WAMC? High GPA/Low Experience Hours

[Dana_May_B]

Hello! I am currently a sophomore in college and I am on track to graduate a year early (spring 2021) so I am applying to vet school this summer. I have two advisors giving me different opinions on my chances at certain vet schools, one says I need to apply to 9 different vet schools because my chances of getting in anywhere are extremely low, while the other says that I'll get into every school on my current list of 6 that I want to apply to. So I figured it would be worth a shot to post my stats in here and see what you guys think! I want to become an avian vet and I'm hoping to work specifically in poultry. I am an avian biology major.

Schools I want to apply to: UPenn (my instate school), UGA, Cornell, LIU, NCSU, and Ohio State. My second advisor wants me to add Auburn, Wisconsin, Iowa and potentially even Tennessee to the list.

GPA: 3.87
Science GPA: 3.4
Last 45 GPA: 3.82

I haven't taken the GRE yet since the coronavirus crisis cancelled my testing date.

Vet Experiences:
SA Internship: 27 hrs
Worked at a SA/Exotic clinic: 390 hrs
Volunteered at a SA clinic: 48 hrs

I have a 150+ hour poultry vet internship set up for the summer so I'm hoping that doesn't get cancelled due to the virus. I also applied to a 4-week wildlife vet internship but that's up in the air right now.

Animal Experiences:
Worked at a dog/cat boarding facility: 480 hrs.
Volunteered at a farm animal rescue: 20 hrs.
Preformed multiple surgeries on live chickens as part of my avian biology bachelor's degree program

I've also done two short animal science research shadowing experiences for a couple hours each.

Honors/Awards:
I am a member of the honors program at UGA
I am a "classic scholars" merit scholarship recipient at UGA
I have received merit scholarships from my department and my overall college every year of undergrad
I have made the dean's list every semester
I was conditionally accepted to the UGA Food Animal Veterinary Incentive Program. This program would normally guarantee acceptance to the UGA vet school, but the condition is that I establish residency in GA, since I'm a PA resident. Unfortunately, I've been working with the Office of the Registrar and they've made it pretty clear that no matter what I do, they most likely won't accept me as a GA resident, even if I take a gap year and live in the state of GA while not attending college.

I know my biggest weakness is my lack of vet experience, but I've had to work every semester to pay for college, because my dad left my mom, my sister and I back when I was in middle school and my mom can't afford to contribute to the cost of my college education at all. Last summer I worked 2 jobs, one full time and one part time, for a total of 56 hours a week so I could save up for rent and tuition. I just didn't have time to shadow a vet for free. I hope the admissions committee will understand that I've done the absolute best I can to get experience while also working and keeping my GPA up. Also, since I'm graduating a year early, I've only had 4 semesters of undergrad before I submit my application, so that has contributed to my lack of hours as well.

Please let me know what you guys think! I really need some honesty right now because applying to vet school is expensive and I don't wanna waste money applying to 9 schools if I really don't need to.

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[asch97]

Hi! So your gpa is really good! Especially your last 45. Just off the bat, maybe center your application to those schools that focus on last 45 heavily. Even though your academics is top par, you’re going to be competing with applicants who have an average of 800+ hours if not more. My gpa was about a 3.5 all around, but I had about 4K hours of small animal/exotics as a vet assistant, 200 hours of wildlife via an internship, about 150 hours of large animal/equine also with a vet for example. In my opinion, I think you should honesty adjust the schools you’re applying to. For example, North Carolina and Georgia (even though you go there) accept very little oos. Instead, again you should apply to schools that focus heavy on your last 45 like Davis for example. There is a spot on the application that you could use to explain why you have a lack of experience, but again you’re going to be competing with applicants with the same gpa but a lot of experience and those with a lower gpa but at least 2x the experience as you and they might get in over you still. Getting into Vet school is a gamble and sometimes it seems like a game of crapshoot, but you do have a decent chance of getting in, the only thing holding you back is you experience!

