What does peer consultation look like for other interns?

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Spydra

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During the designated times for peer consultation (yep scheduled by the supervising staff) at my internship it is less consulting and more socializing, which doesn't seem like the point to me. So I am curious if I just don't get it and don't want to spend the year despising it if this is the norm. What are other interns doing?

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During the designated times for peer consultation (yep scheduled by the supervising staff) at my internship it is less consulting and more socializing, which doesn't seem like the point to me. So I am curious if I just don't get it and don't want to spend the year despising it if this is the norm. What are other interns doing?

Ours was supervised by our DCT, who was not supervising anyone during clinical rotations. We mixed it up with general peer consultation, just bringing up any issues that we wanted during that time, and other times interns were assigned to pick some readings/do light didactics related to a case issue that they had. If we were ever in a more general session and didn't have much to talk about, our DCT would talk about some career/professional development issues.
 
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I had a similar experience to WisNeuro.

I will say that from the supervisor side of things, it is difficult to manufacture "peer consultation" routinely. From my experience, that would happen more organically when I was having a tough case and went back to the intern office, for example. But your experience isn't necessarily unique. My husband's intern cohort called theirs "intern bitch session."
 
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At my VA during our didactic afternoon each week, we had an hour to eat lunch together and then consultation every other week with a rotating faculty member facilitating. Sometimes it was heavy on clinical and other times we would talk about how the year was going, career development stuff, etc.

But without some light structure, which could look like different interns taking turns facilitating, I think any group would struggle to effectively take advantage of consultation time.
 
*sigh* I was afraid I was an anomaly in my group. It seems I'm the only one who wanted and expected a structured setup and everyone else is ok socializing and/or bitching. I have zero expectation of getting everyone to change, but also would rather use my time elsewhere. What is happening now cannot possibly be what peer consultation looks like once fully licensed and independent in the field.....so yep, not seeing how this setup is worthwhile.
 
Not to be a debbie downer, but there will likely be a lot of things in training where you would rather use your time elsewhere.
 
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Not to be a debbie downer, but there will likely be a lot of things in training where you would rather use your time elsewhere.

This I also get and I am learning what I can say no to because it is technically optional versus what is mandatory so that I have more balance. Some mandatory things I can be present at, but engaged elsewhere (e.g., checking the zillions of emails) but so far peer consultation isn't like that.
 
You could consider discussing this with the training director and/or your supervisor; it's the sort of feedback I'd want to receive if I were a DoT. At the very least, you can provide this information via whatever formal feedback your internship site solicits.

Maybe also discuss it with your peers and see if other folks would be on board with adding more structure to the consultation? Might be the best first step. You could even volunteer to be the first to discuss/present your case(s), etc.

Is the consultation time something that occurs over lunch? If so, those do (at least in my experience) tend to be less formal and more geared toward protecting time in interns' weeks to allow them to bond as a cohort. If it's not a lunch meeting, then yes, those do (again, in my experience) tend to be somewhat more structured.
 
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You could consider discussing this with the training director and/or your supervisor; it's the sort of feedback I'd want to receive if I were a DoT. At the very least, you can provide this information via whatever formal feedback your internship site solicits.

Maybe also discuss it with your peers and see if other folks would be on board with adding more structure to the consultation? Might be the best first step. You could even volunteer to be the first to discuss/present your case(s), etc.

Is the consultation time something that occurs over lunch? If so, those do (at least in my experience) tend to be less formal and more geared toward protecting time in interns' weeks to allow them to bond as a cohort. If it's not a lunch meeting, then yes, those do (again, in my experience) tend to be somewhat more structured.

They aren't scheduled during lunch, if they were I might be less annoyed because I could focus on eating. They are late afternoon, which may be why the setup annoys me more. That time of day could be used for the piles of documentation or prepping for the next day. I did actually talk to someone else in my cohort who turns out is also, not happy with the structure, but we both have little expectation of swaying the others. The others have a clearly defined clique we were never invited into which apparently began earlier in the summer. Now they're all neighbors and socialize outside of work hours and are quite happy doing their own thing. I can try talking to the TD, but they are new in that role and I have low expectations for change. I'm not totally opposed to just splitting off and doing my own thing and/or the two of us doing something else, but probably should confirm there is not a policy that would be violated by doing so.
 
*sigh* I was afraid I was an anomaly in my group. It seems I'm the only one who wanted and expected a structured setup and everyone else is ok socializing and/or bitching. I have zero expectation of getting everyone to change, but also would rather use my time elsewhere. What is happening now cannot possibly be what peer consultation looks like once fully licensed and independent in the field.....so yep, not seeing how this setup is worthwhile.

You might want to brace yourself a little bit.
 
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You might want to brace yourself a little bit.
Unfortunately, I was going to say the same thing. I think most regularly-recurring professional meetings eventually seem to turn into a gripe-fest, although that might be unique to my setting.
 
