Trouble with Math. Reconsidering my ability.

[Hume]

I recently finished prerequsites for a formal post-bac program: precalculus and intro to gen chem. I got my butt kicked, more or less. After much effort and to my dismay, I ended up with a C in the math class and a B in chemistry.
I am specifically vexed about my mediocre math grade. I stayed up on my homework, class attendance, and studied for the tests (duh), but just couldn’t seem to perform well on the tests. My teacher was awful, but I don’t want to use that as an excuse. I got a pre-calc DVD supplement from mathtutors.com. It was great, but didn’t even cover half the material we reviewed in class.

Looking back, I’m not sure what I would have done differently. Perhaps shelving out money for a tutor would have worked.

In short, I tried really hard and did poorly. While this semester was humbling and sobering, my resolve to become a doctor is still there; but I need to know that I have what it takes to perform well in the quantitative sciences.

Questions: How did you guys succeed as math students? In preforming sub-par as I did, what does this reflect about my weaknesses as a student? Are there any resources out there that might further supplement a math courses? I’m scheduled to become EMT certified this summer, but may take a math refresher course instead. Thoughts?

As always, I am deeply appreciative for any responses.

Best wishes and enjoy the summer,
~Hume

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[NTF]

Is it possible to schedule time with your professor to go over your exams? You may need to do a post-exam diagnostic to find out what's tricking you up.

 

[murfettie]

1. I am pretty good with math, of course, I didn't take my calculus class at Caltech or anything, I'm sure I would have died there..
Also I moved to the US at 13 from China, so, I was doing 40/problems a day since 4th grades in China, and I was about 3+ grade level ahead when I began American schools. So, math is all about practice.
2. It doesn't reflect anything about your academic ability. Well, it reflects that you are not doing well in a math class and you haven't practiced enough math problems, but, that is ALL. It doesn't reflect anything else about you, don't feel too bad.

do you do enough problems?
just LOOKING at math isn't enough.
usually the hW isn't enough either.
diagnose your problems, figure out exactly which step and why you did something wrong.
figure the concepts involved in your mistakes. attack them
Since you are having problems with precal, I think you might have a pretty weak math foundation, since precal is mostly the stuff already learned more or less in the past. I don't know how much time you want to invest in it, but for example, if you just keep sucking at say... polynomial equation + graph, or particular steps in in, figure out where, then maybe get an algebra II textbook, start there, do the problems there where it introduces the related concept, then move on to your precal stuff..

If you bone up on the algebra, trig stuff in the summer. Say, do 40 problems/day. I promise you that you won't suck at math by months 3. I've tutored worse students and you have to be a Nazi to yourself to improve.
Don't THINK you can do the problems, hide the solution and just do it yourself. Change the conditions, make your own problems, do them too.

also, check out
http://www.khanacademy.org/
This guy's lectures are great!

Don't your school have free tutors? I know a lot of universities provide that.

There is book called how to be a straight A student written by some MIT dude. It's a pretty good book.
You don't really need to buy the book, everything is on his blog since the book spans from his blog.
He gives a lot of advice on studying for techical classes, like math.

That's all I got. Math is not a talent, it simply comes from practice. You can do it.

 

[Hume]

Is it possible to schedule time with your professor to go over your exams? You may need to do a post-exam diagnostic to find out what's tricking you up.

Well, I did do this after my first test but found a rather indifferent attitude from my "teacher." I think the guy was depressed for half the semester because he had no life in him, nor anyway to really help me connect to my math issues. He was more of a explainer than a teacher, if you get me.

 

[murfettie]

Well, I did do this after my first test but found a rather indifferent attitude from my "teacher." I think the guy was depressed for half the semester because he had no life in him, nor anyway to really help me connect to my math issues. He was more of a explainer than a teacher, if you get me.

maybe find the best person from your class to tutor you or the best person from one or two class ahead of you, because sometimes they are really good at figuring out where exactly are you sucking at because they probably might've stumbled there too just shortly ago.

 

[fizzgig]

1)don't freak out about not being able to hack it just yet, because slip ups happen. it can be a weak point and you can still pursue math based paths, definitely! math is not my strongest point - i'm naturally better at reading comp/science info/reasoning/systems than at pure math if that makes any sense (i need to apply it, basically.) ironically i'm in a graduate engineering program, so that tells you that biting it in a math class does not equal getting shot out of the saddle for good.

2)don't freak out that you're an idiot because if math isn't your thing having a bad/indifferent teacher or even just one who isn't on your wavelength can affect you, especially in a subject that you have trouble teaching yourself. i had one class i remember almost nothing from bc the teacher felt we should more teach a section to ourselves then bring him questions about it. i wasn't super at that method and got a little lost. the next class i took i went and asked the prof questions during office hours and he didn't just explain concepts, he'd make me do work on the board there that USED what he'd explained, which usually revealed i didn't truly get it. i left that class really getting the underlying theory, which was awesome! that guy probably thought i was a ***** but it really doesn't matter.

3)i agree with above people that doing problems is the best way to find out if you REALLY get the theory you've studied - i can read textbooks but that doesn't cut it for math - you gotta do problems. and when you miss them, go over them and make sure you get what went wrong. DO the post mortems on any exams or even homework, with a tutor/another student if need be, or your teacher if he's the only one who can. if he's disinterested, or thinks you're an idiot, keep asking til you get it. he can care or not or think whatever he wants - you just need to get the information from his brain.

i have no idea really what precal covers exactly, but i would imagine it is stuff that you would need to be fairly comfortable with at least on a basic level, so a refresher or auditing might be worth it, but if you can get after it on your own and can find people to ask questions, then that might be enough - the second time around the familiarity will be there at least.

