The **NEW & IMPROVED** official low gpa thread...

[NutCracker2021]

---

Members do not see this ad.

does anyone know if SMPs look down upon Ds and Fs on your transcripts...or if they frown upon retakes...

 

[Perrotfish]

Thank you for replying ... where and when am I supposed to be getting LOR's and what am I supposed to be doing to get into SMP's and where is the best SMP closest to the california and what else should I be doing in the meantime?!

To get into an SMP do the same things you would do to get into Med School: decent grades, MCAT, activities, and LOR. The difference is that with the SMP you might be able to get away with ´"bad" (3.0 - 3.2) grades if you have a good enough MCAT.

1) In the meantime take more undergraduate classes to get up to at least a 3.0. Retake any class you got a D or F in. If you´re planning to go DO, maybe retake any classes you got a C in (if you´re sure you can get an A). Volunteer, and maybe do research for money/LORs. If you´re planning to apply DO (which you should, even if you do an SMP) you also need to shadow a DO and get a LOR from the DO about what a good Osteopath you´d make.

2) Also, of course, you´ll need to take the MCAT some time this summer, and do really really well. At least a 32, probably a 33 or 34. I´d recommend one of the 4 big courses if you have the $$$: TPR, TBR, EK, or Kaplan. I had good luck with TPR (I think it´s best if you had a more basic bio education), and EK seems to be the most recommended on this site. Look on the MCAT forum here for more info. The main point is you should plan on spending most of a semester studying for this thing pretty much full time. The MCAT is definitely the cheapest and fastest part of this process, so figuring out if you can do well on it is probably the fastest and cheapest way to figure out how feasible medical school is for you.

You need to get your LORs and such in order for the next application cycle (for 2009), starting around next Januray with application deadlines around the end of next Feburary. For most, admissions are rolling, so applying as soon as the applications come out will help you get into the best programs. You get them by getting either getting As in classes and making friends with the professors of those classes, or doing research for the professors, or basically any other way you can get a prof to like you.

The location of the SMP shouldn´t matter. These things cost so much that relocation costs are almost irrelevant, just go to the best (highest success rate) that will take you. Look on this site for the big list of SMPs.

Being from CA makes everything harder, BTW, sorry to say. Ask around for more specific stats.

Good luck.

does anyone know if SMPs look down upon Ds and Fs on your transcripts...or if they frown upon retakes...

Allo SMPs look at Ds and Fs the same way AMCAS does: they average the two. I´ve never cleared up weather DO SMPs allow for grade replacement the same way DO schools do.

Short answer: If you retook and got As, it shouldn´t kill you, if your MCAT is good. It can´t help, though.

 

[Xcited392]

Being from CA makes everything harder, BTW, sorry to say.

Really? I don't know much about California and med admissions there, but is it a disadvantage? I have in-state residency in a midwestern state (which could be a plus), but currently going to school in Massachusetts. I'm wanting to take upper sciences in a California school because well....I want some sunshine and warmth?

So, would it be a bad move for me to go to CA?

Thanks

 

[Perrotfish]

Really? I don't know much about California and med admissions there, but is it a disadvantage? I have in-state residency in a midwestern state (which could be a plus), but currently going to school in Massachusetts. I'm wanting to take upper sciences in a California school because well....I want some sunshine and warmth?

So, would it be a bad move for me to go to CA?

From the stories on this forum, California residency is a disadvantage (could be an SDN rumor, of course). The state schools are definitely almost impossible to get into, for one thing. Taking courses at a CA school has nothing to do with anything, unless you change your resideny to CA while you´re there. Enjoy the sunshine.

 

[Maxprime]

From the stories on this forum, California residency is a disadvantage (could be an SDN rumor, of course). The state schools are definitely almost impossible to get into, for one thing. Taking courses at a CA school has nothing to do with anything, unless you change your resideny to CA while you´re there. Enjoy the sunshine.

Not just a rumor - too many people in the state for the # of schools that exist. There's a thread somewhere in pre-allo that discusses the worst states to be from (statistically) and CA lives up to its name.

If you are digging out of a hole and relocating to a new school, I would try to establish residency in a state with better options. I know that Ohio schools allow you to establish residency while attending classes - just an option.

 

[Isoprop]

i can personally testify to above. i moved from cali to ohio. there are other benefits aside from residency about ohio undergrads. the next major one is that courses generally count for more credits here. a 4 unit chemsitry course from UCLA = 5 unit chemistry course at OSU. so it'll give you a slight boost in GPA if you do well in ohio.

