The problem with low veterinary experience hours..

[jenkxo]

Long story short, I am super bothered by applicants that are getting in with low veterinary experience hours. And listing 'Pet Ownership' as a experience? That is not something I think anyone should be placing on an application to medical school.

Back to my point. I don't think anyone is doing themselves any favors by not working in a veterinary hospital/ veterinary setting before starting veterinary school. The sad, very real fact of the matter is that many graduate schools are choosing to admit veterinary students based of the fact that they will pass the program, gain the stats they need saying they had lots of graduates, and continue the cycle taking peoples money. They have no problem spitting you out into a field someone may be book smart about but not really have a real passion about. I personally have worked in a veterinary hospital for the last 8 years of my life, accumulating thousands of hours of experience, working full time most of my undergraduate career. I know the good and the bad of veterinary medicine, I understand what I'm getting myself into, and I love what I do. I know no matter what I will love being a vet.
At the hospital I'm currently working at as a technician, I have the pleasure of working with newly graduated veterinary students. Sadly, more then half of them regret there decisions DAILY choosing veterinary medicine. If schools were more keen on hiring those who have veterinary experience, MAYBE there wouldn't be such a high rate of those that switch into different jobs after graduating vet school.

There are so many things to say regarding this topic, but long story short I am strongly against schools accepting applicants based mainly on grades. And to those who are reading this with low veterinary hours, you are really putting yourself at a disadvantage not only in school, but in your future as a vet.

On a side note, I am not a jaded applicant for this cycle, I was accepted into veterinary school and will be attending in the fall. However, I do want to hear/read everyone's thoughts on this. Please bite, chew, and scratch at what I have to say, or meow and purr; what ever you desire.

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[KCgophervet]

For one, I listed pet ownership as animal experience because first of all it makes sense. Someone who has had the pleasure of caring for their own animals has animal experience that someone who hasn't had pets. It's just true. Second of all, I specifically asked my IS school if it should be listed or not and they told me yes, definitely, without hesitation. I'm not sure why you have a problem with that. Especially since it isn't "Vet Experience," just "Animal Experience."

Secondly, not everyone who applies to vet school wants to go work in a private practice clinic. Thankfully, I was in the last applicant round of VMCAS where research and vet experience were under the same category, because I want to be a lab animal vet. Don't get me wrong, I still had some lowly SA vet hours (I want to say 100?), but those hours actually deterred me away from vet school for years. It wasn't until I got some "atypical" vet experience that brought me back to the profession.

I understand the point you're trying to make, but so long as people are doing their research and have at least a respectable amount of "vet experience" I don't think you can make a sweeping statement like that, how anyone with low vet experience is doing themselves a huge disservice. It may be true that I've never placed a catheter before vet school or drawn blood from anything bigger than a rat, but I don't feel terribly disadvantaged in vet school and I don't think it will make me any less of a vet.

You may not be a jaded applicant for this cycle, but the overwhelming negativity for anyone's life experience that varies from your own (of thousands and thousands of hours of experience) is not going to help you in the future, as you judge colleagues and classmates harshly instead of embracing those who took a different path than you did.

 

[Puffins]

You may not be a jaded applicant for this cycle, but the overwhelming negativity for anyone's life experience that varies from your own (of thousands and thousands of hours of experience) is not going to help you in the future, as you judge colleagues and classmates harshly instead of embracing those who took a different path than you did.

Seriously. There are many ways to vet school. Be proud of your accomplishment on getting into vet school and don't disparage your classmates because they didn't take the same route as you.

 

[jiggawigga]

I think its incredibly arrogant and naive for you to think that you know the good and bad of veterinary medicine when you've confined yourself to working at the same hospital for 8 years. First of all, clinical practice is not the only thing you can do with a DVM. People don't necessarily need "thousands and thousands" of hours to figure out whether or not a field is right for them. Your "high rate" of those switching to a different career is arbitrary and based on your personal experiences only. Also, your argument is weak because you rely on an extreme example to support it. I could easily counter-argue that those with a huge amount of hours working in a veterinary hospital who do poorly in undergraduate will not stand up to the rigorous curriculum of vet school.

btw congrats on admission to vet school

 

[Puffins]

PS OP: The 8 years/thousands of hours you've accumulated in preparation for vet school does not give you the right to assume that you are more passionate, more dedicated, or more certain of your veterinary goals than other applicants, successful or no.

