Volunteering Abroad- A Necessity?

[altitude]

Is having volunteer experience abroad (e.g. in a 2nd or 3rd world country) a big boost to a CV? Would some even consider it almost a necessity?

If yes, would it be preferred for it to be health related (e.g. teaching first aid, working in a clinic, ...) or non-health related (e.g. conservation project, teaching English, working in an orphanage, ...) or does it not matter?

What are your experiences?

(Taking MCATs this summer but also strongly considering going on a 2-3 week volunteer trip abroad pre-MCAT studying or post-MCAT)

Let me know what you think. Thanks

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[sliceofbread136]

Far from it, adcoms don't really care.

 

[EnergyDrink]

Most people who volunteer abroad don't actually accomplish anything. True volunteering isn't about a night at a soup kitchen. It takes years to actually make a difference. Adcoms know this.

 

[candav]

I wouldn't consider it a huge boost, but contrary to what many people on these forums seem to think, it can be a very personally valuable experience. I also think it matters how connected an international experience is to the rest of your application; though not significant in isolation, it might be more impressive if it inspires further interests and involvements in global health and development.

 

[V5RED]

That would really screw over people who can barely afford going to school in this country, let alone laying down a couple grand to go to a 3rd world country to pad their resume.

 

[pkwraith]

Let's see. A short term project in a country in which one has little cultural understanding, poor communication link, no applicable medical skills, occasionally performing unlicensed and unqualified work.

Of course, you'll end up with a powerful personal and emotional epiphany after the expensive investment, an epiphany that most people can get locally, while being much cheaper with better impact and less damages.

 

[Stumpyman]

IMO, Volunteering abroad isn't nearly as impressive to adcoms as people think it is. You also don't make much of a difference (but I guess at least it's something). However, I do think that one can personally benefit a lot from the experience.

 

[romanjetfighter]

do it 😀

 

[ghostman]

Is having volunteer experience abroad (e.g. in a 2nd or 3rd world country) a big boost to a CV? Would some even consider it almost a necessity?

No and no. Having meaningful volunteer healthcare experience anywhere will be a big boost to your CV. The key here is "meaningful." Whether that's in a 3rd world country or your local neighborhood clinic doesn't really matter.

I did not do any abroad experience. I volunteered at my local hospitals and had long-term volunteer experience as a tutor. I have been accepted to med schools.

 

[tantacles]

Is having volunteer experience abroad (e.g. in a 2nd or 3rd world country) a big boost to a CV? Would some even consider it almost a necessity?

No and no. Having meaningful volunteer healthcare experience anywhere will be a big boost to your CV. The key here is "meaningful." Whether that's in a 3rd world country or your local neighborhood clinic doesn't really matter.

I did not do any abroad experience. I volunteered at my local hospitals and had long-term volunteer experience as a tutor. I have been accepted to med schools.

Agreed. Meaning that if you're passionate about going to another country to volunteer (perhaps the AIDS crisis in Africa fascinates you, illness-stricken countries with lepers. And leopards.), go for it. Admissions committees will probably look on it positively not because it's international, but because it's volunteering.

That being said, the longer term your volunteering, the more opportunity you have to build relationships and make change. Those kinds of experiences tend to be found more readily in local opportunities. Many people have used experiences from their local volunteering as springboards to their personal statements, so really, they both have value.

 

[dwdrums2112]

do it, but pick a good place

i did and i grew and matured exponentially. it's a personal experience and you'll meet great people from all over the world. i volunteered at peak times in asia for 10 weeks, lived there for 3 months, and it was life changing.

any of these punks on here ever haul tons (literally) of rice from the patties to a warehouse in 50 celsius? or get drugged at 3am and robbed of all your money? climb huge trees to pick fruit for hungry orphans? or rent a motorbike and explore the countryside (in bum****ing egypt) for a week, far from any tourist or big city, seeing billions of stars above you at night? then crash and get injured so badly you can't walk for two weeks and 4 hospitals deny you care since you're not a citizen? chances are, no. chances are, most volunteering in USA will be you in a fluorescent-lit room with filtered HVAC system folding sheets trying to curry favor with nurses, who, while they appreciate your help, don't need you desperately.

