What gets written in a committee letter?

[JustForPretend]

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Does anyone know exactly what goes into a committee letter?

I'm right now in the process of getting a committee letter from my pre-med advisor. She has asked me to fill out a rather comprehensive essay questionnaire to help her write the committee letter, and the questionnaire specifically instructs me to be honest about my weaknesses, because that will help her address them in her letter.

I'm trying to decide how completely to follow that advice.

There are some weaknesses (e.g., my freshman year grades) that I will absolutely point out. But if some committee letters say "This student is in the top 10% of students I have ever advised," then I'm going to try to sell myself hard to get that stamp on my letter!

So does anyone know what goes into these letters? Are they all happy happy fluff fluff about how great you are, or do they maintain some shred of credibility by being less enthusiastic about the less good candidates? Should I be, in a sense, "applying" to my own advisor?

THANKS!

Oh, and feel free to move this into another thread. This is my first ever post here, and the idea of posting on page 12 of the "Official LOR Thread" seemed like it wouldn't help organization one bit! But ... who knows ... if that's how it's done.

 

[music2doc]

I'd think the "top 10% of students I've ever advised" statement is going to be largely reserved for students the committee has had regular interaction with and of whose qualities members of the committee can directly attest. In other words, your selling yourself is probably not going to make a huge difference, although it certainly does make some. I asked my advisors to address certain things I thought might need addressing. I also targeted my letter requests, so, for instance, if I my VR had been low (it wasn't), it might have asked a professor who had supervised me as a lab instructor to speak to my communication skills. That professor would have the ability to speak to my ability to communicate, since s/he would know my work as an instructor. I am, however, speaking from the perspective of one whose committee knows him well because I have worked closely with each member of that committee. Your circumstances may be different.

 

[JustForPretend]

I'd think the "top 10% of students I've ever advised" statement is going to be largely reserved for students the committee has had regular interaction with and of whose qualities members of the committee can directly attest. .

I have never understood the point of the committee letter. The "committee" at my school consists of two nice but relatively uninformed people who have never interacted with me in any medical or scientific way. My PI, on the other hand, has seen and directly mentored hundreds of medical students, undergrads, and residents -- isn't that the kind of recommendation that ought to carry weight? What's the point of the committee letter, anyways?
</rant>

EDIT: and ... thanks very much for the responses. That's very helpful!

 

[music2doc]

I have never understood the point of the committee letter. The "committee" at my school consists of two nice but relatively uninformed people who have never interacted with me in any medical or scientific way. My PI, on the other hand, has seen and directly mentored hundreds of medical students, undergrads, and residents -- isn't that the kind of recommendation that ought to carry weight? What's the point of the committee letter, anyways?
</rant>

EDIT: and ... thanks very much for the responses. That's very helpful!

At my school we're in the process of starting [a new] one, actually. (We're overhauling the entire pre-health/pre-med program because our former advising team royally f***ed things up year after year and we finally succeeded in securing the ringleader's resignation.) The med school we're associated with sees it as a way to verify things administratively (e.g., a Dean's letter, integrated perspective of many faculty, etc.). As a student (and more importantly, an applicant), I haven't gotten to sit in on the "how the committee should work" meetings with our affiliate med school adcom, but what I've taken away from the advisors with whom I work closely, the idea is really to give med schools a consistent perspective from our school that integrates the perspectives of multiple faculty and administrators that allows med schools to compare different students from our institution. Of course, every school is different and the perspective of our adcom may be different from that of the other 130-ish US med schools.

 

[JustForPretend]

the idea is really to give med schools a consistent perspective from our school that integrates the perspectives of multiple faculty and administrators that allows med schools to compare different students from our institution.

Interesting. I suppose that makes good sense as an aim. I have also figured that the committee ought to know well what course schedule is difficult, what ECs are fluff, etc., and me able to comment on that.

I think some of the source of my confusion is that the questionnaire I'm supposed to fill out is very extensive. In addition to asking me to talk about volunteering, patient contact, research, it asks for why I want to go to medical school, what are my interpersonal skills like, etc. In total, about 8 or 10 free-response/essay questions. It's more writing than AMCAS ...

 

[orthomyxo]

I have never understood the point of the committee letter. The "committee" at my school consists of two nice but relatively uninformed people who have never interacted with me in any medical or scientific way. My PI, on the other hand, has seen and directly mentored hundreds of medical students, undergrads, and residents -- isn't that the kind of recommendation that ought to carry weight? What's the point of the committee letter, anyways?
</rant>

EDIT: and ... thanks very much for the responses. That's very helpful!

Yea, I don't really understand it either. I've spoken with my adviser one time and I probably won't meet with him again until I'm ready to submit. The whole committee letter thing is just stupid, IMO.

 

[LizzyM]

The letters vary in content and style from one school to another but are quite similar and predictable in style within a single school. The advisor provides a comparision among applicants from the same school that is very helpful to adcoms.

Some schools include information about the school, about the classes typically taken by pre-meds (e.g. which physics sequence is calculus based & which isn't), the grading standards at the school (e.g. that 2.7 is the average gpa there, etc). Some schools have a cover page with some boilerplate along with class rank, gpa and gpa in the major.

