Which branch of the military is best?

[medstudent24]

Hi,
I've spoken to a few of you about the pros/cons of military medicine. Now I would like to know WHICH BRANCH do you feel is the best to serve as a doctor and WHY ? I've looked around and didn't see a specific thread answering this question. If there is one here feel free to direct me to it, otherwise please post your answers below.
thanks

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[Croooz]

It depends on you.

 

[SeminoleFan3]

Currently, Navy for the 20K bonus. Although, I guess Army is you want the best chance of training straight through.

 

[73BARMYPgsp]

It depends on you.

Agreed. The branches are pretty wildly different, and you need to know yourself well enough before you can answer the question.

I bleed green, so it's a no brainer.

 

[medstudent24]

I asked the same question a little while back. Here's the thread

http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showthread.php?t=407621

thank you. i read through the thread but i still have questions. i wish i could meet all you guys in person i think it would be so much easier to get answers.

 

[medstudent24]

Agreed. The branches are pretty wildly different, and you need to know yourself well enough before you can answer the question.

I bleed green, so it's a no brainer.

Okay I'll be as specific as possible: (ignore my bad spelling)


1. I'm not a good patriotic american. I'm doing this to get my future loans payed off. No other reason. I'm terrified of getting sent to Iraq or any other bomb dropping location. I would make a horrible soilder (i'm a punk) but good doctor.

1. so what branch will likely not be sending me to a middle east hospital?





2. What speciality I don't know. I can't make that decision until I've done rotations to have an idea what its like to actually work day to day in a specific dept. but so far neurology is very interesting to me. i love the amazing brain. but the privalege of working as a doctor would be great but I'm sure I would get tired of doing primary care when my desire may eventually lie elsewhere.

2. so what branch will allow me the ease of picking whatever speciality i want?





3. This is unrealisitic i know, but I don't want to be sent overseas or have to go anywhere and leave new york. i just want to be employed in a military hospital here while i'm on duty.

3. so what branch is less likely to make you deploy?





4. I want the most money (of course) so i don't have to pull a izzy (the people that have the time/desire to watch grey's anatomy will get that)

4. so what branch offers the most reimbursement?





5. I want a easy transition to working in the civilian world unless its a great experience working in a nyc military hospital (as perhaps a neurologist), then i won't mind spending extra time in the military world.

5. so what branch lets you go into a civilian program easily?




I have a million other questions but off the top of my head those are the most important ones. Here's one more: is anyone here from nyc? I need to know where a military hospital is so I can go volunteer and ask these doctors all my questions.


Next summer I'm doing airforce medical labatory tech program (reserves) those that effect anything?

thanks a bunch people

 

[megadon]

Okay I'll be as specific as possible: (ignore my bad spelling)


1. I'm not a good patriotic american. I'm doing this to get my future loans payed off. No other reason. I'm terrified of getting sent to Iraq or any other bomb dropping location. I would make a horrible soilder (i'm a punk) but good doctor.

1. so what branch will likely not be sending me to a middle east hospital?

2. so what branch will allow me the ease of picking whatever speciality i want?

3. This is unrealisitic i know, but I don't want to be sent overseas or have to go anywhere and leave new york. i just want to be employed in a military hospital here while i'm on duty.

3. so what branch is less likely to make you deploy?

4. so what branch offers the most reimbursement?

5. so what branch lets you go into a civilian program easily?

thanks a bunch people

Uhmm, you're in for a big eye-opener. Did you realize that probably 99% of the country is not NYC, and all of us are thinking, what's their deal, they're not their own country! Time to get off the soap box and try and help.

1. Doing it for the money is the worst reason, short of being court ordered into the military (which I don't think they do anymore). As far as the question, the real question is how long, cause all the services have different deployment lengths. This is changing, but the general rule of thumb used to be, Army 1 year, Air Force 3 months, MC 6 months, Navy 6 months unless not assigned to a sea going unit, then a year. I'd put good money on the table thought that by the time I graduate, 2010, it won't be Iraq. Maybe one of their neighbors, maybe SE Asia.

2. Can't objectively answer
3. Your best long shot looks like West Point, you're going to have to serve at a military facility. As far as not deploying, I personally don't think any service provides any safety from that.
4. There is only one pay scale for the entire military, so it's the same, unless you have some extra cash flow from being at sea, or a flight surgeon or something. And we're only talking a couple hundred bucks a month extra.
5. Can't answer

Sorry man, this deal does not sound like it is for you. Either you are going to have to become a little bit more flexible and try and not hate anywhere but NYC, or you are going to be miserable. Let me know where you get stationed so I can rank it real low.

 

[medstudent24]

Uhmm, you're in for a big eye-opener. Did you realize that probably 99% of the country is not NYC, and all of us are thinking, what's their deal, they're not their own country! Time to get off the soap box and try and help.

1. Doing it for the money is the worst reason, short of being court ordered into the military (which I don't think they do anymore). As far as the question, the real question is how long, cause all the services have different deployment lengths. This is changing, but the general rule of thumb used to be, Army 1 year, Air Force 3 months, MC 6 months, Navy 6 months unless not assigned to a sea going unit, then a year. I'd put good money on the table thought that by the time I graduate, 2010, it won't be Iraq. Maybe one of their neighbors, maybe SE Asia.

2. Can't objectively answer
3. Your best long shot looks like West Point, you're going to have to serve at a military facility. As far as not deploying, I personally don't think any service provides any safety from that.
4. There is only one pay scale for the entire military, so it's the same, unless you have some extra cash flow from being at sea, or a flight surgeon or something. And we're only talking a couple hundred bucks a month extra.
5. Can't answer

Sorry man, this deal does not sound like it is for you. Either you are going to have to become a little bit more flexible and try and not hate anywhere but NYC, or you are going to be miserable. Let me know where you get stationed so I can rank it real low.

