The **NEW & IMPROVED** official low gpa thread...

[SteRam]

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Hi I'm just graduated from Brandeis University with a 2.82 GPA, overall. I majored in French but I took some science courses my first two years and did somewhat bad in them. I'm a Hispanic American, first generation HS and College graduate. I really want to do medicine and I'm sure that I've the smarts for it but I unfortunately squandered the golden opportunity college gave me. I know this sounds like a sob story but I would like to know if there is anything that I could possibly do to make my medical aspirations a reality. In my senior year I took 11 classes and received A's in all of them. Could I do a postbac or any other program to help me get into med school? If more information is needed, I'd be more than happy to provide it. Thanks for reading this long post.

 

[DrMidlife]

Could I do a postbac or any other program to help me get into med school?

Hi -

First, breathe. You're going to be okay.

Second, don't compare your path to med school to anybody else's path. Your path will be different. You're on an URM GPA comeback. There are just not very many people on that path with you. So don't hold up other premeds as a ruler to measure yourself by - the units don't match.

Third, take a look at premed programs for disadvantaged students. I made a list of them here, category 5, and that list is pretty old, so there might be new programs as well. You should be able to get into a program that is designed to help you build the skills that will get you to where you can represent an underrepresented physician demographic. These programs tend to be inexpensive and very, very supportive.

Fourth, expect that you'll need to invest a few more years of preparation before you take on applying to med school. This is a good thing. You have time to figure some things out. The world will not end because you're 25 and not in med school yet, for instance. If you spend an extra year or two working on your academics & test taking skills, it will be worth it. I recommend slowing down, adding years to your premed career, to anybody with a sub-3.0. Getting in isn't the hardest part: doing well in med school will suck if you're not prepared.

Fifth. find mentors like this one. Find physicians or med students who came from a similar background, who can understand your family's concerns and can understand how it feels to be fighting against the dominant rich white kid demographic.

Lastly, this is all going to come down to how hard you want to work, and simply not quitting. When you get overwhelmed or depressed at the extent of what you're trying to do, don't use that momentary feeling to quit or stop. Take a break, sure, get help, sure, just don't quit and don't stop working really hard.

Best of luck to you.

 

[TNALgirl]

Hey everyone. 🙂

I definitely qualify for the underdogs in terms of GPA! So I thought I'd ask your opinions. Here's a little bg:

I went to a rural, state school. College was a rocky start for me (not that I'm making excuses, because there are none- I should have done better). I just got diagnosed with UC a couple months ago, but I had problems with it since my college career began. During my first 2 years, my grandmother was diagnosed with Alzheimer's, my family went to war and I was caught in the middle, and I went through some really bad depression thanks to my own stupidity at dating a verbally and emotionally abusive jerk.

So, I graduated with a overall 3.18, but I had to retake organic and calculus. So my science GPA with retakes was a 2.824, and without retakes it's a 3.065. I've taken the MCAT twice. First time was a 25R (VR-10, PS-6, BS-9). I retook and got a 28O (terrible essay questions!) with a 9, 9, 10 breakdown.

I did a biology/chemistry double major in 4 years, did two years of intense research experiece, and have a ton of ECs and leadership experience. I've presented my research at several meetings, but no publications.

I really want to do an MD/PhD, but I know my MCAT/GPA aren't high enough for that, so I was thinking I'd just apply to the PhD portion after my first 2 years (IF I ever get in, haha). I'll be attending an SMP in the fall, so at least I'll have that to prove I can handle the load.

My top choice school is UAB. I'm a TN resident, so obviously I'll apply to Memphis and ETSU. But UAB is my ultimate. I think I have a good shot even though I'm not an AL state resident, because my mom is originally from AL, so that side of my family all live down there, in and around Bham, actually. Also, my mom just got a job in AL, so my parents are looking at relocating. My dad already works in AL, and their house is only 7 minutes from the state line anyway.

Whew! Lots of BG! Sorry. So, questions are: 1.) Thoughts on my chances? 2.) Retake MCAT? My advisor had said NO, absolutely NOT. 3.) UAB feasible? 4.) This SMP a good thing? And 5.) Any other adivce you want to give me?

Thanks guys. Sorry for the long post! I tried to cut some out.

 

[DrMidlife]

All those acronyms surrounded by oceans of text strike me as defensive contempt for the reader. You're making me work awfully hard to comprehend.

2.) Retake MCAT? My advisor had said NO, absolutely NOT.

Your adviser said absolutely not out of fear that your score will go down. Which would be very bad.

But I'd say yes, retake, and get an above average MCAT. You're trying to get into a public school as an out of stater. Generally you have to have better than the instater's averages to get in. If both your GPA and your MCAT are below average, applying as an out of stater (OOS) is a waste of time and money.

Look for old posts from DrJD, who did the Gtown SMP, retook the MCAT for like a 37, and got into Arkansas. That's the closest case study I know of.

3.) UAB feasible?

Find somebody from your SMP who got into UAB as an out of stater. If their stats are as low as yours, then sure, UAB is feasible.

What you'll probably have to do to get into UAB is:
1. Finish your SMP with a great GPA
2. Retake the MCAT and get above average (32+)
3. Establish a domicile in Alabama and apply as a resident

You are not at all likely to get residency consideration for having some family in Alabama. If your parents didn't pay taxes there, then the state doesn't owe you jack. If you want to be considered a resident for the sake of med school admissions, then play the game: get a job, pay rent, pay taxes. Usually you have to do this for 12 months prior to the start of school to claim residency. Pretty much only Ohio lets you become a resident of the state by going to school there.

