What would a "medicare-for-all" system look like?

[deleted927028]

Nope. Private investment money will pursue research if there is a profit potential and private donations for a charitable emotion.... no public research needed

Here is another article on the same subject with a lot of good information

Taxpayers — not Big Pharma — have funded the research behind every new drug since 2010 | Other98

A grassroots activist network committed to fighting Big Banks, Big Oil, and Big Pharma.

other98.com

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Members don't see this ad.

 

[deleted927028]

The US government spends 64 million on research and invents sofosbuvir. It costs only $100 for 12 weeks supply. The private company Gilead gets the patent and it sells the $100 medication for $84,000. Can you believe this? This is the same company behind truvada price gouging. Do you see the pattern?

 

[deleted927028]

The US government spends 64 million on research and invents sofosbuvir. It costs only $100 for 12 weeks supply. The private company Gilead gets the patent and it sells the $100 medication for $84,000. Can you believe this? This is the same company behind truvada price gouging. Do you see the pattern?

The same medicine gets sold for $500 in India. Still 400% profit.

 

[deleted480308]

The US government spends 64 million on research and invents sofosbuvir. It costs only $100 for 12 weeks supply. The private company Gilead gets the patent and it sells the $100 medication for $84,000. Can you believe this? This is the same company behind truvada price gouging. Do you see the pattern?

That’s an absurd misrepresentation of the story. You know better

 

[deleted927028]

The US government spends 64 million on research and invents sofosbuvir. It costs only $100 for 12 weeks supply. The private company Gilead gets the patent and it sells the $100 medication for $84,000. Can you believe this? This is the same company behind truvada price gouging. Do you see the pattern?

Gilead made $60 billion on this drug alone in the first five years.

 

[deleted480308]

Gilead made $60 billion on this drug alone in the first five years.

So?

 

[deleted927028]

That’s an absurd misrepresentation of the story. You know better

We will never get to know 100% truth about what is happening out there. But there is sufficient information there not to dismiss as misrepresentation. But I am really happy to know there are more people out there who share the same belief as me. Gosh, I am not crazy.

 

[deleted927028]

So?

They had no right to it, it is stolen money. That money belongs to the US government/people just like the revenue of oil and natural gas companies.

 

[VA Hopeful Dr]

The US government spends 64 million on research and invents sofosbuvir. It costs only $100 for 12 weeks supply. The private company Gilead gets the patent and it sells the $100 medication for $84,000. Can you believe this? This is the same company behind truvada price gouging. Do you see the pattern?

And remind me, what entity is it that grants patents?

 

[Gyuji]

Public Opinion on Single-Payer, National Health Plans, and Expanding Access to Medicare Coverage | KFF

For many years, Kaiser Family Foundation has been tracking public opinion on the idea of a national health plan (including language referring to Medicare-for-all since 2017). Historically, our polls have shown support for the federal government doing more to help provide health insurance for...

www.kff.org

It would be interesting if the GOP offered something as far as healthcare reform to compare and see if the popularity of the single-payer system would be as popular (as I suspect some of its popularity is due to a absent of contrary policy from the GOP thus nothing to compare it to)... but well... here we are...

GOP offered Trumpcare(a.k.a. Ryancare) in 2017, which is more of an individual-mandate than Obamacare, and pulled an abysmal approval rating of 9% among the public. Rand Paul proposes his reform which was bad: catastrophe insurance with health savings account. GOP offered a reform pre-Trump to replace Obamacare with Obamacare after reappealling Obamacare over 60 times. This just show you - GOP have no where to go because their own healthcare reform is already been implemented yet they won't support Obamacare due to their obnoxious objectionist mindset.

Obamacare, also known as, Romneycare, is a right-wing reform. Originally written by right-wing corporate think-tank The Heritage Foundation in the 1980's as a response to the liberal proposal of single-payer that was propose by Bob Dole in his 1996 presidential campaign in which ultra-conservatives Newt Gringrich and Chuck Grassley supported after blasting Hillarycare which is the same thing. Similar to Nixoncare and JimmyCarterCare(yes, Carter is a Democrat but fiscally conservative) as a response to Ted Kennedy's universal health care bill in the 70's.