 

[Trilt]

I don't think I will be any less of a vet because I had lower experience hours when I applied. Life is what you make of it, and every person has their own story and their own reasons for their actions. Nobody will argue that having a good idea of the field you're entering isn't important... but accumulating thousands of hours of experience is absolutely not guaranteed to give you that perspective, just like having less doesn't mean you don't know what you're doing and will regret your decisions.

Expressing these sorts of opinions IRL will very quickly lose you friends who may have very different (but still very valid!) life experiences than you, btw.

 

[K9Mechanic]

I am kinda shocked if "pet ownership" actually amounts to anything tangible in the application process. I have never met an aspiring vet that had never owned a pet (wow, too many rhymes). That's like trying to be a nascar driver without ever getting your license.

 

[pp9]

That last line....what?

Just going to comment on thr pet ownership: I disagree with listing dogs and cats. However, owning horses or farm animals is something worthy of noting IMO. That experience does set you apart. I actually listed owning my guinea pig, but only calculated the last week of her life and the time I spent caring for her in that last week. She was being hand fed and medicated. Not everyone has experience like that with pocket pets, so I figured it would be a nice thing to add.

If a school wants to ignore pet ownership, that is their decision. Not yours.

 

[DVMDream]

The arrogance is high in this one.

I had 7 years of private practice vet experience going into vet school (well over 10,000 hours) and while it helps in a sense of I have heard of that before and I have seen that before, your classmates who only have a handful of hours are NOT at a disadvantage. There are 41534124 possibilities of what you can do with a vet degree, your narrow view is going to hurt you in vet school as well as your attitude. I enjoy learning from those that have different experiences than I. I haven't done much with large animals, equine, public health, or research and those classmates that have are an invaluable resource for me, just like I am for them with small animal medicine. We all lean on each other and learn from one another. And let me get this point across fast and clear, you might have worked in a vet clinic for 8 years but you are not prepared for the mountain that is vet school, you will not know everything and you had better learn that now before vet school smacks you across the face and firmly shoves you off your pedestal.

Vet school is not equal to practicing medicine and MANY people second guess going through it especially with the costs associated NOT just those that had low experience hours going in. Not only that but unless you are asking every vet student how much prior experience they had coming into vet school, it would be impossible for you to know and if you are asking that, then you are seriously being rude. Who the hell cares? It isn't important and doesn't matter once a person is in vet school.

I sure hope you lose the attitude or you are going to be very lonely in vet school.

 

[DVMDream]

That last line....what?

Just going to comment on thr pet ownership: I disagree with listing dogs and cats. However, owning horses or farm animals is something worthy of noting IMO. That experience does set you apart. I actually listed owning my guinea pig, but only calculated the last week of her life and the time I spent caring for her in that last week. She was being hand fed and medicated. Not everyone has experience like that with pocket pets, so I figured it would be a nice thing to add.

If a school wants to ignore pet ownership, that is their decision. Not yours.

I disagree... there are many people that do things like agility, dog showing, breeding, etc with dogs and cats and that definitely should be listed. I didn't list pet owning on my application because I didn't see the point, but after a few years of vet school, I can see why it is a good thing to add on.

 

[DVMDream]

Sadly, more then half of them regret there decisions DAILY choosing veterinary medicine.

*their



I don't usually do the grammar correcting, but it was bothering me especially with the elitist attitude.

 

[Wiffink]

OP, I am someone who got in to two schools this cycle with very few veterinary experience hours (less than 250, in fact), and I did not list pet ownership on my application. Do I wish I had more veterinary experience? Yes. Am I sure I want to be a veterinarian? Absolutely.

Luckily for me, admissions councils do not narrow-mindedly look at the number of experience hours that a person has, like you have, but instead look at the whole person. It is unfair of you to judge fellow future colleagues on their ability to attain 1000s of experience hours when there are likely other factors that make them just as qualified an applicant as you are.

Good for you for spending 8 years of your life working in the veterinary profession. I'm jealous. Obviously this helped you get into vet school, so congratulations. However, you need to seriously reconsider how you view your future colleagues. Not everyone entering vet school is going to have the same past experiences as you, and this diversity is a good thing.