4.) This SMP a good thing?

No idea, you didn't say what SMP you're in.

5.) Any other adivce you want to give me?

If you're serious about MD/PhD then you should not do the SMP, at least not yet. You need lab research cred. Spend a couple years working in a lab and get a paper out.

But honestly I'd recommend putting aside the PhD and focusing on being ready for med school. Not on getting in, but on being ready. In my view, it's worth it to take on the premed load of suffering required to get more MCAT points, and to do a full year of hard science with a 3.7+, not because it'll get you in, but because then you've built up the academic muscle to have med school not suck. The 4.0 geniuses feel plenty of pain; the 3.ish kids are not at all happy.

Best of luck to you.

 

[TWOOFIVE]

Hi guys, I thought I'd throw in my problem in here.

I have a bachelor's in Chem and got a 2.23 gpa when i graduated, low i know hence me posting here lol.

I'm just wondering what steps i should take, what I should do? Can I apply to an SMP program with this in my transcript and get in the program? or formal postbacc? and if so which schools might accomodate my standing? Thanks for your input kind fellows.

 

[DrMidlife]

I already responded here.

 

[TNALgirl]

All those acronyms surrounded by oceans of text strike me as defensive contempt for the reader. You're making me work awfully hard to comprehend.



I'm sorry, I was just trying to shorten a bit, since my whole post was a little lengthy. I was trying to get everything in because I've noticed a lot of people don't give all the information at once, and then when people try to help they end up asking a lot of questions of the OP in order to give good advice.

Sorry it was difficult. Thanks for taking the time to reply though. I appreciate it.


EDIT: The reason I say I thought I had a decent chance with UAB even though I am not a state resident is because they ask about strong ties. My parents and half my family living there would be strong ties. I would want to stay in Alabama.

 

[DrMidlife]

EDIT: The reason I say I thought I had a decent chance with UAB even though I am not a state resident is because they ask about strong ties. My parents and half my family living there would be strong ties. I would want to stay in Alabama.

I think you might want to do more homework on what constitutes state residency for the purposes of higher education. If you are claimed as a dependent on your parents' taxes, and your parents reside in AL, then you're an AL resident regardless of where you sleep. In this case you could have difficulty claiming TN residency. I'm not a lawyer; please do the research.

 

[TNALgirl]

I am a TN resident because I am married, and my husband is a TN resident. All I was saying was that having family in AL is considered close ties by UAB, per their site.

 

[RogueUnicorn]

Hey everyone. 🙂

I definitely qualify for the underdogs in terms of GPA! So I thought I'd ask your opinions. Here's a little bg:

I went to a rural, state school. College was a rocky start for me (not that I'm making excuses, because there are none- I should have done better). I just got diagnosed with UC a couple months ago, but I had problems with it since my college career began. During my first 2 years, my grandmother was diagnosed with Alzheimer's, my family went to war and I was caught in the middle, and I went through some really bad depression thanks to my own stupidity at dating a verbally and emotionally abusive jerk.

So, I graduated with a overall 3.18, but I had to retake organic and calculus. So my science GPA with retakes was a 2.824, and without retakes it's a 3.065. I've taken the MCAT twice. First time was a 25R (VR-10, PS-6, BS-9). I retook and got a 28O (terrible essay questions!) with a 9, 9, 10 breakdown.

I did a biology/chemistry double major in 4 years, did two years of intense research experiece, and have a ton of ECs and leadership experience. I've presented my research at several meetings, but no publications.

I really want to do an MD/PhD, but I know my MCAT/GPA aren't high enough for that, so I was thinking I'd just apply to the PhD portion after my first 2 years (IF I ever get in, haha). I'll be attending an SMP in the fall, so at least I'll have that to prove I can handle the load.

My top choice school is UAB. I'm a TN resident, so obviously I'll apply to Memphis and ETSU. But UAB is my ultimate. I think I have a good shot even though I'm not an AL state resident, because my mom is originally from AL, so that side of my family all live down there, in and around Bham, actually. Also, my mom just got a job in AL, so my parents are looking at relocating. My dad already works in AL, and their house is only 7 minutes from the state line anyway.

Whew! Lots of BG! Sorry. So, questions are: 1.) Thoughts on my chances? 2.) Retake MCAT? My advisor had said NO, absolutely NOT. 3.) UAB feasible? 4.) This SMP a good thing? And 5.) Any other adivce you want to give me?

Thanks guys. Sorry for the long post! I tried to cut some out.

there's a physician-scientist forum that would be of use to you, but be aware that MD/PhD programs as a whole tend to have higher GPA/MCAT combinations than the straight MD programs. also, what do you mean by "intense" research experiences? this will probably determine your shot at MD/PhD. i'm going to be honest with you, all my measurables were a lot higher than yours across the board and i was still a bubble candidate at mid-tier programs.

 

[TNALgirl]

Thanks! 🙂 I know it's a long shot. Right now, I'm just focusing on doing well in this one-year masters' program I'll start in the fall and trying to get in to regular MD school. I was thinking that after my first two years, I could apply to an MSTP or, if it's an informal program, ask about doing the dual path.

If you'd like to know more about my research, I'd love to give you the details. PM me. I enjoyed it a lot, and love talking about it.

