UCLA vs Princeton for premed

[C@lidoc]

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Go to Princeton. In case he wants to do something other than medicine, princeton >>>>> UCLA. At my job we only hire HYSP grads for the most part. I'll be entering Med school this fall. Going to an elite undergrad opens so many doors. I would take the princeton acceptance and not look back.

 

[Still-Learning]

Really hard to turn down a full scholarship at UCLA. It sounds like it if he went to Princeton he would have to do work study to make it by, which would certainly cut into his time for studying, volunteering/interning, research, and having fun/relaxing. At UCLA, the main downside is that there aren't really pre-med advisors here to guide you through the process, but most determined med school applicants should be able to figure it on their own and seek their own mentors from upperclassmen and faculty. While I'm sure connections at Princeton are invaluable, I can assure you that opportunities are very abundant at UCLA. There are many, many experiences available that will shape your son's path to medical school and allow him to be a competitive applicant 3-4 years from now. Those who say it is difficult to get research are not pursuing the correct avenues.

In comparing the rigor of these schools... they're both difficult to get good grades at. At both schools you are studying alongside very smart and driven students, but if you put in enough work and stay determined, you'll manage. I would not let the difficulty of either school be the determining factor in this decision.

Also to reiterate what other's have said in this thread: please visit both schools and see which has a better environment that suits your son's interests. Being a pre-med should not be the only defining factor of one's college experience. Since he may even change his mind about medicine, it's important to choose a college based on overall fit and where he would be the most happy.

Thank you for your thoughts.
Yes, he will visit both school. In fact, Princeton emailed and offered to pay for travel expenses to visit for chance to attend classes and meet with professors and talk with fin aid, so much attentions to detail infos. Impressive. It say fin aid think he might need help with travel expenses. Ironic, fin aid thought so and charge that much more than UCLA.
We have low income and we have assets. But assets we cannot sell and not planning to in the near future. Based on income, Princeton is not affordable, that's another problem. Is Princeton expecting parents to take a loan? Also, I do not know if we are qualify with the income we have. I apologize if you think this should be on another thread.
Thanks again everyone here. You guys are amazing.

 

[youmed]

Alright, here is my input. I am a senior at UC Berkeley, set to graduate this May. Much of what I want to say have already been stated by other posters. Points that that I want to highlight about UCs are:

1) Difficult to get to know your professors, hence harder to attain experiences such as research position.
2) Pre-med counseling is almost non-existent.
3) Must really go out and search/look for experiences; the university will not guide you in any way.

Looking back, I wish I had gone to a private school even if it meant that I had to pay more money. Like others said, Princeton is once-in-a-lifetime opportunity for your son and he should definitely take it. I would highly advise your son to receive a private school education, even if it means having to pay more money.

Best,

 

[Still-Learning]

It makes things much easier when applying to UC medical schools in the future.

Thank you Barungling.
Are you saying going to UCLA makes things much easier when applying to UC medical schools in the future? And why?

 

[Still-Learning]

Alright, here is my input. I am a senior at UC Berkeley, set to graduate this May. Much of what I want to say have already been stated by other posters. Points that that I want to highlight about UCs are:

1) Difficult to get to know your professors, hence harder to attain experiences such as research position.
2) Pre-med counseling is almost non-existent.
3) Must really go out and search/look for experiences; the university will not guide you in any way.

Looking back, I wish I had gone to a private school even if it meant that I had to pay more money. Like others said, Princeton is once-in-a-lifetime opportunity for your son and he should definitely take it. I would highly advise your son to receive a private school education, even if it means having to pay more money.

Best,

Thank you for your input Youmed.

 

[Neutropix]

Cali resident here. In high school I was torn between Berkeley/UCLA or a few other top 20 private schools and after looking into the UC system it was clearly the worse option. I'd advise towards Princeton for the following reasons:

• The 4-year graduation rate is low at UCs compared to top private schools (4 year graduation rate for UCLA is ~70% while its ~90% for Princeton) because the system is so over-crowded it's hard to register for many required classes. It's a serious problem for premeds in the UCs to get the chem/bio/organic/physics classes they need as freshman and sophomores.
• UCLA largely lacks the small class experiences many people want from college - you have to go out of your way to get classes where students and the professor engage in discussion rather than the teacher standing up front lecturing at the massive class.
• The student-reported happiness is lower at UCs than top private schools - if you can, look at a Princeton Review 377 Best Colleges book which shows surveyed student happiness ratings. Note that there are a few exceptions (people at UChicago and especially Hopkins report low happiness) but I recall Princeton being one of the places with a near-perfect student happiness rating.
  
