The REAL way to make money

[TheCat]

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Well all I have heard for the past 3 years is talk about which specialities make money and which ones do not. I have a finance background and a lot of friends in the business world out there as well as my parents into realestate. I guess I want to tell any of you out there who may be interested in family pract, pscy, int med or whatever else that you may hear does not pay well v. surgery, radiology etc that may pay 300 or 400 k v 150 or 200k in one of the lower paying ones.
let me just fill you in on something. Atleast this is my plan in life. You can make 10 times more than any salary in medicine if you get into real estate and buying properties and accumulating wealth in that manner. I am not saying you have to constantly buy and sell houses but buying 1 or 2 houses smartly a year and working up to more ande selling them at the right times-you can pull in miillions of bucks as you progress-may take 5 years or so to own enough money making properties but you want to know how EVERy rich person out there in the world has made money if they are millionares-REAL ESTATE.
I went to finance school and you would think they would really tell u to buy stocks etc. but you know that all good finance and rich people dont touch stocks-they take other peoples money and put it in stocks but they put their own money into realestate. Do you know that nobody, maybe 1 percent of all investors havfe ever made substantial money in the market on a long term basis-you may make it big one or 2 times but then in the end on average you will almost always break even-that is because as a good finance person knows-NOBODY is smarter than the market.
Anyway-point of this post, if you make 100, 000 bucks-that is AMPLE money to start investing in realestate and make some real money. You should choose a career you are happy in and and one that gives you a lot of free time so you can have more time to MAKE LOTS of money by investments in real estate and time to SPEND all the money you make.
So dont let people tell you to pick fields you hate due to money-they are the people that dont realize how you get rich in this world is NEVER by a salary-anyone making a salary is not going to be very rich-you have to make your own dough-so DONT be discourage if you want to do something that pasy only 100k or something-go for it, be happy and youll STILL be richer than the surgeon working 100 hours a week.
And for all that want to say I am not right-i assure you that you can ask any wealthy person, any financier, any educated business person. Ok just an encouraging word to those who dont want to work away their lives.

 

[Miami_med]

This only works if you know what you are doing. Invest in real estate today and I guarantee that your Med Loans will look petty in 5 years.

 

[TheCat]

This only works if you know what you are doing. Invest in real estate today and I guarantee that your Med Loans will look petty in 5 years.

this makes no sense-my loans will look pretty? Obviously I am taling about after residency when you are salaried and obviously you pay off loans as quick as you can too since the interest is terrible.
And obviously you have to have some idea of what you are doing but not really. It does not take much to recognize when a realestate market is buyers v. sellers market and if you have properties you just wait until the right times to sell-actually does not take much skill at all. You are probably just jelous that people do this and work hardly any at all. My plan is to work 3 days a week-jelous arent ya

 

[MarzMD]

Do you own a suit with question marks on it?

 

[deleted87716]

You can make 10 times more than any salary in medicine if you get into real estate and buying properties and accumulating wealth in that manner.

Your point about wealth accumulation being independent of salary is completely correct. Any physician in any specialty will earn enough to become wealthy, assuming they invest properly. Real estate is not the only investment option, and can be quite risky.

The biggest trap that doctors fall into is striving to maintain a lifestyle that is above their means, spending most of what they earn. Without adequate savings, they'll never be able to retire.

I consider The Millionaire Next Door to be a must-read for anyone starting their career.

 

[YouDontKnowJack]

easier said than done. real estate is not a walk in the park.
things flip around really quick. buy a house at $350000 today, can become hard to sell at $300000.

a lot of us will invest our doctor's salaries, of course. but you want a stable source of cash, which you can play with on the side in real estate, gambling, or making porn movies. the latter will be my side job, as soon as i have enough to pay the porn chicks.

 

[businessmd06]

WARNING - This is NYC, and not the rest of the world

I boutht my first 1 bedroom condo in 2003 in Manhattan. I paid 240k for an up and coming neighborhood 620 sq ft apartment with doorman on 110th and Central Park West (North west corner of central park) considered S.W Harlem, although Columbia was close as was the Upper West Side. I was 25 when I bought it.

I sold it in 2005 after 2 yrs for 480k 🙂 Love the real estate boom in nyc

I then bought a 1300 sqft apt in East Harlem (another up and comer) for 650k. It is now comp'ed at 950k after 10 months. I will sell it as soon as 2 yrs hit to avoid capital gains. So by the time I am 29 I will have made a profit of over 600k in real estate in 4 years... this is only dealing with apartments I am living in. Imagine if one can have a salary on top of this of 200k+ You should buy small places in up and coming neighborhood. Do not stretch yourself, and never mortgage your living space for capital for another place.

Have fun, real estate is amazing.

p.s. - Since I am crazy and decided to go back to Med School, much of my next profit will be keeping a good lifestyle while in school 😱

 

[TheCat]

Ok caveat-you cant be in podunk USA and buy homes and excpect to make money-I guess what I mean is in growing markets, bigger cities-any of the big 5 cities-LA, NYC, DC, Phoenix, Boston, Chicago ( ok that is 6) type cities. Dont go to nebraska and expect to make bucks

 

[fun8stuff]

Ok caveat-you cant be in podunk USA and buy homes and excpect to make money-I guess what I mean is in growing markets, bigger cities-any of the big 5 cities-LA, NYC, DC, Phoenix, Boston, Chicago ( ok that is 6) type cities. Dont go to nebraska and expect to make bucks

I too know physicians who have made a fortune through real estate. One doc in my small hometown bought like 40 acres like 8 years ago. Today he is spliiting it into subdivisions and making a killing.

