Studying Anatomy

[CoachPutMeIn]

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Yes, I know this topic may be over done, but I have a question on two specific books. I have been accepted to osteopathic school for the Fall, and well, as you all know, Anatomy is the first hard hitting class to welcome you in. A friend of mine who is currently in medical school suggested that I take a look at the Board Review Series Anatomy Book and the Netter's Atlas. He told me that it will be hugely beneficial to me when I start class in the Fall.

My question is, for anyone who is familiar with the books, will they help me at all? I haven't taken an Anatomy course at all during my undergraduate career.

 

[spicedmanna]

Yes, I know this topic may be over done, but I have a question on two specific books. I have been accepted to osteopathic school for the Fall, and well, as you all know, Anatomy is the first hard hitting class to welcome you in. A friend of mine who is currently in medical school suggested that I take a look at the Board Review Series Anatomy Book and the Netter's Atlas. He told me that it will be hugely beneficial to me when I start class in the Fall.

My question is, for anyone who is familiar with the books, will they help me at all? I haven't taken an Anatomy course at all during my undergraduate career.

Yeah, the two aforementioned books are helpful. Netter is pretty much the gold standard atlas for gross anatomy. It features a comprehensive volume of artistic sketches in the Netter style. My professors frequently referenced from it and it was our required atlas. I used it a lot, to the point that the book is now falling apart and soaked in formaldehyde. There is certainly variability in anatomical structures, as you will find out, so no atlas is going to cover it all, but I found that Netter tends to take a bit of artistic license with some things. As long as you take that into account, and aren't shocked that structures in your cadavers don't resemble the idealized plates in your Netter atlas, you'll do fine with it. It's not perfect, but it's a good start.

I have BRS Anatomy, but it wasn't that helpful for gross anatomy. It was more helpful for lecture material and tests. It's a nice concise text and it highlights important points. It's no substitute for something like Moore & Dalley, but it's a good supplement.

In addition to the above, I recommend Color Atlas of Anatomy: A Photographic Study of the Human Body, 6th Ed, by Rohen, Yokochi, and Luetjen-Drecoll. The reason I like this atlas is that it has labeled photographs of actual prosected cadavers. It's an excellent resource, especially when you can't get to the lab.

If money isn't a problem, see if you can get your hands on the Robert Acland DVD's. It series of videos developed by a British surgeon who taught anatomy in the states. The quality of this video atlas is amazing. It features beautifully dissected cadavers and the explanations are awesome. I highly recommend it.

No matter which books you use, though, the single most important element to doing well in anatomy is getting your butt down into the lab and spending time drilling your anatomy list with as many different cadavers as you can. You have to spend time in the lab. There's really no substitute for that, in my experience.

 

[CoachPutMeIn]

Thanks for the input!

 

[udsoccer7]

I completely agree with everything Spiced has mentioned.

For Anatomy, I solely used BRS and Netter's. I started off using Moore's Clinical Anatomy, but it took me forever to get through each chapter and I found I was doing just as well if not better by just using the BRS book instead b/c of its condensed format. Now my school also has a good scribe system so I would supplement the BRS with the scribe notes, but overall felt that the BRS w/ Netters was everything I needed.

If you are that interested in getting a head start in Anatomy then the BRS w/ Netters will suffice. As Spiced also mentioned, once school starts the best way to learn Anatomy is by being the lab. I am a very visual learner, so being in the lab and holding each muscle/nerve/artery was very beneficial for me. However, I do know of students who spent little time in the lab and did very well in Anatomy by just studying Rohen's.

You will have to see what works best for your learning modality.

 

[singinfifi]

Never underestimate the importance of a good coloring book.

Seriously.

 

[FlaMedic]

Don't buy Netter's. It is my understanding that if you sign up for SOMA during the first week of school they give you one for free....

At least they have been at West Virginia for several years.....

 

[nevinleiby]

I also heard from a PCOM OMSII that you'll often get a Netter's for free at PCOM, too. I seem to recall that it was given away when you signup for one of the organizations (SOMA or surgery...I don't recall which one)

 

[DiverDoc]

Netters is impressive but ineffective at studying. The diagrams are waaay too busy. I like Gray's and Moore-Dalley.

