What is SGU's current WMPG pass percentage?

Discussion in 'Caribbean' started by aformerstudent, Mar 15, 2017.

  1. SDN is made possible through member donations, sponsorships, and our volunteers. Learn about SDN's nonprofit mission.
  1. aformerstudent

    aformerstudent Banned Banned Account on Hold

    412
    145
    Mar 7, 2017
    I was reading through the Tameer SGU blog and a student who recently matched said that basic sciences WMPG has been bumped from 75 to 82. Can anyone confirm this?

    If this is the case, it just shows you how risky going to the Caribbean is getting as even the for-profit schools are weeding out more aggressively.
     
  2. SDN Members don't see this ad. About the ads.
  3. the argus

    the argus 2+ Year Member

    706
    791
    Mar 3, 2015
    The conclusions you make from looking at unverified arbitrary numbers are meaningless. Maybe they are making the tests easier and people will have overall higher test scores.

    Why would a Caribbean school ever "weed out" students that could otherwise continue on to practice medicine. That's less students, i.e. less money. Caribbean schools make a profit from each individual student, so why on earth would they want to arbitrarily "weed out" more students.

    Despite the nonsense that is stated on this forum, the big Caribbean schools do actually want as many people as possible to graduate. But they also don't want people completing their programs that can't pass the boards. They make their grading and promotion policies as minimal as they can to ensure that most people who make it to the point of the USMLEs can pass them. Caribbean schools accept basically anyone, and they in no way want to "weed" people out. They in fact want as many people as possible to pass, but they also want those who pass to be able to actually complete the USMLE.

    This is what they have always done, and this is what they will continue to do.
     
  4. aformerstudent

    aformerstudent Banned Banned Account on Hold

    412
    145
    Mar 7, 2017
    That was not an essay question man.
     
    barbershop95 likes this.
  5. the argus

    the argus 2+ Year Member

    706
    791
    Mar 3, 2015
    Sorry, thought a longer response was in order because you keep making posts that show you're clueless about what minimum passing scores actually represent.

    Case in point,
     
  6. aformerstudent

    aformerstudent Banned Banned Account on Hold

    412
    145
    Mar 7, 2017
    Are you a Caribbean medical student? If you are not, you should not be responding to my posts or anyone who is on or going down this route as you are not being of any help. The post you so kindly quoted is referring to NBME comp exam scores that most every Carib student takes at the end of basic sciences which are scaled scores.
     
  7. 673441

    673441 Guest

    549
    428
    Feb 20, 2015
    ~ Lost In Translation ~

    Dude... you're back at it again? Give it a rest. You're done with the Caribbean so leave it behind you and move on. I also don't get why you would berate the only person who gave you a response... it was also 100% accurate.
     
  8. shouldigomd

    shouldigomd 5+ Year Member

    173
    121
    Jun 22, 2012
    I don't think it is "risk" as much as competitiveness. SGU and Ross are getting more competitive... Like previously mentioned they aren't making an effort to fail anyone. They want people to succeed and have many resources in place to help students who struggle, but they aren't stupid. They know the statistics and how many people will fail. These are money making machines and if they need more clinical spots there are US hospitals in big cities that are crying for money all over the place....

    It is also true that if you aren't likely to pass the boards then they don't want you to take them. Trust me you don't want to take them either if thats the case...

    I can't speak on behalf of another person and their experience but.... based on my experience if you work hard it really isn't that difficult. I struggled in college and finished my basic sciences with a 90% average. Lets be real though. If you invite 700 people into med school that arguably aren't qualified .... a high % will likely struggle. That is to be expected and should not be shocking.

    I guess the most important question you can ask yourself before going to one of the big carib schools is to truthfully ask yourself if you are capable of changing your ways.
     
    bedevilled ben likes this.
  9. aformerstudent

    aformerstudent Banned Banned Account on Hold

    412
    145
    Mar 7, 2017
    Fair enough. Thank you for the insight.
     
