UK Squatter Schools

[Waiting4Ganong]

General Medical Council Statement

Medical schools in the UK or a British Overseas Territory whose students receive degrees from a university based outside the British mainland.

These medical schools award degrees from an overseas University where some or all of the teaching takes place in the UK or a British Overseas Territory. Their parent universities are NOT subject to any quality assurance arrangements by the QAA nor are the medical schools subject to any quality assurance arrangements by the GMC. In addition, students are not necessarily entitled to apply to the student loans company for government funding towards the cost of their tuition fees.

A degree from one of these institutions does not give any automatic entitlement to registration with the GMC; graduates will additionally be required, amongst other things, to provide the GMC with additional objective evidence of their capability for practice, most commonly by passing the PLAB test, in order to gain registration.

Whilst these arrangements are legal under UK law, in the absence of UK based quality assurance cover, the GMC advises potential applicants to assure themselves about the following issues before making any financial commitments:

• Is the school financially stable and will it exist for the duration of my studies?

There have been instances of schools failing in recent years.

• Am I sure that I will be awarded a degree from an institution that is listed in the World Health Organisation's (WHO) Directory of Medical Schools?

Some schools have long standing relationships with WHO listed Universities. Others appear to change allegiances regularly.

• Are graduates allowed to practise medicine in the country where the degree is awarded?

This may give some indication as to whether local quality assurance arrangements are operating and the outcomes of any such arrangements.

• What are the views of the existing students studying at the medical school?

There are various web discussion forums available where students have posted their views and comments about medical schools which may provide an indication as to whether they are satisfied with their choice of school.

The institutions operating in this category are listed below. Please note that this list only contains institutions we have been made aware of and so may not be exhaustive. The GMC reserves the right to alter its view of these institutions at any time in the future.

If you wish to check the status of any school not listed here please contact [email protected]

Institution & Location
Degree awarding institution and their status with the WHO and GMC*

(* Correct as at 3 November 2005)

European College of Medicine, London
We are currently investigating the European College of Medicine's previously listed affiliations to universities in Russia. Until our investigations are complete we have suspended our acceptance of medical degrees awarded by this institution and/or any of it's affiliations. Please contact us for advice if you are currently studying or applying to study at this institution.

Please note that GMC does not accept degrees awarded by the College's previous affiliation with the St Luke's School of Medicine in Liberia. The WHO has also confirmed that this school will be removed from their listing.

Grace University School of Medicine, London
This institution was previously affiliated to Grace University School of Medicine in Belize and the College of Medicine and Health Sciences in Saint Lucia. It is awaiting accreditation from a new host country. We currently do not accept degrees awarded by this institution as it is unclear who is awarding them.

London College of Medicine, London

London School of Medicine, London

London Medical School, London
The parent institution appears to have changed its name several times. It was previously affiliated to the International University of Health Sciences in St. Kitts and Nevis. We are currently investigating this institution's affiliation to the College of Medicine and Health Sciences in St Lucia. Please contact us for advice if you are currently studying or applying to study at this institution.

School of Health and Neural Sciences, Nottingham
We are currently investigating this institution's affiliation to the College of Medicine and Health Sciences in St Lucia. Please contact us for advice if you are currently studying or applying to study at this institution.

Medical College London, Montserrat
This institution currently awards degrees from the University of Science, Arts and Technology, Montserrat, British West Indies which is not WHO listed. We do not accept its degrees for the purpose of registration.

American International School of Medicine, UK satellite campus
We are currently investigating this institution's affiliation to the American International School of Medicine in Guyana. Please contact us for advice if you are currently studying or applying to study at this institution.

St. Christopher's College of Medicine, Luton
We are currently investigating this institution's affiliation to the St Christopher ‘s College of Medicine in Senegal. Until our investigations are complete we have suspended our acceptance of medical degrees awarded by this institution and/or any of it's affiliations. Please contact us for advice if you are currently studying or applying to study at this institution.


Kigezi International School of Medicine, Cambridge
We are currently investigating this institution's affiliation to the Kigezi International School of Medicine in Uganda. We believe that this school is no longer functioning due to financial difficulties but have no confirmation of this. Please contact us for advice if you are currently studying or applying to study at this institution.

Breyer State University, Alabama, USA
This institution currently awards degrees from the University of Science, Arts and Technology, Montserrat, British West Indies which is not WHO listed. We do not accept its degrees for the purpose of registration.

Lady Memorial Medical College, Florida, USA
This institution currently awards degrees from the University of Science, Arts and Technology, Montserrat, British West Indies which is not WHO listed. We do not accept its degrees for the purpose of registration.