 

[vigocarpathian]

ok ..so im deciding to do a post bacc ala carte.. but how are non science classes viewed mixed in the with science for post bacc?

ie.. next semester..

endocrinology
molec. bio
genetics (retake made a d+)
adolescent health.. (not a science class)

and the next sem im taking german... so is it ok to mix in non science? or is this gonna almost invalidate the point that u try to prove by taking post bacc classes?

 

[Isoprop]

non-BCPM is fine. keep in mind many med schools ask for a humanties LOR.

 

[vigocarpathian]

.

 

[twilighter]

I hate this place.
I don't party, I don't have a life. I'm not brilliant but I work my *** off in these classes and watch students cheat and pull of A's. And people have bad luck once in a while but man wtf?

AMEN!!! life is unfair like that. uargh.

anyway, i just found out my mcat scores for the april 5th exam and boy, was that a slap to the face. i'm so depressed and confused that i don't even know what to do at this point.🙁 i have my dreams set to becoming a doctor, but the difficult part for me now is getting there. lately, i've been thinking a lot about post-bac programs and the ones that have sparked an interest in me (and i think i can get in compared to the ones offered at the UC) are CSU LA and SFSU. how do post-bac programs work and how long do they take? i have an aunt who is now an anesthesiologist and has advised me to look into the SMP program at Georgetown since she went there. however, with my low gpa, i doubt i'll get in. i graduated last june with a b.s. in biology and an overall gpa of 2.8.🙁 i was able to maintain a gpa of 3.8 before i transferred to UC Davis from a community college, but then everything went downhill when i got into a car accident. i don't have any D's or F's, just a lot of C's. bleh.

i'm not too worried about my extra-curricular activities, it's my gpa (and now mcat) that i need to boost up. as of now, my options are doing a post-bacc program, getting second bachelor's degree (why though?), or a SMP, right?

 

[Perrotfish]

i'm not too worried about my extra-curricular activities, it's my gpa (and now mcat) that i need to boost up. as of now, my options are doing a post-bacc program, getting second bachelor's degree (why though?), or a SMP, right

Your first priority is the MCAT. If you can´t get passed that hurdle, you´re not going to get in (your GPA will never be above average, so your MCAT has to be). Did you use a review course? If so which one? How many weeks/hours per day did you study? How much do you need to improve.

After that, yeah, SMP. Your best option at this point would probably be to first get your GPA up to a 3.0 with a year of post bac work. With over a 3.0 you should be able to get into an SMP with an MCAT that is only a little above the average, rather than way above the average. Then you need to ace the SMP, of course. So best case, class of 2014, with a good chance that you´ll be going to class of 2015 instead.

Also, of course, you can look into being a midlevel. I know that´s not what you want to hear but it may be the best option at this point. PA programs, though, have their own prereqs and you may need to look into them if you want to leave that option open.

Sorry about the MCAT, good luck with your application process.

 

[InquisitiveDoc]

Also, of course, you can look into being a midlevel. I know that´s not what you want to hear but it may be the best option at this point. PA programs, though, have their own prereqs and you may need to look into them if you want to leave that option open.

Sorry about the MCAT, good luck with your application process.

Mayb this is a stupid question but what exactly is a midlevel?

 

[Perrotfish]

Mayb this is a stupid question but what exactly is a midlevel?

Midlevel health care providers. Nurse Practicioners and Physicians Assistant and the subspecialties thereof. I have heard RNs use this designation as well.

 

[liverotcod]

Midlevel health care providers. Nurse Practicioners and Physicians Assistant and the subspecialties thereof. I have heard RNs use this designation as well.

And, I hope it doesn't need saying: important, respected members of the health care team that are quite often, especially in the case of the subspecialty midlevels, experts in their fields and carry their own patients, act as 1st assistant in the OR, etc., etc. They do make considerably less dough than their medical-degree trained colleagues, which naturally is a downside.

 

[Sinfest]

Hey guys/gals! How's it going? I was hoping you guys could help me with my current situation, and give me some advice on what I should do with my life.

So I really want to go to medical school, but unfortunately, I don't think my GPA will be sufficient enough to get me in. I am currently a 3rd year bio. sci. major at one of the UC's in Southern California. My current cum. GPA is around a 2.78 with a BCPM of around a 3.0...after talking to my counselor of what I can expect when I graduate, I can possibly have around a 3.0-3.1 cum. and a 3.2-3.3 BCPM. I haven't taken the MCAT's yet, but I plan on taking them in 1 year and to start studying/taking prep courses the end of this summer. I'm hoping I can get a 33+(who doesn't right? hahaha) with A LOT of studying.