many places where i worked needed me badly. e.g. there was ONE person to do acres of farmland, out of 20-30 international volunteers, no one wanted to farm land (it's exhausting), so i helped her out. i also helped plan and implement systems i found in use in european hostels to reduce their use of food/water/soap/etc.

i expect if you find a good place in a 3rd world country you'll be needed, too.

worked for a startup NGO and became friends with the president's friend's son. he had a mercedes, audi, 2-3 porches, a bmw, and 4 chaffeurs and took me everywhere. 😀

plus, many start up NGOs need talent and people who speak english. they'll value your time.

i don't know whether you'll have a great time, but i did. it was really fun.

rambling again, but to everyone who says "meh, not impressive." the point is to not impress adcoms. to impress them, intern or do research with a university with a big fancy name like stanford.

but to grow personally and embark on a journey, open your eyes and see the world.

so many people here are into rankings ("oh hai i go to a top 25!" i don't care? 25, 35, 50, does it make a big difference?) and other prestige crap ("im part of an honor society!!" that's cool, but... so?) to impress adcoms, and i have no problem with that. but life is more than a number on a ranked list. life is more than posturing. it's about DOING what you are passionate about. have fun, go volunteer somewhere if you have the time and money. it might not look super great on the resume, but it's a personal journey no one else will quite understand unless they go through it themselves.

Thanks for the read and post, that was great.

 

[1TB4RKSB4CK]

no

 

[dreamweaver1988]

do it, but pick a good place

i did and i grew and matured exponentially. it's a personal experience and you'll meet great people from all over the world. i volunteered at peak times in asia for 10 weeks, lived there for 3 months, and it was life changing.

any of these punks on here ever haul tons (literally) of rice from the patties to a warehouse in 50 celsius? or get drugged at 3am and robbed of all your money? climb huge trees to pick fruit for hungry orphans? or rent a motorbike and explore the countryside (in bum****ing egypt) for a week, far from any tourist or big city, seeing billions of stars above you at night? then crash and get injured so badly you can't walk for two weeks and 4 hospitals deny you care since you're not a citizen? chances are, no. chances are, most volunteering in USA will be you in a fluorescent-lit room with filtered HVAC system folding sheets trying to curry favor with nurses, who, while they appreciate your help, don't need you desperately.

many places where i worked needed me badly. e.g. there was ONE person to do acres of farmland, out of 20-30 international volunteers, no one wanted to farm land (it's exhausting), so i helped her out. i also helped plan and implement systems i found in use in european hostels to reduce their use of food/water/soap/etc.

i expect if you find a good place in a 3rd world country you'll be needed, too.

worked for a startup NGO and became friends with the president's friend's son. he had a mercedes, audi, 2-3 porches, a bmw, and 4 chaffeurs and took me everywhere. 😀

plus, many start up NGOs need talent and people who speak english. they'll value your time.

i don't know whether you'll have a great time, but i did. it was really fun.

rambling again, but to everyone who says "meh, not impressive." the point is to not impress adcoms. to impress them, intern or do research with a university with a big fancy name like stanford.

but to grow personally and embark on a journey, open your eyes and see the world.

so many people here are into rankings ("oh hai i go to a top 25!" i don't care? 25, 35, 50, does it make a big difference?) and other prestige crap ("im part of an honor society!!" that's cool, but... so?) to impress adcoms, and i have no problem with that. but life is more than a number on a ranked list. life is more than posturing. it's about DOING what you are passionate about. have fun, go volunteer somewhere if you have the time and money. it might not look super great on the resume, but it's a personal journey no one else will quite understand unless they go through it themselves.

Name calling? C'mon, now.

All in all, seems like an incredibly atypical experience.

And, nice to know that money is being well used - for luxury cars.

 

[romanjetfighter]

i was just kidding i didnt really mean it sorry it came across a lot nicer in my head 😛


for anyone interested...
not to endorse anyone here, but go to IVHQ's facebook page and go to group discussions, then find where the people did their placements and talk directly with the NGO in the country, skipping IVHQ which is a costly middleman.

