Ugh, how bad is this?

[axm028400]

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Had to miss a day from a sub-I to stay home with my kiddo who's sick. How big of a deal is this? I'm not missing any more, but should I still ask for a rec. letter (I'd like to match here potentially). The specialty is not a hard core and the rotation has been really relaxed so far, and my attending is very chilled out, but I still feel bad and am wondering how big of a deal this is? TIA

 

[J1515]

Hopefully you called the hospital, contacted your attending/resident, and maybe your school early this morning or as soon as you knew you were going to miss the day and informed them apologetically.

 

[daveyjwin]

If you let them know that you were going to be missing i.e. called in sick, and weren't just a no show, I don't think it'd be a big deal. Everyone has problems sometimes that require missing work, I think most people are understanding of this.

 

[MilkmanAl]

Yeah, I just skipped work today for virtually no reason at all...When I was an intern I never even noticed if the students even showed up.

Somehow, I don't think that'd fly here in the states. Just a guess.

 

[ShyRem]

We had a student not show up. Believe me, EVERYONE noticed. EVERYONE. And it was my housemate. They were all asking me where they were. The head of med ed paged me to ask where my housemate was. Turns out he just "didn't feel like going in." He got the privilege of doing extra rotations and got assigned the absolute worst patients ever.

 

[Rendar5]

Yeah, I just skipped work today for virtually no reason at all (my coordinator is out of town so nobody is going to catch me). The people that do know I was going to just.. not show up don't even care (However I'm no longer working in a hospital environment where people actually keep an eye on who didn't show up).

If a department can't forgive you to skip work 1 day to tend to a sick child and give you problems for it, imagine doing a 4 year residency there as a parent!!! Avoid malignant no child friendly programs if you're a parent.

When I was an intern I never even noticed if the students even showed up. I didn't even learn the names of most of them because they rotated for so few hours. Attendings I know in my experience unless they are working closely to a very small team of students for several weeks probably wouldn't even notice if someone is a no show.

Vasca, an MS4 student doing a subi in the US is completely responsible for her patients and takes care of all of their medical needs. Essentially the exact same thing as a first year resident on the floors and typically work 80hrs-wk. To take a day off is exactly like a resident taking a day off. Meaning if it's a bad place to do residency, you'll get a hard time. And if it's not a bad place to do residency, then a simple call to the chief resident very early in the morning will allow another intern or resident to take care of her patients for the day.

I suspect this is different from what it is typical of a Mexican med school student since this is a differently structured curriculum? Not saying it's worse or better, I'm saying that perhaps what you perceive to be her responsibilities is actually quite different from reality.

 

[SoCuteMD]

.

 

[MJB]

When I was an intern I never even noticed if the students even showed up. I didn't even learn the names of most of them because they rotated for so few hours. Attendings I know in my experience unless they are working closely to a very small team of students for several weeks probably wouldn't even notice if someone is a no show.

The "beauty" of 3rd/4th year.


Incidentally, things like this is why I hope my wife won't need to work during residency. I don't want to have to make a choice between my sick kid and my job.

 

[nascardoc]

The "beauty" of 3rd/4th year.


Incidentally, things like this is why I hope my wife won't need to work during residency. I don't want to have to make a choice between my sick kid and my job.

Amen brother!

 

[smq123]

The "beauty" of 3rd/4th year.

What were those rotations in MS3 and MS4 where you didn't have to show up because no one noticed? 😕 If I wasn't there everyday and pre-rounding on my patients, I would have been in so much deep **it, I can't even start to describe it....

It must be different in Mexico, where "interns" still haven't graduated from med school yet, and the MS3s and MS4s are basically just shadowing.

 

[ShyRem]

I agree, smq. However, I have been on away rotations where 3rd and 4th year students go back to their dorms and nap at 10am because they were partying too hard the night before, where some of the med students smell like booze and no one says anything, and pages are ignored by students. I was quite shocked, but apparently there are places this is common.

So much more the pity for them - they learned nothing. I choose to believe this will bite them in the derriere when they hit residency.

 

[cartoondoc]

I think someone else hit the nail on the head when they said that if you can't miss one day to tend to a sick child, then you really don't want to match there anyway.

I got very sick a couple of times during residency (thanks, daycare) and had to miss a day or two cuz you just can't see patients while actively vomiting. Whenever possible, I would offer to cover for the person who covered for me. THIS IS ALWAYS A GOOD IDEA. You missed a day for a valid reason, and everyone will love you if you offer to make it up.

 

[smq123]

I agree, smq. However, I have been on away rotations where 3rd and 4th year students go back to their dorms and nap at 10am because they were partying too hard the night before, where some of the med students smell like booze and no one says anything, and pages are ignored by students. I was quite shocked, but apparently there are places this is common.

So much more the pity for them - they learned nothing. I choose to believe this will bite them in the derriere when they hit residency.

I totally agree - I feel like the transition to internship was easier because I had a more stringent MS3 and MS4.

