Sticky Solution

[Yunsang]

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Hey guys, after lurking on these very helpful forums for quite a bit, I decided I wanted to post for some help/advice that I could really take into heart from any of you guys. Pre-med's tough, undoubtedly, and I've been deciding that I wanted to switch over to pre-dental sometime soon. As far as I know, requirements are relatively the same so this is pretty much irrelevant to what I wanted to ask about.

I currently have a cGPA (cumulative if that's what the c really does stand for) of 2.421. Bad enough but it unfortunately doesn't tell the whole picture of what's going on. I got a D+ in an intro bio class (physiology) first semester of freshman year, two Cs in cell biology and microbiology respectively, a C- in gen chem I, then a C in gen chem II, and finally a C in organic chemistry I last semester. I'm struggling quite a bit in Orgo II right now and I think I'll probably end up with another C as well by this summer.

Clearly, I'm in a bad spot right now and bitching/whining about it isn't gonna solve anything. One thing that I think strikes odd about me as a candidate though is I'm not your typical science major premedical student, I'm an economics major (or planning on declaring next semester when I'm a junior.) I know I have to retake a lot of these science classes and get As or relatively good grades in them to even have a shot of applying to either medical or dental school but I'm kind of at a loss of what to do because I haven't even scratched some of my economics major requirements as well. Worse, the college (Arts and Sciences) I'm in at my university requires a lot of side liberal arts requirements and language requirements to fulfill as well so I'm not sure when I would have time to retake all these tough science courses and excel in them without having to deal with my economics major requirements as well as my generic college distribution requirements for graduation.

I'm trying to stay positive in spite of my tough situation. For now, I've come to accept that my studying habits are terrible (I don't actively try to study every day, and I'm just cramming instead) and I bought this book to try to fix my studying habits over this summer. Hopefully this book helps some of my very poor study habits. I want to, at the very least, focus on my next year to do well in my physics and organic chemistry lab course so I don't have to worry about retaking any of those. At this point, should I just focus on taking all of these courses in a post-bacc program? It's really hard for me to think I have any chance at all to get into med/dental school now given these science grades, but I refuse to give up. Should I still study for the MCATs/DATs this summer given how little understanding of the subject matter I actually got from my science courses when they were actually supposed to help me a great deal on those standardized tests? Sorry for the long post, I'm just a bit confused as to what my next course of action should be and when I can retake these courses again. It's clear that I obviously can't apply in time for the 2014-2015 cycle since I don't have the right GPA. Any advice/suggestions is greatly, greatly appreciated.

Thanks.

 

[sinombre]

It seems you've already identified your biggest problem: you cram for tests. Before you do anything else, you have to learn how to study effectively. It isn't worthwhile for you to plan on studying for any standardized test until that happens. Unfortunately, you've already more or less proven to anyone on an admissions committee that you don't possess the capacity to succeed academically--it's going to take some serious work to undo the damage you've done.

 

[Yunsang]

It seems you've already identified your biggest problem: you cram for tests. Before you do anything else, you have to learn how to study effectively. It isn't worthwhile for you to plan on studying for any standardized test until that happens. Unfortunately, you've already more or less proven to anyone on an admissions committee that you don't possess the capacity to succeed academically--it's going to take some serious work to undo the damage you've done.

Thank you very much for your reply. I did excellent in high school (was a top 5 student), but that really doesn't matter since high school is a lot easier than college is. I do need to change up my study habits. I'm willing to put in the time and hard work to change everything though, what do you think, for now, my next course of action should be? Should I just focus on getting back good study habits this summer?

 

[sinombre]

Thank you very much for your reply. I did excellent in high school (was a top 5 student), but that really doesn't matter since high school is a lot easier than college is. I do need to change up my study habits. I'm willing to put in the time and hard work to change everything though, what do you think, for now, my next course of action should be? Should I just focus on getting back good study habits this summer?

Yeah, focus on getting them back right now. This really isn't a complicated issue--you need to study more frequently. Come up with a study schedule and go spend some time in the library every day. If you put in the time, you'll see the results.

 

[candbgirl]

Go be an Econ major and forget about medical/dental school for now. You have dug yourself a huge hole and I personally don't see any easy way out. After you graduate you can reassess your desires to pursue something in the medical field. But first you have to learn how to study effectively or you wont be successful in Econ either.

 

[DrEnderW]

I second sinombre. It wasn't uncommon for me to study 20 hours for some tests -- try putting in some substantial time and see where that gets you.

Who knows if med school will be out of the question until you have a final GPA, MCAT, and ECs all finalized. However, no matter what happens, turning your grades around will only be beneficial.

 

[cerno]

You'll need to do some serious climbing to get out of the hole you've dug. A couple years off including a post-bac comes to mind.

 

[medoc4]

Allopathic would be virtually impossible for you. Osteopathic grade replacement may be an option to consider.

 

[Yunsang]

Thanks guys, I guess my best options right now are to continue taking my Econ/Premed classes, at least the ones that are left and do well in them, then try to find time in my senior year to squeeze in retakes if I can. Definitely don't wanna give up though, I still have faith in myself.