• SDN tends to be in denial about elite school reputation being worth a lot, but an AAMC survey of private medical schools found that "Selectivity of undergraduate institution" was of "highest importance" along with GPA and MCAT (see here page 7). Princeton is one of the very few schools that can be said to have a considerable reputation bump over UCLA so this should be a factor.
• Both schools are very grade deflating

This

 

[efle]

Wow my first time getting QFT'd

 

[DokterMom]

Princeton. If he decides to not go to medical school, he'll be able to start a career in whatever field he likes with Princeton on his resume. If he decides to put off medical school for a few years, he'll be able to get job with Princeton on his resume. His classmates at Princeton (and maybe at UCLA too) will be future Congressman, Supreme Court Justices, CEOS and CFOS, and maybe even future heads of state for countries around the world. In his time there, he will make priceless connections.

Princeton is a very rare opportunity. There is a risk he may regret throwing away that opportunity later in life, especially if he decides to not pursue med school.

-Given the great financial aid offer from Princeton, the money difference is really quite small
-Yes, he can keep CA residency for future med school applications. Simply have him keep using his CA address as his permanent address for any government forms and keep renewing his California Driver's license. So don't worry about that.

If I am assessing an applicant and see a degree from UCLA on his resume, I think "OK-good, next item." If I see a degree from Princeton, I know this applicant is a superstar. A Princeton grad will have been challenged to really think, competitively and collaboratively, with some of the finest minds in the world. Even average grades at Princeton mean quite a lot. And that Princeton name will stay with him throughout his entire life, whatever he does and wherever he goes, opening doors.

I'm not saying such intellectual development isn't possible at UCLA -- just that it isn't a given. IF your son is ambitious and aggressive about pursuing opportunities and standing out from the crowd. (Note that it's a really big crowd there...) Bottom line, if he's got the type of personality that will make him a "big fish" in any sized pond, then UCLA is a financially prudent move.

But if he's one to swim along with the other fish and just quietly do extremely well, then a smaller, more nurturing school might be much better for him, and he'd emerge from Princeton with a world-class education and a 'Wow!' credential.

 

[Still-Learning]

This

Thank you Cpt Ahab.

 

[Still-Learning]

If I am assessing an applicant and see a degree from UCLA on his resume, I think "OK-good, next item." If I see a degree from Princeton, I know this applicant is a superstar. A Princeton grad will have been challenged to really think, competitively and collaboratively, with some of the finest minds in the world. Even average grades at Princeton mean quite a lot. And that Princeton name will stay with him throughout his entire life, whatever he does and wherever he goes, opening doors.

I'm not saying such intellectual development isn't possible at UCLA -- just that it isn't a given. IF your son is ambitious and aggressive about pursuing opportunities and standing out from the crowd. (Note that it's a really big crowd there...) Bottom line, if he's got the type of personality that will make him a "big fish" in any sized pond, then UCLA is a financially prudent move.

But if he's one to swim along with the other fish and just quietly do extremely well, then a smaller, more nurturing school might be much better for him, and he'd emerge from Princeton with a world-class education and a 'Wow!' credential.

Thank you for your input DokterMom.

 

[Enginerd2016]

You guys act like working is a bad thing? If you have time management skills, working can be a huge plus. I worked 35+ hours a week to pay for school and I did just fine in engineering/pre-med if not better than 99% of my peers. I would choose Princeton. I have friends who went to both UCLA and Princeton and there is honestly no comparison. You're going to have to work hard wherever you go, but Princeton is known across the globe. Most HYP grads find it easier to matriculate anywhere else in the country (including HYP for grad school), the same cannot be said for most places. Unless your son has an issue with being so far from home, I would choose the school that would give him the best opportunity to succeed later in life.

Also, you cannot bank on being in the top 1.5% - 10% of students in college. High school is high school. I also came from a top high school in the nation and my peers who thrived in high school completely fell apart in college, academically and socially. It's a different experience. You aren't necessarily in a structured environment. You have to learn to live on your own for the most part. So, I would not bank on getting a 4.0 wherever you go, you have to earn it.

