To all of you without the cookie cutter stats

[ilovedisish]

---

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Each time I browse SDN I hate seeing people who have never been to medical school speak as if they are admissions experts and tell people "you'll never get in with those scores." Truth is people with 4.0 and 33+ MCATs get rejected each year from medical school, but you rarely hear about them because they are too embarrassed to say. As someone who has been through the process and has assisted with admissions I must tell you guys that while your numbers may be good they can also work against you. Too often I interviewed applicants with the typical background:

1. 3.7+ GPA
2. 33+ MCAT
3. Research experience
4. Shadowing
5. Volunteer work

When it comes time for the interview those are the only things those applicants can discuss. What makes you stand out from the crowd?? NOTHING! So for those of you on here who have felt like you are untouchable because of your numbers- think again. Your numbers will mean nothing once you step into medical school. No patient will ever ask what your undergrad GPA was, what your MCAT score was, how much research experience you have, how many hours of shadowing you did, or how much volunteer work you did.

This post is for all of you out there without the perfect GPA, perfect MCAT, or anything else the "elites" on this forum boast about having. Keep working hard because I am sure your stories are much more interesting than the majority of theirs and don't let a few people's inflated egos bruise yours. You can do it and once you walk through the door remember the playing field is even.

~~~~ Class of 2009~~~~ Now Harvard Orthopedic Resident
(((2.3 undergrad sci major, 3.5 post bacc, 27MCAT, non URM)))

 

[mikevick]

sanks

 

[boko]

good post. I too dont have the cookie cutter stats but I know i can still make a great doctor!

 

[GrabSlamBoot]

so your non cookie cutter stats are......2.3 GPA and 27 MCAT.... way to be unique!

 

[PreMedOrDead]

Devil's advocate time...

Truth is people with 4.0 and 33+ MCATs get rejected each year from medical school, but you rarely hear about them because they are too embarrassed to say.

Maybe from some schools, but the fact is the better stats you have, the better chance you have of getting in. The statistics say you're wrong. You rarely hear about them because there are few people with what you call 'cookie cutter' stats and no acceptances. Stats in that range are in the 90% acceptance category.

When it comes time for the interview those are the only things those applicants can discuss. What makes you stand out from the crowd?? NOTHING! So for those of you on here who have felt like you are untouchable because of your numbers- think again.

Who has ever said this? If this were true, the stats would reach 100%, and they don't. And who is to say that high stat applicants can't have personalities? I've also met medical students that don't have personalities, so go figure. They're doing just fine.

Your numbers will mean nothing once you step into medical school. No patient will ever ask what your undergrad GPA was, what your MCAT score was, how much research experience you have, how many hours of shadowing you did, or how much volunteer work you did.

I've actually asked/heard a patient ask all of the above in some context of a conversation. 🙄

This post is for all of you out there without the perfect GPA, perfect MCAT, or anything else the "elites" on this forum boast about having.

Honestly, this just sounds like a rant to 'scare' high stat applicants.

Keep working hard because I am sure your stories are much more interesting than the majority of theirs and don't let a few people's inflated egos bruise yours. You can do it and once you walk through the door remember the playing field is even.

Like I said, fear-mongering the high stat applicants. I don't understand your beef with them, as they worked hard for their stats, doesn't necessarily mean they're *******s. I have pretty good stats, and I have yet to get a compliment on my scores, every compliment I've received has been regarding the uniqueness of my application and my personal sentiments.

You can do it and once you walk through the door remember the playing field is even.

Obviously this is true, in fact there are schools that do 'blind interviews' in which the person interviewing you has no idea of your statistical ability. But, the problem with your argument is the fact the medical schools screen MCAT/GPA. If you don't comply with their requirements, you aren't getting in the door.

As for those with low stats, yes, keep working hard. It's a more difficult path and you will have to work harder than those with better stats, but surely it isn't impossible. If anything, take advice from high stat applicants and see what they're doing differently. This definitely helped me as I was coming through my undergrad. I've seen many 'low stat' applicants become 'high stat' applicants by rigorous studying and putting in the extra work. Funny thing is, once they become 'high stat' applicants, people start attacking them just like this thread. Such is life. 😳

However, at the same time, it is necessary to be reasonable in your assessment of your stats and your experiences. You better have something extremely unconventional on your application if your GPA is a 2.0 and your MCAT is a 20, or else there isn't an MD school in the country that would be willing to pull you in.

Icing on the cake:

ilovedisish
New Member
Join Date: 07-18-2012
Total Posts: 1

 

[Crunk Norris]

Trollololololololololololol

 

[1289]

as much as I'd like to believe you are telling the truth about yourself..

i dont.

 

[OREdwardsJR]

~~~~ Class of 2009~~~~ Now Harvard Orthopedic Resident
(((2.3 undergrad sci major, 3.5 post bacc, 27MCAT, non URM)))

Is this thread srs or am I getting trolled?