In our modern age of politics, it just shows you that GOP have no ideas other than deregulation and tax cuts with conspired help with the Democrats.

 

[deleted480308]

GOP offered Trumpcare(a.k.a. Ryancare) in 2017, which is more of an individual-mandate than Obamacare, and pulled an abysmal approval rating of 9% among the public. Rand Paul proposes his reform which was bad: catastrophe insurance with health savings account. GOP offered a reform pre-Trump to replace Obamacare with Obamacare after reappealling Obamacare over 60 times. This just show you - GOP have no where to go because their own healthcare reform is already been implemented yet they won't support Obamacare due to their obnoxious objectionist mindset.

Obamacare, also known as, Romneycare, is a right-wing reform. Originally written by right-wing corporate think-tank The Heritage Foundation in the 1980's as a response to the liberal proposal of single-payer that was propose by Bob Dole in his 1996 presidential campaign in which ultra-conservatives Newt Gringrich and Chuck Grassley supported after blasting Hillarycare which is the same thing. Similar to Nixoncare and JimmyCarterCare(yes, Carter is a Democrat but fiscally conservative) as a response to Ted Kennedy's universal health care bill in the 70's.

In our modern age of politics, it just shows you that GOP have no ideas other than deregulation and tax cuts with conspired help with the Democrats.

Deregulation and tax cuts are generally awesome

 

[deleted480308]

They had no right to it, it is stolen money. That money belongs to the US government/people just like the revenue of oil and natural gas companies.

No right to sell the product they bought? That’s an odd assessment

 

[Gyuji]

Deregulation and tax cuts are generally awesome

Not really. Causes more problems than good. We're heading into a recession because of it.

 

[deleted480308]

Not really. Causes more problems than good. We're heading into a recession because of it.

Spend less and print less money.

 

[SurfingDoctor]

GOP offered Trumpcare(a.k.a. Ryancare) in 2017, which is more of an individual-mandate than Obamacare, and pulled an abysmal approval rating of 9% among the public. Rand Paul proposes his reform which was bad: catastrophe insurance with health savings account. GOP offered a reform pre-Trump to replace Obamacare with Obamacare after reappealling Obamacare over 60 times. This just show you - GOP have no where to go because their own healthcare reform is already been implemented yet they won't support Obamacare due to their obnoxious objectionist mindset.

Obamacare, also known as, Romneycare, is a right-wing reform. Originally written by right-wing corporate think-tank The Heritage Foundation in the 1980's as a response to the liberal proposal of single-payer that was propose by Bob Dole in his 1996 presidential campaign in which ultra-conservatives Newt Gringrich and Chuck Grassley supported after blasting Hillarycare which is the same thing. Similar to Nixoncare and JimmyCarterCare(yes, Carter is a Democrat but fiscally conservative) as a response to Ted Kennedy's universal health care bill in the 70's.

In our modern age of politics, it just shows you that GOP have no ideas other than deregulation and tax cuts with conspired help with the Democrats.

I mean, they didn’t really offer anything because that wasn’t a serious plan. That was just slinging crap against the wall in the hope that something would stick. The premise was to just have the government invest less. But if anyone thought that was a serious plan to reign in healthcare costs, they are sorely mistaken. Granted the ACA didn’t necessarily tackle costs either, though it had the premise that more people who have primary care if they were covered and save in the long run. Didn’t quite work out that way, but the theory was nice. The GOP attempt was more like “not our problem”. I mean, that’s very subjective, but that’s not necessarily what voters want to hear.

 

[deleted927028]

And remind me, what entity is it that grants patents?

Of course, it is the government agency, anyone can see that. But you can’t stop at just scratching the surface , throw up hands and just give up. You have to dig deeper, call out all the culprits whoever they are, bring them to justice and ensure no such thing ever happens again. Ironically it can happen only through an elected politicians, so we have to back the right ones. The ongoing theft is an insult to our intelligence and slap on the face of all the citizens irrespective of our differences.

