student loans

[bruins2008]

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for those residents about to graduate in a few months, how are yall making the first student loan payment if youre not starting your job right away?

Also, I assume a lot of graduates will owe anywhere from $200-300K in student loans. What are most of you doing in terms of payment plan (how many years, graduated plan, etc)? I

 

[PMPMD]

for those residents about to graduate in a few months, how are yall making the first student loan payment if youre not starting your job right away?

Also, I assume a lot of graduates will owe anywhere from $200-300K in student loans. What are most of you doing in terms of payment plan (how many years, graduated plan, etc)? I

Moonlighting.

 

[kazuma]

Moonlighting.

Anesthesiology or urgent care?

 

[PMPMD]

Anesthesiology

Yes

or urgent care?

 

[cchoukal]

I went into forbearance, which means I didn't have to make payments, but interest accumulated (even on the subsidized). I assume this is still an option? The only criteria for qualifiying for forbearance is being able to say that you are "willing but unable to pay."

Obviously, whether or not the accumulated interest is more of a bother than the monthly payments is an individualized decision, but I have not regretted it.

 

[BLADEMDA]

I went into forbearance, which means I didn't have to make payments, but interest accumulated (even on the subsidized). I assume this is still an option? The only criteria for qualifiying for forbearance is being able to say that you are "willing but unable to pay."

Obviously, whether or not the accumulated interest is more of a bother than the monthly payments is an individualized decision, but I have not regretted it.

Do you qualify for loan forgiveness?

 

[heronmd]

I went into forbearance, which means I didn't have to make payments, but interest accumulated (even on the subsidized). I assume this is still an option? The only criteria for qualifiying for forbearance is being able to say that you are "willing but unable to pay."

Obviously, whether or not the accumulated interest is more of a bother than the monthly payments is an individualized decision, but I have not regretted it.

But did you pay the loan off?

 

[SitraAchra]

Moonlighting for me.

 

[periopdoc]

I went into forbearance, which means I didn't have to make payments, but interest accumulated (even on the subsidized). I assume this is still an option? The only criteria for qualifiying for forbearance is being able to say that you are "willing but unable to pay."

Obviously, whether or not the accumulated interest is more of a bother than the monthly payments is an individualized decision, but I have not regretted it.

I think this option is gone. I tried to go into forbearance again this year, but was not allowed to (no since paying anything on low interest fed loans until higher interest state loans are payed off). Perhaps it is still a short term option, but it appears that the days of perpetual forbearance have concluded.

- pod

 

[cchoukal]

Blade, I don't think I qualify for loan forgiveness (under what program?). The VA has some options for people in certain specialties (all primary care-related, last I checked).

Heron, no I did not. I've been in practice two years now and I pay the bare minimum (25 year fixed) since I have a really low interest rate.

POD, wow, that's a huge drag. So no more forebearance? How in the hell are residents supposed to pay these loans? There are some of these "pay 10% for 10 years" things I've heard lore about but never seen in writing, but beyond that, I can't imagine making the 25 yr fixed payments on a resident's salary.

 

[bullard]

I think this option is gone. I tried to go into forbearance again this year, but was not allowed to (no since paying anything on low interest fed loans until higher interest state loans are payed off). Perhaps it is still a short term option, but it appears that the days of perpetual forbearance have concluded.

- pod

Why would you want to go into/continue forbearance as an attending?

 

[mersault]

Do you qualify for loan forgiveness?

you would qualify for forgiveness if you did the Income Based Return (IBR) AND worked for a 501(c) non-profit for 10 years. Now the good news is that residency counts towards those ten years (so 4-5 years are done that way) but for the remaining 5-6 years you would have to find a non-profit.
I posed the question to the forum a few months ago but it unfortunately was interpreted more as a joke than a serious question, so I'll take advantage of the opportunity here and pose it again: is it possible to work for a 501(c) after residency in anesthesiology? Are the academic jobs out there truly non-profit and employed by the hospital/university, or are they mostly private practice groups contracted to university hospitals?