UK and overseas universities awarding medical degrees on the basis of prior experience
There are no circumstances under which these degrees will be accepted for the purposes of registration with the GMC. We are currently aware of certificates from five institutions but this list may not be exhaustive. The institutions falling into this category are:

The National Ecclesiastical University

University of Belford

University of Shepperton

University of Ravenhurst

Rochville University online medical degrees

What if the UK university I'm interested in is not mentioned here?
Please email [email protected]

from: http://www.gmc-uk.org/education/undergraduate/studying_medicine_at_undergraduate_level.asp accessed 3rd Dec 2005

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[Amit1]

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/4410020.stm

Schools like this are a disgrace to mankind. In an effort to probe how corrupt these schools are, I called them as a prospective student. They assured me if I was a graduate from any US high school with a SAT above 1000 or ACT over 21 they could "guarantee me a spot in their medical school, provided I could pay the fees". In addition they asked if I knew anybody else who would like a degree - ANY degree "provided they could pay the fees".

They are sullying the reputation of the entire medical community and need to be dissolved as soon as possible.

 

[Doc-Hollywood]

each and every one of these schools should be closed down.

What kind of fool would take the risk to attend a squatter school when there are so many other options?

 

[bts4202]

each and every one of these schools should be closed down.

What kind of fool would take the risk to attend a squatter school when there are so many other options?

wow, thats what the US grads said when the carrib schools opened.

 

[Doc-Hollywood]

What kind of fool would take the risk to attend a squatter school when there are so many other options?

wow, thats what the US grads said when the carrib schools opened.

Thanks for answering my question

Good luck with the GMC FRAUD unit

Time to start memorizing this phrase " Would you like fries with that"?

 

[Waiting4Ganong]

'School of Health and Neural Sciences' (SOHANS)

an affiliate and satellite campus of
the College of Medicine and Health Sciences, St Lucia

http://www.journals.graph.org.uk/med.html


Maybe this is to cater who those who become school-less when St Chris closes down (Like St Chris catered to when Kigezi/Cambridge closed down...)

 

[Doc-Hollywood]

'School of Health and Neural Sciences' (SOHANS)

an affiliate and satellite campus of
the College of Medicine and Health Sciences, St Lucia

http://www.journals.graph.org.uk/med.html


Maybe this is to cater who those who become school-less when St Chris closes down (Like St Chris catered to when Kigezi/Cambridge closed down...)

"Fool me once shame on you, fool me twice shame on me"

I can't believe there are people dumb enough to bounce from Kigezi to St Chris. I can see making one blunder, but to repeat it.............

well let's just say these are not the types of numbskulls you want to refer your patients to, assuming any of them actually find the way into the medical profession and somehow slip under the radar and get a license

 

[bts4202]

St. Chris has fully licensed grads in Ohio, Oklahoma, and Louisiana currently and residents in 28 US states.

 

[azskeptic]

St. Chris has fully licensed grads in Ohio, Oklahoma, and Louisiana currently and residents in 28 US states.

http://www.gmc-uk.org/doctors/how_t.../acceptable_primary_medical_qualification.asp

 

[bts4202]

http://www.gmc-uk.org/doctors/how_t.../acceptable_primary_medical_qualification.asp

stop playing dumb and claiming "latest news". You posted that same link on valuemd on the day the GMC first started the investigation a month or so ago. Pretty slimy tactic.

 

[azskeptic]

stop playing dumb and claiming "latest news". You posted that same link on valuemd on the day the GMC first started the investigation a month or so ago. Pretty slimy tactic.

Well, we didn't get it on this forum so updated it here also.

 

[bts4202]

Well, we didn't get it on this forum so updated it here also.

OMG, you are still hawking these forums at 11 at night so closely that you can reply to my random reply within 3 minutes. You gotta get yourself a life man.

 

[azskeptic]

OMG, you are still hawking these forums at 11 at night so closely that you can reply to my random reply within 3 minutes. You gotta get yourself a life man.

only 9 pm out here. it pops up on my screen..I answer. doesn't bother my article writing much. life goes on

 

[bts4202]

only 9 pm out here. it pops up on my screen..I answer. doesn't bother my article writing much. life goes on

yeah, it usually pops up a lot when you hawk the forums.

 

[leorl]

Dude, you're up replying yourself, so that's the pot calling the kettle black, isn't it? Anyway, there's no need for name-calling. Keep the discussions in here civil and hopefully objective.

 

[Doc-Hollywood]

stop playing dumb and claiming "latest news". You posted that same link on valuemd on the day the GMC first started the investigation a month or so ago. Pretty slimy tactic.

Slimy?

Informing people about squatter schools that have lost their recognition is slimy?

I think slimy is taking people's money for medical education and offering them worthless degrees, and at the moment the schools listed in that link are WORTHLESS in the UK.

