Too old to become a doctor ?

[hamiltonnyc]

over 40 is certainly too old to start med school. Don't waste your time.

Even when people work well into their 80s now? That's a solid 30 years of physicianing. I probably wouldn't want to practice into my 80s but I wouldn't speak in terms of absolutes for others.

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[Ligament]

Even when people work well into their 80s now? That's a solid 30 years of physicianing. I probably wouldn't want to practice into my 80s but I wouldn't speak in terms of absolutes for others.

Hi, yes even when people work into their 80s. There are very, very few physicians working into their 80s; its too hard. Loss of cognitive funciton, loss of motor function, loss of stamina. It is very hard to practice as a physician past 65 y/o. This is reality.

I was a nontraditional applicant and started med school at 27. That was too old IMO. I had nobody to advise me.

Unless you are independently wealthy, it is a waste becoming a physician when you are too old. You'll practice for 10 or 15 years in some of these examples. It takes 10-15 years in some cases to find a steady job, or one that has a good financial situation. Or if you are going to start your own practice, takes up to 10 years to mature and become financially rewarding.

Not only that, surviving call in your 40s and 50s is unbearable. Hard enough in your 20s and 30s.

What a waste of time and money.

 

[hamiltonnyc]

I was a nontraditional applicant and started med school at 27. That was too old IMO. I had nobody to advise me.

Not only that, surviving call in your 40s and 50s is unbearable. Hard enough in your 20s and 30s.

What a waste of time and money.

Sounds like a case very specific to you.

 

[Ligament]

Sounds like a case very specific to you.

Not really!

 

[hamiltonnyc]

Not really!

Head over to the nontraditional ages thread!

 

[Ligament]

Head over to the nontraditional ages thread!

I wish you the best. Just trying to save some people some time and money.

I was older when I started med school (27). Even that age is not too bad, it was just doable. I am an attending physician of well over a decade now. I dont need to read about all the older applicants and their stories. I've lived it. I've seen plenty of "nontraditional" applicants drop out of med school and/or internship/residency, or make it into attending status only to burn out or fail due to lack of stamina or other health problems. Sure some make it, but at what cost? Many HAD to go into specialties based on the workload, vs. what they loved, as they could not handle the sleep deprivation and work hours of more work intensive specialties.

I've said what I have to say. If you feel you want to spend the next 10 years of your life in training, enter the workforce when you are old and in massive debt, and then work for a decade or so before you are too old to continue or too burned out, fine with me. Keep in mind most new doctors change jobs multiple times in the early years before they find a stable or non-abusive gig. So by the time you find a job you are happy with, you may have to retire.

 

[hamiltonnyc]

I wish you the best. Just trying to save some people some time and money.

I was older when I started med school (27). Even that age is not too bad, it was just doable. I am an attending physician of well over a decade now. I dont need to read about all the older applicants and their stories. I've lived it. I've seen plenty of "nontraditional" applicants drop out of med school and/or internship/residency, or make it into attending status only to burn out or fail due to lack of stamina or other health problems. Sure some make it, but at what cost? Many HAD to go into specialties based on the workload, vs. what they loved, as they could not handle the sleep deprivation and work hours of more work intensive specialties.

I've said what I have to say. If you feel you want to spend the next 10 years of your life in training, enter the workforce when you are old and in massive debt, and then work for a decade or so before you are too old to continue or too burned out, fine with me. Keep in mind most new doctors change jobs multiple times in the early years before they find a stable or non-abusive gig. So by the time you find a job you are happy with, you may have to retire.

Yeah I'd love to see the statistics on medical school completion rates split by age.

You seem to regret going to medical school. Can I ask you what your motivations were to be a physician and what changed?

 

[RNthenDoc]

It takes 10-15 years in some cases to find a steady job, or one that has a good financial situation.

I’ve never heard of a physician that took 15 years to find a steady job, so I’m curious about what you meant here.

For that kind of time investment, you could go military, or underserved and erase all your debt. With *no* debt, basically any physician job will be a good financial situation.

So what kind of situations are you referencing, taking 15 years to find a steady job?

