What's wrong with my app?

[radioactive15]

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[Astra]

I applied early this cycle, and I thought I had a solid app.

LizzyM 71-75
ORM
Anthropology Major
250 clinical hours
200 nonclinical volunteering
50 shadowing
2 years of research
LORs from professors who knew me well

Broad school list, composed heavily of low tiers and a few mid tiers. All MD.

My own state school hasn't even interviewed me, and I received 2 IIs at low tiers, but was outright rejected at both. At one of them, the interviewers told me that they would surely recommend me, and I also felt I did well. At the other, I felt I did well, except for one MMI station.

Is there a red flag somewhere on my app? If there is, I have no idea what it could be. I don't think my interviewing skills are the problem, because I'm not even receiving interviews at schools where I exceed the median numbers.

I don't know if I'll receive any more IIs. 7 schools left to hear back from and I was complete at all of those by the end of July

You seem to have a solid app. I would say that you either have a red flag in your secondaries/primary or schools haven't gotten to you yet. I submitted my application early, and I just got a few interviews at schools this past few weeks.

Did you reword the same essays for all the schools you submitted to? If there is something in there they didn't like, or a typo then that might explain the mass silence.

I do think your two rejections is due to poor interview skills. If your interview went well, I would assume you would've at least been wait listed. What are the post II acceptance rates for those 2 schools?

 

[Gurby]

Did you only apply to 9 schools? IMO one should apply to 20+ schools.

What was your school list? Some mid/low tier schools are notoriously low yield because they get so many apps.

 

[radioactive15]

Did you only apply to 9 schools? IMO one should apply to 20+ schools.

What was your school list? Some mid/low tier schools are notoriously low yield because they get so many apps.

Applied to 25. 2 II -> rejects, 7 silence, 16 pre-II rejections.

 

[Astra]

Applied to 25. 2 II -> rejects, 7 silence, 16 pre-II rejections.

that seems like an insanely high pre-II rejection rate. I strongly think you have a red flag of some sort be it your primary,seconday or LoR.

 

[Doggo]

Criminal Convictions? Maybe you filled out part of AMCAS wrong?

 

[radioactive15]

Criminal Convictions? Maybe you filled out part of AMCAS wrong?

No criminal convictions and no AMCAS entering errors.

that seems like an insanely high pre-II rejection rate. I strongly think you have a red flag of some sort be it your primary,seconday or LoR.

Do you think it could be a submarine letter?

 

[libertyyne]

Applied to 25. 2 II -> rejects, 7 silence, 16 pre-II rejections.

What is your school list and your actual stats. And your state of residence.

 

[efle]

It's a little odd to get the 2 IIs if you have some huge glaring red flag.

Helpful to know:

-school list, if low tiers means a lot of OOS public schools it may have just been poorly constructed
-more exact stats, a 3.7/38 is very different from a 3.9/32
-did you have other people read your PS, activity descriptions, secondaries? Could be any of this

 

[Astra]

We dont have actual stats,
courses/term GPAs
Trends,
MCAT

Nor do we have the actual application not so much in terms of content but in term coherence and compelling narrative.
reaching a conclusion is a stretch under this limited info. My general advice to an applicant like this is to first critically review and analyze the actual app. I see far too many good candidates with applications that do not present their narrative in EC, PS, and Secondaries, in a concise, coherent, and compelling manner. Remember, you are dealing in something like an Olympic event where only the top 3 out of 50 or 100 get a medal at each school. Hence fractions of second matter to win. A school will get a several thousand application, reduced to several hundred interviews, to a few hundred acceptances and reduced waitlisted acceptees. At any indivdual medical school, at least 80% of applicants are rejected pre II.

Additionally, every applicant has to remember of out of all the applicants in any cycle
60% do not get accepted
20% get a single acceptance
20% get two or more acceptance.