 

[ShyRem]

As a math major, I've run into my share of students that say they were "just bad" at math. Most of the time it's just a simple fundamental way of thinking that needs tweaking in order for you to "get it."

Go to your math department and ask for a tutor. Some schools have a tutoring pool that is actually a work-study job.

Of course, some of my math major friends have been assigned students that were truly hopeless cases. If you don't know where to put -3 on a number line labeled -10, 0, 10 then your problem is a bit more than a simple tutor can handle.

 

[gman33]

If you've been away from math for a long time, maybe the course was a little too advanced for you. Math, chem, physics are all classes that test your problem solving ability. The best way to get better is to do a lot of problems. It may take a crazy amount of time, but do EVERY problem in your book and make sure you understand what is going on with each one. Get back tests if they are available.

Teachers can be hit or miss; especially with their ability and willingness to help outside of class. Get a tutor, get some friends in class, whatever.
Just find somebody you can go over problems with.

If there is a solutions manual for your math text, get that as well.
That always helped me to see things worked out.

Lastly, don't think you need to scrap everything because you "suck" at math. Past the premed stuff, you will need next to no math skills in medicine. At least none that I'm sure you don't already have.

I got off to a terrible start in my post-bacc and ended up transfering schools to someone that worked better for me.

I start my M3 year in 2 weeks, so initial problems can be overcome.

 

[Danlee07]

instead of really spending so much time with actual problems, I tend to just play with formulas for math based classes.

if it's just calc, I just visualized graphs first and messed with those. then, i messed with the formulas for each of the graphs. instead of having to keep plugging numbers into different situations, I just used to make the formulas in different arrangements, then i plugged them in somewhere else that made sense. each one kept building until i finally understood everything with the big picture...

for physics, i'm applying the same concept. much less work since i can apply them to everyday things. the study hacks link mentioned above is great and helped me restructure my study method.

 

[nontrdgsbuiucmd]

I worked in a quantitative field for years; did fine @ premed courses that involved math.

But these abilities have almost no applicability to med school success; at least for the first year, things are far more geared toward rote memorization and understanding biochemical pathways and the like. I know the genchem classes are required; suggestion is to just get through these as best you can.

the way that I succeeded in genchem was to do every problem from every chapter that we completed (I had an answer key that explained 1/2 of all end-of-chapter problems. So if 10 were assigned for a chapter, I'd do 20, or 40, or whatever number there were.

 

[ArkansasRanger]

I recently finished prerequsites for a formal post-bac program: precalculus and intro to gen chem. I got my butt kicked, more or less. After much effort and to my dismay, I ended up with a C in the math class and a B in chemistry.
I am specifically vexed about my mediocre math grade. I stayed up on my homework, class attendance, and studied for the tests (duh), but just couldn’t seem to perform well on the tests. My teacher was awful, but I don’t want to use that as an excuse. I got a pre-calc DVD supplement from mathtutors.com. It was great, but didn’t even cover half the material we reviewed in class.

Looking back, I’m not sure what I would have done differently. Perhaps shelving out money for a tutor would have worked.

In short, I tried really hard and did poorly. While this semester was humbling and sobering, my resolve to become a doctor is still there; but I need to know that I have what it takes to perform well in the quantitative sciences.

Questions: How did you guys succeed as math students? In preforming sub-par as I did, what does this reflect about my weaknesses as a student? Are there any resources out there that might further supplement a math courses? I’m scheduled to become EMT certified this summer, but may take a math refresher course instead. Thoughts?

As always, I am deeply appreciative for any responses.

Best wishes and enjoy the summer,
~Hume

Since I've known what an equation was I've had trouble setting them up.

It's ******ed I guess, and you can teach me. I know, for example, D = mass/volume when you're talking about density. However, if you said what is volume I couldn't tell if you if it's mass divided by density or mass times volume or any of the three.

 

[NTF]

OP, I think everyone's giving you some excellent advice, but given that you told us that you stayed current with the class and studied hard you really need to sit down with a professor or tutor and diagnose the problem. It sounds like your struggles aren't due to a lack of effort. Finding out why you are getting the answers incorrect is crucial because you could pour a lot of work into things that don't address your particular issue. It could be a minor comprehension error. It could be a faulty approach to test-taking. It could be something more fundamental.

And I wouldn't lose confidence. The kinds of "brains" you need to be a successful pre-med or medical student is in many ways cumulative not innate. The more you work at it the better you get at it. And many of us struggled in one or more (or in my case many) classes in our time. Trust me most med students SUCK at math. Keep chugging along, take your coursework seriously, and you'll do fine.

 

[Hume]

Guys,
I am overwhelmed by your words. Thank you so much for taking the time to write. I'm printing this out and stapling it to where I sleep.

I'll keep plugging away with math problems this summer and sit down with this great local tutor and try to diagnose my issue.

Thanks again everyone,
~Hume

 

[brdmadgrl82]

I feel your pain. I always disliked math...When I took Precalculus I got lucky with a good professor and I worked hard also. I did attend tutoring center ALOT, thats how I got my A. I think forming study groups or tutoring can be VERY helpful...and like someone suggested practice practice practice! I'm currently in a summer full year of gen chem for my post-bac and it is intense... good luck to you, at least you got through it!