 

[supershorty]

Your academic stats are good - I think it would be prudent to apply to some of the programs that emphasize last 45 credits, since yours are quite good (Minnesota and Kansas both emphasize that, there are others too but those are the ones that come to me off the top of my head). Is there an online substitute for the GRE being offered? You'll have more options if you are able to take it somehow.

If you don't want to waste money, given that you have a relatively competitive application, I would drop LIU from your list. Incredibly expensive program that doesn't have a teaching hospital and has never graduated a class - we're in a period of economic uncertainty and I think going to a new school is an unnecessary risk. I feel like a broken record saying this, but I really hope that potential applicants think long and hard about it.

 

[Dana_May_B]

Your academic stats are good - I think it would be prudent to apply to some of the programs that emphasize last 45 credits, since yours are quite good (Minnesota and Kansas both emphasize that, there are others too but those are the ones that come to me off the top of my head). Is there an online substitute for the GRE being offered? You'll have more options if you are able to take it somehow.

If you don't want to waste money, given that you have a relatively competitive application, I would drop LIU from your list. Incredibly expensive program that doesn't have a teaching hospital and has never graduated a class - we're in a period of economic uncertainty and I think going to a new school is an unnecessary risk. I feel like a broken record saying this, but I really hope that potential applicants think long and hard about it.

Thanks so much for the reply! I will definitely look into Minnesota and Kansas and make sure the colleges I'm already thinking about applying to will prioritize GPA. I definitely understand what youre saying about LIU, but I guess I've just seen that as a "safety" school since I figured they would have a higher acceptance rate as a new vet school than the more established ones. But what you're saying is very valid and I will definitely rethink applying there.

 

[Dana_May_B]

For example, North Carolina and Georgia (even though you go there) accept very little oos. Instead, again you should apply to schools that focus heavy on your last 45 like Davis for example. There is a spot on the application that you could use to explain why you have a lack of experience, but again you’re going to be competing with applicants with the same gpa but a lot of experience and those with a lower gpa but at least 2x the experience as you and they might get in over you still.

Thanks for replying! I will definitely take this into consideration. Maybe it would be best for me to apply to a few schools this year and then reapply next cycle if I don't get in, allowing me to gain some more experience before my next attempt. I will look into which schools take more oos applicants and maybe knock NCSU off my list of schools I'm applying to!

 

[als52698]

Don’t let the lack of vet hours get you down. I had about 550 when I applied between an equine vet, exotic, small animal and emergency vet. I was accepted into 4 schools including one on your list!
I would definitely recommend applying to where you could see yourself attending, and maybe one “safety” school. Don’t apply to too many as that’s a big financial commitment.

 

[Georgethecat]

I was conditionally accepted to the UGA Food Animal Veterinary Incentive Program. This program would normally guarantee acceptance to the UGA vet school, but the condition is that I establish residency in GA, since I'm a PA resident. Unfortunately, I've been working with the Office of the Registrar and they've made it pretty clear that no matter what I do, they most likely won't accept me as a GA resident, even if I take a gap year and live in the state of GA while not attending college.

My understanding regarding that program was that you had to be considered an IS student when you applied for the program during undergrad.

Your stats are very good. Be aware that UGA only considers their science/math pre-req's in the science gpa calculations. Do well on the GRE and you've got a good shot at UGA. For the 2020/2021 application cycle, you are considered OOS for UGA. Since you are graduating a year early, have you considered staying in Georgia after graduation? Get a job, switch your drivers license to GA, register to vote etc and then you would qualify as IS for the 2021/2022 application cycle. I have friends who are current vet students who have gone this route. This would give you more time to get more vet hours and take the GRE. Also a chance to save up a little money before vet school starts and save a TON of money on tuition. Unless you are very lucky and get a big scholarship at UPenn or get a coveted spot at NC State, cost of attendance is going to be a lot of money as compared with IS at UGA.

Check out the VIN map for a comparison on costs.