Thanks for the info but I just want to make it clear: I love ny but I don't hate anywhere else. due to personal reasons i don't want to leave anytime soon but i lived in other states/countries so i'm aware that there's life outside nyc but i don't want it right now. i'm kinda stiff in what i want so you're right the military route may not work out for me but right now i'm trying to see how close i can get to what i want.

 

[medstudent24]

For those who, in the past, couldn't understand where a1 was coming from in some of his arguments, reread the OP's last post. I'm not in milimed yet, but I think the OP just gave a laundry list of the worst possible personal reasons and expectations for joining the military and it makes me twitch. Anyway, here's the secondhand information I've gotten from these boards and other sources.

1)AF, though why you would join the military if you're terrified of war is beyond me.
2) Army>Navy>AF though Navy is more likely to make you serve a GMO tour first. Note: 1 and 2 conflict. Also if you're planning on being anything but FP or IM you're probably making a poor financial decision.
3) None of the above. If you go military you're going where they send you and you should expect to move. There's a very slim chance that you'll stay in one place, almost no chance it will be where you want.
4) Navy offers a $20,000 signing bonus right now, otherwise the pay should be about equal across services.
5) Not sure I understand the question. You finish your service when you finish you obligation and can start working in the civilian world then.

lol yes i know i'm bad. didn't mean to make you twitch. back in the day (from what i understand) it was easier to work in the medical field in a war zone. you were in the hospital not necesarily near the front line. but now adays conflict is potentially anywhere you step foot.

in regards to number 5. i keep hearing people complain about dificulty getting back into a civilian residency w/o spending many many years in service. that is why i asked that. but okay you answered my question.
thanks

 

[HumptyDumptyMil]

Here's a tidbit from an AF HPSPer:

Good:
-You get to fly in planes if you become a flight surgeon
-The best facilities
-officer's training is not that rough compared to Army
-I personally like the color blue over tan and green


Bad:
-AF deployments are now 6 months.
-They told us at flight surgery intro course that we WILL be deployed.
-The downsizing of hospitals seemed to be affecting the AF hospitals the most, so residency options are limited compared to Army (don't know about Navy)
-AF personnel are running hospitals in Iraq right now

Here's the worst part about AF in my opinion, not sure if this is true for other branches:
If you do not match for residency, you are REQUIRED to serve as a flight surgeon for minimum 2 years.

Someone correct me if I am wrong about any of the above.

If I am able to choose which branch to serve in right now, I will still have chosen AF b/c:
1) deployments are not long as Army
2) I can never see myself on a ship
3) Many AF residencies collaborate with Army residencies, especially in San Antonio.

My new advice to potential HPSP candidates (they tell you this at training all the time):If you cannot see yourself as a SOLDIER in addition to being a doctor, you may regret doing HPSP.

 

[megadon]

Thanks for the info but I just want to make it clear: I love ny but I don't hate anywhere else. due to personal reasons i don't want to leave anytime soon but i lived in other states/countries so i'm aware that there's life outside nyc but i don't want it right now. i'm kinda stiff in what i want so you're right the military route may not work out for me but right now i'm trying to see how close i can get to what i want.

I hope you don't think I was just trying to just flame you. I was being honest and give some advice. After 11 years (acad plus active duty), I ran across a ton of NYC people, and they are stereotypically similar. The one's I ran across broke into two categories, the ones who thought how much this place sucks more than NYC, and the ones who thought, NYC is cool, its my hometown, but there's a lot of cool stuff to do here.

But seriously, doing it for the money is the WORST financial decision you can make. Read at least four threads on this forum, and it will come up. And then someone will post a financial breakdown of doing military or going to Harvard (or whatever the most expensive school is) as a foreignor unable to secure reasonable government loans, so takes out at 11%, and they still win. Bottom line, doing military for the money is an oxymoron, like military intelligence. You can get rich quicker play three card monty back in NYC. Will you make money, yes. Will you make it as quickly as your civilian counterparts, oh no.

So if you haven't signed, you have three options.
1. Go short sided, sign up, do your time and get out.
2. Take out loans like the other 95% of your classmates.
3. Sign, complain at every step at how you're being screwed and this isn't what you signed up for. We told you. I'm writing down your name in case.

Oh what the heck, option 4, sign up, change your screen name and complain about how you've been screwed at every step.

 

[NavyFP]

Okay I'll be as specific as possible: (ignore my bad spelling)


1. I'm not a good patriotic american. I'm doing this to get my future loans payed off. No other reason. I'm terrified of getting sent to Iraq or any other bomb dropping location. I would make a horrible soilder (i'm a punk) but good doctor.

1. so what branch will likely not be sending me to a middle east hospital?





2. What speciality I don't know. I can't make that decision until I've done rotations to have an idea what its like to actually work day to day in a specific dept. but so far neurology is very interesting to me. i love the amazing brain. but the privalege of working as a doctor would be great but I'm sure I would get tired of doing primary care when my desire may eventually lie elsewhere.

2. so what branch will allow me the ease of picking whatever speciality i want?





3. This is unrealisitic i know, but I don't want to be sent overseas or have to go anywhere and leave new york. i just want to be employed in a military hospital here while i'm on duty.

3. so what branch is less likely to make you deploy?





4. I want the most money (of course) so i don't have to pull a izzy (the people that have the time/desire to watch grey's anatomy will get that)

4. so what branch offers the most reimbursement?