On top of school, I have been doing research within a lab for 1 year(I'm still in it), I have an internship at a big local hospital, I have been teaching at-risk high school kids how to pass the California High School Exit Exams, I'm joining the Flying-Sams this week, and I'm looking into getting another internship at a local doctors office.

Should I try my luck and apply to DO schools? Or instead of wasting money, should I go straight to applying to a post-bacc program(btw, what's a SMP?)? Are there post-bacc programs at med-schools where they can almost "guarantee" admittance if you do well? I would preferably like to stay in California, but if I had to go out of state I would do it. Or should I totally just give up on med. school and try for pharm? 😕:cry: hahaha

Sorry for all the questions, but thanks in advance if any of you help! 👍

 

[fluxcapacitor]

Are there post-bacc programs at med-schools where they can almost "guarantee" admittance if you do well?

This is essentially what an SMP is--a highly competitive post-bacc program where you take med school courses and if you do very well the odds of getting accepted to the school are high. This is particularly true of EVMS and Tulane ACP, and some of the other better ones. Just check out the "official SMP guide" on this board, and that should be a good jumping-off point for information.

 

[stiz]

Bachelor in Psychology (1993): 2.87

Post-bac year with pre-med courses (and others): ~ 2.7

Since 2000:
6 hours I.T. grad program: 3.5 (2000)
24 hours Australia Vet: ~3.1 (2007)

Current graduate program (21 hours): 4.0
(Biochem 8cr, Repro Phys 4cr, Genetics 3cr, Stats 3cr, Env. Health 3cr)

BCPM and Science both at 3.0


Tons of extra-curriq (the good ones):
-Veteran, US Army (1st Gulf War)
-Coauthor, Atlases for Heart Disease published with CDC
-GA in Dept. of Community Medicine and Public Health (currently)
-6 months volunteer (network engineer) for UN DPKO (Liberia)

Doing more volunteer work, shadowing, and kaplan mcat course this
summer. I turn 40 in September!

Wish me luck.

Shaun

 

[bruindoc916]

can someone please advise me on what i should do to get acceptance into US med school. I am graduating this year and will finish with probably a 3.15gpa cum and 3.0 in sci and i just received my mcat score with a 34Q. i will be considered disadvantaged on AMCAS because i do receive financial aid, and qualified for the Fee assistance program. I am applying to US med schools because i can do it for free this year. I also have applied for the NYMC accelerated SMP but no others. I have 2 years of research in with poster presentation and a possible publication.

sorry for the long post, but suggestions are welcomed.

 

[summersands00]

Hey guys. my math/science gpa is not as great as it should be (below a 2.5, illness) and I just graduated this past winter. Im planning on retaking all of my science classes, but for the sake of saving money, and the plan of kicking the MCAT's *** at the end of this summer. Should I just take the classes that i recieved less than a B, over? Or should I just take upper level casses to improve my gpa?

 

[Perrotfish]

Hey guys. my math/science gpa is not as great as it should be (below a 2.5, illness) and I just graduated this past winter. Im planning on retaking all of my science classes, but for the sake of saving money, and the plan of kicking the MCAT's *** at the end of this summer. Should I just take the classes that i recieved less than a B, over? Or should I just take upper level casses to improve my gpa?

If you´re planning on going DO, retake the classes. If they were medical school prereqs, retake the classes. If you definitely want Allo and they weren´t prereqs, only retake the classes if you´re absolultey sure you can get an A.

 

[Sinfest]

Anyone want to give post # 940 some info...please 😀

 

[hung]

Don't give up and do pharm if medicine is what you really want to do. It is an uphill battle to get into an med school at this point, but it can be done. The decision to do MD vs DO is up to you. You need to do the research and find which one fits you best. If you pick MD, you would most likely need to do an SMP, special masters program, there is a sticky thread in the main postbacc forum that explains it. If you pick DO, you might get away with just retaking the science classes that you got Cs or lower. Only, DO schools replace grades if you retake. To do well on the MCAT, checkout the MCAT forum. There are plenty of guides on how to study and tips/tricks for each section.

 

[Maxprime]

How's it going?

Doing okay, thanks for asking.