Besides, The Millionaire Next Door, do you have any books you recommend?

 

[MeowMix]

WARNING - This is NYC, and not the rest of the world

Exactly. Those of us who were working and trying to save money in the 80s remember double-digit interest rates and selling houses for less than you bought them for.

You have made good investments, and been lucky, in the real-estate equivalent of the dot-com boom. Like that boom, it is probably not a permanent phenomenon, nor a wise long-term investment strategy; if you were 55, it would be very unwise to have your life savings tied up in your apartment. And, as you point out, it only works in certain real-estate markets right now, not for the vast number of people who live in other parts of the US.

I will also point out that some people have zero interest in buying and selling real estate, no matter how much money they could make. They enjoy their jobs, they are perfectly happy with a modest salary, and they want to invest their energy and time in their work. There is nothing wrong with that, and nothing foolish about it. It's just another option.

 

[MeowMix]

Obviously I am taling about after residency when you are salaried and obviously you pay off loans as quick as you can too since the interest is terrible.

Anyone with your financial acumen should know that paying off a $200,000 loan at 2.75% does not make financial sense.

 

[TheCat]

Exactly my only point was to encourage people who may choose careers they DONT like that they should not do that if the only reason they were going to was to make money. My only point is there are tons and tons of other ways to make money and my personal favorite is real estate. And it is not like it takes energy to buy and sell houses. You can even buy 1 new house every couple years, live in it, enjoy it and make 300 or 400 k when you sell it. And realestate is NOT at all the same as dot coms! haha realestate has been around forever and is probably the ONLY long term investment that is smart-you will never lose all of your money in realestate-houses and properties in areas where property is limited will always have inherent value. And oh for those of you not planning to live in big cities-its called have 2nd homes, vacation homes-most succesful peoplle i know have 2 homes in differnet cities-and buy diff ones all the time as prices go up or down.
Hey its not for everyone just throwing the option out there for people who may not know that money exists outside the world of salaries

 

[TheCat]

Any loan is no good when you are making 100s of thousands of dollars. Interest rate or not the accumulation over 30 years still stinks and once I am making money I will be happy to get rid of my payments. I personally do not like having debt-guess I am kind of anal-I am not saying if you have limited funds then obvoiusly your best spent money is not in loans .

 

[MarzMD]

I think he is referring to the fact that using "all that money" you will be making to invest in other things will probably give you better returns than the 2.xx percent that your loans take away . Therefore, paying off your loans faster is not advantageous.

 

[Clemson Doc]

First of all, I get tired of people in medical school saying "I should have majored in business/gotten my MBA, because it is easy to make money that way." These people are usually science majors who have no idea how hard business is. Sure, the major isn't as intense as some science majors, but the real world is hard. There are a lot of good ideas out there, but most people can't implement their ideas. Plenty of people get their MBA and make a good living, but there are also people who get their MBA and make $60K most of their careers. That is not a bad living, but based on what some people who aren't in business say, all you have to do is enter the business world and you are on your way to wealth. Unfortunately, shows like The Apprentice have painted a false picture of the business world, much like ER has done for medicine.

As for real estate, yes it is possible to make a lot of money doing that. There are also a lot of hacks who are in real estate because they can't do anything else. There is a high rate of turnover in real estate, because many people realize that the hours are not the best and that it is hard to list and sell properties for a profit.

If you are going to medical school, rest assured that you will make a very good living doing something you (hopefully) enjoy. You might've made more if you had gone into business and earned your MBA, but then again you might've been totally uncreative and difficult to get along with. You just never know. What you can do is invest properly, which is easier said than done or else everyone would be making money through their investments. Unfortunately, most doctors have horrible business sense and have no idea how to manage their practices (much less their wealth). Thus the need for CPA's, wealth management firms, etc. I suppose the point is that we must know our limits and ask for help when we need it.

 

[TheCat]

hey clemsondoc get with the program dude-nobody here is talking about being a realestate agent you fool-we are talking about buying your own houses and owning them and selling them making huge profits. Obviously being a realestate agent isnt something youll do as a doctor hahaha-your post made me laugh-

 

[xlithiumx]

Well all I have heard for the past 3 years is talk about which specialities make money and which ones do not. I have a finance background and a lot of friends in the business world out there as well as my parents into realestate. I guess I want to tell any of you out there who may be interested in family pract, pscy, int med or whatever else that you may hear does not pay well v. surgery, radiology etc that may pay 300 or 400 k v 150 or 200k in one of the lower paying ones .... blah blah blah ...
And for all that want to say I am not right-i assure you that you can ask any wealthy person, any financier, any educated business person. Ok just an encouraging word to those who dont want to work away their lives.

Well, my head is now out of my ass. It's here to tell you to shut up with the unsolicited financial advice.

 

[cdql]

If it were that simple, then everyone would be doing it. Investing in real estate is a lot harder than it sounds.

You need to pick houses in the right location. You need to pick houses that won't be inundated by crappy neighbors. You need to pick houses in areas with good schools. You need to pick houses in areas with low tax rates. You need to properly maintain the house. If you aren't living in it (purely using the house as an investment), you need to be especially careful in maintaining the house.

Our med school brings in a financial advisor every year to talk to us and he told us that real estate is one of the worst investments a young medical doctor can make because there is so much that these young physcians don't know and they often don't have time to sit down and figure it all out during the busy residency years. If you live in the house, this will bring down the risk considerably because if the investment plan doesn't work, you can always live in it. To start purchasing 2nd homes as investments without having the proper knowledge base is no different than throwing your money into the stock market with no clue of what is going on.