Congratulations for having succeeded in high school! You're super lucky to have to make this choice. Regardless of my input, you really can't go wrong with either option.

 

[Lucca]

He should visit both and see which he likes best. The big state school and small private school feel are very different. I think all else being equal people should go for the smallest class sizes at the most prestigious institution possible. I'm at a big state school but the classes where the size is closer to 20 than 100 are always better, more fun, more productive. However, it's all going to be up to his set of preferences. I strongly recommend against choosing a school based on an intended career path.



From an objective standpoint? Princeton > UCLA, very easy decision in my eyes. People who do not go to private schools or are not involved in some program that provides heavy institutional support for research, national competitions, career opportunities, etc. cannot really understand how valuable it is to have an institution willing to back you up in anything you do and it's much harder to do that at bigger state schools where students are largely left to their own devices.

The only reason I feel I made the better choice going to the school where I am versus other private schools (Not HYSPM though) is because I am in such a program with institutional support and smaller class sizes. Otherwise, I would have most likely regretted the state school choice.

 

[pbjbanana]

Go to Princeton. Also contact the financial aid office and let them know about your desire to attend but that money is a big concern and that UCLA offered a full ride. When I was applying for colleges, one of my schools (ivy league - for comparison's sake) sent me 3 financial packages over a span of 3 months with ~$10,000 total increase to try and convince me to go. This was after I let them know of a better offer to another school (with proof). The reason I mention this is that you mention that Princeton offered to fly your son out to visit. This is not a common occurrence and obviously they are very interested in your son attending their school. However, even if they don't match UCLA, I say take the acceptance and never look back.

 

[Enginerd2016]

Oh and I forgot to add: Most people don't look for jobs where you can study while working. I worked as a tutor for the College of Engineering at my school for 15 hours a week where I waited for people to come ask me questions. In reality, I was studying 12 of those and tutoring for 3. So wherever he goes, look for opportunities to maximize his time. Money + Studying > Money. Just food for thought.

 

[snowflakes]

Go to Princeton. Also contact the financial aid office and let them know about your desire to attend but that money is a big concern and that UCLA offered a full ride. When I was applying for colleges, one of my schools (ivy league - for comparison's sake) sent me 3 financial packages over a span of 3 months with ~$10,000 total increase to try and convince me to go. This was after I let them know of a better offer to another school (with proof). The reason I mention this is that you mention that Princeton offered to fly your son out to visit. This is not a common occurrence and obviously they are very interested in your son attending their school. However, even if they don't match UCLA, I say take the acceptance and never look back.

DO THIS!! Schools like Princeton are usually willing to consider upping your financial aid, especially if you have a better offer. Tell them how much he wants to go to Princeton, but money is really the only thing holding him back.

 

[snowflakes]

Oh and I forgot to add: Most people don't look for jobs where you can study while working. I worked as a tutor for the College of Engineering at my school for 15 hours a week where I waited for people to come ask me questions. In reality, I was studying 12 of those and tutoring for 3. So wherever he goes, look for opportunities to maximize his time. Money + Studying > Money. Just food for thought.

Yes, there's definitely jobs like this. Also, there's jobs like paid research lab positions that he will actually learn a lot from and will look good on his CV. Work-STUDY usually means there's a learning component to the work, so he should ultimately gain something from the job in addition to being paid for it.

 

[Doug Underhill]

Does UCLA give any preference/have any reserved slots for UCLA undergrads for med school admissions? Some elite programs do, especially Brown. Since Princeton doesn't have a medical school, they definitely do not.

 

[pbjbanana]

Does UCLA give any preference/have any reserved slots for UCLA undergrads for med school admissions?

I believe they have a preference for their own undergrads (not sure how large a preference) just like most other schools with undergrad and medical schools

ome elite programs do, especially Brown

Brown is actually the opposite case. Correct me if I'm wrong but I believe it is harder to get into Brown med as a Brown undergrad due to the PLME program. Also, not sure if Brown is really considered elite.

Since Princeton doesn't have a medical school, they definitely do not.

See USNWR top 10

 

[Enginerd2016]

Whoa whoa whoa. Brown isn't considered elite? That's debatable. Ivy league connections, even to other schools are worth quite a bit in my opinion. From my experience in the work force/grad school, it's 80 percent about who you know that can open doors and 20% performance (mostly because you have to get in the door to show off your performance). My $0.02.