Bottom Line : There is no substitute for spending time in the lab. You can know it fowards and backwards on a pretty colorful diagram, but if you dont know it on a cadaver...... good luck on practicals.

 

[Semicolon]

You can always get an iphone/ipod touch, jailbreak it, and get all the medical studying tools (Netter's and BRS Anatomy, Neuroscience, Microbio, Infectious Diseases, etc.) for free.

But that's a whole story. 😀

 

[Chocolate Bear]

You can always get an iphone/ipod touch, jailbreak it, and get all the medical studying tools (Netter's and BRS Anatomy, Neuroscience, Microbio, Infectious Diseases, etc.) for free.

But that's a whole story. 😀

If it's not legit, I don't want to hear that story. 😉

 

[Semicolon]

If it's not legit, I don't want to hear that story. 😉

It is; there's no laws against it or anything, at least not yet. I was just suggesting it as a money-saver. I wouldn't post anything that meant trouble, CB. 😉

 

[Chocolate Bear]

It is; there's no laws against it or anything, at least not yet. I was just suggesting it as a money-saver. I wouldn't post anything that meant trouble, CB. 😉

👍

 

[udsoccer7]

I also heard from a PCOM OMSII that you'll often get a Netter's for free at PCOM, too. I seem to recall that it was given away when you signup for one of the organizations (SOMA or surgery...I don't recall which one)

SOMA does give them away when you sign up for their group however, it all depends on when the sign up is. For instance, at PCOM this year, the group sign ups were a week before our first anatomy exam/practical. So, although you get a free Netter's, it wasn't until a week before the test that covered 4 weeks of material. Keep that in mind.

 

[Hokie06]

.

 

[Semicolon]

Don't listen to semicolon he's a hacker trying to bring you down with him!! Trust me, I'm a doctor to be!

 

[MossPoh]

It is; there's no laws against it or anything, at least not yet. I was just suggesting it as a money-saver. I wouldn't post anything that meant trouble, CB. 😉

Actually, it isn't legit. 😉

http://www.copyright.gov/title17/92chap12.html

Jailbreaking is bypassing security but you are also downloading something that would otherwise be purchased. Apple is considering pursuing cases of jailbreaking, but they probably won't. It is the same thing as modding your xbox, but with more contracts involved. Not only can you lose your warranty, but since you are signing a contract with ATT they may have stipulations in there about modifications. (I'm not sure) I unlocked my phone for world travel and mentioned it was unlocked to a guy at the store once and he hinted that it would be unwise to mention that again. 😛

 

[Semicolon]

Actually, it isn't legit. 😉

http://www.copyright.gov/title17/92chap12.html

Jailbreaking is bypassing security but you are also downloading something that would otherwise be purchased. Apple is considering pursuing cases of jailbreaking, but they probably won't. It is the same thing as modding your xbox, but with more contracts involved. Not only can you lose your warranty, but since you are signing a contract with ATT they may have stipulations in there about modifications. (I'm not sure) I unlocked my phone for world travel and mentioned it was unlocked to a guy at the store once and he hinted that it would be unwise to mention that again. 😛

I have experience with the ipod touch personally, but you're right that with the iphone specifically there may be extra legal baggage associated with the phone service. However, jailbreaking is not illegal (and will probably remain as such) and obtaining paid apps for free (or "cracked" apps) is not something I condone; when it comes to cheap 1-2 dollar apps, I don't mind getting them from the app store legitimately, but I was specifically talking about the medical apps that cost about $35. With a cost like that for an app, I felt that it's a bit more justified considering the budget of a med student and the good that these apps would do for one.

Also, while technically you would lose your warranty if they found out, there's absolutely NO way for them to find out you jailbroke it unless you literally showed it to them and went, "see"?". You can ALWAYS use iTunes to restore to an original firmware, and thus erase any and all evidence of tampering. There's no risk.

 

[bleeker10]

I have experience with the ipod touch personally, but you're right that with the iphone specifically there may be extra legal baggage associated with the phone service. However, jailbreaking is not illegal (and will probably remain as such) and obtaining paid apps for free (or "cracked" apps) is not something I condone; when it comes to cheap 1-2 dollar apps, I don't mind getting them from the app store legitimately, but I was specifically talking about the medical apps that cost about $35. With a cost like that for an app, I felt that it's a bit more justified considering the budget of a med student and the good that these apps would do for one.

