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Why is there a negative view towards Argosy University?

Discussion in 'Psychology [Psy.D. / Ph.D.]' started by ExpressYourself, Jun 22, 2007.

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  1. Therapist4Chnge

    Therapist4Chnge Neuropsych Ninja Faculty Moderator Emeritus 10+ Year Member

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    It is absolutely required for the VA (one of the largest trainers of psychologists), and I'd think a challenge to compete against others who completed APA-accredited internships.
     
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  3. aagman01

    aagman01 2+ Year Member

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    These days? The programs I linked above all just went into effect within the past several months.

    If one is making $50,000 after taxes, the figure comes out to $5,000. Divided by 12, thats roughly $420 per month. While you are right in that 10% is not "nothing", it is actually a manageable debt level. I am certainly not advocating that people go into debt - all I am saying is that it is possible for people to go through a professional school garnering substantial debt and still serve the community (either though a government job such as the VA or NIMH, a non-profit community health/mental health, hospital, university, etc).

     
  4. psychmama

    psychmama 5+ Year Member

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    And I'd add that the top 50% at the professional schools are not the ones who are likely to worry about dropping out, not getting good internships, and such. Moral of the story -- do your homework before applying. Be honest about your strengths, limitations, and professional goals. Above all, know thyself and have a plan:).
     
  5. Therapist4Chnge

    Therapist4Chnge Neuropsych Ninja Faculty Moderator Emeritus 10+ Year Member

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    If the bottom 50% could be cut, I think that would improve the overall quality of clinicians coming out, but unfortunately that won't be happening.
     
  6. Markp

    Markp Clinical Psychologist 7+ Year Member

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    Your conservative roots are showing again, go back and dye yourself liberal again. ;)

    You hit the nail on the head, it affects us all in a number of ways.

    1. There are people who are so desparate to get into the field that they will do everything in their power to gain admission to it, including debt ratios that would be unsustainable save government intervention. More than likely these people are not you, but I am sure that you may have seen someone who fits this discription, at some time, in some program.

    (Disclosure - I considered going down this road after my first year interviews until someone slapped some sense into me. I wanted to be in a program badly.)

    2. These same people who were desparate enough to endure these unreasonable debt loads and exploitive programs are now competing for jobs... How do they do it? By accepting lower salaries and placing downward pressure on the job market through saturation. Our world is one that operates on supply and demand for services, when we have an excess supply of psychologists, we all suffer.

    3. Finally my earnings further subsidize this mess through the taxes I pay each year. I am not judging those who take advantage of the LRP program, hell, if I were faced with a crippling debt and a low paying job (compared to time and dollars invested in education with other fields) I would take advantage of every opportunity to reduce that drag. I do however disagree with those who put the system in place.

    Mark
     
    Last edited: Nov 2, 2009
  7. aagman01

    aagman01 2+ Year Member

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    Again, I will have to disagree. There are many people who go to professional schools for a variety of reasons other than because they could not get into a phd program (i.e. geographical necessity, preference for an applied career and geographic need to stay in one location, etc.). Secondly, discussing those who have lower GREs/GPAs who are enrolled in professional schools - I would just say that one of the great things about life should be the opportunity to reinvent or better oneself.

    With that said, while I am personally opposed to for-profit professional schools (as I am opposed to for-profit institutions health care, which put profits ahead of quality of care or health) - I am surpised that some of the more, uh, conservative individuals on this site do not support professional schools. Its supply and demand, right? If people are willing to pay $150,000 to pay for tuition, that is what the market allows.....right? Why not let them pay what the market will bear, right (forgetting about the new, large federal loan forgiveness program that just went into effect this past summer, as that occurred well after professional schools have established themselves)? Just like health care to the conservatives - let those who can afford to get quality care, and screw everyone else to preserve the "market" (even though that is, admittedly, an unfair comparison, as national health care will likely result in net savings over the long term for taxpayers).



     
  8. cara susanna

    cara susanna 7+ Year Member

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    I won't address your disparagement towards conservatives' views of universal healthcare because we've been down that road before.

    I am not against the existence of professional schools. I am against people deciding to attend them. If there were no market for them, they would not exist, like you said. So if people just wouldn't go to them, it would be okay. Or if the APA wouldn't accredit them.
     