See, no government employee can grant the patent to anyone unilaterally. The drug companies buy off the politicians and the top elected government officials, write the laws the way they want and loot the country and its citizens. Government employees are forced to go along with them, they are just pawns who take orders. If you take out all of these criminals, everything will be fine. I still believe that law enforcement works fine in our country, it is just the law making process is corrupt that gives the wrong impression that we can’t do anything.

One thing, please do not assume that I blindly support the government and berate the private entities. I call spade a spade, that’s all. Every one should be held accountable whoever they are.

BTW, @VA Hopeful Dr, you are a good man !!!

 

[deleted927028]

Deregulation and tax cuts are generally awesome

You can’t make such a blanket statement without knowing what regulation it is, why it was enacted and repercussions of revoking it. Tax cuts are generally irresponsible. At the appropriate time we can entertain some if it comes with matching spending cut.

 

[deleted927028]

No right to sell the product they bought? That’s an odd assessment

This shows that you did not go through the information provided in the link. Please be serious.

 

[deleted480308]

You can’t make such a blanket statement without knowing what regulation it is, why it was enacted and repercussions of revoking it. Tax cuts are generally irresponsible. At the appropriate time we can entertain some if it comes with matching spending cut.

Tax cuts are morally right, that money doesn’t belong to the govt

 

[VA Hopeful Dr]

Of course, it is the government agency, anyone can see that. But you can’t stop at just scratching the surface , throw up hands and just give up. You have to dig deeper, call out all the culprits whoever they are, bring them to justice and ensure no such thing ever happens again. Ironically it can happen only through an elected politicians, so we have to back the right ones. The ongoing theft is an insult to our intelligence and slap on the face of all the citizens irrespective of our differences.

See, no government employee can grant the patent to anyone unilaterally. The drug companies buy off the politicians and the top elected government officials, write the laws the way they want and loot the country and its citizens. Government employees are forced to go along with them, they are just pawns who take orders. If you take out all of these criminals, everything will be fine. I still believe that law enforcement works fine in our country, it is just the law making process is corrupt that gives the wrong impression that we can’t do anything.

One thing, please do not assume that I blindly support the government and berate the private entities. I call spade a spade, that’s all. Every one should be held accountable whoever they are.

BTW, @VA Hopeful Dr, you are a good man !!!

But see this is the whole problem. You want to give more power to the government. The very government that per you is selling us out to corporations. What makes you think that giving the government more power is going to make it less corrupt?

Once you give enough power to the government, you lose the ability to hold it accountable.

 

[deleted927028]

But see this is the whole problem. You want to give more power to the government. The very government that per you is selling us out to corporations. What makes you think that giving the government more power is going to make it less corrupt?

Once you give enough power to the government, you lose the ability to hold it accountable.

I am really sorry to say this but I don’t get what you are trying to convey .

The politicians or the government as you prefer to call, already have all the power they need. They can pretty much can do anything they want to, even now. I do not honestly understand how demanding/forcing the politicians to do what they are supposed to do (work for the people rather than the corporations), is somehow going to give them additional power. May be, you can give some examples.

If you still fear that they Government will harm/control the population, don’t the population have the option to vote them out?

 

[deleted927028]

But see this is the whole problem. You want to give more power to the government. The very government that per you is selling us out to corporations. What makes you think that giving the government more power is going to make it less corrupt?

Once you give enough power to the government, you lose the ability to hold it accountable.

From your viewpoint, what could be the possible option to stop this? What will work?

 

[deleted927028]

But see this is the whole problem. You want to give more power to the government. The very government that per you is selling us out to corporations. What makes you think that giving the government more power is going to make it less corrupt?

Once you give enough power to the government, you lose the ability to hold it accountable.

See, we are putting a thousands of criminals in the jail every day. The government already has that power. Then why you are you being apprehensive about declaring “gifting patent of inventions done by using government money, to private entities “ as illegal and putting these criminals in the jail? How this will give the politicians/government additional power? I am not harassing you but honestly trying to understand what you are trying to convey. That’s all.

 

[321931]

Nurses will be offered supermarket discounts to persuade them to stay in the NHS

Nurses will be offered supermarket discounts and cheap gym membership as part of efforts to persuade workers stay in the NHS, health chiefs will say.

www.telegraph.co.uk

So apparently the NHS- single payer system- in Britain is so bad- they are giving nurses supermarket discounts to stay in the service!

