touro CA Rotation sites

[Thomas Hearns]

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I've heard some bad things about this schools organization with their rotation sites while reading around on this site. I wanted to get some more confirmation/information about this. It sounded very distressing... this was a school I was strongly considering going to because it is close to my home and in an area where I'd like to practice later in life.

Please let me know if this school has something I should be worried about with disorganized and/or low-quality rotation sites or something similar. Thank you all very much for your time, I truly appreciate it.

 

[MasterShakeDO]

Here is the complete list of affiliated rotation sites as posted on our clinical ed website.

Of these, here are ones I know of that we can spend at least 6 months for 3rd year cores.

Alta Bates Summit Medical Center, Berkeley, CA
Arrowhead Regional Medical Center, Colton, CA
Botsford General Hospital, Farmington Hills, MI
Chino Valley Medical Center, Chino, CA
Colorado Society of Osteopathic Medicine, Denver, CO
Doctor's Hospital Medical Center, San Pablo/Pinole, CA
Downey Regional Medical Center, Downey, CA
Kern Medical Center, Bakersfield, CA
Mendocino Community Health Clinic, Ukiah, CA
Pacific Hospital Long Beach, Long Beach, CA
Pontiac Osteopathic Hospital, Pontiac, MI
St. John's Episcopal Hospital, South Shore, Far Rockaway, NY
St. Joseph Mercy-Oakland, Pontiac, MI
University of California San Francisco – Fresno, CA
Wilson Memorial Hospital – United Health Services, Johnson City, NY

Most of the teaching hospitals where you can spend a whole year are not in the Bay Area. Many who stay in the Bay Area commute to different sites each rotation, and the quality of teaching varies by site. Most sites you will be one-on-one with a preceptor. There are those who learn best that way, and there are those who don't.
If you want to learn at a place that has residents, interns, and attendings then I would shoot for one of the above teaching hospitals. I did my cores at on of the teaching hospitals and would not trade it for anything. I believe that clinical ed is working on adding core sites to the Bay Area... not sure on any specific recent progress. I know Alta Bates was added, but St. Lukes in SF was lost. They also have plenty of spots upstate for the taking if you are so inclined.

4th years can go anywhere and see anything so long as you do at least 5 rotations at affiliated sites. If you live in a region with many university-affiliated hospitals this arrangement can really work to your advantage (ie. Nor. Cal or So. Cal). Yes it's a pain to set up every single rotation but the flexibility you have to go to the U.C.'s, Kaisers, private practice makes it worth it.

Any more questions you can PM me

 

[Thomas Hearns]

Thank you very much for the information! I may be taking up your offer of a PM

 

[Thomas Hearns]

PMd

 

[Thomas Hearns]

Sorry to bump this thread, but I'm curious about the "competition" in getting rotation spots? I've heard that the students at this school have to compete with Standford and UCD among other medical students in trying to get rotation spots. Does this apply to elective rotations, or all rotations? How does this work? It's a concern I have about attending this school, I've heard a few stories of people unable to obtain rotation spots in the area, having to move around the country, and I'm just seeking more information about how the process works, and where the problems are for this school. Thanks!

 

[danimjo]

bump

 

[bth7]

They will give you a list of hospitals. They will say "its not a problem, we have the rotations. You can do your 3rd year here."

BE SKEPTICAL OF TOURO. Ask the tough questions:

How many students are taken at each of these hospitals? (They'll often throw in the name of a respectable hospital to distract you, but not tell you that only one student/year rotates there.)

How many students will be assigned to a particular rotation? (30 students assigned to the same surgery rotation means you won't get to scrub in on cases.)

Is it a teaching hospital with supervision for students to assist with procedures? (if its not you'll never put in an IV, never assist with a central line placement, never do an ABG, never learn to suture a laceration. You'll stand there, watching, for two years b/c students aren't covered by hospital insurance policy.)

How many times will you have to move 3rd and 4th years? (If you have to move every 3 months from upstate to downstate to Michigan to get all your required rotations in, you'll be so displaced it will be nearly impossible to focus on learning.)

Will my rotations be inpatient? (An OG/GYN "rotation" at an outpatient clinic means you'll never see a delivery, let alone assist with one. A Medicine rotation at an outpatient clinic means you'll never do an admission, never work-up a patient for MI or Stroke or Afib or GI bleed, or anything else.)

Does the hospital count DOs and Carribean students together? Hospitals/DO schools have started to do this sneaky thing to pack students on rotations. The have quotas on the number of med students they can have on a rotation, but they count DO students separately from MD students (Caribbean) allowing them to take twice as many students.

Is there an organized didactic program at the hospital in which med students can participate? Students sent to hospitals without residency programs in that department. No residency program means no lectures, no teaching rounds, no attendings willing to round on their patients with students. No interns/residents there to help students along.

Does the school compensate attendings to teach? No $$ = no teaching. Attendings are busy people. If you don't pay them to take the time out of their day to teach, they have no incentive to teach.

What rotations are required? What is available? No required neurology rotation means they had such a hard time finding neurology rotations for students that they couldn't require students do one. No neurosurg rotation available means no chance to see neurosurg. No child psych rotation means you won't be seeing child psych.

Which professors from years 1&2 will be continuing to teach students years 3&4? No continuity in teaching means a massive disconnect in your education.

Investigate your field of interest. If you have an interest in peds, ask to speak to someone in the pediatrics department about the rotation. Ask them what the rotation is like for med students. If you can't talk to anyone at all for even a few minutes, this is a red flag.

Ask the tough questions. Don't be fooled by vague promises and a "list of hospitals."

Don't rely solely on admissions personnel. Talk to 4th year students who can tell you their experience with trying to arrange their rotations. Find out what its really like.

Again, do yourself a favor, please talk directly to 4th year medical students and graduates at Touro.

bth

 

[ducki303]

Hey bth7,

You seem to be very familiar with the Touro campuses. What are your pros and cons between the campuses? Are both sites having a hard time providing quality rotations for their students?

 

[bth7]

Hey bth7,

You seem to be very familiar with the Touro campuses. What are your pros and cons between the campuses? Are both sites having a hard time providing quality rotations for their students?

Hi Ducki,

I've written about Touro, the good and the bad, over the past 4 years.

http://forums.studentdoctor.net/search.php?do=finduser&u=36159

Try skimming through my old posts.

bth

 

[ducki303]

wonderful... i couldn't figure how to consolidate your responses.