why are pharmacists paid so high?

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saltmania

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No offense to Pharmacists....but why are they paid so high?

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Simple supply and demand issue. However the days of pill counting are over as Pharmacists are the most accessible healthcare provder out there. As a result, pharmacists are active in patient counseling, therapeutic interchange, drug information research, etc. This, on top of 6 years of schooling, increases the value of pharmacists. How many people would go through 6 years of hefty schooling including a year of unpaid clinical rotations to work in a job that doesn't pay well.
 
With $70,000 of student loans from a state, public school (undergrad and pharmd), I don't care what career you are in, you better be getting paid.
 
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htyotispharm said:
With $70,000 of student loans from a state, public school (undergrad and pharmd), I don't care what career you are in, you better be getting paid.

70,000??? Try $114,000 for me.
 
pharmdgto said:
Simple supply and demand issue. However the days of pill counting are over as Pharmacists are the most accessible healthcare provder out there. As a result, pharmacists are active in patient counseling, therapeutic interchange, drug information research, etc. This, on top of 6 years of schooling, increases the value of pharmacists. How many people would go through 6 years of hefty schooling including a year of unpaid clinical rotations to work in a job that doesn't pay well.

Medicine, 8 years of schooling, with 2 years of unpaid rotations, and at least 3 years of residency that is payed peanuts and yet people go to it. Now if pharmacy paid 50 or 60 grand a year, would people go into it, you bet your a%%.
 
saltmania said:
No offense to Pharmacists....but why are they paid so high?

The real question is why dentists are paid so high (higher than pharmacists)?

All these folks do is scratching somebody's oral cavity for the whole day.
If a pharmacist screws up his work somebody might easily die, if a dentist screws up a filling or a cavity - what happens? PRETTY MUCH NOTHING (except some pain and discomfort).
 
tupac_don said:
Now if pharmacy paid 50 or 60 grand a year, would people go into it, you bet your a%%.

I don't think there would be any more new pharmacy schools opening up if this was the case...to be honest.
 
tupac_don said:
Medicine, 8 years of schooling, with 2 years of unpaid rotations, and at least 3 years of residency that is payed peanuts and yet people go to it. Now if pharmacy paid 50 or 60 grand a year, would people go into it, you bet your a%%.

Yeah, but physicians, especially those who specialize, make 200k + a year. Don't forget that physicians are not the only ones that can get residencies. Pharm.D's can do a year or two of residencies plus fellowships as well for 30k or less a year as well. The 6 year program is just the entry level for a Pharm.D. If you want to specialize or gain your Ph.D in a particular field your up there at 8-10 years.

Also you have to remember that physicians are becoming a dime a dozen (GP's). Pretty soon they are going to have to advertise like lawyers in the phone book to gain buisiness. Not only that but alot of people unfortunitely have lost alot of faith in particular physicians so there is alot of competition going on in community practice to gain buisness. We don't have to worry about that because we work for mass chains or large hospitals who need our services, especially with the large increase of prescriptions due to a nice chunk of the population entering midlife. Also you can blame the drug compaines with direct-to-consumer adverstising that perpetuates the pharmacy business. The only way to end a patient-physician interaction unfortunitely is to put the pen to the pad of paper.
 
konkan said:
The real question is why dentists are paid so high (higher than pharmacists)?

All these folks do is scratching somebody's oral cavity for the whole day.
If a pharmacist screws up his work somebody might easily die, if a dentist screws up a filling or a cavity - what happens? PRETTY MUCH NOTHING (except some pain and discomfort).


Oh crap, I accidently gave him too much drug while inducing anesthesia...it's a good thing I do nothing or I might have had someone's life in my hands!!!

Dentists deserve banks, too.
 
saltmania said:
No offense to Pharmacists....but why are they paid so high?

Because we control the DRUGS. And he who controls the drugs controls the Universe...
 
kkelloww said:
Because we control the DRUGS. And he who controls the drugs controls the Universe...

The worms, the spice, is there a relationship?
 
konkan said:
The real question is why dentists are paid so high (higher than pharmacists)?