  10. bedevilled ben

    bedevilled ben AFreud of the dark 2+ Year Member

    408
    387
    Aug 28, 2012
    Exactly this. The business model of for-profit schools like this is not difficult to follow. They make money by filling seats. They don't fill seats if nobody Matches. They don't fill seats if everybody fails out in MS1. They don't fill seats if they can't place students in clinical rotations. They know exactly how many students they are likely to lose each term to attrition, exactly how many students they can manage to enroll each term, and what grades/scores students need to be reasonably assured to Match into a preferred specialty. The schools are not looking to "weed out" anybody, they're looking to cast a wide enough net to fill all of their seats, while still maintaining a certain attrition/Match percentage to ensure long-term desirability of their program. As demand for spots increases, they can be more selective in who they take. If demand falls, they will simply lower admissions standards slightly until they again reach that equilibrium. It's not rocket science.
     
    WGSgrad and Goro like this.
  11. Toutie

    Toutie 2+ Year Member

    883
    1,224
    Apr 12, 2015
    How is this not weeding out? :confused:
     
    aformerstudent likes this.
  12. bedevilled ben

    bedevilled ben AFreud of the dark 2+ Year Member

    408
    387
    Aug 28, 2012
    Maybe this is a semantic issue, because it seems to be a real confusing point for a lot of people on these forums. For me, "weeding out" in this context would imply that the school is actively trying to remove students from the program, which as I think I clearly stated above, runs directly counter-current to the aims of a for-profit school. Having a minimum standard is not the same as "weeding out" to me, though perhaps I am indeed in the minority on this.

    I don't recall hearing of USMD or DO schools "weeding out" students from their program when they fail a class. Why do you think that is? I'm sure it's not because of some double standard whereby US students are judged differently than IMG/FMG students.
     
    Last edited: Mar 16, 2017
  13. Toutie

    Toutie 2+ Year Member

    883
    1,224
    Apr 12, 2015
    Semantics indeed.
     
  14. bedevilled ben

    bedevilled ben AFreud of the dark 2+ Year Member

    408
    387
    Aug 28, 2012
    Strong argument.
     
    Toutie likes this.
  15. aformerstudent

    aformerstudent Banned Banned Account on Hold

    412
    145
    Mar 7, 2017
    I believe you are confused with the idea of "weeding out" because you are failing to understand the workings of a for-profit school and how they actually make money. If you were to do the math, you would see that SGU would still be making a substantial amount of money from all of the students that it does graduate. The people that get "weeded-out" simply make more money for the school in addition to the profits that they already make from people that do graduate and SGU does this because they have earned the right to do it! They've earned the reputation over the years and people now flock to the school for a second chance at earning an MD. You do remember that Grenada operates on the EC right? You think all those buildings on campus were built with a price tag in US dollars? Yet they charge you the room fees in US dollars. Lots of money to be made there alone.

    Also when you have "minimum standards" as you suggest and a school accepts students with stats that show that they have not demonstrated the capacity to meet those "minimum standards," then that is either unethical, some scheme disguised to weed them out, or perhaps both.

    US attrition is in the single digits. How you are comparing that number to the Caribbean is :shrug:
     
  16. treefriend

    treefriend

    34
    15
    Aug 17, 2015
    BC, Canada
    @aformerstudent I don't understand how you are putting the sole blame on SGU.
    A student with a 2.7 GPA and a 25 MCAT, do he/she not realize that medicine just isn't for them? Are they that delusional to not understand that medicine is a rigorous program and they do not have the aptitude for it? An average student who attends SGU's 4 year program is at the very least 22 years old. I would say that a 22 year old is mature enough to know and be able to properly gauge his or her potential.

    The students who fail to finish the Caribbean programs were never cut out for medicine to begin with. It's not like these students were perfectly capable to-be-doctors and SGU forcefully/unfairly "weeded them out". They provide ample study resources to all students on campus to succeed and do well. Bottom line is that these subpar students should've known that they arent cut out for med and not have embarked on the journey at all.

    And what on earth makes a student who barely made 50th percentile on the MCAT believe that he/she will not only ace the USMLE but also score better on it than USMD students (it is fairly well known that for IMG's to get a particular residency spot, they need to score higher than USMDs applying for the same spots).
     