 

[YouDontKnowJack]

you can't make money if you don't have money.


that said, i can't wait to be a smut peddler. My wife will be COO of YouDon'tKnowPorn Inc.

 

[NunoBR]

I consider The Millionaire Next Door to be a must-read for anyone starting their career.

Just bought the book.
Thanks a lot.

And I definitely agreed people should become educated about investing their money (in whatever they think is good) in order to make more.
Salary is a salary and you can't count on it to make a lot of money....because guess what?...It's a SALARY....and it will never change...
And I definitely second the idea that people don't have money because they live way above their means.
I think people see celebrities and rap/hip hop starts (Conspicuous consumers) and they think anyone who has money has that kind of life style. NO.

Anyway, just my two cents.

And to be fair...I too struggle with no overspending....cuz shopping is FUN.

 

[deleted87716]

Just bought the book. Thanks a lot.

No problem. Just remember that you don't have to follow those principles to a ridiculous extreme (e.g., become a miser). Use them as guidelines.

 

[MeowMix]

I think people see celebrities and rap/hip hop starts (Conspicuous consumers) and they think anyone who has money has that kind of life style. NO.

Let's not forget the girls of Sex and the City, role models for a generation, who demonstrated that we can spend all our time having lunch with girlfriends and still afford fabulous apartments in NYC and unlimited new shoes. Why spend all that time slaving through medical school to be a doctor?

 

[xanthines]

How much is capital gains tax? Edit: added link

http://www.fool.com/taxes/2001/taxes010105.htm

I guess it's pretty high for us would-be and current physicians.

I know a non-MD guy who buys houses every 2-3 years, move in, lives there, and then sells. He makes a killing since capital gains doesn't apply to the primary residence. I guess moving every 2 years is a pain, but I guess "no pain, no gain" huh?

Oh yeah, here's a link to back my statements up. If this is inaccurate or wrong, please let me (and everyone else) know!

http://www.fool.com/taxes/2000/taxes000428.htm

-X

 

[Law2Doc]

Oh yeah, here's a link to back my statements up. If this is inaccurate or wrong, please let me (and everyone else) know!

-X

I'm not going to pull the IRC to check, but would caution people that the tax code undergoes a multitude of changes every year or so, and so what was law or permitted back in 2000 or 2001, or what the cap gains tax rates were, is likely not still the same in 2006. 😎

 

[MarzMD]

How much is capital gains tax? Edit: added link

http://www.fool.com/taxes/2001/taxes010105.htm

I guess it's pretty high for us would-be and current physicians.

I know a non-MD guy who buys houses every 2-3 years, move in, lives there, and then sells. He makes a killing since capital gains doesn't apply to the primary residence. I guess moving every 2 years is a pain, but I guess "no pain, no gain" huh?

Oh yeah, here's a link to back my statements up. If this is inaccurate or wrong, please let me (and everyone else) know!

http://www.fool.com/taxes/2000/taxes000428.htm

-X

Why doesnt he just buy a second house, rent it out for a while, sell it, then use the newly acquired money to rollover to buying a new house?

 

[businessmd06]

Exactly. Those of us who were working and trying to save money in the 80s remember double-digit interest rates and selling houses for less than you bought them for.

You have made good investments, and been lucky, in the real-estate equivalent of the dot-com boom. Like that boom, it is probably not a permanent phenomenon, nor a wise long-term investment strategy; if you were 55, it would be very unwise to have your life savings tied up in your apartment. And, as you point out, it only works in certain real-estate markets right now, not for the vast number of people who live in other parts of the US.

I will also point out that some people have zero interest in buying and selling real estate, no matter how much money they could make. They enjoy their jobs, they are perfectly happy with a modest salary, and they want to invest their energy and time in their work. There is nothing wrong with that, and nothing foolish about it. It's just another option.

I would say the market is still not doom and gloom in most major metro areas... As far as NYC (everyone assumed the boom was over last summer) well condo's have appreciated over 5 percent already this year. Modest investments in r.estate not stretching yourself, and creating the possibility of losing your actual house are a solid investment and will remain so for some time.

Interest rates are still low historically so it is still time to invest.

 

[businessmd06]

Any loan is no good when you are making 100s of thousands of dollars. Interest rate or not the accumulation over 30 years still stinks and once I am making money I will be happy to get rid of my payments. I personally do not like having debt-guess I am kind of anal-I am not saying if you have limited funds then obvoiusly your best spent money is not in loans .

Also keep in mind there are serious tax benefits to owning a second home, and a primary home.

ESP if you are a contract doc..... then the write off's are very big

 

[businessmd06]

First of all, I get tired of people in medical school saying "I should have majored in business/gotten my MBA, because it is easy to make money that way." These people are usually science majors who have no idea how hard business is. Sure, the major isn't as intense as some science majors, but the real world is hard. There are a lot of good ideas out there, but most people can't implement their ideas. Plenty of people get their MBA and make a good living, but there are also people who get their MBA and make $60K most of their careers. That is not a bad living, but based on what some people who aren't in business say, all you have to do is enter the business world and you are on your way to wealth. Unfortunately, shows like The Apprentice have painted a false picture of the business world, much like ER has done for medicine.

As for real estate, yes it is possible to make a lot of money doing that. There are also a lot of hacks who are in real estate because they can't do anything else. There is a high rate of turnover in real estate, because many people realize that the hours are not the best and that it is hard to list and sell properties for a profit.