  9. futureapppsy2

    futureapppsy2 Assistant professor Gold Donor SDN Moderator 7+ Year Member

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    I really think this would be the best approach, though unlikely.
     
  10. aagman01

    aagman01 2+ Year Member

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    While I personally like that idea of APA not accrediting for-profit professional schools, isn't that also hypocritical (again, regarding the conservatives on here)?

    I would like the federal government to not accredit health insurance companies that drop individuals for "pre-existing" conditions. Pre-existing conditions that have recently warranted a drop of individuals include:

    --experience by women of a previous sexual assault
    --two-year old child being overweight
    --two-year old child being underweight

    Why is it ok to NOT accredit for-profit professional schools, but unacceptable to remove accredition from health insurance companies that take advantage of the public to maximize profits?



     
  11. cara susanna

    cara susanna 7+ Year Member

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    Because the APA isn't the government, it's an organization with the right to accredit whatever the heck it wants.
     
  12. edieb

    edieb Senior Member 10+ Year Member

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    Would you please stop bringing healthcare reform into every single post you write? It is SO axis II!
     
  13. aagman01

    aagman01 2+ Year Member

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    The APA is in theory is administered by numerous elected board, accountable to the electors (i.e. APA membership).

    How is government in theory administered?

     
  14. cara susanna

    cara susanna 7+ Year Member

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    That's not the point. The point is that if a government does not accredit something it essentially is illegitimizing it. If an insurance company were not accredited, it essentially could not function.

    When the APA does not accredit something it doesn't look good, but that organization can still function and exist.
     
  15. Therapist4Chnge

    Therapist4Chnge Neuropsych Ninja Faculty Moderator Emeritus 10+ Year Member

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    *MOD NOTE: For those interested in the more political side of things, you should take the discussion to the SocioPolitical Forum. It can be a rather entertaining place to post, with a bit more leeway than we have in here for political talk.* -t4c
     
  16. WannaBeDrMe

    WannaBeDrMe 2+ Year Member

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    I'm going to reverse respond. Bottom paragraph first; then top. Before I begin, I'm not speaking from the viewpoint of a conservative. I held a national appointment on a democratic caucus. None of this is directed at you, either, but rather just a response to your post. That being said...

    1. Supply and demand? I'm not going to look up stats, so take it as opinion only, but I believe a HUGE problem is that these people can't AFFORD to pay $150k in tuition and are borrowing it to support their effort. The nation only now sees the horror in predatory lending re: overextending terms to offer individuals housing that they couldn't afford... this is the exact same slippery slope.

    2. The loan forgiveness program being manipulated by people who attended outrageously expensive pay for play schools makes my stomach turn. Where do people think this money will come from anyway? We have 9 more years to see if anyone's loans are actually cancelled out... I'm not holding my breath. Especially with the way the new law has been twisted to fit the needs of predatory "schools" as a marketing tool.

    3. I haven't seen your other posts about healthcare but this one is entirely off point and more rhetoric than fact. Complex human behavior influences decisions about how an individual chooses to care for themselves including whether or not they will make positive and healthy life decisions INCLUDING obtaining preventative care and even seeking out emergent care for acute issues. IT is not as simple as the rich get health care and everyone else is screwed. Health disparities are a complicated field study influenced by issues of socioeconomics, race, cultural traditions, geography, region, sociocultural and religious beliefs, etc. Your over-simplification of it is an offense to me.

    4. Having a reason for a decision does nothing to encourage me to support/like/approve of the aforementioned decision. Stating that geographic reasons prevent someone from pursuing a traditional PhD program essentially takes the arrogant stance that those who do travel for doctoral work have less responsibility/more freedom than those who stay. MANY people pick up and move with families, disabled children, dying parents, financial hardships, severe anxiety about the move, etc, etc. The entitlement complex that exists with some people blows my mind.