I was thinking of retaking the MCAT. I honestly know that I really can do better. The only reason I'm hesitating is just because my advisor said not to since I had such a well-distributed breakdown, even if my actual score was in the "gray area".

Thanks again for the help and advice.

 

[RogueUnicorn]

Thanks! 🙂 I know it's a long shot. Right now, I'm just focusing on doing well in this one-year masters' program I'll start in the fall and trying to get in to regular MD school. I was thinking that after my first two years, I could apply to an MSTP or, if it's an informal program, ask about doing the dual path.

If you'd like to know more about my research, I'd love to give you the details. PM me. I enjoyed it a lot, and love talking about it.

I was thinking of retaking the MCAT. I honestly know that I really can do better. The only reason I'm hesitating is just because my advisor said not to since I had such a well-distributed breakdown, even if my actual score was in the "gray area".

Thanks again for the help and advice.

i'm primarily interested in clarifying what you mean by intense, specifically in terms of hours/wk and environment, not the substance of the research itself. depending on how strong your research background is, md/phd might actually present a higher chance of success

 

[TNALgirl]

I was in the lab probably 15 hours a week, sometimes more. Weekends saw me put in a lot of hours. I would start a transformation experiment that morning, come in to continue when I got out of class, and then set alarms to wake me up to finish once my culture reached mid-log. I stayed over breaks to work on my project. I would be in the lab early and leave late. Sometimes my weeks were closer to 25 hours of lab work. It was hard but worth it. I really enjoyed it. I ended up with a freezer box full of strains. Haha. 🙂

 

[TWOOFIVE]

I think you might want to do more homework on what constitutes state residency for the purposes of higher education. If you are claimed as a dependent on your parents' taxes, and your parents reside in AL, then you're an AL resident regardless of where you sleep. In this case you could have difficulty claiming TN residency. I'm not a lawyer; please do the research.

ANyone with a more encouraging help out there? lol.

 

[bigloley]

ANyone with a more encouraging help out there? lol.

It's going to be a very uphill battle with very little room for error. I say you'd need at least 60 credits postbacc work of science, at least at a 3.7 preferably higher. Then you're going to need to ROCK the MCAT, at least a 34 or above, preferably in the 36+ range. You're also going to have to have stellar ec's, such as hundreds of clinical and shadowing experience. After that, it will still be an uphill battle getting into medical school, but I'd say an SMP will take a chance with you. Try for a high linkage program such as EVMS or U of Cinci. It's going to take you at least 3 years.

If you still want to continue, all the luck to you, but be advised it will probably take you at least 10 years to get into, complete medical school and finish a residency. If you're not rich, that's going to be a TON of money to pay back/lost by not working. Plan accordingly with expectations of family/financial situation. Not being a doctor is not the end of the world, just know you are prepared to make the sacrifices and make sure it's worth it for you. Good luck

 

[deleted248403]

ANyone with a more encouraging help out there? lol.

You just want to be told what you want to hear - but that doesnt make it good advice. It just means we'd be lying to you and you'd be lying to yourself

Time for some accountability....

 

[EnergyDrink]

I'm kind of in an odd scenario...

I'm doing my MS at a medical school (2 years), which is a research oriented MS (not an SMP) - its essentially the first 2 years of a PhD program with a steady lab rather than rotations. My courses overlap with some of the SMP program here, but its much more rigorous than the SMP. We also have more difficult exams. GPA: 3.90

I also have a 2.99 cGPA (Year 1/2 = 2.65, Year 3/4 = 3.50). C's in a few of the pre-reqs, A's in the harder sciences (I was an idiot my first 2 years).

Should I look for an SMP? I feel like I already completed one =/

My research adviser is medical school faculty (LOR)
I don't have an official MCAT, but I'll probably land somewhere around a 36.

My ECs are superb. I'm working on more clinical experience this summer.

 

[DrMidlife]

I'm kind of in an odd scenario...

I'd say get an appointment with your school's director of admissions. Home court advantage should give you access.

Bring a one-pager that makes you really easy to understand - make it super easy for him/her to see your app package and see that cGPA in context. He/she may not have commentary that you can leverage outside your current school, but it's possible.

You might be surprised at how much work med school or an SMP is, compared to your research masters. Not a good idea to try to compare the two, anyway: that's just contentious outside the research labs. Apples & oranges.

Keep in mind that it's not the business of med school admissions to judge the rigor of your grad program. It's their job to judge your undergrad credentials & MCAT. How you think you should be perceived won't be a factor. To wit: your schools' dean of MD admissions might have no opinion at all about the work you're doing, and you'll have at most the equivalent of an elevator ride pitch to sell your story.

I don't have an official MCAT, but I'll probably land somewhere around a 36.

If I had a dime for every time I've heard "36" and never seen the poster again (because they got a 22 or whatnot), I'd have a big pile of dimes. If you've hit 38 on multiple practice tests, then 36 is reasonable. Otherwise you're full of it. Just sayin.

Best of luck to you.

 

[EnergyDrink]

I'd say get an appointment with your school's director of admissions. Home court advantage should give you access.

Bring a one-pager that makes you really easy to understand - make it super easy for him/her to see your app package and see that cGPA in context. He/she may not have commentary that you can leverage outside your current school, but it's possible.

You might be surprised at how much work med school or an SMP is, compared to your research masters. Not a good idea to try to compare the two, anyway: that's just contentious outside the research labs. Apples & oranges.