    Last edited: Mar 17, 2017
  17. the argus

    the argus 2+ Year Member

    706
    791
    Mar 3, 2015
    Yes, I'm a Ross grad who actually finished school, went through the match, and am now in residency. That's compared to you, who apparently went to a non-big 4 school for some short amount of time, either failed or dropped out, and now you spend your time posting on SDN as an "expert" on Caribbean medical education to "help" other people.

    So I'm sure one of us is qualified to talk about these topics, I'll let others decide who that is...
     
  18. aformerstudent

    aformerstudent Banned Banned Account on Hold

    412
    145
    Mar 7, 2017
    After this post, I'm going to put you on ignore because I can sense a very confrontational and arrogant approach in ALL of your posts which I find concerning and even more disturbing if you are actually a resident who has a responsibility to teach others. And you certainly aren't doing your part to represent Ross the way I think they'd want an alumnus to.

    I think in my first post I had said I dropped out. So get that straight. You don't know me.

    Unless you really do live in a cave, you do realize that an IMG is an IMG right? Big 4 or not, there are people even from MUA that are smarter than you in better residencies than you...who DO NOT have time to post on SDN because they are busy actually saving lives. So think about that and try and humble yourself if you think for a second that you are somehow better than someone because you graduated and someone else struggled. Like I said before, MUA, a tiny school, has a guy in surgery at Hopkins. Why don't you go up to that guy and say "Hey look at me! I'm from Big 4 Ross!!"

    My posts, if you read them slowly and with your finger going over each word, have been focused solely on the basic sciences component of Caribbean medical education so I think I am more than qualified to talk about that. Whether I completed the program or not is honestly irrelevant as you so keenly pointed out. You made it out? Great, good for you :claps:but again, stay humble and realize that there are people all over the islands right now signing drop slips and withdrawal forms who are not going to reach that point. I think they deserve to know how things work down there. If I can do my part to help them see what I saw, then I will. If you don't like it, look the other way.

    To be quite honest with you, I don't know what your argument is. When Caribbean attrition falls into the single digits then maybe people will take you seriously and call me crazy instead. For now, I think it's the other way around.
     
    Last edited: Mar 17, 2017
    Goro likes this.
  19. 673441

    673441 Guest

    549
    428
    Feb 20, 2015
    ~ Lost In Translation ~
    Well, Argus is a doctor. So, I'll take them seriously lol
     
    bears1992 likes this.
  20. aformerstudent

    aformerstudent Banned Banned Account on Hold

    412
    145
    Mar 7, 2017
    When you get to medical school you will understand this concept in practice. SGU or any school is not targeting certain people. There are people with even low incoming stats that end up making it off the island and matching. What a lot of people argue with regards to attrition is that MOST people with a 2.7 and 25 will have a hard time making it out of an accelerated Caribbean program. Some will make the changes to succeed; most will not be able to. As a result, they don't even make it to STEP. Setting the admissions criteria that low is unethical. If a US program did the same thing, the school would get shut down. So if the Caribbean programs are continuing to do it, then it can be inferred that they are indeed weeding students out. My argument has been whether or not taking that risk is worth it for you to apply. The Caribbean is not for every US reject, it's for a very specific student who knows exactly what they are doing.

    There are some people on this forum that can't seem to wrap their head around that idea.
     
    treefriend likes this.
  21. TimeTraveller

    TimeTraveller

    84
    65
    Aug 24, 2016
    Sadly Caribbean schools don't give a **** about their students. Why would they accept a student when they know the student will fail out all in the name of making profit? US schools accept qualified students who actually graduate. I went to SGU and withdrew. If some idiot actually thinks am not cut for medical school or I don't qualify to be a doctor then they will become my laughing stock. Caribbean schools are simply not worth it and with US school expansions its only going to get worse. At SGU, I saw people who worked hard, smart and still couldn't make it but they would have made it for sure in an American school. SCREW Caribbean schools and I hope they all get **** down real soon.
     