 

[pbjbanana]

Whoa whoa whoa. Brown isn't considered elite? That's debatable. Ivy league connections, even to other schools are worth quite a bit in my opinion. From my experience in the work force/grad school, it's 80 percent about who you know that can open doors and 20% performance (mostly because you have to get in the door to show off your performance). My $0.02.

As an institution yes - in terms of connections, prestige, undergrad program, professors, etc etc. I was more referring to the medical school itself as if it were a stand-alone program compared to the likes of Harvard, Hopkins, Columbia, Penn, Stanford, etc.

 

[lifetothefullest]

But some of the people in this thread that keep harping about vague notions like "connections" at Princeton don't seem to have any real world experience. He isn't going to go to Princeton and automatically be part of some special "in crowd" and be set for life- so don't expect that either.

I do have real, firsthand world experience. Connections aren't about making friends, etc. It's about getting somewhere in the real world. Princeton is a top recruiting target for top firms in fields from finance to Wall Street. Alumni networking events can give you experience in any field you desire.

 

[Enginerd2016]

As an institution yes - in terms of connections, prestige, undergrad program, professors, etc etc. I was more referring to the medical school itself as if it were a stand-alone program compared to the likes of Harvard, Hopkins, Columbia, Penn, Stanford, etc.

Oh, gotcha. I was talking about Brown undergrad. My mistake!

 

[gettheleadout]

If I am assessing an applicant and see a degree from UCLA on his resume, I think "OK-good, next item." If I see a degree from Princeton, I know this applicant is a superstar. A Princeton grad will have been challenged to really think, competitively and collaboratively, with some of the finest minds in the world. Even average grades at Princeton mean quite a lot. And that Princeton name will stay with him throughout his entire life, whatever he does and wherever he goes, opening doors.

I'm not saying such intellectual development isn't possible at UCLA -- just that it isn't a given. IF your son is ambitious and aggressive about pursuing opportunities and standing out from the crowd. (Note that it's a really big crowd there...) Bottom line, if he's got the type of personality that will make him a "big fish" in any sized pond, then UCLA is a financially prudent move.

But if he's one to swim along with the other fish and just quietly do extremely well, then a smaller, more nurturing school might be much better for him, and he'd emerge from Princeton with a world-class education and a 'Wow!' credential.

Quite a sobering reminder of the pathetic experience I had at my state school (and how its perceived)...

 

[doggieblaze]

I didn't see anyone else mention that it's really great to experience life in the east coast. I grew up in California and went to school in Philly. It was incredibly life-changing to see a different perspective of America and gave me a more nuanced understanding of cultural differences. Even though the transition was really tough, it definitely challenged me in a good way. In terms of choosing between Princeton and UCLA for applying to medical school, the pros and cons balance each other out for the most part, but nothing can beat the personal challenge of exploring something completely different.

 

[efle]

@DokterMom out of curiosity how far does this wow factor extend? HYPSM? All the ivies? In another thread a few people were arguing that UNC carries an ivy-caliber reputation among adcoms but if UCLA gets a "meh" I somehow doubt that's true.

@gettheleadout are you being sarcastic or did you actually feel your college experience was that bad??

 

[efle]

I'd also like to second whoever suggested showing Princeton your full ride offer, I got my first choice school to come up ~10k/year in aid by showing them I had a much more generous offer at another top 20

 

[Eppur Si Muove]

I think Princeton is a no-brainer. It will cost you more but you can't put a price on the experience or the connections you will make there. He will be fine wherever he goes.

 

[gettheleadout]

@DokterMom out of curiosity how far does this wow factor extend? HYPSM? All the ivies? In another thread a few people were arguing that UNC carries an ivy-caliber reputation among adcoms but if UCLA gets a "meh" I somehow doubt that's true.

@gettheleadout are you being sarcastic or did you actually feel your college experience was that bad??

I'm serious. My college experience was nothing like what I would expect at a top school, and I'm also sure my undergrad and application experiences would have been quite different (better) had I attended one.

 

[lifetothefullest]

I didn't see anyone else mention that it's really great to experience life in the east coast. I grew up in California and went to school in Philly. It was incredibly life-changing to see a different perspective of America and gave me a more nuanced understanding of cultural differences. Even though the transition was really tough, it definitely challenged me in a good way. In terms of choosing between Princeton and UCLA for applying to medical school, the pros and cons balance each other out for the most part, but nothing can beat the personal challenge of exploring something completely different.