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So there really is no discussing cases or ethical concerns?
I do that plenty with my VA team but I generally just reach out to 1 or 2 people specifically whose counsel I trust and respect. And I'm much more likely to ask really specific questions since we all have a lot going on.

We also have dedicated team meeting times and will discuss cases occasionally but most of that time is spent on logistical or programmatic matters.

If you're in a setting where you are the sole psychologist (say inpatient working mostly with medical staff) or in private practice, it'll take more effort to find peer support but it's definitely out there if you make the effort.
 
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@BuckeyeLove @AcronymAllergy So there really is no discussing cases or ethical concerns? *sigh*
Oh, there definitely is; I didn't mean to imply that doesn't happen at all. It just depends on a variety of factors, including the overall atmosphere of wherever you're working, the tone/precedent of how meetings have typically gone in the past, and the approach supervisors take in organizing and running those meetings. I just meant to say that large groups of people getting together for one stated purpose while ultimately morphing into a continual airing of grievances doesn't end after you finish training.

Like @futureapppsy2, I've seen good discussions on listservs, although there's a lot of variability across the listservs themselves. I've also seen smaller, regularly-meeting groups have excellent discussions, and like @summerbabe, reaching out to 1 or 2 people individually can often also be an excellent resource.
 
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Well are interns allowed to join these listservs of other professionals talking about cases and such? I would much rather use my time there. At this point I have zero idea of the capabilities of any of the other interns so I do not see why I would consult with any of them on anything. And our TD explained the purpose of these meetings is for us to learn to utilize our peers as resources. Well since I don't need advice on great bars in town (and that is all they want to talk about) I simply need new peers.
 
Well are interns allowed to join these listservs of other professionals talking about cases and such? I would much rather use my time there. At this point I have zero idea of the capabilities of any of the other interns so I do not see why I would consult with any of them on anything. And our TD explained the purpose of these meetings is for us to learn to utilize our peers as resources. Well since I don't need advice on great bars in town (and that is all they want to talk about) I simply need new peers.

Depends on the listserv. APA divisions are generally open to all. There are some others like the npsych listserv that allows students, AACN has a community discussion listserv. We also have an ABPP listserv, though it's only open to boarded peeps. May be worth it to start a new thread asking about listservs in specific topic areas that you operate in to get some ideas.
 
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Well are interns allowed to join these listservs of other professionals talking about cases and such? I would much rather use my time there. At this point I have zero idea of the capabilities of any of the other interns so I do not see why I would consult with any of them on anything. And our TD explained the purpose of these meetings is for us to learn to utilize our peers as resources. Well since I don't need advice on great bars in town (and that is all they want to talk about) I simply need new peers.
I've genuinely felt a lot of what you're feeling now when I was in training, but the bolded sentence is a little much. Sure, some interns may not have great training, but many likely do, and there is certainly an opportunity to broaden your horizons here. Throughout my training, it was eye-opening and sometimes helpful to see the differences in how people were trained, what they had experience in, and sometimes, yes, specific experiences that were helpful to my cases. My fellow trainees often had experience in certain populations/therapies/etc. that I did not. Refusing to consult with them before getting to know what these are is a problematic attitude and will not serve you well throughout training and beyond.
 
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Sure, some interns may not have great training, but many likely do, and there is certainly an opportunity to broaden your horizons here.
Great point! And if you ever plan on taking an agency/hospital job, you will work with a wide range of providers including folks on future teams who you diverge greatly from in modality/approach or your perception of their competence.

Yet you'll still be on a team together working towards shared goals and figuring out how to find your co-workers to be valuable resources (including maybe just to meet social needs that brings levity to work) and how to be a valuable resource for them is not only really valuable for that team but will also impact your happiness working in a setting like that and your contributions to that team's dynamics.
At this point I have zero idea of the capabilities of any of the other interns so I do not see why I would consult with any of them on anything.
You've been at internship for a max of 6 weeks and likely less (and with some of that time spent purely on orientation). This is also likely a new location for everybody with no/minimal social support in this area so bar talk would seem pretty normal to me, especially if people's clinical cases are still minimal. I would bet that as the year goes along and people's clinical work picks up, these meetings may turn more towards the original intent.

And I'm probably overstretching but I'd encourage you to reflect on this hasty foreclosure of your colleagues as a possible valuable resource and maybe even whether this might stretch into other professional areas (e.g., foreclosing a patient as unwilling to engage in treatment if they no-show 2 appointments).
 
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@BuckeyeLove @AcronymAllergy So there really is no discussing cases or ethical concerns? *sigh*

I am wrapping up internship, and this has not been my experience at all at any of my practicum sites or internship sites with unsupervised peer consultation. I am sorry to see that it appears to be more common than I had thought it was based on your responses and the responses of others.