All these folks do is scratching somebody's oral cavity for the whole day.
If a pharmacist screws up his work somebody might easily die, if a dentist screws up a filling or a cavity - what happens? PRETTY MUCH NOTHING (except some pain and discomfort).
what's your beef on dentists? Did you not make it into dental school or something?
 
pharmdgto said:
Yeah, but physicians, especially those who specialize, make 200k + a year. Don't forget that physicians are not the only ones that can get residencies. Pharm.D's can do a year or two of residencies plus fellowships as well for 30k or less a year as well. The 6 year program is just the entry level for a Pharm.D. If you want to specialize or gain your Ph.D in a particular field your up there at 8-10 years.

Also you have to remember that physicians are becoming a dime a dozen (GP's). Pretty soon they are going to have to advertise like lawyers in the phone book to gain buisiness. Not only that but alot of people unfortunitely have lost alot of faith in particular physicians so there is alot of competition going on in community practice to gain buisness. We don't have to worry about that because we work for mass chains or large hospitals who need our services, especially with the large increase of prescriptions due to a nice chunk of the population entering midlife. Also you can blame the drug compaines with direct-to-consumer adverstising that perpetuates the pharmacy business. The only way to end a patient-physician interaction unfortunitely is to put the pen to the pad of paper.

The bolded is hardly true. It is actually the opposite. GP's are on the decline, check any news source and you will see the gloom and doom forecast of primary care. Docs don't want to be paid peanuts and GP's are on the bottom of the pay scale. People are picking the lifestyle specialties more and more.
 
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The Dental Program is much much more difficult than pharmacy. If we have to stay in school in class from 1-4 for P1, Dental 1s have to stay in class from 8-5 everyday, and the program is very demanding. Dental schools for the most part require a bachelor of science, while pharmacy schools take college sophomores.

Not everyone is willing to "scratch people's oral cavities" all day long. I personally would not do it, no matter how much it pays. It is stressful for dentists, because they can really make mistakes that are not reversable when it comes to teeth, and that damage holds up in court real nice.

I do not believe that dentists are overpaid at all.



konkan said:
The real question is why dentists are paid so high (higher than pharmacists)?

All these folks do is scratching somebody's oral cavity for the whole day.
If a pharmacist screws up his work somebody might easily die, if a dentist screws up a filling or a cavity - what happens? PRETTY MUCH NOTHING (except some pain and discomfort).
 
JordanP said:
The Dental Program is much much more difficult than pharmacy. If we have to stay in school in class from 1-4 for P1, Dental 1s have to stay in class from 8-5 everyday, and the program is very demanding. Dental schools for the most part require a bachelor of science, while pharmacy schools take college sophomores.

I don't think you can compare all pharmacy schools to all dental schools. I know that my P1 year was not 3 hours a day of lecture. Some pharmacy schools require a bachelors degree and I would expect this to become the norm in the near future as the competition for seats increase.

I don't think any of the health professions are overpaid. Nurses are underpaid for what they have to do.
 
CVS paid the pharmacist a day's pay for the holiday PLUS time and a half if they were working for a total of 2.5 times pay. $235 an hour for 10 hours and it was dead.

man i coulda used an extra 2 grAnd today!... and he didn't even buy lunch...coulda paid for the whole staff in 6 minutes lol....
 
RxRob said:
CVS paid the pharmacist a day's pay for the holiday PLUS time and a half if they were working for a total of 2.5 times pay. $235 an hour for 10 hours and it was dead.

man i coulda used an extra 2 grAnd today!... and he didn't even buy lunch...coulda paid for the whole staff in 6 minutes lol....

Why the hell would they do this? Are you sure the pharmacist wasn't messing with you?
 
All full time pharmacy employees get it, it's just not as impressive a number for the rest of us. July 4th is a paid holiday for everyone, so it wouldn't be fair to have to work it if there wasn't incentive. They could just pay doubletime for sure, but I'm sure it's one of CVS's selling points to prospective pharmacists.

Time and a half only would be a complete ripoff since it's only half your pay beyond just staying home to work it.
 
RxRob said:
CVS paid the pharmacist a day's pay for the holiday PLUS time and a half if they were working for a total of 2.5 times pay. $235 an hour for 10 hours and it was dead.

2.5 times pay ended up $235/hour? So the pharmacists regularly make $94/hour??
 
Caverject said:
what's your beef on dentists? Did you not make it into dental school or something?

