substantial CA disadvantage?

[sinombre]

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😡

Just saw this and lol'd

 

[rfvbnmju]

california is the land of dreams, man. theres not a single soul here that wants to leave for medical school. that is why its so hard. you might think your friends have strong apps, but the UC system literally produces hundreds of similar cookie cutter premeds with 3.8+/36+. its a total crapshoot unless you got something else that can catch the eye

Is it really the land of dreams? I'm probably one of the few that don't mind leaving if necessary.

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[sinombre]

Is it really the land of dreams? I'm probably one of the few that don't mind leaving if necessary.

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I think so. I really can't imagine ever moving away (even though there's a good chance I'll have to in 4 years). California has everything.

 

[gyngyn]

I think so. I really can't imagine ever moving away (even though there's a good chance I'll have to in 4 years). California has everything.

California is a mystical, magical infuriating enigma. I'm glad to be here, too.

 

[Noggin]

What other state has awesome surf and world-class skiing within a four-hour drive? California is an incredible place to live!

 

[askamsky51]

What other state has awesome surf and world-class skiing within a four-hour drive? California is an incredible place to live!

And less people? Oregon 😉

Why do ya think so many of us former Californians flock north?

Better up the size of that wetsuit though. It's a bit nippy

 

[sinombre]

And less people? Oregon 😉

Why do ya think so many of us former Californians flock north?

Better up the size of that wetsuit though. It's a bit nippy

Oregon is cool and all, but the rain... Weeks of nonstop precipitation can wreak havoc on the psyche (says the guy who sees about two weeks of rain a year).

 

[askamsky51]

Oregon is cool and all, but the rain... Weeks of nonstop precipitation can wreak havoc on the psyche (says the guy who sees about two weeks of rain a year).

Very true, but the rain is only in the Willamette valley--admittedly where I live, and where the population density is. Though Oregon is much larger than the north I-5 corridor.

 

[AbitConfusedATM]

Average school stats:
UCSF 34.5 /3.77
Stanford 35.8 /3.79
UCLA 33.9 /3.73
UCSD 33 / 3.73
USC 34.2 /3.64
UCI 32 /3.67
Loma Linda 31 /3.78
UCD 31 / 3.6


updated with newest MSAR data

As someone who doesn't have the most up to date MSAR, can you shed some light on these numbers? I just read in another thread that UC Davis, UC Irvine, and UCSD had median MCATs of 33, 33, and 35, respectively. Are these numbers averages rather than medians, or has there been a substantial jump in MCAT numbers in just the past few months?

 

[pyrrion89]

Is there IS preference? How do you measure that? In my opinion, a good mathematical metric should take into account the relative numbers of OOS vs. IS applicants and then normalize for that fact.

One idea is to just compare (#OOS applicants/#OOS acceptances) vs. (#IS applicants/#IS acceptances), then divide the IS% over the OOS% to get a "preference factor". Any value greater than 1 denotes IS preference, any value less than 1 denotes OOS preference. Any value close to 1 indicates no real preference.

So, the data compares how much a school prefers to recruit from one pool (IS) versus another pool (OOS). This seems to me the fairest way to measure residency preferences. Values below are listed in descending order of IS preference ("preference factor")

%is %oos preference factor
ucd 5.94% 0.44% 13.39
uci 5.58% 2.45% 2.27
ucla 5.29% 2.59% 2.04
ucsf 5.35% 2.63% 2.04
usc 7.01% 3.53% 1.99
ucsd 5.35% 3.44% 1.56
sfd 2.61% 2.87% 0.91

Stanford seems to be the only school that has no real preference for IS students. USC does, despite being a private school. UC Davis has a much stronger preference for IS moreso than any other school. The other UC's are relatively uniform in their modest preference for IS applicants, although UCSD has a curiously lesser IS preference. I forgot to add Loma Linda here. Don't have UCR's data.

So is there a substantial CA disadvantage? No. In fact, for most Californian schools, there is a substantial advantage for CA residents. Is this IS-advantage greater for residents in other states when they apply to their respective in-state schools? That's a great question. I would guess the answer is yes.

Do CA residents have a harder time matriculating into their in-state schools compared to residents of other states matriculating into their respective in-state schools? Yes, if you judge by comparing average IS accepted student MCAT/GPA scores for CA state schools and extra-CA state schools.

 

[BlueLabel]

Food for thought:

California

residents = 38 million

MD schools = 9

ratio= 4.2:1

Oregon (just as an example, my home school)

residents = 4 million

MD Schools = 1

ratio = 4:1

Percent accepted OOS

California (avg including privates) = 22.3%

California (avg of just public) = 11.1%

Oregon = 35.6%

--------------------------------------------
Conclusion: CA students are not disadvantaged IMO.

Question about these numbers: doesn't Oregon (and several other Pacific NW states) have some sort of deal where Alaska residents are given preference similar to in-state applicants? Do these numbers count Alaska applicants as IS or OOS? Maybe Oregon isn't the best example, but please correct me if I'm wrong.

 

[BlueLabel]

Is there IS preference? How do you measure that? In my opinion, a good mathematical metric should take into account the relative numbers of OOS vs. IS applicants and then normalize for that fact.

One idea is to just compare (#OOS applicants/#OOS acceptances) vs. (#IS applicants/#IS acceptances), then divide the IS% over the OOS% to get a "preference factor". Any value greater than 1 denotes IS preference, any value less than 1 denotes OOS preference. Any value close to 1 indicates no real preference.

So, the data compares how much a school prefers to recruit from one pool (IS) versus another pool (OOS). This seems to me the fairest way to measure residency preferences. Values below are listed in descending order of IS preference ("preference factor")

%is %oos preference factor
ucd 5.94% 0.44% 13.39
uci 5.58% 2.45% 2.27
ucla 5.29% 2.59% 2.04
ucsf 5.35% 2.63% 2.04
usc 7.01% 3.53% 1.99
ucsd 5.35% 3.44% 1.56
sfd 2.61% 2.87% 0.91

Stanford seems to be the only school that has no real preference for IS students. USC does, despite being a private school. UC Davis has a much stronger preference for IS moreso than any other school. The other UC's are relatively uniform in their modest preference for IS applicants, although UCSD has a curiously lesser IS preference. I forgot to add Loma Linda here. Don't have UCR's data.

So is there a substantial CA disadvantage? No. In fact, for most Californian schools, there is a substantial advantage for CA residents. Is this IS-advantage greater for residents in other states when they apply to their respective in-state schools? That's a great question. I would guess the answer is yes.

Do CA residents have a harder time matriculating into their in-state schools compared to residents of other states matriculating into their respective in-state schools? Yes, if you judge by comparing average IS accepted student MCAT/GPA scores for CA state schools and extra-CA state schools.

Well-reasoned and explained, +1

The only caveat I'd add is, there could be some self-selection in these numbers. Fewer less-competitive IS applicants that would normally apply to their state school if they were residents elsewhere actually apply to these schools, whereas countless OOS applicants apply to California publics as a "reach" option because of their cachet, despite knowing they don't have much of a chance. I'm not saying self-selection effects necessarily invalidate your argument but they are probably not completely negligible.

 

[Anicetus]

It's not that CA residents are disadvantaged. There are just massive amounts of brilliant premeds in CA.

 

[gyngyn]

It's not that CA residents are disadvantaged. There are just massive amounts of brilliant premeds in CA.

UCLA applicants alone could fill 80% of the available 1st year positions in CA.