Keep in mind that it's not the business of med school admissions to judge the rigor of your grad program. It's their job to judge your undergrad credentials & MCAT. How you think you should be perceived won't be a factor. To wit: your schools' dean of MD admissions might have no opinion at all about the work you're doing, and you'll have at most the equivalent of an elevator ride pitch to sell your story.

If I had a dime for every time I've heard "36" and never seen the poster again (because they got a 22 or whatnot), I'd have a big pile of dimes. If you've hit 38 on multiple practice tests, then 36 is reasonable. Otherwise you're full of it. Just sayin.

Best of luck to you.

Thanks for the advice.

I certainly don't mean to compare medical school to graduate school... I wouldn't dare. Let's drop that now.

 

[zdlee]

So, just another low gpa story to add to this thread...I'm currently in mid-career working full time and recently decided to go for dental school. I graduated 7yrs ago with my BA, cumGPA was around 2.6, and no science classes.

Last fall I took bio 1 and another math course (total 8.5 credits) while still working full time, and it was not easy. Of course now I regret wasting away the precious time I had in college not having to worry about work, only to goof off and fall into academic probation freshman year. So now all I do is work and school, and still I need more time for study (it's been a while and i'm a little rusty). I got a C in Bio 1. This past spring I took Bio 2 and GenChem 1 and got a C+ and C, respectively.

I still have to take GenChem 2 (starting in July), and in the fall OChem 1 and Phys1, followed by OChem 2 and Phys 2. And those are only the prereques. Now I am at a loss of words and wondering if there's even a tiny speck of a chance for the admissions committee to even read past the low gpa. I still have to take the DATs, shadow, get LORs, and work on the essay.

Looks like if I manage to put in an application for dschool it won't be sent out till august, at the soonest, and in my case I shouldn't even bother until next year's cycle and send out applications in May/June.

Considering the circumstances, and if all went as planned, I'd finish dschool just past my mid 30's, then complete a year of residency, and then finally consider starting up a practice, which is what I'm planning. But seeing how poorly I'm doing so far I have little faith in the way things are going.

What I'd like to know is, are there anybody in, or know somebody, who is going through a similar situation, and whether they pulled through the other end.

I have read all the optimistic threads of low gpa's being rectified and eventual success stories, which we all appreciate and gives us hope. Can anybody offer me any hope, or otherwise put me out of my misery. What are the alternatives then, dental hygenist? I'm sorry but I've never heard of anybody telling me "I've got a dental hygenist appointment this afternoon" (lol).

I'm guessing one option is to quit my job, enroll fulltime and along with the remaining prereqs take some upper level bio courses, ace the DAT's, and send in app early.

Thank you all and again, I really do enjoy all the success stories, and I apologize for such a long post. All advice, suggestions, orders, comments, rants, etc are much appreciated.

 

[DrMidlife]

S...cumGPA was around 2.6, and no science classes...Last fall I took bio 1 and another math course (total 8.5 credits) while still working full time, and it was not easy. Of course now I regret wasting away the precious time I had in college not having to worry about work, only to goof off and fall into academic probation freshman year. So now all I do is work and school, and still I need more time for study (it's been a while and i'm a little rusty). I got a C in Bio 1. This past spring I took Bio 2 and GenChem 1 and got a C+ and C, respectively...I still have to take GenChem 2 (starting in July), and in the fall OChem 1 and Phys1, followed by OChem 2 and Phys 2. And those are only the prereques. Now I am at a loss of words and wondering if there's even a tiny speck of a chance for the admissions committee to even read past the low gpa.

Stop taking classes. Do not pass go, do not collect $200. Just stop. You are permanently ruining your ability to ever get into a US dental (?) school by making your GPA go down. You're giving admissions committees full permission to say no: you haven't given them any reason to be confident in you. A's tend to give adcoms reasons to be confident.

In particular, do not keep taking prereqs. You most likely are going to have to retake all the bio & chem you've just done.

What you should be doing is starting at the beginning: math and maybe introductory science, maybe even English. One class, get an A, end of story.

More details on way-below-3.0 recovery here: http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showthread.php?p=11083370#post11083370

Best of luck to you.

 

[zdlee]

thank you midlife, straight to the point and no bs, wish I found your thread sooner. It doesn't help much when people tell you "anything is possible" (not to say that optimism is bad), but does contribute to delusions. I don't have the luxury of another 3,4,5 years for retaking classes to fix my GPA, unlike many other recent grads. Perhaps it's time to face the music and take a bow. Some decisions to make, perhaps move to Tx...but I love NY!

Thanks again and best of luck to everybody

 

[gujuDoc]

God is great!!!!!!!!! Got accepted to med school today at Wayne state!!!!!

Never give up or stop believing.

 

[bcpmawesome]

When is the best time to study for and take the MCAT for those with low GPA's? My undergrad GPA is really bad: 2.6... Should I study for MCAT over the summer before doing anything about my GPA? Or should I be looking at post-bac programs now (or at least consecutive with MCAT prep)? Thanks.

 

[bdvz]

God is great!!!!!!!!! Got accepted to med school today at Wayne state!!!!!

Never give up or stop believing.