 

[Nymphicus]

Is having volunteer experience abroad (e.g. in a 2nd or 3rd world country) a big boost to a CV? Would some even consider it almost a necessity?

If yes, would it be preferred for it to be health related (e.g. teaching first aid, working in a clinic, ...) or non-health related (e.g. conservation project, teaching English, working in an orphanage, ...) or does it not matter?

What are your experiences?

(Taking MCATs this summer but also strongly considering going on a 2-3 week volunteer trip abroad pre-MCAT studying or post-MCAT)

Let me know what you think. Thanks

Not really. No.

 

[Law2Doc]

Is having volunteer experience abroad (e.g. in a 2nd or 3rd world country) a big boost to a CV? Would some even consider it almost a necessity?

If yes, would it be preferred for it to be health related (e.g. teaching first aid, working in a clinic, ...) or non-health related (e.g. conservation project, teaching English, working in an orphanage, ...) or does it not matter?

What are your experiences?

(Taking MCATs this summer but also strongly considering going on a 2-3 week volunteer trip abroad pre-MCAT studying or post-MCAT)

Let me know what you think. Thanks

I've been told it sometimes rubs folks the wrong way, both because it highlights a background of financial privilege ( not a selling point to adcoms), and because there are so many people in need in the US. That being said, the folks i have known who have done a stint in the Peace Corps frequently do well with adcoms.

 

[sector9]

Volunteering abroad is NOT a necessity for any medical school. In fact, some medical school adcomms have said they are wary of participation (I believe UMich posted on their Twitter about students doing unethical stuff abroad on these trips)

 

[notbobtrustme]

Is having volunteer experience abroad (e.g. in a 2nd or 3rd world country) a big boost to a CV? Would some even consider it almost a necessity?

What do you think 2nd and 3rd world means?

1st, 2nd and 3rd world refers to the axis of powers during the Cold War. You had the West, the Eastern Bloc and then countries that weren't affiliated with either (3rd). It has nothing to do with living standards, although it is highly correlated. So volunteering at a 2nd world country would entail going to Russia or some other former Soviet Union territory.

 

[dwdrums2112]

Are you sure about that statement?

 

[phltz]

What do you think 2nd and 3rd world means?

1st, 2nd and 3rd world refers to the axis of powers during the Cold War. You had the West, the Eastern Bloc and then countries that weren't affiliated with either (3rd). It has nothing to do with living standards, although it is highly correlated. So volunteering at a 2nd world country would entail going to Russia or some other former Soviet Union territory.

Worse than that. The second world are the communist totalitarian states and their vassal states. Russia and China aren't even second world countries anymore. Who's left? North Korea, I guess. Maybe Cuba. I think that's about it.

OP, please, please, please don't go "volunteer" in North Korea. Whatever benefit you think it might bring to your application, it can't possibly be worth it.

In terms of international volunteering in a third world country, be honest with yourself and your goals. Are you there to "do good"? As unskilled labor, in a short trip, you'll do little, if any good. If you _do_ have specific hard skills that are in short supply in that country, (perhaps you're an experienced trainer of wastewater management techniques, an accomplished surgeon, or a veteral financial advisor to aspiring small businessmen), a short trip could be productive and worthwhile. A short trip might also be worthwhile if it's part of a well organized group that will follow up one what you do (perhaps you're scouting out locations that might benefit from reforestation training). Otherwise, anything on the scale of two weeks is likely to be useless.

If you really want to go abroad and do something helpful, but lack specific hard skills and are not part of an organization that can follow up on your work, consider the Peace Corps. Two years is enough time that _most_ Peace Corps volunteers find they're able to do something worthwhile. If you talk to a bunch of former volunteers, I think most will tell you that after their 10 week intensive training program they felt ready to get going and do something, but that it wasn't until their second year that they started to be really effective. It just takes a lot of time to figure out the lay of the land, the actual needs in the community, the power structures and habits that will help or stymie you, to build the person contacts, develop the language and cultural skills, and to actually recognize what you can do to help and how to make it happen. Honestly, even a year long experience is going to be considerably less useful than a two year stint.

