Why does DO exist?

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I see a lot of banter in threads like these about how LCME should take over the COMs, and how DO and MD should merge, and other wishful thinking.

When it has been brought up 3+ times by separate administration members at different moments I would say that it is far from wishful thinking. They are seriously concerned that it will happen, and that it will happen in a faster time frame than many people think.

If ACGME said that only LCME certified schools could get into their residencies, DO schools would have to shape up or fold. However, I have no idea of how much crossover there is between LCME & ACGME there is, so I have no idea how likely this would be.

Could ACGME require its residencies not to accept COMLEX? And basically require all applicants to take USMLE to apply?

You two are forgetting that ACGME would never be able pass a rule like that now that that 30% of the voting board seats are owned by the AOA.
 
When it has been brought up 3+ times by separate administration members at different moments I would say that it is far from wishful thinking. They are seriously concerned that it will happen, and that it will happen in a faster time frame than many people think.

Fears and reality are two different things.
 
Wise @Med Ed and @gyngyn , who know LCME works...what say you?

I don’t think it will be an LCME takeover personally. I think it will be a legislative thing where there is no need to have two accrediting bodies that are doing the exact same thing, especially since the next training step is standardized. This is the vibe I’ve been getting from the higher ups.
 
I don’t think it will be an LCME takeover personally. I think it will be a legislative thing where there is no need to have two accrediting bodies that are doing the exact same thing, especially since the next training step is standardized. This is the vibe I’ve been getting from the higher ups.
Ahh, it's totally different if politicians get involved. But it will have to be done at the national level.
 
I don’t think it will be an LCME takeover personally. I think it will be a legislative thing where there is no need to have two accrediting bodies that are doing the exact same thing, especially since the next training step is standardized. This is the vibe I’ve been getting from the higher ups.

Ahh, it's totally different if politicians get involved. But it will have to be done at the national level.

The LCME is a hybrid entity formed by the AMA and AAMC. I don't think it has any appetite for taking on osteopathic accreditation. The simple truth is that if the LCME applied its standards to DO schools, the vast majority of them would be shut down. Even in the most gentle scenario would be devastating to osteopathic education. I don't think anyone has the stomach for it, or would want to grapple with the consequences.
 
And do you make a significant distinction that he’s not a DMD. Although the difference may be clear in your mind most patients will have no clue.

Take for instance the deluge of chiropractic shills that parade as Dr. so-and-so taking advantage of public ignorance. They never try to market their alternative treatments making the distinction that they are chiropractors or even chiropractic physician. If you dig around their websites they will hide this information and their degree in the deepest recesses.

As a DO, you are a physician. If it will give you a complex or you want a competitive specialty then look elsewhere.


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But there is no difference between a DDS and a DMD - only the naming convention of the university awarding the degree. This is not unique to medicine. For example, from the world of accounting, there is no difference between a Masters of Accountancy (MAcc) and a Master of Science in Accounting (MSA) degree - both qualify you to sit for the CPA exam.

Unlike medicine, there is only one dental accreditation agency in the U.S. - the American Dental Association's Committee on Dental Accreditation or CODA. All DDS and DMD programs must receive CODA approval. The reason the DMD came into being was when Harvard started its dental school, it wanted to award its degree in Latin. See below.

What Is the Difference Between Dentists with DDS and DMD Degrees? | Oral Answers
 
But there is no difference between a DDS and a DMD - only the naming convention of the university awarding the degree. This is not unique to medicine. For example, from the world of accounting, there is no difference between a Masters of Accountancy (MAcc) and a Master of Science in Accounting (MSA) degree - both qualify you to sit for the CPA exam.

Unlike medicine, there is only one dental accreditation agency in the U.S. - the American Dental Association's Committee on Dental Accreditation or CODA. All DDS and DMD programs must receive CODA approval. The reason the DMD came into being was when Harvard started its dental school, it wanted to award its degree in Latin. See below.

What Is the Difference Between Dentists with DDS and DMD Degrees? | Oral Answers

Find me one layperson who can make this distinction. There may be more distinction but there is no limitation of the DO degree. You missed the entire point of the post - your patients won’t know the difference.


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Find me one layperson who can make this distinction. There may be more distinction but there is no limitation of the DO degree. You missed the entire point of the post - your patients won’t know the difference.


