Undergrad Vet ER Internship?

[hopeful2016]

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Hi everyone,
I am a pre-vet student who (at the moment) is thinking about tracking for ER/ICU medicine. I am currently a junior in college and have had several prior internships including wildlife rehab, exotics, marine mammal rescue, and domestic small animals. After hours of research I have been entirely unsuccessful at finding internships or shadowing opportunities for undergrad students in veterinary ERs. I would love to be able to explore this field a little bit more before I start my applications. Has anyone been able to shadow, intern or volunteer in a veterinary ER clinic? Any help would be greatly appreciated!

Thanks!

 

[NStarz]

Hi everyone,
I am a pre-vet student who (at the moment) is thinking about tracking for ER/ICU medicine. I am currently a junior in college and have had several prior internships including wildlife rehab, exotics, marine mammal rescue, and domestic small animals. After hours of research I have been entirely unsuccessful at finding internships or shadowing opportunities for undergrad students in veterinary ERs. I would love to be able to explore this field a little bit more before I start my applications. Has anyone been able to shadow, intern or volunteer in a veterinary ER clinic? Any help would be greatly appreciated!

Thanks!

Where are you located? Best bet would probably be to call/stop in to local ER clinics (24 hr or after hours hospitals) and ask if you can hang out! ER is awesome, but it can be pretty hit or miss, depending on what kind of area you're in. I did some ER shadowing in NJ, but am not sure if that would be feasible for you 🙂

 

[hopeful2016]

Thanks for your advice! 🙂 Im located in MA not too far from Boston. I have called, emailed and visited the local ERs that I know of and unfortunately none of them have volunteer or intern positions. I've been told that the only positions available are either paper-pushing or in the back cleaning kennels. I'm all for working hard and earning responsibility over time, but I'm wary of traveling long distances and making huge commitments for simply a 'maybe' or 'its unlikely'. I'd love to find an ER that has a summer intern or assistant position open. If I knew that I could help out - even if it was just fetching supplies and cleaning stations - I'd be willing to travel and make a serious commitment.

 

[jmo1012]

If you're not too far from Boston, maybe see if Angell Animal Medical Center will let you shadow. They're a really big referral hospital with an ER/ICU. Otherwise just try calling around/stopping by local ERs and seeing if you can shadow or if they have any vet tech assistant positions open.

I really doubt you'll find something labelled as an "internship" as that word is usually associated with someone with a DVM in the vet world.

Also, not sure what you mean by "tracking" - do you mean specializing post DVM or specifically in school curriculum-wise? Because you don't get to track more than "small animal" in vet schools that even offer tracking. And in case you didn't know this, you don't have to do an internship/residency/specialty training to be an ER vet. In fact, a general ER vet and an ECC specialist are very different in terms of focus and in-hospital work. 🙂

 

[NStarz]

You may want to ask for a shadowing opportunity instead of volunteering/internship opportunities. You may get different results. Especially in ER where things are very fast paced and often are life/death, clinics may be reluctant to take on a volunteer. But they may not be opposed to someone observing. And definitely go in person and ask to speak to a vet/someone in charge vs. calling/emailing. You often have better luck that way 🙂 Don't be too pushy about being hands on at first. If you show yourself to be curious, conscientious, and responsible, a position may present itself later on. Good luck 🙂

 

[T_Rose]

I did an internship at an ER clinic (so far, I've been the only one at that particular clinic), and I loved it. However, I got lucky because the owner of the clinic had been looking for an undergraduate for that purpose, and I happened to know her well since I volunteer for an organization she started. I agree with everyone else. The best way to get started would be to ask if you can observe. It really is a fast-paced place, and you have to be ready for anything. Shadowing is a good way to show you are interested.