5. I want a easy transition to working in the civilian world unless its a great experience working in a nyc military hospital (as perhaps a neurologist), then i won't mind spending extra time in the military world.

5. so what branch lets you go into a civilian program easily?




I have a million other questions but off the top of my head those are the most important ones. Here's one more: is anyone here from nyc? I need to know where a military hospital is so I can go volunteer and ask these doctors all my questions.


Next summer I'm doing airforce medical labatory tech program (reserves) those that effect anything?

thanks a bunch people

After reading these questions, the only answer that is obvious to me is that there is no way in Hades you should join any of the services. And there are no military hospitals in NYC.

 

[megadon]

I've been told that if you consider any service's medical officer's training "rough" you should seriously consider hospice care. Have I been misinformed?

I'll say this caveated by I didn't go to OIS, OCS, whatever they call it these days. I did do plebe summer, I did do a month of Navy boot camp as a sea cadet. And it would be harder to do it again, cause you realize it is a huge game, it is a completely artificial enviroment in which the primary goal is to get you unsettled, and accept this new system entirely. It's pretty brilliant, and works really well. I would do terribbly at OIS, knowing how the Navy really does work. I would be detrimental to the process because I would question a lot of what they told me, and told my other squadmates that's not how it works in the real world. Once again, see caveat, I didn't go, so it's speculation. However, having a chief or GYSGT yell at me at this point would not scare me, just piss me off, unless it was about some point of medicine where I thought they might actually know more than me (so wouldn't be the gunny). Could I play the game, yes, I just would be a lousy contestant. However, it does prepare you for every other demoralizing training pipeline in the Navy. I don't expect medicine to be too much different. As the saying goes, it the government wanted you to have feelings, they would have issued them to you. It hasn't gotten better though.

 

[West Side]

Uhmm, you're in for a big eye-opener. Did you realize that probably 99% of the country is not NYC, and all of us are thinking, what's their deal, they're not their own country! Time to get off the soap box and try and help.

Per the 2000 census, NYC proper counted just over 8MM in population. The US, at the same census, had around 301MM people. Assume the last 7 years has seen continued urbanization of the country's population, and I'll go out on a limb and say New York is 3% of the population.

Just an FYI. The country is made up of only about 30 New Yorks.

 

[colbgw02]

2) Army>Navy>AF though Navy is more likely to make you serve a GMO tour first. Note: 1 and 2 conflict. Also if you're planning on being anything but FP or IM you're probably making a poor financial decision.

I don't think this is true. In fact, I think it's the opposite, which makes me wonder if you meant to type Army<Navy<AF.

It's not that the Army is kinder and gentler; it's a numbers thing. The Army has approximately the same number of total GME slots as applicants = relatively few GMOs.

 

[daveyjwin]

Financial Analysis of HPSP:
http://halfmd.wordpress.com/2007/03...f-the-health-professions-scholarship-program/

Basically it says that if you go into a surgical or other high paying field, you are losing money. If you go into primary care, or something lower paying, such as internal medicine, you come out significantly on top.

But, on the flip side of that, my girlfriend signed up for it solely for financial reasons, and HATES it, and wishes she hadn't. So, I'd say don't do it unless you want to. Loans aren't that bad, and if you play your cards right, you can pay them back in 5 years or so. From what I've read from you, I'd say don't do it.

 

[Gastrapathy]

1. I'm not a good patriotic american. I'm doing this to get my future loans payed off. No other reason. I'm terrified of getting sent to Iraq or any other bomb dropping location. I would make a horrible soilder (i'm a punk) but good doctor.

1. so what branch will likely not be sending me to a middle east hospital?

There are no middle east hospitals, there is no war and, don't worry, no matter which service you "join", you'll never deploy.

2. What speciality I don't know. I can't make that decision until I've done rotations to have an idea what its like to actually work day to day in a specific dept. but so far neurology is very interesting to me. i love the amazing brain. but the privalege of working as a doctor would be great but I'm sure I would get tired of doing primary care when my desire may eventually lie elsewhere.

2. so what branch will allow me the ease of picking whatever speciality i want?

You want to be a neurologist and you're worried about primary care being boring?





3. This is unrealisitic i know, but I don't want to be sent overseas or have to go anywhere and leave new york. i just want to be employed in a military hospital here while i'm on duty.

3. so what branch is less likely to make you deploy?

See #1



4. I want the most money (of course) so i don't have to pull a izzy (the people that have the time/desire to watch grey's anatomy will get that)

4. so what branch offers the most reimbursement?

There is a supersecret bonus that only AF officers get.



5. I want a easy transition to working in the civilian world unless its a great experience working in a nyc military hospital (as perhaps a neurologist), then i won't mind spending extra time in the military world.

5. so what branch lets you go into a civilian program easily?

The NYC military hospital is an amazing, state of the art facility.


I have a million other questions but off the top of my head those are the most important ones. Here's one more: is anyone here from nyc? I need to know where a military hospital is so I can go volunteer and ask these doctors all my questions.


Next summer I'm doing airforce medical labatory tech program (reserves) those that effect anything?

Holy Crap, you've already joined. I take back all my sarcasm. It really doesn't sound like military medicine is for you and if you are in the reserves, your trip to the sand box is coming soon. Good luck.



wow.

 

[medstudent24]

I hope you don't think I was just trying to just flame you. I was being honest and give some advice. After 11 years (acad plus active duty), I ran across a ton of NYC people, and they are stereotypically similar. The one's I ran across broke into two categories, the ones who thought how much this place sucks more than NYC, and the ones who thought, NYC is cool, its my hometown, but there's a lot of cool stuff to do here.