So do you still "purchase" the apps from the iTunes store for the iPod Touch? I wouldn't care about the warranty because I have a PRP from Best Buy and they will replace it with no problems.

 

[Semicolon]

So do you still "purchase" the apps from the iTunes store for the iPod Touch? I wouldn't care about the warranty because I have a PRP from Best Buy and they will replace it with no problems.

If you're talking about the "cracked" apps, then no you don't; you obtain them through a program you install after jailbreaking that lets you browse and download apps directly to your iphone/ipod touch from a website that uploads the apps. I don't want to advertise this, so you can PM me if you want more info.

 

[bleeker10]

If you're talking about the "cracked" apps, then no you don't; you obtain them through a program you install after jailbreaking that lets you browse and download apps directly to your iphone/ipod touch from a website that uploads the apps. I don't want to advertise this, so you can PM me if you want more info.

Oh ok gotcha. I haven't decided if I am going to do this and I won't pursue this publicly on an internet forum because I don't want to implicate anyone.

 

[MossPoh]

I have experience with the ipod touch personally, but you're right that with the iphone specifically there may be extra legal baggage associated with the phone service. However, jailbreaking is not illegal (and will probably remain as such) and obtaining paid apps for free (or "cracked" apps) is not something I condone; when it comes to cheap 1-2 dollar apps, I don't mind getting them from the app store legitimately, but I was specifically talking about the medical apps that cost about $35. With a cost like that for an app, I felt that it's a bit more justified considering the budget of a med student and the good that these apps would do for one.

Also, while technically you would lose your warranty if they found out, there's absolutely NO way for them to find out you jailbroke it unless you literally showed it to them and went, "see"?". You can ALWAYS use iTunes to restore to an original firmware, and thus erase any and all evidence of tampering. There's no risk.

I actually think jailbreaking is technically illegal. They just don't care to hunt you down about it. As is noted in the DMCA, you are bypassing security functions intended for a specific purpose. Way to justify it though. 😉 I don't personally give a damn, but the topic of jailbreaking and arguing it is for the sake of expensive medical applications for money we don't have doesn't really change things. It is treading a very thin line. People have been sued/arrested for cracking adobe e-reader software, making their DVDs playable on linux and even bypassing the security on a cd to rip it to their computer for personal use. Is it horse crap that they CAN do that? Yes....but they still can and it is probably in the best interest of the site to avoid legal gray areas.

How could they find out (aside from the software you downloaded), well, my friend can tell by the code. He helped create and stitch together the vast majority of the ipod touch and iphone software. It really isn't THAT hard if you are set out to prove it. (Even if you undo it sometimes)

 

[DrMattOglesby]

aside from "jail-breaking"...

I feel comfy with my anatomy skillz because I took a class in undergrad (then later tutored it). Is this comfort giving me false confidence or will it be true that I actually might have it a little easier?

(PS: same scenario for microbio and physio)

 

[J-Rad]

At this point this is going back eight (!) years to anatomy (at UNECOM) for me, but if I had it to do again (I scrimped by, but passed the first time around):

I still don't think "pre"-studying prior to the class would help that much. I would have spent more time in the lab for the lab practical tests. For the didactic tests, I actually found that I did well just reading the chapter in "big" Moore the night before (this is a very poor way of studying though). BUT, looking through "baby" Moore, I think this would have done just as well (and even better without the night-before all-nighters😳). Netter is a decent atlas, but I agree that many (including myself) supplemented with the pictorial Rohen atlas. Netter's strongest suit is in the stylization of the cranial nerve and H&N anatomy but it's weakest point is its extreme over-labeling of almost every image. The visual overcrowding can be a severe detriment to some for studying purposes. I'd get the free Netter from whoever and consider Clemente. Truthfully, both Clemente and Grant's have more "beautiful" (yes, I know, it's subjective) drawings than Netter, but Clemente is the far better in quality IMO. You'll find your own preferences when you start.