 

[pooter]

I worked in an ER briefly as an undergrad. It was a small, after-hours facility in MD, and I only learned about the position through a family friend. The place took on a few pre-vets to clean, fetch supplies, restrain and so forth, but they also taught us skills and we were eventually responsible for some treatments. It was kind of an experiment for them, since they normally operated with no assistants and all their techs were hired at at least five years of experience (usually more). Everyone knew I was underqualified, but I worked hard and kept my head down and I don't *think* I killed anything. But, there was a close call. It involved a Yorkie and a fluid bolus that didn't get turned off. I'm telling you this not to scare you off, but to point out why many of these places can be very wary of hiring interns and assistants--it's a liability issue and mistakes are much more likely to have dire consequences when you're working with the sickest patients. If I had to do it all over again, I might try to find a particular vet who worked in emergency and get them to let me shadow. This strategy would probably leave me with fewer hours, though, and definitely with fewer clinical skills.

p.s. If you live within commuting distance of a vet school, you might check with them. I know that Penn, at least, has an established program for "candy-stripers" who get to hang out in the ER in exchange for wiping down cages and so forth. Or just wait until you're in vet school and start shadowing then; you have plenty of time and it doesn't sound like you're in need of hours in general.

 

[sunshinevet]

Thanks for your advice! 🙂 Im located in MA not too far from Boston. I have called, emailed and visited the local ERs that I know of and unfortunately none of them have volunteer or intern positions. I've been told that the only positions available are either paper-pushing or in the back cleaning kennels. I'm all for working hard and earning responsibility over time, but I'm wary of traveling long distances and making huge commitments for simply a 'maybe' or 'its unlikely'. I'd love to find an ER that has a summer intern or assistant position open. If I knew that I could help out - even if it was just fetching supplies and cleaning stations - I'd be willing to travel and make a serious commitment.

I'm a bit confused - on one hand you reject places that would only offer you a kennel hand position, yet you say you would make a serious commitment to a place that let's you clean up stations and get supplies?
Maybe I'm just think but that pretty much IS a kennel hand position...

If j were you, I would take either a
Reception position or a kennel hand position. You will not be allowed to be involved in patient care off the bat - you need to earn that trust, and honestly, a lot of the time, work experience people tend to get in the way. By taking a reception or kennel
Hand position you get your foot in the door and will learn tonnes of stuff, and you might also be able to come in on your days off to watch stuff.

Also, what's with everyone in the US calling work experience "internships"??

 

[Trilt]

I'm a bit confused - on one hand you reject places that would only offer you a kennel hand position, yet you say you would make a serious commitment to a place that let's you clean up stations and get supplies?
Maybe I'm just think but that pretty much IS a kennel hand position...

If j were you, I would take either a
Reception position or a kennel hand position. You will not be allowed to be involved in patient care off the bat - you need to earn that trust, and honestly, a lot of the time, work experience people tend to get in the way. By taking a reception or kennel
Hand position you get your foot in the door and will learn tonnes of stuff, and you might also be able to come in on your days off to watch stuff.

Also, what's with everyone in the US calling work experience "internships"??

Difference between being stuck in the back kennel cleaning all day vs. shadowing, then cleaning up stations and grabbing supplies in exchange.

 

[christiansenle]

I'm a bit confused - on one hand you reject places that would only offer you a kennel hand position, yet you say you would make a serious commitment to a place that let's you clean up stations and get supplies?
Maybe I'm just think but that pretty much IS a kennel hand position...

If j were you, I would take either a
Reception position or a kennel hand position. You will not be allowed to be involved in patient care off the bat - you need to earn that trust, and honestly, a lot of the time, work experience people tend to get in the way. By taking a reception or kennel
Hand position you get your foot in the door and will learn tonnes of stuff, and you might also be able to come in on your days off to watch stuff.

Also, what's with everyone in the US calling work experience "internships"??

I think hopeful2016 was willing to be a kennel hand somewhere close to home, but wasn't sure if they should commit to such a position if it's far away from home given that advancement/experience isn't guaranteed.

Also, internships in the US usually imply unpaid (although they may provide housing) work over a short amount of time- usually summer vacation or a free semester. Work experience would be something where you're actually getting paid for your time.

However, I agree with you that hopeful2016 should take whatever they can get, regardless of distance and give it a chance. If it ends up being a situation where you're not getting any learning opportunities, you can always give them your notice and put that experience on your CV while you search for better options that are also closer to you.

