Why do some cheaters still win?

[TomWestmanRules]

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I know some girl at my college who plagiarized her ENTIRE final report for a Biochem Lab course -- and was caught. The prof said she'd get an F for the course, but she went and cried and somehow was absolved and worked her course grade back up to an A-.

And here's the kicker. This stupid girl got an acceptance into a better medical school than I have so far. I know life isn't fair, etc. etc. etc., and I am plenty happy that I have an acceptance for next year. But I am interested in finding out how common this is across the board.

Seriously, I feel bad for whoever gets stuck in a group with this chick in medical school, or even better... in a medical practice someday. Have fun when she slits your throat just to get a copy of your work and put her name on it.

 

[monkily_stealth]

This is disturbing on many levels.

 

[PropofolandPorsche]

.

 

[szhao]

o well, everyone makes mistakes, i don't think people should hold grudges, i mean i know i make mistakes all the time. and if people forgive me i should forgive others too.

 

[anonpremed]

is that avatar ur pic?

 

[TomWestmanRules]

Man oh man does that suck. But I've gotta ask--just how hot is she?

Meh... nothing special. I've had better.

 

[Ladyfingers]

You could always write a letter to this med school informing them of this. Of course this likely won't do anything, but yeah, that is super lame. I don't know how common it is but I hope not very. What school did she get into? I may not want to go there.

 

[krachenfels89]

You cant discredit her that much, she obviously knows what she's doing, unless she is extremely lucky. Regardless, It will all catch up to her whether its in mec school or slacking off on the job.

 

[degoo_]

It happens quite often. Perhaps not to that extent.

A friend who went to a local college pretty much just plagarized everything of the net for an entire term, but his B and brags about it.

 

[ONYX4000GT]

I know some gutter trash skank at my college who plagiarized her ENTIRE final report for a Biochem Lab course -- and was caught. The prof said she'd get an F for the course, but she went and cried and somehow was absolved and worked her course grade back up to an A-.

And here's the kicker. This stupid ***** got an acceptance into a better medical school than I have so far. I know life isn't fair, etc. etc. etc., and I am plenty happy that I have an acceptance for next year. But I am interested in finding out how common this is across the board.

Seriously, I feel bad for whoever gets stuck in a group with this chick in medical school, or even better... in a medical practice someday. Have fun when she slits your throat just to get a copy of your work and put her name on it.

No Good, No Good 👎 👎

 

[TomWestmanRules]

is that avatar ur pic?

Oh yeah... about that. I haven't changed that in several months. That was the picture of some chick on Survivor I had a crush on.

I browsed thru the sample avatars here for a few. I found the worst one and made it my new pic for now. I'll find a better one later.

Anyhow, I'm not really bitter about this, and not looking to do anything about it. It's more that I was wondering how often things like this happen, and just bringing awareness to the fact that you should probably choose your medical school friends wisely. You never know the track record of that person studying right next to you.

 

[premedtim]

I know some gutter trash skank at my college who plagiarized her ENTIRE final report for a Biochem Lab course -- and was caught. The prof said she'd get an F for the course, but she went and cried and somehow was absolved and worked her course grade back up to an A-.

And here's the kicker. This stupid ***** got an acceptance into a better medical school than I have so far. I know life isn't fair, etc. etc. etc., and I am plenty happy that I have an acceptance for next year. But I am interested in finding out how common this is across the board.

Seriously, I feel bad for whoever gets stuck in a group with this chick in medical school, or even better... in a medical practice someday. Have fun when she slits your throat just to get a copy of your work and put her name on it.

I'm extremely disgusted that the prof had no spine in dealing with her. That basically tells every other student in his class that it's ok to cheat in college (and in life will be the silent assumption) so there's no reason not to. Remind me never to refer any patients to her...she'd probably write down the wrong prescription and then blame it on her nurse if it came back to her.

 

[BeatrixKiddo]

I know some gutter trash skank at my college who plagiarized her ENTIRE final report for a Biochem Lab course -- and was caught. The prof said she'd get an F for the course, but she went and cried and somehow was absolved and worked her course grade back up to an A-.