 

[katryn]

I'm going to agree with everyone else so far. I've meet vets with little experience who love the field and are awesome at what they do, and others with countless hours of experience who regret the decision. There isn't a good way to 100% predict what will happen to you during and after vet school to shape your feelings towards your job.

I think listing pet ownership is hit or miss. Farm life, absolutely; exotics, also yes. Those are things that are not a dime a dozen. Dogs and cats are a little grey to me. I didn't list my own pets as experience, but did list pet sitting. Some of the pets I watched required more than just food, water, and potty breaks. Also, it showed that someone thought I was responsible enough to watch their pets.

 

[dyachei]

So many things wrong with this. First of all, vet and animal experience hours aren't lumped together. They are separate and the schools know this. Some schools require that you list it and others would prefer not. But it's not like animal experience is a substitute for veterinary experience. Schools don't treat it as such.
Second - Not all those that are interested in vet med are interested in clinical practice. And may have more experiences in research, public health, or the like. It depends on what their goals are.
Third - what does it matter to YOU? You're not in charge of what these people do with their lives or if they decide to drop out or not pursue vet med after being in school. For what it's worth, I've seen a few people leave the profession. The majority had a higher number of hours beforehand. Sometimes you find that you're not a good academic fit or you don't want to be the responsible party for medical decisions. Or maybe they had a medical issue and left because it didn't make sense for them. You're putting a lot of assumptions together and coming off elitist.

They have no problem spitting you out into a field someone may be book smart about but not really have a real passion about.

How do YOU know this? They are the only ones that can determine their passion level. Not everyone shows passion externally

I have the pleasure of working with newly graduated veterinary students. Sadly, more then half of them regret there decisions DAILY choosing veterinary medicine.

Did you ask these newly graduated very why they regret their decision? Or how many hours they had or are you making assumptions. I love the field but hate the debt and have days where I regret my decisions. I had thousands of hours of vet experience before becoming a vet.

There are so many things to say regarding this topic, but long story short I am strongly against schools accepting applicants based mainly on grades

Almost no schools do this. There may be 1-2 that do, but the majority do not.

If schools were more keen on hiring those who have veterinary experience, MAYBE there wouldn't be such a high rate of those that switch into different jobs after graduating vet school.

I'd like to see data on this. Because not many people switch out of vet med entirely. It's difficult to do with the debt load.

 

[orca2011]

Highly recommend you don't go spitting this out to your classmates because it's going to make vet school even more of a hell.

And I really don't have much to say on this beyond what everyone else said. I was an applicant with lower experience hours (and I mean just vet...didn't include pet ownership since most of the schools I applied to didn't consider it), but understood what I was getting myself into and love the different aspects of this field. Having lower hours doesn't mean I'm any less passionate. For me, it just meant I had (and still have) other interests and passions outside of just getting into vet school. I worked a different job during college, did club sports, went on service trips and spent a year abroad. All those experiences made me a more well rounded person and probably even more prepared (meaning other skill sets) than just working 8 years at the same job. It also gave me additional connections and topics to chat about with my interviewers so they can see that not everything I did was for my application. And mainly, I wanted to enjoy my college years, not look back on it 10 years from now and wish I'd done things differently.

Other people are career changers and just can't financially take a vet assistant job if they have a family and kids to support. Plus, in some areas it's even just hard enough to land a shadowing opportunity, let alone an actually paid position. It took me numerous phone calls to just set up some shadowing opportunities.

Will there be days I dislike my job and have regrets--yes, but I'm pretty sure this is a normal feeling and happens to everyone in any career. But I definitely think the good days will outweigh the bad days.

 

[deleted498041]

Oh wow. I think a lot of what needs to be said, has been. I just wanted to throw in a different factor for OP. I was 18 when I applied to vet school and 19 when I got in. I was a baby, at least within the US. Obviously this would be different if I were overseas.

The area I lived in absolutely did not want people working in a hospital or clinic of any kind unless they were 18. I sent out job and volunteering opportunities to over 40 hospitals. I heard back from two telling me they couldn't take me, and never once heard back from the rest. I started working at a corporate hospital when I was 18, but how many hours do you really think I had when I applied? Not a lot.

I don't think I should be punished for being young and dedicated. It's not my fault I had very few hours when I applied, and I did everything I could to remedy that. I don't think it makes me any less dedicated, makes me more likely to regret going into veterinary medicine, or makes me less deserving of getting into vet school.

