What happens when a categorical at a 6 year program leaves??

[knife to me plz]

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Hey guys,

I was hoping someone can answer this question for me. I know that they made the new requirement that if you're a GS categorical, you cannot leave your home institution after your third year to complete a fellowship elsewhere.

I understand that part.

But what happens if a categorical at one of the 5 or 6 year categorical plastic surgery programs leaves? For example, lets say a plastics categorical leaves after their PGY-1 or 2 year. Is that spot up for grabs by anyone? If I'm a GS categorical at another institution and I hear of the opening, can I apply for it?

Currently applying to both PS and GS programs.

Thanks for any replies!!


PS

I've also been told by a number of people that the attrition rate at thesecategorical programs is as high as 25% in some years! How accurate is this figure?

 

[maxheadroom]

I know residents at several integrated programs. The attrition rate is actually quite low. I couldn't quote a number, but 25% sounds spectacularly high. In the past, for a PGY 1-3 position, a resident at a equal or greater level of training in general surgery has been able to take the position, but they usually have to do some "make-up" work to get in the PGY 1-3 rotations that the Plastics residents did that they didn't complete in GenSurg. Positions for years 4-6 are often filled as a traditional spot, with someone who has completed GenSurg/Ortho/Oto. I think in both cases, the RRC has to approve the resident transferring into the program and the program's plan for the resident's training.

 

[plastikosmd]

i agree that rate is high...i have heard of one person at our program leaving..maybe in the last 15 years or so....25% is more likely a general surgery number that you are thinking of...usually around 20%

 

[deleted144060]

Starting in 2008, ALL plastic (including the 3 years of general surgery training) must be done at the same institution. Even if a PGY-1 leaves, according the to RRC, you cannot transfer to that institution because you cannot repeat a PGY-1 year, therefore you'd be in violation of the above rule.

The 20-30% attrition rate is, as mentioned, for general surgery. People dropping out of combined programs, while it happens, is a rare event nowadays. I think since the 80 hour week, it's getting less in general surgery as well. I don't know that's a good or bad thing, but it is what it is.

Regards,

--M

 

[Pir8DeacDoc]

Starting in 2008, ALL plastic (including the 3 years of general surgery training) must be done at the same institution. Even if a PGY-1 leaves, according the to RRC, you cannot transfer to that institution because you cannot repeat a PGY-1 year, therefore you'd be in violation of the above rule.


Regards,

--M

Why can't someone repeat internship? I have a good friend who is currently repeating internship in a combined plastics program because he didn't match out of med school and did a prelim year.

 

[deleted144060]

Why can't someone repeat internship? I have a good friend who is currently repeating internship in a combined plastics program because he didn't match out of med school and did a prelim year.

Sorry...I should have clarified. You can become a PGY-1 categorical after doing a year as a prelim, but you can't be a "categorical" PGY anything more than once, except under some rare circumstances. The only time I'm aware that this can happen is when a categorical is made to repeat a year because of performance issues. This has to be documented and the resident is supposed to be notified 4 months before the end of the academic year (according to the ACGME rules) so that they may file a grievance if they wish.

For whatever reason they have, the ACGME doesn't recognize the preliminary year as part of a "complete GME program."

--M

 

[Pir8DeacDoc]

thanks for clarifying