Life is really a lot quicker out here in the East and it's really a great intra-cultural experience. Not only that, but Princeton is also a very small town but very well connected. So while you might like the quiet at night, you can hop on a train and be in NYC in 45 minutes. So it's really a hybrid between town and city and I know many people who turned down Harvard to come here because of the atmosphere, not to mention the attention on undergrads.

I'm serious. My college experience was nothing like what I would expect at a top school, and I'm also sure my undergrad and application experiences would have been quite different (better) had I attended one.

It is what you make of it and you'll never know unless you can live parallel lives but it sounds like you've made the best out of your experience and kudos to ya!

 

[neekzg]

Thank you for your thoughts.
Yes, he will visit both school. In fact, Princeton emailed and offered to pay for travel expenses to visit for chance to attend classes and meet with professors and talk with fin aid, so much attentions to detail infos. Impressive. It say fin aid think he might need help with travel expenses. Ironic, fin aid thought so and charge that much more than UCLA.
We have low income and we have assets. But assets we cannot sell and not planning to in the near future. Based on income, Princeton is not affordable, that's another problem. Is Princeton expecting parents to take a loan? Also, I do not know if we are qualify with the income we have. I apologize if you think this should be on another thread.
Thanks again everyone here. You guys are amazing.

You guys should check out Princeton and see if they'll match UCLA's offer. Many parents and students do end up taking out loans to fund a college education, but that's not something we can tell you is right or wrong based on your personal circumstances.

I am biased towards UCLA but I have to agree that Princeton will open many doors and provide a lot of great guidance that a large, public university like UCLA cannot. Assuming your son is aiming to come back to California for medical school and residency, it would be nice to experience living on the opposite coast for 4 years.

To answer a question earlier in this thread: UCLA's medical school is filled with probably 20-30% UCLA undergrad graduates. Seeing that up to 1/3 of the class is from the undergraduate might seem like a bias, but I would not bank on going to UCLA for undergrad to have improved chances at the medical school.

 

[medguy24]

To sum this up:

If your 1000000% sure on pre-med and there's no chance he'll change his mind-go to the California school with the full ride
However if there's a doubt in your mind- even if it's extremely small- go to Princeton as they'll be more opportunities down the wrong!
Good luck!

 

[GreatAdviceForPass]

I know many that went to both schools. I would personally pick Princeton - if he is going for a BS in STEM, but it all depends on what he wants to study.
I personally know a Harvard grad with a BA in English that went to Masters at UCB and is now teaching at a local high school. He should have saved money and not gone to Harvard. Besides wow factor with some parents, he got nothing else to show for it.
I also know many Chicago, Cornell and UPenn grads who are unemployed at this moment; they majored in Sociology or International studies. I also know many unemployed UCLA, Berkeley and USC grads around here.
Also, just because a student excelled in hs doesn't guarantee he will in university. I personally know perfect 1600 kids that couldn't hack premed courses at Berkeley and UCLA and dropped out. Consider all possibilities including the financial aspect and go from there.

In short, school reputation will only save a student if he does well - or be a son of someone famous like W Bush or Obama. And please don't choose a wrong major like English or Sociology, which has a low job prospect

 

[efle]

I'm serious. My college experience was nothing like what I would expect at a top school, and I'm also sure my undergrad and application experiences would have been quite different (better) had I attended one.

This may be a grass is always greener type of thing, no? Maybe a prestige bump would be countered by a lower GPA or something, and iirc you scored like 99.9th percentile mcat which should've dispelled any adcom doubts about being from a less known school

What were your big complaints/what would you expect to be better elsewhere? Research, class availability, advising, prof accessibility? Always good to air honest opinions about different types of schools, hearing this stuff saved me from the UC premed nightmare some of my high school buddies have been dealing with

 

[pbjbanana]

If your 1000000% sure on pre-med and there's no chance he'll change his mind-go to the California school with the full ride

I just want to point out that it's impossible to know at this point. College is a time when people mature and change and find themselves. I feel like some people forget that college is not just 4 transitional years that acts as a stepping stone for future post graduate prospects. When you surround yourself with like-minded, high-achieving, and ambitious peers, everything from your clothing preference to your entire world view may change. From my experience, I believe going to a top school gave me (as cliche as it sounds) invaluable experiences learning in the classroom from world-class professors. It also broadened my understanding of other's views that I would not have been exposed to if I went to my state school. In the end, I decided to pursue medicine but I had the resources around me to explore and succeed in whatever interested me.