Just chill out. I have nothing against dentists. don't get why they're making that kind of money. That's all. Never wanted to spend my life next to a stinky mouth.
 
konkan said:
Just chill out. I have nothing against dentists. don't get why they're making that kind of money. That's all. Never wanted to spend my life next to a stinky mouth.
Do you wonder the same thing about podiatrists? I bet you never wanted to spend the rest of your life next to stinky feet either....
 
konkan said:
Just chill out. I have nothing against dentists. don't get why they're making that kind of money. That's all. Never wanted to spend my life next to a stinky mouth.

I think you just answered your own question.

That and the fact people are willing to pay a lot of money on their teeth...and the fact that teeth can get painful.
 
RxRob said:
CVS paid the pharmacist a day's pay for the holiday PLUS time and a half if they were working for a total of 2.5 times pay. $235 an hour for 10 hours and it was dead.

man i coulda used an extra 2 grAnd today!... and he didn't even buy lunch...coulda paid for the whole staff in 6 minutes lol....
And I thought my $15 an hour (time and a half versus no pay at all for part-timers) for 8 hours was good...not! Can't wait till I make the pharmacist's salary :)
 
JordanP said:
The Dental Program is much much more difficult than pharmacy. If we have to stay in school in class from 1-4 for P1, Dental 1s have to stay in class from 8-5 everyday, and the program is very demanding. Dental schools for the most part require a bachelor of science, while pharmacy schools take college sophomores.

Not everyone is willing to "scratch people's oral cavities" all day long. I personally would not do it, no matter how much it pays. It is stressful for dentists, because they can really make mistakes that are not reversable when it comes to teeth, and that damage holds up in court real nice.

I do not believe that dentists are overpaid at all.

Nova has 3 hour days??? Are you serious?? Your whole day is as long as Ochem lab?
 
NSU P1 students usually range from 1:00PM to 5:00PM. This does not include lab, or early service learning which usually extends the day. Correct if I'm wrong, but don't pharmacy students have 3 years of classes and 1 year of rotations and dentist students have 2 years of classes and 2 years of rotations? If I'm correct, then it would make sense that the day for a D1 would be longer because they need to cram in more material in a less time.
 
saltmania said:
No offense to Pharmacists....but why are they paid so high?


When you say "No Offense" you offend.

No, we're not paid so "High."
 
konkan said:
if a dentist screws up a filling or a cavity - what happens? PRETTY MUCH NOTHING (except some pain and discomfort).
It's always easy to spot people who've never had a toothache in their lives...they're the ones who talk about "some pain and discomfort" like it's nothing (and they're usually the ones who, when something does go wrong, try to make it my fault for not driving to their house tid to brush their teeth for them). :rolleyes:

Everybody has their niche to fill in the healthcare system. I'd personally be bored stiff doing pharmacy, along with any number of other health professions. I like to be busy doing procedures to fix people's problems, and dentistry is a good match for that. Other people like to manage patients' problems more cerebrally, and want nothing to do with the technical hassles of doing the procedures, and I say more power to them too. Patients need people to do that, too, and I'm glad they're filling that role so I can do what I enjoy. It truly does take all kinds in this field.

JackFruitLover said:
NSU P1 students usually range from 1:00PM to 5:00PM. This does not include lab, or early service learning which usually extends the day. Correct if I'm wrong, but don't pharmacy students have 3 years of classes and 1 year of rotations and dentist students have 2 years of classes and 2 years of rotations? If I'm correct, then it would make sense that the day for a D1 would be longer because they need to cram in more material in a less time.
Dental school is (roughly) 2+2 as you've described here. At most schools, the second year of dental school is the hardest, and honestly, for a lot of people (myself included) it sucks pretty hard. D1 tends to be more slanted toward basic science didactics with the introductory pre-clinic lab courses, while D2 is typically a *ton* of lab courses along with the more clinically oriented didactics. D3 is primarily patient care with a smattering of advanced clinical courses, and D4 is entirely clinic. In rough terms, how does that compare to the pharmacy school curriculum?
 