And here's the kicker. This stupid ***** got an acceptance into a better medical school than I have so far. I know life isn't fair, etc. etc. etc., and I am plenty happy that I have an acceptance for next year. But I am interested in finding out how common this is across the board.

Seriously, I feel bad for whoever gets stuck in a group with this chick in medical school, or even better... in a medical practice someday. Have fun when she slits your throat just to get a copy of your work and put her name on it.

Maybe you should have taken some pointers from her. If you admire this girl, maybe you can tell her and she help you.

 

[clusterfunk]

These kind of actions persist throughout higher education, and medical school is no exception. It's rather ironic--albeit predictable--that the medical profession promotes teamwork, collaboration, and all that touchy-feely solidarity/fratty fluff; as such, I know several medical students who often "collaborate" (i.e. cheat) on exams in their dual-degree MPH coursework. The professors and their advisors know exactly what is happening, but tradition and common knowledge reveal that MD/MPH students receive preferential treatment because they are such huge a$$ets to the school's financial viability and reputation.

On a deeper level, I think it also shows how marginalized public health really is in healthcare/medical education.

 

[Pemberley]

o well, everyone makes mistakes, i don't think people should hold grudges, i mean i know i make mistakes all the time. and if people forgive me i should forgive others too.

A mistake is trying to do something correctly but executing in error. This was an intentionally chosen wrong decision.

And, speaking as a TA, I can't tell you how Clintonesque the college morals in Massachusetts are. Getting caught is the only crime.

 

[MonkeyNuts!]

Yeah I'd be more worried about that professor. This girl is just one person, imagine how many students are gonna skate through because of the prof... better to find out what happened and maybe tell your concerns to dean or something.

 

[xpinchx]

Don't worry, it'll catch up to her and she'll get it further down the road. If it gives you any justice, she'll fall 5x as hard if she gets caught doing something similar in medical school. She could kiss her dreams of being a doctor goodbye. 🙂 Just take pride in the fact that you did it the honest way.

 

[BeatrixKiddo]

Don't worry, it'll catch up to her and she'll get it further down the road. If it gives you any justice, she'll fall 5x as hard if she gets caught doing something similar in medical school. She could kiss her dreams of being a doctor goodbye. 🙂 Just take pride in the fact that you did it the honest way.

LOL!! That is soo cute!

 

[maestro1625]

had a guy like that in HS... he later ended up pulling at 2.5 at UMich...

 

[MinnyGophers]

Seriously though, if she has been cheating her way into med school, she will get caught up eventually. It is a lot harder to try to pass stuff like that in med school than it is in college or high school. The only thing to hope for is that it's before she makes a mistake with a real patient.

However, if it's just a one time deal (unlikely) then she hopefully learned her lesson.

 

[dynx]

Don't worry, it'll catch up to her and she'll get it further down the road. If it gives you any justice, she'll fall 5x as hard if she gets caught doing something similar in medical school. She could kiss her dreams of being a doctor goodbye. 🙂 Just take pride in the fact that you did it the honest way.

Oh if only this happy notion were true. We've had a girl caught on tape cheating on a shelf exam (for you pre-meds those are the nationally standardized tests at the end of your core rotations). End result, nothing. Still gonna graduate, still gonna get her MD, still gonna practice. Nice huh? Thats medical school for you, all talk, no action.

 

[HumbleMD]

Unfortunately life isn't fair. It's also frustrating to see how much lying folks try to justify on SDN.

 

[spicedmanna]

They don't win. She's got a big ole hole in her integrity; that's gotta smart somewhere... Moreover, she's gotta wake up to herself every morning for the rest of her life.

 

[SteveUTexas]

You could always write a letter to this med school informing them of this. Of course this likely won't do anything, but yeah, that is super lame. I don't know how common it is but I hope not very. What school did she get into? I may not want to go there.

This is the exact problem with premeds. Didn't you learn in kindergarten that nobody likes a tattletale? Also unless you have proof, and even if you did it is not your place, it would probably be considered libel to write something like that to the medical school. People need to quit worrying so much about others and focus on themselves. If you work hard, are smart, and work well with others you will be successful. Going around and whining about others is not going to get you anywhere.