But seriously, doing it for the money is the WORST financial decision you can make. Read at least four threads on this forum, and it will come up. And then someone will post a financial breakdown of doing military or going to Harvard (or whatever the most expensive school is) as a foreignor unable to secure reasonable government loans, so takes out at 11%, and they still win. Bottom line, doing military for the money is an oxymoron, like military intelligence. You can get rich quicker play three card monty back in NYC. Will you make money, yes. Will you make it as quickly as your civilian counterparts, oh no.

So if you haven't signed, you have three options.
1. Go short sided, sign up, do your time and get out.
2. Take out loans like the other 95% of your classmates.
3. Sign, complain at every step at how you're being screwed and this isn't what you signed up for. We told you. I'm writing down your name in case.

Oh what the heck, option 4, sign up, change your screen name and complain about how you've been screwed at every step.

you're funny. like how you express yourself. okay i'm starting to think i shouldn't bother also and just pay off my loans after med school. okay i know you guys are docs but how about my answering my question on my other interest....: what do you think about doing on of those programs (medical laboratory technician in the reserves) i have two years left of undergrad and have to go to a smp due to my grades. so i will have lots of loans to pay off before i even start med school. good/bad what do you think?....


p.s. i know what you're talking about the new yorker thing. but tecnically i'm not even from here. originally from boston.

 

[medstudent24]

After reading these questions, the only answer that is obvious to me is that there is no way in Hades you should join any of the services. And there are no military hospitals in NYC.

okay what about the reserves med lab tech program? since i'm already a clt in the chem dept at my school.

 

[medstudent24]

Financial Analysis of HPSP:
http://halfmd.wordpress.com/2007/03...f-the-health-professions-scholarship-program/

Basically it says that if you go into a surgical or other high paying field, you are losing money. If you go into primary care, or something lower paying, such as internal medicine, you come out significantly on top.

But, on the flip side of that, my girlfriend signed up for it solely for financial reasons, and HATES it, and wishes she hadn't. So, I'd say don't do it unless you want to. Loans aren't that bad, and if you play your cards right, you can pay them back in 5 years or so. From what I've read from you, I'd say don't do it.

i'm going to take your advice on the doc thing but how do you feel about the med lab tech program.

 

[West Side]

Financial Analysis of HPSP:
http://halfmd.wordpress.com/2007/03...f-the-health-professions-scholarship-program/

Basically it says that if you go into a surgical or other high paying field, you are losing money. If you go into primary care, or something lower paying, such as internal medicine, you come out significantly on top.

This is a game effort on the author's part, but as the comment in below the article states, it's fundamentally flawed. It's just not realistically pitched. In short, there is really, honestly no way that you can come out ahead financially. Just believe me, I've looked at this from a number of different angles, trying to see how it could. At best, you can get within 2-3% of civilian financing, and that's under absolutely optimal conditions.

There are good reasons to get into this racket. I don't understand them, but if they make sense to you, then it's something to think about. However, if you think there's any way you can end up level financially, send whatever you're smoking my way.

 

[daveyjwin]

This is a game effort on the author's part, but as the comment in below the article states, it's fundamentally flawed. It's just not realistically pitched. In short, there is really, honestly no way that you can come out ahead financially. Just believe me, I've looked at this from a number of different angles, trying to see how it could. At best, you can get within 2-3% of civilian financing, and that's under absolutely optimal conditions.

There are good reasons to get into this racket. I don't understand them, but if they make sense to you, then it's something to think about. However, if you think there's any way you can end up level financially, send whatever you're smoking my way.

That argument wasn't there when I posted. It was posted like 2 hours ago. Heh. Anyway, my girl is in HPSP, so I'm, trying to remain optimistic about everything. And frankly, I'd just like to get debt free ASAP, and so I plan on paying back my loans as soon as I can. Then I can just be net + for the rest of my life. Would be nice anyway...

You were the one who's wife got out, right? I'm envious...

 

[orbitsurgMD]

Hi,
I've spoken to a few of you about the pros/cons of military medicine. Now I would like to know WHICH BRANCH do you feel is the best

Probably the Hussars. If not them, then the light dragoons.

 

[Gastrapathy]

http://www.legion-recrute.com/en/

 

[orbitsurgMD]

http://www.legion-recrute.com/en/

Right, the 2eme R.E.P.

 

[megadon]

i'm going to take your advice on the doc thing but how do you feel about the med lab tech program.

Well, since we have now established you're two years away from graduating, yes. Do it, it will serve two purposes for you. You can put it on your application, and discuss it during interviews. It also serves the purpose of giving you a limited exposure to what military medicine may be like. At least then you can objectively make this decision based on something other than your wallet. Best of luck to you. But tell me, how in the world are you going to work this deal? Bases/Posts/Forts/Camps aren't exactly the easiest places to get access to.

 

[megadon]

I thought he said the med tech lab position was an MOS in the reserves. Am I confused?

You may be, but I know I am, it only took me 31 posts to figure out this kid was a premed sophomore. I thought we had an emminent crisis on our hands.

 

[HumptyDumptyMil]

I've been told that if you consider any service's medical officer's training "rough" you should seriously consider hospice care. Have I been misinformed?

I was just speaking in relative terms. We go to Officer's training. I know that Officer's training is nothing compared to the enlistees, regardless of which service. Our training was mostly done in classrooms with A/C and stayed in dorms with housekeeping service every day. I heard army has to do field exercises with big guns and a heavy backpack. I envy the big gun thing, but I rather stay in tents with a/c during our field exercise.