 

[cchoukal]

Why would you want to go into/continue forbearance as an attending?

If you had an investment opportunity that would yield greater than the interest on your loans.

 

[periopdoc]

My federal loans are just over 2%. My state loans are 7%. Why pay any more than I have to on the lower interest loan until the higher interest loan is payed off?

Of course, since the federal loan is forgiven on my death, I could just forebear forever.

I don't know if it is totally gone or if they just put a time limit on it now. Hope it isn't gone for residents and fellows.

- pod

 

[aneftp]

you would qualify for forgiveness if you did the Income Based Return (IBR) AND worked for a 501(c) non-profit for 10 years. Now the good news is that residency counts towards those ten years (so 4-5 years are done that way) but for the remaining 5-6 years you would have to find a non-profit.
I posed the question to the forum a few months ago but it unfortunately was interpreted more as a joke than a serious question, so I'll take advantage of the opportunity here and pose it again: is it possible to work for a 501(c) after residency in anesthesiology? Are the academic jobs out there truly non-profit and employed by the hospital/university, or are they mostly private practice groups contracted to university hospitals?

Yep, Totally agree with you. People talk about HealthCare reform. But the multi billion dollar trojan horse that was attached to healthcare reform was the Student Loan package.

Who's to say what's 10% of your income after "living costs". For all we know, A ultra luxury car payment plus a mortgage on a house on the Beach. One a $20-30K income per month, you may only be left with say $1000 left. So instead of paying $1200 a month on your student loans. You pay only 10% of what's left of you normal living costs.

So it's begging people to live it up. Why pay $1200 a month when you can live in luxury and have only $1000 left. So that means you end up paying only $100 a month! Milk it for another 5-6 years after residency. Bam that $200K student loan is basically forgiven without you barely paying into it.

The student loan package wasn't passed without much thought how it could be toughly abused by the savvy students.

 

[bullard]

If you had an investment opportunity that would yield greater than the interest on your loans.

Well, sure, but there's no guarantees. I am paying off the small amount of loans I have left at 4.5% ASAP and then will make minimum payments on the rest (the bulk) of my loans since they are approximately 2.8%. Where are you guys getting a guaranteed 3% return on your money? Sign me up!

 

[kazuma]

Yep, Totally agree with you. People talk about HealthCare reform. But the multi billion dollar trojan horse that was attached to healthcare reform was the Student Loan package.

Who's to say what's 10% of your income after "living costs". For all we know, A ultra luxury car payment plus a mortgage on a house on the Beach. One a $20-30K income per month, you may only be left with say $1000 left. So instead of paying $1200 a month on your student loans. You pay only 10% of what's left of you normal living costs.

So it's begging people to live it up. Why pay $1200 a month when you can live in luxury and have only $1000 left. So that means you end up paying only $100 a month! Milk it for another 5-6 years after residency. Bam that $200K student loan is basically forgiven without you barely paying into it.

The student loan package wasn't passed without much thought how it could be toughly abused by the savvy students.

When did they specify 10% after living expenses? Fedloan servicing uses your tax return for determining what your monthly payment will be. I hope I'm wrong, but I wasn't aware that an individual is able to determine how much their living expenses are, then deduct 10% off of what is left over for loan payments.

 

[ashkenazi1234]

They didn't say after living expenses deducted, it is based on tax return. So apparently the "savvy" aren't really savvy at all. Hope the govt doesn't eventually change their mind, or else the savvy will be stuck with all the interest plus all the principal loans plus all the things they wasted money on just to make their living expenses higher. Yup savvy

 

[IgM]

I don't speak legalese, and I am also financially ******ed, so (not kidding) I'm hoping someone can confirm for me what this means:

"Income-based Repayment (IBR): ACA reduces the repayment formula of the Income-Based Repayment (IBR) program from 15 percent of adjusted gross income to 10 percent, as well as reducing the maximum loan repayment duration from 25 years to 20 years before forgiveness. The IBR changes are effective July 1, 2014, and will only apply to new borrowers."
AAMC Source: https://www.aamc.org/advocacy/meded/79048/student_loan_repayment.html

I am going to be a categorical anesthesia intern in 2012 - does this mean that the 20 year repayment thing, and also IBR of 10% will never apply to me?