 

[eeyoreish]

Each time I browse SDN I hate seeing people who have never been to medical school speak as if they are admissions experts and tell people "you'll never get in with those scores." Truth is people with 4.0 and 33+ MCATs get rejected each year from medical school, but you rarely hear about them because they are too embarrassed to say. As someone who has been through the process and has assisted with admissions I must tell you guys that while your numbers may be good they can also work against you. Too often I interviewed applicants with the typical background:

1. 3.7+ GPA
2. 33+ MCAT
3. Research experience
4. Shadowing
5. Volunteer work

When it comes time for the interview those are the only things those applicants can discuss. What makes you stand out from the crowd?? NOTHING! So for those of you on here who have felt like you are untouchable because of your numbers- think again. Your numbers will mean nothing once you step into medical school. No patient will ever ask what your undergrad GPA was, what your MCAT score was, how much research experience you have, how many hours of shadowing you did, or how much volunteer work you did.

This post is for all of you out there without the perfect GPA, perfect MCAT, or anything else the "elites" on this forum boast about having. Keep working hard because I am sure your stories are much more interesting than the majority of theirs and don't let a few people's inflated egos bruise yours. You can do it and once you walk through the door remember the playing field is even.

~~~~ Class of 2009~~~~ Now Harvard Orthopedic Resident
(((2.3 undergrad sci major, 3.5 post bacc, 27MCAT, non URM)))

That's good advice in some sense. Once you get to the point of the interview, how you interview is going to make a big difference. Just because people have below average stats doesn't mean all hope is lost. To those people the advice to apply widely, let your personality shine through and hope for the best is always good. Congratulations on getting into such a competitive residency!

Keep in mind though that when you gained admission to medical school (2005?) it was completely different. We are in the longest recession since the the 1930's, and there is no end in sight. Growth is absolutely anemic.

That means that the competition for medical school slots has skyrocketed dramatically. The number of applicants is increasing, but that isn't the only thing to look at. You also have to take into how much higher quality the applicants are.

When I was applying to medical school it was really weird for my dad. He applied in the late 80's in a year that was really really uncompetitive, we are talking 20k first time applicants for just over 15k MD spots.

https://www.aamc.org/download/153708/data/charts1982to2012.pdf

So for him, he scored in the mid 20's on the MCAT and had good EC and other stuff on his application, and had absolutely no problem getting accepted to a very nice brand name institution, and was accepted to every single school he applied to.

When I got back my MCAT score he was like "holy crap, that blows mine out of the water you'll have a breeze going anywhere you want..." and that definitely wasn't the case. I got into a school I like and am really happy with, but it's by no means "brand name" (not that I care about that) and it certainly wasn't easy to get in, and I got my share of rejections.

Anyway food for thought!

 

[Ruhroh]

Post verification that you are an orthopedic resident or GTFO

 

[TheShaker]

Is this thread srs or am I getting trolled?

A user with 1 post during the peak of the application preparation season? I can't see how this can be a troll.

 

[eeyoreish]

Gotta agree. Just someone who is jelly trying to rustle the jimmies of people with good stats. 2.3 GPA and a 3.5 post-bacc isn't going to get you into harvard unless you're like a urm that started some enormous non-profit

He said resident, that doesn't mean he went to harvard for medical school. He probably went to a mid-tier state medical school and then just worked hard and got some good research (assuming this isn't a troll).

 

[TipToad]

He's a RESIDENT at Harvard.

Resident. Not med student. Big difference.

 

[ilovedisish]

This is not to scare anyone... If you have high stats great, but I hate to see people on here think that because they have a great MCAT/ GPA that they are automatically experts on "what it takes to get into medical school." Instead of bashing people, let them know what worked for you and leave it at that. Don't go around bruising people's ego just because yours is inflated.... medical school will humble you in 1 day.

PS ... as stated before I am not a URM.

 

[Slowpoke]

Can you take a picture of your current hospital badge (with the name crossed out if you wish) and something to show your undergrad GPA?

 

[VisionaryTics]

 

[MaenadsDance]

I do not have "cookie-cutter" stats. I have a checkered transcript. And you know what? It legitimately worries me that the weak spots on my transcript may accurately predict future problems in my abilities to handle not only medical school, but also residency. I have plenty of reasons and excuses for why I've made the mistakes I've made, but the thing is, not everybody makes those mistakes. They have a right to feel proud of their accomplishments.

 

[FattySlug]

Horrible trolling. You sound like some dumb premed who is trying to take a shot at the "elites" so you feel a tiny bit better about your mediocre application. If anything is scary about the OP it is his insecurity

 

[PreMedOrDead]

My God, your profile picture...

I do not have "cookie-cutter" stats. I have a checkered transcript. And you know what? It legitimately worries me that the weak spots on my transcript may accurately predict future problems in my abilities to handle not only medical school, but also residency. I have plenty of reasons and excuses for why I've made the mistakes I've made, but the thing is, not everybody makes those mistakes. They have a right to feel proud of their accomplishments.