It might bite them in the derriere even BEFORE they hit residency. The MS4 sub-I who looks disapprovingly at you when you show up to rounds smelling heavily like booze may be the intern sitting on the committee with the program director when they make up their rank list for the following year. And trust me, they WILL remember you as "that MS3" who couldn't stay sober long enough to show up to rounds in a decent state. I saw something like this happen this year as we made up our rank list, so it's not all that unlikely a scenario.

 

[MJB]

My comment was speaking more to the fact that as medical students, you have absolutely no role. That's the "beauty" of the clinical years...you're expected to show up and play doctor, and some people act like it's vital that you're there doing their busy work for them. Personally, I could have done without "rounding" all day on some rotations, to say the least.

Sure, people notice if you don't show (and I'm not one of those that no-shows...I'm an adult), but the fact remains that you're meaningless as a 3rd year student, so it doesn't matter if you're there or not. Kind of like med students taking a bunch of call....WHY? They can't do ANYTHING productive. I've been around when people have no-showed, and the only reason I didn't like it is because I was the one getting asked where they were....Personally...I don't care, they are supposedly grown ups...and you have a phone, Mr. Attending....call them.


As for the OP needing to "get it and their childare plans together"...I'd say they have...I'd rather have a person with their priorities straight as a doctor than some idiot that thinks missing a day of a job (for which the OP is not getting paid, by the way) to take care of a child is some sort of sin.

I truly hope that post was sarcasm.



It's amazing to me that in this field, a big part of being an "all star" involves just showing up every day (or accounting for your absence), doing what you're asked to do, and not being a complete clown. That totally amuses me.



After speaking to some attendings at a local teaching institution, it's truly amazing to me that this is apparently a problem with residents as well...showing up hungover, not showing, etc... WHAT THE HELL?


All I'm saying is, I'd rather the OP take the time to care for what's truly important than spend time worrying about some mundane 4th year rotation.

Residency is a different matter...you have a defined role, you are being paid, and are responsible for getting your job done. Period. And, you're actually doing something you hopefully enjoy and have an interest in. That still doesn't mean that life doesn't happen and you cannot/should not ever miss a day of work. Just my opinion.

 

[ShyRem]

I think there are definitely some places where being a student doesn't matter as much as other places. If you're 4th or 5th back in the OR begging for the opportunity to touch a retractor, your presence or lack thereof for a day is not a big deal.

However, while on my third year rotations, all the residents had exams on a couple days of the year (spread out). I happened to be on medicine service on one of those days - and it was me and a covering attending who was new to the service that day. I had prepared the day before, seen every patient on the service, and showed up early (very) that day to at least go over labs, get sign-out, etc., and could speak somewhat intelligently about all patients on the service, not just the ones assigned to me. I stayed late that day to make sure all the tasks and orders we put in got done, and signed out to the evening resident.

My presence that day was definitely not in the "who cares if they show up" category, and the attending commented on it several times. The beauty of 3rd/4th year: the ability to shine if given the opportunity.

I also agree that sick kids are different and it is exceedingly difficult to get child care for sick children unless you have grandma in town who can come over. Daycare centers don't want your sick kids.

 

[MJB]

My presence that day was definitely not in the "who cares if they show up" category, and the attending commented on it several times. The beauty of 3rd/4th year: the ability to shine if given the opportunity.

This is what I'm hoping more of my 4th year rotations are like...needless to say, I didn't have much of that 3rd year. Too much shadowing and wondering "what the hell am I doing here, and WHY am I paying 30K in tuition for this?"

I did learn a lot this year, however...I've read a ton.

 

[smq123]

This is what I'm hoping more of my 4th year rotations are like...needless to say, I didn't have much of that 3rd year. Too much shadowing and wondering "what the hell am I doing here, and WHY am I paying 30K in tuition for this?"

I did learn a lot this year, however...I've read a ton.

🙁 That is definitely a shame. I had very little shadowing, and quite a bit of responsibility. In retrospect, that was a good thing.

I also agree that sick kids are different and it is exceedingly difficult to get child care for sick children unless you have grandma in town who can come over. Daycare centers don't want your sick kids.

One of my fellow residents and I joked that someday, when we're crotchety and tired and jaded (but, probably, not quite old enough to retire), we're going to get together with some equally jaded pediatricians and pediatric nurses and open an Urgent Care Daycare Center. It'd be like a daycare center for mildly sick kids - the sniffler, the cougher, the occasional wheezer, the viral URI-er. We'd probably have to send a few parents to the ED, and set strict guidelines about who was too sick to accept, but can you imagine how popular that would be with med students and residents?

<sigh> Well, I guess we can dream.

 

[MJB]

Having a defined role would be wonderful. At least then it wouldn't feel like a total waste of time.

 

[bigDinLV]

Get your s--- and your childcare plans in order. Seriously.

Well genius, sometimes child care won't take sick kids. Then what, leave the kid alone so you can appear like you have your "s---" together?

I'd actually give the poster props for being a good parent and recognizing what is important in life. God forbid they put their child before one day of med student rotations. Douche bag!