 

[JSReed]

I’ve never heard of a physician that took 15 years to find a steady job, so I’m curious about what you meant here.

For that kind of time investment, you could go military, or underserved and erase all your debt. With *no* debt, basically any physician job will be a good financial situation.

So what kind of situations are you referencing, taking 15 years to find a steady job?

Attempting to interpret here, but think its referring to finding a job where you're paid well, have a good rapport with the staff, dont totally hate all the higher-ups, aren't giving up half your salary for loan repayments, aren't totally overwhelmed, don't get totally shafted on call schedules, etc. etc.

@Ligament But also I think that's kind of the risk you take as a non-trad (not 23, more like 30+). You're going back to the bottom of the totem pole and you have to be able to take the graveyard shifts and picking up other peoples ****. The idea is that you care much less about financial stability, retirement funds, lifestyle at large, etc than you do about being a physician. At least that's how I've justified it to myself. But good to hear the opposite side as well.

 

[deleted709753]

i started when i was 30. im a 33 year old ms4 now. i wish I started when i was younger. Maybe if i was younger i would be more inclined to go into a surgery residency. But now that im going into EM im dreading starting a four year program and really preferring to do a 3 year program, just because i need to start paying off this massive debt and saving for a house.

 

[Dave1980]

Agree with @Ligament. You can't count on working into your 80's. Most people work into their early to mid 60's.

Also once you become an Attending you aren't automatically at the top of the pyramid. You are now at the bottom of a different pyramid. This one is composed of partners above you (in PP) or associate and full professors above you (in academics). Being a new Attending in your late 40's or early 50's would be miserable. You still have a lot to learn in your first years as an Attending.

 

[hamiltonnyc]

Also once you become an Attending you aren't automatically at the top of the pyramid. You are now at the bottom of a different pyramid. This one is composed of partners above you (in PP) or associate and full professors above you (in academics). Being a new Attending in your late 40's or early 50's would be miserable. You still have a lot to learn in your first years as an Attending.

I wouldn't say you need to be at the top of the pyramid to be settled into a career, necessarily. Some people strive for the top, but others care more about the work they're doing. The ego in medicine is one of the things I do not look forward to.

 

[peregrino]

I would like to think that whether an applicant is too old to go into medicine is something that both applicants and AdComms need to carefully consider on a case-by-case basis, not some comprehensive policy. One never knows how things will turn out. There is one doctor with whom I worked for several years. She attended a top medical school in her 50s. She is now a pediatrician, neonatologist and assistant professor and faculty member at another highly-ranked medical school, has done pioneering research on infant development and has given talks about it around the world. As an older applicant myself, I have looked to her as as example of how physicians can contribute to advancing healthcare and medicine even at later ages.

Perhaps what some older non-trads want is just the chance to try. Not everyone considers health care as a career early in life. Some of us took different career paths and had different interests. Others, like myself, had negative health care experiences when we were young (my situation) that dissuaded us from pursuing medicine or health care careers earlier. However, we have now resolved the issues that had disinclined us to medicine, and want to pursue it now.

P.S. I think this thread has become one of those threads that seems to never end . . .

 

[Ligament]

I would like to think that whether an applicant is too old to go into medicine is something that both applicants and AdComms need to carefully consider on a case-by-case basis, not some comprehensive policy. One never knows how things will turn out. There is one doctor with whom I worked for several years. She attended a top medical school in her 50s. She is now a pediatrician, neonatologist and assistant professor and faculty member at another highly-ranked medical school, has done pioneering research on infant development and has given talks about it around the world. As an older applicant myself, I have looked to her as as example of how physicians can contribute to advancing healthcare and medicine even at later ages.

Perhaps what some older non-trads want is just the chance to try. Not everyone considers health care as a career early in life. Some of us took different career paths and had different interests. Others, like myself, had negative health care experiences when we were young (my situation) that dissuaded us from pursuing medicine or health care careers earlier. Howeer, we have now resolved the issues that had disinclined us to medicine, and want to pursue it now.