If you are going to medical school, rest assured that you will make a very good living doing something you (hopefully) enjoy. You might've made more if you had gone into business and earned your MBA, but then again you might've been totally uncreative and difficult to get along with. You just never know. What you can do is invest properly, which is easier said than done or else everyone would be making money through their investments. Unfortunately, most doctors have horrible business sense and have no idea how to manage their practices (much less their wealth). Thus the need for CPA's, wealth management firms, etc. I suppose the point is that we must know our limits and ask for help when we need it.

There is a big difference btwn being a real estate agent and working for a 6% commission which you split in half with the listing or selling broker, and then only earn 50% because you have to pay your brokerage than investing in personal real estate and selling it and making the profit on the price of the unit.

This is not comparable

 

[businessmd06]

How much is capital gains tax? Edit: added link

http://www.fool.com/taxes/2001/taxes010105.htm

I guess it's pretty high for us would-be and current physicians.

I know a non-MD guy who buys houses every 2-3 years, move in, lives there, and then sells. He makes a killing since capital gains doesn't apply to the primary residence. I guess moving every 2 years is a pain, but I guess "no pain, no gain" huh?

Oh yeah, here's a link to back my statements up. If this is inaccurate or wrong, please let me (and everyone else) know!

http://www.fool.com/taxes/2000/taxes000428.htm

-X

If it is your primary residence and you have lived there for 2 yrs, then as long as your profit does not exceed 500k there is no capital gains. If you sell before 2 yrs you lose about 20 percent

 

[tigershark]

This is proof positive that the real estate market is about to bust.

When you have random knobs running around yelling "OMG OMGWTFBBQ REAL ESTATE DUDE!"

Kind of like right before the stockmarket crashed in the 20's, you had shoeshine boys giving wallstreet fat cats stocktips.....they knew it was all about to come crashing down and pulled out.

 

[TheCat]

dude, I am educated in the field and figured most medical people probably are not that knowledgable cause they were likely scienece peopple. I struggled with choosing a speciliaty entirely due to money before I snapped out of it and realized there are other ways to make money and choosing specialities that make you happy are more important cause the money will come. All I wanted to do was to possibly save one person from choosing a crappy career for the wrong reasons. I am not giving advice-I have had plans to do realestate for probably 6 years since i was in college-its a smart investment-housing and property has inherent value!! Stocks have NO INHERENT value-that is the big diff for all you poeple comparing the market/dotcoms to realestate-think about it-you will never losein the same way if you own a piece of land in a great location-it is supply and demand-as long as the city is desirable then someone will alwasy demand a home there and if land is hard to come by-then it will have inherent value. Unless cali sinks or something then yes you may lose money if you buy in cali-but I amnot giving advice just enlighetening anyone who may not realize the opportunity is out there. It is your dime-spend it as you wish-I dont really care if people choose to work their tails off and bemiserable to make a salary-I know I will be happy and making money and have lots of time-that is all i care about! do as you wish bro!

 

[TypeA]

This only works if you know what you are doing. Invest in real estate today and I guarantee that your Med Loans will look petty in 5 years.

Amen to that. Stupid to invest in RE right now

 

[tigershark]

Any loan is no good when you are making 100s of thousands of dollars. Interest rate or not the accumulation over 30 years still stinks and once I am making money I will be happy to get rid of my payments. I personally do not like having debt-guess I am kind of anal-I am not saying if you have limited funds then obvoiusly your best spent money is not in loans .

Nobody who has a financial education would say something like that.

Heard of opportunity cost? Leverage?

Debt can be a good thing, especially when it's cheap.

You must have just watched one of those late night get-rick-quick real estate ads.

 

[TheCat]

hahaha ok dude-I just wanted to laugh but I had to correct you-Having debt is great if you take new debt out at a cheap rate and then use it to invest-sure fine. But you are being ******ed-when you make 200k for example as a doctor-what the heck is the point of taking loans even at a low interest rate when you have the cash to invest!!! Yes low interest is great and you would get a higher return on investing but you know what yields an even higher return-is if you use cash!! You are speaking of people with minimal cash flow who is deciding between using their money for A. Paying back their loans and having no money to invest v. B. Investing and making money and paying loans later. Well hello with 200k or more after a couple of years you can do both-you dont need the debt/capital to invest since you have enough cash flow-so actually hanging on to any dead debt even at a low rate is stupidity if you have the cash flow to invest wihtout -which most doctors will.
So
1. Dont tell me my knowledge sucks when you obviously dont know what you are talking about
2. why get so defensive for just trying to tell some people about this if maybe they were not aware. Even me being knowledgable about this still questioned going into higher paying fields-being skewed by the allure of a higher sallary and forgetin that there are ways to make money elsewhere-so I thought it may be a common view-why get defensive-if you dont think its a good idea fine but I would hardly call recomending realestate is something crazy-i think if you look into it-it is the one tried and true, safest long term investment out there that millions of poeple do every day. I mean besides gov. bonds or something it is the safest-you know what I mean. I am not recomended a win-the-lotto skeem. And the guy on tv is all about knowing how to hit the gov up for random money or to buy his products to teach you how to buy absolute dumps of houses in forclosure and turn around and make money-I agree that advice blows since that is risky business and usually doesnt work
But I think it is completely normaly to use your 200k a year as a doc and double it by buying your own nice houses smartly and selling them later when the price is right. Most people buy houses and make some profit but itsjust when you are able to buy 500k to 1millino dollar houses-even 5 percent growth is huge when your dealing with large sums of money and we will have those kind of houses as docs.
Suit yourself everyone who wants to get angry-instead of getting angry why dont you go waste your time elsewhere if you are not interested in learning how to make money-your loss