I am currently a 3rd year bio. sci. major at one of the UC's in Southern California. My current cum. GPA is around a 2.78 with a BCPM of around a 3.0...after talking to my counselor of what I can expect when I graduate, I can possibly have around a 3.0-3.1 cum. and a 3.2-3.3 BCPM.

Should I try my luck and apply to DO schools?

That depends mostly on how your MCAT turns out. If you are okay with the DO route, then it will be much easier for you to become a doctor. DO schools replace old grades with the most recent one so you can replace bad GPA points instead of just adding on - helps big time.

Or instead of wasting money, should I go straight to applying to a post-bacc program(btw, what's a SMP?)?

SMP = Special Masters Program. Check out the FAQ in the post-bacc forum. My personal opinion is that you can pull up your GPA in a post-bacc (at your school, just delay graduation) and it would do more good than going to an SMP. SMP is more of a last ditch effort for people with low GPAs, they are tailored much more to people with good GPAs and low MCATs.

Are there post-bacc programs at med-schools where they can almost "guarantee" admittance if you do well?

For all intensive purposes, no - this includes SMPs. There is maybe one or two (Hopkins post-bacc comes to mind) but you have to be someone with numbers that would probably get into med school easily anyways so this doesn't apply to those of us lucky enough to post in this thread. 🙂

I would preferably like to stay in California, but if I had to go out of state I would do it.

Beggars can't be choosers - in today's application environment if you get in anywhere you should be overjoyed.

Or should I totally just give up on med. school and try for pharm?

Doing the "fix the low-GPA and beg your way into med school" thing really blows - I can't stress that enough (I would know - I've been there). If your heart isn't 100% in it and you could see yourself doing something else, I would explore those options. Pharmacists work much better hours, rarely get blamed for killing people, to my knowledge aren't on call, etc.

 

[Perrotfish]

So I really want to go to medical school, but unfortunately, I don't think my GPA will be sufficient enough to get me in. I am currently a 3rd year bio. sci. major at one of the UC's in Southern California. My current cum. GPA is around a 2.78 with a BCPM of around a 3.0...after talking to my counselor of what I can expect when I graduate, I can possibly have around a 3.0-3.1 cum. and a 3.2-3.3 BCPM. I haven't taken the MCAT's yet, but I plan on taking them in 1 year and to start studying/taking prep courses the end of this summer. I'm hoping I can get a 33+(who doesn't right? hahaha) with A LOT of studying.

]Should I try my luck and apply to DO schools? Or instead of wasting money, should I go straight to applying to a post-bacc program(btw, what's a SMP?)? Are there post-bacc programs at med-schools where they can almost "guarantee" admittance if you do well? I would preferably like to stay in California, but if I had to go out of state I would do it. Or should I totally just give up on med. school and try for pharm? 😕:cry: hahaha

My opinin: what you need to do depends on what you get on your MCAT. If you get a 33 or greater try for an SMP. If you get between a 29 and a 33 start retaking classes and apply DO in a year or two. If you get under a 29 retake the MCAT or you probably aren´t going to medical school (probably, miracles do happenm feel free to apply if applying isn´t a major expense). In any event you´re probably going to have a year gap in between Undergrad and Medschool, at a minimum, and it´s going to be an expensive year. You´re almost definitely not going to a Cali school. You can do this if you want it. Good luck.

 

[lostchild]

okay people. here i am .. damage control time.. i know i messed up or should i say totally 'effd up' soo help me out. or give advice or watever just do something ..

currently an undergrad in NJ with a overall GPA of 2.49 and science gpa 2.14.👎mad:😳🙁😱 . yea i know. laugh. i have tons of volunteer hours sincei basically spend all my time at the hospital after my paretns passed away. i did an internship in England a while back in freshman year. i dont know what to do . and if i will even get into a post. bacc school if you know how. please advice. it is very much appreciated.

 

[madelinever]

2.85 Overall, 2.74 BPCM, MCAT 37R

I might be able to get into some SMPs with my mcat score, and I'm confident I would do well in an SMP program. But even, hypothetitically, if I get a 4.0 in my SMP program, that ugrad gpa is still going to stay there.

Should I take a year to a year and a half to raise my ugrad gpa, THEN go take the SMP? And if I decide to do a postbacc to raise my ugrad gpa, should I retake the pre-med prereq courses I received a C in, or take upper division units?

Ideally, I would like to just enter into an SMP program and apply to med school the same year. Any advice?

 

[Perrotfish]

I might be able to get into some SMPs with my mcat score, and I'm confident I would do well in an SMP program. But even, hypothetitically, if I get a 4.0 in my SMP program, that ugrad gpa is still going to stay there.