Perhaps soon to be worthless in the USA. People in America need to know that these squatter schools are out there. I think it would be advisable for consumer advocates to write letters to every US state licensing board warning them about squatter graduates. Squatter grads already licensed should lose their licenses. Squatters in residency should be fired. Squatters in the match process should be disqualified. We should protect the American public against squatter docs in the same way the GMC is protecting their public.
I feel no sympathy for people that chose squatter over normal schools.
Caveat emptor!

 

[Waiting4Ganong]

Bump (for Quash)

 

[BlondeCookie]

There is a lot of debate now at the UK med student leadership conferences about foreign non-UK schools taking up hospital training spots usually reserved for UK students. The situation is getting weird. There are 23 schools in the UK. Recently 4 new UK schools were approved by the GMC. However, there may be less and less clinical spots available for these new students.

Apparently, there are non-UK schools that are having their students trained in UK hospitals. The number of these foreign schools using up UK clinical training spots are growing rapidly. Many of these schools are in the carribeans. The GMC defines a squatter school as any med school that has its students doing any part of their med school (Basic Science or Clinical Rotation) curriculum in the UK.

 

[azskeptic]

There is a lot of debate now at the UK med student leadership conferences about foreign non-UK schools taking up hospital training spots usually reserved for UK students. The situation is getting weird. There are 23 schools in the UK. Recently 4 new UK schools were approved by the GMC. However, there may be less and less clinical spots available for these new students.

Apparently, there are non-UK schools that are having their students trained in UK hospitals. The number of these foreign schools using up UK clinical training spots are growing rapidly. Many of these schools are in the carribeans. The GMC defines a squatter school as any med school that has its students doing any part of their med school (Basic Science or Clinical Rotation) curriculum in the UK.

The GMC will eventually rule on the plight of the offshore schools that are squatting and my guess is that they will perhaps help the UK students by eliminating the non-UK squatter school students from being in NHS clinicals,etc.

 

[BlondeCookie]

The GMC will eventually rule on the plight of the offshore schools that are squatting and my guess is that they will perhaps help the UK students by eliminating the non-UK squatter school students from being in NHS clinicals,etc.

What would happen to these caribb squatter schools in the UK, if the GMC eventually decides that they cannot utilise UK clinical spots reserved for the new UK schools? Would it put such schools out of business? I heard that the squatter schools don't actually have any training facilites, which is why they are utilising the UK clinical training facilities in the 1st place.

 

[pruritis_ani]

I think most of the schools have the majority of the clinicals in the US. So, losing clinicals in the UK shouldn't hurt them too much.

The schools that seem at the most risk are the ones that offer basic science in the UK while holding a charter somewhere else. It appearst that the GMC is looking very carefully at the relationship between these schools and the charter country. What is looking more and more likely is a ban from the GMC for any of these degrees being used in the UK. The question then is how far behind is the US? Even with a GMC ban, these schools theoretically could still enroll students on UK soil, give them clinicals in the US and get them an ECFMG certificate...after that, practice in a few states almost a certainty!

But, I would be very surprised if the ECFMG and/or state licensing boards did not quickly follow suit if the GMC refuses to recognize these degrees. These students appear to be in a world of hurt right now, and I would bet that there are going to be a lot of very screwed people in the near future...I am very, very curious to see how the ECFMG suspension pans out. The school has students in the match right now, that are currently unable to get an ECFMG certificate. It blows my mind that the NRMP would still allow them in the match....

 

[Doc-Hollywood]

Squatters have matched !!!

5 students matched to UAG
3 matched to SMU
1 matched to University of North Carolina Medical school ( as a cook in the cafeteria)
9 scrambled into Spartan

congrats to all squatters !
Good luck with your state licensing boards, (unless you started over)

 

[BlondeCookie]

Squatters have matched !!!

5 students matched to UAG
3 matched to SMU
1 matched to University of North Carolina Medical school ( as a cook in the cafeteria)
9 scrambled into Spartan

congrats to all squatters !
Good luck with your state licensing boards, (unless you started over)

And possibly the saddest situation is that the squatter schools come over to the UK, use the Clinical Training facilities, and the doctors produced don't go to alleviating the UK doctor shortage problem. Why the GMC allows this to happen at the expense of the healthcare system and the diminishing number of clinical spots for the newer UK students is anybody's guess. What a tragedy.

 

[Waiting4Ganong]

Why the GMC allows this to happen at the expense of the healthcare system and the diminishing number of clinical spots for the newer UK students is anybody's guess. What a tragedy.

They don't anymore! As far as St Chris goes - stick a fork in it - it is done. The stain on UK medical education has been erased. Squatter schools are no more.