If your goal is to get out into the world and experience something outside of America, bravo. It'd be great if more Americans got to travel abroad. You can find language/cultural training programs in a lot of countries that put you in a homestay family and do immersion language training. These can be very valuable experiences. Just don't expect that you'll do much in the way of giving back to the community you're in, other than that you'll be paying a teacher's wages and helping out a family with their expenses.

If your goal is just to pad out your resume for your application, please consider doing something closer to home. If by some magical set of circumstances, you live in a charmed community where no one needs anything you have to offer, there are surely nearby communities where you can volunteer at a hospice, mentor schoolchildren, or find some other way to give back. You'll be more effective and waste less of everyone else's time, energy, and money that way too.

 

[LizzyM]

Want to know what impressed the adcom at my place this week? Someone who volunteered in a US city for the summer because he saw a need in his own back yard (metaphorically speaking) and didn't feel the need to fly somewhere exotic to serve people in need.

If you are going to go abroad for a year or more with the Peace Corps or the military, it is a different beast than short-term trips.

 

[IntoTheWest]

While volunteering abroad can be great experience and can be an interesting thing to write about on secondaries or talk about in interviews in my opinion it was not worth the thousands of dollars. In my experience, these types of abroad opportunities are often grossly exaggerated, I didn't end up doing half the things they told us we were going to able to do. There are far more cheaper and worthwhile volunteering experiences closer to home.

 

[DocGodfather]

I think it's more important to volunteer in the community you've been living in more then anything else. I've taught English abroad for free, but all my other volunteering has been done in the States.

 

[alexrgross]

2-3 weeks is too short. Ultimately @ interviews, adcoms get impressed by YOU not what types of activities pad your primary.

 

[AF2Doc]

I only served in Afghanistan for six months... will my experience be thrown in with the "short-term trips?"

Want to know what impressed the adcom at my place this week? Someone who volunteered in a US city for the summer because he saw a need in his own back yard (metaphorically speaking) and didn't feel the need to fly somewhere exotic to serve people in need.

If you are going to go abroad for a year or more with the Peace Corps or the military, it is a different beast than short-term trips.

 

[typicalindian]

Is your own community a perfect place where volunteers aren't needed? Going abroad to volunteer doesn't mean much in my opinion other than the fact that you want a vacation without it being one. Find a place to help out your own community and stick with it.

 

[BurntFlower]

I have a question that is sort of relevant to this. I have done volunteering abroad, but it's not like I had limited understanding of the culture and the language because I have lived there for ten years and wanted to contribute to my community (and my family and friends still live there). How would Adcoms see this?

 

[robertch8]

I've done both international volunteering and long term AmeriCorps volunteering locally. When I did international volunteering, I think I benefited from more from it on the level that I got to see first hand what a third world country is like and some of the things and mannerisms that the citizens there have. It was more of an observational experience than anything and while very beneficial and actually helpful, I kind of felt like I was an extra hand that probably wasn't needed on the service project.

But as an AmeriCorps member, I actually felt a lot more like I made a real difference during my time. I had to fill a gap in the primary care clinic signing up uninsured patients for medications and so being there and providing that outlet for patients was a huge boost and something that was far more substantial than traveling abroad; I knew that missing a day would hurt the clinic and the patients trying to get their paperwork set up. It wasn't a visually eye opening experience like going to Latin America but it felt a lot more substantial and emotional and I felt like I could put a pulse to the problems that are being discussed across our country.

I think you can get a lot out of both experiences but I really do believe that you can get more out of volunteering locally because adcoms don't necessarily care about what you do but more what you get out of it and how you articulate those emotions to your passion for medicine; I definitely developed much more substantial sentiments and feelings serving locally over volunteering overseas. I put those emotions and feelings onto paper in my PS and I think it helped me a ton this year admissions cycle wise.

 

[gettheleadout]

I truly wonder where the idea that this could be a necessity comes from...

 

[canadian18]

Is having volunteer experience abroad (e.g. in a 2nd or 3rd world country) a big boost to a CV?