Congratulations gujuDoc!!! 🙂

 

[gujuDoc]

When is the best time to study for and take the MCAT for those with low GPA's? My undergrad GPA is really bad: 2.6... Should I study for MCAT over the summer before doing anything about my GPA? Or should I be looking at post-bac programs now (or at least consecutive with MCAT prep)? Thanks.

Do 40-60 hours of postbac classes, then take the MCAT. Postbac doesn't have to be a formal postbac.

 

[greencrescent]

Hey Guys, I am going to get str8 to the point.

I graduated from my undergrad in 2009. (graduated with over 170 hours of course work)

Undergrad Course Work

Ugpa - 2.5
BCPM - 2.4

Completed All Pre-Med Courses and about 8 other Science Courses on Top of Pre-Med Courses

Degree was in Health Sciences

Also I have re-taken 4 of my pre-med courses and avg a B- on my retakes.

What Have I been doing for the Past Two Years?

Working in the marketing industry

Extracurricular Activities

Over 100+ Hours of Volunteering at Hospitals, Clinics, etc during 2007-2009
Research at Dermatology Lab during 2006-2008 (No Publish Work)
Started and am Currently on the Board of Directors of a Non-Profit Organization
Have many more extra-curric activities but it was during 2005-2008 Period.

What I would like to do?

I would like to go back and try medicine, whether it's Carrib, DO, or MD (Preferably MD in the States)

Post Bacc vs Formal Postbacc?

The only way I can think of getting back into Medicine is going through a Post bacc program. My question is what are your thoughts on a Formal Post bacc vs a Informal Post bacc, and which programs would you suggest?

I have taken a look at UPENN's program, Harvard Extension, Bryn Mawr, but I have noticed many of those programs require students that are coming from a good academic background, which is where I am lacking.

I have yet to find a Formal Post Bacc program that would be willing to take someone from a poor science and undergrad background into their program.

It's been almost 3 years since my last science course I have taken, so do you guys think those previous science courses from my undergrad would be expired and I would be able to retake my science courses being on a fresh brand new slate?

Let me know what you guys think,

Thanks

 

[deleted248403]

Ugpa - 2.5
BCPM - 2.4
I would like to go back and try medicine, whether it's Carrib, DO, or MD (Preferably MD in the States)

I have taken a look at UPENN's program, Harvard Extension, Bryn Mawr, but I have noticed many of those programs require students that are coming from a good academic background, which is where I am lacking.

Quickest way is to the Carib.

You won't get into any of those post-bacs with those grades.

Go to a CC, take an intro science course, get an A . If you can't do that; then seriously reconsider if medicine is right for you.

If you get that A, then look at your local 4-yr univ and look at applying to do a 2nd degree. Then you'll prob have to do an SMP. You are going to need a lot of GPA help.

 

[DrMidlife]

It's been almost 3 years since my last science course I have taken, so do you guys think those previous science courses from my undergrad would be expired and I would be able to retake my science courses being on a fresh brand new slate?

Let me know what you guys think,

Thanks

I agree w/Rob.

GPA is more permanent than a tattoo, except after 10 years in TX.

Here's more detail on how to proceed: http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showpost.php?p=11083370&postcount=3

Best of luck to you.

 

[greencrescent]

Hey thanks guys I really appreciate it.

So I called Drexel and they told me the IHS program would really help me out, even with a low gpa. After doing a yr of IHS than depending on how well I perform I would be able to get into the IMS program the following year, and than hopefully medical school after that.

So what do you guys think about this process? Getting into Drexel's Post-Bacc program?

To me it looks pretty good, since its a legit program designed to help students from low academic standings back into being competitive for medical school.

The only issue I have is the "risk" and the Tuition costs. I have no idea how I am going to be able to pay for my Tuition and Living Costs.

 

[DrMidlife]

Hey thanks guys I really appreciate it.

So I called Drexel and they told me the IHS program would really help me out, even with a low gpa. After doing a yr of IHS than depending on how well I perform I would be able to get into the IMS program the following year, and than hopefully medical school after that.

So what do you guys think about this process? Getting into Drexel's Post-Bacc program?

To me it looks pretty good, since its a legit program designed to help students from low academic standings back into being competitive for medical school.

The only issue I have is the "risk" and the Tuition costs. I have no idea how I am going to be able to pay for my Tuition and Living Costs.

While Drexel has some good programs, I suggest that the part of Drexel that you're talking to is focused on selling you a product. Out here in Seattle, Drexel advertises its special programs on the side of buses. That and the video-hall instruction plan and other factors has led me to think of Drexel's special programs as being McWalmart. You need it? They're selling it. Of course they're making it sound like at Drexel you have a straightforward path to your goal through their educational programs. That's their job. I suggest that the products they're selling you will eventually put you in a Carib school out of which you will fail, a couple hundred thousand in debt.

You've taken the prereqs twice and not gotten an A in any of them, correct? I suggest that you are not ready to be talking to a Drexel or other university. I suggest that your next order of business is to go take one class in math or science or maybe English, and get an A. Not a C, not a B-, not a B+, not an A-. Kill that class dead. Until you do this, you have no credibility. And after you get that big fat A, then get 2 big fat A's. If you can't figure out how to get A's, which is a non-trivial problem, then you should not be pursuing med school.

You say you're worried about risk, and I assume the risk you're talking about is that you'll invest time & money and not get into med school on the other side.