Sucks for the "medical students" there but if St Chris was their best option then you have to ask could they have ever cut it in medicine anyway...

 

[CatsandCradles]

They don't anymore! As far as St Chris goes - stick a fork in it - it is done. The stain on UK medical education has been erased. Squatter schools are no more.

Sucks for the "medical students" there but if St Chris was their best option then you have to ask could they have ever cut it in medicine anyway...

St Chris is gone?

 

[oldpro]

They don't anymore! As far as St Chris goes - stick a fork in it - it is done. The stain on UK medical education has been erased. Squatter schools are no more.

Sucks for the "medical students" there but if St Chris was their best option then you have to ask could they have ever cut it in medicine anyway...

Well not really there are 2 more of those schools operating over there and the GMC will let them register on a case by case basis, read the new GMC listing.

 

[BlondeCookie]

They don't anymore! As far as St Chris goes - stick a fork in it - it is done. The stain on UK medical education has been erased. Squatter schools are no more.

Sucks for the "medical students" there but if St Chris was their best option then you have to ask could they have ever cut it in medicine anyway...

Not true. There are carib squatter schools in the UK besides St. Chris that are having their students do their clinical training in UK hospitals. Just because a school is operating on some far away island for the first two years, doesn't mean that those schools are not squatter schools. The GMC defines a squatter school as any med school that has its students doing any part of their med school (Basic Science or Clinical Rotation) curriculum in the UK.

 

[Waiting4Ganong]

"Case by case" review is a stepping stone to "not so much". If they were planning on allowing squatter schools long-term they'd just allow any graduate of them to register for PLAB etc. like they do for graduates of any other of the 1000's of real medical schools worldwide.

 

[Doc-Hollywood]

THOU SHALT NOT LIE.

attention marcuswelby, MTT and BTS:
any comment on your years of outright lies and propoganda finally and officially being exposed?

Given the bannage of St Christopher's college of medicine by the GMC, I urge all forum readers to enjoy the utter nonsense spewed by the sewage pipe of propoganda on threads like this one http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showthread.php?t=49138

Mtt said

The university is a college within the University of Luton, an accredited UK university

What utter nonsense!!


mtt said in response to this question " Where in relation to the school is the much referenced Burger King? "

The main campus in Luton is not on top of any Burger King. It is currently in the University of Luton and we are University of Luton students. The university has approximately 12000 students. Realize we are in a small city and we have a mall, restaurants, and all sorts of things. There is a Burger King approximately 5 minutes away in the mall adjacent to the Thistle Hotel.

5 minutes from burger king. well mtt at least you can walk to work

Goebbels said it best.( I bet he would have worked for St Christopher as a dean of admissions )

Goebbels said

“Make the lie big, make it simple, keep saying it, and eventually they will believe it”

Goebbels said

“The greater the lie, the greater the chance that it will be believed”

I wonder if students that believed these liars have any legal recourse against them for using the phone lines and internet to mislead people and commit fraud. Certainly there are laws against this

and finally for a hearty laugh
marcuswelby wrote

in the next four years this school will be a prolific force in foreign medical education.

 

[penguins]

I can't believe you are "laughing" about this!
It is very sad. Perhaps it is a good thing for St. Chris to be shut down- I don't have all the facts but it looks that way - but many many people's lives will be effected by this.
It doesn't matter what kind of students they are/were at this point. The fact is that they cared enough about medicine to go into tremendous debt, leave home and give it a shot. Not everyone who wants to be a doctor should get to be one, certainly.
Have some decency and stop laughing at their plight. Your side won so don't gloat!!!
I met a couple students that went there. They are nice people. A couple were really bright and scored great on all steps. What happens to them now? It is very sad regardless of the right/wrongness of the decision.

 

[Doc-Hollywood]

I can't believe you are "laughing" about this!
It is very sad. Perhaps it is a good thing for St. Chris to be shut down- I don't have all the facts but it looks that way - but many many people's lives will be effected by this.
It doesn't matter what kind of students they are/were at this point. The fact is that they cared enough about medicine to go into tremendous debt, leave home and give it a shot. Not everyone who wants to be a doctor should get to be one, certainly.
Have some decency and stop laughing at their plight. Your side won so don't gloat!!!
I met a couple students that went there. They are nice people. A couple were really bright and scored great on all steps. What happens to them now? It is very sad regardless of the right/wrongness of the decision.

not talking about the students that got duped by the big lie of being " british medical students" who were far superior to those lowly students from Grenada
I am referring to the small crew of stooges and sycophants for their administration who willfully duped these so-called innocent people.
The tone of my post is directed to the three individuals I named who have a long history of lies and deceit, and now they have finally been exposed


in this day and age with all the resources available, nobody should fall for a con job, so if the poor victims of these lies are SOL.......am I supposed to hold their hand and sing kum-by-yah?

