What Are My Chances and Other General Questions

[Bibbed]

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MCAT: 35

GPA: 3.7


psyc major

C in freaking organic chemistry I and genchem I B in gen chem II B in gen bio I

A's in everything else ( including upper level psychology classes, genetics, organic II, microbio)



2 years research ( 1 yr at my school 1 yr at a medical school)

over 10 places of non medical volunteering

billions of medical related volunteering

Exposure with surgeons, GPs, DO's ....

STUPID GEN CHEM AND ORGANIC... screwed me over 😡

Those grades in your pre-med prereq's are definitely a concern, but it sounds like your other stuff is amazing (ECs and MCAT). I think you'll have some trouble getting into upper tier schools, but you should be fine for a good state school. Why did you get those C's? Any particular reason, because it seems like an anomaly?

 

[MedSchoolOrBust]

Just looking to see what everyone's general feelings are towards my prospects of getting into a med school. Here goes nothing:

MCAT Score: VR 10, PS 9, BS 12, Q
BCPM GPA: 3.23
Overall GPA: 3.36 (not the best but significant upward trend 3.7 for junior and senior year)

Here's my ECs

part of an international community service organization
2 years neurochemistry laboratory assistant researching effects of meth and MDMA on the dopaminergic system
2 semesters Statistics teaching assistant
Dean's List 4 semesters
Worked 3 part time jobs (~40hrs/week) throughout college

Post-college:
Physician shadowing with a neurologist attending who specializes in movement disorders - both in-patient rounds and outpatient clinic.
Post-Anesthesia Care Unit Volunteer (Apr07 to present)
Worked as a research assistant looking to identify biomarkers of Multiple Sclerosis for a year after college.
Currently an associate scientist for a major Biotech company working on various drugs on cancer, rheumatoid arthritis, neuropathic pain and neuroregeneration.

Graduated in '06. Took my MCAT in Jan '07. Decided to wait til the '09 Cycle

Here are the schools I'm possibly looking at

Albert Einstein of Yeshiva University
Boston University
Cornell University
George Washington University
Georgetown University
Jefferson Medical College
Loyola University Chicago
Mount Sinai School of Medicine
Northwestern University
Saint Louis University
Stanford University
Temple University
Tufts University
Tulane University
University of Colorado
University of Nevada
University of Southern California

 

[c3c4cam]

Honestly, I think you will get in this cycle with your stats. your mcat is above average and your gpa is above average. Don't even worry about the C in o-chem/gen chem. By the time you finish your degree you have over 40 courses and 2-4 courses don't even make a difference, especially if you have a nice GPA of 3.7.

MCAT: 35

GPA: 3.7


psyc major

C in freaking organic chemistry I and genchem I B in gen chem II B in gen bio I

A's in everything else ( including upper level psychology classes, genetics, organic II, microbio)



2 years research ( 1 yr at my school 1 yr at a medical school)

over 10 places of non medical volunteering

billions of medical related volunteering

Exposure with surgeons, GPs, DO's ....

STUPID GEN CHEM AND ORGANIC... screwed me over 😡

 

[ChubbyChaser]

Just looking to see what everyone's general feelings are towards my prospects of getting into a med school. Here goes nothing:

MCAT Score: VR 10, PS 9, BS 12, Q
BCPM GPA: 3.23
Overall GPA: 3.36 (not the best but significant upward trend 3.7 for junior and senior year)

Here's my ECs

part of an international community service organization
2 years neurochemistry laboratory assistant researching effects of meth and MDMA on the dopaminergic system
2 semesters Statistics teaching assistant
Dean's List 4 semesters
Worked 3 part time jobs (~40hrs/week) throughout college

Post-college:
Physician shadowing with a neurologist attending who specializes in movement disorders - both in-patient rounds and outpatient clinic.
Post-Anesthesia Care Unit Volunteer (Apr07 to present)
Worked as a research assistant looking to identify biomarkers of Multiple Sclerosis for a year after college.
Currently an associate scientist for a major Biotech company working on various drugs on cancer, rheumatoid arthritis, neuropathic pain and neuroregeneration.

Graduated in '06. Took my MCAT in Jan '07. Decided to wait til the '09 Cycle

Here are the schools I'm possibly looking at

Albert Einstein of Yeshiva University
Boston University
Cornell University
George Washington University
Georgetown University
Jefferson Medical College
Loyola University Chicago
Mount Sinai School of Medicine
Northwestern University
Saint Louis University
Stanford University
Temple University
Tufts University
Tulane University
University of Colorado
University of Nevada
University of Southern California

HOnestly...I dont like your chances.. Your GPA is just too low and your MCAT doesnt make up for it either. Consider DO schools.

 

[adamber]

I'm having a hard time deciding whether or not to apply this year. I think I have a decent shot (according to my advisors) as far as an application goes, but I will only be 20 when June rolls around, and don't turn 21 until Nov. I think I would probably be a better applicant in a year (higher gpa, more time to take the mcat, better lor's, and not to mention i'm in a pretty bad state as far as getting into med schools go), so is it worth it to wait a year? Its hard for me to do that, because I am extremely ambitious, but I keep leaning that way. I just don't know what to do for time off, been thinking TFA, or just working in a lab. Any feedback with a similar situation of being young would be appreciated. Thanks.

 

[mdgator]

Hard to tell without an MCAT score what your chances might be. When would you be taking it? What kind of score do you anticipate? Are all of your ducks in a row, otherwise, (i.e., letters of rec requested, good clinical experiences behind you, pre reqs finished up or in progress, prepared to write a personal statement, etc?) If you are prepared, go for it if you want to. If not, trust me (speaking from experience), a year off is NOT a big deal. You can strengthen your app, save some money, and relax. Good luck.