The more immediate risk is that you will get more bad grades. You can't get any more bad grades. You are deep in an abandoned well and the rope that you might be able to use to climb out is about 10 feet above your reach. Think of every preliminary A you get as a brick you can stand on. And after you get a bunch of preliminary A's, then you get to start thinking of yourself as a premed, and pursue a premed program.

Best of luck to you.

 

[EagerBeaver]

Hey Guys,

So I graduated last year from McGill with a BSc in Physiology (killer program) though no excuse for my performance. Thought I'd work a bit and try something else, job markets sucked, so no luck. But I did get a public health internship in a developing country during the time.
Im thinking of applying this cycle and the next to the US (MD), and foreign schools (aus, ireland, europe). Not applying to Canada as I have no chance of getting in here.

MCAT 2008 - 29O 9/9/11(bio) (Didn't study for this but retaking it this year hoping for a ~36+, studying like a dog)- Hoping a high MCAT will cover up for the UG-GPA.

UG GPA- 3.0 Flat
BCPM - 2.9
All other- 3.3

I really worked hard to develop good work ethic in the first few years of college. Completely bombed the first year, but I showed an upward trend:

Freshman 2.15
Sophomore 3.16
Junior- 3.17
Senior- 3.53 (Was expecting a much higher senior year gpa but due to extenuating personal circumstances, I completely gave up studying in the middle of the final semester and picked up late).

Related EC's- Interned at a NonProfit: helped launch a RCT on TB patients,
Helped Start a group which ended up raising over $25k for disaster relief in flooded area,
Human Rights College Club VP,
TA position for a semester,
Volunteer in Clinics in Panama,
RA for 1 year in a Cancer Research Lab,
RA for a Hematologist,
Worked with the faculty of arts as an advisor for a bit.

Clinical/shadowing- shadowed residents while RA with hematologist, got a chance to scrub into 2 neurosurgeries as an observer, regularly interacted with patients in panama and with TB patients during internship.

What advice do you guys have? Also I never did college level intro bio, chem and physics (as I got transfer credits from A-levels and WAS NOT ALLOWED to take the classes). Should I take these courses somehow? I was thinking of Also applying to the Georgetown SMP next year, hoping an admission into their science premed program for UG might help my chances there:S.

Im already 24, but really hope/ need to start a Med Program latest by 26. Anyone else been in a similar situation? In Canada?!

 

[phant0m0o0o]

I have always lurked these forums for inspiration as they have given me hope when I had none. I need to know what else I can do before I apply.

Bombed classes about 8-10 years ago. Straight F semesters mixed with a few B's and C's here and there in community college. Managed to get my act together for a few semesters to get into my state school. Bombed there, was diagnosed with extreme depression, forced into wrong major, mother died of cancer, massive school shooting @ building I was scheduled to be in etc. Grades from state school removed, therapy taken, major changed.

about 100 credits of straight A's since, 20+ credits per semester straight sciences, intro and advanced. 2 years worth.

cum/science gpa's
Amcas GPA ~ 3.03/3.3
AACOMAS ~ 3.54/3.7
MCAT being taken july 28th. Avg mcat practice ~ 33

Volunteer religiously at free clinic(last 1 1/2 years, 500+ hours). Run/lead the night clinics, train new volunteers, run labs, administration, triaging assisting in procedures etc.

Outstanding letters of rec from chemistry, biology/dean of science, clinic coordinator and doctors from the clinic.


So far all of this was only possible due to the encouragement of friends, reading these forums and of course many sleepless nights.

I will apply to both D.O. and M.D. as now I have a decent shot at D.O. I was wondering if there is anything I can do to improve my M.D. chances. ~200+ credits taken so I don't know how much more that GPA is going to move up with AMCAS. Is it too early to apply? It has only been 2 years since I have turned it around. I am trying for a few schools this round.

P.S. - please be nice 🙂 I remember when I asked for advice before I started all this and got torn a new one.

 

[phant0m0o0o]

BTW congrats guju! I have seen you on here working towards this for awhile now!!!!!! I take it your postbac/smp worked?? 😀 😀

 

[DrMidlife]

I was wondering if there is anything I can do to improve my M.D. chances. ~200+ credits taken so I don't know how much more that GPA is going to move up with AMCAS. Is it too early to apply? It has only been 2 years since I have turned it around. I am trying for a few schools this round.

If you want to go MD, you should be looking at SMPs. It's really late to be applying for the coming school year now, though. You're in VA, right? Maybe the VCU postbac.

On the subject of getting good advice without getting harshed on here, the strategy I recommend is reading about 100 relevant threads (not posts, threads), start to finish, before posting a question or WAMC. If this sounds like a lot of work, yes, it is, and it's what your competition is doing to take charge of their GPA comebacks. Posting a question hits random responders; reading historical conversations gives you perspective.

Best of luck to you.

 

[phant0m0o0o]

Thanks for the advice. I actually have thought about the SMP programs and even have an in at VCU with Zach. The only issue I have is the money involved and am not quite sure if I can afford it. VCU is actually one of the more affordable ones too. I have talked to the admissions dean(Dr. Whitehurst-Cook) there for the medical school who said I should apply without it and see how it goes but want to maximize my chances in the first round. Short of an SMP theres no other options?

Future- moving to texas to follow wife to grad school. Scribe position? Make money pay off as much as I can of my loans.

 

[DrMidlife]

Future- moving to texas to follow wife to grad school. Scribe position? Make money pay off as much as I can of my loans.