Should I take a year to a year and a half to raise my ugrad gpa, THEN go take the SMP? And if I decide to do a postbacc to raise my ugrad gpa, should I retake the pre-med prereq courses I received a C in, or take upper division units?

Ideally, I would like to just enter into an SMP program and apply to med school the same year. Any advice?

Are you looking at SMPs for 2008 or 2009? If you´re looking at 2008 you´ve missed the deadlines for the majority of the good programs. Apply to the few good ones that are still open, but if they don´t take you I´d say try to get up to a 3.0 by taking more classes. If you´re intereted in 2009, of if you get in to a good program for 2008, then yes, you should just go to the SMP program. If you get a 4.0 in your SMP while your undergrad GPA will still be there, I think you will find that ADCOMs will probably ignore it and let you in anyway (or at least that was the experience that most people successful in SMPs have had). However, don´t be surprised if there is a gap year in between doing the SMP and getting into medical school, unless you do a high linkage SMP.

 

[Perrotfish]

okay people. here i am .. damage control time.. i know i messed up or should i say totally 'effd up' soo help me out. or give advice or watever just do something ..

currently an undergrad in NJ with a overall GPA of 2.49 and science gpa 2.14

1) Have you taken the medical school prereqs?

2) If so, have you taken a practice MCAT?

3) How much undergrad do you have left to go?

4) No more than one emoticon per post.

 

[mR LaZy]

what is one to do with a low gpa like around ~2.5 and a high mcat scores like ~35 or higher? do you apply to smp? but don't usually smp have cut off around 2.8 at the least?

 

[Maxprime]

what is one to do with a low gpa like around ~2.5 and a high mcat scores like ~35 or higher? do you apply to smp? but don't usually smp have cut off around 2.8 at the least?

SMPs are usually more tailored for the high GPA/low MCAT crowd. I think most people would agree that the best course of action is to work to bring your GPA up to at least a 3.0, depending on how possible that really is.

 

[mR LaZy]

SMPs are usually more tailored for the high GPA/low MCAT crowd. I think most people would agree that the best course of action is to work to bring your GPA up to at least a 3.0, depending on how possible that really is.

Wait isn't it for low gpa/high mcats? why would someone need additional schooling if they already have high gpa and low mcats? that wouldn't make sense, they would just need to work on mcats scores...

well i read the sticky on postbacc programs and the gpa range was said to be as low as 2.4? i was wondering which schools have the least stringent gpa requirement?

 

[Perrotfish]

SMPs are usually more tailored for the high GPA/low MCAT crowd. I think most people would agree that the best course of action is to work to bring your GPA up to at least a 3.0, depending on how possible that really is.

You are not necessarily "most people" 🙂. I still think you should just raise your GPA to whatever you need to get into the SMP (with a 35 that should be a 2.8), then do the SMP. While no one would argue a 3.0 isn´t better than a 2.8, I would argue it´s not worth an extra year to go from 2.8 to 3.0 if you can get into the SMP at a 2.8. Also yes, HIGH MCAT/ LOW GPA for SMPs. I think you mispoke.

what is one to do with a low gpa like around ~2.5 and a high mcat scores like ~35 or higher? do you apply to smp? but don't usually smp have cut off around 2.8 at the least?

HOWEVER: yes, you need to raise your GPA to about a 2.8 to even have a good shot to get into the SMP, then you need to do the SMP. So at least a 2 year process. Sucks I know. There are programs that will admit you with a lower GPA, but if you investigate I think you´ll find most of them have very low success rates. If you can get a 35 I´d spend the extra year in undergrad and hold out for the SMP with an 70% or greater success rate. Your call, though.

 

[Maxprime]

Sorry for the error - Perrot & Lazy are right, I flipped the two. I agree with what Perrot said with 1 qualification:

Remember that SMP is kind of the end of the road - it's a bit backwards to return to undergraduate level work. Make sure you put all the work you want to into your GPA before you start your SMP. Obviously, as stated, you should consider the reward for each semester of work you put in towards improving your GPA. Doing well in an SMP proves you can do the work, but if someone else in your class did just as well and has a better GPA then they'll probably beat you out for a spot.

 

[starrynite14]

GPA overall: 2.9
GPA science: 2.5
MCAT 23Q

Accepted to Barry University
Waitlisted at Midwestern (Az)
Still waiting to hear from a few others.

My stats are low but I know that this path is right for me. I know that I'll get there. I just have to keep moving forward.