 

[nu2004]

I'm having a hard time deciding whether or not to apply this year. I think I have a decent shot (according to my advisors) as far as an application goes, but I will only be 20 when June rolls around, and don't turn 21 until Nov. I think I would probably be a better applicant in a year (higher gpa, more time to take the mcat, better lor's, and not to mention i'm in a pretty bad state as far as getting into med schools go), so is it worth it to wait a year? Its hard for me to do that, because I am extremely ambitious, but I keep leaning that way. I just don't know what to do for time off, been thinking TFA, or just working in a lab. Any feedback with a similar situation of being young would be appreciated. Thanks.

TFA is not a good fall-back option. You should only do it if you're really passionate about it. I can tell from your robust service history that you might be, but if you would just be doing it to kill time or increase your chances for med school (and really law schools are more interested in that) I would strongly recommend against it. I've had friends who have done it and it is really, really hard.

 

[adamber]

Hard to tell without an MCAT score what your chances might be. When would you be taking it? What kind of score do you anticipate? Are all of your ducks in a row, otherwise, (i.e., letters of rec requested, good clinical experiences behind you, pre reqs finished up or in progress, prepared to write a personal statement, etc?) If you are prepared, go for it if you want to. If not, trust me (speaking from experience), a year off is NOT a big deal. You can strengthen your app, save some money, and relax. Good luck.

June 13th for the MCAT. Everything else is pretty much good to go, because I went through the committee letter process at my school. Clinical is kind of lacking (in my opinion), only about 150 hours total, split between a hospital and a pediatrics clinic for uninsured patients. Did you apply for right after undergrad, or just take a year off? I'm curious what the negatives are to applying and not being accepted, in terms of having to make a lot of improvement for the following year.

 

[dirkenator]

Those grades in your pre-med prereq's are definitely a concern, but it sounds like your other stuff is amazing (ECs and MCAT). I think you'll have some trouble getting into upper tier schools, but you should be fine for a good state school. Why did you get those C's? Any particular reason, because it seems like an anomaly?

Bad schedules... VERY BAD SCHEDULES... so many annoying elective classes that felt that their class would = instant success in the world... i cant even remember their names

 

[jdla]

Last year I applied to these but I voided my MCAT

Albany Medical School
Drexel
Eastern Virginia
Howard
Morehouse
New York Medical College
Penn State
SUNY Upstate
SUNY Downtown
Temple
Tufts
RWJM
NJMS
University of Arkansas
University of Kentucky
University of Louisville
Rochester
West Virginia
Saint Louis



Can someone give me more opinions on my chances? What MCAT score will I need?

I taking my MCAT in June.

Chemistry Tutor for 1 year
2 Research Projects
Published Abstract
Internship
Volunteer in Hospital 100 hours
Phi Sigma Pi
National Dean List
Independent Business Owner
Teacher Assistant to Kindergartens to 8th grade 1 year
Librarian Assistant 2 years
Mentor those who want to start their own business
NEAGEP Program @ UMASS
Special Dorm for women in math and science
Participated other in volunteer work: Relay for Life, Tenn State, and feed the children
Volunteer at my church
Scholarship Recipient

Other Jobs

Summer: Volunteering in the Hospital, Working on Job to promote environment awareness, and Shadowing a Doctor.

 

[c3c4cam]

Yes, you MAY get into low end DO schools, however DO schools nowdays require almost the same marks as MD in terms of GPA ~3.5, however they are more lenient towards MCAT. DO schools also love life experiences and may overlook your grades if you have amazing personal attributes.

HOnestly...I dont like your chances.. Your GPA is just too low and your MCAT doesnt make up for it either. Consider DO schools.

 

[c3c4cam]

I will give this a try again, what are my chances?

1st year: 3.55
2nd year: 3.67
3rd year:3.67
4rth year: 3.97
MCAT: 27

Work History: Tutor, Best buy officer, Nordic research, Driving School, Cashier, Teacher Assitant

Volunteer: 7 years in hospital (Snacks,Seniors,ER), Meditation center construction work, Distress center councellor (eg. suicides, drugs, depression, etc), homesless sheltor, animal hospital, reading buddies, UNICEF, and a few more.

Extracurricular: high school track team for 3 years, cricket team for 4 years, few clubs, Salsa, international punjabi dance team member

Research: 6 months in research-present, 2 other research independent projects, 1 abstract published, working on a publication right now.

Other: Can speak write Hindi and Punjabi. Can also communicate in Rajasthani and Urdu.

 

[LittleCoconut]

I will give this a try again, what are my chances?

1st year: 3.55
2nd year: 3.67
3rd year:3.67
4rth year: 3.97
MCAT: 27

Work History: Tutor, Best buy officer, Nordic research, Driving School, Cashier, Teacher Assitant

Volunteer: 7 years in hospital (Snacks,Seniors,ER), Meditation center construction work, Distress center councellor (eg. suicides, drugs, depression, etc), homesless sheltor, animal hospital, reading buddies, UNICEF, and a few more.

Extracurricular: high school track team for 3 years, cricket team for 4 years, few clubs, Salsa, international punjabi dance team member

Research: 6 months in research-present, 2 other research independent projects, 1 abstract published, working on a publication right now.

Other: Can speak write Hindi and Punjabi. Can also communicate in Rajasthani and Urdu.

To Decico:
"You deserve an MD"? Are you implying DO's are inferior or something (Despite the fact that they are more qualified after they graduate since they have the added knowledge of OMM?) I met up with a DO in Canada (Calgary) and he is in much more demand (3 months waiting time) than MDs, because he also does OMM in his practice and all the MD stuff. He said its quite easy to come back to Canada as a DO if you do family med, but with specialities, you have to get fellowship, just as it is with MD. MD/DO **** is a premed thinking who have not yet experienced the REAL medical world, but in reality its just another name of the same degree (ie: we have alot of graduates that don't have MD or DO in Canada, they have MBBS OR some other degree I never seen here b4. Tell me the last time you went to an engineer and asked what the initials of his degree were? My personal view is MD=NERDS (clones of each other), DO= Intelligent/cool

Based on what you say you'd never want to apply to MD schools in the first place. This is the Pre-Allopathic forum, not the Pre-Osteopathic forum. Your tenacious defense of DO schools is admirable in its own rights, but it's misplaced here, in this forum of people you don't seem to respect. In case you were simply in the wrong place, here is the link to the Pre-Osteopathic forums, don't be afraid to try it out.

http://forums.studentdoctor.net/forumdisplay.php?f=13

To answer, honestly answer your request about your app as it pertains to MD admission:

Your MCAT puts your app behind the curve. Your Canadian GPA isn't as strong as an American GPA of those numbers would be. High school extra-curriculars aren't really powerful arguments. "Best Buy Officer"? Really? What is that? And if you mention speaking Hindi, it's not like speaking Urdu is a separate major accomplishment, they are extremely similar languages, almost identical.