If you'll be in TX, then put all your eggs in that basket, imho. It takes 2 years to establish a domicile there, as a non-student, to get residency. TX also has academic fresh start, some reputable structured postbac/SMPs, and a huge number of inexpensive, good schools (MD & DO).

Again, I recommend doing a lot of SDN reading. You're asking questions that just skim the surface of historical conversations (postbac and nontrad) that will actually educate you and give you perspective about these issues.

Best of luck to you.

 

[bkprodigy]

Hi all,

Just thought I'd share my progress with you all. I think I'm doing everything right at this point and hoping my experience will help those of you with similar circumstance.

I graduated from U of MD in 2007 with a biology degree. My cGPA was 2.62 and sGPA was 2.52. After graduation, I got into military medical research. My life changed ever since.

I was employed full time for three years, doing hands on large animal surgeries in human surgery setting along with visiting physicians. I was lucky enough to learn and perform various surgical procedures. I also have 4 journals and about 15 posters including one international conference presentation.

I knew I had to do something drastic to have a shot at MD school. So I declared part time with research and re-enrolled at U of MD. Up until this point I had 9 credits of grad level biotech courses with 4.0.
I purposefully made my life very miserable for the 3 semesters at UMD. I took 15 credits of most challenging science courses while researching, tutoring, and volunteering at a hospital. After 3 semesters of insanity, I have accrued 54 credits of 4.0. Despite the retake, my MCAT was 33R (10PS 9VR, 14BS) I wish I wasn't ESL...
My cGPA as of now is 3.02 and sGPA is 3.12.

I applied to numerous SMPs this spring and got into a few. I'm waitlisted at gtown and ucinn but with my updated GPA and MCAT, I may have a shot at one of the two. If not, I can go to Drexel or Rosalind.

I'm also applying to 18 schools this cycle. I submitted my primary early and broadly with kick ass personal statement and excellent LORs. I have added my independent research, international medical volunteership, shadowing, and teaching assistantship to help the cause. I'm hoping I will land an acceptance. I will be updating each school with my 1st semester SMP grades. If I don't get in, I'll try again next cycle, which by then, I'm sure I'll be landing at least a few acceptances.

It has not been easy. It's physically, mentally, and financially taxing. Take your time and shoot for excellence instead of measly grades. When you strive to be the best, grades will follow. I'll update with my further progress. Good luck to you all.

 

[SoWasRed]

Hello Student Doctor,

I have been browsing around the website for about a year now but this is my first post. I am in the middle of a post bacc program and could use some advice. I graduated from undergrad in 2005 from a State School in the Philadelphia area with a degree in Communication Studies and Journalism and finished with a G.P.A of 2.71 with college math being the only science class haven taken. I did not put forth very much effort in my scholastics but did play college football for 4 years. I have been successful in my career advancing to district sales manager for a large company. I never had any experience in a clinical setting before a few years ago but that has changed. For the past two years I have been taking care of my elderly father who unfortunately has had many health issues. Being in the clinical setting has made me realize what I now consider my dream of becoming a physician. Earlier this year I started a post bacc at the same school I went to for undergrad and so far I have taken the following classes:

-Biology - A-
-Microbiology - A
-Chem 1 - A -
-Physics - A
-Statistics - A

I have had the labs associated with all the science classes as well. My bcpm gpa is now 3.82.

I am starting to volunteer in a formal pre-med volunteering program and should have 250 + hours by the time I apply next spring. My questions is "if" I am able to finish up my post bacc having my cGPA at 3.0-3.1 and my sGPA at 3.8-3.9 and receive an MCAT score of 30 + will I be competitive for MD/DO programs? I have already made a list of the 20+ schools I will be applying to and they are a mixture of MD and DO. I should also mention that I will be 29 turning 30 when applying next year. Any advice would be greatly appreciated.

-Thanks

 

[rupharm]

Hi here are my stats
3.0 ugrad
3.25 science (including respective labs)
4.0 grad

mcats - will take next summer

lots of volunteering as emt and certified nurse aid at nursing home
shadowed doctor
many ec, with leadership positions ( 3)
work history (both health and non health related)
will graduate with a pharmD (plz dont be mad at me and say why did I take up someones seat bc I worked hard to get that seat and I enjoy the profession ...just want more)

what do you think my mcat has to be to get a shot at us med school (not picky I just want to get in)?? Thanks a lot,,,,much appreciation 😉

 

[sublm128]

well im OFFICIALLY screwed.

BCPM 2.65
overall 2.31

MASTERS in molecular biology Graduate January 2012
GPA 3.72 (32 credits)

2 years clinical experience as a technician in hospital and endolab.
2 years of research in biomedical sci. with journal publication and poster
About 1 year of shadowing
No volunteering

MCAT 30R

ANY ADVICE? DO I HAVE ANY CHANCE FOR A US M.D. SCHOOL? or even a D.O. school?

I dont even know why im bothering applying to med school at this point. As much as I enjoy interacting with patients i might be better off pursuing a phd. After all, my masters credits would transfer towards that.

🙁🙁🙁🙁🙁🙁🙁🙁

 

[gunito]

well im OFFICIALLY screwed.

BCPM 2.65
overall 2.31

MASTERS in molecular biology Graduate January 2012
GPA 3.72 (32 credits)

2 years clinical experience as a technician in hospital and endolab.
2 years of research in biomedical sci. with journal publication and poster
About 1 year of shadowing
No volunteering

MCAT 30R

ANY ADVICE? DO I HAVE ANY CHANCE FOR A US M.D. SCHOOL? or even a D.O. school?