 

[SurfingDoctor]

Nurses will be offered supermarket discounts to persuade them to stay in the NHS

Nurses will be offered supermarket discounts and cheap gym membership as part of efforts to persuade workers stay in the NHS, health chiefs will say.

www.telegraph.co.uk

So apparently the NHS- single payer system- in Britain is so bad- they are giving nurses supermarket discounts to stay in the service!

I know. Thank god we don’t have nursing shortages and turnover in this country.

 

[Gyuji]

Nurses will be offered supermarket discounts to persuade them to stay in the NHS

Nurses will be offered supermarket discounts and cheap gym membership as part of efforts to persuade workers stay in the NHS, health chiefs will say.

www.telegraph.co.uk

So apparently the NHS- single payer system- in Britain is so bad- they are giving nurses supermarket discounts to stay in the service!

that's what happens when you got right-wing government with two right-wing political parties that follow the neoliberal principle for the last 40 years. Thanks to Thatcher, austerity been a growing problem to the UK. Tories have been trying to privatize NHS bit by bit.

 

[deleted480308]

See, we are putting a thousands of criminals in the jail every day. The government already has that power. Then why you are you being apprehensive about declaring “gifting patent of inventions done by using government money, to private entities “ as illegal and putting these criminals in the jail? How this will give the politicians/government additional power? I am not harassing you but honestly trying to understand what you are trying to convey. That’s all.

The govt should have less power.

 

[Gyuji]

I mean, they didn’t really offer anything because that wasn’t a serious plan. That was just slinging crap against the wall in the hope that something would stick. The premise was to just have the government invest less. But if anyone thought that was a serious plan to reign in healthcare costs, they are sorely mistaken. Granted the ACA didn’t necessarily tackle costs either, though it had the premise that more people who have primary care if they were covered and save in the long run. Didn’t quite work out that way, but the theory was nice. The GOP attempt was more like “not our problem”. I mean, that’s very subjective, but that’s not necessarily what voters want to hear.

They did. They almost dismantle Obamacare and replacing it with Trumpcare which is another disguise for corporations to get more tax cuts and removing state lines in order to all HMOs to move to Delaware. Only saved by the "maverick" St. John McCain at the last minute and everyone see him as a hero. The only reason he voted to save Obamacare was to flip the middle finger to Trump for that "He's a hero because he was captured. I like the ones who weren't captured" comment. Just for a petty reason, and even Trump called McCain to change his vote afterward..

The thing about the Obamacare, or the individual-mandate system, is to keep private insurance in business and in control. Could have been better with the public option or in other word, expand Medicaid. But HMOs and donors squeezed Obama to not pass the public option.

As I said before, the Obamacare is a right-wing healthcare reform that is a rip-off of Romneycare that is rip-off the healthcare reform made from right-wing corporate think-tank the Heritage Foundation in the late-1980's that was supported by ultra-conservative Newt Gringrich and Chuck Grassley when Bob Dole proposed it during his 1996 presidential campaign.

The Republicans should be the ones embracing Obamacare at the moment and trying to make it better. But since it was the Democrats and a Democrat president who did it when they had super-majority(2009-2011), the Republicans just want to destroy it because it was implemented by a black Democratic president with a Muslim-like name who should be looked up to by these obnoxious Republicans as Obama is the second-coming of St. Reagan, and replace with another reform similar to Obamacare. That's all the Republicans got when it comes to healthcare but they and the Democrats are playing political football to undermine the real issues going on in the nation.

 

[Gyuji]

The govt should have less power.

Well-known libertarian, Ayn Rand, lived off of Medicare and Social Security in her later years. She didn't complain about it...

 

[deleted480308]

Well-known libertarian, Ayn Rand, lived off of Medicare and Social Security in her later years. She didn't complain about it...

That’s like saying it was ok to mug me if I agree to accept some of losses back after the mugging.

It’s a poor argument

 

[AnatomyGrey12]

If you still fear that they Government will harm/control the population, don’t the population have the option to vote them out?