Exactly, I agree. It's entirely okay to be proud of what you've done.

However, it's not okay to degrade other applicants. OP seems to be doing the reverse, degrading those with higher stats. Odd, but still clearly there.

I have no problem bringing a high stat applicant to their senses if they degrade a low stat applicant, but that's just not the case. I very rarely, if ever, have seen that happen. Just because someone posts their high stats doesn't mean they're trying to make you feel bad because you're lower.

Edit:
Just so you know, I have a 42S and a 3.99 sGPA/4.00 cGPA. I'm also a female URM on my second publication and founder of the largest local nonprofit.
I also have 420 posts, teehee.

 

[TheShaker]

My God, your profile picture...



Exactly, I agree. It's entirely okay to be proud of what you've done.

However, it's not okay to degrade other applicants. OP seems to be doing the reverse, degrading those with higher stats. Odd, but still clearly there.

I have no problem bringing a high stat applicant to their senses if they degrade a low stat applicant, but that's just not the case. I very rarely, if ever, have seen that happen. Just because someone posts their high stats doesn't mean they're trying to make you feel bad because you're lower.

Edit:
Just so you know, I have a 42S and a 3.99 sGPA/4.00 cGPA. I'm also a female URM on my second publication and founder of the largest local nonprofit.
I also have 420 posts, teehee.

How can you have a 4.00cGPA with a 3.99sGPA? That's impossible. Hah! That's the ONLY unbelievable part of your post. 🙄

 

[PreMedOrDead]

How can you have a 4.00cGPA with a 3.99sGPA? That's impossible. Hah! That's the ONLY unbelievable part of your post. 🙄

Rounding errors in transcripts.

I.E.: A- in a one credit science course gives a 3.994 sGPA but a 3.996 cGPA. Put your critical thinking skills to work. 😉

 

[ShenanigansMD]

Sigh... an eye-for-an-eye makes the whole world blind dude. I mean yes, elites can be annoying, but this is exactly the same condescending crap. As long as you have Harvard behind your name you can say anything apparently.

EDIT: Although, orthopedics is pretty awesome.

 

[VisionaryTics]

My God, your profile picture...

I've thought about changing it for variety's sake, but it gets such a strong response.

 

[carramrod06]

Rounding errors in transcripts.

I.E.: A- in a one credit science course gives a 3.994 sGPA but a 3.996 cGPA. Put your critical thinking skills to work. 😉

critical thinking?! but i thought we were done with critical thinking after the mcat!

 

[ilovedisish]

I do wonder though, what percentage of people on SDN do lie about their stats. If so, Why?

 

[PreMedOrDead]

I've thought about changing it for variety's sake, but it gets such a strong response.

Especially when you include nothing in your post and your picture provides a perfect context for the thread. Eerie, almost.

critical thinking?! but i thought we were done with critical thinking after the mcat!

Hmm...

How about this

I do wonder though, what percentage of people on SDN do lie about their stats. If so, Why?

Why don't you tell us?

 

[ShenanigansMD]

I do wonder though, what percentage of people on SDN do lie about their stats. If so, Why?

To fit in, or feel good about themselves, or risk being made fun of. I get crap for being an engineer pre-med, and people say "engineers don't know anything about medicine" and all that garbage, and I really don't care anymore.

 

[PreMedOrDead]

To fit in, or feel good about themselves, or risk being made fun of. I get crap for being an engineer pre-med, and people say "engineers don't know anything about medicine" and all that garbage, and I really don't care anymore.

Engineers don't know anything about medicine.

But neither do people majoring in:


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[FONT=Arial, Helvetica]Medical School FAQ.​

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.

 

[ShenanigansMD]

Lol Mormon affiliation is a major?

 

[PreMedOrDead]

Lol Mormon affiliation is a major?

If you attend SVU, I believe so. (not Special Victims Unit...)

 

[circulus vitios]

I have a high GPA, mediocre ECs, no research experience, and the personality of a door.

I guess I'm screwed.

 

[ShenanigansMD]

I have a high GPA, mediocre ECs, no research experience, and the personality of a door.

I guess I'm screwed.

check this out

 

[typicalindian]

I wish I had cookie cutter stats lmao.

 

[ILuvScience]

I know that's right : )

 

[GNE24]

Each time I browse SDN I hate seeing people who have never been to medical school speak as if they are admissions experts and tell people "you'll never get in with those scores." Truth is people with 4.0 and 33+ MCATs get rejected each year from medical school, but you rarely hear about them because they are too embarrassed to say. As someone who has been through the process and has assisted with admissions I must tell you guys that while your numbers may be good they can also work against you. Too often I interviewed applicants with the typical background:

1. 3.7+ GPA
2. 33+ MCAT
3. Research experience
4. Shadowing
5. Volunteer work

When it comes time for the interview those are the only things those applicants can discuss. What makes you stand out from the crowd?? NOTHING! So for those of you on here who have felt like you are untouchable because of your numbers- think again. Your numbers will mean nothing once you step into medical school. No patient will ever ask what your undergrad GPA was, what your MCAT score was, how much research experience you have, how many hours of shadowing you did, or how much volunteer work you did.

This post is for all of you out there without the perfect GPA, perfect MCAT, or anything else the "elites" on this forum boast about having. Keep working hard because I am sure your stories are much more interesting than the majority of theirs and don't let a few people's inflated egos bruise yours. You can do it and once you walk through the door remember the playing field is even.