PS: Could someone without an anti-MD agenda look into the app I posted on the previous page? I would be very grateful for some independent feedback 🙂

 

[Artimacia]

I'm now a sophmore in college, so it's a bit early, but I wanted to make sure I'm on the right track.

I'm in Honors Program, Colleges Against Cancer (I want to go into Oncology)
3.9 GPA
Only a B in gen chem 1
A in Bio 1
Planning to volunteer in hospitals, shadow (joining a volunteer service team through Honors Program)

I know it doesn't seem like a lot yet, but I just want to make sure I'm on the right track.

 

[c3c4cam]

Based on what you say you'd never want to apply to MD schools in the first place. This is the Pre-Allopathic forum, not the Pre-Osteopathic forum. Your tenacious defense of DO schools is admirable in its own rights, but it's misplaced here, in this forum of people you don't seem to respect. In case you were simply in the wrong place, here is the link to the Pre-Osteopathic forums, don't be afraid to try it out.

http://forums.studentdoctor.net/forumdisplay.php?f=13

To answer, honestly answer your request about your app as it pertains to MD admission:

Your MCAT puts your app behind the curve. Your Canadian GPA isn't as strong as an American GPA of those numbers would be. High school extra-curriculars aren't really powerful arguments. "Best Buy Officer"? Really? What is that? And if you mention speaking Hindi, it's not like speaking Urdu is a separate major accomplishment, they are extremely similar languages, almost identical.

PS: Could someone without an anti-MD agenda look into the app I posted on the previous page? I would be very grateful for some independent feedback 🙂

I appeciate your input. However, it is your false assumption that I am anti-MD. I would love to get into MD or DO. I just thought that I would enligthen some people on here who still, in 2008 think that DO is inferior. Thats like saying DDS is inferior to DMD. The reason I put Urdu in a separate category is because I can write Hindi but not Urdu.

 

[Chuckwalla]

Yes, you MAY get into low end DO schools, however DO schools nowdays require almost the same marks as MD in terms of GPA ~3.5, however they are more lenient towards MCAT. DO schools also love life experiences and may overlook your grades if you have amazing personal attributes.

There is a significant difference between DO GPA acceptance and MD GPA acceptance.

Your GPA is good enough for DO schools MedSchoolorBust. If you have a some lower-tier state schools you might have a chance at MD, but do not count on it.

 

[secret25]

Hey everyone, I posted a few days ago, but I didn't get a response, so I was wondering if anyone can give me any hints about my app, and recommendations about where to apply. Rather than re-post everything, mostly everything is on my MDapplicants profile which is to the left. Thanks!

 

[Chuckwalla]

Hey everyone, I posted a few days ago, but I didn't get a response, so I was wondering if anyone can give me any hints about my app, and recommendations about where to apply. Rather than re-post everything, mostly everything is on my MDapplicants profile which is to the left. Thanks!

You have excellent stats and you are in a great state, probably the best to be in. I honestly do not know why you are asking. Unless you have a toxic personality you should get into most of the schools are applying without much trouble.

If you are happy with going to Texas (your tuition rates are enviable) then there is little need for you to retake the MCAT. A 31 will not cause problems for you. If you want to go Ivy League, which you have the potential to do, then maybe it could use a boost.

 

[secret25]

You have excellent stats and you are in a great state, probably the best to be in. I honestly do not know why you are asking. Unless you have a toxic personality you should get into most of the schools are applying without much trouble.

If you are happy with going to Texas (your tuition rates are enviable) then there is little need for you to retake the MCAT. A 31 will not cause problems for you. If you want to go Ivy League, which you have the potential to do, then maybe it could use a boost.

Thanks! Hopefully I don't have a toxic personality, I guess I'll find out...I know I'm lucky to be in Texas, when it comes to Med Schools at least, but I've been here for a while now so I'd love to get out. And since I am taking a year off I feel like I may as well retake the MCAT, which I'm doing in June if my practice tests are where I want them to be. If not, I'm applying with my score. But, I'm looking for possible schools, aside from Texas, that I'd have a decent shot at if the 31 ends up being my score. The MSAR overwhelms me and makes me feel like I won't ever get in anywhere, so I'm thinking input from actual people would be more helpful! 🙂 Thanks again!

 

[Bibbed]

I will give this a try again, what are my chances?

1st year: 3.55
2nd year: 3.67
3rd year:3.67
4rth year: 3.97
MCAT: 27

Work History: Tutor, Best buy officer, Nordic research, Driving School, Cashier, Teacher Assitant

Volunteer: 7 years in hospital (Snacks,Seniors,ER), Meditation center construction work, Distress center councellor (eg. suicides, drugs, depression, etc), homesless sheltor, animal hospital, reading buddies, UNICEF, and a few more.

Extracurricular: high school track team for 3 years, cricket team for 4 years, few clubs, Salsa, international punjabi dance team member

Research: 6 months in research-present, 2 other research independent projects, 1 abstract published, working on a publication right now.

Other: Can speak write Hindi and Punjabi. Can also communicate in Rajasthani and Urdu.

Personally, I believe that MCAT score is better indication of person's potential than their GPA is (the old standardization argument and what not). However, my GPA is low and my MCAT is high, so that could be a result of my bias.