I didn't see anyone else mention that it's really great to experience life in the east coast. I grew up in California and went to school in Philly. It was incredibly life-changing to see a different perspective of America and gave me a more nuanced understanding of cultural differences. Even though the transition was really tough, it definitely challenged me in a good way. In terms of choosing between Princeton and UCLA for applying to medical school, the pros and cons balance each other out for the most part, but nothing can beat the personal challenge of exploring something completely different.

To add onto this: I know the OP mentioned that she is a very caring mother but I feel that it also may be good for him to leave the nest and be on his own for a few years. Of course, I do not know what the family dynamics are and in the end it is up to the discretion of the student and parents. I just wanted to mention my own opinion on the matter.

Full disclosure: I turned down a full-ride at my large state school to attend a top school and it ended up costing ~80-100k. I have no regrets and would do it again in a heartbeat.

 

[Doug Underhill]

Anyone who said UNC carries an Ivy-caliber reputation amongst adcoms is probably a UNC alum or employee. I go to one of the USNWR Top 20 elite private schools and I know we don't have an Ivy-caliber reputation. Well, our reputation may be comparable to the so-called "dumpster" Ivies- Brown and Dartmouth, perhaps. It's not the same as HYPS. You will have fewer opportunities in life than if you went to those schools.

Anyway, the UC system does have some advantages in the field of research. For example, Princeton's neuroscience department just got started.

 

[efle]

I turned down a full-ride at my large state school to attend a top school and it ended up costing ~80-100k. I have no regrets and would do it again in a heartbeat.

And how much of that was absorbed by your parents? Are you yourself now responsible for 100k of undergrad debt with no doubts at all about it?

 

[efle]

I go to one of the USNWR Top 20 elite private schools and I know we don't have an Ivy-caliber reputation. Well, our reputation may be comparable to the so-called "dumpster" Ivies- Brown and Dartmouth, perhaps. It's not the same as HYPS. You will have fewer opportunities in life than if you went to those schools.

Anyway, the UC system does have some advantages in the field of research. For example, Princeton's neuroscience department just got started.

No no no no no no no. Go back under your bridge you trolly troll you

 

[GreatAdviceForPass]

yeah 80k to 100K debt is too much. If you take out another 300K for med school ... Yikes.. your interest compounds the day you start med school. It is like 5 to 7%?
Just don't do primary care in the future, since it will take a long long time to pay that back...

 

[pbjbanana]

And how much of that was absorbed by your parents? Are you yourself now responsible for 100k of undergrad debt with no doubts at all about it?

Crucial detail I left out: my parents absorbed all of the tuition costs, apart from some tiny work-study earnings. My last sentence should be rephrased to "my parents have no regrets," although that in its literal sense is impossible unless I am a mind-reader. However, my parents encouraged me to go to the school and were more than happy to pay the tuition. They would have actually been disappointed if I went the state school route.

 

[pbjbanana]

yeah 80k to 100K debt is too much. If you take out another 300K for med school ... Yikes.. your interest compounds the day you start med school. It is like 5 to 7%?
Just don't do primary care in the future, since it will take a long long time to pay that back...

The financial aid calculations ended up working well for me and most of the classmates I talked to. There were no loans in the financial aid package and my parents graduated me "debt-free" (no interested to be paid upon the tuition). The cost in itself (~80-100k) was quite substantial and I am very thankful for my parents' support in that regard. I come from a middle-class background.

 

[efle]

Crucial detail I left out: my parents absorbed all of the tuition costs, apart from some tiny work-study earnings. My last sentence should be rephrased to "my parents have no regrets," although that in its literal sense is impossible unless I am a mind-reader. However, my parents encouraged me to go to the school and were more than happy to pay the tuition. They would have actually been disappointed if I went the state school route.

Ok so to clarify, your elitist parents are happy to foot a $100,000 bill so they can say their kid went to a top university, and you personally have no financial consequence and your experience is moot for OP

Christ, this reminds me of when Ace Khalifa said he was paying for Wustl and really he meant he had gotten "an interest free loan" from his physician parents

 

[efle]

The financial aid calculations ended up working well for me and most of the classmates I talked to. There were no loans in the financial aid package and my parents graduated me "debt-free" (no interested to be paid upon the tuition). The cost in itself (~80-100k) was quite substantial and I am very thankful for my parents' support in that regard. I come from a middle-class background.