 

[tigershark]

I would like to clarify some comments I made recently regarding TheCat. In the rest of this letter, I will use history and science (in the Hegelian sense) to prove that TheCat is penny wise and pound foolish. Almost everyone will agree that anyone the least bit knowledgeable about his condescending background would know that we can't afford to be so pudibund in such difficult times, but he says that he can ignore rules, laws, and protocol without repercussion. What he means by this, of course, is that he wants free reign to cast ordinary consumption and investment decisions in the light of high religious purpose. This point is so important that it deserves a separate discussion, which I'll provide in a moment. But first, let me just say that contrary to my personal preferences, I'm thinking about what's best for all of us. My conclusion is that what's best for all of us is for me to seek liberty, equality, and fraternity. The wisdom that comes from maturation of the spirit, mind, and body will some day prevail over the idiocy of TheCat's principles. How does TheCat deal with this fascinating piece of information? He totally ignores it.

Given the tenor of our times, TheCat acts as if he were King of the World. This hauteur is astonishing, staggering, and mind-boggling. I could tell him that solecism is not confined to any specific era, culture, or country, although he obviously doesn't care. I could tell him that his decisions are ill-advised, but he wouldn't believe me. He probably also doesn't care that he has completely stepped off the deep end. So let me appeal to whatever small semblance of reason TheCat may be capable of when I tell him that he wants to be the one who determines what information we have access to. Yet TheCat is also a big proponent of a particularly confused form of antiheroism. Do you see something wrong with that picture? What I see is that he doesn't care about freedom, as he can neither eat it nor put it in the bank. It's just a word to him.

TheCat once tried convincing me that he can make all of our problems go away merely by sprinkling some sort of magic pink pixie dust over everything that he considers voluble or disreputable. Does he think I was born yesterday? I mean, it seems pretty obvious that the point is that if everyone spent just five minutes a day thinking about ways to discuss, openly and candidly, a vision for a harmonious, multiracial society, we'd all be a lot better off. Is five minutes a day too much to ask for the promise of a better tomorrow? I hope not, but then again, TheCat ignores a breathtaking number of facts, most notably:

Fact: TheCat has a blatant disregard for society's basic laws.

Fact: TheCat talks out of both sides of his mouth.

Fact: The fabric of TheCat's objectives is infused with testy mercantalism.

In addition, I've tried explaining to TheCat's comrades that satanic, stinking cynicism is merely a symptom of the disease called "TheCat-ism". Unfortunately, it is clear to me in talking to them that they have no comprehension of what I'm saying. I might as well be talking to creatures from Mars. In fact, I'd bet Martians would be more likely to discern that the time is always right to do what is right. That's why we must sincerely arraign TheCat at the tribunal of public opinion. The first step in that process is to realize that some warped self-proclaimed arbiters of taste and standards actually suspect that human beings should be appraised by the number of things and the amount of money they possess instead of by their internal value and achievements. This is the kind of muddled thinking that he is encouraging with his inclinations. Even worse, all those who raise their voice against this brainwashing campaign are denounced as deceitful spoilsports. Dirty skinflints, more than any other segment of the population, like to create a new cottage industry around TheCat's antisocial form of sensationalism. In reaching that conclusion, I have made the usual assumption that it's easy for us to shake our heads at his foolishness and cowardice. It's easy for us to exclaim that we should put to rest the animosities that have kept various groups of people from enjoying anything other than superficial unity. It's easy for us to say, "It is hardly surprising that TheCat is not known for interpreting facts rationally or objectively." The point is that it's easy for us to say these things because TheCat says that no one is smart enough to see through his transparent lies. This is noxious falsehood. The truth is that his memoirs have merged with solipsism in several interesting ways. Both spring from the same kind of reality-denying mentality. Both show us a gross miscarriage of common judgment. And both engulf the world in a dense miasma of chauvinism. Here's some news for people who are suprised by sunrise: Anyone who believes that absolutism is the only alternative to cronyism is kidding himself. If you think you can escape from TheCat's disorganized refrains, then good-bye and good luck. To the rest of you I suggest that I correctly predicted that he would curry favor with contumelious renegades (especially the primitive type) using a barrage of flattery, especially recognition of their "value", their "importance", their "educational mission", and other pugnacious nonsense. Alas, I didn't think he'd do that so effectively -- or so soon. Griping about TheCat will not make him stop trying to hammer a few more nails into the coffin of freedom. But even if it did, he would just find some other way to oppress, segregate, and punish others. So, what am I doing about that? I'm educating. I'm trying to provide a trenchant analysis of his opuscula.

TheCat's legatees have cooperated closely with unregenerate scrubs on several projects. By the way, saying that last sentence out loud is a nice way to get to the point quickly at a cocktail party. TheCat is like a broken record, using the same tired cliches about family and education and safer streets, yet that fact is simply inescapable to any thinking man or woman. "Thinking" is the key word in the previous sentence. Out of the vast number of devastating evils for which insensate converts to unilateralism are directly or indirectly responsible, I shall pick out only a single one which is most in keeping with the inner essence of TheCat's unbalanced stratagems: alarmism.