That aside, I believe your MCAT score is too low to be competitive at even mid-level schools. I didn't calculate your GPA, but 3.8ish GPAs are a dime a dozen these days, so I don't think it'll counteract your MCAT. If you had a 29, I would give you a good chance, but I think 27 is too low for anything but the lowest level schools (and maybe even for them).

In my personal experience, I know two individuals with 3.95ish GPAs and 29 MCATs that got into my state med school but not really anywhere else. Maybe something to consider. I'd re-take the MCAT if I were you (which I assume you're planning to do).

 

[crazymed09]

I feel like I'm baring all for a Penthouse shoot:

GPA: 3.45 (BCPM 3.15, AO 3.58)
MCAT 33 (10Verbal, 12Physical, 11 Bio, Q Essay)

EC: 3 years of research with one publication, Volunteering, physician shadowing, relay for life, eboard.

So People, what are my chances?

 

[ChubbyChaser]

I feel like I'm baring all for a Penthouse shoot:

GPA: 3.45 (BCPM 3.15, AO 3.58)
MCAT 33 (10Verbal, 12Physical, 11 Bio, Q Essay)

EC: 3 years of research with one publication, Volunteering, physician shadowing, relay for life, eboard.

So People, what are my chances?

74.839%

 

[MedSchoolOrBust]

There is a significant difference between DO GPA acceptance and MD GPA acceptance.

Your GPA is good enough for DO schools MedSchoolorBust. If you have a some lower-tier state schools you might have a chance at MD, but do not count on it.

Thanks, I didn't think my GPA was that low to not even be considered for DO schools. It's a low GPA but by no means ****ty. Most of my courses for junior and senior year, which I did very well in, were upper/grad level science courses and even included gross human anatomy with a cadaver lab (I believe only a limited number of schools offer that at the undergrad level).

As for the DO schools, I have not considered those yet. Nothing personally against them but I don't quite get the philosophical distinction between allopathic and osteopathic schools.

And lower tier state schools ... umm NEVADA?! Haha not to rag on the school but I think they are pretty low on the scale.

I'm probably relying on more of my life experience/ps/recs to give my app a boost more than my raw numbers.

and if it matters, I believe I'm an under-represented minority but I am not promoting affirmative action.

 

[JMedical08]

Thanks, I didn't think my GPA was that low to not even be considered for DO schools. It's a low GPA but by no means ****ty. Most of my courses for junior and senior year, which I did very well in, were upper/grad level science courses and even included gross human anatomy with a cadaver lab (I believe only a limited number of schools offer that at the undergrad level).

As for the DO schools, I have not considered those yet. Nothing personally against them but I don't quite get the philosophical distinction between allopathic and osteopathic schools.

And lower tier state schools ... umm NEVADA?! Haha not to rag on the school but I think they are pretty low on the scale.

I'm probably relying on more of my life experience/ps/recs to give my app a boost more than my raw numbers.

and if it matters, I believe I'm an under-represented minority but I am not promoting affirmative action.

You may have a huge advantage due to you being a URM but just a word of caution:

I have a higher MCAT, same GPA, a Masters degree from a top 2 engineering program, waaaaaaay more clinical experience than you, and as a resident I got waitlisted at that school that you said was so low on the scale. Anything can happen anywhere, I f'ed up by being too cocky with the admissions cycle, didn't even get into my backup and now i have only one choice of a school that, technically, I wasn't aware that I was applying to (got a campus assignment at a campus that I didnt know existed when i applied).

 

[MedSchoolOrBust]

You may have a huge advantage due to you being a URM but just a word of caution:

I have a higher MCAT, same GPA, a Masters degree from a top 2 engineering program, waaaaaaay more clinical experience than you, and as a resident I got waitlisted at that school that you said was so low on the scale. Anything can happen anywhere, I f'ed up by being too cocky with the admissions cycle, didn't even get into my backup and now i have only one choice of a school that, technically, I wasn't aware that I was applying to (got a campus assignment at a campus that I didnt know existed when i applied).

By no means am I underestimating Nevada. I'm sure they are competitive to get into. Not sure how low they are on the scale but they are not mid-tier. I'm not applying to the school because it's at the bottom of the list, I'm applying because I have strong ties to that state that increases my chances of getting in. Trust me, I wasn't being cocky and I'm not taking any school lightly.

What was your backup school? and did you get into UWash and got assigned to the Idaho campus?

 

[the_samrat]

hey

I have similar problems that many here had/have.

I'm from Canada, and my first year at university was really bad. I ended up with 1.7 GPA, taking life sciences (basic courses). It wasn't my potential and I changed to a different program at a different university to start from scratch.

I have done 3 years so far and my cGPA for 3 years in this fresh program 3.85. Most of my courses are medicine related, including pathophysiology, clinical biochemistry, microbiology, hematology/transfusion science, genetics, anatomy/physiology, histology etc.

My concern is, if I include all my 4 years (including my terrible FIRST year), my GPA will count to 3.3 or something. I have one more year to go but I am planning to apply in august. Is it going to affect me real bad?

Please let me know, so I can take appropriate courses/work to boost my application.

Thanks

 

[Chuckwalla]

Thanks, I didn't think my GPA was that low to not even be considered for DO schools. It's a low GPA but by no means ****ty. Most of my courses for junior and senior year, which I did very well in, were upper/grad level science courses and even included gross human anatomy with a cadaver lab (I believe only a limited number of schools offer that at the undergrad level).

As for the DO schools, I have not considered those yet. Nothing personally against them but I don't quite get the philosophical distinction between allopathic and osteopathic schools.

And lower tier state schools ... umm NEVADA?! Haha not to rag on the school but I think they are pretty low on the scale.

I'm probably relying on more of my life experience/ps/recs to give my app a boost more than my raw numbers.

and if it matters, I believe I'm an under-represented minority but I am not promoting affirmative action.

I completely understand what you are saying about DO. I would have no problem being a DO but the fact is many people are ignorant and you will face adversity on some level.

I am certainly not a fan of affirmative action. On a personal level however, take whatever advantage you can get. If you are a URM you should have little problem getting into a MD school, chances are you will have your choice of them.