 

[deleted498041]

On a side note, I am not a jaded applicant for this cycle, I was accepted into veterinary school and will be attending in the fall. However, I do want to hear/read everyone's thoughts on this. Please bite, chew, and scratch at what I have to say, or meow and purr; what ever you desire.

Just wanted to add that getting into vet school doesn't mean you're not a jaded applicant.

 

[Skimble]

I have a lot of vet experience hours from working full-time as a vet tech for 6 years. While I may be quicker with catheter placement than some of my future classmates, I also suspect that many of them will have a lot more experience in other areas that I don't have much at all in. I'm actually jealous of some of their experiences and wish I had been able to do more!

I also didn't include pet ownership. It never even occurred to me to include it.

 

[swiniazycie]

There are 41534124 possibilities of what you can do with a vet degree, your narrow view is going to hurt you in vet school as well as your attitude

I'm gonna need to see your math worked out for this. 😉

 

[CalliopeDVM]

So many posters have talked about your arrogance and elitism so far, but few have talked about international schools who do not have the same expectations or standards, and still turn out hundreds of happy, passionate, skilled, and talented vets. In some places, vet students are much younger than in the US, and in some places, more emphasis is put on the interview than the number of hours of experience, for example. Personally, I think those ridiculously high numbers of hours of "veterinary experience" common in the US don't matter much - in my opinion, there should be more emphasis placed on breadth of experience hours.....and, either way, I think no one really needs that much exposure. Fortunately, I'm also in a country where number of hours don't matter as much, as I probably had no more than a few hundred. Yet, here I am, well into my second decade of happily and successfully being a vet. Go figure.

 

[pp9]

I disagree... there are many people that do things like agility, dog showing, breeding, etc with dogs and cats and that definitely should be listed. I didn't list pet owning on my application because I didn't see the point, but after a few years of vet school, I can see why it is a good thing to add on.

You're right, I failed to mention other unique aspects of pet ownership besides just owning animals other than cats/dogs. So there's another reason pet ownership is not just a desperate attempt to add hours to your application.

But edit: FYI, I wasn't implying that showing cats and dogs shouldn't be listed. Some applicants wonder if they should list that they've owned Fluffy the cat for 3 years, and that is what I disagree with. I think that is what the OP is referring to, as well.

 

[neocia]

I have seen and read such incredible and often inspiring personal stories from people on SDN. People who managed a 4.0 sGPA, people raising children while in undergrad, people who've overcome disabilities or financial trouble, who've been injured or ill, and still gotten into veterinary school. Hey, they may have limited veterinary hours for whatever reason - but they got in to the highly competitive schooling for their dream job. Congratulations to those people!

The admissions departments from these schools take your whole application into consideration, not just pure vet experience hours, as others have said.

 

[battie]

I would also like to add to the thought that there are more careers in vet med than standard GP. I have been thinking of working exclusively with dog breeders and pet stores to maintain healthy puppies. I think my personal experiences of working in my family's pet stores, working with our breeders, and all the veterinarians involved (breeder's and ours) is more valuable than my short stints in GP vet clinics. In fact, the stints in the GP vet clinics has steered me more towards my original goal than towards GP. Giving this opinion during my interview during the c/o 2018 cycle was a strong point in my application apparently, and I was waitlisted (though never called off) with only 135 hours of experience at that point. Even though I had only 135 hours of directly working with/for veterinarians, I still had a good idea of what I would be getting myself into. While I do think 10 hours isn't enough to say yay or nay to something, I don't think you need 1,000 hours either. It varies from person to person it is pretty pretentious for someone to define how many experience hours someone needs to say, "I want to be a vet."

 

[pp9]

I mean, really, I decided I wanted to do this for sure about 100 hours in.

Anything after that (and I'm in the thousands now) is how I've been learning what kind of doctor/person I do/do not want to be.

 

[WhtsThFrequency]

Wow.

Let me tell you something, grasshopper. I got into vet school almost 9 years ago with the bare minimum of clinical hours. You know why? Because there are many other areas of veterinary medicine besides basic general practice that a good number of us who enter veterinary school are planning to pursue, (in my case, thousands of hours research in chemistry and pathobiology) and to us, GP work is useless and we are sick of being judged by purists. I had absolutely no desire to work in a clinic. And yeah, I had quite a number of people in my class scoffing at me and asking me how I planned to be a "real vet" since they had all worked in GP clinics for however many years and through they knew **** from shat. I'm now a specialist and you know what? Those hoity-toity kids with tons of clinic hours now working in general practice? *I* am the one THEY call when they can't figure stuff out.