Accompanying this recognition of the indeterminateness of verifiability with regard to an external, objective reality has been a crisis regarding our ability to know that TheCat has been trying for some time to sell the public on an immoralism-based government. His sales pitch proceeds both pragmatically and emotionally. The pragmatic argument: We should all bear the brunt of TheCat's actions. The emotional argument: He is a tireless protector of civil rights and civil liberties for all people. As you can see, neither argument is valid, which should indicate to you that it's not the boogeyman that our children need to worry about. It's TheCat. Not only is TheCat more unenlightened and more unholy than any envisaged boogeyman or bugbear, but we must certainly help you reflect and reexamine your views on TheCat. Does that sound extremist? Is it too obstinate for you? I'm sorry if it seems that way, but that's life. TheCat's coadjutors don't represent an ideology. They don't represent a legitimate political group of people. They're just flat obnoxious. I don't mean to throw fuel on an already considerable fire, but TheCat has stated that his faction is looking out for our interests. That's just pure antinomianism. Well, in TheCat's case, it might be pure ignorance, seeing that the "freedom" that TheCat is always so keen to talk about is a sheep's freedom to choose the patch of grass in which it will graze while growing wool and mutton for its owners. An equal but opposite observation is that I try never to argue with TheCat, because it's clear he's not susceptible to reason. TheCat has a penchant for counterinsurgency and clandestine operations. Period, finis, and Q.E.D. Let me leave you with one last thought: TheCat's ideologies smack of commercialism.

 

[TheCat]

omg you are one freaky dude-I stopped reading after like 1 paragraph where I didnt know what half your words even meant-and you sounded crazzzzy. Dude you never know who you get on these boards-Also get a life dude that was a BOOK you wrote-can you say WAckk Job-

 

[tigershark]

I kept my silence when TheCat announced he wanted to insult the intelligence, interests, and life plans of whole groups of people. I did nothing when he tried to break down traditional values. But his latest stratagems are the straw that breaks the camel's back. It may help if I begin my discussion by relating an innocuous story in order to illustrate my point: A few days ago I was arguing with a stultiloquent spoiled brat who was insisting that an open party with unlimited access to alcohol can't possibly outgrow the host's ability to manage the crowd. I tried to convince this deceitful dissolute-type that if I want to dig my own grave and pay for the shovel, that should be my prerogative. I don't need TheCat forcing me to. His hariolations occasionally differ in terms of how wanton can they are, but generally share one fundamental tendency: They create a world sunk in the most abject superstition, fanaticism, and ignorance. Caustic boosterism is the shadow cast on society by his objectives, and as long as this is so, the attenuation of the shadow will not change the substance.

I stand by what I've written before, that TheCat is the embodiment of everything petty in our lives. Every grievance, every envy, every callous, poxy ideology finds expression in TheCat. Let's look at the facts. First, he is far more interested in fattening himself on the various processes of decay in our society than he is in helping us reveal the truth about his expositions. Second, he isn't as smart as he thinks he is. And finally, there are many roads leading to the defeat of his plans to dilute the nation's sense of common purpose and shared sacrifice. I definitely think that all of these roads must eventually pass through the same set of gates: the ability to fight to the end for our ideas and ideals.

TheCat once tried convincing me that his zingers are Right with a capital R. Does he think I was born yesterday? I mean, it seems pretty obvious that TheCat should clarify his point so people like you and me can tell what the heck he's talking about. Without clarification, TheCat's animadversions sound lofty and include some emotionally charged words but don't really seem to make any sense. Try as I may, I can't understand why he would want to waste taxpayers' money. I, not being one of the many nutty scalawags of this world, can't follow TheCat's pretzel logic. I do, however, know that he hates people who have huge supplies of the things he lacks. What TheCat lacks the most is common sense, which underlies my point that I would never take a job working for him. Given his incoherent, oligophrenic undertakings, who would want to? You may be surprised to learn that I was once like TheCat. I, too, wanted to move detestable narcissism from the insecure fringe into a realm of respectability. It interfered with my judgment, my reasoning, and my ability to help people see TheCat's unprincipled, perverted tactics for what they are. We must assert ourselves as champions of freedom and expose TheCat's overgeneralizations for what they really are. That is why, come what may, we must investigate TheCat's subversive principles, ideals, and objectives.

 

[Indryd]

omg you are one freaky dude-I stopped reading after like 1 paragraph where I didnt know what half your words even meant-and you sounded crazzzzy. Dude you never know who you get on these boards-Also get a life dude that was a BOOK you wrote-can you say WAckk Job-

HAHA tigershark is yer dadday!

 

[TheCat]

HAHA tigershark is yer dadday!

haha he very well may be after what he wrote-I couldnt undersand about 2/3rds of it-hey verbal was not my strong suit-who knows WHAT he said!

 

[businessmd06]

Although The Cat's assumptions that med people do not know about Real Estate could be considered off base, I will say that many people who are negating R.E as a proven investment opportunity are either too scared to invest, or do not realize the potential. I am not saying one should go second mortgage their home to buy an investment property, however if you live in areas that have up and coming neighborhoods (gentrafication anyone?) you may have the opportunity to invest in a small condo that will then in 2 yrs double in value. This has been happening in NYC for years, it happens in small resort towns all the time, and it happens anywhere were people want to live, but can't afford the best neighborhood. People in Manhattan like myself wanted space... so I bought 1300sqft in Spanish Harlem. I am still in Manhattan, but it is an up and coming neighborhood. I paid 650k, it would have cost me 1.4 million just 20 blocks south (1mile). Many professionals like me will continue to want to have more amenities and space but will not be able to live in the best areas.. this means when I sell next yr, my area will be 2 yrs better (new developments / new stores because of people like me who choose to come here) and will thus sell for 1 million. This is happening in DC, Philly, NYC, FL, CO, LA, and Scottsdale etc... the key is to understand what types of investments are the right ones. The up and comers are right because you get them CHEAP, and they appreciate. Don't go buy a mansion in beverly hills and expect it to go up that much.