P.S. I think this thread has become one of those threads that seems to never end . . .

Does not end because nobody is listening to the actual physicians who have gone through this. There is an echo chamber of idealistic undergrads and med students here.

You guys who are 40 years old and just starting med school are making a very poor decision unless you already have retirement funds and enjoy sleep deprivation. If the latter two fit you, by all means do it.

The schools and hospitals make a TON of money off your tuition and virtually free labor. Of course they are going to encourage you.

 

[Dave1980]

I wouldn't say you need to be at the top of the pyramid to be settled into a career, necessarily. Some people strive for the top, but others care more about the work they're doing. The ego in medicine is one of the things I do not look forward to.

Being at the bottom of the pyramid as an Attending doesn't suck because it hurts your ego it sucks because you are clinically not as good as people who have been in the game longer, you typically don't get paid for weekends and nights (which partners do), you work the more desirable holidays and the most undesirable shifts/locations/clinics, you don't get to have input on major decisions that affect the group, and your position within the group is relatively tenuous.

 

[hamiltonnyc]

Does not end because nobody is listening to the actual physicians who have gone through this. There is an echo chamber of idealistic undergrads and med students here.

You guys who are 40 years old and just starting med school are making a very poor decision unless you already have retirement funds and enjoy sleep deprivation. If the latter two fit you, by all means do it.

The schools and hospitals make a TON of money off your tuition and virtually free labor. Of course they are going to encourage you.

What was your motivation to do medicine and how has that changed? I understand your frustrations, but you talk about your path like it's inevitable. I want to see how close we both are at the starting point when we decided to pursue medicine.
You mention finances a lot, and that's fair. However, did you not know this going in? How big of a motivation was money in your decision? I'm curious because you mention money a lot, and if we are to go off of generalizations like you are inclined to do, the older generation of doctors were more influenced by money when it was a lot more lucrative.

 

[hamiltonnyc]

Being at the bottom of the pyramid as an Attending doesn't suck because it hurts your ego it sucks because you are clinically not as good as people who have been in the game longer, you typically don't get paid for weekends and nights (which partners do), you work the more desirable holidays and the most undesirable shifts/locations/clinics, you don't get to have input on major decisions that affect the group, and your position within the group is relatively tenuous.

Same question, what was your motivation for medicine and how has that changed? Do you feel like you're making a difference in your work?

 

[Dave1980]

Same question, what was your motivation for medicine and how has that changed? Do you feel like you're making a difference in your work?

I'm Jewish. My mother told me I had to be a doctor. Nothing has changed...still Jewish.

I definitely feel like I am making a difference. I'm a radiologist. A bad radiologist can do a lot of damage.

 

[hamiltonnyc]

I'm Jewish. My mother told me I had to be a doctor. Nothing has changed...still Jewish.

I definitely feel like I am making a difference. I'm a radiologist. A bad radiologist can do a lot of damage.

Thank you, this puts your perspective in, well, perspective. I understand that there can be a lot of frustrations in medicine, and I don't pretend to understand them all. But as a career changer (and a lucrative but grueling one at that), I understand that there are downsides in all jobs. I didn't decide to career change because of the day to day annoyances, though.

 

[LUCPM]

As somone (n=1) who has become an attending just before turning 50, I have never regretted my decision to pursue medicine as a second career. In fact, it is the best and the most fulfilling job I've ever had. We all have bad days but life is good for the most part.

I try not to worry about finance too much because I can now easily pay off some of the debt I incurred during my school years with a salary that pays way more than what I used to make. Student loans?? Hopefully I will make it to the end, Lol. I have seen quite a few people who worked all their lives but were eventually ended up comatose at a nursing home after giving away all their savings and house just to stay there. I sometimes think what's the point of all this? I don't even know how long I can stay healthy and no one can predict what tomorrow will bring. I just chose a different career that would make me happy. Life seems too short.

If your goal is a financial success or whatever, there are other jobs that can give you financial stability and such. Fortunately, we get to make a choice in our lives.

 

[Errollt]

Sorry, but the OPost looks like a troll post...