 

[maestro1625]

Unfortunately life isn't fair. It's also frustrating to see how much lying folks try to justify on SDN.

so true.

 

[xpinchx]

LOL!! That is soo cute!

Talk dirty to me.

 

[BeatrixKiddo]

Talk dirty to me.

Take out the trash. And then do the laundry. OHHH YEAH!

 

[powerbooki]

Cheaters are an unavoidable part of the equilibrium, there will always be some. Cheaters often breed with cheaters, there is not any powerful enough selection factor that makes cheaters eventually die out. Cheaters' self-blaming is nowhere close to make them commit suicide before they reach child-bearing age.

For most of us, come and enjoy the bigger and better club of honest and hard-working people.

 

[Chuckwalla]

Hopefully when she gets busted again it will be with a female professor. She won't be able to pull anything.

 

[BeatrixKiddo]

Why do you guys hate cheaters so much.. this is like bad karma.

 

[dantt]

Just have to believe in Karma . . . I'm not sure what school you go to but at my school, the teachers are pretty strict about cheating. A girl got caught cheating on her Ochem test and was humiliated in front of the class and failed with a letter in her file. She can kiss her dreams of professional school goodbye. It was pretty intense because she was sitting near me and when the professor pointed at her and told her to stand up, nobody knew what was going on.

 

[xpinchx]

Take out the trash. And then do the laundry. OHHH YEAH!

Only if you cook dinner baby. 😉

 

[ggman]

I know some gutter trash skank at my college who plagiarized her ENTIRE final report for a Biochem Lab course -- and was caught. The prof said she'd get an F for the course, but she went and cried and somehow was absolved and worked her course grade back up to an A-.

And here's the kicker. This stupid ***** got an acceptance into a better medical school than I have so far. I know life isn't fair, etc. etc. etc., and I am plenty happy that I have an acceptance for next year. But I am interested in finding out how common this is across the board.

Seriously, I feel bad for whoever gets stuck in a group with this chick in medical school, or even better... in a medical practice someday. Have fun when she slits your throat just to get a copy of your work and put her name on it.

Sorry to be blunt, but that's life. You will encounter people like this ALL the time. From what I have seen, it only gets worse the older you get, so the best you can do is to learn from this and get ready for the future 👍 .

 

[szhao]

A mistake is trying to do something correctly but executing in error. This was an intentionally chosen wrong decision.

And, speaking as a TA, I can't tell you how Clintonesque the college morals in Massachusetts are. Getting caught is the only crime.

lol also speaking as a TA of 14 different courses over the past 3 years, i don't really care if they cheat, though i only report it if the prof has a different feeling on the subject. this does not mean i condone cheating, i just believe it is a waste of my time to care. in the end if they some how learn the material well they got lucky, if they don't there is where they will fail, not me stopping them. the world will sort itself out.

i guess let me append to this before someone response. cheating is bad, but you shouldn't stop cheating because ur goign to get caught, you should stop cheating because well you realize it is bad.

 

[solitude]

I know some gutter trash skank at my college who plagiarized her ENTIRE final report for a Biochem Lab course -- and was caught. The prof said she'd get an F for the course, but she went and cried and somehow was absolved and worked her course grade back up to an A-.

And here's the kicker. This stupid ***** got an acceptance into a better medical school than I have so far. I know life isn't fair, etc. etc. etc., and I am plenty happy that I have an acceptance for next year. But I am interested in finding out how common this is across the board.

Seriously, I feel bad for whoever gets stuck in a group with this chick in medical school, or even better... in a medical practice someday. Have fun when she slits your throat just to get a copy of your work and put her name on it.

I'm not going to defend her actions, but I wish you hadn't referred to her as a "skank" and a "*****". I hate to see people denigrate any woman - even a cheater - in such a way.

 

[etf]

Seriously though, if she has been cheating her way into med school, she will get caught up eventually. It is a lot harder to try to pass stuff like that in med school than it is in college or high school. The only thing to hope for is that it's before she makes a mistake with a real patient.