 

[hopeful2016]

Yes that is what I meant. I apologize if I wasn't clear before. I absolutely am willing to work in small jobs first and earn greater responsibility with time. I completely understand that is how these jobs work. I get that in this profession you have to take what you can get and work your way up. What I had been told before was that there was essentially no way I'd be allowed in the ER even after an extended period of time of volunteering. They simply do not allow anyone but staff in there. For obvious reasons I have concerns about committing to a job like that far away with no guarantee of shadowing in the ER. Im not looking for pay or housing and would even be willing to look for an apartment closer to a position if I knew I'd have some opportunity to shadow available.

 

[sunshinevet]

Sorry, I assumed that by positions avaliable you meant paid positions as a kennel hand, not volunteer positions. My bad.

I don't really understand how/why they would keep kennel hands out of the ER, since there would obviously be kennel hand stuff to do in there, but that is extremely unfortunate.

I guess its just such a different part of veterinary medicine it can make it difficult to have shadowers. I work in em/cc and whenever we have people shadowing its really difficult because they can't nessercerrily go into consults because of how upset owners might be, they don't understand a lot of whats going on and so a lot of the time there isn't much to do but stand around and watch vets and nurses talking lol. We do try our best but it is hard. Good luck, I hope you find something. Maybe you'll have more luck once you get into vet school?


PS the internship/work experience thing is essentially reversed here in Aus 🙂

 

[MysteryCat]

Hi everyone,
I am a pre-vet student who (at the moment) is thinking about tracking for ER/ICU medicine. I am currently a junior in college and have had several prior internships including wildlife rehab, exotics, marine mammal rescue, and domestic small animals. After hours of research I have been entirely unsuccessful at finding internships or shadowing opportunities for undergrad students in veterinary ERs. I would love to be able to explore this field a little bit more before I start my applications. Has anyone been able to shadow, intern or volunteer in a veterinary ER clinic? Any help would be greatly appreciated!

Thanks!

ER/ICU is my goal too. I'm lucky enough to have an aunt who is an LVT at an after hours practice in town and I am able to shadow/volunteer there a bit. It's awesome and I highly recommend that you try to go talk to some of your local clinics. Sometimes they just have to know you're serious!

 

[Awendela]

Try to go through a vet, if you can find anyone you have a connection to at Angell. (I went through the alum network of my undergrad institution to contact someone.) You might have more luck doing things that way as opposed to trying to set up a formal arrangement with the hospital administration. I'd start out requesting a single day of shadowing or even just a lunch meeting to talk about the career, and then if things go well, you can try to build off of that.

I used to shadow there, and I got to spend time with vets on several different specialties - the hospital was amazing! It is a little bit harder to get into the ER (partially because the interns and residents are usually handling most of it, and the organization is pretty different), but you can always try contacting them. I also found it was a lot easier to float between specialties once I made my initial contact (who was willing to reassure other vets that I wouldn't bite or whatever).

Obviously shadowing will be unpaid, and it may not look as "serious" on your application as an official position, but it counts as veterinary experience, and I found that I learned a lot while I was there. I did one full day every other week for several months (it was kind of far away for me, too), but the hours added up, and one of the vets there even wrote a recommendation for me for this application cycle.

Just my opinion based on my own experience with Angell. If you have any more questions about it, feel free to PM me.

 

[hygebeorht]

I think working in critical care and urgent care is a great idea. It looks better than general practice hours on an application, since you're likely to see more, and it works great around a student schedule since many facilities are 24/7.

I volunteered for a year at a specialty/critical care facility and learned a vast amount. Yes, most of what I did was tidying up, but if you're a hard worker, cheerful, and helpful, the vets and techs really appreciate you and want to teach you more and give you more responsibility. It's really true that you need to start by doing laundry, mopping, and filling flushes to earn more responsibility.

Also, there tends to be fewer staff working ER shifts, and they may need your hands for things that you'd normally not be able to do. If they are slammed, you may be a critical resource. I loved doing what I did.

Just google emergency vets in your area and send emails and make calls. Ask to volunteer and say you're aiming for vet school, but you're willing to do whatever they need and you're a self-starter. And then be a great volunteer and a great self-starter!