 

[scarletgirl777]

I completely understand what you are saying about DO. I would have no problem being a DO but the fact is many people are ignorant and you will face adversity on some level.

I am certainly not a fan of affirmative action. On a personal level however, take whatever advantage you can get. If you are a URM you should have little problem getting into a MD school, chances are you will have your choice of them.

MedSchoolOrBust, I'm wary of assuming things will work out just because you are a minority. It's so hard to tell how much affirmative action can help you and I certainly wouldn't say you'd have "your choice" of schools because different schools will put different emphases on diversity and this is not really something that you can predict. I certainly know qualified URMs who got into a med school but not necessarily the med school they hoped for. I would say, if you feel like you've done everything you can to get into med school, then you should apply--then no matter what happens, you know you've put in your best effort. Could your ECs, MCAT, and especially GPA be better? It would obviously be preferable if you could bring your GPA up a tenth of a point or two, and that GPA's going to negativly affect your chances and maybe quash them at your reaches despite URM status.

I suggest looking closely at the MSAR. For instance Stanford--very high numbers. And this year's MSAR shows only 2 African-Americans are enrolled in the class that was surveyed. So you see, they are obviously not taking just any URM that comes their way. I would say apply based on MSAR and just consider race to be a bonus.

 

[Chuckwalla]

MedSchoolOrBust, I'm wary of assuming things will work out just because you are a minority. It's so hard to tell how much affirmative action can help you and I certainly wouldn't say you'd have "your choice" of schools because different schools will put different emphases on diversity and this is not really something that you can predict. I certainly know qualified URMs who got into a med school but not necessarily the med school they hoped for. I would say, if you feel like you've done everything you can to get into med school, then you should apply--then no matter what happens, you know you've put in your best effort. Could your ECs, MCAT, and especially GPA be better? It would obviously be preferable if you could bring your GPA up a tenth of a point or two, and that GPA's going to negativly affect your chances and maybe quash them at your reaches despite URM status.

I suggest looking closely at the MSAR. For instance Stanford--very high numbers. And this year's MSAR shows only 2 African-Americans are enrolled in the class that was surveyed. So you see, they are obviously not taking just any URM that comes their way. I would say apply based on MSAR and just consider race to be a bonus.

When I said their choice I meant in the respect of state schools and low-tier schools, not Ivy Leagues. Comparing what I said to Stanford is a pretty unfair comparison.

I never said that everything will work out because they are a minority. However, being a URM is a significant plus. With their GPA they had a slight chance at a MD school, the URM status throws them over the edge.

LizzyM pointed out something very important about MSAR. It shows the GPA of accepted students not people who attend. The people with high GPA's who get accepted multiple places artificially drive the averages upward. Seeing this freaks a lot people out, check the schools website for a better idea of what you need.

 

[Bibbed]

hey

I have similar problems that many here had/have.

I'm from Canada, and my first year at university was really bad. I ended up with 1.7 GPA, taking life sciences (basic courses). It wasn't my potential and I changed to a different program at a different university to start from scratch.

I have done 3 years so far and my cGPA for 3 years in this fresh program 3.85. Most of my courses are medicine related, including pathophysiology, clinical biochemistry, microbiology, hematology/transfusion science, genetics, anatomy/physiology, histology etc.

My concern is, if I include all my 4 years (including my terrible FIRST year), my GPA will count to 3.3 or something. I have one more year to go but I am planning to apply in august. Is it going to affect me real bad?

Please let me know, so I can take appropriate courses/work to boost my application.

Thanks

Well, you are obligated to report all of your undergraduate coursework, so I imagine you'll have to include that first year. The massive upward trend will count for something, but I'm not sure if you be able to get in anywhere your first time applying.

For the purpose of comparison. My first year was a 2.2, my last three were a 3.9. I also got a 35 on my MCAT, and still didn't get a single interview from one of the 20+ schools applied to. Your situation may be somewhat different though, so it could all work out for you.

 

[blaise77]

hey

I have similar problems that many here had/have.

I'm from Canada, and my first year at university was really bad. I ended up with 1.7 GPA, taking life sciences (basic courses). It wasn't my potential and I changed to a different program at a different university to start from scratch.

I have done 3 years so far and my cGPA for 3 years in this fresh program 3.85. Most of my courses are medicine related, including pathophysiology, clinical biochemistry, microbiology, hematology/transfusion science, genetics, anatomy/physiology, histology etc.

My concern is, if I include all my 4 years (including my terrible FIRST year), my GPA will count to 3.3 or something. I have one more year to go but I am planning to apply in august. Is it going to affect me real bad?

Please let me know, so I can take appropriate courses/work to boost my application.

Thanks

Hey I understand your situation...I went to a not so prestigous uni and got like a 2.2 first year GPA....however for the next 4 years I received a 4.0 including all my science courses. I had to retake some courses that I failed first year, and when you apply to AMCAS it averages your failed and retook classes so my AMCAS GPA was 3.7 but uni GPA was 3.89, my MCAT was V = 8 P =11 B = 10, I applied to only 5 schools mostly between top 20-50 rankings, I interviewed at 3 and was accepted to 2 a now currently top 45 school. So my advice to you is dont let this discourage you....schools take into account your trend in grades seeing that you improved since first year...you just have to show that you really want it and specifically want their program

 

[scarletgirl777]

When I said their choice I meant in the respect of state schools and low-tier schools, not Ivy Leagues. Comparing what I said to Stanford is a pretty unfair comparison.

I never said that everything will work out because they are a minority. However, being a URM is a significant plus. With their GPA they had a slight chance at a MD school, the URM status throws them over the edge.

LizzyM pointed out something very important about MSAR. It shows the GPA of accepted students not people who attend. The people with high GPA's who get accepted multiple places artificially drive the averages upward. Seeing this freaks a lot people out, check the schools website for a better idea of what you need.