    Goro likes this.
  22. aformerstudent

    aformerstudent Banned Banned Account on Hold

    412
    145
    Mar 7, 2017
    I'm sorry to hear that you did not make it at SGU. But now you know how it works down there and that will allow you to calculate your next move. I don't think a school like SGU will be closing it's doors any time soon though. What I do see is SGU continuing to raise their admissions standards and also continuing to raise the bar with minimum passing scores. A lot of Caribbean schools are not worth the risk but the right student can succeed at SGU and possibly Ross and still come out a doctor by taking that route. Is it risky? Absolutely, especially today.
     
  23. aformerstudent

    aformerstudent Banned Banned Account on Hold

    412
    145
    Mar 7, 2017
    :smack:

    :shrug: If every student from every Caribbean school passed STEP1 and STEP 2, like you are suggesting Caribbean schools are advocating, there aren't enough residencies for them. Can you say lawsuit?
     
    Goro likes this.
  24. treefriend

    treefriend

    34
    15
    Aug 17, 2015
    BC, Canada
    I guess I see what you're trying to say. Idk, i can excuse low GPAs but a low MCAT score, I still feel, should tell the student that med ain't for them. Add to the fact that it is also in the Caribbean..a new country, stigmatized etc..
    But I can see how some people might feel cheated or taken for a ride. They shouldn't have been accepted in the first place or their money for first semester should be refunded..
    I'm sorry for your experience.
     
  25. bedevilled ben

    bedevilled ben AFreud of the dark 2+ Year Member

    408
    387
    Aug 28, 2012
    You have no idea what you're talking about. Explain to me clearly how a student leaving the program makes MORE money for SGU than a student that stays in for 4+ years.

    Would it make you feel better if they charged it in EC? I can't fathom the point you're trying to make here. Yes, it's a very expensive school. Yes, I'm sure construction and labor costs are significantly cheaper in Grenada than they are in the US. What the hell is your point? The amount of money that SGU makes off of room and board is quite a small portion of the overall tuition.

    No it's not, that's a completely false dichotomy. Cutting students from the program because they fail to meet a minimum standard is neither unethical nor a scheme to weed out students. They are not actively trying to remove students from the program, they are trying to preserve credentialing standards and their passing Step/Match rates. Students are aware of those minimum standards well before they ever set foot on the island, and the school gives students MULTIPLE opportunities to correct deficiencies before they will fail them out entirely. Those opportunities, by the way, make the school a ton of money on their own. Deceling a class makes the school a proportionally larger profit because they're expending significantly fewer resources on a student and charging them a hefty fee for the chance to redo part of a class.

    Certainly never did that, you're just making up straw-mans at this point.
     
  26. IMGyn

    IMGyn

    6
    3
    Sep 16, 2016
    It's probably the alcohol talking, but myself and 840+ other SGU MS4's survived the "weeding out" process and matched into US residencies this year, so the school much be doing something right. Sorry for those that couldn't make it, but it's definitely not impossible. Dreams do come true!
     
    567WingsO'Heaven likes this.
  27. the argus

    the argus 2+ Year Member

    706
    791
    Mar 3, 2015
    I won't really comment on this ridiculous diatribe other than to say I was in no way saying I'm smarter or more qualified than every MUA grad. I was saying I'm more qualified than you specifically, who is neither an MUA student or graduate. You aren't thoughtful enough to realize that since you didn't actually complete the process of medical school, maybe your declarations aren't as informed or knowledgable as you think they are.
    First off, that's just factually incorrect. >3500 foreign-IMGs continue to match every year (>3800 in 2017 actually). All the data shows that other than the small percentage of superstar foreign-IMG applicants from top universities abroad, US-IMGs are favored over foreign-IMGs by residency programs. Unless you are going to claim that >3500 people fail out of Caribbean schools every year, then your argument is nonsense.

    And what exactly would a lawsuit look like. No Caribbean school that I'm aware of guarantees graduates a residency spot (Ross surely didn't when I enrolled). In fact, Ross actually puts on their website that only 91% of grads matched into residency within 2 years of graduating. So again, another super well thought out point on your part...
     