~~~~ Class of 2009~~~~ Now Harvard Orthopedic Resident
(((2.3 undergrad sci major, 3.5 post bacc, 27MCAT, non URM)))

If you guys read the post correctly he's a non-urm. Sounds like a troll, but then again why would this person waist their time on sdn like this? I say good job.

 

[ILuvScience]

U go hun! : )

 

[MedPR]

I wish I had cookie cutter stats lmao.

Me too. Oh wait, I have cookie cutter URM stats. Go me!

 

[MedPR]

Gotta agree. Just someone who is jelly trying to rustle the jimmies of people with good stats. 2.3 GPA and a 3.5 post-bacc isn't going to get you into harvard unless you're like a urm that started some enormous non-profit

I agree with you except you missed the part where the OP said they are a Harvard ortho resident, not a Harvard med student. UG GPA doesn't matter once you're an M0.

 

[TheMightySmiter]

I think it's fine to be interested in other applications for the purpose of roughly gauging your own chances, but I don't know why so many people are obsessed with judging people based on their stats or ECs or whatever.

 

[Alejandro]

I think its good to see what others bring to the table, but honestly...there are so many factors involved that stats matter, but also do not matter.

It's like counting cards in blackjack: You fluctuate your bets, and keep count of when the shoe is going for faces. Does that mean by counting you will win every hand? Nope. But you're trying to play out a statistical advantage by making the most when your odds are high to win. So, in the case of stats, your GPA and MCAT scores are going to give you a statistical advantage, but doesn't mean every applicant with those stats will get in.

I think the moral of the story is that once you have your GPA and MCAT scores figured out, everything forward from there is NOTHING about it. You won't revisit any of those classes, and you won't need the GPA or the MCAT other than apps. At this point, you ought to worry less on your numbers and more about who you are as a person, and what qualifies you to be a doctor besides your numbers.

Besides, why fret about numbers when you can't change them (MCAT maybe, but it's a lot of work) after you're done?