I'm sorry, I thought the phrase "your choice" would mean his choice off the list he created, which included Stanford (why I mentioned it) and other similar caliber schools. Also, the point about accepted schools is well taken, but even looking at US News and World Report data of matriculants, Stanford's data is pretty high compared to his (though much lower than MSAR suggests).

 

[MedSchoolOrBust]

I'm sorry, I thought the phrase "your choice" would mean his choice off the list he created, which included Stanford (why I mentioned it) and other similar caliber schools. Also, the point about accepted schools is well taken, but even looking at US News and World Report data of matriculants, Stanford's data is pretty high compared to his (though much lower than MSAR suggests).

Thanks for what seems to be your genuine concern for the schools I have listed. I have no reason to believe I will have my choice of schools based on the fact that I am a URM. As for Stanford, I consider that to be a REEEAAACH school. Do I expect to get in? Probably not. Will it stop me from applying? No. I think for the most part, the schools I have listed are reach schools. In fact I think everyone should consider most med schools reach schools until they have been accepted. Honestly, this whole process is waaay too unpredictable to quantify a 3.8 and a 33 as a golden ticket to an M.D.

I chose most of these schools partly for their numbers as I'm trying to be as realistic as possible (and if you - by this I mean anyone who reads this - think I'm waay over my head for applying to solely MD schools then that's your opinion). But at the same time, I chose these schools for what they offer their students in terms of geography, clinical setting, patient demographics, and international opportunities.

Back to the URM thing as that seems to be what has been highlighted from my whole portfolio ... I really am not for affirmative action, on a personal level I know it will probably help, it would be stupid of me to omit that info from my app, but do I really think that is my best asset? I hope not. I know this process won't be easy. It will be rocky at best, but it'll be oh so worth it.

 

[MilkmanAl]

I really am not for affirmative action, on a personal level I know it will probably help, it would be stupid of me to omit that info from my app, but do I really think that is my best asset? I hope not.

Not to knock the rest of your application, but your URM status may well be your most powerful tool for getting into med school. Personally, I strongly disagree with holding minorities to lower standards than everyone else for many reasons, but I accept that's how the system works. You might as well take advantage of everything you can to achieve your goals. I know that I'd flog the hell out of my URM status if I had it. Why not? This whole process is about self-aggrandizement anyway.

 

[scarletgirl777]

Thanks for what seems to be your genuine concern for the schools I have listed. I have no reason to believe I will have my choice of schools based on the fact that I am a URM. As for Stanford, I consider that to be a REEEAAACH school. Do I expect to get in? Probably not. Will it stop me from applying? No. I think for the most part, the schools I have listed are reach schools. In fact I think everyone should consider most med schools reach schools until they have been accepted. Honestly, this whole process is waaay too unpredictable to quantify a 3.8 and a 33 as a golden ticket to an M.D.

I chose most of these schools partly for their numbers as I'm trying to be as realistic as possible (and if you - by this I mean anyone who reads this - think I'm waay over my head for applying to solely MD schools then that's your opinion). But at the same time, I chose these schools for what they offer their students in terms of geography, clinical setting, patient demographics, and international opportunities.

Back to the URM thing as that seems to be what has been highlighted from my whole portfolio ... I really am not for affirmative action, on a personal level I know it will probably help, it would be stupid of me to omit that info from my app, but do I really think that is my best asset? I hope not. I know this process won't be easy. It will be rocky at best, but it'll be oh so worth it.

I can't really comment on whether you should try DO. I'm of the mind that personally, I'd rather reapply than include DO. On the other hand, I'm also personally of the mind that if push came to shove that I could do more to strengthen my application and I'd have no problem taking an extra year or 2 to do that (yes, I think that's worth the "meaningless" difference in letters). I would say, apply only to those schools to which you'd feel satisfied attending--unless you are reapplying, there is no need to apply to schools you would be unhappy attending. If that for you includes DO, then go ahead and include it. In that same vein, 1 or 2 more lower tier private schools other than Gtown and GWU (something with a few thousand fewer applications) might be a good idea.

For me the URM part of your application sticks out because it is the most unique aspect of your application. I mean, I see that you have spent time having a real job at that biotech company, but other than that the URM thing sticks out most--your GPA is below average (don't know where you went to school or what you majored in, but still), your MCAT is average, and there is nothing really out of the ordinary about your college ECs. But I don't see how you could "flog the hell" out of your URM status...I mean, there is one place where you get to mention race on AMCAS, so I don't know what MilkmanAl meant by that.

This isn't really directed at you specifically, but too many people overestimate the differences between URMs and non-URMs who get accepted to any given school, and if you are a URM its best to be conservative about the impact of affirmative action when evaluating your chances or what you need to do to make yourself competitive.

 

[Jimmy]

Hi everybody! So here is my background:

B.S. Mechanical Engineering - 3.49 GPA (South Dakota State University)
Minor biology
M.S. Biomedical Engineering - (Ohio State University)

Right now I'm currently working on my M.S. in biomedical engineering at Ohio State, and now that I've started working in more medical related fields from my undergrad in mechanical engineering, I absolutely love what I'm doing. I'm currently working on research related to signaling in endothelial cells in arteries during ischemic events, and I don't think I've ever been so interested in something in my entire life.

Knowing that, I've really started to contemplate if I should try to go to medical school. The thing is, because of my background in mechanical engineering, I'm going to have to complete a lot of the requirements for science (chem II, org. Chem, some biology etc.) during my masters to even be able to apply! Knowing that, the prereqs. I've taken so far:

Biology-A
Phys I-B
Phys II, Chem I-C

Everything else I still need to take.

So, I'm trying to determine if its worth me even attempting to get into medical school, since I'll be taking the prereqs on top of my masters classes in biomed. engineering. Reading some of the stuff on here, I'm worried that I won't ever have a realistic shot, no matter what I do, so I don't want to go down a path that has no realistic chance of ending in the way I hope!

If anybody has any advice I would really appreciate it! I apologize for this being somewhat vague, but thats the information I'm trying to work with right now. I know its probably difficult to decide without having MCAT and science scores, but anything you could say would be helpful!