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In the U.S. there isn’t, but as someone who travels frequently and plans on internationals practice, there are real limitations in some nations.

A merger would fix all of that!

Plus, expecting students to sit for two sets of boards is just evil.
 
The LCME is a hybrid entity formed by the AMA and AAMC. I don't think it has any appetite for taking on osteopathic accreditation. The simple truth is that if the LCME applied its standards to DO schools, the vast majority of them would be shut down. Even in the most gentle scenario would be devastating to osteopathic education. I don't think anyone has the stomach for it, or would want to grapple with the consequences.

Which LCME standards are the majority of DO schools failing to meet? Quality of clinical rotations? Research opportunities?

Which DO schools would survive?
 
From my understanding MD and DO are in essence the same thing. DO has manipulative therapy, but some MD programs teach this as well. Some DOs never utilize it, and some MDs implement it.


Why do separate licenses that do the same identical thing still exist? Just something I've wondered.
Not therapy. Treatment. Physicians provide treatment. Osteopathic philosophy and principles are the core of who DOs are. Even though some never put OMT to use, the essence of each DO is NOT the same as MDs.
 
Not therapy. Treatment. Physicians provide treatment. Osteopathic philosophy and principles are the core of who DOs are. Even though some never put OMT to use, the essence of each DO is NOT the same as MDs.

Why can't MDs use osteopathic philosophy and principles to guide their treatment? This isn't unique to DOs.
 
If the LCME takes over accreditation, most DO schools would be forced to close because they would fail to meet the strict standards. The really strong DO schools would probably end up like UC Irvine.

Interesting, out of curiosity why the comparison to UC Irvine?

I don't think so. I've only been to a handful of doctors. The only way it would've been possible is back in the late 80s-early 90s when I was a child. I've only went to a doctor for anything like 3 times since then, and it was an EENT, an endocrinologist, and a sleep doctor. All MDs. They don't have very many DOs in Louisiana. I know they exist here, but theyre very few compared to MDs.

I haven't been to a dentist in 6 years, but he was a DDS. Family friend.

Six years?! Not even for a check-up and cleaning?
 
Nah I'm terrible. Going to go this summer. My girlfriend is going too, been about the same amount of time for her she says.
 
Why can't MDs use osteopathic philosophy and principles to guide their treatment? This isn't unique to DOs.

DO Philosphy is suddenly now sexy and the in-thing.

MD fellowship known as Integrative Medicine is literally word for word the Tenants of Osteopathic medicine. (It is pretty interesting— pull it up on google, two windows: one for tenants of Osteopathic medicine and one for the MD fellowship.

NP school websites and ads for Nursing Week literally sounds exactly like how DOs work : listen to the patient, work with the whole person, partner with the patient....

MDs and Physical therapist can indeed bill for OMT — instead of Osteopathic Manipulative Treatment, MDs bill for Orthopedic Manipultive Treatment and Physical therapists bill for Orthopedic Manipulative Therapy.

Perhaps that is the purpose of DOs... to hold the ground, make advances despite ridicule for 100s if Years, for our peers “catch up.”

But seriously, how many MDs take the integrative medicine fellowship? How many MDs roll their eyes at DOs and OMT?

Until MD schools and DO schools do somehow merge one day (not just residencies) then DOs must still exist, to be the Light.
 
Which LCME standards are the majority of DO schools failing to meet? Quality of clinical rotations? Research opportunities?

Which DO schools would survive?

If I were a member of an LCME site visit team conducting a survey of a DO school, here are the areas I would start with:

Standard 3.1 - Resident participation in medical student education
Standard 3.2 - Community of scholars/research opportunities
Standard 4.1 - Sufficiency of faculty
Standard 5.1 - Adequacy of financial resources
Standard 5.3 - Pressures for self-financing
Standard 5.4 - Sufficiency of buildings and equipment
Standard 5.5 - Resources for clinical instruction
Standard 6.3 - Self-directed and life-long learning
Standard 6.4 - Inpatient/outpatient experiences
Standard 6.7 - Academic environments
Standard 10.2 - Final authority of the admission committee

I'm not saying that every DO school is lacking in every area, but I'm willing to bet the above would trip up quite a few. I don't know enough about individual DO schools to hazard a guess which ones could pass. I do know, however, that the LCME is not fond of lecture-heavy curricula, tuition-dependent financial models, and DIY clinical years.
 