Not if you're doing it for the sake of boosting your CV

Do it if you want to. Don't do it if you don't want to.

 

[DCBFan]

No. Not at all. It can look good or bad depending on many things. As many have pointed out it can smack of privilege or arrogance depending on how it's presented. I really feel like there's a reactionary trend against pre-med overseas volunteering, precisely because it's gotten to the point where people can ask in all seriousness (assuming not troll) if it's a prerequisite. However, adcoms DO like to see that you've experienced cultures other than your own. This of course can be accomplished by both overseas and domestic volunteering, travel, study abroad, etc.

I volunteered abroad for a year, and I don't think it really helped my app. However, I'm very glad I went because I didn't go to help my application.

So what I would do is ask yourself-- assuming your experiences will not help your application any more than comparable stateside volunteering and will almost certainly cost more-- do you want to do it still? If so, go right ahead.

 

[LizzyM]

I only served in Afghanistan for six months... will my experience be thrown in with the "short-term trips?"

Ah, no.

 

[sibitrum]

Take the money you would spend traveling to one of these places for two weeks and donate it to one of the charities recommended by givewell.org. Anything else is just mental masturbation.

 

[Tsiana]

I say do it if you're genuinely curious about the experience, but don't expect it to revolutionize your app. I shadowed for just 3 days in China out of curiosity - I'd no idea we could even include shadowing on our AMCAS, although I eventually just grouped that in with other shadowing experience. Didn't make a big deal about it in any way, but once in a while I would bring it up in an interview and, really, who wouldn't be interested in talking about experiences abroad?

If you can personally gain something from the experience, then do it.

 

[AllDaWEI]

I truly wonder where the idea that this could be a necessity comes from...

It must be in the water.

 

[gettheleadout]

I say do it if you're genuinely curious about the experience, but don't expect it to revolutionize your app. I shadowed for just 3 days in China out of curiosity - I'd no idea we could even include shadowing on our AMCAS, although I eventually just grouped that in with other shadowing experience. Didn't make a big deal about it in any way, but once in a while I would bring it up in an interview and, really, who wouldn't be interested in talking about experiences abroad?

If you can personally gain something from the experience, then do it.

This is the first time I've seen you or a post of yours, but is it bad that I knew who you would be from your name + avatar even before I saw the link in your signature?

Nice to see an MDApps from chronicidal's other half. 🙂

Congrats to both of you on your success!

 

[AF2Doc]

Glad to hear in spite of your earlier post.

Ah, no.

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[AF2Doc]

What's the benefit of doing that for the med school applicant?

Take the money you would spend traveling to one of these places for two weeks and donate it to one of the charities recommended by givewell.org. Anything else is just mental masturbation.

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[AF2Doc]

Three very well-reasoned posts. Simply doing a volunteer activity (stateside or abroad) isn't likely to boost your admissions chances. You'll need to demonstrate impact in some way (i.e you provided a needed service or the experience solidified your decision to pursue medicine). If you want to go abroad and help those in need, then by all means do so. Just realize it's not going to be a golden ticket to med school. But, if you can articulate the positive aspects of the experience and demonstrate impact, then the trip abroad could help you.

Not if you're doing it for the sake of boosting your CV

Do it if you want to. Don't do it if you don't want to.

No. Not at all. It can look good or bad depending on many things. As many have pointed out it can smack of privilege or arrogance depending on how it's presented. I really feel like there's a reactionary trend against pre-med overseas volunteering, precisely because it's gotten to the point where people can ask in all seriousness (assuming not troll) if it's a prerequisite. However, adcoms DO like to see that you've experienced cultures other than your own. This of course can be accomplished by both overseas and domestic volunteering, travel, study abroad, etc.

I volunteered abroad for a year, and I don't think it really helped my app. However, I'm very glad I went because I didn't go to help my application.

So what I would do is ask yourself-- assuming your experiences will not help your application any more than comparable stateside volunteering and will almost certainly cost more-- do you want to do it still? If so, go right ahead.