 

[Semicolon]

I actually think jailbreaking is technically illegal. They just don't care to hunt you down about it. As is noted in the DMCA, you are bypassing security functions intended for a specific purpose. Way to justify it though. 😉 I don't personally give a damn, but the topic of jailbreaking and arguing it is for the sake of expensive medical applications for money we don't have doesn't really change things. It is treading a very thin line. People have been sued/arrested for cracking adobe e-reader software, making their DVDs playable on linux and even bypassing the security on a cd to rip it to their computer for personal use. Is it horse crap that they CAN do that? Yes....but they still can and it is probably in the best interest of the site to avoid legal gray areas.

How could they find out (aside from the software you downloaded), well, my friend can tell by the code. He helped create and stitch together the vast majority of the ipod touch and iphone software. It really isn't THAT hard if you are set out to prove it. (Even if you undo it sometimes)

I'm sorry, but I don't think you actually know what you're talking about. Jailbreaking is NOT illegal, as in there are NO laws against it; it is seen as the equivalent of "unlocking" any given cell phone, which is done at all times and often sold online. The ONLY case Apple has against jailbreaking are the "cracked" apps, which the majority of people who jailbrake do not utilize. In fact, companies like Mozilla and Skype are backing up the claim that jailbreaking is not illegal and should never be.

And I'll reiterate that there is absolutely no way that you can get caught if you simply restore the original firmware. It will be as if you had just bought it, and there will be no outstanding "codes" that Apple, or anyone associated with them, could read. Also, considering how many people have done it, no one cares enough to check. I'll stand by my point that there is absolutely no legal risk with doing this; even if they did actively attempt to take legal action (which they won't), they would only be able to go after those that uploaded the apps and not those that downloaded them.

My apologies for hijacking this thread. I made a suggestion with good intentions but I ended up treading on morally grey ground. I just want to make it clear that what I posted would not get anyone into trouble.

Now, back to your regularly scheduled programming. 😀

 

[Chocolate Bear]

What were we talking about, again?

lol

 

[spicedmanna]

aside from "jail-breaking"...

I feel comfy with my anatomy skillz because I took a class in undergrad (then later tutored it). Is this comfort giving me false confidence or will it be true that I actually might have it a little easier?

(PS: same scenario for microbio and physio)

Certainly some background is going to be helpful, and it's good to feel confident, but I strongly caution against becoming over-confident about any medical school material, even if it seems easy on the onset. That sort of thing can lead to complacency and false security (and ultimately not doing well).

Most undergrad level material isn't going to prepare you adequately for the intensity and volume of what you are about to encounter. You might find that what you thought you knew a bit about a subject, and it might provide some initial edge, but it's quickly surpassed. Anatomy isn't hard, it's just the volume and speed that hurts...and unless you've had experience w/ gross, you have to get used to seeing stuff in situ, which can be significantly different than looking at pictures and being able to id stuff, etc... Then there's the whole clinical element that undergrad classes usually don't touch on a whole lot. Yeesh...looking back, there's just so much minutiae.

Anyway, I'd probably say that having a background in this or that will make some of the vocab easier to understand and you'll have fewer, "What the heck?" moments, especially initially, but I'd still recommend studying like you had never seen the stuff before. It's fairly easy to drop the ball and then have to pay the price on a quiz or test because you thought you knew something, but really didn't.

 

[MossPoh]

I'm sorry, but I don't think you actually know what you're talking about. Jailbreaking is NOT illegal, as in there are NO laws against it; it is seen as the equivalent of "unlocking" any given cell phone, which is done at all times and often sold online. The ONLY case Apple has against jailbreaking are the "cracked" apps, which the majority of people who jailbrake do not utilize. In fact, companies like Mozilla and Skype are backing up the claim that jailbreaking is not illegal and should never be.

And I'll reiterate that there is absolutely no way that you can get caught if you simply restore the original firmware. It will be as if you had just bought it, and there will be no outstanding "codes" that Apple, or anyone associated with them, could read. Also, considering how many people have done it, no one cares enough to check. I'll stand by my point that there is absolutely no legal risk with doing this; even if they did actively attempt to take legal action (which they won't), they would only be able to go after those that uploaded the apps and not those that downloaded them.