HOW MUCH WILL MY VETERINARY EDUCATION COST? - Vet School Bound

HOW MUCH WILL MY VETERINARY EDUCATION COST? New veterinarians with less educational debt have a head start on life, the VIN Foundation Cost of Education Map is here to help. A lighter debt burden translates into more financial, career, and personal flexibility. Wouldn’t it be great to pursue an...

vetschoolbound.org

Best of luck to you!

 

[Dana_May_B]

My understanding regarding that program was that you had to be considered an IS student when you applied for the program during undergrad.

Your stats are very good. Be aware that UGA only considers their science/math pre-req's in the science gpa calculations. Do well on the GRE and you've got a good shot at UGA. For the 2020/2021 application cycle, you are considered OOS for UGA. Since you are graduating a year early, have you considered staying in Georgia after graduation? Get a job, switch your drivers license to GA, register to vote etc and then you would qualify as IS for the 2021/2022 application cycle. I have friends who are current vet students who have gone this route. This would give you more time to get more vet hours and take the GRE. Also a chance to save up a little money before vet school starts and save a TON of money on tuition. Unless you are very lucky and get a big scholarship at UPenn or get a coveted spot at NC State, cost of attendance is going to be a lot of money as compared with IS at UGA.

Check out the VIN map for a comparison on costs.

HOW MUCH WILL MY VETERINARY EDUCATION COST? - Vet School Bound

HOW MUCH WILL MY VETERINARY EDUCATION COST? New veterinarians with less educational debt have a head start on life, the VIN Foundation Cost of Education Map is here to help. A lighter debt burden translates into more financial, career, and personal flexibility. Wouldn’t it be great to pursue an...

vetschoolbound.org

Best of luck to you!

Thanks for the response! The program is normally reserved for IS students, but I reached out and asked if I couple apply, because I was in the unique situation where I am graduating a year early. The FAVIP committee thought I could take a gap year and become a georgia resident, exactly how you described, and then be in-state by the time I matriculate to vet school. However, while both me and the committee assumed this would work, so I was allowed to apply, no one reached out to the Registrar's office to confirm. So when I was accepted on the condition that I take a gap year and become an instate student, I contacted the Registrar's office to see what I needed to do during my gap year to be classified as instate. They told me pretty bluntly that because I was out of state for undergrad at UGA, they would never ever ever consider me to be instate for vet school or grad school, even if I lived in georgia for like 20 years after getting my bachelor's degree. Apparently its some unwritten rule that they have. So that's why I'm in a bit of a pickle now. But thanks for the link, I will definitely use that to narrow down my list of schools I'm applying to!

 

[Georgethecat]

I highly recommend that you reach out to Parker at the vet school, because this just doesn't sound right. Might need to wait until staff is back on campus and an in person meeting might be more productive than email/phone.

I agree that for the upcoming cycle while you are still attending undergrad at UGA as an OOS student that you are considered OOS for vet school. But a gap year and above mentioned steps to prove you are independent etc and a tax paying resident of the state of Georgia should qualify you for the 2021/2022 cycle. It just seems ridiculous that going to UGA for undergrad permanently disqualifies you from ever establishing in state residency.

Granted the person I referenced did not go to UGA undergrad, but moved to Georgia in July 2016 and was able to apply as IS for the 2016/2017 cycle.

Another point to note is that you would need to NOT be claimed as a dependent on your mother's tax return likely starting in 2021 and not continue to take any classes during the gap year.

Copied and pasted from UGA vet med application website.

DVM Application Process - University of Georgia College of Veterinary Medicine

DVM Application Process University of Georgia College of Veterinary Medicine

vet.uga.edu

The following general descriptions are not inclusive, nor do they supersede existing regulations concerning in-state residency. This is only an explanatory guide for Georgia residency for tuition purposes. Detailed official guidelines are listed in both the UGA Bulletin and in the codes of the University System of Georgia.