Your point that people need to experience veterinary medicine before they apply is correct. But your assumption that people who don't have a lot of GP clinic hours don't understand "the field" is laughable considering how many other options there are besides GP clinical work (as is your assumption that you understand everything about the field just because you have worked in one practice for 8 years, or that the main reason people become disillusioned with the field is because they didn't work at clinics enough early on).

 

[DVMDream]

I'm gonna need to see your math worked out for this. 😉

I would, but this is highly complex math that is just near impossible to understand unless you have numerous experience hours with dragons, who happen to be very good at this kind of math. 😉

 

[DVMDream]

(in my case, thousands of hours research in chemistry and pathobiology) and to us, GP work is useless and we are sick of being judged by purists.

🙁 *tear*

Meanie pathologist.. 😛

 

[WhtsThFrequency]

🙁 *tear*

Meanie pathologist.. 😛

I will rephrase: GP work isn't useless in terms of the knowledge and experiences gained if you are talking absolute values - far from it. It is just useless for us (i.e. those of us on the dark side who are not interested in clinic work) to do it for years and years to "gain experience", and it's silly to think that working at a clinic is by definition the gold standard form of experience in the field regardless of the applicants goals. It is simply the most common.

 

[DVMDream]

I will rephrase: GP work isn't useless in terms of the knowledge and experiences gained if you are talking absolute values - far from it. It is just useless for us (i.e. those of us on the dark side who are not interested in clinic work) to do it for years and years to "gain experience", and it's silly to think that working at a clinic is by definition the gold standard form of experience in the field regardless of the applicants goals. It is simply the most common.

Yeah, I knew where you were coming from, but I had to poke fun. Because it is what I do. 🙂


ETA: According to all of my vet school career so far I should either join the dark side of pathology or be an equine vet... ewww, equines...

 

[LetItSnow]

Long story short, I am super bothered by applicants that are getting in with low veterinary experience hours. And listing 'Pet Ownership' as a experience? That is not something I think anyone should be placing on an application to medical school.

Hahahahahha. PinkPuppy has a disciple! MiniCompass? Compass the Second?

My school very specifically told me "Include everything. Including pet ownership."

I guess I would advise people to listen to the folks whose opinion actually has relevance, rather than some arrogant pre-vet who thinks she's better than everyone else. So if you have questions about what to put on the app, ask the schools to which you are applying. Don't listen to pompous pre-vets who don't have a clue what they're talking about.

I know no matter what I will love being a vet.

Actually, you don't. You kinda sound like you're going to be the vet student who constantly says, "Well, at MY clinic we do <blah blah blah>.....".

Those were the worst..... the ones who thought their pre-vet experienced trumped everybody else and that OF COURSE the way their clinic does it HAS to be the best. It was always a secret little pleasure to see a clinician beat those people down.

 

[Coquette22]

However, I do want to hear/read everyone's thoughts on this. Please bite, chew, and scratch at what I have to say, or meow and purr; what ever you desire.

My opinion, in brief: You should have put "Sitting on high horse" under your animal experience.

 

[Skimble]

My opinion, in brief: You should have put "Sitting on high horse" under your animal experience.

😆😆😆😆😆😆😆😆
If only I did this, I could have gotten some large animal experience!

 

[Trilt]

My opinion, in brief: You should have put "Sitting on high horse" under your animal experience.

 

[DVMDream]

I personally have worked in a veterinary hospital for the last 8 years of my life, accumulating thousands of hours of experience, working full time most of my undergraduate career.

I am starting to wonder if you are trolling... according to this post of yours made back in November of 2013:

Hey Everyone!
Any comments definitely appreciated! This was my first application cycle and I have never been so nervous! 😕

22 yr old,
Science GPA: 3.21
Non-science: 3.44
Cumulative: 3.12
Last 45 (ish): ~3.4
** Mentioned in my personal statement that I have continuously been working on average 25 hours a week since high school while in college.

