym. You are correct. I'm not in the education field so somewhat far away from that journal.

 

[Sugoi Travis]

The job market should be discussed every day on this forum. It doesn't if it
is being discussed in a new thread or an old thread. It needs to be mentioned daily. That is how important this topic is to the profession. When there is a lack of job (note I used the word "lack", not "no job"), it doesn't matter if you worked your butt off, networked every single waking hour, graduated in the top of your class, worked as a tech and intern for the last 8 years, the odd is against you.

It doesn't matter to me if you decide to pursue pharmacy or not. It is obviously a personal decision and based on your options in life (or the lack of them). It also doesn't matter to me whether you read these threads or not but you shouldn't discourage others from posting about this topic. If threads like these bother so much then I can only imagine how you would do when it is time for you look for a pharmacist position.

You don't know how scary it is to graduate with 250 k student loan plus 6.8-7.9% annual interest and can't find a job. Fear is the word that describes it well.

I don't have a problem with people discussing the job market in a realistic way. However, when you get the same 5-10 people spouting the same thing over and over again about how the armageddon of pharmacy is here and that this is the end and run for your lives, then it gets old, very fast. I am more than willing to understand that these people have a reason to rag on pharmacy, but seriously...to say that there are no jobs is far-fetched. Like I said earlier, I have absolutely no problem with people making threads and discussing the job market in a realistic way. However, when I read forum posts and get the impression that 50-90% of future PharmD graduates will be jobless for an extended amount of time, then I become somewhat skeptical.

Give us a realistic viewpoint of what the hell is going on and I will shut up for good. I don't consider it realistic when a person has to say "there are no jobs" three times in a single post. I haven't posted much in the Pharmacy forum, but I have requested on two occasions for someone to give me a realistic viewpoint of pharmacy. Is that too much to ask?

If threads like these bother so much then I can only imagine how you would do when it is time for you look for a pharmacist position.

Trust me; threads like these do not bother me at all when you compare it to what I've been dealing with for the past 9 years.

 

[foreverstud]

if theres no job for pharmacy, then theres no jobs for MD as well. shouldn't be that much of a difference

 

[Seahawksfan87]

it seems to me that the message boils down to this: there will be jobs for pharmacy, but prepare to move far away and quite possibly to an undesirable location. If you already plan on working in, say, the rural midwest, then go for it.

 

[rph3664]

if theres no job for pharmacy, then theres no jobs for MD as well. shouldn't be that much of a difference

However, an MD can hang out a shingle and see patients pretty much anywhere, and even hang a poster in the waiting room with a list of all their fees (yes, there are doctors who do this). It's not so simple for a pharmacist.

And if you think it's hard for a new grad to find a pharmacy job, try getting one with a BS and 20 years' experience. Ask me how I know this, and why I decided to retire (although I do plan to keep my licenses).

 

[AlPacino]

However, an MD can hang out a shingle and see patients pretty much anywhere, and even hang a poster in the waiting room with a list of all their fees (yes, there are doctors who do this). It's not so simple for a pharmacist.

And if you think it's hard for a new grad to find a pharmacy job, try getting one with a BS and 20 years' experience. Ask me how I know this, and why I decided to retire (although I do plan to keep my licenses).

Its not because you got PharmDs coming out that are 20 years younger, can work longer hours, and will take less pay?

 

[rph3664]

Its not because you got PharmDs coming out that are 20 years younger, can work longer hours, and will take less pay?

On top of it, a shocking number of them are coming out of school with NO job experience of any kind, so employers know they can dink them around in ways they can't with more experienced people. 🙄

 

[Angela1234]

Just posted this on another thread in the Pharmacy Forum about how a recent graduate could not find a pharmacist job. I'm more concerned with myself finding a job rather than telling people not to go to pharmacy school at this point. People are going to do what they want to do, regardless of what you tell them.

Rph3664, employers can also make the wages as low as possible for the new grads and other people knowing that people are stuck. Once I found an ad posted online where a guy was looking to hire someone for an independent pharmacy he started and was paying $40,000 for the year. He said he was paying the same as a residency.

 

[half life]

twester

As your status reads "pharmacist", I was wondering if you are practicing pharmacy in any capacity (per diem, contract, et al), or are you strictly doing IT work at the moment?

If I remember correctly from some years-old threads (lurked for some time prior to joining), your work search at the time was limited to a few hours' radius around Denver. Has that changed?

 

[rxtech2012]

All due respect but so what if nurses can't find a job? What does that have to do with pharmacists? If anything their struggle is just another cautionary take

BMB-what's your take on the Texas job market?

 

[BMBiology]

It doesn't matter. Everywhere will be saturated within a couple of years.

New grads are starting to realize that they need to move for a job and soon, they will. Student loan repayment will start soon.

 

[BMBiology]

However, when I read forum posts and get the impression that 50-90% of future PharmD graduates will be jobless for an extended amount of time, then I become somewhat skeptical.

This will be the future for new pharmacists.