The key to r.e. is investing smart, and not overextending yourself. Another caveat is, if you are not willing to take any risks in life you will never reap the greatest rewards.

Thats my 2 dollars 🙂

 

[Clemson Doc]

The key to r.e. is investing smart, and not overextending yourself.

That's like saying, "The key to doing well on an exam is choosing all of the right answers." Investing smart is not common sense, or else everyone would be doing it. If real estate were easy, then people with real estate acumen (which I am sure you have) would not know when some other person were selling a property for too low of a price.

"Buy low, sell high" and "location, location, location" are both very appropriate sayings, but just because we will have M.D.'s it doesn't mean we can make money with ease just by buying and selling property. I know plenty of people who found "great investments that they just couldn't pass up," only to be sitting on those same investments 10-15 years later not knowing what to do with them other than sell them for a loss.

So yeah, our good friend TheCat is doing us a wonderful service to tell us about real estate. It is something to consider, but do your homework first.

 

[yellowcat322]

TheCat your post about loans still doesn;'t make any sense. It doesn't matter how much extra money you have to invest. If you locked in your loan at a low interest rate it's pretty easy to make more than that in low risk investments, which means you are making enough money to fully cover your accruing interest (and probably a profit on top of that). Having extra cash to invest has nothing to do with this. It's just financially savvy either way you look at it to hold on to those loans for as long as you can.

 

[TheCat]

TheCat your post about loans still doesn;'t make any sense. It doesn't matter how much extra money you have to invest. If you locked in your loan at a low interest rate it's pretty easy to make more than that in low risk investments, which means you are making enough money to fully cover your accruing interest (and probably a profit on top of that). Having extra cash to invest has nothing to do with this. It's just financially savvy either way you look at it to hold on to those loans for as long as you can.

God you are so dense! How can you be in medschool and be so completely dense! Any loans with interest that you are paying is wasted money. If you have an investment that is turning out a profit-why throw away some of the profit to pay interst on a loan, when you could have used your income/cash to make the investment and then the profit would be 100 percent profit without paying any away in interest. I guess you need an elementry example
1. Say you make 400k and want to invest in a 200k home and you have 100k in loans You can take 200k out of your salary and stick it in the investment. Now say a year later your investment doubles and you make 200 k. You also take 100 k form your salary and pay off your laons in entirety. So at the end of the year, assuming hypothetically that you dont spend any of your income ( for example purpose) you will have 100k cash from your initial salary left since you paid off your loan, 200k that went into your investment plus 200 k return on your investment. That givfes you 500k when its all said and done and of this 500-200k was pure profit ok.

2. You have the same 200k plus 100k outstanding loan. and you choose to not pay the loan off and lets say it accrues 10k interst over this next year. Plus you make the same investment into a 200k property that doubles in a year. Now at the end of the year you havfe 200k from initial salary, 200 in the investment, 200 profit from the investment which is 600 total. Now PUREPROFIT in your pocket is 200 -10k interest equals 190k profit.

Now in part 1 if you pay off your laons and get rid of your interst you make 10k more profit than you do if you funnel more money away into interst.

You are mistaking a concept-If you had 200k only-and EITHER could make the investment of 200k OR NOT make the investment and instead pay off your laons-then of course it is better to NOT pay loans off because the profit is much larger than the interst paid
BUT the point is when your a doctor-or atleast my plan-you are investing cash that is cash you dont need to live-extra money into property AND still being able to pay off a loan-you are making the same investment you would if you didnt pay off your loan is my point. It is only when you are sacrficing an investment to pay a loan off that it is a bad idea.

arrg.. so so dense you people

 

[yellowcat322]

God you are so dense! How can you be in medschool and be so completely dense! Any loans with interest that you are paying is wasted money. If you have an investment that is turning out a profit-why throw away some of the profit to pay interst on a loan, when you could have used your income/cash to make the investment and then the profit would be 100 percent profit without paying any away in interest. I guess you need an elementry example
1. Say you make 400k and want to invest in a 200k home and you have 100k in loans You can take 200k out of your salary and stick it in the investment. Now say a year later your investment doubles and you make 200 k. You also take 100 k form your salary and pay off your laons in entirety. So at the end of the year, assuming hypothetically that you dont spend any of your income ( for example purpose) you will have 100k cash from your initial salary left since you paid off your loan, 200k that went into your investment plus 200 k return on your investment. That givfes you 500k when its all said and done and of this 500-200k was pure profit ok.

2. You have the same 200k plus 100k outstanding loan. and you choose to not pay the loan off and lets say it accrues 10k interst over this next year. Plus you make the same investment into a 200k property that doubles in a year. Now at the end of the year you havfe 200k from initial salary, 200 in the investment, 200 profit from the investment which is 600 total. Now PUREPROFIT in your pocket is 200 -10k interest equals 190k profit.

Now in part 1 if you pay off your laons and get rid of your interst you make 10k more profit than you do if you funnel more money away into interst.

You are mistaking a concept-If you had 200k only-and EITHER could make the investment of 200k OR NOT make the investment and instead pay off your laons-then of course it is better to NOT pay loans off because the profit is much larger than the interst paid
BUT the point is when your a doctor-or atleast my plan-you are investing cash that is cash you dont need to live-extra money into property AND still being able to pay off a loan-you are making the same investment you would if you didnt pay off your loan is my point. It is only when you are sacrficing an investment to pay a loan off that it is a bad idea.

arrg.. so so dense you people

Ok

First off, enough with dishing out insults. You should be able to debate without antagonizing people or implying they shouldn't be in medical school.