Do you know anything at all about the history of governments who were given more and more power? Long story short, it isn't pretty.

 

[Gyuji]

Do you know anything at all about the history of governments who were given more and more power? Long story short, it isn't pretty.

Sweden, Finland, Norway and Denmark are doing okay with strong union, labour laws, strict regulations on banks and corporations.

Have you seen how privatization, or in other word - corporatization, does to a nation? It's not pretty at all on multiple cases.

 

[Stagg737]

They had no right to it, it is stolen money. That money belongs to the US government/people just like the revenue of oil and natural gas companies.

One could make the same argument about government taxes. "They had no right to it, it is stolen money. That money belongs to the taxpayers"...

If you still fear that they Government will harm/control the population, don’t the population have the option to vote them out?

Oh sweet summer child...

Sweden, Finland, Norway and Denmark are doing okay with strong union, labour laws, strict regulations on banks and corporations.

Have you seen how privatization, or in other word - corporatization, does to a nation? It's not pretty at all on multiple cases.

And now let's look at other nations were govs were given excess power like Venezuela, Cuba, or almost any Latin American country. Picking a handful of nations where a policies vaguely fit what you're arguing does not make the underlying theory any stronger.

 

[Generic.name]

So interestingly, I had to start a patient on one of the new sub-q cholesterol drugs last week. Patient is uninsured so I go looking at the drug company's patient assistance program.

You can get the drug for free if your income is less than 500% of the federal poverty level. This woman lived with her husband, so as long as they made less than 82.3k/year she got the drug for free.

This of course caught my interest. Novo Nordisk (makes lots of insulins) will do the same for 400% FPL. For a childless couple, this translates to 67.6k/year.

Not too shabby.

Novo Nordisk Patient Assistance Program (PAP) | NovoCare®

Apply for the Novo Nordisk Patient Assistance Program (PAP) to see if you qualify to receive your Novo Nordisk diabetes medicine at no cost.

www.novocare.com

I am not a doctor, so I don't know how long one normally needs to treat chronic problems like cholesterol and diabetes, cough, but Novo Nordisk's website on patient assistance indicates that "Patients who are approved for the PAP may qualify to receive free diabetes medicine from Novo Nordisk for up to a year" and you cannot be a part of "Any federal, state, or local program such as Medicare or Medicaid." Please reference site for exclusions.

^^ in the above I am being cheeky - but in all seriousness, much love and respect to the knowledgeable debaters, one of the most important being VA Hopeful Dr.

I just mention this because, to my limited understanding, these are standard restrictions for all assistance programs and manufacturer discount cards. Apparently it can really suck for a patient to be ecstatic for a year, only to find that their golden ticket vanishes and they are responsible for 2-500 dollars a month. The tricky part is, once on such-and-such medication, the average patient may have grown to trust that medication. After all, they haven't died over the past year. It is really expensive, therefore, it must be the very best. And their doctor prescribed it while knowing it was the newest, best, most expensive drug. The doctor wouldn't have done that unless it was absolutely necessary for their specific condition.

Then it is no more rationalization of cost and outcomes... in their mind, they just have to have that drug or die. And then they blame drug companies for being evil and money hungry while assuming any alternative would kill them. ... this is also when they sometimes say stuff like "bleeping obamacare" or "this is why we need socialized medicine." Funny how the problem pushes in both directions.

Again, perhaps I am ignorant. I certainly hope there is a loophole or a counter argument that makes this all better. I look forward to reading it.

Also, I am a little mixed up. I'd like to hear from all camps (especially Libertarian minded folks): where do you stand on patents exactly?

Do I correctly understand that all libertarians want all research to be privately funded?

 

[tr]

Nope. Private investment money will pursue research if there is a profit potential and private donations for a charitable emotion.... no public research needed

So vaccines, antibiotics, etc., which have enormous public health benefit but minimal profit potential, we should be relying on charitable donations for those? You know of any charities that support vaccine development?

 

[deleted480308]

So vaccines, antibiotics, etc., which have enormous public health benefit but minimal profit potential, we should be relying on charitable donations for those? You know of any charities that support vaccine development?