For Georgia resident status, the three most important things to remember are:

• Students must first prove that they have established a primary domicile or permanent Georgia home at least 12 consecutive months immediately preceding the beginning of classes for the term to be considered for residency. Typically, the residency status of a dependent student is tied to the status of the parent(s), or in the case of divorce, the tax-dependent or majority support parent, so the parent(s) must show proof of domicile.
• Students and/or parent(s) of dependent students also should be able to provide documentation showing payment of Georgia state income tax, as this shows a tie to the state that proves financial support for the Georgia educational system. Mere property ownership in Georgia, by itself, is usually insufficient.
• The Office of Admissions also suggests that students be able to provide copies of any other documents showing their intent to be a Georgia resident, such as a Georgia driver’s license, car or voter registration, home ownership, full-time employment records, etc. Attending college in Georgia is not proof of intention to be a Georgia resident.

Since the University of Georgia is a state-supported institution, students must show documented proof of residency and the duration of their residency in order to qualify for in-state tuition.

In reviewing petitions for in-state residency, UGA CVM considers each student’s situation as unique, and so there are no universal formulas. In general, though, the three items mentioned previously are key. UGA CVM does understand that there are situations, such as parents living in separate states or a family in the military, that may alter the review process.

Special Situations Involving Residency Classification

The following descriptions should help in understanding what the our Office of Admissions considers when reviewing certain situations.

Dependent versus Independent Students

If a student is listed as a dependent on their parent’s/parents’ or legal guardian’s previous year’s tax returns or receives more than 50% of their financial support from a parent or guardian, they are considered a dependent student and UGA considers the student to be a resident, for tuition purposes, of the parent’s/parents’ or guardian’s state of residence. (A legal guardian must provide court and/or financial documentation of support for the student.)

An independent student who wishes to establish in-state tuition residency must document that his/her parent(s) have not claimed him/her as a tax dependent for the 12 months prior to the start of the term, and that he/she has provided 100% of his/her financial support as shown in federal and state tax returns. No student shall gain or acquire in-state classification while attending any post-secondary educational institution in this state without clear evidence of having established domicile in Georgia for purposes other than attending a post-secondary educational institution in this state.

Non-U.S. Citizens

Non-U.S. citizens are only eligible for in-state residency if they are lawful permanent residents as documented by the U.S. Immigration and Naturalization Service or have been granted a visa in an eligible category. F-1 student visas are not eligible. These students must still provide documentation of in-state residency for the 12-month period prior to the start of the term.

As stated before, all petitions for in-state residency are considered in their entirety, so every file must be reviewed based upon its own merit. In addition, this page is meant as a general guide about Georgia residency for tuition purposes, but does not supersede any existing policies for in-state residency found in the UGA Bulletin and in the codes of the University System of Georgia.

*Important Note: Once a student matriculates into the University of Georgia College of Veterinary Medicine, he/she cannot change his/her tuition classification to become a Georgia resident for tuition purposes.

 

[Dana_May_B]

I highly recommend that you reach out to Parker at the vet school, because this just doesn't sound right. Might need to wait until staff is back on campus and an in person meeting might be more productive than email/phone.

I agree that for the upcoming cycle while you are still attending undergrad at UGA as an OOS student that you are considered OOS for vet school. But a gap year and above mentioned steps to prove you are independent etc and a tax paying resident of the state of Georgia should qualify you for the 2021/2022 cycle. It just seems ridiculous that going to UGA for undergrad permanently disqualifies you from ever establishing in state residency.

Granted the person I referenced did not go to UGA undergrad, but moved to Georgia in July 2016 and was able to apply as IS for the 2016/2017 cycle.

Another point to note is that you would need to NOT be claimed as a dependent on your mother's tax return likely starting in 2021 and not continue to take any classes during the gap year.

Copied and pasted from UGA vet med application website.

DVM Application Process - University of Georgia College of Veterinary Medicine

DVM Application Process University of Georgia College of Veterinary Medicine

vet.uga.edu

The following general descriptions are not inclusive, nor do they supersede existing regulations concerning in-state residency. This is only an explanatory guide for Georgia residency for tuition purposes. Detailed official guidelines are listed in both the UGA Bulletin and in the codes of the University System of Georgia.