GRE:
My writing portion was a 4.0
And the rest of the GRE was on the lower (45th/30th percentile) 😳

Vet Experience (all paid positions) (unless stated):
Kennel Assistant (my first job when I was 18): 680 hours
Vet Receptionist/Assistant (small animal hospital):950 hours
Ambulatory Equine Vet Shadow (non-paid): 12 hours
Equine Hospital (non-paid): 50 hours of shadowing experience
Outpatient Vet Assistant (VCA) (small animal) : 790 hours
Surgical Assistant (small animal) (at one of Chicago largest veterinary hospitals and specialty centers) scrubbing in with surgeons on a daily basis: 390 hours on my application however I am still currently employed and will be until I get into vet school!
I also put on my application that I will be doing a 50 hour internship in the emergency department at the hospital I work at during the winter time

You were working part-time during undergrad, not full time as you claim in this thread (25 hours a week is not full time).

Also, 8 years of working in a vet clinic. Considering this post was made in November of 2013 and it is now March of 2015, you were 22 in Nov. '13 and started working, as you claim, at 18. That is 4 years experience in Nov' of 2013, it hasn't even been 2 years, but heck even if it had been 2 years that is only 6 years working in a vet clinic. That doesn't even touch upon how kennel work is debatable as "vet experience" and varies from clinic to clinic as to how it should be considered.

Either you are trolling or flat out lying in at least one of your posts.

Having stated that, it isn't the years or number of hours of experience gained but the quality of experience that you have.

 

[jenkxo]

Wow so much hatred..
The reason I posted this is to get everyone's points of view, which to those who have done so without taking jabs at me personally your awesome.
And to the comment that all my hours were from one clinic, I never said that, I've worked at several different hospitals due to moving, personal reasons, ect.
Also, to the comment about me saying I would be the student in school stating that 'at my clinic we do this'.. no, I'm not like that at all, far from it. Don't feel the need to defend myself on that, but thought that was a complete childish comment.

However, I see how if someone goes into vet research that makes sense and you would have vet experience, I agree with that statement. But that was not my point and I am sorry if I didn't make my argument 100% clear.

Those applicants that go into vet school with no research and no vet experience I feel are doing themselves a disfavor. Anyone can type into the search bar here, type low experience, and see that there are people that apply with the low amount of hours, I still think they are doing themselves a huge disservice.

 

[ameropean_chelsea]

So... um... diversity. It's a great thing. Learn to appreciate it and how to work with it because whether or not you are in private practice, a specialty, a nontrad career or whatever, you WILL be the better for being amenable to change and approachable to people who differ from yourself.

As everyone's said, there are a lot of factors that get an adcom to offer admission to a given individual. Student A's awesomeness is going to be different from Student Z's.

The point is this: somebody realized the awesomeness in each and every one of us and gave us a chance.

I think you're right only in that applicants do need some significant vet-related experience before applying, but who am I to judge what was significant when I haven't seen everything they have provided to an admissions committee?

 

[jenkxo]

I am starting to wonder if you are trolling... according to this post of yours made back in November of 2013:



You were working part-time during undergrad, not full time as you claim in this thread (25 hours a week is not full time).

Also, 8 years of working in a vet clinic. Considering this post was made in November of 2013 and it is now March of 2015, you were 22 in Nov. '13 and started working, as you claim, at 18. That is 4 years experience in Nov' of 2013, it hasn't even been 2 years, but heck even if it had been 2 years that is only 6 years working in a vet clinic. That doesn't even touch upon how kennel work is debatable as "vet experience" and varies from clinic to clinic as to how it should be considered.

Either you are trolling or flat out lying in at least one of your posts.

Having stated that, it isn't the years or number of hours of experience gained but the quality of experience that you have.

No, I was working full time. I did nanny work on the side. Only could afford to work in a vet hospital 25-30 due to the low pay. So yes I did work full time.
Also I did volunteer work at a shelter in high school when I was 16, I didn't put that on my application because I didn't feel like calculating the hours, emailing my high school, and putting it on my application.

Anymore questions?

 

[DVMDream]

No, I was working full time. I did nanny work on the side. Only could afford to work in a vet hospital 25-30 due to the low pay. So yes I did work full time.
Also I did volunteer work at a shelter in high school when I was 16, I didn't put that on my application because I didn't feel like calculating the hours, emailing my high school, and putting it on my application.

Anymore questions?