Some schools append letters submitted in support of the applicant, some quote from the letters within the text of the committee letter, some schools do both.

Some schools have a commitee interview or a one-on-one interview and report the results of that interview in the letter. Others, obviously, have you write everything and then use that to sing your praises in the letter (Mr. Pretend has considered this decision carefully and has shadowed several medical specialists as well as a pediatrician, a dentist and an occupational therapist.) Some schools include details you've provided about your family (e.g. where they are going to school, their majors, or their professions, or perhaps that one is disabled-- things you might not otherwise have a chance to describe in your application but that are helpful to the adcom).

Finally, many of the schools classify their applicants. Some are more transparent than others about the proportion of students in each tier and a few even tell us what proportion of students in each tier were admitted to med school in the previous year(s). Others are more circumspect and it takes months of experience before you realize that "I highly recommend" is a third tier letter below "most highly" and "very highly". Another school might recommend with enthusiasm, with confidence, or just plain "recommend" which is damning with faint praise.

I tend to batch applications from the same school so that I can compare letters from the same source and get a feel for a particular school's style.

 

[aSagacious]

Why would a committee agree to write a third tier letter? Why not simply tell the applicant that the committee's letter will not help the applicant? Seems like this would be in the best interest of not only the applicant but also the committee (school).

Committee letters are often required.

 

[mohad]

Ok, so from my understanding we need at least 2 science and 1 non science LOR. Does that mean the committee counts as one of these science/non-science letters, or is this ontop of the letters you get from your prof?

 

[mauberley]

Ok, so from my understanding we need at least 2 science and 1 non science LOR. Does that mean the committee counts as one of these science/non-science letters, or is this ontop of the letters you get from your prof?

Generally, your committee letter would be used in place of the 2 sci/1 non-sci requirement. You really need to check each school's requirements, however, as they will vary.

 

[mauberley]

By whom?

The med school to which you are applying.

 

[aSagacious]

By whom?

I'd take a look at the MSAR or school website for this one, as it is on a school-by-school basis. Many schools state that if your undergrad institution has a pre-med committee, then you must obtain one from them (you can include some optional supplementary letters as well).

 

[Ride Big Sky]

At my undergrad the committee letter was basically a composite of letters along with a cover sheet with various statistics. These basically included the types of things like LizzyM was saying, average GPA for the school and major, the various tiers we may fall into (ie: recommend, highly recommend, very highly recommend) and what those signify, stats about the school itself and how it places in various professional schools. From what I've heard all those funky stats and school specific items are what make the committee letter valued.

 

[TOcho118]

Generally, your committee letter would be used in place of the 2 sci/1 non-sci requirement. You really need to check each school's requirements, however, as they will vary.

Please correct me if I'm wrong people, but IMO there's absolutely no way any med school would allow your committee letter to take the place of letters of rec coming from your professors. In my experience, the committee letter was simply used to introduce the applicant/advocate for them and at best is reviewed by the adcom in conjunction with your actual letters of rec.

 

[orthomyxo]

Please correct me if I'm wrong people, but IMO there's absolutely no way any med school would allow your committee letter to take the place of letters of rec coming from your professors.

Nope. The replacing letters thing is true.

 

[Flamen04]

Thank god my school doesn't write committee letters. If you are a small liberal arts college, then yea that's fine. However, the advisors from a big state school will not know you as well as your professors.

 

[DoItToIt]

Some schools append letters submitted in support of the applicant, some quote from the letters within the text of the committee letter, some schools do both.

Some schools have a commitee interview or a one-on-one interview and report the results of that interview in the letter. Others, obviously, have you write everything and then use that to sing your praises in the letter (Mr. Pretend has considered this decision carefully and has shadowed several medical specialists as well as a pediatrician, a dentist and an occupational therapist.) Some schools include details you've provided about your family (e.g. where they are going to school, their majors, or their professions, or perhaps that one is disabled-- things you might not otherwise have a chance to describe in your application but that are helpful to the adcom).

...

Finally, many of the schools classify their applicants. Some are more transparent than others about the proportion of students in each tier and a few even tell us what proportion of students in each tier were admitted to med school in the previous year(s). Others are more circumspect and it takes months of experience before you realize that "I highly recommend" is a third tier letter below "most highly" and "very highly". Another school might recommend with enthusiasm, with confidence, or just plain "recommend" which is damning with faint praise.

This is what my school's health professions committee does. They also have policies where they can only "recommend" an applicant, and attach an overall evaluation letter on top of the standard LORs, if they have an MCAT score above a certain number. A big reason is to retain credibility. A school that highly recommends each applicant with enthusisasm (unless each applicant happens to truly be extremely competitive and qualified) would probably not be taken seriously.

 

[LizzyM]

Thank god my school doesn't write committee letters. If you are a small liberal arts college, then yea that's fine. However, the advisors from a big state school will not know you as well as your professors.