I know i'm spoiled

 

[medstudent24]

1) Have you joined the AF reserve already, or is this a decision you're still considering?

2) Just how bad are your grades that you're already sure you'll need an SMP with two full years of undergrad left and no MCAT scores?

1. I haven't signed anything just considering. Went to see a army recruiter last month then spoke to a friend who just left the army after he completed his 4 years (he's nonmedical) and is going back into AF (he says its better/easier than army)

2. My grades are horrible, too embarassing to state in a public forum. My gpa will not rise that much because I have to complete chem/org1/2/biochem1/2 but I've finished all my other classes. Even if I rocked the MCAT's I'm sure the only place I could get into w/o a smp is a caribbean school. I would really like to stay in nyc for med school (my dream cornel/columbia)

 

[medstudent24]

Well, since we have now established you're two years away from graduating, yes. Do it, it will serve two purposes for you. You can put it on your application, and discuss it during interviews. It also serves the purpose of giving you a limited exposure to what military medicine may be like. At least then you can objectively make this decision based on something other than your wallet. Best of luck to you. But tell me, how in the world are you going to work this deal? Bases/Posts/Forts/Camps aren't exactly the easiest places to get access to.

How am I going to work it? According to the army recruiter I spoke to last month:

I have to go for basic training for nine weeks (I will do during the summer to not interupt my classes).
After that I have the option of either going to Houston, Texas for one year to complete the med lab tech program and then coming back home to work in the reserves in a hospital in nyc --- or---- I can after basic training enrol at a nyc area school that gives the med lab tech program and then continue here.

I told him I would choose the later option so I can continue my chem classes that I have to complete (i'm 27 not trying to take my time here). I can only take one chem class at a time so I would be able to handle a med lab tech program for a year (i already work as a chem lab tech right now)

That's all he told me. I know their job is to make everything look glorious. What tiny big detail is he leaving out that you think I would not be able to handle it? Please share...

 

[medstudent24]

You may be, but I know I am, it only took me 31 posts to figure out this kid was a premed sophomore. I thought we had an emminent crisis on our hands.

ayy take it easy. first i'm not a kid. i'm a transfer student/at sophmore level due to personal situations which i will not elaborate on. but i'm mature grown ass 27 year old woman. second if you want to make fun of me for your entertainment have at it. i'm a easy target since i'm ignorant of all this military medical information. but if you're serious about giving advice realize that i'm only on here because i'm trying to figure out what is the best option/route for me to become a doctor. its a fact that it will be a long journey for me so i want to make it as cost effective (w/o screwing myself over) as possible

 

[medstudent24]

I think Megadon thought you were looking at a civilian medical intern job at a military base. If you're looking at the reserves, I think that most people on this forum would advise you not to do it, for the same reasons they would advise you not to do military medicine: you don't want to move, you don't want deploy, and you're terrified of warzones. If you go military in any form you need to be prepared for all three.

Whatever your recruiter tells you, if you sign up for the military you can and probably will deploy. In fact these days you'll probably be activated for Iraq within a month of finishing your training (so long college). Also if it's not guarenteed in your contract you probably won't get the job you want

Also are you looking at Army or AF? You said AF reserves earlier, but now you're talking about an army recruiter.

Okay that makes sense. I first heard specifically about the med lab tech program from a army recruiter listing on craigslist. I went in spoke w/ him got all the info. I was really considering leaving this summer for basic training but I would have had to lose 15 lbs before I left everything was so rushed so I decided to wait until next summer. Recently I was speaking to a friend who told me that AF is better, so that's why I was considering AF reserves for the same lab tech program instead.

 

[medstudent24]

I think Megadon thought you were looking at a civilian medical intern job at a military base. If you're looking at the reserves, I think that most people on this forum would advise you not to do it, for the same reasons they would advise you not to do military medicine: you don't want to move, you don't want deploy, and you're terrified of warzones. If you go military in any form you need to be prepared for all three.

Whatever your recruiter tells you, if you sign up for the military you can and probably will deploy. In fact these days you'll probably be activated for Iraq within a month of finishing your training (so long college). Also if it's not guarenteed in your contract you probably won't get the job you want

Also are you looking at Army or AF? You said AF reserves earlier, but now you're talking about an army recruiter.

Finally I don't know how bad your GPA is, but you should know there's a pretty narrow range that are eligible for SMPs but not Medical school. Basically you need a fairly high MCAT but a GPA less than 3.3 and not much below a 2.8. Above a 3.3 can generally get into med school with a good MCAT (above 3.0 with a great MCAT), and below 2.8 you pretty much need more undergraduate courses to raise your GPA.

I think I'll be able to get to a 2.8 by the time I graduate.

 

[almostfamous]

I think I'll be able to get to a 2.8 by the time I graduate.

with a 2.8 and a 28 or 30 MCAT, there might be a few MD schools, maybe half of the DO schools, and the island paradise schools (which I don't think are eligible for HPSP scholarships) which you should be able to get into without any problems as long as the other applicant prereqs (community service , med volunteer, etc.) are in good order.

The MSAR is a good resource for that stuff.

 

[medstudent24]

Other things you should know:

1) All obligations, including the reserves and national call to service plans, are for 8 years. Some of this time, usually 4 years, is spent in the 'inactive reserves' where you don't drill on the weekends. Not drilling on the weekends, though, doesn't mean they can't deploy you for all of that 8 year obligation. I'd still advise against it for the same reasons stated in previous posts, but it's at least a better option.