Until MD schools and DO schools do somehow merge one day (not just residencies) then DOs must still exist, to be the Light.

How-to-Clean-a-Bug-Zapper.jpg
 
Standard 5.1 - Adequacy of financial resources

This is the one that would trip up even established schools. Honestly, this is one of the biggest reasons I wish LCME would take charge of DO school certification. I went to a fantastic school (for the most part), but the debt I’m coming out with is insane.
 
If I were a member of an LCME site visit team conducting a survey of a DO school, here are the areas I would start with:

Standard 3.1 - Resident participation in medical student education
Standard 3.2 - Community of scholars/research opportunities
Standard 4.1 - Sufficiency of faculty
Standard 5.1 - Adequacy of financial resources
Standard 5.3 - Pressures for self-financing
Standard 5.4 - Sufficiency of buildings and equipment
Standard 5.5 - Resources for clinical instruction
Standard 6.3 - Self-directed and life-long learning
Standard 6.4 - Inpatient/outpatient experiences
Standard 6.7 - Academic environments
Standard 10.2 - Final authority of the admission committee

I'm not saying that every DO school is lacking in every area, but I'm willing to bet the above would trip up quite a few. I don't know enough about individual DO schools to hazard a guess which ones could pass. I do know, however, that the LCME is not fond of lecture-heavy curricula, tuition-dependent financial models, and DIY clinical years.

Yeah you’re right, there are probably only about 8 schools that would meet those criteria or be very close. That’s only ~20% of DO schools and literally none of the new schools would even be in the right ballpark.
 
They were originally a DO school. Then they became MD.
California had a little snit about DOs

The CA story is a fascinating one. If I remember my details, the CA Medical Association offered up a small fee to convert any DO degree into an MD. Naturally, tons of people took them up on the offer. But then they got to greedy by saying that no new DOs could set up practice in the state. That's a restraint of trade issue there. So it was fought in court and the CAMA lost. In part of the process, the CA DO school converted to the present UCI MD school.

One almost has to admire them for their ruthlessness!

If I were a member of an LCME site visit team conducting a survey of a DO school, here are the areas I would start with:

Standard 3.1 - Resident participation in medical student education
Standard 3.2 - Community of scholars/research opportunities
Standard 4.1 - Sufficiency of faculty
Standard 5.1 - Adequacy of financial resources
Standard 5.3 - Pressures for self-financing
Standard 5.4 - Sufficiency of buildings and equipment
Standard 5.5 - Resources for clinical instruction
Standard 6.3 - Self-directed and life-long learning
Standard 6.4 - Inpatient/outpatient experiences
Standard 6.7 - Academic environments
Standard 10.2 - Final authority of the admission committee

I'm not saying that every DO school is lacking in every area, but I'm willing to bet the above would trip up quite a few. I don't know enough about individual DO schools to hazard a guess which ones could pass. I do know, however, that the LCME is not fond of lecture-heavy curricula, tuition-dependent financial models, and DIY clinical years.

Without outing my school, I'd say we have issues with 3-4 of the things on the list, especially 10.2. At most DO schools, the Dean is the Final Decider as to admissions fates. Several of the newest schools easily have issues with five or more of the standards!
 
DO Philosphy is suddenly now sexy and the in-thing.

MD fellowship known as Integrative Medicine is literally word for word the Tenants of Osteopathic medicine. (It is pretty interesting— pull it up on google, two windows: one for tenants of Osteopathic medicine and one for the MD fellowship.

NP school websites and ads for Nursing Week literally sounds exactly like how DOs work : listen to the patient, work with the whole person, partner with the patient....

MDs and Physical therapist can indeed bill for OMT — instead of Osteopathic Manipulative Treatment, MDs bill for Orthopedic Manipultive Treatment and Physical therapists bill for Orthopedic Manipulative Therapy.

Perhaps that is the purpose of DOs... to hold the ground, make advances despite ridicule for 100s if Years, for our peers “catch up.”

But seriously, how many MDs take the integrative medicine fellowship? How many MDs roll their eyes at DOs and OMT?