 

[Lollygag]

Do you go to a top university or a university known for being substantially difficult? It sounds really insane that a top 5 student in high school would struggle so much, yea high school is different but not that different.

I agree with another poster and I want to reiterate this to you as well as I wish somebody had told me this 2 years ago. Focus on Econ and just give the sciences a break for some time. Concentrate on the requirements for your econ and general education classes and then once that is completed either stay an extra 2 years at your school or do an SMP, post bacc or something of that sort to work on the pre-med requirements. I think that if you tried to do both at the same time, then you will overwhelm yourself and it will most likely end bad due to your history. Taking your focus off of pre-med/pre-dental for some time will give you a chance to do some soul searching, identify the issues you have with studying, and even leave you some extra personal time to get involved in extracurricular's/shadow docs etc that you most likely wouldn't have time for if you jam pack your schedule with Econ, pre-med classes and general education classes.

Also, the fact that you still have a lot of Econ credits and other requirements to complete by your school may not be such a bad thing. It is likely that these classes will be easier than the sciences classes you've taken and with better study habits you can use those classes to raise your GPA. I see that as good news for you! If you were a senior graduating this year with a 2.94 then yes, you'd be really really screwed, but you have several more classes to go-- this is your second chance!

 

[Yunsang]

Do you go to a top university or a university known for being substantially difficult? It sounds really insane that a top 5 student in high school would struggle so much, yea high school is different but not that different.

I agree with another poster and I want to reiterate this to you as well as I wish somebody had told me this 2 years ago. Focus on Econ and just give the sciences a break for some time. Concentrate on the requirements for your econ and general education classes and then once that is completed either stay an extra 2 years at your school or do an SMP, post bacc or something of that sort to work on the pre-med requirements. I think that if you tried to do both at the same time, then you will overwhelm yourself and it will most likely end bad due to your history. Taking your focus off of pre-med/pre-dental for some time will give you a chance to do some soul searching, identify the issues you have with studying, and even leave you some extra personal time to get involved in extracurricular's/shadow docs etc that you most likely wouldn't have time for if you jam pack your schedule with Econ, pre-med classes and general education classes.

Also, the fact that you still have a lot of Econ credits and other requirements to complete by your school may not be such a bad thing. It is likely that these classes will be easier than the sciences classes you've taken and with better study habits you can use those classes to raise your GPA. I see that as good news for you! If you were a senior graduating this year with a 2.94 then yes, you'd be really really screwed, but you have several more classes to go-- this is your second chance!

I go to Cornell University so it is definitely challenging being a premed here, but I still think the main fault is within my study habits and how I approached my schoolwork here. Very interesting solution you offered here, I may go through with this because it's been such a struggle getting everything under control while trying to maintain a high GPA. I'm actually thinking about going with Physics for now next semester for a bit and if it's too overwhelming and I feel like I can't do well in it, dropping it.

I have two questions though. I know that most of these post-baccalaureate or special programs for completing medical/dental school requirements are notorious for not offering financial aid. I'm not exactly from a well-off family so financial issues have always been something that I have had to worry about. Can I delay repaying the loans that I probably have to borrow to finance these special programs until say... when I actually start working? I know it's really far off in the future that I'm thinking here but it's something I'm curious about. That's the first question. The second is... what happens if I don't get accepted to any of these special programs? Do I take gap years to try to apply to them again? What exactly do I do in those gap years? Build clinical experience? Try to land a job? I don't really want to think about myself being in that situation, but with the grades I have now, it just might become a reality and I'm worried sick of what I'm going to 🙁

 

[candbgirl]

You shouldn't be worrying about what is going to happen 4-5 years down the road. Get yourself together. Figure out what you need to do to study more effectively. Make the changes to your life style that will help you to be a more successful student. Have you met with a counselor at Cornell? Maybe you should so you can have some support to get you through the next few months/years. You at least know there is a problem, you have a good idea of what you need to do to solve it and unlike many on SDN you are accepting responsibility for your predicament. I do hope you will keep us posted over the next few years to see how this whole thing plays out.

 

[Lollygag]

You shouldn't be worrying about what is going to happen 4-5 years down the road. Get yourself together. Figure out what you need to do to study more effectively. Make the changes to your life style that will help you to be a more successful student. Have you met with a counselor at Cornell? Maybe you should so you can have some support to get you through the next few months/years. You at least know there is a problem, you have a good idea of what you need to do to solve it and unlike many on SDN you are accepting responsibility for your predicament. I do hope you will keep us posted over the next few years to see how this whole thing plays out.

Except the OP is coming from a top ivy league school which = very expensive so while I agree they shouldn't obsess over 4-5 years down the road (because things do change), I don't think OP should be ignorant of what their final decision will mean for them financially.