In my experience, the professors at the big state schools don't know the students at all. We've had to educate adcom members about some of the LORs we get from science professors at some schools a they just regurgitate their grade book.... nothing personal at all. Of course, if this is an o-chem class with 300 students, what can you expect?

The committee or advisor generally meets at least once with the applicant but might meet often for several years for advising. The advisor or committee also has access to your transcript, other files, and any letters of recommendation submitted on your behalf (if the committee/advisor serves an Interfolio role of keeping and distributing your letters). Some committees do a med school style interview and report on the applicant's ability to answer those questions.

Why would a school agree to write a 3rd tier letter.... because they also write 4th tier letters, but not very often. The fourth tier is usually someone who has had a major bump in the road and who might be high risk (3.0/25) but who has life experiences and so forth that might make a med school be willing to stretch and take a chance. Some med schools may feel that a student with a 3rd tier recommendation from Duke or Penn is just fine in their book (let's say a 3.5/30 for stats and some of the usual ECs) whereas other schools are looking for more highly recommended students with exceptional records.

 

[mauberley]

Please correct me if I'm wrong people, but IMO there's absolutely no way any med school would allow your committee letter to take the place of letters of rec coming from your professors. In my experience, the committee letter was simply used to introduce the applicant/advocate for them and at best is reviewed by the adcom in conjunction with your actual letters of rec.

Nope. The replacing letters thing is true.

Just to back this up with evidence: from http://www.feinberg.northwestern.edu/admissions/process/requirements/letters.html (emphasis not mine):

Your letters may be written by your college's pre-medical advisory committee, or they may come from three faculty members, at least two of whom are science faculty members, who have taught you.

 

[RogueUnicorn]

Please correct me if I'm wrong people, but IMO there's absolutely no way any med school would allow your committee letter to take the place of letters of rec coming from your professors. In my experience, the committee letter was simply used to introduce the applicant/advocate for them and at best is reviewed by the adcom in conjunction with your actual letters of rec.

did you actually ever apply to med school

 

[aSagacious]

In my experience, the professors at the big state schools don't know the students at all. We've had to educate adcom members about some of the LORs we get from science professors at some schools a they just regurgitate their grade book.... nothing personal at all. Of course, if this is an o-chem class with 300 students, what can you expect?

Thank goodness you guys are aware of this, trying to get a half-decent letter at a Big-10 school is quite the headache (and still I suspect one of my letters to be the 'regurgitated grade book' despite my best efforts).

 

[TOcho118]

Just to back this up with evidence: from http://www.feinberg.northwestern.edu/admissions/process/requirements/letters.html (emphasis not mine):

Is there a chance that we are confusing the ideas of a committee packet versus a committee letter? At my school, the committee packet consisted of a cover letter written by the advising committee (ie. the committee letter) and all the letters of rec I had received. And yes, this packet did take the place of sending individual letters to each school.

I just don't understand the logic behind letter written by pre-med advisor = letters from 3 faculty members who taught you. How can adcoms view these 2 different options in the same light? LizzyM care to elaborate?

 

[mauberley]

Is there a chance that we are confusing the ideas of a committee packet versus a committee letter? At my school, the committee packet consisted of a cover letter written by the advising committee (ie. the committee letter) and all the letters of rec I had received. And yes, this packet did take the place of sending individual letters to each school.

What you had is a committee letter, with supporting materials. Here are the operative definitions from the latest AMCAS instruction manual (page 54):

Committee Letter: A letter authored by a pre-health committee or pre-health advisor and intended to represent your institution's evaluation of you. A committee letter may or may not include additional letters written in support of your application.
Letter Packet: A packet or set of letters assembled and distributed by your institution, often by the institution's career center. A Letter Packet may include a cover sheet from your pre-health committee or advisor; however, in contrast to a Committee Letter, a Letter Packet does not include an evaluative letter from your pre-health committee or advisor.

I think LizzyM has already explained fairly well in this very thread the purpose of a committee letter and its usefulness compared to individual letters.

 

[235788]

Thank god my school doesn't do them and prob won't ever do them.... hell yeah budget cuts 😀

 

[RogueUnicorn]

Is there a chance that we are confusing the ideas of a committee packet versus a committee letter?

if by "we" you mean "I", yes. if your cover letter evaluated you in any way, that's a committee letter. if it just introduced your school and just state some facts about its applicants or whatever, it's a cover letter of a packet. the contents of this thread refer to the former.

more to the point - your premed office will tell you which is the appropriate box to check off. that's the definitive information.

 

[ponyo]

With respect to the weakness thing, I think you should find those weaknesses that raise questions from adcoms based on the rest of your application. It sounds like she'll use the committee letter to help you address these since you can't actually just bring them up for no apparent reason even though they are sure to be noticed. These are things that you wish you could address before you get to the interview stage.

But I can't imagine why you would possibly want to bring something up which nobody would otherwise have noticed. Also I don't think you should mention things that you might know are weak but that might slip under the radar (for example if you did some shadowing but there was little actual interaction). You don't want her to highlight weaknesses unnecessarily.

Disclaimer: not anywhere near experienced