Until MD schools and DO schools do somehow merge one day (not just residencies) then DOs must still exist, to be the Light.

If MDs and other healthcare providers can still bill for and perform OMT and treatment, this means OMM is no longer a unique aspect for DOs. Which means the unique aspect of DOs is historical. You should take a look on the Paradox of Osteopathy which was reported by a physician in 1990s: NEJM - Error

JD Howell, author of The Paradox of Osteopathy, notes claims of a "fundamental yet ineffable difference" between MD and DO qualified physicians are based on practices such as "preventive medicine and seeing patients in a sociological context" that are "widely encountered not only in osteopathic medicine but also in allopathic medicine." Studies have confirmed the lack of any "philosophic concept or resultant practice behavior" that would distinguish a D.O. from an M.D.
If osteopathy has become the functional equivalent of allopathy [meaning the MD profession], what is the justification for its continued existence? And if there is value in therapy that is uniquely osteopathic, why should its use be limited to osteopaths?
 
If MDs and other healthcare providers can still bill for and perform OMT and treatment, this means OMM is no longer a unique aspect for DOs. Which means the unique aspect of DOs is historical. You should take a look on the Paradox of Osteopathy which was reported by a physician in 1990s: NEJM - Error

Bill for does not equal “same as.”

Imagine a green belt saying he is “basically the same” as the karate master.

Or a house painter saying he is “basically the same” as Picasso.

Not everyone gets a trophy.
 
Bill for does not equal “same as.”

Imagine a green belt saying he is “basically the same” as the karate master.

Or a house painter saying he is “basically the same” as Picasso.

Not everyone gets a trophy.

😕 so you think DOs are somehow more knowledgeable/experienced with OMM than MDs/other healthcare providers who learned and used it their training?
 
😕 so you think DOs are somehow more knowledgeable/experienced with OMM than MDs/other healthcare providers who learned and used it their training?
IMO, I strongly believe so. 2 years learning it in class, then 3 years specializing in it. That's way more training in OMM than any MDs practicing OMT.

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IMO, I strongly believe so. 2 years learning it in class, then 3 years specializing in it. That's way more training in OMM than any MDs practicing OMT.

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I think CME credits allow MDs to become just as experienced with OMM than DOs who barely use it despite being required to learn it in school

Even then, this isn’t enough to justify having two separate pathways. I’ve been arguing for trying to collapse DO education into a fourth year elective which seemingly got support from DO students here.
 
I think CME credits allow MDs to become just as experienced with OMM than DOs who barely use it despite being required to learn it in school

Even then, this isn’t enough to justify having two separate pathways. I’ve been arguing for trying to collapse DO education into a fourth year elective which seemingly got support from DO students here.
I was talking about people that actually specializes in NMM/OMM.

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I was talking about people that actually specializes in NMM/OMM.

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That's a small subset of DOs. But that's not what it was meant by this post:

Bill for does not equal “same as.”

Imagine a green belt saying he is “basically the same” as the karate master.

Or a house painter saying he is “basically the same” as Picasso.

Not everyone gets a trophy.

I don't think DOs with NMM/OMM are being compared with MDs with NMM/OMM. It's DOs as a whole vs MDs with NMM/OMM training, even though most DOs don't pursue further OMM training past med school.
 
For everyone saying that DO was viewed as a pseudoscience...you do understand that the birth of DO was brought around because Dr. Still saw medicine during that time causing more harm than good? Medicine during that time practiced by MD wasn't the same medicine today. There was a lot of snake oil, bleeding of the humors and other practices that often led to death rather than wellness. I feel like people forget that DO's take the same courses as MD's and take the same national licensing boards for their specialties...If you pass these boards you are qualified and the path you chose to get there should be a non -issue.
 
posted too soon. In addition, once in the real world your colleges are not going to give two hoots about where you went to school or what initials you have after your name as long as you pull your weight in your group, are a competent physician, and are not a total prick to work with. Honestly I only see people making a big deal out of DO vs MD are pre meds and medical students. Source- Husband is a physician and I come from a family of both MD and DO.
 