However, if it's just a one time deal (unlikely) then she hopefully learned her lesson.

i'm not a cheater, and i'm not particularly averse to seeing them get what they deserve, but i think it's kind of naive to think that these cheaters "will get caught eventually" or that "it will catch up with them" or even that it will just cause them to become more unethical down the line. most of them will, but more than a few will be able to pull it off without ever getting caught, or having it affect their life negatively in anyway. it's sad, but it's the real world, and it happens. you see it in business all the time, and at the end of the day, medicine is a business.

 

[szhao]

i'm not a cheater, and i'm not particularly averse to seeing them get what they deserve, but i think it's kind of naive to think that these cheaters "will get caught eventually" or that "it will catch up with them" or even that it will just cause them to become more unethical down the line. most of them will, but more than a few will be able to pull it off without ever getting caught, or having it affect their life negatively in anyway. it's sad, but it's the real world, and it happens. you see it in business all the time, and at the end of the day, medicine is a business.

if they do everything correctly despite it being cheating, if no one gets hurt, i am not talking about if you feel you deserved more than you got, but if no one got hurt in a way that is punishable by law, then so be it, i am not going through extra stress to make sure they suffer.

 

[brown98]

I feel for you. In one of my hard upper biology classes, we get take home exams. Guess what the girl next to me does? She has her boyfriend who is a biochemist do the test for her. The class consist mainly of two tests and both are take home.

Life is not fair. I guess we just have to work harder to cover our bases 🙂

 

[wickd]

This is the exact problem with premeds. Didn't you learn in kindergarten that nobody likes a tattletale? Also unless you have proof, and even if you did it is not your place, it would probably be considered libel to write something like that to the medical school. People need to quit worrying so much about others and focus on themselves. If you work hard, are smart, and work well with others you will be successful. Going around and whining about others is not going to get you anywhere.

Couldn't say it better. Besides if she has been cheating the whole time, don't you think she would have crashed on the MCAT? I think this is only a 1 time thing for her.

On second note, I suspect a bribe of some sort going on for the prof. to NOT report this. The prof. can get fired if the administration catches him passing a cheater...

 

[wickd]

Why do you guys hate cheaters so much.. this is like bad karma.

Because most people here spent almost sleepless nights working away on their GPA, improving on their MCAT score etc. and then you see someone coast through a class by cheating, and they still get to the same endpoint as you, only doing a lot less work in the process. Is this a clear explanation for you?

Personally I don't care much about cheaters. When you think about it, its all around us. Executives of a corporation lie and cheat to line their wallets, kids attempt hacking into their teacher's computer to bump their grade, etc. In the end who cares what happens to them? Even though it sounds a bit selfish, but the only person you should care about at this time is you. Life itself has its own way of getting rid of cheaters. 😉

 

[jackieMD2007]

I'm not going to defend her actions, but I wish you hadn't referred to her as a "skank" and a "*****". I hate to see people denigrate any woman - even a cheater - in such a way.

Well put. C'mon TomWestman. You could have called her some other things besides that. Unless you know that she's totally promiscuous--but that is a different thread, right?

 

[UIC Killa]

I know some gutter trash skank at my college who plagiarized her ENTIRE final report for a Biochem Lab course -- and was caught. The prof said she'd get an F for the course, but she went and cried and somehow was absolved and worked her course grade back up to an A-.

And here's the kicker. This stupid ***** got an acceptance into a better medical school than I have so far. I know life isn't fair, etc. etc. etc., and I am plenty happy that I have an acceptance for next year. But I am interested in finding out how common this is across the board.

Seriously, I feel bad for whoever gets stuck in a group with this chick in medical school, or even better... in a medical practice someday. Have fun when she slits your throat just to get a copy of your work and put her name on it.

unfortunately, in the cut-throat world of pre-medical students, where uncertainty prevails (mcats, application process,...) some people just feel the pressure and consort to cheating when they feel desperate...this easily occurs during undergrad but I cant see why someone would cheat in medical school...there is way too much information to not study, fellow students aren't going to help you and there is such a larger disparity in the risk vs. reward ratio, especially when some schools offer ways to help students who fail an exam (retakes...etc). I could not imagine getting kicked out of medical school for cheating...