    5. GRE/GPA and re-invention? Sure, I'm all for it... but honestly, I think it's crap. I had a really rough GPA, barely 3.0 undergrad, and I had not grand GRE's... above average but not 1600 for sure... but I still secured multiple well-respected opportunities for myself over the years. I did what I had to do to stay in a player on a certain half of the field without going into areas that I considered to be out of bounds (pay for play professional schools). There are ALWAYS ways to better yourself within the realm of the existing systems. I'm all for creating change and inventing alternative solutions but when the end result is to weaken the overall existing structure, then really, how can you argue that your motivation for the change was anything other than pure selfishness? My personal values lead me to hesitate contribution unless I believe, 100%, that I will bolster the existing system or re-structure it in a way that benefits the whole rather than only myself and/or a few people.

    Just my 3 cents...
     
  17. cara susanna

    cara susanna 7+ Year Member

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    Well said, WannabeDrMe. Though we apparently have opposite political views, I agree completely. :D
     
  18. aagman01

    aagman01 2+ Year Member

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    Appreciate your post. I will respond to each under your post:

    1. Supply and demand? I'm not going to look up stats, so take it as opinion only, but I believe a HUGE problem is that these people can't AFFORD to pay $150k in tuition and are borrowing it to support their effort. The nation only now sees the horror in predatory lending re: overextending terms to offer individuals housing that they couldn't afford... this is the exact same slippery slope.

    ---Sure it is. In my opinion, we need universal higher education. Barring that, the new loan forgiveness and debt capping programs provides all people the OPPORTUNITY to pursue advanced degrees. It is not like the debt is simply being forgiven - an individual has to make 10 consecutive years of responsible payments to have his or her debts forgiven.

    Is the new system ideal? No. But I would rather pay out a small portion of my taxes to support higher education than to support corporate bonuses. Being that half of corporations do not even pay income taxes while most Americans do, I do not have a problem with the common guy (or gal, whatever the case may be) getting help in this way to complete schooling.

    2. The loan forgiveness program being manipulated by people who attended outrageously expensive pay for play schools makes my stomach turn. Where do people think this money will come from anyway? We have 9 more years to see if anyone's loans are actually cancelled out... I'm not holding my breath. Especially with the way the new law has been twisted to fit the needs of predatory "schools" as a marketing tool.

    ---In what ways have these "new laws been twisted to fit the needs of predatory schools?" The new law largely is paid for through a change in the loan program. In the past, the federal government subsidized banks and private student loan companies who gave out student loans. Now the government is directly providing loans, saving hundreds of millions annually. This is a simplistic statement, but one that seems to fit - Banks and lenders lose, students win.

    3. I haven't seen your other
    posts about healthcare but this one is entirely off point and more rhetoric than fact. Complex human behavior influences decisions about how an individual chooses to care for themselves including whether or not they will make positive and healthy life decisions INCLUDING obtaining preventative care and even seeking out emergent care for acute issues. IT is not as simple as the rich get health care and everyone else is screwed. Health disparities are a complicated field study influenced by issues of socioeconomics, race, cultural traditions, geography, region, sociocultural and religious beliefs, etc. Your over-simplification of it is an offense to me.

    ---Of course there are a mileau of reasons that people do not have health insurance. Nonetheless, there are 40 million uninsured. And many of them are simply priced out of the marketplace or thrown out by health insurance companies. Healthcare costs are the #1 reason people go bankrupt - fortunately I have never had that happen to me. Most psychologists I suspect have not, as they tend to come from advantaged backgrounds. But it does happen.

    4. Having a reason for a decision does nothing to encourage me to support/like/approve of the aforementioned decision. Stating that geographic reasons prevent someone from pursuing a traditional PhD program essentially takes the arrogant stance that those who do travel for doctoral work have less responsibility/more freedom than those who stay. MANY people pick up and move with families, disabled children, dying parents, financial hardships, severe anxiety about the move, etc, etc. The entitlement complex that exists with some people blows my mind.

    ---I too moved across the country to attend my current graduate program (well half way across the country :)). I did so independently, as I have no financial support besides myself. I know others who have moved in spite of a variety of obstacles. That is great for them. However, I also know people who could not bear to leave loved ones behind, could not leave elderly behind, etc. People have different needs. People who do not move shouldn't be told "screw you" or your "not dedicated" or "not worthy" solely because they will not move across the country. As a budding psychologist, I am surprised more of us aren't concerned about the variety of human factors that can impact decision making and well being.