My apologies for hijacking this thread. I made a suggestion with good intentions but I ended up treading on morally grey ground. I just want to make it clear that what I posted would not get anyone into trouble.

Now, back to your regularly scheduled programming. 😀

No, I know what I'm talking about. They aren't going to do it and they generally don't care. If you restore it you're correct they aren't going to dig down and notice. If you're loaded with tons of copywritten software/material that is normally required to pay for then yes you can still get in trouble. Just as bypassing any security measure was an issue with the DMCA.

Keep in mind, I know that guy that wrote a huge chunk of the software for the iphone. If you restore all the locks then you're fine and I know that apple hates security measures in general, but just because you can get away with it doesn't mean it is legal. There are several instances of companies (see Adobe) that get really pissed off when you bypass security for their ebook software. Apple won't crack down because it isn't good for their image. Steve Jobs doesn't like most DRM himself. I wasn't saying there is some magic line of code that always sticks. I'm saying that for the vast majority of people, flashing their firmware is already a big step. So, returning everything back to normal with the exact same version is even more complicated for a large chunk of people. It is easy to take stuff apart. Putting things together EXACTLY the same is difficult. There are things that don't always jive. Hell, I thought I removed something from my computer and the kernel extension was still there evidently. My friend told me when he was looking at a bug report I sent to him while he was on the other coast...sure enough and for whatever reason, it was there.

The whole culling of the debate wasn't because I THOUGHT people would be caught or should fear swat teams dropping down at an apple store. It was because companies as a whole are still hypersensitive about this stuff and it could breed other issues. You pay for Netters in every version, so free flashcards is still copyright infringement unless they were paid by someone else. I'd rather read about some fanatical group like the RIAA (yes I know they are music) coming down on some other website for some B.S. charge.

Its like arguing whether you think pot should be legal or not. I really don't give a damn and many people don't consider it bad, but there are still issues in the books that say otherwise....even if you get rid of evidence. Only a couple months late. 😉

 

[Semicolon]

No, I know what I'm talking about. They aren't going to do it and they generally don't care. If you restore it you're correct they aren't going to dig down and notice. If you're loaded with tons of copywritten software/material that is normally required to pay for then yes you can still get in trouble. Just as bypassing any security measure was an issue with the DMCA.

Keep in mind, I know that guy that wrote a huge chunk of the software for the iphone. If you restore all the locks then you're fine and I know that apple hates security measures in general, but just because you can get away with it doesn't mean it is legal. There are several instances of companies (see Adobe) that get really pissed off when you bypass security for their ebook software. Apple won't crack down because it isn't good for their image. Steve Jobs doesn't like most DRM himself. I wasn't saying there is some magic line of code that always sticks. I'm saying that for the vast majority of people, flashing their firmware is already a big step. So, returning everything back to normal with the exact same version is even more complicated for a large chunk of people. It is easy to take stuff apart. Putting things together EXACTLY the same is difficult. There are things that don't always jive. Hell, I thought I removed something from my computer and the kernel extension was still there evidently. My friend told me when he was looking at a bug report I sent to him while he was on the other coast...sure enough and for whatever reason, it was there.

The whole culling of the debate wasn't because I THOUGHT people would be caught or should fear swat teams dropping down at an apple store. It was because companies as a whole are still hypersensitive about this stuff and it could breed other issues. You pay for Netters in every version, so free flashcards is still copyright infringement unless they were paid by someone else. I'd rather read about some fanatical group like the RIAA (yes I know they are music) coming down on some other website for some B.S. charge.

Its like arguing whether you think pot should be legal or not. I really don't give a damn and many people don't consider it bad, but there are still issues in the books that say otherwise....even if you get rid of evidence. Only a couple months late. 😉

Dude, 3 months later? Really?

You make a good point, and I don't really want to continue a silly debate. I'll just leave it at the discretion of the individual. If you're okay with it, and can accept any consequences associated with it, then it's up to you.

Btw, I know you've begun your coursework already, so I wish you the best of luck. Glad you still have the time to debate on Apple, though. 😀

 

[Mohammed1989]

You guys go all out lol. I did enjoy this apple discussion between you guys 🙂