 

[Foxhunter]

I think working in critical care and urgent care is a great idea. It looks better than general practice hours on an application, since you're likely to see more, and it works great around a student schedule since many facilities are 24/7.

I question this statement for a couple of reasons. 1) Most general practices get plenty of emergencies throughout the day and you still "see a lot" there. 2) I acknowledge that breadth is important on an application, but I don't think any one area looks better than others or stands on it's own (I don't think an applicant who only worked in ER is going to look any better than an applicant with the same number of hours in general practice, may even look worse as you see chronic and acute issues, day-to-day stuff, and emergencies in a general practice). 3) Unless you're an admissions officer or have talked to one about it you can't say which looks better.

 

[Foxhunter]

As for my opinion, specifically ask clinics about shadowing. It's crazy, but word choice is important. Make it clear you're excited about emergency medicine and that you're trying to get into vet school

 

[cdndvm]

I question this statement for a couple of reasons. 1) Most general practices get plenty of emergencies throughout the day and you still "see a lot" there. 2) I acknowledge that breadth is important on an application, but I don't think any one area looks better than others or stands on it's own (I don't think an applicant who only worked in ER is going to look any better than an applicant with the same number of hours in general practice, may even look worse as you see chronic and acute issues, day-to-day stuff, and emergencies in a general practice). 3) Unless you're an admissions officer or have talked to one about it you can't say which looks better.

Agreed. I dont think ER experience holds any weight over GP experience.

 

[lgs9109]

Hi everyone,
I am a pre-vet student who (at the moment) is thinking about tracking for ER/ICU medicine. I am currently a junior in college and have had several prior internships including wildlife rehab, exotics, marine mammal rescue, and domestic small animals. After hours of research I have been entirely unsuccessful at finding internships or shadowing opportunities for undergrad students in veterinary ERs. I would love to be able to explore this field a little bit more before I start my applications. Has anyone been able to shadow, intern or volunteer in a veterinary ER clinic? Any help would be greatly appreciated!

Thanks!

My Junior year of college (I'm now a senior) I was lucky to land a job as a treatment/emergency technician at a local clinic (I'm in Albuquerque, NM). Previously, I'd worked in 2 small general practice clinics that didn't allow me to gain much hands on experience. I had an in to this clinic and through a recommendation, landed the job. They had to teach me a lot, but were willing to work with me. I am not a registered technician. The hospital is a VCA with a general practice side, referral side, and emergency services. Its a HUGE hospital. They are always willing to have people intern or shadow as they please. I would look into your local VCAs and see what opportunities they have for you.

I know the common feeling about VCA is not a happy one, but I LOVE IT! They treat their employees outstandingly. I would highly recommend looking into a VCA that is a larger hospital.

Let me know if you have any more questions 🙂

 

[lgs9109]

Agreed. I dont think ER experience holds any weight over GP experience.

Maybe on an application it doesn't.... But I know the experience I've gained through working at an ER vet has taught me a lot more than the GPs I've worked at. Plus, we have interns at my work who will give you old books and help you a ton with the application process 🙂

I know it helped me get into vet school (first time around too) by saying "Hey, I want to be an emergency and critical care vet and I have the experience in an vet ER clinic to back up that desire." Instead of wanting to be an emergency and critical care vet without really knowing why.

 

[tropictuco]

I guess its just such a different part of veterinary medicine it can make it difficult to have shadowers. I work in em/cc and whenever we have people shadowing its really difficult because they can't nessercerrily go into consults because of how upset owners might be, they don't understand a lot of whats going on and so a lot of the time there isn't much to do but stand around and watch vets and nurses talking lol. We do try our best but it is hard. Good luck, I hope you find something. Maybe you'll have more luck once you get into vet school?

I shadow at a mixed animal clinic and I'm not allowed in the rooms for consults either, but I still learn a whole lot from hanging out in the back when everyone's talking. One of the vets likes to talk through the cases out loud, even if I'm the only one back there (then he talks to meee!).

Anyway, just wanted to let you know that we shadow-ers still learn a lot from you all even if we're just standing around.