If your parents can send their kid to a top school for 100k instead of state for free they probably aren't middle class

 

[Skittsie13]

DO THIS!! Schools like Princeton are usually willing to consider upping your financial aid, especially if you have a better offer. Tell them how much he wants to go to Princeton, but money is really the only thing holding him back.

If he had a full-ride from a school that competes with Princeton for admission, this might work. I tried this with the top 20 school I got into, compared to the top ~30 LAC where I received a full-tuition scholarship, and was completely brushed off. It's worth a shot but I definitely wouldn't bank on it.

 

[pbjbanana]

If your parents can send their kid to a top school for 100k instead of state for free they probably aren't middle class

Well if it helps.. I come from an immigrant family and from probably since I was in middle school, my parents saved for my college education. They came here for me to have the best opportunity I could. Our family of 4 earned $30,000 until I was in 5th grade. Then we earned collectively $60,000 until high school and then $80,000 until I graduated. I'm sorry that you see my parents as "elitist" but I guess our family's values are just different. If those numbers are not middle class then I am sorry that I offended you. I just assumed in order to be considered upper class, combined parental income should exceed $100,000.

 

[22031 Alum]

There's no way to know at this time if your son will actually end up in medicine. But I can say that if he does, he should take the full ride to undergrad and run with it. I went to undergrad for free, and having that much less debt to think about when looking at med schools was great.

Now that I'm out in academic medicine, my "clout" in any prestige comparisons (which happen, it's the nature of the field) comes from my top-ranked residency. Followed by my top-ranked med school. Undergrad barely registers.

 

[efle]

If he had a full-ride from a school that competes with Princeton for admission, this might work. I tried this with the top 20 school I got into, compared to the top ~30 LAC where I received a full-tuition scholarship, and was completely brushed off. It's worth a shot but I definitely wouldn't bank on it.

They may not match the full ride but rather compromise by a slightly lowered expected family contribution. Can't hurt to try, and can help a ton if it works out in their favor.

 

[justadream]

If your parents can send their kid to a top school for 100k instead of state for free they probably aren't middle class

For a family with a single child making like 130k, it would cost around paying 20-25k per year to go to most of the top schools.

Now, I don't know whether you consider 130k middle class though.

 

[Doug Underhill]

No no no no no no no. Go back under your bridge you trolly troll you

Why did you bold the part about research? UCLA gets more research dollars than Princeton, and has more labs as a result, and more labs means more chances for an undergrad to get on an exciting project and a paper. Do you have statistics suggesting that Princeton pre-meds get better research experience than UCLA pre-meds?

 

[efle]

Well if it helps.. I come from an immigrant family and from probably since I was in middle school, my parents saved for my college education. They came here for me to have the best opportunity I could. Our family of 4 earned $30,000 until I was in 5th grade. Then we earned collectively $60,000 until high school and then $80,000 until I graduated. I'm sorry that you see my parents as "elitist" but I guess our family's values are just different. If those numbers are not middle class then I am sorry that I offended you. I just assumed in order to be considered upper class, combined parental income should exceed $100,000.

I'm quite skeptical that any Top 20 gave your family of 4 with those income levels an expected family contribution of $25k/yr. Valuing college prestige more than a hundred thousand dollars, especially when 100k is years and years worth of savings, makes them pretty elitist, yes.

I'm not offended, just don't want OP seeing things like "my education cost 100 grand and I don't regret it" when that's so misleading.

 

[efle]

For a family with a single child making like 130k, it would cost around paying 20-25k per year to go to most of the top schools.

Now, I don't know whether you consider 130k middle class though.

A family of 3 pulling 130k is way way above the middle last time I checked

Why did you bold the part about research? UCLA gets more research dollars than Princeton, and has more labs as a result, and more labs means more chances for an undergrad to get on an exciting project and a paper. Do you have statistics suggesting that Princeton pre-meds get better research experience than UCLA pre-meds?

It's undergrad access to the research/research availability per capita I was disagreeing about, not the fact that the far far larger university produces more research. Do you have statistics that UC premeds have the same access to high quality PI mentorship in the first years of school as top private schools?