I'll pass

 

[pruritis_ani]

It is sorta sad. Certainly not "very sad".

There has been a LOT of information out there regarding St Chris, and the risks involved with going there. The students that went are now suffering the consequences of a very poor choice. Rough one, sure, but nobody forced them to pick a crappy school.

Then there are those bastards that up to just a few weeks ago were constantly on here spouting off about how wonderful the school was, and how everybody was just out to get them. Feel sorry for them? Nope. There is a special place in Hell for those guys.

 

[Doc-Hollywood]

It is sorta sad. Certainly not "very sad".

There has been a LOT of information out there regarding St Chris, and the risks involved with going there. The students that went are now suffering the consequences of a very poor choice. Rough one, sure, but nobody forced them to pick a crappy school.

Then there are those bastards that up to just a few weeks ago were constantly on here spouting off about how wonderful the school was, and how everybody was just out to get them. Feel sorry for them? Nope. There is a special place in Hell for those guys.

Bad choices were made. People were warning about this school for YEARS. The people that warned folks were attacked at every turn. People chose to ignore the warnings. Bad choices=bad outcomes
I guess putting your future in the hands of this guy............well you get what you deserve.

 

[penguins]

Well, I just don't see the point of kicking these people while they are down. Rake the admin over the coals as much as you want but I am just requesting a little more tact with respect to the students. I don't know any St. Chris students any more but wherever they are, I am sure they are feeling stupid enough.
Doc-Hollywood, why do you care so much? Are you a former student there or something? Just curious.

 

[Doc-Hollywood]

Well, I just don't see the point of kicking these people while they are down. Rake the admin over the coals as much as you want but I am just requesting a little more tact with respect to the students. I don't know any St. Chris students any more but wherever they are, I am sure they are feeling stupid enough.
Doc-Hollywood, why do you care so much? Are you a former student there or something? Just curious.

nope, just been following the saga for a while now.

the people I am enjoying kicking when they are down deserve it. sorry if you are offended by reading that. I suggest you try Martha Stewart Living's website if you want and

or better yet read a few year's worth of posts by folks like BTS and mtt and you'll get into the swing of things

 

[pruritis_ani]

Well, I just don't see the point of kicking these people while they are down. Rake the admin over the coals as much as you want but I am just requesting a little more tact with respect to the students. I don't know any St. Chris students any more but wherever they are, I am sure they are feeling stupid enough.
Doc-Hollywood, why do you care so much? Are you a former student there or something? Just curious.

Speaking of kicking, you should have read the posts of BTS, MTT, futurphysician and others on this forum and valuemd. Those guys were outright hostile and insulting whenever anybody brought up potential problems with St. Chris. Now that what they were warned about has happened, I think you are going to have a hard time generating much sympathy for them here.

I am sure there are some "innocent" victims in this, some that went and trusted the school. However it is still pretty hard to work up too much sadness for these folks. The writing was on the wall, the potential problems were there (as well as the unforseen disasters that actually happened), and they chose St. Chris in spite of the fact that there are several other schools that did not have the same risk profile.

Why did people go to St. Chris anyhow? I still really don't know. The reasons I have heard range from avoiding the stigma of the carib, to wanting to live in london, to having been kicked out of other schools. Weak reasons, every one of these and the others that I have heard. About the only reason I can kind of see is those with such weak academic credentials that absolutely couldn't get in anywhere else...but, even so, the Central Europe schools are pretty wide open, and much better than SC. Besides, if you academics are that bad, any med school is likely a bad idea...

There has NEVER been a valid reason to accept the amount of risk St. Chris was saddled with, IMHO. So, now they must deal with the consequences of a poor choice.

While having to repeat 1-4 years of school would absolutely suck, it certainly is not an insurmountable obstacle. SGU has made a very generous offer to SC students, so financially it would be less of a burden. The smart folks will learn from the mistakes, dust themselves off and go to a real school. Lesson learned. The rest of them likely shouldn't be practicing anyway.

BTW, can you imagine how pissed some PD's are going to be when they find out that the St. Chris students that matched are not able to get an ECFMG certificate? If anybody needs a residency spot all they have to do is find out where an SC student matched, and wait til July 1st. Those spots will very likely not be filled at that time.

 

[Doc-Hollywood]

Speaking of kicking, you should have read the posts of BTS, MTT, futurphysician and others on this forum and valuemd. Those guys were outright hostile and insulting whenever anybody brought up potential problems with St. Chris. Now that what they were warned about has happened, I think you are going to have a hard time generating much sympathy for them here.