 

[Sinfest]

Thanks Hung, Maxprime, and Perrotfish! 🙂

Maxprime, did you mean low GPA and high MCAT for SMP? BTW, I wish I could delay graduation but the bio. department at my school wants you out ASAP, so they said I can only stay for another quarter after my 4th year, if that, to do more work or else I would have to change majors...what do I do then? And my comment about staying in California may have came off incorrectly...I would be TOTALLY overjoyed, ecstatic, excited, whatever you wanna call it, getting into ANY Med. School in the US...*sigh* I hope I can hahaha

Perrotfish, so what's the benefit of a SMP over a post-bacc(I'm sure this has been covered a bajillion times, sorry)? So even though my U-grad GPA may be a 3.0, the SMP program(assuming I do get 33> on the MCAT) would be sufficient enough to get me into a DO school?

Thanks again everyone 👍

 

[Sinfest]

GPA overall: 2.9
GPA science: 2.5
MCAT 23Q

Accepted to Barry University
Waitlisted at Midwestern (Az)
Still waiting to hear from a few others.

My stats are low but I know that this path is right for me. I know that I'll get
there. I just have to keep moving forward.

I admire your optimism and outlook, best of luck to you 👍

BTW, fellow central coaster...I'm from Monterey I would love to go to Midwestern SMP considering how "close" it is to home.

 

[Perrotfish]

Perrotfish, so what's the benefit of a SMP over a post-bacc(I'm sure this has been covered a bajillion times, sorry)? So even though my U-grad GPA may be a 3.0, the SMP program(assuming I do get 33> on the MCAT) would be sufficient enough to get me into a DO school?

SMPs are programs where you take classes with medical students to prove you belong in medical school. Post-bacs are just more undergrad classess. The problem with post-bacs is that they´re not really weighted any more strongly than other undergrad classes, so if you have a long way to go (less than a 3.2) getting into med school via a post bac can be a long wait. SMPs are more expensive, and generally considered riskier (who is going to take you if you prove you CAN´T pass medical school classes), but have the upside that they can generally improve your application from bad to acceptable in a single year. They´re both options, it´s just a matter of which is better for your timeline/budget.

Generally SMPs are aimed at getting you into MD schools. The exception is a few DO SMPs, which you can read about elsewhere on this site.

 

[liverotcod]

...The problem with post-bacs is that they´re not really weighted any more strongly than other undergrad classes, so if you have a long way to go (less than a 3.2) getting into med school via a post bac can be a long wait.

There is an exception to this otherwise true observation: when the post baccalaureate work follows a long time doing something else: a career, obvious maturation, etc. In my case my post-bacc was 13 years after I got my college degree, and I don't think they even looked at my undergrad record.

 

[Perrotfish]

There is an exception to this otherwise true observation: when the post baccalaureate work follows a long time doing something else: a career, obvious maturation, etc. In my case my post-bacc was 13 years after I got my college degree, and I don't think they even looked at my undergrad record.

True, from what Ive heard. And Ive even hear conflicting reports about people who just had really positive trends (2.0 for 4 years followed by a 4.0 for 2, or something like). But this is the internet and that means I get to oversimplify 🙂.

 

[Sinfest]

Sorry, 1 more question regarding my stats in post #940(Cliffs of what I'll have when I graduate: ~3.0-3.1 cum. with ~3.2-3.3 BCPM, 2 1/2 years research, 1 1/2 years hospital internship, teaching high school kids, Flying-Sams, & intern w/ doctor) Do I have a shot at a DO school if I apply next year? If I could, I would like to skip the post-bacc/SMP route(save money and time). FYI, if I were to apply, I would do a mass application, applying to every school haha


I lied...one more question...I've read/heard that many schools will disregard your app. off the bat if you're under a 3.0...is this for Cum., BCPM, or both? I'm a little worried I won't be able to pass that 3.0 Cum. mark and end up with like a 2.999999 Cum. hahaha

Thanks!

 

[Perrotfish]

Sorry, 1 more question regarding my stats in post #940(Cliffs of what I'll have when I graduate: ~3.0-3.1 cum. with ~3.2-3.3 BCPM, 2 1/2 years research, 1 1/2 years hospital internship, teaching high school kids, Flying-Sams, & intern w/ doctor) Do I have a shot at a DO school if I apply next year? If I could, I would like to skip the post-bacc/SMP route(save money and time). FYI, if I were to apply, I would do a mass application, applying to every school haha

Depends on MCAT, if your MCAT is high I would say you have a chance, yes, but you will likely be doing an SMP.