Reason I said he has some sort of red flag is that I applied the same time as him, with similar LizzyM score, and I have only recieved 5 pre II rejections. It seemed really high to receive 16/25 pre II rejections. But you're right. without school list, trends etc, my conclusion might be jumping the gun

 

[Frogger27]

We dont have actual stats,
courses/term GPAs
Trends,
MCAT

Nor do we have the actual application not so much in terms of content but in term coherence and compelling narrative.
reaching a conclusion is a stretch under this limited info. My general advice to an applicant like this is to first critically review and analyze the actual app. I see far too many good candidates with applications that do not present their narrative in EC, PS, and Secondaries, in a concise, coherent, and compelling manner. Remember, you are dealing in something like an Olympic event where only the top 3 out of 50 or 100 get a medal at each school. Hence fractions of second matter to win. A school will get a several thousand application, reduced to several hundred interviews, to a few hundred acceptances and reduced waitlisted acceptees. At any indivdual medical school, at least 80% of applicants are rejected pre II.

Additionally, every applicant has to remember of out of all the applicants in any cycle
60% do not get accepted
20% get a single acceptance
20% get two or more acceptance.

OP I bolded the most important part in what @gonnif said... Your application is your story.

Your application should:
1) Clearly state your motivation for pursuing this career
2) have consistency in your application through your activities/secondaries that support this narrative

I see many people who have a poor story and their application is just a bag of random "pre-med" activities. This is not to say that their reason for pursuing this career and activities are bad, but it is how you come across in an application. I always say that you are trying to "sell" yourself to adcoms.

 

[Frogger27]

The three Cs: an application should be a coherent, concise and compelling narrative showing a strong pattern of motivation, commitment and achievement. It is in your ECs, PS, and secondaries that you show and sell that pattern.

The three C's will get you the II... After that, you need to sell yourself to the adcoms and show that you are indeed that person on paper.

At my last II, the interview started out by saying "Well Frogger, I have reviewed your application. What I see is a student who has had some pretty unique life experiences that have helped shape you into someone who wants to become a successful physician. I see a student who has dealt with some hardships, but will never let anything get in their way of accomplishing the task at hand. Does this sound like the student sitting in front of me right now?"

I was like "YES that is exactly what I was trying to convey in my application"... These interviewers are pretty sharp

 

[Goro]

Yes. I suspect either poorly written essays, a red flag LOR, or a semi-lethal IA.

Two post interview rejections suggest otherwise. Most people are terrible at assessing their own interview performance, and interviewers are trained to be polite.

Is there a red flag somewhere on my app? If there is, I have no idea what it could be. I don't think my interviewing skills are the problem, because I'm not even receiving interviews at schools where I exceed the median numbers.

I don't know if I'll receive any more IIs. 7 schools left to hear back from and I was complete at all of those by the end of July

 

[efle]

Two post interview rejections suggest otherwise.

You mean rather than post-II waitlisting? Do most schools only outright reject very poor interview scores?

 

[Goro]

One has to work to garner an outright rejection, which OP managed to do. This is saying something.

You mean rather than post-II waitlisting? Do most schools only outright reject very poor interview scores?

 

[libertyyne]

You mean rather than post-II waitlisting? Do most schools only outright reject very poor interview scores?

I can't imagine a rational reason as to why someone would invite an applicant for an interview, feed them, spend resources to get people to interview them if they wanted to reject them and potentially waste an interview that they could have conducted on someone who might actually matriculate or at least wait list.

 

[Astra]

I can't imagine a rational reason as to why someone would invite an applicant for an interview, feed them, spend resources to get people to interview them if they wanted to reject them and potentially waste an interview that they could have conducted on someone who might actually matriculate or at least wait list.

 

[efle]

I can't imagine a rational reason as to why someone would invite an applicant for an interview, feed them, spend resources to get people to interview them if they wanted to reject them and potentially waste an interview that they could have conducted on someone who might actually matriculate.

Huh, I figured maybe they'd invite people who might get in if they interview great, but will get reject if they interview just ok. Sounds like it takes a lot more to get the R

Bold move for Mr. Probation over here

 

[libertyyne]

Huh, I figured maybe they'd invite people who might get in if they interview great, but will get reject if they interview just ok. Sounds like it takes a lot more to get the R



Bold move for Mr. Probation over here

There is no Downside for the school to wait list the applicant. There is something really wrong if after interview the school says : nope, I'd rather not have you even if my class was empty on July 1st.

 

[efle]

There is no Downside for the school to wait list the applicant. There is something really wrong if after interview the school says : nope, I'd rather not have you even if my class was empty on July 1st.

Ah, I was thinking maybe the schools didn't want to string people along with a deep waitlist spot they didn't even get close to in any former year...but then I remembered how schools don't publish screens and charge $100 per secondary.