 

[warriorpoet85]

Forebearance still exists for residents/interns. Directly form my National Student Loan Exit Counseling:

"You must contact your loan holder to request forbearance. Most forbearance is discretionary - it is completely up to your loan holder to grant one. Under certain provisions, loan holders are required to grant forbearance, such as if your student loan payment is greater than 20 percent of monthly income or if you are in an internship or residency."

 

[cchoukal]

I don't speak legalese, and I am also financially ******ed, so (not kidding) I'm hoping someone can confirm for me what this means:

"Income-based Repayment (IBR): ACA reduces the repayment formula of the Income-Based Repayment (IBR) program from 15 percent of adjusted gross income to 10 percent, as well as reducing the maximum loan repayment duration from 25 years to 20 years before forgiveness. The IBR changes are effective July 1, 2014, and will only apply to new borrowers."
AAMC Source: https://www.aamc.org/advocacy/meded/79048/student_loan_repayment.html

I am going to be a categorical anesthesia intern in 2012 - does this mean that the 20 year repayment thing, and also IBR of 10% will never apply to me?

You are correct; this will not apply to you. And even if it did, you'd have to do some math to figure out if it would be the right call anyway. 15% of your AGI in 4 years of residency is really small, but 15% of your AGI for the remaining 16 yrs as an attending is huge and, overall, might exceed what you would've paid by forbearing during training and just paying it off afterward. This should be relatively easy to estimate. Of course, if you went into IBR during medical school...

 

[Coastie]

intership, residency, and fellowship forebearance still exists, as does voluntary forebearance, and hardship forebearance.

Any working doc wont qualify for hardship, but I think you have 60 months of voluntary forebearance, on top of the internship/residency/fellowship.

The interest rate is variable depending on time of disbursement. If after July 2006, its fixed @ 6.8% for federal. If before, it's 91 day t bill plus a small amount, which is around 2.5% total right now.

The low rate is determined each July based on the Tbill auction prices for last Monday of May and is fixed for the following year. This only applies to staffords, both sub and unsub. Now, sub is going away, and most med schools COA is above the stafford limit, so newbies are SCREWED with private loans (plus the increase of all staffords to a fixed level).

For the old guys, like me, there is a cap on the staffords (6.8 or 8.5), but there is also an annual max of rate of increase, such that it cant go from 2.5 to 8.5 in a year ,regardless of the 91 day tbill rate.

So, if hyperinflation hits, my loans will still only rise nominally, and I can invest in a money market, beating out the paltry 4-5% rise on my loans.

Link to sallie mae interest rates: https://www1.salliemae.com/after_gr...loans/repaying-student-loans/interest_fed.htm

 

[JSB235]

You are correct; this will not apply to you. And even if it did, you'd have to do some math to figure out if it would be the right call anyway. 15% of your AGI in 4 years of residency is really small, but 15% of your AGI for the remaining 16 yrs as an attending is huge and, overall, might exceed what you would've paid by forbearing during training and just paying it off afterward. This should be relatively easy to estimate. Of course, if you went into IBR during medical school...

If you go into IBR, you do pay 15% or the difference between your AGI, and the national poverty level. Then as an attending if 15% of your AGI minus the national povertly level is greater than your regular payment, you are just require to pay the regular payment you would have to pay anyways. If you pay more, then you pay down your loan faster. You don't have to pay for 25 years with IBR, that is just the max that you have to pay for. You can always pay it off early. Also if you do IBR the government pays the interest on your loans for the first 3 years. If you can afford to go into IBR as a resident, you will always pay less compared to going into forbearance. The reason why a lot of residents don't want to do IBR is because if you are single with no dependents the monthly payment as an intern will be arond $350 a month doing IBR compared to $0 for forebearance.