I lied...one more question...I've read/heard that many schools will disregard your app. off the bat if you're under a 3.0...is this for Cum., BCPM, or both? I'm a little worried I won't be able to pass that 3.0 Cum. mark and end up with like a 2.999999 Cum. hahaha

ADCOMs don't like answering this question directly, and I don't think you're going to get any really useful data from an internet message board. The ones that have true cutoffs (i.e. they won't even send you a secondary) I THINK generally have cutoffs at 3.2, not 3.0. For the rest... I think it matters, but I've never gotten any direct answers/data to support that. Hitting that 3.0 IS very important for the better SMP programs. It's their cutoff, or at least a strong preference, and it's on all of their websites.

 

[elxr06]

SMPs are programs where you take classes with medical students to prove you belong in medical school. Post-bacs are just more undergrad classess. The problem with post-bacs is that they´re not really weighted any more strongly than other undergrad classes, so if you have a long way to go (less than a 3.2) getting into med school via a post bac can be a long wait. SMPs are more expensive, and generally considered riskier (who is going to take you if you prove you CAN´T pass medical school classes), but have the upside that they can generally improve your application from bad to acceptable in a single year. They´re both options, it´s just a matter of which is better for your timeline/budget.

Generally SMPs are aimed at getting you into MD schools. The exception is a few DO SMPs, which you can read about elsewhere on this site.

So SMP is just basically the first year of medical school (although you get a master's degree in the process) and if you succeed, then a med school will (more likely) take you on to complete the other 3 years required for M.D. or D.O.?

and don't you apply for medical school the same year you're doing the SMP so that a gap year doesn't occur if you want to go directly to 2nd year of med school from the SMP?

 

[Perrotfish]

So SMP is just basically the first year of medical school (although you get a master's degree in the process) and if you succeed, then a med school will (more likely) take you on to complete the other 3 years required for M.D. or D.O.?

Generally with SMPs some of your classes will be with the first year medical school classess with the first year medical students, and some will not be. At the end of the year, if you get in, you start as a first year student (four full years to go), but if you get in to the school where you took the SMP you will probably be allowed to take electives in place of the classes you already passed (which means a very nice first semester/year). I'm not aware of any SMP programs where you take the complete first year cirriculum.

The "gap year" refers to the fact that, since you won't get your complete set of grades from the SMP until the end of spring semester, chances are you are going to need to spend a year waiting around applying, since the ADCOMs probably aren't going to accept you on the basis of one year of grades (i.e. SMP in 2008 for medical school in 2010). If your first semester grades are really good, or if your program is high linkage, you might get to skip the gap year.

 

[surag]

Hey guys, I'm so glad I found this. I was looking all over SDN for a thread like this but couldnt till I searched with the google tool, why I didn't do this earlier I dont know.

Anyway, my stats:

37, 14P 11V, 12B

my GPA- 2.8

So whats the best course for me? Do I have a chance for an SMP? I'm going to work this year, shadow and apply early for SMP/postbaccs for 09.

If I do well in an SMP do I have a shot at med school or should I just do postbacc first and then SMP?

An aside....

I'm fairly certain I can be hardworking now because I had gone through a lot of family issues at home. I read earlier someone saying thats not a valid excuse to not succeed...well it is, and its not an excuse. They said they had lost close family members and that they had overcome this to go to med school and its ok for the numbers game to be used for admissions, something along those lines.

First, kudos to you for getting over w/e troubles you had. Second, while I have to suspend disbelief that you could succeed in the face of severe difficulty, thats not to say it can't happen. However, I strongly believe that what you go through can indeed affect you as an individual no matter how hard working you are!

Something that happens to you for years in and out on a regular daily basis can affect your ability to succeed (abuse, poor family structure, family created stress etc). Other difficulties may be severe but not persistent and can let you succeed because its transient(deaths in family, injury/sickness, etc.) I was in the first category and I've had to go through a lot and only recently have I managed to overcome whats been happening(though even that I can't be 100% about-thank god it wasn't physical abuse).

Anyway, what I'm saying is don't put down people and say that somehow everyone is supposed to succeed regardless of what happens...thats not how the human brain works and everyone can be affected by their environment regardless of determination or ability. So please don't put down people, especially in this thread where we're all looking for advice.

I still agree that the numbers are important. They're a strong indicator of whether you'll succeed in a very stressful education such as in MD.