What type of site are you at? I am generally in higher-stress CMHC environments with high productivity requirements, so if we are engaging in something we cannot bill for, we tend to NOT want to mess around, and use the time wisely- either by cancelling the meetings if we have nothing, or bringing up ethical and clinical considerations. This year, the intern cohort made sure to meet monthly or every other month outside of internship to have bitchfests via hiking or wine tasting if we needed to. It is possible that your cohort is just trying to get comfortable with each other and get to know each other- how much this early in internship do you even have to dive into, clinically? I don't think we began our peer consultation group until we had begun seeing clients, about a month after we started as it took BOP a bit to process us. Could it also be possible that that is what the hour is saved for, some sort of stress reduction, and not actually peer consultation? I know that some DCTs just want to give interns a protected hour they get paid to chill weekly.

I am curious- is there something about them being less professional, or less competent, that might serve to make you feel good or better about yourself? Just shooting in the dark, and could be totally wrong, but this tendency could definitely paint the way you are seeing their interactions and as someone else said, have you foreclose early on relationships that you maybe should not be dismissing. Or, they truly could be mindlessly f-ing around, and that will suck.
 
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It isn't that I don't think the other interns could have knowledge I don't. I simply have no idea, because the time allocated to be learning such things is not being used to do that and myself and the other intern are outvoted on the 'lets discuss cases' front. We all began seeing clients week two so there is something to talk about. But if they're superstars I'll never know it. I also don't know them well enough personally to say they're just sucky people overall. Our TD's response is the time is designated as peer consultation and is to be structured how the cohort prefers. Mmmkay.......
 
It isn't that I don't think the other interns could have knowledge I don't. I simply have no idea, because the time allocated to be learning such things is not being used to do that and myself and the other intern are outvoted on the 'lets discuss cases' front. We all began seeing clients week two so there is something to talk about. But if they're superstars I'll never know it. I also don't know them well enough personally to say they're just sucky people overall. Our TD's response is the time is designated as peer consultation and is to be structured how the cohort prefers. Mmmkay.......
So, here are my thoughts:

This might get better and it might not, there is only one way to find out...stick it out.

Your TD is not finding extra financial or personnel support for this and you are not a group of kindergartners, so they are going to expect all of you to figure this out amongst yourselves.

That said, this is a great learning opportunity. The truth is that unless you are in solo PP and never need referral sources, this is something you are going to have to deal with on an ongoing basis from here on out. The soft skills of getting along with colleagues and working as part of a team are likely to be more useful to your career than being the best clinician in the world. Better this as a first lesson than having a crappy, absent supervisor( been there). Good luck!
 
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That said, this is a great learning opportunity. The truth is that unless you are in solo PP and never need referral sources, this is something you are going to have to deal with on an ongoing basis from here on out. The soft skills of getting along with colleagues and working as part of a team are likely to be more useful to your career than being the best clinician in the world.
Can't emphasize this enough! Unless somebody had a career and entered psychology later in life, internship is likely the first time one has been in a full-time career role that wasn't augmented with school or something else major.

I learned a ton clinically during internship but just as much about myself as a professional and how I want to try to carry myself in this setting (self-confidence, developing good working relationships with colleagues, figuring out how to have fun at work when it's appropriate, work-life balance, etc). I also saw/experienced stuff at my VA internship that I thought was ridiculous and incompetent and had to figure out how to deal with that appropriately and not let it negatively impact the other 95% of my experience.
I also don't know them well enough personally to say they're just sucky people overall.
Perhaps this can be an opportunity to challenge yourself to get to know them more as people, regardless of whether peer consultation will ever be used well for clinical cases or if you'll reach out to them during informal times for consultation.

In my experience, when people make comments in professional contexts such as "Oh Dr. X is just so great!", it has very little to do with their clinical acumen because most will hardly ever going to be in a position to truly judge another's clinical work directly. Instead, it's all about the soft skills @Sanman mentioned such as friendliness, helpfulness, commitment to their job, humility, joy vs bother to be around, etc.
I simply have no idea, because the time allocated to be learning such things is not being used to do that and myself and the other intern are outvoted on the 'lets discuss cases' front.
I can definitely relate to the frustration of having structured things during training feel less than valuable. However, in my current job, I would kill to have regular downtime to just hang out with colleagues and talk about our kids/pets, what people did last weekend, a new show somebody started watching, etc because mental health work is super stressful and having good bonds with your co-workers is really important to decompress but also to know that you have a group of people to turn to if an all-hands-on-deck kind of crisis arose.
 
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So far I've been showing up every week with questions and/or research related to my cases to discuss, ask if anyone wants to discuss cases, and don't make a fuss when the answer is no. They're chatting about stuff I am not into and myself and the other intern are like those quiet group members that are just sitting amongst the chatter. I guess that's better than complaining every week. Presuming this is just one way they process stress, I suppose it isn't fair to disrupt that.
 
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