    567WingsO'Heaven likes this.
  28. aformerstudent

    aformerstudent Banned Banned Account on Hold

    412
    145
    Mar 7, 2017
    It's the alcohol. But congratulations and best of luck to you as you start your residency. Whether it's SGU or any other Caribbean school, I do have a lot of respect for anyone that makes it through that process and succeeds.
     
  29. aformerstudent

    aformerstudent Banned Banned Account on Hold

    412
    145
    Mar 7, 2017
    Now what's the point of all of this? I'm just saying know what you're signing up for when you sign up to go down to the Caribbean. It really is not for everybody. You and a few of your compadres somehow think this is somehow about you. This is for the majority of students who apply to SGU and other Caribbean schools thinking it's a legitimate path to a guaranteed MD. Perhaps for a few but certainly not for everyone.
     
    Last edited: Mar 18, 2017
  30. Skip Intro

    Skip Intro Registered User 10+ Year Member

    3,053
    598
    Apr 29, 2002
    This year's Match stats mete out everything the argus has said on this and other threads with regards to this specific topic.

    -Skip
     
    WGSgrad and 567WingsO'Heaven like this.
  31. npappasan

    npappasan

    109
    103
    Nov 5, 2016
    SGU - Residency Appointment Directory

    Looking at the list, the appointments are not too shabby. A bunch of surgery and ob-gyn placements, which are moderately competitive. One guy matched categorical in neurosurgery! I know I'll probably get flamed but I think this shows that the Carib route can work out for the right student.
     
  32. The Wobblie

    The Wobblie 7+ Year Member

    229
    107
    Jul 12, 2009
    Physician
    There's one person listed as having matched into my program that didn't actually match there. I'm curious how accurate these lists really are.
     
    gyngyn likes this.
  33. TimeTraveller

    TimeTraveller

    84
    65
    Aug 24, 2016
    Geesh dude relax. I doubt they would actually put an inaccurate list
     
  34. gyngyn

    gyngyn Professor Lifetime Donor Gold Donor SDN Moderator 5+ Year Member

    There is no oversight and no repercussion for "errors."
     
    WGSgrad, throw_away5122 and Goro like this.
  35. the argus

    the argus 2+ Year Member

    706
    791
    Mar 3, 2015
    Which specialty? Would make it more verifiable without blowing your anonymity.
     
    treefriend likes this.
  36. CleganeBowlis4Real

    CleganeBowlis4Real

    1,085
    989
    Nov 24, 2015
    A lot of times these errors are the result of there being multiple community branches of bigger residency programs. The people who end up making these lists usually dont know every program or for example the difference between NYU Lutheran and the main NYU program, so every NYU community program gets listed as NYU. Its something that I have seen happen at American schools, and is bound to happen at a school as big as the caribbean schools.
     
  37. gyngyn

    gyngyn Professor Lifetime Donor Gold Donor SDN Moderator 5+ Year Member

    The NRMP sends the school a match list with the exact name of the program.
     
    Goro likes this.
  38. the argus

    the argus 2+ Year Member

    706
    791
    Mar 3, 2015
    SGU publishes the name of the student along with where they matched. Seems unlikely they would maliciously post incorrect information as is being implied by @gyngyn
     
  39. The Wobblie

    The Wobblie 7+ Year Member

    229
    107
    Jul 12, 2009
    Physician
    I'd prefer not to say, not just to protect my anonymity but the anonymity of the person in question.

    This might explain it. My institution has community branches across all of the specialties that are not necessarily distinguishable unless you put in the city of the residency. I'm not in NY so it's possible that whoever made the list assumed the program that the person matched into was mine even if it might be a community branch program with a similar name but a different city if they don't know the area.
     
  40. Goro

    Goro 7+ Year Member

    Do not underestimate the power of ignorance, or wishful thinking. I see way too many posts in SDN from people contemplating the Carib diploma mills who think they they'll be the ones to hit 250 on Steps.