 

[cchoukal]

If you go into IBR, you do pay 15% or the difference between your AGI, and the national poverty level. Then as an attending if 15% of your AGI minus the national povertly level is greater than your regular payment, you are just require to pay the regular payment you would have to pay anyways. If you pay more, then you pay down your loan faster. You don't have to pay for 25 years with IBR, that is just the max that you have to pay for. You can always pay it off early. Also if you do IBR the government pays the interest on your loans for the first 3 years. If you can afford to go into IBR as a resident, you will always pay less compared to going into forbearance. The reason why a lot of residents don't want to do IBR is because if you are single with no dependents the monthly payment as an intern will be arond $350 a month doing IBR compared to $0 for forebearance.

Interesting. Thanks for posting this.

 

[Postictal Raiden]

If you go into IBR, you do pay 15% or the difference between your AGI, and the national poverty level. Then as an attending if 15% of your AGI minus the national povertly level is greater than your regular payment, you are just require to pay the regular payment you would have to pay anyways. If you pay more, then you pay down your loan faster. You don't have to pay for 25 years with IBR, that is just the max that you have to pay for. You can always pay it off early. Also if you do IBR the government pays the interest on your loans for the first 3 years. If you can afford to go into IBR as a resident, you will always pay less compared to going into forbearance. The reason why a lot of residents don't want to do IBR is because if you are single with no dependents the monthly payment as an intern will be arond $350 a month doing IBR compared to $0 for forebearance.

What happens to interests accrued during residency? Can someone utilize IBR while in residency, then switch to the traditional 10-year repayment without worrying about the interests accumulated during residency?

 

[mersault]

If you go into IBR, you do pay 15% or the difference between your AGI, and the national poverty level. Then as an attending if 15% of your AGI minus the national povertly level is greater than your regular payment, you are just require to pay the regular payment you would have to pay anyways. If you pay more, then you pay down your loan faster. You don't have to pay for 25 years with IBR, that is just the max that you have to pay for. You can always pay it off early. Also if you do IBR the government pays the interest on your loans for the first 3 years. If you can afford to go into IBR as a resident, you will always pay less compared to going into forbearance. The reason why a lot of residents don't want to do IBR is because if you are single with no dependents the monthly payment as an intern will be arond $350 a month doing IBR compared to $0 for forebearance.

"If you can afford to go into IBR as a resident, you will always pay less compared to going into forbearance." I'm not sure that's entirely accurate. If you go into IBR you cannot target any payments you make in residency towards the higher interest loans (i.e. grad PLUS). So it may be to your advantage to not do IBR, and just pay what you can to get the high interest loans out of the way (as much as possible).

 

[cincincyreds]

I think you guys really should stop worrying about having 300k of debt. Because after residency, you should easily be able to start at 300k/ year. So if you live like a resident for a few years, you should easily be able to pay off the 300k. And if your place lets you work extra, then in your first year, you should easily be able to make 350-400k from what I have seen.

The other side of the coin is what happens when obamacare takes over. If you then only start at 100k, that is a different story entirely.

 

[PinchandBurn]

If you had an investment opportunity that would yield greater than the interest on your loans.

If one has about 200k in loans and now is a first year attending, what would you recommend. My rate is 4.5%, but after 18 ontime payments it goes down to 3.5% (i've done 12 so far).

I''m thinking of paying a lump sum of 15k off sometime in a few weeks, but currently just pay $850/ mo roughly, which is mainly just interest and not principal.

Any recs? Would you pay the lump sum of 15k or just make minimum payments? I've 'lived like a resident' and have a significant saved up (over 90k), but would rather invest it, but dont know in what!! Thoughts?

 

[BLADEMDA]

Borrowing $200K is the easy part. But, paying it back isn't easy or fun. SEVO knows the sacrifice it takes to pay back massive loans. Most here just plan on the 25 year pay back.