For everyone saying that DO was viewed as a pseudoscience...you do understand that the birth of DO was brought around because Dr. Still saw medicine during that time causing more harm than good? Medicine during that time practiced by MD wasn't the same medicine today. There was a lot of snake oil, bleeding of the humors and other practices that often led to death rather than wellness. I feel like people forget that DO's take the same courses as MD's and take the same national licensing boards for their specialties...If you pass these boards you are qualified and the path you chose to get there should be a non -issue.

That’s great, but now the AOA peddles snake oil in the form of things like cranial & Chapman’s points. Yes, AT Still was trying to change the world of medicine, and that was admirable, but MDs got better and improved their methods, whereas many DOs, particularly in leadership, remain so stuck in the past that they hold back any advancements and improvements that could be made in reaching equality with MDs in terms of respect and opportunity.
 
DO schools pedal an amazing medical education that each year sees thousands of competent physicians graduate and go on to do amazing things. If you are waiting for someone to hand out respect and opportunity you will be waiting a while. You need to go out and prove yourself as a competent physician and make your own name for your self. Why are you hinging your self worth on what others think of you? In the medical field you need a thick skin as regardless of DO or MD you will often find patients, other attendings, and even administrators are slow to dole out the respect. There are techniques still taught in MD schools that are not all evidence based either but have just been done because that is what has always been done. :thinking: shrug.. I am aware that there are some things taught that are sketch but you can just ignore it and move on. If you are an amazing and driven student you are going to go out and find opportunities. Nothing will be handed to us in life and I for one am not going to wait around to be patted on the head and told by some MD that they respect me.
 
DO schools pedal an amazing medical education that each year sees thousands of competent physicians graduate and go on to do amazing things. If you are waiting for someone to hand out respect and opportunity you will be waiting a while. You need to go out and prove yourself as a competent physician and make your own name for your self. Why are you hinging your self worth on what others think of you? In the medical field you need a thick skin as regardless of DO or MD you will often find patients, other attendings, and even administrators are slow to dole out the respect. There are techniques still taught in MD schools that are not all evidence based either but have just been done because that is what has always been done. :thinking: shrug.. I am aware that there are some things taught that are sketch but you can just ignore it and move on. If you are an amazing and driven student you are going to go out and find opportunities. Nothing will be handed to us in life and I for one am not going to wait around to be patted on the head and told by some MD that they respect me.

I just want to point out that your posts are strengthening the argument to unify the two degrees and have a single accreditating agency. All you’re saying is DO and MD are functionally the same. No one is arguing otherwise. But there is zero reason to keep the degree pathways separate if they lead to the same outcome of producing physicians.
 
I don't know why I keep coming back to this page when I could be studying from Step 1 on Friday,
Study hard, best of luck. It is a rite of passage - nashing through that First Aid Step 1 book. A Rite of passage that both MD and DO students go through. Our MD brothers and sisters, just know that there is something that you can learn from DOs. Together we can improve the state of medicine. From my childhood, I remember a character on TV saying, “watcha readin’ For, geek! Dontcha know how to work a TV?!?” Be humble, keep you head down, study hard — go to, get through and excel at Med school — whether Md or Do. Know enough so that one day you may be aware enough to tell a patient/loved one “I know someone whi might be able to help.....” as opposed to “there’s nothing we can do, sorry....”
 
Study hard, best of luck. It is a rite of passage - nashing through that First Aid Step 1 book. A Rite of passage that both MD and DO students go through. Our MD brothers and sisters, just know that there is something that you can learn from DOs. Together we can improve the state of medicine. From my childhood, I remember a character on TV saying, “watcha readin’ For, geek! Dontcha know how to work a TV?!?” Be humble, keep you head down, study hard — go to, get through and excel at Med school — whether Md or Do. Know enough so that one day you may be aware enough to tell a patient/loved one “I know someone whi might be able to help.....” as opposed to “there’s nothing we can do, sorry....”

I feel like the focus is getting shifted from the main point of the thread. Everyone here acknowledges that MDs and DOs are equal and many recognize that OMM is useful and MDs can learn, train and use it in their practice. The fact that MDs and other healthcare providers use OMM in clinical practice show that they have learned from DOs.

But none of the posts have convincingly shown why despite this equivalency, DO and MD should remain separate degree pathways with separate accreditation systems. The paradox of osteopathy that I linked above wasn’t addressed and I’m seeing vague implications that somehow DOs have this unique essence that MDs lack despite training in OMM.