 

[Sarg's kid]

if they do everything correctly despite it being cheating, if no one gets hurt, i am not talking about if you feel you deserved more than you got, but if no one got hurt in a way that is punishable by law, then so be it, i am not going through extra stress to make sure they suffer.

Ah, the words of a fellow cheater. Stung by the realization that it is wrong, immediately jumps in to justify cheating to ease their own concience. Bravo.

Happy cheating.

 

[sirus_virus]

forget about it. Focus on you

 

[MinnyGophers]

i'm not a cheater, and i'm not particularly averse to seeing them get what they deserve, but i think it's kind of naive to think that these cheaters "will get caught eventually" or that "it will catch up with them" or even that it will just cause them to become more unethical down the line. most of them will, but more than a few will be able to pull it off without ever getting caught, or having it affect their life negatively in anyway. it's sad, but it's the real world, and it happens. you see it in business all the time, and at the end of the day, medicine is a business.

I'm not saying that life will always be fair.. but what i am saying is that if cheating her way through undergrad was what got her into med school, she will not get far either way, whether she keeps on cheating or not. I'm not saying karma will get her. I am saying that people can bluff through so much before they face something that they will not be able to cheat at.

So maybe she keeps on cheating and what not, and that it doesnt affect her at all. Good for her. As long as it does not affect her patients, then i couldn't care less what happens to her.

 

[CTSballer11]

You could always write a letter to this med school informing them of this. Of course this likely won't do anything, but yeah, that is super lame. I don't know how common it is but I hope not very. What school did she get into? I may not want to go there.

It is not what you know it is what you can prove. Here is some advice; stay out of other people's business unless it specifically pertains to you.

 

[CTSballer11]

To all the posters who mention karma.

I am pretty sure that it will never catch up to her. Many people lie, cheat ,and steal and never have to face the music. We call these people President, Senator, CEO and the list goes on.

 

[MinnyGophers]

To all the posters who mention karma.

I am pretty sure that it will never catch up to her. Many people lie, cheat ,and steal and never have to face the music. We call these people President, Senator, CEO and the list goes on.

Horrible examples, especially President and Senator.

No one goes under more scrutiny than the President and Senators/other politicians. The entire elective process is to reveal those lies. If you think politicians have it easy, think again. Nowhere else can a lie be discovered more quickly than in politics.
Now whether something is done about it is another problem...

 

[sirus_virus]

Horrible examples, especially President and Senator.

No one goes under more scrutiny than the President and Senators/other politicians. The entire elective process is to reveal those lies. If you think politicians have it easy, think again. Nowhere else can a lie be discovered more quickly than in politics.
Now whether something is done about it is another problem...

Just like th OP said--it was discovered and nothing was done about it. The whole idea here is to learn not to let those types of things weigh you down. The OP is obviously disturbed by the fact that she got into a better medschool which should not be an issue. Just let it go and worry about how you can be the best doctor that you can be. What if for some reason this same girl gets into a "better" residency program and goes on to become a "better" doctor. Are you then going to submit to the fact that evil people always win? That is why I emphasize focusing on your own success otherwise **** like that will start playing tricks on your mind.

 

[CTSballer11]

Horrible examples, especially President and Senator.

No one goes under more scrutiny than the President and Senators/other politicians. The entire elective process is to reveal those lies. If you think politicians have it easy, think again. Nowhere else can a lie be discovered more quickly than in politics.
Now whether something is done about it is another problem...[/QUOTE]

My point exactly.

Take a look at the revolving door that is Kstreet and capital hill. Just this last year Tom Delay, Bob Ney, Duke Cunningham, Curt Wedlon, etc have all been indicted and Ney and Cunningham are already in jail. Delay was the fu King majority leader. Not to mention Mark Foley who has been messing around with teenage boys for god knows how long, you have to ask hastert about that one. Jefferson had his office raided by the FBI and they found 90k in his freezer and nothing has happened to him. They gerrymander districts to ensure and easy reelction, that sounds like cheating to me. You are so incredibly naive.