 

[JSB235]

"If you can afford to go into IBR as a resident, you will always pay less compared to going into forbearance." I'm not sure that's entirely accurate. If you go into IBR you cannot target any payments you make in residency towards the higher interest loans (i.e. grad PLUS). So it may be to your advantage to not do IBR, and just pay what you can to get the high interest loans out of the way (as much as possible).

It is true that you won't be able to pay off your higher interest rates if you go with IBR since you have to consolidate all your loans. However grad plus is not that much Higher than your typical stafford... 8.5% compared to 6.8%. But 3 extra years of the government paying your interest on $300,000 in loans is quite a bit(That is $61,200 at 6.8 percent). I don't think you are going to save that much by paying the higher loan of first unless the higher loan is at like 13% or more, but then I haven't done all the math so you might be right. I just know I am planning on doing PSLF, so I want to count my residency time towards my 10 years.

 

[JSB235]

What happens to interests accrued during residency? Can someone utilize IBR while in residency, then switch to the traditional 10-year repayment without worrying about the interests accumulated during residency?

You are going to accumulate interest no matter what during residency(except with IBR the government pays the interest on qualifying loans for 3 years). If you go into forbearance, you still accumulate interest and the interest then goes on to the principal, and then you are accumulating interest on interest. You can always switch from IBR to the 10 repayment plan at anytime.

 

[bruins2008]

how much are ya'll paying a month towards student loans?

 

[Per4mer8]

OK so direct from the NSLDS, here is the interest calculation per month

The following formula demonstrates how the simple interest
is calculated between payments​

Average daily balance between payments x
Interest rate x
(Number of days between payments/365.25)= Monthly interest
​

So, lets use a fairly average these days total loan amount of $250,000 at 6.8% (ignoring that the PLUS loan portion is 7.9%):​

$250,000 x .068 x (30/365.25 or .08214) = $1,396.38 per month of acruing interest. You have to make a payment of $1400 per month just to tread water and plan to pay for all eternity. 😱​

 

[Per4mer8]

Thats why IBR is important if you can swing it during residency. Otherwise ~$1400/month is getting tacked on.

 

[Postictal Raiden]

You are going to accumulate interest no matter what during residency(except with IBR the government pays the interest on qualifying loans for 3 years). If you go into forbearance, you still accumulate interest and the interest then goes on to the principal, and then you are accumulating interest on interest. You can always switch from IBR to the 10 repayment plan at anytime.

Thanks.

What happens to the accrued interests under IBR when switching to the 10-year schedule?

I'm asking because I feel it's not financially logical to make the switch if the accrued interest is added to the principle. For example, 300k of debt will accrue over 80k of interests over 4 years in residency. Therefore, by switching to the 10-year plan, one will pay 300k(principle) + 80k(residency interests) + ~150k(interest during the 10 years) = ~530k. In this case, I might as well do a 2-year fellowship, work in academia, and do the 25-year IBR plan. The difference in repayment total would be very marginal considering the length of repayment period and inflation

 

[mersault]

It is true that you won't be able to pay off your higher interest rates if you go with IBR since you have to consolidate all your loans. However grad plus is not that much Higher than your typical stafford... 8.5% compared to 6.8%. But 3 extra years of the government paying your interest on $300,000 in loans is quite a bit(That is $61,200 at 6.8 percent). I don't think you are going to save that much by paying the higher loan of first unless the higher loan is at like 13% or more, but then I haven't done all the math so you might be right. I just know I am planning on doing PSLF, so I want to count my residency time towards my 10 years.

you are right. I have to do the math and see what it comes out too. Regarding IBR, I think the govt only pays 3 years of interest on Stafford Subsidized loans, not on all your (i.e. 300K) loans. So for example in my case, the subsidized stafford loans are really ~40K whereas the bulk is Unsubsidized Stafford loans whose interest the government will NOT cover during those three years.
Regarding PSLF, are you planning on going into anesthesia? The thing is, I'd like to do PSLF too, I just don't know how realistic it is in anesthesia. You see, a lot of students think academia means working for a non-profit, but when it comes to specialties even in academia you often have a private practice group that's contracted with the academic hospital. Now many of those faculty also get a paycheck from the university, but I don't think it's the bulk of their income and am not sure they qualify for PSLF b/c they're not working solely for a 501(c). I don't know, I've posed the question several times already but no one else seems to know either.