For Georgia resident status, the three most important things to remember are:

• Students must first prove that they have established a primary domicile or permanent Georgia home at least 12 consecutive months immediately preceding the beginning of classes for the term to be considered for residency. Typically, the residency status of a dependent student is tied to the status of the parent(s), or in the case of divorce, the tax-dependent or majority support parent, so the parent(s) must show proof of domicile.
• Students and/or parent(s) of dependent students also should be able to provide documentation showing payment of Georgia state income tax, as this shows a tie to the state that proves financial support for the Georgia educational system. Mere property ownership in Georgia, by itself, is usually insufficient.
• The Office of Admissions also suggests that students be able to provide copies of any other documents showing their intent to be a Georgia resident, such as a Georgia driver’s license, car or voter registration, home ownership, full-time employment records, etc. Attending college in Georgia is not proof of intention to be a Georgia resident.

Since the University of Georgia is a state-supported institution, students must show documented proof of residency and the duration of their residency in order to qualify for in-state tuition.

In reviewing petitions for in-state residency, UGA CVM considers each student’s situation as unique, and so there are no universal formulas. In general, though, the three items mentioned previously are key. UGA CVM does understand that there are situations, such as parents living in separate states or a family in the military, that may alter the review process.

Special Situations Involving Residency Classification

The following descriptions should help in understanding what the our Office of Admissions considers when reviewing certain situations.

Dependent versus Independent Students

If a student is listed as a dependent on their parent’s/parents’ or legal guardian’s previous year’s tax returns or receives more than 50% of their financial support from a parent or guardian, they are considered a dependent student and UGA considers the student to be a resident, for tuition purposes, of the parent’s/parents’ or guardian’s state of residence. (A legal guardian must provide court and/or financial documentation of support for the student.)

An independent student who wishes to establish in-state tuition residency must document that his/her parent(s) have not claimed him/her as a tax dependent for the 12 months prior to the start of the term, and that he/she has provided 100% of his/her financial support as shown in federal and state tax returns. No student shall gain or acquire in-state classification while attending any post-secondary educational institution in this state without clear evidence of having established domicile in Georgia for purposes other than attending a post-secondary educational institution in this state.

Non-U.S. Citizens

Non-U.S. citizens are only eligible for in-state residency if they are lawful permanent residents as documented by the U.S. Immigration and Naturalization Service or have been granted a visa in an eligible category. F-1 student visas are not eligible. These students must still provide documentation of in-state residency for the 12-month period prior to the start of the term.

As stated before, all petitions for in-state residency are considered in their entirety, so every file must be reviewed based upon its own merit. In addition, this page is meant as a general guide about Georgia residency for tuition purposes, but does not supersede any existing policies for in-state residency found in the UGA Bulletin and in the codes of the University System of Georgia.

*Important Note: Once a student matriculates into the University of Georgia College of Veterinary Medicine, he/she cannot change his/her tuition classification to become a Georgia resident for tuition purposes.

I have spoken countless times with Parker, the Assistant Dean of the College of Ag (who is in charge of the program), the Office of the Registrar, my faculty mentor in the FAVIP, and many many others to resolve this situation and unfortunately as an out of state undergrad at UGA, i wont be instate for vet school. I talked to the office of the registrar about not being claimed on my parent's taxes and even being independent will not change this situation. I've been trying to resolve this for a year, and its definitely been very frustrating. its just a case of where everyone kind of made an assumption that I would be good to go, but no one actually checked so now im kind of in limbo with this program. Regardless, im applying this cycle and my FAVIP acceptance would be for the 2021-2022 cycle, so I have another year to figure that out if i dont get accepted anywhere this cycle.

 

[Georgethecat]

I'm so sorry and think that is absolutely wrong!!! Best of luck to you!