2) If you're sure going to need an SMP anyway, you do also have the option (this is brand new) of finishing your degree and going directly into the reserves as an officer. Better job options, better resume fodder, some actual leadership experience, and pretty good pay if you're unlucky enough to get deployed.

1. the recruiter i spoke to said w/ reserves deployment is always a possiblity but not very likely. (but i think i'll take your word over his)

2. sounds interesting, its going to require me to start another thread, lol or go back and see that recruiter again. BUT after i have my degree i'm going to be concentrating on the smp that will be my last chance to show that i can handle graduate work. i'm pretty sure i need the smp since i don't want to go to a caribbean school. plus i don't mind research no more than 2 years, since that's what i'm involved in now (medicinal chemistry, a new drug to fight the effects of ecasty overdose). these decisions just keep coming it never seems to end. thanks

note: don't know what urm is but i'm from nyc

 

[medstudent24]

URM=underrepresented in medicine (black or certain kinds of hispanic), higher chance of getting in with the same stats.

Sorry I thought you were CA, their state schools are notoriously hard to get into (harder than most private schoolS). I have no idea what the odds of getting into a NY schools

well i'm a black/latina female but i don't want to factor that into my chances. if it helps great but i'm really just tying to make myself look better on paper since that is the first thing most admissions see is numbers.

 

[megadon]

ayy take it easy. first i'm not a kid. i'm a transfer student/at sophmore level due to personal situations which i will not elaborate on. but i'm mature grown ass 27 year old woman. second if you want to make fun of me for your entertainment have at it. i'm a easy target since i'm ignorant of all this military medical information. but if you're serious about giving advice realize that i'm only on here because i'm trying to figure out what is the best option/route for me to become a doctor. its a fact that it will be a long journey for me so i want to make it as cost effective (w/o screwing myself over) as possible

First off, I wasn't trying to make fun of you, and if took it that way, I apologize. I'm 31, so sorry. The point is, we're 30 or 40 posts in, and finally we now know you are a 27 year old black/latina female. It won't change the advice I give, but it certainly does change how I think of you. I thought you were just another guy who was doing the traditional high school to college deal. Obviously you have done some other things in your life, and hats off to you for getting where you are now. Hopefully now you can see why I was confused.

I had thought you were trying to work this lab tech deal as a civilian, which would be a good deal and help towards your resume, etc. However, if you have to enlist to work this deal, I think its a terrible idea. First off, you are a college student! Granted I had plenty of enlisted guys working for me who had college credits, but you are steadfastly working towards your degree, DO NOT ENLIST! You are officer material. This deal will only potentially be a huge detour on your quest for medical school. This isn't like signing up for a job, you are selling your body to the military, they have complete control over your life. Never trust a recruitor, they always paint the rosiest picture. To be as blunt as possible, signing a contract with the military is essentially making yourself a prostitute to a pimp, they own you. Obviously I was comfortable with that having done it twice, but I knew a lot more the second time around.

With this new information, here is my advice. Find somewhere to either volunteer or get a job helping with research. Doesn't matter if you get published, but that would help. As far as the military stuff goes, troll this page to get some level of immersion (while recognizing it is second hand knowledge). Finish your degree and apply to school. But please don't enlist as a stepping stone to getting a commission, from my end it is just counter intuitive.

As far as your best financial option, the miliary aint it. Sure you'll be more comfortable during your four years of medical school, but civilian doctors make a lot of money. That's why everyone puts up with four years of raman noodles, cause it's a small lifestyle sacrifice for four years compared to the next forty.

Apparantly you have a lot of hard decisions coming up, so please don't let them overwhelm you. These decisions don't need to be made tonight, or even this week. Focus on school, cause that's the primary reason you are even doing all this. Keep us posted, and we'll continue to try and let you in on what military crap we do know about. Thanks for hanging in there.

 

[medstudent24]

First off, I wasn't trying to make fun of you, and if took it that way, I apologize. I'm 31, so sorry. The point is, we're 30 or 40 posts in, and finally we now know you are a 27 year old black/latina female. It won't change the advice I give, but it certainly does change how I think of you. I thought you were just another guy who was doing the traditional high school to college deal. Obviously you have done some other things in your life, and hats off to you for getting where you are now. Hopefully now you can see why I was confused.

I had thought you were trying to work this lab tech deal as a civilian, which would be a good deal and help towards your resume, etc. However, if you have to enlist to work this deal, I think its a terrible idea. First off, you are a college student! Granted I had plenty of enlisted guys working for me who had college credits, but you are steadfastly working towards your degree, DO NOT ENLIST! You are officer material. This deal will only potentially be a huge detour on your quest for medical school. This isn't like signing up for a job, you are selling your body to the military, they have complete control over your life. Never trust a recruitor, they always paint the rosiest picture. To be as blunt as possible, signing a contract with the military is essentially making yourself a prostitute to a pimp, they own you. Obviously I was comfortable with that having done it twice, but I knew a lot more the second time around.

With this new information, here is my advice. Find somewhere to either volunteer or get a job helping with research. Doesn't matter if you get published, but that would help. As far as the military stuff goes, troll this page to get some level of immersion (while recognizing it is second hand knowledge). Finish your degree and apply to school. But please don't enlist as a stepping stone to getting a commission, from my end it is just counter intuitive.

As far as your best financial option, the miliary aint it. Sure you'll be more comfortable during your four years of medical school, but civilian doctors make a lot of money. That's why everyone puts up with four years of raman noodles, cause it's a small lifestyle sacrifice for four years compared to the next forty.