I come from the low-numbers pool, supposedly. Those with the high numbers, all I want to know is that you're a chill person who isn't neurotic when hangin out with friends, and knows how to be professional around patients, especially those who are difficult to handle. If you can do that, you have my respect.🙂 Props with the strong stats!

 

[circulus vitios]

Contrary to SDN beliefs, you don't need a 3.8 sGPA/3.8 cGPA/38 MCAT/4 years research/4 years TAing/500 hours clinical volunteering/500 hours non-clinical volunteering/founding of a non-profit/etc. to get into medical school.

Also contrary to SDN beliefs, schools routinely accept below-average applicants. Funny how math works like that. However, higher stats obviously help as evident by AAMC data.

I think most people can get into at least one "lower-tier" medical school if they have average stats (3.63/31/50-100 hours shadowing/100-200 hours clinical volunteering/100-200 hours non-clinical volunteering), provided they submit 20 or so applicants and they don't interview like someone with Aspergers.

If you have below average stats then you might want to have good ECs. If you have above average stats then you might be able to get in with slightly below average ECs.

Or at least that's how I see it. Time will tell, when I apply next year.

 

[moneytree]

Each time I browse SDN I hate seeing people who have never been to medical school speak as if they are admissions experts and tell people "you'll never get in with those scores." Truth is people with 4.0 and 33+ MCATs get rejected each year from medical school, but you rarely hear about them because they are too embarrassed to say. As someone who has been through the process and has assisted with admissions I must tell you guys that while your numbers may be good they can also work against you. Too often I interviewed applicants with the typical background:

1. 3.7+ GPA
2. 33+ MCAT
3. Research experience
4. Shadowing
5. Volunteer work

When it comes time for the interview those are the only things those applicants can discuss. What makes you stand out from the crowd?? NOTHING! So for those of you on here who have felt like you are untouchable because of your numbers- think again. Your numbers will mean nothing once you step into medical school. No patient will ever ask what your undergrad GPA was, what your MCAT score was, how much research experience you have, how many hours of shadowing you did, or how much volunteer work you did.

This post is for all of you out there without the perfect GPA, perfect MCAT, or anything else the "elites" on this forum boast about having. Keep working hard because I am sure your stories are much more interesting than the majority of theirs and don't let a few people's inflated egos bruise yours. You can do it and once you walk through the door remember the playing field is even.

~~~~ Class of 2009~~~~ Now Harvard Orthopedic Resident
(((2.3 undergrad sci major, 3.5 post bacc, 27MCAT, non URM)))

😏
Are you one of these people?
http://www.harvardorthoresidency.org/pgy3

 

[TheMightySmiter]

😏
Are you one of these people?
http://www.harvardorthoresidency.org/pgy3

It's funny that they put the only attractive person in the most prominent spot (top, middle). LOL.

 

[gettheleadout]

😏
Are you one of these people?
http://www.harvardorthoresidency.org/pgy3

If he is then it's a coin flip for us to determine his identity, because only two PGY-3's there attended schools outside the top 10-ish (and if the OP had, he would have included this in his post.)

 

[tn4596]

It's funny that they put the only attractive person in the most prominent spot (top, middle). LOL.

they are all attractive in their own way! stop being so judgemental

 

[moneytree]

It's funny that they put the only attractive person in the most prominent spot (top, middle). LOL.

It's in alphabetical order bro.

 

[circulus vitios]

It's funny that they put the only attractive person in the most prominent spot (top, middle). LOL.

Carl Harper looks like a pedophile.

 

[ilikesports]

12

 

[Geebeejay]

It's funny that they put the only attractive person in the most prominent spot (top, middle). LOL.

Hah, I work with him....gotta show him your post next time I see him

 

[von Matterhorn]

My buddy with a 4.0 undergrad GPA in Biology, 40 on the MCAT (retake from a 37), and very traditional ECs (volunteer at local hospital, school research, EMT, etc) got rejected from a lot of schools he applied to. I personally believe it's because he spent his entire time in school trying to become the perfect applicant, and actually missed the boat on becoming it. He has never worked a job in his life, never left his state, etc.

Of course, he did get into a school, but it was kind of eye-opening to see so many schools reject him, even our state schools. I often ask him how his stats impacted his success, but he always tells me that pretty much no one ever acknowledged his scores or success in school during the application process, although I'm sure it did open a few doors for him.