I’ll be direct. I find OMM useful and I want to see it used as an elective for all medical students in school. Rather than having COMLEX and DO shelves, I would like to have a separate OMM shelf that tests thr material. And there can be OMM boards for those wanting to be licensed and certified in OMM. This way the history of osteopathic medicine is well respected in medical community and education without having to need two separate pathways.

I view the current system of separate but equal redundant at best and dangerous at worst. COCA is far far more relaxed in its standards than LCME. COCA has monetary interests which is why it’s encouraging this insane DO expansion with new schools and branch campuses popping out with large class sizes and accepting applicants with high risk of failing the boards. This doesn’t happen under LCME’s watch because the LCME isn’t afraid to ding schools for violating the standards.

If the two education pathways remain separate, COCA will continue to encourage this DO expansion. This will worsen the problems, which is why DO residents have repeatedly and openly said on here that they are glad they are done with school and won’t have to deal with the dangers that will inevitably come with the expansion. And these dangers will tragically worsen the anti-DO bias that DO grads are facing in the residency trail.

This is why I’m strongly advocating for the LCME takeover of DO schools as long as there is a longer transition period and some standards are relaxed. I want to eliminate the anti-DO bias and also ensure that DO students get just as good education as their MD counterparts.
 
DO schools pedal an amazing medical education that each year sees thousands of competent physicians graduate and go on to do amazing things. If you are waiting for someone to hand out respect and opportunity you will be waiting a while. You need to go out and prove yourself as a competent physician and make your own name for your self. Why are you hinging your self worth on what others think of you? In the medical field you need a thick skin as regardless of DO or MD you will often find patients, other attendings, and even administrators are slow to dole out the respect. There are techniques still taught in MD schools that are not all evidence based either but have just been done because that is what has always been done. :thinking: shrug.. I am aware that there are some things taught that are sketch but you can just ignore it and move on. If you are an amazing and driven student you are going to go out and find opportunities. Nothing will be handed to us in life and I for one am not going to wait around to be patted on the head and told by some MD that they respect me.

I’m very happy with where I’m at and where I’m going. However, I take umbrage at your implication that gaining respect is solely in the hands of the individual. The AOA is tasked with protecting DO interests and advancing the DO reputation; they have failed miserably. The “Doctors that DO” campaign a year or two ago was a shameful attempt to promote DOs as a better option at the expense of our MD colleagues; it was humiliating. This year, the AOA was trying to get students to celebrate their COMLEX-only success stories; even the most adamantly pro-AOA student in my class called them out for this shameful self promotion at the expense of medical students’ futures. The AOA leadership are so desperate to hold on to the cash cow that is osteopathic medicine that they’re selling out their members. It’s my job to earn the respect of the people immediately around me; it’s the AOA leadership’s job to earn DOs the respect of the medical community and public at large, and they are screwing the pooch every opportunity they get. I am astronomically pleased with the opportunities that my school and the letters after my name have afforded me; I am very proud to be a DO, but I am embarassed by the organization that claims to represent my interests, as they very obviously do not care about my future nor the future of my colleagues in the least.
 
I feel like the focus is getting shifted from the main point of the thread. Everyone here acknowledges that MDs and DOs are equal and many recognize that OMM is useful and MDs can learn, train and use it in their practice. The fact that MDs and other healthcare providers use OMM in clinical practice show that they have learned from DOs.

But none of the posts have convincingly shown why despite this equivalency, DO and MD should remain separate degree pathways with separate accreditation systems. The paradox of osteopathy that I linked above wasn’t addressed and I’m seeing vague implications that somehow DOs have this unique essence that MDs lack despite training in OMM.

I’ll be direct. I find OMM useful and I want to see it used as an elective for all medical students in school. Rather than having COMLEX and DO shelves, I would like to have a separate OMM shelf that tests thr material. And there can be OMM boards for those wanting to be licensed and certified in OMM. This way the history of osteopathic medicine is well respected in medical community and education without having to need two separate pathways.

I view the current system of separate but equal redundant at best and dangerous at worst. COCA is far far more relaxed in its standards than LCME. COCA has monetary interests which is why it’s encouraging this insane DO expansion with new schools and branch campuses popping out with large class sizes and accepting applicants with high risk of failing the boards. This doesn’t happen under LCME’s watch because the LCME isn’t afraid to ding schools for violating the standards.