I am sure there are some "innocent" victims in this, some that went and trusted the school. However it is still pretty hard to work up too much sadness for these folks. The writing was on the wall, the potential problems were there (as well as the unforseen disasters that actually happened), and they chose St. Chris in spite of the fact that there are several other schools that did not have the same risk profile.

Why did people go to St. Chris anyhow? I still really don't know. The reasons I have heard range from avoiding the stigma of the carib, to wanting to live in london, to having been kicked out of other schools. Weak reasons, every one of these and the others that I have heard. About the only reason I can kind of see is those with such weak academic credentials that absolutely couldn't get in anywhere else...but, even so, the Central Europe schools are pretty wide open, and much better than SC. Besides, if you academics are that bad, any med school is likely a bad idea...

There has NEVER been a valid reason to accept the amount of risk St. Chris was saddled with, IMHO. So, now they must deal with the consequences of a poor choice.

While having to repeat 1-4 years of school would absolutely suck, it certainly is not an insurmountable obstacle. SGU has made a very generous offer to SC students, so financially it would be less of a burden. The smart folks will learn from the mistakes, dust themselves off and go to a real school. Lesson learned. The rest of them likely shouldn't be practicing anyway.

BTW, can you imagine how pissed some PD's are going to be when they find out that the St. Chris students that matched are not able to get an ECFMG certificate? If anybody needs a residency spot all they have to do is find out where an SC student matched, and wait til July 1st. Those spots will very likely not be filled at that time.

I'm not sure the SGU offer is anything more than a PR stunt. The SC students still need to meet the regular criteria for admission to SGU, and I doubt very many will.
How many have even taken the MCAT?
realistically, how many students will they actually take? half a dozen?

 

[pruritis_ani]

I'm not sure the SGU offer is anything more than a PR stunt. The SC students still need to meet the regular criteria for admission to SGU, and I doubt very many will.
How many have even taken the MCAT?
realistically, how many students will they actually take? half a dozen?

I am sure not many will qualify. Those that don't qualify for the SGU offer can try to get into Ross, SABA or AUC. There is also UAG, Ireland, Australia and the Central Europe schools. While I would not hold my breath for them having any credit recognized at any of these schools, those that are even remotely qualified to study medicine should be able to get in and start over at one of the above schools.

It ain't gonna be easy, but it will seperate the wheat from the chaffe. Those that are qualified and want to be doctors still have many legit means to do it. Those that are doing it for mommy or daddy, or that don't have the smarts to get through it are going to be left behind. All of this is good, IMHO.

With less crappy, fly by night operations out there that mislead students, the rest of us won't have to deal with an even worse public opinion of IMG's. I have a feeling that the next wave of screwed students and school closures is not too far away....I would not be surprised to see many, if not all states adopting a more hard line stance for offshore school standards, and if this happens, the smaller, newer schools don't have a chance.

With this recent proliferation of schools, it seems that the time for thinning the herd is near.

Take home lesson: DON'T BE A LAB RAT FOR A NEW SCHOOL! Lab rats die, and the mad scientists get rich. No matter how good a new school looks in person, or on paper, you still have a huge risk. Go to an established school.

 

[f_w]

Nothing wrong with going to a newly established medical school. Just make sure that the underlying concept is legit. (And the concept of bribing some official in a impoverished third world country to obtain a charter and then setting up shop in a prestigious location to attract simple minded US applicants just doesn't pan out in the long run.)

 

[pruritis_ani]

Nothing wrong with going to a newly established medical school. Just make sure that the underlying concept is legit. (And the concept of bribing some official in a impoverished third world country to obtain a charter and then setting up shop in a prestigious location to attract simple minded US applicants just doesn't pan out in the long run.)

I strongly disagree. There are plenty of new schools that failed. I cannot imagine any reason to trust a new school with all of my hard earned money.

And how do you propose verifying that the "underlying concept" is legit? There is no verifying anything until grads go out and get residencies and unrestricted licenses. If by "underlying concept" you mean simply that they are located in the country of charter and in the carib, I think that is a very low standard. Look to Grace, Lord Liverpool University, PBU just to name a few recent failures.

The potential for problems is pretty limitless and ranges from non trustworthy admin, failure to generate enough students to stay open, licensing issues and who knows what else.

Going to an established school gives the student some semblance of security. At least the school has been around, is well established financially, has alumni that may be able to help (or at least have paved the way) and may even have a decent reputation to trade on.

I fail to see any compelling reason to choose a new school. Poor academic qualifications? You can find somewhere to let you in. Cost? Saba and the Central Europe schools are cheap. Location? Well, there are well established schools in the Carib, Mexico, Europe and Australia, so you can really take your pick as far as city vs rural goes. You can pretty much find any teaching method, research availability, size of classes and quality of professor that you want among the established schools.