You didn't state that. You stated this:

I personally have worked in a veterinary hospital for the last 8 years of my life, accumulating thousands of hours of experience, working full time most of my undergraduate career.

That implies that you were working full time in a vet clinic for 8 years. Volunteering in a shelter is NOT working in a vet clinic.... it is animal experience.

So you did flat out lie in this thread. Or, you are trolling. I'm kind of sad you got rid of the saying under your name that you had briefly "smarter then most" really made me laugh, and think you are definitely trolling. Also, if you put it back up... ehh, nevermind... put it back up.. it makes me laugh... for reasons.


Also, I have been on the forums, for about 5ish years, I have yet to see anyone get accepted with zero experience as you claim happens and happens frequently. I think you really believe your clinical private practice experience is the end all be all and you are back-tracking now that you realize you were wrong.

 

[jenkxo]

Long story short, I have learned posting on SDN unfortunately is not a good place to have a healthy conversation.

Everyone can think I did this believing I am 'higher' or 'above' other people, in reality, that is so far from the truth its pathetic. There are a lot of students in undergrad reading these posts and learning from them. Now at least they can see how rude a lot of their future classmates will be.

 

[K9Mechanic]

Strong thread backfire

 

[jenkxo]

Well DVMdream I thought it was funny, then I realized I'm not going to fuel the fire.
I also apologize for not being specific in my argument and being more detailed.

 

[DVMDream]

Well DVMdream I thought it was funny, then I realized I'm not going to fuel the fire.
I also apologize for not being specific in my argument and being more detailed.

I think why I think it was funny and why you think it was are two different reasons.

However, it definitely made me laugh... "smarter then most" ...

I might steal this.

 

[ResoluteMike]

Long story short, I have learned posting on SDN unfortunately is not a good place to have a healthy conversation.

Everyone can think I did this believing I am 'higher' or 'above' other people, in reality, that is so far from the truth its pathetic. There are a lot of students in undergrad reading these posts and learning from them. Now at least they can see how rude a lot of their future classmates will be.

SDN is a great community for learning and discussion. It does however require a certain amount of discretion and tact in how you make your point.

 

[Gwenevre]

Long story short, I have learned posting on SDN unfortunately is not a good place to have a healthy conversation.

Everyone can think I did this believing I am 'higher' or 'above' other people, in reality, that is so far from the truth its pathetic. There are a lot of students in undergrad reading these posts and learning from them. Now at least they can see how rude a lot of their future classmates will be.

Posting on SDN can yield healthy forms of communication. But in your initial post the tone you gave off was that you were potentially annoyed by your "future classmate's" experiences. And that was in the first sentence!

Long story short, I am super bothered by applicants that are getting in with low veterinary experience hours. And listing 'Pet Ownership' as a experience? That is not something I think anyone should be placing on an application to medical school.

Pet ownership can be classified as experience. I put down ownership of show class Pomeranians for two years because we maintained a healthy breeding program. I had a good hand in maintaining the health of our dogs and consequently our puppies during that time. But you're claiming because we owned these animals as pets, that shouldn't count towards my experience to show to schools that I am interested in the field because of XYZ reasons.
And furthermore, you openly invited us to critique your opinion, which, interestingly enough, is our opinion as well. You openly asked for us to "bite, chew, and scratch" at what you had to say. Considering that a majority of people who have responded to your post are either seasoned students or long-practicing vets that know this field and the caliber of veterinarians that have been pumped out by schools that have accepted students with a low number of hours should speak volumes on your thought process.

On a side note, I am not a jaded applicant for this cycle, I was accepted into veterinary school and will be attending in the fall. However, I do want to hear/read everyone's thoughts on this. Please bite, chew, and scratch at what I have to say, or meow and purr; what ever you desire.

 

[jenkxo]

'ALso, I have been on the forums, for about 5ish years, I have yet to see anyone get accepted with zero experience as you claim happens and happens frequently. I think you really believe your clinical private practice experience is the end all be all and you are back-tracking now that you realize you were wrong."

I wanted to reply to this, I do not believe GP that it is the end all be all, that is way extreme to what I stated so far. It is not the only experience I personally have and do not favor GP over any other experience. However, I do think GP experience is beneficial to have before veterinary school because although someone might be working out of a GP, there are so many things to learn in a GP that I feel would be good to learn. Mainly working with clients and other employees.
I really do not want to go through the threads, to post here to show you, however like I said, if you type in the search bar for low experience hours, people do post asking about this.
*And to be clear this is my opinion, it might be wrong to some people, some might agree, however it is my own opinion.