I say do it if you're genuinely curious about the experience, but don't expect it to revolutionize your app. I shadowed for just 3 days in China out of curiosity - I'd no idea we could even include shadowing on our AMCAS, although I eventually just grouped that in with other shadowing experience. Didn't make a big deal about it in any way, but once in a while I would bring it up in an interview and, really, who wouldn't be interested in talking about experiences abroad?

If you can personally gain something from the experience, then do it.

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[lgirl60]

I didn't read all of the other replies, but I do recall reading on University of Michigan Medical School's Twitter a tweet that said (I'm paraphrasing here): Those of you that go abroad for a short amount of time for volunteering projects, I'm not a big fan of you. I'd rather you do something more meaningful in your own community.

 

[Ub3rmensch]

I was recently accepted to a volunteer program abroad, to Ghana. Would it be wise to follow up with that program (1 month), or volunteer at a local hospital and take up a job?

 

[DCBFan]

The only reason I would take the Ghana trip is if you really want to go there. It's unlikely to be of greater help than domestic volunteering, application-wise.

 

[notbobtrustme]

What's the point of volunteering overseas when you'll be practicing in the US?

Think about that for a minute.

 

[North12]

What's the point of volunteering overseas when you'll be practicing in the US?

Think about that for a minute.

Hopefully the people who have volunteered overseas are the ones who want to make service trips part of their careers. That is why I went, and I plan to practice with a service organization for a couple months every 3 years (after I pay off that debt!)

 

[Ub3rmensch]

What's the point of volunteering overseas when you'll be practicing in the US?

Think about that for a minute.

Because people need help overseas as well. Also, I would like to continue overseas volunteering if I do end up becoming an attending. Hopefully with organizations such as MSF.

 

[AF2Doc]

What's the point of volunteering overseas when you'll be practicing in the US?

Think about that for a minute.

Because even in America, it's doubtful you will only treat Americans. If you're practicing in a major metropolitan area, you will likely be treating patients from very different cultures whose unique views on medicine may need to be accounted for. Experiencing different cultures firsthand is one way to develop a broader perspective to help you overcome any cultural differences you may encounter while practicing.

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[AF2Doc]

I didn't read all of the other replies, but I do recall reading on University of Michigan Medical School's Twitter a tweet that said (I'm paraphrasing here): Those of you that go abroad for a short amount of time for volunteering projects, I'm not a big fan of you. I'd rather you do something more meaningful in your own community.

Do you have a link you can provide?

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[anegron519]

.

 

[anegron519]

.

 

[AF2Doc]

If this was really said, thats kind of discusting. I volunteered with orphanages in China that have a 45% mortality rate due to bad conditions. I was in China for 3 years but only did this the last year because my Mandarin was more than good enough at that point. I was one of 2 Americans who helped set up cardio surgeons from America to go out to these orphanages, teach the doctors the proper surgical techniques to help with a large amount of heart issues these poor kids had. There are now over 130 cardiac surgeries being performed every week on these children in the orphanages. My other friend is getting her PhD there so she stayed behind and still helps run this whole thing. How can one possibly not be a fan of helping/saving lives in whatever way they can?

And the University of Michigan has a international clinic in Hangzhou, China and sends out Physicians and Med students on 2 week to 2 month rotations. Hypocrisy anyone?

Here's the exact quote from Twitter (dated 18 June 2011 #UMichMedAdmiss):

"Pre-meds going abroad for brief clinical opportunities-I'm not a fan...rather you found sustained, meaningful work in your own community."

My question is: is going abroad for a short-term volunteering opportunity and finding sustained, meaningful in your community mutually exclusive? I can certainly find fault in the applicant who volunteers abroad for a month in Africa for the sole attempt to compensate for a lack of volunteering experience at home. But what about the applicant who uses volunteer abroad opportunities to complement their volunteer experiences at home in order to gain more international exposure? After all, in its guidelines to the pre-med students volunteering abroad, the AAMC states:

"Acquiring exposure to a variety of health-related clinical settings is a vital part of premedical and medical student preparation."

"Also, be mindful that while appropriate experience in other countries can be valuable and may be viewed as complementary, if you plan to practice in the U.S, it is particularly important to understand U.S. healthcare."