Why is ENT so competitive?

[deuce924]

I know this question has been brought up multiple times so I apologize. I am a M2 with 2 (possibly 3) ENT-related publications. When I tell people I am interested in ENT many people often say, "Yea I have heard of that. I also heard that was a competitive residency to get in to". I wanted to get your opinion on why the field of ENT is so competitive.

It doesn't have that wow factor of telling someone your are an Orthopedic or Neurosurgeon (not to mention the salary). It doesn't have the lifestyle of the ROAD Specialties. So I ask, Why is ENT considered such a competitive field and why does it draw many strong candidates to apply for a career in the field? Thanks for your help.

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[bowzer]

I know this question has been brought up multiple times so I apologize. I am a M2 with 2 (possibly 3) ENT-related publications. When I tell people I am interested in ENT many people often say, "Yea I have heard of that. I also heard that was a competitive residency to get in to". I wanted to get your opinion on why the field of ENT is so competitive.

It doesn't have that wow factor of telling someone your are an Orthopedic or Neurosurgeon (not to mention the salary). It doesn't have the lifestyle of the ROAD Specialties. So I ask, Why is ENT considered such a competitive field and why does it draw many strong candidates to apply for a career in the field? Thanks for your help.

imagine if you went to an icecream shop and you saw someone enjoying a delicious chocolate cone. then that persons comes to you and asks you why do so many people enjoy this flavor if its not doesnt taste like the other delicious flavors. what would you say to that person?

 

[Flank Pain]

It "draws so many applicants" because:
1. It is good surgery
2. The people are nice
3. The life style (hours) are generally good
4. You can make a BOAT LOAD of money

 

[deuce924]

Flank Pain.... Thanks for the reply

Bowzer..... What???

 

[TeamZissou]

Studying for Medical School is like drunk sex, you never finish, you just do it until its not worth it anymore...

Hahaha thanks for the laughs.

 

[surgery2121]

Here's why it attracts me.

1.) See patients of all age groups and many of them are healthy
2.) good mix of medicine and surgery
3.) Anatomy is interesting
4.) Can tailor your practice to do lots of surgery early on and then ween off to more clinic time as you get older
5.) Personally know an ENT who has been playing golf 4 days a week for the past 20 years

What I don't like about it

1.) For how competitive it is the reimbursements aren't that high. Sure you can make around 300k but as a urologist, orthopod, cardiologist, rad onc, radiologist, GI etc. you can make much much more.
2.) I have seen some of their surgeries and I am amazed. They seem very delicate and I am not sure that my shaky hands would be able to handle them.

 

[ZagDoc]

Not to mention the tech. ENT as a field has really embraced fiberoptics, lasers, minimally invasive techniques, etc. Tons of fun toys to play with!

 

[bronx43]

Here's why it attracts me.

1.) See patients of all age groups and many of them are healthy
2.) good mix of medicine and surgery
3.) Anatomy is interesting
4.) Can tailor your practice to do lots of surgery early on and then ween off to more clinic time as you get older
5.) Personally know an ENT who has been playing golf 4 days a week for the past 20 years

What I don't like about it

1.) For how competitive it is the reimbursements aren't that high. Sure you can make around 300k but as a urologist, orthopod, cardiologist, rad onc, radiologist, GI etc. you can make much much more.
2.) I have seen some of their surgeries and I am amazed. They seem very delicate and I am not sure that my shaky hands would be able to handle them.

Yeah, I'm in the same boat with the shaky hands. Though if it's an essential tremor, you could probably just pop some beta blockers and be okay.

As for the relatively low reimbursement rates, it just goes to show you how much people like the field to make it that competitive despite the non-lucrative pay.

 

[Pir8DeacDoc]

Not sure you guys are on track with your thoughts about salary in otolaryngology.

ENT is generally on par salary wise with urology, which is to say it's more than general surgery but a touch less than ortho and quite a bit less than NSurg. There is still the potential to make a lot of money as an ENT. I would say that salary is not a negative aspect of otolaryngology especially when you consider the hours worked.

 

[bobby6]

Most general ENTs 5 years out from residency are making between 300-400k. Not bad for a 40-50hr work week.

 

[resxn]

Most general ENTs 5 years out from residency are making between 300-400k. Not bad for a 40-50hr work week.

You've got to be kidding me? In the US? I wish. Check out the MGMA statistics on this--not even close for the average.

 

[bobby6]

Below is from an article from the AAO-HNS academy www.entnet.org website titled
Physician Compensation
Studies: An Analysis

Specialty compensation survey data:
academic and private practice combined
The 2004 MGMA Physician Compensation and
Production Survey reports that for the specialty of otolaryngology,
with 410 otolaryngologists reporting, median
physician compensation is $296,338 and the mean physician
compensation value is $341,482. Those reporting a
specialty of Pediatric Otolaryngology reported a median
value of $209,438 and a mean value of $250,279. For hospital-
owned practices, the MGMA survey reports a median
salary of $287,682 for otolaryngology versus a median salary
of $300,004 for non-hospital-owned practices. This is
comparable to the Academy’s 2004 socioeconomic survey
data, which reflected an average salary of $258,100, an
increase of 5.3 percent over 2002 data.
This MGMA survey also reports salary based on the
number of clinical hours worked. For otolaryngologists
working less than 40 clinical hours per week, the median
salary was $275,346, and otolaryngologists working more
than 40 clinical hours per week reported a median salary
of $304,975.

There is a big difference between in pay of new otolaryngologists (1-3 years out) and 4+. I think a new ENT can expect ~200-250 starting out depending on the location.

 

[resxn]

Now you're talking real numbers. Data is always better than unsubstantiated claims. Thanks for pulling them, I was too lazy.

 

[surgery2121]

Yeah, I'm in the same boat with the shaky hands. Though if it's an essential tremor, you could probably just pop some beta blockers and be okay.

As for the relatively low reimbursement rates, it just goes to show you how much people like the field to make it that competitive despite the non-lucrative pay.

I don't know if I want to be taking beta blockers for the rest of my life. I might just go for ortho, you don't need steady hands to hammer, screw and saw.

 

[Herman Bloom]

I don't know if I want to be taking beta blockers for the rest of my life. I might just go for ortho, you don't need steady hands to hammer, screw and saw.

Not to burst your bubble, but don't forget that ortho has it's share of microsurgery (esp. in hand, some in spine).

Just pop the betas and have fun!

 

[skiz knot]

I might just go for ortho, you don't need steady hands to hammer, screw and saw.

I hope that was tongue in cheek. As mentioned, ortho certainly has it's specialties that operate on exquisitely delicate parts of the body, but if your tremor is really that bad, maybe any surgical specialty isn't a good option for you. You will have a hard time making it just doing the "hammer and saw cases." Try to fix a dusted intraarticular distal radius fracture if your tremor makes it difficult to do get/keep the reduction, saw through the popliteal artery once or twice cause you can't handle the saw, or lose a screw in the soft tissues on a fat person cause it shook off.