Secondly, with all due respect, your deductions don't hold any water whatsoever. Using your own example, if I were to take my original salary of $400,000 and instead of investing $200K and paying 100K towards the loan, I would invest 300K, then according to your scenario of doubling returns, I would end up with 600K by the end of the year, I would then pay out 100K of that ending up with 500K plus the 100K from my salary for a total of 600K minus the 10K accrued loan interest still gives you $590K. In your scenario you end up with a total of only 500K. Your mistake was that in your second example you did nothing with the money you would have used to pay off the loan -- you just let it sit while your loan accrued interest. What I;m saying is, if you use that extra 100K to invest (forget doubling returns -- any investment that brings returns higher than the interest rate will do) you are actually going to be in better shape financially.

Thirdly, your example is too oversimplified to be applied. You are not taking into account many significant factors, such as:

a) very few people have all that extra free capital lying around. even with high paying specialist salaries, when you minus the taxes, malpractice insurance, and retirement fund payments you;re not exactly rolling in it

b) majority of people have other debt besides the student loans, such as mortgage, car payments, credit cards, etc. all of these debts usually have much higher interest than student loans. therefore, it makes sense to put whatever extra cash you may have towards paying back these loans before you pay off your student loan.

these are elementary concepts, especially for someone with a background in business; strange that you don;t get this

 

[TheCat]

Simple example for a seemingly simple mind-I dont have the time or the want to give you an entire detailed schematic of investment strategies-it was a very simplified illustration-i am not surprised you found a way to argue about it-i dont really care-you can go ask someone else you know or another financial advisor-they will tell you the same thing-I dont care to argue about something that is not even debated in the financial world-its simple princpiles. So have fun. spend your money how you want it! its not me that is losing out!

 

[MarzMD]

Simple example for a seemingly simple mind-I dont have the time or the want to give you an entire detailed schematic of investment strategies-it was a very simplified illustration-i am not surprised you found a way to argue about it-i dont really care-you can go ask someone else you know or another financial advisor-they will tell you the same thing-I dont care to argue about something that is not even debated in the financial world-its simple princpiles. So have fun. spend your money how you want it! its not me that is losing out!

TheCat, you are looking at it VERY wrong. For you to completely dismiss/not understand the practice of not paying off your loans all at once makes me question whether you know all that much about investing.

 

[Mr T]

I think people need to stop attacking this guy (cat). I've been thinking about whether to sacrifice my lifestyle to some extent (neuro surgery) for a higher salary. And I've been thinking about investing (RE and others) in order to maintain a better lifestyle. The guy makes a good general point, I don't think he mean't it as a step by step plan.

A lot of premed/med people are extremely insecure and anal, which may explain the 10 page mind-numbing responses.

 

[tigershark]

I think people need to stop attacking this guy (cat). I've been thinking about whether to sacrifice my lifestyle to some extent (neuro surgery) for a higher salary. And I've been thinking about investing (RE and others) in order to maintain a better lifestyle. The guy makes a good general point, I don't think he mean't it as a step by step plan.

A lot of premed/med people are extremely insecure and anal, which may explain the 10 page mind-numbing responses.

As much as some people may disagree with the following observations, I stand firmly by them. For practical reasons, I have to confine my discussion to areas that have received insufficient public attention or in which I have something new to say. Mr T's inability to fathom what I am talking about is betrayed by his insistence that everyone who doesn't share his beliefs is an abhorrent bureaucrat deserving of death and damnation. I'll say that again, because I want it to sink in: Vandalism, death threats, and slander are typical tactics used by his supporters.

It is important to differentiate between effrontive yutzes and patronizing maniacs who, in a variety of ways, have been lured by Mr T's daft threats or who have ended up wittingly or unwittingly in coalitions with Mr T's forces or who maintain contact with Mr T as part of serious and legitimate research. Why he would even pretend that he should use our weaknesses to his advantage because "it's the right thing to do" is beyond me. He wants to flout all of society's rules. Such intolerance is felt by all people, from every background. I've never bothered Mr T. Yet Mr T wants to suppress controversy and debate. Whatever happened to "live and let live"? In closing this letter, let me point out that I would be remiss if I didn't remind you that nowhere in the Bible does it say, "It's okay to annihilate a person's personality, individuality, will, and character".

 

[Flopotomist]

I went to finance school

What the heck is "finance school?"

 

[businessmd06]

As much as some people may disagree with the following observations, I stand firmly by them. For practical reasons, I have to confine my discussion to areas that have received insufficient public attention or in which I have something new to say. Mr T's inability to fathom what I am talking about is betrayed by his insistence that everyone who doesn't share his beliefs is an abhorrent bureaucrat deserving of death and damnation. I'll say that again, because I want it to sink in: Vandalism, death threats, and slander are typical tactics used by his supporters.

It is important to differentiate between effrontive yutzes and patronizing maniacs who, in a variety of ways, have been lured by Mr T's daft threats or who have ended up wittingly or unwittingly in coalitions with Mr T's forces or who maintain contact with Mr T as part of serious and legitimate research. Why he would even pretend that he should use our weaknesses to his advantage because "it's the right thing to do" is beyond me. He wants to flout all of society's rules. Such intolerance is felt by all people, from every background. I've never bothered Mr T. Yet Mr T wants to suppress controversy and debate. Whatever happened to "live and let live"? In closing this letter, let me point out that I would be remiss if I didn't remind you that nowhere in the Bible does it say, "It's okay to annihilate a person's personality, individuality, will, and character".

Wordy, too much jargon, not just this post, particularly the first one in response to the cat.