Thanks!

 

[MilkmanAl]

I mean, there is one place where you get to mention race on AMCAS, so I don't know what MilkmanAl meant by that.

I meant that I'd mention it whenever possible. If there was some notable experience in my life involving race that was PS material, I'd go with it. I'd also get involved in some race relation-type EC's. Like I said, it's a powerful tool. You might as well wield it. I certainly wouldn't rely on racial status to get in somewhere, but there's nothing wrong with treating it like another weapon in your arsenal.

 

[scarletgirl777]

.

 

[blaise77]

Hi everybody! So here is my background:

B.S. Mechanical Engineering - 3.49 GPA (South Dakota State University)
Minor biology
M.S. Biomedical Engineering - (Ohio State University)

Right now I'm currently working on my M.S. in biomedical engineering at Ohio State, and now that I've started working in more medical related fields from my undergrad in mechanical engineering, I absolutely love what I'm doing. I'm currently working on research related to signaling in endothelial cells in arteries during ischemic events, and I don't think I've ever been so interested in something in my entire life.

Knowing that, I've really started to contemplate if I should try to go to medical school. The thing is, because of my background in mechanical engineering, I'm going to have to complete a lot of the requirements for science (chem II, org. Chem, some biology etc.) during my masters to even be able to apply! Knowing that, the prereqs. I've taken so far:

Biology-A
Phys I-B
Phys II, Chem I-C

Everything else I still need to take.

So, I'm trying to determine if its worth me even attempting to get into medical school, since I'll be taking the prereqs on top of my masters classes in biomed. engineering. Reading some of the stuff on here, I'm worried that I won't ever have a realistic shot, no matter what I do, so I don't want to go down a path that has no realistic chance of ending in the way I hope!

If anybody has any advice I would really appreciate it! I apologize for this being somewhat vague, but thats the information I'm trying to work with right now. I know its probably difficult to decide without having MCAT and science scores, but anything you could say would be helpful!

Thanks!

You probably have a shot at getting into a medical school somewhere...where will most likely depend on how the rest of your premed courses turn out and how you do on the MCATs....you have to decide if you really want this. It will definitely make your life harder while trying to fufill the requirements on top of finishing your masters. You NEED to do better on your science classes...no C's...and try and at least get a 30 on MCAT. Your advantage is that you will have a masters and significant amount of research. You probably wont have a hard time on the MCAT since your already a biomechanical engineer but I would still recommend a prep course. To my limited knowledge the job outlook for biomechanical engineers isnt too bad....

 

[soundesign]

A friend clued me into this site and I thought I'd give it a try. I'm a super-senior applying for the 2009 cycle.

-MCAT: 30
-GPA: 3.5-ish
-Science GPA: 3.25-3.30 (depends on this semester)
-1 semester of psychology research
-1 publication
-Decent amount of shadowing
-Healthy amount of volunteering
-Couple scholarships

I know my GPA is what's going to kill me. I took O-Chem when I was in high school (yep, that was stupid, but I was cocky enough to think I could do it at the time) and ended up w/ a C for both semesters. In college, I retook Ochem I and still only got a C+. At that point I got discouraged and decided medicine wasn't for me and looked to other pursuits. After trying a lot of different things, I realized I still really wanted to do medicine and decided to retake O-Chem 1 & 2 again. I ended up with a B+ for both semesters. All my other prereq science classes have been at least a B though.

I will be applying to a slew of DO schools, so no need to mention those. I'm mainly interested to see whether I have any real chance at MD schools with such a low cumulative/science GPA. I am also a Texas resident and will be primarily applying to in-state MD schools (with maybe 1 or 2 privates out-of-state). Please help!

 

[ChubbyChaser]

A friend clued me into this site and I thought I'd give it a try. I'm a super-senior applying for the 2009 cycle.

-MCAT: 30
-GPA: 3.5-ish
-Science GPA: 3.25-3.30 (depends on this semester)
-1 semester of psychology research
-1 publication
-Decent amount of shadowing
-Healthy amount of volunteering
-Couple scholarships

I know my GPA is what's going to kill me. I took O-Chem when I was in high school (yep, that was stupid, but I was cocky enough to think I could do it at the time) and ended up w/ a C for both semesters. In college, I retook Ochem I and still only got a C+. At that point I got discouraged and decided medicine wasn't for me and looked to other pursuits. After trying a lot of different things, I realized I still really wanted to do medicine and decided to retake O-Chem 1 & 2 again. I ended up with a B+ for both semesters. All my other prereq science classes have been at least a B though.

I will be applying to a slew of DO schools, so no need to mention those. I'm mainly interested to see whether I have any real chance at MD schools with such a low cumulative/science GPA. I am also a Texas resident and will be primarily applying to in-state MD schools (with maybe 1 or 2 privates out-of-state). Please help!

Id say you have a shot at an MD school if you apply early...

Im not sure how they will view taking the same course 3 times though.

 

[soundesign]

Id say you have a shot at an MD school if you apply early...

Im not sure how they will view taking the same course 3 times though.

Yeah, that's what I'm afraid of. I originally retook Ochem b/c my schools allows for grade-replacement, but I didn't know AMCAS still counts everything. 🙁 Also, thank you for your reply. I would really appreciate it if some more people can chime in too. I just set up a MDApps profile too: http://www.mdapplicants.com/viewprofile.php?myid=10330

 

[neuroanatomy]

Hi,
I was wondering if you could give me some feedback about my info. I am doing a double major in two hard sciences (neuroscience bs and physiology bs) and am planning to either apply to med school this summer or next. By the time I graduate I project that my gpa will be around 3.65 with bcpm around 3.5. I will have obtained dept honors for neuroscience. I know its not too great, and was wondering if you had suggestions as to what kinds of med schools I should be looking into. I want to attend a school in the US and would like to attend a middle tier school if possible...

Also, i have a U shaped trend. i did decent freshman and this year, but soph/junior yr wasnt as great..