I have a love/hate relationship with the dentist. I love the fact that they can fix my numerous dental problems but I hate the fact that I have numerous dental problems that require me to go to the dentist. I can't stand the thought of needles in my gums or the sound of the drill against my teeth. I look forward to going to the gynecologist more than I do the dentist. God bless dentist because I couldn't do it! :scared:

I agree with the above poster, we all have our role in the healthcare system and what may be right from one person may not be right for someone else but what I think that we all can hopefully agree on is that no one's journey (whether it be pharm, dent, pod, med, opt) is easy so I give everyone much respect for the time and effort that they have (or will) put into getting their respective degree.
 
I agree with the above people about the roles we play.

About pharmacy salary, as I understand it there is a shortage of pharmacists in many parts of the country. Because of that, our pay is a bit inflated. There is also the fact that our education and knowledge is extensive so we are paid accordingly. With the baby boomers aging and CVS, etc., opening on every corner, they will continue to pay us high as long as they have plenty of positions to fill. However, with so many pharmacy schools opening up, at some point in the future things will level out and our pay will probably go down somewhat.

The exact same thing is happening in the nursing field, where pay is increasing to attract nurses to jobs. Now that the pay is high, more young people are interested in going to nursing school. But eventually the shortage will dissipate and the pay will level off as well.
 
pharmdgto said:
Also you have to remember that physicians are becoming a dime a dozen (GP's). Pretty soon they are going to have to advertise like lawyers in the phone book to gain buisiness.

I dont necessarily disagree with you, but I will point out that every single newspaper and every single medical organization in teh country is convinced that there is a massive GP shortage, not a surplus
 
BrettBatchelor said:
The bolded is hardly true. It is actually the opposite. GP's are on the decline, check any news source and you will see the gloom and doom forecast of primary care. Docs don't want to be paid peanuts and GP's are on the bottom of the pay scale. People are picking the lifestyle specialties more and more.

From what I understand is that these GP shortages are in rural areas, much the same as any healthcare provider. There are massive shortages of pharmacists in states like west virginia as well. I can open my phone book right now and see pages upon pages of doctors (obviously not all are GP's). I am not saying there isn't a shortage of doctors, as there are all healthcare providers. What I am particularly trying to convey is that the general public is becoming increasingly skeptical of GP's and its going to be come survival of the fittest per sey. How do I know this? You should hear all the comments people make about certain doctors while waiting in the pharmacy....
 
BrettBatchelor said:
The bolded is hardly true. It is actually the opposite. GP's are on the decline, check any news source and you will see the gloom and doom forecast of primary care. Docs don't want to be paid peanuts and GP's are on the bottom of the pay scale. People are picking the lifestyle specialties more and more.

From what I understand is that these GP shortages are in rural areas, much the same as any healthcare provider. There are massive shortages of pharmacists in states like west virginia as well. I can open my phone book right now and see pages upon pages of doctors (obviously not all are GP's). I am not saying there isn't a shortage of doctors, as there are all healthcare providers. What I am particularly trying to convey is that the general public is becoming increasingly skeptical of GP's and its going to be come survival of the fittest per sey.
 
elmoz said:
With the baby boomers aging and CVS, etc., opening on every corner, they will continue to pay us high as long as they have plenty of positions to fill. However, with so many pharmacy schools opening up, at some point in the future things will level out and our pay will probably go down somewhat.

The exact same thing is happening in the nursing field, where pay is increasing to attract nurses to jobs. Now that the pay is high, more young people are interested in going to nursing school. But eventually the shortage will dissipate and the pay will level off as well.

Is this really possible? How can the pay go down? I understand it staying at the same level if the shortage eventually dissipates but don't you think it's kind of unlikely the pay would go down?
 
starsweet said:
Is this really possible? How can the pay go down? I understand it staying at the same level if the shortage eventually dissipates but don't you think it's kind of unlikely the pay would go down?

You should ask all the IT people about that. Several areas lost salary or held constant for several years now. So yes, if there's a flood of new pharmacists out there, it's not unreasonable to expect that salaries could potentially drop in certain areas.
 
KUMoose said:
You should ask all the IT people about that. Several areas lost salary or held constant for several years now. So yes, if there's a flood of new pharmacists out there, it's not unreasonable to expect that salaries could potentially drop in certain areas.


I don't see the market flooding with pharmacists the way it did with IT professionals...