Apparantly you have a lot of hard decisions coming up, so please don't let them overwhelm you. These decisions don't need to be made tonight, or even this week. Focus on school, cause that's the primary reason you are even doing all this. Keep us posted, and we'll continue to try and let you in on what military crap we do know about. Thanks for hanging in there.

ok apology accepted. i'm actually already working as a lab tech in research but i'm not doing any writing the grad students do that(except for my progress lab notes that I record for the professor). just the manual work of running chromatography columns/doing tlcs, etc. hopefully once i'm done w/ org chem1/2 my professor will give me more responsibility. i don't care about sacrifice and raman noodles... been there done that. i just don't want to have to work during med school or while doing my smp. the federal direct loans only pay a max of $20,000 per yr. and my credit probably won't qualify for personal loans. but i guess depending on what school i go to 20k will cover most of my expenses and i'll just have to suck it up and get a part time job. thanks

 

[medstudent24]

Thanks to everyone that posted valuable advice/info it's very much appreciated.

 

[BomberDoc]

All through college (which I paid for myself by working), I thought the happiest day of my life would be getting that acceptance to medical school. I remember the reality of it sinking in and my first thought wasn't overwhelming joy, it was "How the hell am I going to pay for this?"

I decided the military and specifically Air Force HPSP was the best way to go. Holy crap, was I mistaken. At first, I thought I was pretty clever as my med school classmates were taking on larger and larger amounts of debt to finance their education. I went to one month per year of military rotations and collected a monthly stipend (that paid for a hole in the wall apartment, some ramen, and a pack of hotdogs). Toward the end of med school, however, I realized the error of my ways. My classmates were matching into great residencies, while I got notified that I would be deferred for a year of internship and become a GMO. Fast forward a few years. My classmates are finishing their residencies and getting RIDICULOUS (half a Mil is not out of the ordinary) attending jobs while I'm still waiting out my time in the military and getting ready to start my residency. I am so far behind, I don't even want to think about it.

For what its worth, a few more student loans won't kill you. 4 years in the military not only puts you significantly behind your peers, the pay SUCKS A$$, there is more BS than you can believe, and it really might kill you. Seriously. Do well in college. Blow the MCAT away. Kaplan is expensive but worth every penny. Get into med school and pay for it on your own. Learn from my mistake and the mistakes of so many others.

 

[Founder]

If you want to do the military, do it because you truly want to.

I've wanted to be in the military since forever. I know there will be a ton of bull**** associated with military medicine. But since I didn't want to go SWO for 4 years and then go to med school, I decided to do HPSP and serve my required time (I had an ROTC scholarship so I have to commission anyway) as a future physician.

Would I be behind if I do really well in med school and then could match into a good residency? Yes. But that isn't the issue. I want to be in the military. The military will pay very well. The military actually pays very damned well when you compare it to other professions. Of course it doesn't pay nearly as well as a civilian physician would get. But you will never be in need of money in the military as long as you don't go out and buy tons of expensive **** you don't really need.

I might just do 4 years, I might try and do a whole 20. I don't know. We'll see. I'm keeping an open mind as of right now.

But everyone I talked to with an HPSP said you have to want to do it. Everyone I have talked to about military service has said do it because you want to. If you do it because of money or some ulterior motive then you will just be constantly disappointed and annoyed.

 

[megadon]

ok apology accepted. i'm actually already working as a lab tech in research but i'm not doing any writing the grad students do that(except for my progress lab notes that I record for the professor). just the manual work of running chromatography columns/doing tlcs, etc. hopefully once i'm done w/ org chem1/2 my professor will give me more responsibility. i don't care about sacrifice and raman noodles... been there done that. i just don't want to have to work during med school or while doing my smp. the federal direct loans only pay a max of $20,000 per yr. and my credit probably won't qualify for personal loans. but i guess depending on what school i go to 20k will cover most of my expenses and i'll just have to suck it up and get a part time job. thanks

will you get added to the pub list based on the work you did? That's all that matters. Go to a state school and not worry about the extraneous costs. What do they call the first guy who graduates, doctor, what do they call the last guy doctor. C=MD baby, you just have to get into a program. There are plenty of programs outside NYC where you might be able to budget it. I'm in memphis, and trust me, my best view of this f'd up city will be the rear view mirror.

 

[medstudent24]

All through college (which I paid for myself by working), I thought the happiest day of my life would be getting that acceptance to medical school. I remember the reality of it sinking in and my first thought wasn't overwhelming joy, it was "How the hell am I going to pay for this?"

I decided the military and specifically Air Force HPSP was the best way to go. Holy crap, was I mistaken. At first, I thought I was pretty clever as my med school classmates were taking on larger and larger amounts of debt to finance their education. I went to one month per year of military rotations and collected a monthly stipend (that paid for a hole in the wall apartment, some ramen, and a pack of hotdogs). Toward the end of med school, however, I realized the error of my ways. My classmates were matching into great residencies, while I got notified that I would be deferred for a year of internship and become a GMO. Fast forward a few years. My classmates are finishing their residencies and getting RIDICULOUS (half a Mil is not out of the ordinary) attending jobs while I'm still waiting out my time in the military and getting ready to start my residency. I am so far behind, I don't even want to think about it.

For what its worth, a few more student loans won't kill you. 4 years in the military not only puts you significantly behind your peers, the pay SUCKS A$$, there is more BS than you can believe, and it really might kill you. Seriously. Do well in college. Blow the MCAT away. Kaplan is expensive but worth every penny. Get into med school and pay for it on your own. Learn from my mistake and the mistakes of so many others.

ramen and hot dogs. never tried it that but that sounds good... lol it's all about the seasoning. ok but seriously i got you. thanks

 

[medstudent24]

If you want to do the military, do it because you truly want to.