Private charities support all sorts of medical development, and if the public really wants a vaccine then the citizens that want it can donate to it

It’s not a proper role of govt

 

[Gyuji]

And now let's look at other nations were govs were given excess power like Venezuela, Cuba, or almost any Latin American country. Picking a handful of nations where a policies vaguely fit what you're arguing does not make the underlying theory any stronger.

You're confusing with one country that has far-left ideology governed by far-right and another democratic moderate-left neoliberal-center government with center-left countries of Scandinavia.

If you want to see libertarianism at it's best, look at Honduras.

 

[Stagg737]

You're confusing with one country that has far-left ideology governed by far-right and another democratic moderate-left neoliberal-center government with center-left countries of Scandinavia.

If you want to see libertarianism at it's best, look at Honduras.

My point was they're all on the left, lol that Venezuela is governed by "the far right".

 

[Gyuji]

My point was they're all on the left, lol that Venezuela is governed by "the far right".

Venezuela isn't far-right, it's moderate-left due to mixing "socialism," (giving public education, food, public healthcare sector) and democracy governed by right-wingers who are described themselves "socialists." A country that has privatization(corporatization) and it's economy heavily dependent on its oil that prices of oil spiked during Chavez's first years that he helped him get his social policies to get through and elected him for another term. But later, the country is suffering from a rigged economy and later, sanctions from Trump's presidency.

The one governed "far-right" is Cuba. No democracy and speaking against the status quo is prohibit and punishable is far-right or facistism. Mixing communism, far-left, that gets rid of capitalism, and all things is state-owned minus personal belongings. Though Cuba has loosen up and now small business is legal thanks to Obama. It's a weird combination of ideology from both countries similar to China and Russia(USSR) even the US(corporate-socialist neoliberalism mixing socialism). Now, Russia is pretty much like the US; crony capitalism run by oligarchs.

To me, mostly all developed countries are on the left, minus USA and somewhat UK, to provide its citizens public services when time of need. Even Japan, socially-conservative but provide its citizens a form of "welfare."

 

[Stagg737]

Venezuela isn't far-right, it's moderate-left due to mixing "socialism," (giving public education, food, public healthcare sector) and democracy governed by right-wingers who are described themselves "socialists." A country that has privatization(corporatization) and it's economy heavily dependent on its oil that prices of oil spiked during Chavez's first years that he helped him get his social policies to get through and elected him for another term. But later, the country is suffering from a rigged economy and later, sanctions from Trump's presidency.

The one governed "far-right" is Cuba. No democracy and speaking against the status quo is prohibit and punishable is far-right or facistism. Mixing communism, far-left, that gets rid of capitalism, and all things is state-owned minus personal belongings. Though Cuba has loosen up and now small business is legal thanks to Obama. It's a weird combination of ideology from both countries similar to China and Russia(USSR) even the US(corporate-socialist neoliberalism mixing socialism). Now, Russia is pretty much like the US; crony capitalism run by oligarchs.

To me, mostly all developed countries are on the left, minus USA and somewhat UK, to provide its citizens public services when time of need. Even Japan, socially-conservative but provide its citizens a form of "welfare."

The oil industry in Venezuela is no longer privatized as it is basically completely run by the gov. Lol that Trump sanctions are what caused its collapse, they were screwed well before he came into office and there were plenty of stories of I think during the Obama administration (like people eating zoo animals). Also, if they're a "moderately" left country there's another example of disastrous results.

I won't comment on whether Cuba's gov is far right or not, but the idea the fascism is unique to the right isn't laughable. It's a form of authoritarianism which is on a totally separate axis from liberal and conservative (the traditional left and right).

You have strange definitions of what you consider left and right. Japan is certainly not a "left" country, and if your evidence that they are isn't simply that they have welfare programs then the US must be left as well since we have millions of people receiving welfare as well as one of the largest welfare systems in the world (Medicare).

 

[Gyuji]

Huh? What that does mean? When I went to some of the websites, the cash fees they charge is better then my insurance fees in the states. Basically it has opened a cash market for dentistry because dentists do not want to deal with Britains Medicare for All option.