 

[Frank Rizzo]

If one has about 200k in loans and now is a first year attending, what would you recommend. My rate is 4.5%, but after 18 ontime payments it goes down to 3.5% (i've done 12 so far).

I''m thinking of paying a lump sum of 15k off sometime in a few weeks, but currently just pay $850/ mo roughly, which is mainly just interest and not principal.

Any recs? Would you pay the lump sum of 15k or just make minimum payments? I've 'lived like a resident' and have a significant saved up (over 90k), but would rather invest it, but dont know in what!! Thoughts?

Debt is anchor. 15K? Pay that **** off.

 

[Frank Rizzo]

Borrowing $200K is the easy part. But, paying it back isn't easy or fun. SEVO knows the sacrifice it takes to pay back massive loans. Most here just plan on the 25 year pay back.

I'm in the minority then... While not as hardcore as SEVO, I've put myself on a 5yr plan to pay off the $170ishK I'm in thw hole for. I'm 3 yrs into it and on schedule. Like somebody said, show me where I can put money right now and be guarunteed 4% return.

 

[Per4mer8]

I'm in the minority then... While not as hardcore as SEVO, I've put myself on a 5yr plan to pay off the $170ishK I'm in thw hole for. I'm 3 yrs into it and on schedule. Like somebody said, show me where I can put money right now and be guarunteed 4% return.

And for all us just getting through med school we would need a guaranteed 8%, minimum. Not happening.

 

[JSB235]

you are right. I have to do the math and see what it comes out too. Regarding IBR, I think the govt only pays 3 years of interest on Stafford Subsidized loans, not on all your (i.e. 300K) loans. So for example in my case, the subsidized stafford loans are really ~40K whereas the bulk is Unsubsidized Stafford loans whose interest the government will NOT cover during those three years.
Regarding PSLF, are you planning on going into anesthesia? The thing is, I'd like to do PSLF too, I just don't know how realistic it is in anesthesia. You see, a lot of students think academia means working for a non-profit, but when it comes to specialties even in academia you often have a private practice group that's contracted with the academic hospital. Now many of those faculty also get a paycheck from the university, but I don't think it's the bulk of their income and am not sure they qualify for PSLF b/c they're not working solely for a 501(c). I don't know, I've posed the question several times already but no one else seems to know either.

I think your right about this thanks for clarifying for everybody.

This is what is says on studentaid.ed.gov with regards to what qualifies for PSLF...

What kinds of employment qualify?
Qualifying employment is any employment that has been designated as tax-exempt 501(c)(3. The type or nature of employment with the organization does not matter for PSLF purposes.
or......
A private non-profit employer that is not a tax-exempt organization under Section 501(c)(3) of the IRC may be a qualifying public service organization if it provides certain specified public services. These services include emergency management, military service, public safety, or law enforcement services; public health services; public education or public library services; school library and other school-based services; public interest law services; early childhood education; public service for individuals with disabilities and the elderly.

I think for anyone going into anesthesia, or any other specialty this is the loop hole that we are all going to be able to fit into. Most academic places provide all types of public service, ie free clinics, free physical, community awarness, etc..and don't forget all the uninsured you will see that you can write off as public service.
But since the first group that will qualify for PSLF won't even come around for another 5-6 years, nobody is really going to know how it will work until them.

 

[mersault]

I think your right about this thanks for clarifying for everybody.

This is what is says on studentaid.ed.gov with regards to what qualifies for PSLF...

What kinds of employment qualify?
Qualifying employment is any employment that has been designated as tax-exempt 501(c)(3. The type or nature of employment with the organization does not matter for PSLF purposes.
or......
A private non-profit employer that is not a tax-exempt organization under Section 501(c)(3) of the IRC may be a qualifying public service organization if it provides certain specified public services. These services include emergency management, military service, public safety, or law enforcement services; public health services; public education or public library services; school library and other school-based services; public interest law services; early childhood education; public service for individuals with disabilities and the elderly.