I dont even know why im bothering applying to med school at this point. As much as I enjoy interacting with patients i might be better off pursuing a phd. After all, my masters credits would transfer towards that.

🙁🙁🙁🙁🙁🙁🙁🙁

Youre MCAT score is good, so you have that working for you. A post bacc would help, but that would take at least two years. Im pretty sure 2.75 is the MINIMUM gpa to receive a secondary app, so I dont know why you would apply with such an abysmal gpa. My gpa was right around what you have and I am up to a 2.73 after a year (gotta love grade replacement). How did you get into a masters program with a gpa like that? If you want to go to med school, then you'll fight through the rough patches and get there. I hope you didnt actually apply with a 2.31. Even with a 45 MCAT you probably wouldn't get in. Patience and persistence are your friends.

 

[deleted248403]

BCPM 2.65
overall 2.31

MASTERS in molecular biology Graduate January 2012
GPA 3.72 (32 credits)

MCAT 30R

ANY ADVICE? DO I HAVE ANY CHANCE FOR A US M.D. SCHOOL? or even a D.O. school?

I dont even know why im bothering applying to med school at this point.

Nor do I - with those grades and MCAT you have zero chance of acceptance. Like literally zero.

Stop the process now, you are just wasting money

 

[deleted248403]

Hi here are my stats
will graduate with a pharmD (plz dont be mad at me and say why did I take up someones seat bc I worked hard to get that seat and I enjoy the profession ...just want more)

what do you think my mcat has to be to get a shot at us med school (not picky I just want to get in)?? Thanks a lot,,,,much appreciation 😉

31+ for MD

And in regard to "plz dont be mad at me and say why did I take up someones seat bc I worked hard to get that seat and I enjoy the profession ...just want more" - you'll hear it on your interview too; and just want more, isn't going to be a satisfactory answer in that situation so i'd start thinking of a better one

 

[pancakesyrup]

well im OFFICIALLY screwed.

BCPM 2.65
overall 2.31

MASTERS in molecular biology Graduate January 2012
GPA 3.72 (32 credits)

2 years clinical experience as a technician in hospital and endolab.
2 years of research in biomedical sci. with journal publication and poster
About 1 year of shadowing
No volunteering

MCAT 30R

I dont even know why im bothering applying to med school at this point. As much as I enjoy interacting with patients i might be better off pursuing a phd. After all, my masters credits would transfer towards that.

🙁🙁🙁🙁🙁🙁🙁🙁

http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showpost.php?p=11083370&postcount=3

ANY ADVICE? DO I HAVE ANY CHANCE FOR A US M.D. SCHOOL?

No

or even a D.O. school?

Very narrow chance.

 

[DrMidlife]

My questions is "if" I am able to finish up my post bacc having my cGPA at 3.0-3.1 and my sGPA at 3.8-3.9 and receive an MCAT score of 30 + will I be competitive for MD/DO programs?

Put everything you've got into getting your cumulative over 3.0 and getting your MCAT over 30. Get your MCAT score back before June 1 (which means schedule your exam for April) so that you can apply early. If you get 32+, then you might have some MD luck. If you get lower than that, then save your money and don't apply MD except for your state schools.

Make sure you've done your homework about DO schools. Don't set yourself up to get accepted to a school you're not willing to attend. How to figure this out? Read everything ever posted in the osteo forum that didn't come from a premed.

I should also mention that I will be 29 turning 30 when applying next year.

Assume this is an asset, if your maturity and experience are evident.

Best of luck to you.

 

[DrMidlife]

Anyone else been in a similar situation? In Canada?!

I've been hesitating to respond because I don't know how GPA comebacks play out for Canadians.

I suggest that you might get somewhere if you contact the Gtown SMP and ask to talk to Canadian grads. I'm suggesting Gtown because they have the most volume, thus the highest likelihood of a useful contact.

If you get useful info there or on SDN, kindly come back and post your findings.

Best of luck to you.

 

[SoWasRed]

Dr. Midlife,

Thanks for the advice. One other question. I am being told by the PreMed Coordinator at my school that not having any formal research/publications will not be that big of an issue when applying at my age. Do you agree with this and think I should focus on GPA/MCAT/Volunteering hours or do you think I should try and get some some research in? I have been building good relationships with my professors and a few have already said they will give me great letters of recommendation.

 

[DrMidlife]

Dr. Midlife,

Thanks for the advice. One other question. I am being told by the PreMed Coordinator at my school that not having any formal research/publications will not be that big of an issue when applying at my age. Do you agree with this and think I should focus on GPA/MCAT/Volunteering hours or do you think I should try and get some some research in? I have been building good relationships with my professors and a few have already said they will give me great letters of recommendation.

I don't think the added app benefit of research experience is going to be worth the delay in applying to get some. Addressing GPA and killing the MCAT are magnitudes more important, imho.

 

[rupharm]

31+ for MD

And in regard to "plz dont be mad at me and say why did I take up someones seat bc I worked hard to get that seat and I enjoy the profession ...just want more" - you'll hear it on your interview too; and just want more, isn't going to be a satisfactory answer in that situation so i'd start thinking of a better one

thanks for your help and yes I def have a better reason than that,lol this was just for the forum. Again, thanks for your advice and input 🙂