I would be interested in hearing any reasons for choosing the newer schools that you can come up with. I am of the opinion that any benefit that a new school may offer would be far outweighed by the security of choosing an established school.

 

[BlondeCookie]

Are you kidding me? Sad story for who, the St. Christopher students? Surely not! I hear many of these students are being offered international spots in the legitimate GMC accredited UK schools. And so it seems, they lucked out.

 

[pruritis_ani]

Are you kidding me? Sad story for who, the St. Christopher students? Surely not! I hear many of these students are being offered international spots in the legitimate GMC accredited UK schools. And so it seems, they lucked out.

That would be extremely fortuitous for them. But, for any real shot at legitimacy they would still need to repear med school. It the UK schools accept the St Chris credits the students will likely face licensing issues for having credits from a non-existent school.

Really, no matter what happens, these students wasted time and money. Those that try to sneak the St. Chris credits through another school will likely find another failure in the future.

Still, it is certainly not a "sad story". It is what happens when you make stupid choices. They may get lucky and have options, that is about the best that can happen now.

BTW, where did you hear this about legit UK schools offering seats? Which students are eligible and which schools are offering?

 

[Doc-Hollywood]

That would be extremely fortuitous for them. But, for any real shot at legitimacy they would still need to repear med school. It the UK schools accept the St Chris credits the students will likely face licensing issues for having credits from a non-existent school.

Really, no matter what happens, these students wasted time and money. Those that try to sneak the St. Chris credits through another school will likely find another failure in the future.

Still, it is certainly not a "sad story". It is what happens when you make stupid choices. They may get lucky and have options, that is about the best that can happen now.

BTW, where did you hear this about legit UK schools offering seats? Which students are eligible and which schools are offering?

I guess what I don't understand is if the GMC feels that their education is in question enough to ban all grads, and ECFMG is currently preventing students who have yet to get an ECFMG certificate from getting one, why is there no movement to ban graduates working in America?
Should not state licensing boards strip these graduates of their licenses?

This has all the makings of some really good investigative TV reporting.
How about dateline NBC taking a trip to Luton, or to some residency program somewhere where a graduate is working who attended a school which is banned in England.
The public deserves the truth. I am pretty sure they will soon get it

 

[penguins]

I guess what I don't understand is if the GMC feels that their education is in question enough to ban all grads, and ECFMG is currently preventing students who have yet to get an ECFMG certificate from getting one, why is there no movement to ban graduates working in America?
Should not state licensing boards strip these graduates of their licenses?

This has all the makings of some really good investigative TV reporting.
How about dateline NBC taking a trip to Luton, or to some residency program somewhere where a graduate is working who attended a school which is banned in England.
The public deserves the truth. I am pretty sure they will soon get it

Don't you have anything better to do with your time than hunt down hard working residents who took the tests and did what they needed to get where they are. You have got to be kidding that you think it would be a good thing to investigate these doctors.
Why don't you put your time into investigating bad doctors - no matter where they went to school. If a St. Chris grad is a bad doc - by all means, throw the book at them. But if they are out there just trying to be the best doc they can be and are minding their own business and got to where they are... leave them alone.
What kind of mean-spirited person are you. Are you in medical school? Are you a doctor?

 

[Doc-Hollywood]

Don't you have anything better to do with your time than hunt down hard working residents who took the tests and did what they needed to get where they are. You have got to be kidding that you think it would be a good thing to investigate these doctors.
Why don't you put your time into investigating bad doctors - no matter where they went to school. If a St. Chris grad is a bad doc - by all means, throw the book at them. But if they are out there just trying to be the best doc they can be and are minding their own business and got to where they are... leave them alone.
What kind of mean-spirited person are you. Are you in medical school? Are you a doctor?

The truth is sometimes painful but we must follow it.
You cannot polish a turd. You still have a turd.
The truth shall set you free, and the american healthcare consumer must be protected from the SC turds

Now march along penguin

 

[penguins]

The truth is sometimes painful but we must follow it.
You cannot polish a turd. You still have a turd.
The truth shall set you free, and the american healthcare consumer must be protected from the SC turds

Now march along penguin

Grow up.

 

[Doc-Hollywood]

Grow up.

I've grown up.
The world is a mean place.
Survival of the fittest.
The medical training process is like Parris Island in a sense that only the strongest ought to survive.