I think for anyone going into anesthesia, or any other specialty this is the loop hole that we are all going to be able to fit into. Most academic places provide all types of public service, ie free clinics, free physical, community awarness, etc..and don't forget all the uninsured you will see that you can write off as public service.
But since the first group that will qualify for PSLF won't even come around for another 5-6 years, nobody is really going to know how it will work until them.

That is an interesting loop hole, and as you mention we won't know if it's going to work or not for another 5-6 years. Do you think places like Kaiser, Sutter Health, other HMOs would qualify? I'm pretty sure those places are also labeled as non profit.
on the flip side, I'm trying to think of reasons NOT to do IBR, and I can only think of two reasons, so please add to the list if you know of any: 1. you will be COMMITTED to make a monthly payment whereas if you do forbearance during residency and are smart/responsible about it, you can still make the minimum payment you would make under IBR anyway, except there's no commitment so if one month unexpected expenses occur you could not pay.
2. all your payments go towards the "lump sum" large loan that you have, and cannot be targeted towards the higher interest (i.e. Grad PLUS) loans.
So I guess the question becomes: is enrolling in IBR and essentially hoping to get forgiveness ("hoping" since no one seems to know if we will actually qualify or not) worth numbers 1 and 2 as mentioned above?

 

[cchoukal]

I'm in the minority then... While not as hardcore as SEVO, I've put myself on a 5yr plan to pay off the $170ishK I'm in thw hole for. I'm 3 yrs into it and on schedule. Like somebody said, show me where I can put money right now and be guarunteed 4% return.

While there are never any guarantees, I just looked at the March statement from my tax-advantaged managed mutual fund account, and the return for year-to-date was 17%. This isn't some hidden, super secret fund strategy, and my advisors probably aren't the only ones who have heard of it.

That said, obviously everyone feels differently and no one will ever know how it would've turned out if we'd chosen differently (that is, if I had chosen early aggressive payoff or if you hadn't). What's right for you isn't right for everyone, nor is what is right for me (and my loans are at 3.5%, so it's easy for me to gloat).

 

[Frank Rizzo]

While there are never any guarantees, I just looked at the March statement from my tax-advantaged managed mutual fund account, and the return for year-to-date was 17%. This isn't some hidden, super secret fund strategy, and my advisors probably aren't the only ones who have heard of it.

That said, obviously everyone feels differently and no one will ever know how it would've turned out if we'd chosen differently (that is, if I had chosen early aggressive payoff or if you hadn't). What's right for you isn't right for everyone, nor is what is right for me (and my loans are at 3.5%, so it's easy for me to gloat).

Oh, I know. In one of my retirement accounts, the past few quarters have had anywhere from +18% gain to -5% loss. Don't take my stance on debt meaning that I am not investing some also. I try to play both sides a little. 🙂

For me, the key word is "guaranteed." I can't 100% guarantee my return on investments, but I can 100% guarantee that $17 of accruing interest "is capitalized daily" on my loans. Thats over $500/month. F that!

Small house, paid off car, no extravagant trips/purchases... I'm essentially living like a resident. This allows me the freedom to stick to my 5yr plan of paying off loans, while still putting some money in retirement, and funding a nice, liquid FU account. I'm not saying that this is the right or wrong way... its just my way.

 

[ashkenazi1234]

While there are never any guarantees, I just looked at the March statement from my tax-advantaged managed mutual fund account, and the return for year-to-date was 17%. This isn't some hidden, super secret fund strategy, and my advisors probably aren't the only ones who have heard of it.

That said, obviously everyone feels differently and no one will ever know how it would've turned out if we'd chosen differently (that is, if I had chosen early aggressive payoff or if you hadn't). What's right for you isn't right for everyone, nor is what is right for me (and my loans are at 3.5%, so it's easy for me to gloat).

Deja vu to Bernie madoffs fund