43% of newly licensed RNs do not have a job within 18 months after graduation:

http://money.cnn.com/2013/01/14/news/economy/nursing-jobs-new-grads/index.html?iid=HP_MPM

At least nurses don't need to borrow 250 k in student loans.

Record number of pharmacy schools (2x as many compared to 10 years ago) + dramatic drop in admissions standards + record number of new graduates = high unemployment. Use your head. It is obvious where the profession is heading.

 

[scienceguy13]

43% of newly licensed RNs do not have a job within 18 months after graduation:

Yeah, in California.... forgot to mention that specific geographic part. Just as everyone forgets to mention on this forum. California, New York, East Coast, and West Coast, all sound saturated. However, as it turns out, there is a magical place in the United States called the Midwest. Is that area completely free of saturation problems? No, not necessarily, but I do think it's better. Mostly because a lot of people are too high and mighty to ever consider leaving their respective areas. I get bummed out by this forum from time to time, but I have to remember it is dependent on where you are, as to how bad your situation might be. For example, my school has a job placement rate in the upper 90's, with starting salaries from 90-130K (excluding residencies). However, a lot of people wouldn't consider the state an extremely desirable place to live. Considering that, I don't see tons of new grads moving into the area. So I don't know... I do think it all varies greatly on geography

 

[Sugoi Travis]

This will be the future for new pharmacists.

43% of newly licensed RNs do not have a job within 18 months after graduation:

http://money.cnn.com/2013/01/14/news/economy/nursing-jobs-new-grads/index.html?iid=HP_MPM

At least nurses don't need to borrow 250 k in student loans.

Record number of pharmacy schools (2x as many compared to 10 years ago) + dramatic drop in admissions standards + record number of new graduates = high unemployment. Use your head. It is obvious where the profession is heading.

You're telling me to use my head when, aside from the link, I already know what you just told me (see bolded part). Like I'm gonna say, again, I already know where pharmacy is headed and it's going in the wrong direction. I am not one of those incoming pharmacy students who thinks that everything is going to be fine and that everyone will be able to find a job after 3-4 years of pharmacy school. I've checked the forums for awhile and I've seen a lot of posts regarding the field and how twisted it has become.

I actually am and have been using my head. Whether you believe this or not is ultimately your choice.

 

[ramizlol]

Alright, pharmacy is bad career path. What is a good health care career to go into..

 

[smercer]

Alright, pharmacy is bad career path. What is a good health care career to go into..

Healthcare is becoming saturated b/c job articles have been telling people to get into all healthcare fields for the last 10-15 years.

 

[Kat3445]

Do you think professional athletes loose sleep over the thousands of other people who are very skilled at the same sport? Do you think the small bakery owner throws in the towel if he hears about an Einstein Bros opening up across town? Do you think the violinist in the symphony sells his instrument when the new 25-year-old prodigy beats him out in a chair challenge?

NO! Because they LOVE what they do!

If you demonstrate such a lack of self-esteem, lack of passion for the field, and lack of flexibility for what field of pharmacy or what state you end up in, then pharmacy isn't for you. You are a gold-digging fad-chaser who happens to be able to pass chemistry classes-- but probably flounders in an interview.

After I was hospitalized and saw the face of death, it was the pharmacist that took the time to patiently answer my questions and listen to my concerns that the doctors and nurses always seemed to busy for. The way she impacted my life in just one meeting gave me the vision that pharmacy is my path. Only time stands between me and that first interview after earning a Pharm.D, and I know in my heart I want this more than any news or even scholarly article can scare me away from.

This is the first and last time I'm going to reply to one of these posts, because it just gets me so worked up every time I see one!

 

[DL44]

Do you think professional athletes loose sleep over the thousands of other people who are very skilled at the same sport? Do you think the small bakery owner throws in the towel if he hears about an Einstein Bros opening up across town? Do you think the violinist in the symphony sells his instrument when the new 25-year-old prodigy beats him out in a chair challenge?

NO! Because they LOVE what they do!

If you demonstrate such a lack of self-esteem, lack of passion for the field, and lack of flexibility for what field of pharmacy or what state you end up in, then pharmacy isn't for you. You are a gold-digging fad-chaser who happens to be able to pass chemistry classes-- but probably flounders in an interview.

After I was hospitalized and saw the face of death, it was the pharmacist that took the time to patiently answer my questions and listen to my concerns that the doctors and nurses always seemed to busy for. The way she impacted my life in just one meeting gave me the vision that pharmacy is my path. Only time stands between me and that first interview after earning a Pharm.D, and I know in my heart I want this more than any news or even scholarly article can scare me away from.

This is the first and last time I'm going to reply to one of these posts, because it just gets me so worked up every time I see one!

I'm saying man. I was discussing this with my roommate. I got pretty scared after reading all of these posts about our field. You have to do what makes you happy. I'm sticking with Pharmacy because that's what I want to do. With regards to the job market, I'm sure I'll manage just fine when the time comes.

 

[slimcutt]

i swear with these kinds of threads popping up like weeds, the "there are no jobs" saying is going to turn into some form of meme here on the forums.