 

[cdndvm]

Maybe on an application it doesn't.... But I know the experience I've gained through working at an ER vet has taught me a lot more than the GPs I've worked at. Plus, we have interns at my work who will give you old books and help you a ton with the application process 🙂

I know it helped me get into vet school (first time around too) by saying "Hey, I want to be an emergency and critical care vet and I have the experience in an vet ER clinic to back up that desire." Instead of wanting to be an emergency and critical care vet without really knowing why.

I dont disagree that from a learning perspective that ECC has a lot to offer with respect to caseload etc (and i'm biased bc i practice referral ER/CC exclusively - haha). Additionally by spending time in a large referral centre you are more likely to interact with specialists within the field who can write reference letters for you. But when we are reviewing applications for vet school we don't value ER experience over GP experience. To be honest, people now a days have so many hours of experience in one discipline or another its difficult to weigh which candidate has an advantage over the other. Often it comes down to letters of reference from people you know that are generated from those experiences. A candidate who has spent 200 hours in a hospital that has managed to impress someone enough to write them an outstanding LOR is worth more then 1000 hours of experience and an average LOR or even decent LOR. Quality over quantity.

 

[Foxhunter]

Maybe on an application it doesn't.... But I know the experience I've gained through working at an ER vet has taught me a lot more than the GPs I've worked at. Plus, we have interns at my work who will give you old books and help you a ton with the application process 🙂

I think this completely depends on the practice, not what type of practice it is. Some vets really take people under their wings and show them the ropes, others don't. At 17, I was doing dentals, going on farm calls, scrubbing in for surgeries, learning blood draws, and being on call for emergencies at a general practice clinic.

I know it helped me get into vet school (first time around too) by saying "Hey, I want to be an emergency and critical care vet and I have the experience in an vet ER clinic to back up that desire." Instead of wanting to be an emergency and critical care vet without really knowing why.

This is true. It is helpful to be able to say "this is what I want to do and this is why I want to do it and this is the experience I have that proves I know what I'm getting myself into"

 

[WolvesDragon55]

I just started shadowing at an ER this past week. That's in MD however, so I'm not sure it would help you. I also don't know if they take undergraduate interns normally- One of the vets I shadow a lot with is on the board and got me in. However, since I don't have a rabies vaccine, I can't actually touch any animal there. I did get to draw up some meds and help with cleaning and such, but best of all, I get to go into consults and hear the vets explain things to the clients, then they explain it to me in more detail in the back. The techs are also (as always) awesome with explaining things. So even though I am somewhat limited with what I can do, it will still be a great learning experience for emergency diagnostics and procedures. I have equine, cattle, exotic, small animal (GP) and I wanted to see some further emergency work than what I got at the GP (though this was quite a bit!). Technically, I am a "volunteer."

 

[hygebeorht]

I question this statement for a couple of reasons. 1) Most general practices get plenty of emergencies throughout the day and you still "see a lot" there. 2) I acknowledge that breadth is important on an application, but I don't think any one area looks better than others or stands on it's own (I don't think an applicant who only worked in ER is going to look any better than an applicant with the same number of hours in general practice, may even look worse as you see chronic and acute issues, day-to-day stuff, and emergencies in a general practice). 3) Unless you're an admissions officer or have talked to one about it you can't say which looks better.

Well, I'm not just saying it 'cause it makes me feel fuzzy inside 😉. I have spoken candidly with several current and former members of admissions committees, and they have told me that especially for someone who has <1000-1500 vet hours, working for a CC/ER vet practice looks great compared to a general practice. While at a general practice, you can see interesting cases, at a CC/ER practice it's almost guaranteed. It is possible to put in your volunteer hours and never see anything much more exciting than a spay at some general practice clinics, while HBCs, BD/LDs, and crazy toxicities are the norm at most CC/ER clinics.

Additionally, while it always depends on the docs, people at CC/ER practices can get to do a lot of interesting stuff just because it's usually a smaller staff during emergency hours. The clinic where I worked had 5ish docs during the day and maybe 8-10 techs. During emergency hours (nights and weekends) there was one doc, one or two techs, and me. So that's good news when you have to fill out your duties - you get to put in the really exciting and nasty stuff, which is important to adcoms because they want to know that you have a good sense of the uglier side of the profession too.