    The DDx for a Caribbean grad is pretty off-putting: bad judgment, bad advice, egotism, gullibility, overbearing parents, inability to delay gratification, IA's, legal problems, weak research skills, high risk behavior. This is not to say that all of them still have the quality that drew them into this situation. There is just no way to know which ones they are.


    I know a Lotto winner too. But I wouldn't use that as a strategy to prepare for retirement income.

    Cue the Lotto winners to come in sputtering ..."but but, NRMP!"


     
  41. the argus

    the argus 2+ Year Member

    706
    791
    Mar 3, 2015
    To compare matching out of the Caribbean to winning the lotto is not only insulting, but also shows a fundamental lack of basic knowledge about match statistics.

    Please scurry back to the pre-osteopathic forum where you're at least somewhat qualified to make proclamations.

    Please explain why a non-physician PhD who teaches basic science at an osteopathic medical school would have the experience or expertise to make statements on how Caribbean grads are judged by residency PDs. Time spent trolling SDN doesn't count...
     
    ewax and 567WingsO'Heaven like this.
  42. TimeTraveller

    TimeTraveller

    84
    65
    Aug 24, 2016
    Lol you such an idiot. Goro is definitely respected all across this board. I honestly don't believe that you are a resident.
     
    throw_away5122 and Aonyx like this.
  43. the argus

    the argus 2+ Year Member

    706
    791
    Mar 3, 2015
    Speaking of people who have no experience or expertise but still feel for some reason that their comments are necessary...
     
  44. TimeTraveller

    TimeTraveller

    84
    65
    Aug 24, 2016
    I have no experience? Don't play yourself dude. I was in SGU for a year and I know how ****ty the Caribbean is.
     
  45. aformerstudent

    aformerstudent Banned Banned Account on Hold

    412
    145
    Mar 7, 2017
    What I'm confused about is why is that dude who you are referring to is posting so much stuff in favor of the Caribbean when he already matched and is done with the Caribbean experience? I merely started the thread to warn other PROSPECTIVE students about the risks associated with going down the Caribbean route especially today and this guy keeps making strange posts about how he is the authority on Caribbean matching statistics and how anybody who doesn't make it through the program has no say on the issue. There is zero logic in his argument unless I'm speaking a different language and he's just not getting it. When the statistics show that around 50% of IMG's are matching, who in their right mind would advocate going down that path without at least some caution? That dude seriously scares me. The Caribbean today is not the Caribbean of 10 years ago.

    You know and I know what goes on at these schools and it is NOT in favor of the student. Every prospective pre-med going down that route deserves to know that before they make that decision because just like you and I had our difficulties, there will be others to come who fall victim to the trap. This guy is somehow sending the message to those same students that these schools want you to succeed and that you are going to succeed. I'm sure they do want you to succeed but they also could care less if you don't. And the program and recruiting are designed to highlight the latter.

    On a side note, I hope you're not giving up on med school. Stay focused, improve your stats, and get it done.
     
  46. mw18

    mw18 2+ Year Member

    760
    731
    Jan 7, 2014
    I was under the impression that Caribbean schools had limited numbers of openings for clinical rotations, so part of the hustle is to make as much money as possible in the preclinical years (accept everyone) where it's almost unlimited and cheap and then only let the number of people you have rotations for advance (weed out, while also limiting the number of failures and non-matches that make you look bad). Is this not accurate? I'm genuinely asking. This question to answer why a for-profit school would dismiss someone when they make money by having them. I am truly just curious (already a med student in the U.S.) and not trying to argue.
     
  47. aformerstudent

    aformerstudent Banned Banned Account on Hold

    412
    145
    Mar 7, 2017
    That's accurate I suppose. Do you feel that is fair for the unassuming student?
     
  48. the argus

    the argus 2+ Year Member

    706
    791
    Mar 3, 2015
    I'm not saying I'm the absolute authority, I'm saying you guys don't know what you're talking about. I also post so PROSPECTIVE students get actual accurate information to make an informed choice, not the ramblings of disgruntled former students or non-physicians with no relevant experience.