My comment originally meant that while you think medicare for all solved the need for cheaper, universal coverage for the people- it actually created a shortage of dentists due to low reimbursements and poor working conditions, that it inevitably created a cash model market for dentists. Now they just advertise a cash/membership option that patients pay as you go for private dental care.

My comment was basically saying that it opened the doors for a cash based free market, and that some industries like dentistry would probably benefit from this. Not so much medicine though.

Soon-to-be Prime Minister Boris Johnson was filmed saying that the NHS needs to be "reform."

Now, this is the guy, a Tory, who campaigned on Brexit with a slogan "We sent 350 million pounds per week to the EU. Let's put that in our NHS!" written on his campaign bus and the Brits knows what "reform" means, code word for cut or privatization, and they do not want a system like the USA. It just shows you about the Conservative Party and their austerity agenda of "starving" NHS in order to help their donors get to the US healthcare system. No one from the developed countries want a healthcare system like the U.S. It's plain ridiculous.

 

[deleted927028]

Wrong heading. The right heading would be, “ why we need Medicare for all NOW”

California Offers A Lesson In Why 'Medicare For All' Would Be So Difficult

Hospitals won a big round in the fight over surprise billing legislation. And it's just a hint of what they can do.

www.huffpost.com

 

[AnatomyGrey12]

Wrong heading. The right heading would be, “ why we need Medicare for all NOW”

California Offers A Lesson In Why 'Medicare For All' Would Be So Difficult

Hospitals won a big round in the fight over surprise billing legislation. And it's just a hint of what they can do.

www.huffpost.com

Did you really just try and use the Huffpost as a legitimate source to argue your point?

 

[deleted941485]

that's what happens when you got right-wing government with two right-wing political parties that follow the neoliberal principle for the last 40 years. Thanks to Thatcher, austerity been a growing problem to the UK. Tories have been trying to privatize NHS bit by bit.

But that’s one of the problems with these govt run systems. Every party has an agenda. Even if we get a national health program that’s very generous for all participants. It’ll probably be short lived as the other party that doesn’t like it and wants to “improve” will just make worse.

Medicare was similar. Started out as a pretty good payer in the 60s and 70s that you basically just billed and they didn’t ask too many questions fast forward 50 years now you are their data entry clerk and every year they cut payments through the Magic of inflation.

 

[deleted930101]

Will the American Medical Association do nothing to fight Medical for All as it could have a significant adverse income outcomes and badly reshape the future of several specialities because the brigh minds will be deterred from pursing medicine?
Also, IMO there is absolutely no way Medicare for All could happen will current tax rates, they Have to be higher, OR gov prints more money, acquire more debt, someone waves the hand outside of Airforce one(Happy country) until Yuan beats the petrodollar because that day America is truly ****ed, but that will take a generation or two. If we are lucky and scientists are right, the world will end by then, if we maintain our current consumption of natural resources and emission of CH4 and CO2.

 

[SurfingDoctor]

Will the American Medical Association do nothing to fight Medical for All as it could have a significant adverse income outcomes and badly reshape the future of several specialities because the brigh minds will be deterred from pursing medicine?
Also, IMO there is absolutely no way Medicare for All could happen will current tax rates, they Have to be higher, OR gov prints more money, acquire more debt, someone waves the hand outside of Airforce one(Happy country) until Yuan beats the petrodollar because that day America is truly ****ed, but that will take a generation or two. If we are lucky and scientists are right, the world will end by then, if we maintain our current consumption of natural resources and emission of CH4 and CO2.

I can’t tell... is this sarcasm or not? You know the AMA is a worthless entity nowadays.

Ironically though, it was the AMA that crushed the idea of government run healthcare in the mid 20th century for the reason you specify. Now, they are a vestigial organ...

 

[bluebubbles]

God I hate far-left talking points.

"Every other developed country has free healthcare, lower costs, and better outcomes." ~Sanders, Warren, Harris

Let's just ignore that the "land of the free" is full of irresponsible people, with a per capita rate of violent gun deaths 80x higher than other developed countries. But hey, I'm happy to go along with the Medicare-for-All experiment and see if soaking the rich and soaking greedy doctors & biopharma brings everyone better outcomes & more cures.