So yeah, I'm not just making it up. I've been complimented in interviews on my ER experience compared to just general practice stuff, and since I didn't have 5000 hours of vet experience, that made a big difference.

 

[WolvesDragon55]

^ is part of why I did it. I have <1000 hours, so I'm hoping that it will help me out. It also will help me see things I didn't get to see at the GP. I shadowed two or three times a week there but I somehow always missed the surgeries that weren't spays and neuters. I saw two vicious dog bites, and that's it! In one night at the ER, I saw such a variety of things, and a lot of them were the parts you miss at GP because well... you're not an emergency hospital. I have never heard of it being better or worse, just different. I thought it would be a valuable experience, and it has been.

 

[LetItSnow]

Well, I'm not just saying it 'cause it makes me feel fuzzy inside 😉. I have spoken candidly with several current and former members of admissions committees, and they have told me that especially for someone who has <1000-1500 vet hours, working for a CC/ER vet practice looks great compared to a general practice. While at a general practice, you can see interesting cases, at a CC/ER practice it's almost guaranteed.

Eh. I'm not buying. For starters, being complimented on your experience doesn't mean that it's better than other types - it just means somebody is complimenting you on what you've done. Second, it doesn't make rational sense: you're hinging your argument on "you get to see interesting stuff" - but why is "seeing interesting stuff" indicative of a better candidate? Most of medicine *isn't* "interesting stuff" so there's no real reason to weigh the "cool" factor of emergency medicine when you're evaluating a vet school candidate. Third, your background experience doesn't stand by itself; it's taken in the context of your career goals. If you say you want to be an ER doc, then sure - ER experience is part of what they would want to see on your application and it would give you a leg up. If you want to be a public health person, experience in that sector is going to provide that impressive, consistent story to your application.

And fourth, from a DVM:

But when we are reviewing applications for vet school we don't value ER experience over GP experience.

I suspect all those 'candid' conversations you say you've had were like a lot of conversations where you go in and ask somebody if X will help you get into vet school and they nod and say "Yeah, yeah, that looks really good!"

The bottom line is that you want quality experience with you as closely involved in the process as can be. The more client communication you're involved with the better. Whether that's working routine preg checks with a dairy practitioner or tracking ER cases in a referral clinic isn't really relevant to the applications process.

I'm way out in "guessing" territory, but my bet is that being able to say that you've been involved in client communication is going to trump just about anything.

 

[tromboneplayer1]

I'm also interested in Emergency/Critical Care. I'm not sure how accessible NYC is to you, given the fact that you live near the Boston area, but you may want to take a look at this: http://www.amcny.org/veterinary-com...e-veterinary-student-summer-volunteer-program. That's an actual pre-vet summer internship program at Animal Medical Center, which is one of the leading veterinary teaching hospitals in the country. Not sure if you'd still be looking to get experience next summer, but this internship is definitely worth looking into! I start it on June 10th, so feel free to PM me if you have any questions!

 

[that redhead]

You may want to ask for a shadowing opportunity instead of volunteering/internship opportunities. You may get different results. Especially in ER where things are very fast paced and often are life/death, clinics may be reluctant to take on a volunteer. But they may not be opposed to someone observing. And definitely go in person and ask to speak to a vet/someone in charge vs. calling/emailing. You often have better luck that way 🙂 Don't be too pushy about being hands on at first. If you show yourself to be curious, conscientious, and responsible, a position may present itself later on. Good luck 🙂

👍 My advice exactly 🙂

 

[PippyPony]

Since you're in MA, have you checked out the Adventures in Veterinary Medicine program at Tufts? It's only a week, but I still found it to be really valuable (and super fun!!). You spend 3 full mornings doing rotations in areas of your choosing -- I picked the ER/ICU for one of my options because I wanted a glimpse of the ER environment.

So, not an internship by any means, but still a great chance to talk with some ER vets and see them in action!

Someone from the school/one of their hospitals might also be able to give you some suggestions of referring ER clinics in the MA area that take on interns.