    This is exemplified by the fact that you claim only 50% of IMGs are matching and that its much different now than 10 years ago. Much higher than 50% of US-IMGs match overall. The numbers you see in the NRMP reports are counting re-applicants, which by including them with fresh graduates way oversamples the yearly unmatched cohort of applicants and skews the data. And if you actually look at the ACGME data, you'll plainly see that basically the same number of IMGs are matching now than were 10 years ago.

    http://www.nrmp.org/wp-content/uplo...tional-Medical-Graduates-Revised.PDF-File.pdf
    look at the mean time since graduation for unmatched US-IMGs. I'll give you a sneak-peak, they're mostly not fresh graduates. Ross specifically states on their website, if you graduate without any USMLE failures, 99% match within 2 years. Out of all graduates (including those with USMLE failures) 91% will match within 2 years.

    http://www.acgme.org/About-Us/Publi...Graduate-Medical-Education-Data-Resource-Book
    On page 79 you will see that the number of AMGs (USMD + DO) starting residency each year has increased quite a bit over the past decade, but the number of IMGs has stayed mostly stable. That's because the increase in residency positions on a yearly basis has basically equaled the increase in AMGs.
     
  49. PossibleDOC?

    PossibleDOC?

    290
    214
    Mar 30, 2016
    Please note that the argus really does make a good point you can match over 90% of the time from the Caribbean!....if you're willing to wait two years, pray, do SOAP twice, have excellent board scores with a std of +10pts (most specialties require at least that to match as a IMG...something argus ALWAYS fails to mention in his NRMP posts), no problems in your rotations, and basically be a candidate from Harvard but from the Caribbean, and then maybe get the random residency out in Wyoming......but please go for it!

    This n=1 has to stop, the Caribbean is risky we all know this, and its unfortunate that people like the argus prop it up to be this magnificent alternative. I give him/her credit they made it through and congrats to that but again I personally wouldn't want to wait 2 years AFTER i graduated to start my residency in something like psych which I have no interest in. Remember Caribbean grads match into their first choice but thats because they have changed their first choice from IM in their home state for example like in Pennsylvania, to IM in Alaska, or psych in Georgia its a victory all around but you are limiting yourself and with all the effort and time put in wouldn't you want to be happy with the outcome. I know being a psych isnt something I want to do....if thats you then you're good to go if not then see what you can do in the US first.
     
    aformerstudent likes this.
  50. pseud0

    pseud0

    427
    538
    Feb 10, 2016
    They need to weed out students because their corporate overlords couldn't afford to bribe enough hospitals around the US for MS3 clinical rotation spots... so they only have enough space for like half the MS1 class size.


    So the idea is...take as much money as you can from as many people as you can during MS1+MS2, but cut enough of the crappier students so that they can find the better ones clinical spots. They still get the MS1+2 money from the crappier students who could never pass the steps anyway, which is many thousands of dollars.

    It's really not that hard to figure out and has been discussed ad nauseam on this forum.
     
    aformerstudent and PossibleDOC? like this.
  51. the argus

    the argus 2+ Year Member

    706
    791
    Mar 3, 2015
    What really needs to stop is people like you posting nonsense. Please go back and find some of my quotes that "prop up" the Caribbean as a "magnificent alternative." Please.

    I repeatedly say to exhaust all US options for 2 cycles before considering the Caribbean. I also repeatedly say 25% of people that start fail to graduate. And another 10% that do graduate never match. I also repeatedly say most Caribbean grads are limited to primary care specialties, and you are limited in program tier within specialty. I also say you have to apply very broadly and be willing to go anywhere to match.

    And your nonsense about having to have higher board scores to match out of the Caribbean is just ridiculous. There's data available. Matched US-IMGs have lower board scores than matched USMDs in most specialties. That's just a fact. To compete with a USMD at a particular program you have to outscore them, but overall board scores are lower. This is freely available information.

    And this n=1 argument is also nonsense. Look at the SGU match list over the past few years. You'll see >350 people yearly from SGU matching into university primary care or non-primary care specialties. Ross is about the same. I don't claim to be a special snowflake, I'm not.

    So what am I sugar coating? Please, find some examples where I say things that aren't true.
     

Share This Page