I've wanted to be in the military since forever. I know there will be a ton of bull**** associated with military medicine. But since I didn't want to go SWO for 4 years and then go to med school, I decided to do HPSP and serve my required time (I had an ROTC scholarship so I have to commission anyway) as a future physician.

Would I be behind if I do really well in med school and then could match into a good residency? Yes. But that isn't the issue. I want to be in the military. The military will pay very well. The military actually pays very damned well when you compare it to other professions. Of course it doesn't pay nearly as well as a civilian physician would get. But you will never be in need of money in the military as long as you don't go out and buy tons of expensive **** you don't really need.

I might just do 4 years, I might try and do a whole 20. I don't know. We'll see. I'm keeping an open mind as of right now.

But everyone I talked to with an HPSP said you have to want to do it. Everyone I have talked to about military service has said do it because you want to. If you do it because of money or some ulterior motive then you will just be constantly disappointed and annoyed.

yes that makes sense. (everyone except the recruiters)

 

[medstudent24]

will you get added to the pub list based on the work you did? That's all that matters. Go to a state school and not worry about the extraneous costs. What do they call the first guy who graduates, doctor, what do they call the last guy doctor. C=MD baby, you just have to get into a program. There are plenty of programs outside NYC where you might be able to budget it. I'm in memphis, and trust me, my best view of this f'd up city will be the rear view mirror.

to be honest i haven't even thought about that. i've only been working there a few months and i'm concentrating on learning how to do everything in that lab so i don't have to ask the grad students or anyone any questions. once i can do everything w/ my hands behind my back i'll start looking into the procedure of what needs to be done to be added to the published list and do it. i'm sure there's a thread on here somewhere about that. i'll be working there for at least another 2 yrs while doing my undergrad so i have plenty of time to think about it. i think now its a little too soon to ask the professor. i don't want him looking at me crazy.

 

[Croooz]

i'll be working there for at least another 2 yrs while doing my undergrad so i have plenty of time to think about it. i think now its a little too soon to ask the professor. i don't want him looking at me crazy.

It's never too soon. You need to let them know your intentions, otherwise you'll be left high and dry. If they know now they can plan to give you some of the smaller portions of the research to do. Heck they might have you redo some assays to prove/disprove something which will help in the pub. The work you do today will be the pub a few years from now. You might even be in med school when they come asking you to sign consent forms to include you in the pub.

They are high risk because you never know what work will get accepted. Best, if possible, to spread your involvement in as many projects as you can. This of course depends on what you can do and what they trust you to do.

As a final thought by telling them upfront of your intentions you should ask how they add names to the pub list. Is it only the senior PI's? Is it everyone including the janitor? Do they limit the number of techs on the list? This way you know upfront whether or not there is any light at the end of the tunnel. Some places refuse to put anyone without a doctorate on the list.

 

[HumptyDumptyMil]

If you want to do the military, do it because you truly want to.

I've wanted to be in the military since forever. I know there will be a ton of bull**** associated with military medicine. But since I didn't want to go SWO for 4 years and then go to med school, I decided to do HPSP and serve my required time (I had an ROTC scholarship so I have to commission anyway) as a future physician.

Would I be behind if I do really well in med school and then could match into a good residency? Yes. But that isn't the issue. I want to be in the military. The military will pay very well. The military actually pays very damned well when you compare it to other professions. Of course it doesn't pay nearly as well as a civilian physician would get. But you will never be in need of money in the military as long as you don't go out and buy tons of expensive **** you don't really need.

I might just do 4 years, I might try and do a whole 20. I don't know. We'll see. I'm keeping an open mind as of right now.

But everyone I talked to with an HPSP said you have to want to do it. Everyone I have talked to about military service has said do it because you want to. If you do it because of money or some ulterior motive then you will just be constantly disappointed and annoyed.

I'm in the same boat. I think people with our mindset will be the ONLY one's being happy taking the HPSP scholarship. It never bothered me that I will be making less money than my civilian counterparts, or that I will be behind them in my training (and that is the worst case scenario). I do not see the rush at all.

 

[jeepgirl]

But since I didn't want to go SWO for 4 years and then go to med school, I decided to do HPSP and serve my required time (I had an ROTC scholarship so I have to commission anyway) as a future physician.

I might just do 4 years, I might try and do a whole 20. I don't know. We'll see. I'm keeping an open mind as of right now.

Apologies for the thread hijack, but I keep reading differing things ...

Will an ROTC scholarship obligation and an HPSP obligation be served consecutively or concurrently?

 

[midn]

Apologies for the thread hijack, but I keep reading differing things ...

Will an ROTC scholarship obligation and an HPSP obligation be served consecutively or concurrently?

Consecutively after your residency. Residency + 8 years = total active duty time.

That's what I last heard anyways.

 

[Founder]

Apologies for the thread hijack, but I keep reading differing things ...

Will an ROTC scholarship obligation and an HPSP obligation be served consecutively or concurrently?

I don't know exactly. No one I have talked to really knows. I think it was 5 years for ROTC and 3 years in the reserves or you can be active duty that whole time. I am not sure if residencies count for active duty to pay off the ROTC scholarship.

If I am behind in my career I will not be too, too concerned. I mean I don't want to retire from working when I am 50. I want to work well into my 60s. I get bored if I am not doing something. I know there will be a bunch of crap in the military but I am going to keep an open mind about my chances to get what I want. But I am not going into the military to necessarily get what I want. But what the Navy wants. Now I think I can serve the Navy better in something I would enjoy doing and be delighted to do.