I go to Cornell University so it is definitely challenging being a premed here, but I still think the main fault is within my study habits and how I approached my schoolwork here. Very interesting solution you offered here, I may go through with this because it's been such a struggle getting everything under control while trying to maintain a high GPA. I'm actually thinking about going with Physics for now next semester for a bit and if it's too overwhelming and I feel like I can't do well in it, dropping it.

I have two questions though. I know that most of these post-baccalaureate or special programs for completing medical/dental school requirements are notorious for not offering financial aid. I'm not exactly from a well-off family so financial issues have always been something that I have had to worry about. Can I delay repaying the loans that I probably have to borrow to finance these special programs until say... when I actually start working? I know it's really far off in the future that I'm thinking here but it's something I'm curious about. That's the first question. The second is... what happens if I don't get accepted to any of these special programs? Do I take gap years to try to apply to them again? What exactly do I do in those gap years? Build clinical experience? Try to land a job? I don't really want to think about myself being in that situation, but with the grades I have now, it just might become a reality and I'm worried sick of what I'm going to 🙁

I actually don't know how the financial aid/loan repayment stuff works, I'm completely ignorant when it comes to that stuff, but I think there is a designated SMP, post bacc section of SDN. I've never ventured there so I don't know exactly where it is, if I find it I'll post! But I think they would be the best people to ask regarding your financial situation.

And regarding whether you would get in or not I think you need a 3.0+ so really, if you just work your butt off the rest of the time you're in college, hopefully you can even pull a GPA higher than that by the time you graduate so I think you have a decent shot at getting in. (not an expert though so do some research!)

And if for some reason you don't get in, then you could spend that time doing whatever you want, as long as it's profitable. Maybe just get a regular full time job to pay the bills and volunteer/shadow on the side; especially since you're coming from Cornell I would think you could land a pretty decent paying job. Or you could spend that year just fully immersing yourself in extracurricular's to build your resume with volunteering/shadowing. Maybe even take the MCAT during that time; even with time removed from pre-med classes, a year is more than enough time to re-learn the material and take the MCAT; in reality you could do it in 4 months.

There is a ton of stuff you could spend that year doing and ADCOM's love diversity so even if it's not directly related to medicine, as long as it makes you interesting and you can speak about how it will make you a better doctor then it should be fine. But getting into an SMP right after college would be ideal just so you can get on with your life. Something else you could consider is just going to grad school for biology and look for a GA or community director position that pays for grad school to relieve the financial burden. I have heard however, that there is grade inflation with grad school and it isn't always the best option but nonetheless, it's something worth looking into if finances become a big issue.

 

[Lollygag]

Found this, but it's a thread, I'm sure theres a way to get to the actual forum from here but it looks like this answers a lot of the basic questions you may have about SMP's

http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showthread.php?t=346106

 

[SpaceyWacey]

Also, what has changed between high school and college? I generally feel that those who do well in high school at least do average in college. What other habits of yours have changed? Instead of taking a relaxing weekend off do you go party instead (nothing wrong with that if you do). I'm just saying that you should also assess what helped you succeed in high school and try to replicate those results. Good luck to you!

 

[survivordo]

Seems like you're looking for the easy way out considering you purchased a book titled "how to score higher while studying less". Here's my advice, forget that shiz. There are no shortcuts in life, especially medical school. There comes a point in all of our lives when we can no longer get by with just cramming, we actually have to prepare properly. You have reached this point. You need to fix your study habits pronto and then attempt to recover from the damage you have already done.

Survivor DO

 

[Yunsang]

Seems like you're looking for the easy way out considering you purchased a book titled "how to score higher while studying less". Here's my advice, forget that shiz. There are no shortcuts in life, especially medical school. There comes a point in all of our lives when we can no longer get by with just cramming, we actually have to prepare properly. You have reached this point. You need to fix your study habits pronto and then attempt to recover from the damage you have already done.

Survivor DO

Absolutely not. No matter how easy high school was, I took it very seriously and spent my entire time working my ass off so that I can still stand out and not just cruise my way to where I am today. High school's over, but I want to take my life very seriously. I know life's tough, I learn that every day through the lives that my parents have to live every day. The book title, be as it may, has no indication of my intentions. I simply bought that book because it was recommended by several people here (after lurking for a bit) and other forums as a great book for fixing study habits. I seriously do want to
get my problems fixed and grow up. I still feel like a little kid when I feel that my peers around me have already started to mature and take control of their lives. First things first though, my study habits need to be fixed and I'm hoping figure out how to fix them. Reading that book might be definitely beneficial but I definitely am not looking for the easy way out. I realized that life isn't easy no matter what path you take.

 

[Xenops]

Seems like you're looking for the easy way out considering you purchased a book titled "how to score higher while studying less". Here's my advice, forget that shiz. There are no shortcuts in life, especially medical school. There comes a point in all of our lives when we can no longer get by with just cramming, we actually have to prepare properly. You have reached this point. You need to fix your study habits pronto and then attempt to recover from the damage you have already done.

Survivor DO

Kinda harsh, don't cha think?

I actually liked that book, because it provides study commonsense that many of us don't have (like me).