 

[Perrotfish]

So whats the best course for me? Do I have a chance for an SMP? I'm going to work this year, shadow and apply early for SMP/postbaccs for 09.

If I do well in an SMP do I have a shot at med school or should I just do postbacc first and then SMP?

My "I'm not on an ADCOM" advice. With a 37 you have an excellent shot at an SMP. Once you finish the SMP you apply to medical school, no further work necessary. However if you're going to have a year before the SMP I would probably take some easy night classes to get up to that magic 3.0, if that's possible. Actually if you hit the 3.0, with a 37 you would not only be a sure thing for a good SMP, but you would at least have a shot of just getting into DO.

Anyway, what I'm saying is don't put down people and say that somehow everyone is supposed to succeed regardless of what happens...thats not how the human brain works and everyone can be affected by their environment regardless of determination or ability. So please don't put down people, especially in this thread where we're all looking for advice.

Dude, you don't need to tell people at an AA meeting not to judge your drinking, and you don't need to tell people on this thread not to judge your grades.

 

[surag]

My "I'm not on an ADCOM" advice. With a 37 you have an excellent shot at an SMP. Once you finish the SMP you apply to medical school, no further work necessary. However if you're going to have a year before the SMP I would probably take some easy night classes to get up to that magic 3.0, if that's possible. Actually if you hit the 3.0, with a 37 you would not only be a sure thing for a good SMP, but you would at least have a shot of just getting into DO.

For me to hit the magic 3.0 from a 2.8, I've calculated that I need to take a full load of 8 classes(2 semesters) and have a 4.0....I was hoping to use the SMP to show I can succeed.

A lot of people are saying I wont even get into an SMP right now. Any other ways I could strengthen my abilities to get into med school? Should I retake a few classes I bummed in like genetics and biochem?

let me know

Thanks

 

[Perrotfish]

A lot of people are saying I wont even get into an SMP right now. Any other ways I could strengthen my abilities to get into med school? Should I retake a few classes I bummed in like genetics and biochem?

If you don't have any Ds or Fs (or all Cs) in your premed courses, or a 2.0 BCPM, I don't see any reason why you wouldn't get into an SMP if you apply broadly. I got in to a whole bunch with the same GPA and a lower MCAT. However, yes, retaking a few of your worst courses would be a good idea. Should help, can't hurt, and you'll probably see those same courses in the SMP (biochem is real popular). The "lot of people" may have meant that you've missed a lot of deadlines for SMPs, and the ones that are still open tend to have rolling admissions so you´re at a disadvantage applying late. So, while there's no reason not to take a shot at the few still open, you're probably going to end up applying for next year.

If you get into a good SMP, and do well, yes that should be enough to get you into medical school, 2.8 and all. Assuming, of course, an early broad app, DO schools included, ideally you having shadowed a DO, good interviews, and me having any idea what I'm talking about.

 

[starrynite14]

I admire your optimism and outlook, best of luck to you 👍

BTW, fellow central coaster...I'm from Monterey I would love to go to Midwestern SMP considering how "close" it is to home.

thanks! midwestern would be really awesome to go to. my dad and the rest of the fam live in so cal, so i would be really close. i really hope i get off the waitlist and in a seat.

 

[Raj80]

Hello All,
Just wondering if anyone has any info on Canadian school entry..... I know we do not have post-bacc programs or SMPs so are there any Canadian pre-meds that have had a success story after leaving undergrad with a low gpa?
FYI my stats are sitting at:
uGPA 2.78, MCAT to be written this year, but I have deferred my graduation so I can still take courses next year to boost the undergrad gpa. I have backup plans, I'm Planning to apply for a masters program.... I have tons of hospital volunteer experience, I work in the ICU as a unit clerk and in trauma unit as an NA so clinical is covered.
I just need to know if there is any hope in hell that the undergrad gpa can be surpassed and if it is worth my time and money to continue on this trek, or would it be more beneficial to enter a 2 year accelerated nursing program to get my hands dirty working and then try for medicine??
I'm also wondering how hard is it really for a Canadian to gain entry into an American school... I have heard mixed reviews, I do have dual citizenship but from my understanding most spots are filled by permanent residents... any thoughts?

 

[surag]

thanks perrotfish...i really appreciate your advice. I know i've been posting in multiple threads but your input is valuable. So you too had a below 3.0 GPA and got into SMP programs? Where did you go? And did u go to med school finally?
What ECs have you done and what would you recommend me do this year that would strengthen my run for med school?