I have mostly As and Bs, but i did get a c+ in systems anatomy. how detrimental would this look to the adcom? i took neuroanatomy the following year (the hardest class offered at our school, taught by distinguished med school faculty) and got a B+.

I know mcat is a big factor and since i have yet to take it the info is incomplete. However, if I were to get a decent/avg score (31-33ish...??) what do you think? what kinds of schools and how many of them should i apply to?

very briefly, heres some ec's,etc:
honors research with thesis, 2 poster presentations coming up, 2nd author abstract
student clinic volunteer with homeless
student health advisor
cancer education/research intern, worked with local communities...
some standard hospital volunteer work, minimal shadowing exp
full scholarship during college
etc...

also, i dont think i will get an md LOR. is md LOR really that much more advantageous?

 

[MedSchoolOrBust]

I can't really comment on whether you should try DO. I'm of the mind that personally, I'd rather reapply than include DO. On the other hand, I'm also personally of the mind that if push came to shove that I could do more to strengthen my application and I'd have no problem taking an extra year or 2 to do that (yes, I think that's worth the "meaningless" difference in letters). I would say, apply only to those schools to which you'd feel satisfied attending--unless you are reapplying, there is no need to apply to schools you would be unhappy attending. If that for you includes DO, then go ahead and include it. In that same vein, 1 or 2 more lower tier private schools other than Gtown and GWU (something with a few thousand fewer applications) might be a good idea.

For me the URM part of your application sticks out because it is the most unique aspect of your application. I mean, I see that you have spent time having a real job at that biotech company, but other than that the URM thing sticks out most--your GPA is below average (don't know where you went to school or what you majored in, but still), your MCAT is average, and there is nothing really out of the ordinary about your college ECs. But I don't see how you could "flog the hell" out of your URM status...I mean, there is one place where you get to mention race on AMCAS, so I don't know what MilkmanAl meant by that.

This isn't really directed at you specifically, but too many people overestimate the differences between URMs and non-URMs who get accepted to any given school, and if you are a URM its best to be conservative about the impact of affirmative action when evaluating your chances or what you need to do to make yourself competitive.

I definitely need to work on my list of schools. Probably won't include DO still. But I agree with adding a few schools with a better outlook than Gtown and GW.

As for my undergrad, I did neuroscience. I went to one of the schools in Boston with a medical school. The undergrad has been publicized in nationally circulated media, NY Times for one, for grade deflation - not sure how aware adcoms are.

I digress with the URM bit, it's not like half the medical school classes these days come with a ****load of minorities. The last time I checked ... they are still minorities.

 

[scarletgirl777]

I definitely need to work on my list of schools. Probably won't include DO still. But I agree with adding a few schools with a better outlook than Gtown and GW.

As for my undergrad, I did neuroscience. I went to one of the schools in Boston with a medical school. The undergrad has been publicized in nationally circulated media, NY Times for one, for grade deflation - not sure how aware adcoms are.

I digress with the URM bit, it's not like half the medical school classes these days come with a ****load of minorities. The last time I checked ... they are still minorities.

I would say that your premed office is in the best position to say what your GPA from your school means, especially if you have a lot of med school applicants. I know you're an alum, but you could try calling one of your premed advisors to realistically assess your GPA. It's kind of a myth that school doesn't matter, but random people on SDN aren't really in the best position to tell you how your school's particular ranking/grade inflation or deflation reputation affects your GPA.

 

[goingmed]

hello every1...i'm a new member to this forum and would like to know ur thoughts on my chances

I'm a permanent resident of canada
BCMP: 3.75
overall: 3.73
MCAT: 33

hospital volunteering, summer research once, part time lab job, 2 community service positions

I plan to apply to
SUNY upstate
Mount Sinai
New york medical college
Penn state
Winconsin (looks a bit too competitive compared to others)
Jefferson??

So I'd like to know whether I'm in a OK position to apply to these schools. Its kinda difficult for me to come up with the list without any inputs from anyone else as this is my first time applying and have never been to america.

Thanks guys!

 

[Wylde]

I think you stats are good enough, but you need to apply MUCH better:

You have average stats, so you're going to need to apply very broadly and early. You might want to add some lower-mid tier schools:

drexel
rosalind franklin
Tulane
Albany
etc.

Grab an MSAR.

You also probably have a better shot at MCW than UW-madison. Consider some more OOS friendly schools (ie OH state, MI state, etc.)

 

[nonesuchgirl]

que

 

[87138]

Well now isn't this a bit embarrassing.

 

[rs28]

Hi,

I am not really too sure what the wisest thing to do is in my situation, so I was hoping someone more knowledgeable could give me some advice.

I just finished college. I originally started as a history major, but decided to switch in to physiology halfway through. I also decided to become a doctor. I finished in four years, and my GPA is 3.72, and my science GPA is about a 3.9. My GPA has improved every year.

I am taking the MCAT in July. I just took an AAMC practice test to see where I'm at before I start studying , and I got a 33. I think I'll be able to do at least that well on the actual test, because I haven't put any effort into preparing yet. I think that a 33 is fairly competitive, but I might be wrong.

I am trying to decide whether I should apply this year (i.e. for 2009 admission) or wait until the next year. My main concerns are:
- I'll be taking the MCAT in July, so I won't be able to get the application in until later.
- I'm not really sure if my extracurricular activities are acceptable. I worked as as a food server and dishwasher in the cafeteria throughout college, and I was the captain of an intramural basketball team. Over the summers, I've worked full time as a camp counselor and a painter. Last summer, I also volunteered in the ER of a hospital for about 50 hours, and I also volunteered in a children's hospital in Uganda for a month. This is pretty much the extent of my clinical experience. Next year, I want to work full time as a CNA. This summer, I have a job working in a lab for one of my professors.

So, my question is whether I should wait a year and get the experience working in a hospital in before I actually apply, or whether I should just go for it this year. Most people I have talked to have advised me to just apply this year, but they don't really know anything about the admissions process.

Any advice would be appreciated,
Thanks.