A ton of tech programs opened up seemingly overnight here, offering short-term programs, microsoft certification. I'll bet 10 new "colleges" opened in my city alone. These programs were PUMPING out new grads at record pace.

It's a lot harder to start (and accredit) a pharmacy program.

Not to say that supply won't increase to the point where salaries level off a bit; I just don't think it will be as dramatic as IT.
 
starsweet said:
Is this really possible? How can the pay go down? I understand it staying at the same level if the shortage eventually dissipates but don't you think it's kind of unlikely the pay would go down?
It happens. Ask any number of primary care physicians.
 
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starsweet said:
Is this really possible? How can the pay go down? I understand it staying at the same level if the shortage eventually dissipates but don't you think it's kind of unlikely the pay would go down?

Yes....I do think this is highly unlikely. I've been a pharmacist for a long time & been through many cycles of saturation & high demand. My salary has NEVER been reduced. There have been years when I've not received a raise & some years I've received more than 10% raise. But...my income (I should say my hourly income) has never gone down.
 
According to one of my professors who used to own his own pharmacy, the pay is high because the chains and hospitals know you have the legal right to make a lot more money if you owned your own pharmacy rather than work for them. That's unlike a lot of other professions like teachers and more akin to dentists and physicians.

Right now I think the demand is high because of the huge boon in prescription demand (see all the ads on TV since 1997 when they allowed DTC), increased consumer awareness, Medicare Part D, the aging population, awareness by supermarket and department stores (Target and Wal-Mart) that pharmacy can bring in regular customers who spend money at their stores, and the implementation of the mandatory PharmD. Also, the decreased insurance reimbursements to primary care physicians (meaning less time spent talking to your doctor because they have to see more patients) have encouraged mid-levels and pharmacists to play a bigger role in educating and treating their patients.
 
We still have increased life expectancy (about 78 years now) and increasing U.S. population (About 300 million now) on our side. (increase in demand) :)
 
what is the average salary for a pharmacist anyways?
 
According to a recent survey done by ISHP (Illinois Society of Health System Pharmacists), the average income of Illinois Pharmacists is about $95,000.
 
uncle sam takes most of it away. I get 34% taken away of state and federal. Anybody knows good state or country with low taxes.
 
UOPharmD said:
uncle sam takes most of it away. I get 34% taken away of state and federal. Anybody knows good state or country with low taxes.

No state tax in Florida at all. You get to deduct your state sales tax from a table if you itemize your deductions, too. My husband's salary is $100k and we paid a little over $5,000 in income tax last year. We'll get killed once we get up to $200k, though.
 
UOPharmD said:
uncle sam takes most of it away. I get 34% taken away of state and federal. Anybody knows good state or country with low taxes.

No state tax in NV. Are you dually licensed? They're always looking for relief pharmacists in Zephyr Cove - pay is equivalent to the highest in CA & they pay your travel & lodging. Not a bad gig for a beautiful spot!
 
JordanP said:
The Dental Program is much much more difficult than pharmacy. If we have to stay in school in class from 1-4 for P1, Dental 1s have to stay in class from 8-5 everyday, and the program is very demanding. Dental schools for the most part require a bachelor of science, while pharmacy schools take college sophomores.

I just got my P1 schedule and I'll be in class 8-5 every day Mon-Fri and the school I'll be attending took a lot more people with BS degrees than "college sophomores." And pharmacy is demanding, as I'm sure everyone on here will agree.
 
No, we're not paid so "High."

$100,000+ isn't going to be more than 60 or 70K after taxes PLUS I know I'll owe my first born child to loans and credit cards when I'm done.
 
The way that I look at it is if you cannot live off of 70k TAKE HOME then you need to adjust your lifestyle. Most people would kill for that kind of take home salary....
 
RxRob said:
CVS paid the pharmacist a day's pay for the holiday PLUS time and a half if they were working for a total of 2.5 times pay. $235 an hour for 10 hours and it was dead.

man i coulda used an extra 2 grAnd today!... and he didn't even buy lunch...coulda paid for the whole staff in 6 minutes lol....

OMG.
My CVS pays 1.5x reg. pay on holidays

BTW, where do you live? Pharmacists here don't regularly make $94/hr...more like a little more than half of that. I always thought we had pretty good salaries in the DC area, but I guess not!
 
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