 

[WildZoo]

Long story short, I have learned posting on SDN unfortunately is not a good place to have a healthy conversation.

Everyone can think I did this believing I am 'higher' or 'above' other people, in reality, that is so far from the truth its pathetic. There are a lot of students in undergrad reading these posts and learning from them. Now at least they can see how rude a lot of their future classmates will be.

Or, they can see how their future classmates may defend them against unwarranted criticism. Personally I would like to know 1) how many experience hours you would classify as "enough" to meet your standards 2) why you think you know better than the admissions committees 3) The data on all these cases of people getting in with "low" hours and burning out because of it

But beyond any of that...who cares how many hours someone else has? In what way does that affect your life at all? It is not for us to judge what makes someone a good applicant after they have been accepted - the goal here is to help those who are on the road to applying. So yes, we would always suggest that future applicants get as much experience as they can. But if they get in with less than the thousands of hours of clinical experience that you think they need, it's really nobody else's business. Assuming that they are going to fail because of it when clearly the school saw potential in them is just ridiculous.

 

[LetItSnow]

Wow so much hatred..

When you come out hatin', expect to get it back in your face just like you deserved.

There are a lot of students in undergrad reading these posts and learning from them. Now at least they can see how rude a lot of their future classmates will be.

You mean like yourself? That might be the most accurate thing you've said so far.

Yeah. You're a real peach, MiniCompass.

 

[WhtsThFrequency]

Those applicants that go into vet school with no research and no vet experience I feel are doing themselves a disfavor.

But you didn't say that.

You said "low" hours working specifically "in a veterinary hospital" or clinical setting, and didn't even seem to consider the myriad of other ways people can get veterinary experience (via biomedical research, governmental regulatory bodies, international work, etc). All of these types of experiences can and do educate people about the field. No one is going to get into vet school anyway with NO hours in ANYTHING. You're being hyperbolic to prove poorly-made point.

That's why you are getting backlash, in addition to insinuating that newly graduated vets are so disillusioned with the field because they didn't accrue enough clinical hours in their pre-vet years....do you know how silly that sounds given the current state of higher education and the economy? Really, do you? There is a metric assload of reasons for new graduates to be disillusioned and it has nothing to do with pre-vet experience.

 

[Coquette22]

Long story short, I have learned posting on SDN unfortunately is not a good place to have a healthy conversation.

SDN is a fabulous place to have a healthy conversation. Lots of them happen all the time. But in my experience, healthy conversation usually requires that people can back up their statements. Statements such as:

If schools were more keen on hiring those who have veterinary experience, MAYBE there wouldn't be such a high rate of those that switch into different jobs after graduating vet school..

What's a "high rate"? Do you have numbers or is this just based on people you know? In other words... Cite please?

Those applicants that go into vet school with no research and no vet experience I feel are doing themselves a disfavor.

People are getting in with NO research and NO vet experience? Like who? Sure, they may not have as much as you, but none? Zero? At all? Again... Cite please?

 

[jenkxo]

Once again, it seems like everyone is going to twist and turn what I have said, taking things to an extreme. And this is becoming a waste of my time rebutting comments that don't make sense.
I am not insulting any new graduates, my argument if anything is aimed at the schools that do look at grades more so then experience. And stating that I believe anyone looking into veterinary school without good experience before is doing themselves a disfavor. And yes I do question those who have low veterinary experience, because sometimes those students are taking a seat away from someone who maybe knew for there entire life they wanted to be a veterinarian.

I have personally met and spoke to individuals that are choosing to pursue other careers because they didn't understand what they were getting themselves into. I guess it is hard to argue this point to others if they haven't been exposed to individuals that feel this way. I have worked with several doctors that after working in vet med have switched into different fields. This comes from personal experience like I've stated.

To those that have graduated, made it through vet medicine with the same passion they had when they first started, getting into vet med with a slight understanding of what veterinary medicine is about, your lucky. I guess regardless of what I read here, I still hold the opinion that vet schools should accept more students based on a good balance of long term experience, not students who have spent their undergrad heavily focusing on grades.

Peace out people of sdn.