A pack of idiots who thought they could cheat and attend a school in England with a dubious charter in Senegal to me is like the fat frat boy that joins the marines. He ought to wash out and they ought to wash out. What , do you want a fat stupid idiot becoming a marine? I don't. Likewise I don't want a bunch of scammer liars like BTS and MTT lying for years and burning tons of kids not smart enough to check out their BS and believe all the people speaking the truth, like Neil C to become physicians. The Hell with them. Let them start over, or fovever change bedpans in a nursing home ( provided they can pass the requirements to become LVN's)

What are you related to that ignoramus whuds from a certain medical school forum? ( speaking of a chronic liar ) Why do you have such a simpering soft spot for these fools?
Let them wither on the vine!!!
The herd just got stronger with the death of these mental invalids and cheaters

Semper fi

 

[oldpro]

New I saw this on VMD and wanted to post it, it looks as if the school is dead now:

To whom this may concern,To whom this may concern,

We are writing to announce the dismissal of Dr. Paul L from the board of directors of St. Christopher’s Iba Mar Diop College of Medicine, Dakar, Senegal. It was announced that the remainder of the board of trustees have serious questions about whether Dr. L has engaged in unethical practices. This change will enable St. Christopher’s to push forward and develop an institution we can all be proud of.

As many are aware, the ECFMG has requested verification from Senegal that the Luton campus of St. Christopher’s is fully recognized and accredited. Although Senegal has always fully supported the Luton campus, this letter has been held back by Senegal due to the allegations against him. The Senegal administration and Ministry of Health does not wish to be involved with someone who has so many unanswered questions surrounding them and wanted some resolution before any support for the Luton campus was reaffirmed. The administration of the Dakar campus of St. Christopher’s is currently auditing each student file to ensure that no other illegal or unethical practices have been employed. Once that has occurred, the ECFMG will be informed that all remaining individuals have the full backing of the Senegal government from February 2000 until the end of this current semester. After that, accreditation of the current Luton campus will be removed and applied to a new campus in England that will be run by a new administrator recently hired by the Dakar campus president.

The charter of St. Christopher’s is owned by the sovereign country of Senegal and not by any one individual. However, the current physical facilities of the Luton campus is owned by Dr. L and he therefore still has the right to do with those facilities as he pleases. Therefore, anything that Dr. L does with the current UK business named St. Christopher’s College of Medicine Lmtd will have no relation whatsoever to the Senegal medical college of the same name. Should he attempt to obtain a new charter to continue operating the physical facilities that he owns, it will have to be considered an entirely new entity that is separate from the current college of medicine.

All of the details regarding the current changes have not been completely ironed out yet, however the Senegalese administration and their newly appointed UK administration are working around the clock to make all the necessary preparations. Both administrations have already held meetings with the ECFMG and some of the state licensing boards. They are trying to reverse previous policies of silence and remain completely transparent to outside official organizations. As we have more info, we will release it in a timely fashion.
__________________
BTS4202
St. Christopher's COM
4th Year
http://www.mdparadise.com

 

[pruritis_ani]

Dead, but trying to reincarnate an identical St Chris in another English location.

What a bunch of idiots. Going down with the ship to the bitter end.

 

[whuds]

I've grown up.
The world is a mean place.
Survival of the fittest.
The medical training process is like Parris Island in a sense that only the strongest ought to survive.

A pack of idiots who thought they could cheat and attend a school in England with a dubious charter in Senegal to me is like the fat frat boy that joins the marines. He ought to wash out and they ought to wash out. What , do you want a fat stupid idiot becoming a marine? I don't. Likewise I don't want a bunch of scammer liars like BTS and MTT lying for years and burning tons of kids not smart enough to check out their BS and believe all the people speaking the truth, like Neil C to become physicians. The Hell with them. Let them start over, or fovever change bedpans in a nursing home ( provided they can pass the requirements to become LVN's)

What are you related to that ignoramus whuds from a certain medical school forum? ( speaking of a chronic liar ) Why do you have such a simpering soft spot for these fools?
Let them wither on the vine!!!
The herd just got stronger with the death of these mental invalids and cheaters

Semper fi

Funny how you must feel superior by insulting me I do not even post over here any more and came over to see whats up, You just blindly insult me why not man enough to come over to VMD or did I ban you for insults like this?
Someone has to be the mod for the SC forum, so you pick on me.

Well I noticed this form is not moderated well so look only a weak person can only make a point in an insultive and inmature way and Doctors are supposed to protect the weak and heal the sick God help us from the likes of you!

calling me a liar is fighting words in Georgia you ***.



BY the way yea I went to that School but ran into problems there by the ADMIN and woke up. If you read any of my latest posts there you will see.
I left last year and when these problems happened after I left I hoped the school would work out these problems but so far hasn't yea it's a mess and I think it should close down and go away.
I made a mistake just like the thousand or so who went there over the last 5 years but I woke up and went somewhere else. I believed the cheer leaders for the school and was hooked into it. It's over now the final truth has hit the fan. I got over it and started over at another school.

I'm strong and will survive , but if you have a problem with me don't run to another web site like a coward and post crap.