If the two education pathways remain separate, COCA will continue to encourage this DO expansion. This will worsen the problems, which is why DO residents have repeatedly and openly said on here that they are glad they are done with school and won’t have to deal with the dangers that will inevitably come with the expansion. And these dangers will tragically worsen the anti-DO bias that DO grads are facing in the residency trail.

This is why I’m strongly advocating for the LCME takeover of DO schools as long as there is a longer transition period and some standards are relaxed. I want to eliminate the anti-DO bias and also ensure that DO students get just as good education as their MD counterparts.
Save your your breath already. There's no white knight out there. The AOA will only stop this process when enough of its members are willing to do so.

LCME takeover indeed.
 
DO Philosphy is suddenly now sexy and the in-thing.

MD fellowship known as Integrative Medicine is literally word for word the Tenants of Osteopathic medicine. (It is pretty interesting— pull it up on google, two windows: one for tenants of Osteopathic medicine and one for the MD fellowship.

NP school websites and ads for Nursing Week literally sounds exactly like how DOs work : listen to the patient, work with the whole person, partner with the patient....

MDs and Physical therapist can indeed bill for OMT — instead of Osteopathic Manipulative Treatment, MDs bill for Orthopedic Manipultive Treatment and Physical therapists bill for Orthopedic Manipulative Therapy.

Perhaps that is the purpose of DOs... to hold the ground, make advances despite ridicule for 100s if Years, for our peers “catch up.”

But seriously, how many MDs take the integrative medicine fellowship? How many MDs roll their eyes at DOs and OMT?

Until MD schools and DO schools do somehow merge one day (not just residencies) then DOs must still exist, to be the Light.


100 years of Osteopathy, and you think Still was the first to care holistically?

Florence Nightingale would like a word. 😉
 
I always wonder if DO/ MD schools merged, would their admissions philosophies merge as well?
Hmmmm

( Sorry I know I know I have so many questions but it's just.so.interesting)
 
I always wonder if DO/ MD schools merged, would their admissions philosophies merge as well?
Hmmmm

( Sorry I know I know I have so many questions but it's just.so.interesting)
Lots of schools have different admissions philosophies. SLU is not Duke, nor GWU, for example.
 
Lots of schools have different admissions philosophies. SLU is not Duke, nor GWU, for example.
But the generally lower MCAT/GPA and more forgiveness for a weak start to college, I feel like all DO schools have more room for that than even the more forgiving MD programs? I also think multiple MCAT's are handled differently by DO schools. ( I think it's newest, not average, but I'm not sure).
 
But the generally lower MCAT/GPA and more forgiveness for a weak start to college, I feel like all DO schools have more room for that than even the more forgiving MD programs? I also think multiple MCAT's are handled differently by DO schools. ( I think it's newest, not average, but I'm not sure).
It's true that DO schools are more willing to overlook past acadmic mistakes.

At my school, we average MCAT scores. Others takew the best composite, and still others take the most recent. MD schools do this as well.
 
ot how science works.

Also, want to know a secret about pain medicine, particularly spine procedures?
But the generally lower MCAT/GPA and more forgiveness for a weak start to college, I feel like all DO schools have more room for that than even the more forgiving MD programs? I also think multiple MCAT's are handled differently by DO schools. ( I think it's newest, not average, but I'm not sure).

If MD and DO schools merged under the LCME, DO schools that met LCME standards would be able to dictate whatever standards their environment and pockets afforded. PCOM, being in a nicer area, could afford to be more competitive than some MD schools with a full merger. The irony is that AOA/COCA is holding its own gems back so that they can milk $ off of every Osteopathic student by making them take the COMLEX and learn OMM. I don't understand why anyone (outside of OMM enthusiasts) are defending Osteopathic leadership. They're really the ones holding DOs back, not the MD governing bodies. The reasons aren't political. Refer to Med Ed's list of quality standards most DO schools (not students) don't meet. They're legitimate concerns. My friends at DO schools hardly interact with residents on rotations. Some schools (like maybe LECOM/PCOM/TCOM) do and their students will come on Medical Students-DO and will truthfully state their experiences are different and tell me I'm uninformed. It's happened before.
 
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