    5. GRE/GPA and re-invention? Sure, I'm all for it... but honestly, I think it's crap. I had a really rough GPA, barely 3.0 undergrad, and I had not grand GRE's... above average but not 1600 for sure... but I still secured multiple well-respected opportunities for myself over the years. I did what I had to do to stay in a player on a certain half of the field without going into areas that I considered to be out of bounds (pay for play professional schools). There are ALWAYS ways to better yourself within the realm of the existing systems. I'm all for creating change and inventing alternative solutions but when the end result is to weaken the overall existing structure, then really, how can you argue that your motivation for the change was anything other than pure selfishness? My personal values lead me to hesitate contribution unless I believe, 100%, that I will bolster the existing system or re-structure it in a way that benefits the whole rather than only myself and/or a few people.

    ---This last paragraph above is particularly convoluted (no offense).

    Congratulations on moving ahead in spite of barely having a 3.0 undergrad GPA. I am sure many in the professional school students would like to have had your great GRE score and the opportunity to attend a university if they could. Unfortunately, for whatever reason, it didn't work out for them as it did for you. Likewise, congratulations on not having to take out $100,000 + in loans. I have also avoided such debt. I am appreciative of that. Its good that we avoided falling into extensive debt for school.

    So its unethical to take out loans and "pay for play" at professional schools. I personally do not like the idea of for-profit professional schools either - but I do not think I would say someone is "anything other than pure selfishness." for doing so. If they were truly selfish, why would they even enter our field. You can get a two-years associate degree and get a job that pays the same or more than many psychologists with a phd earn (i.e. nursing).

    So your statement really makes no sense to me. Someone is trying to improve themselves and contribute in a positive way to society by going to a professional schools - and that makes them unethical and evil (what you are implying, I believe, as you state such people who attend professional schools are selfish). It sounds to me like rotten grapes - you got in, so screw anyone else who did not.


    Just my 3 cents...[/QUOTE]

    ---Just my 3 cents :smuggrin:
     
  19. Jon Snow

    Jon Snow Senior Member 10+ Year Member

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    Awesome, I'm starting a university right now.

    Please think through this idea. What are the implications? How would it manifest? In the US, we have private universities (that's who these pay for play programs are). You think we should just fund any business that decides to call itself a university and offers a degree?


    Supply and demand curves operate on multiple levels in this scenario. Of course, at present, there is abundance of students (customers for these universities) that want degrees. The businesses involved have a huge supply of money available because of predatory student loan rules (that they exploit). But, just because there is ample supply of students does not mean there is ample supply of jobs, or of quality students, or that this influx of new grads will not harm the field.
     
  20. aagman01

    aagman01 2+ Year Member

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    I have thought through this and other ideas. THe implications of universal education is that people from less advantaged socioeconomic backgrounds will not be priced out of education. It happens. And much of Europe & many other less developed countries in the world have publicly funded higher education.

    No, I do not think any entity that calls itself a university should be supported. In fact, I don't think private education should be publicly supported. If it is, it should not be supported for tuition to any greater extent than public education (and private/religious institutions should not receive any funding).

    I also do NOT believe that any for-profit institution (such as, for one small example, the for-profit professional psychology schools) should receive public funds.

    Lastly, I do think a series of safeguards should be built to ensure that the system is not abused (i.e. a max number of years to complete an education before tuition support is cut off, achievement level expectations, etc.). I also wouldn't have a problem with targeting a universal education towards specific public needs (i.e. majors in critical shortage/need areas) - that already has been done at the state level for certain career paths, such as nursing and education.

    And regarding "supply and demand curves" education is supposed to be about freeing and advancing independent thought (my belief, anyways). Industry needs should play little role in universal higher education.

     
  21. Therapist4Chnge

    Therapist4Chnge Neuropsych Ninja Faculty Moderator Emeritus 10+ Year Member

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    I wish that could be a realistic goal, but higher education in today's world is about access to jobs. 50 years ago a HS diploma was all that was needed, then it was a BA/BS....and now it is working towards advanced training. I think a big part of it (someone would say blame) are educational institutions that try and make artificial markets for their degrees. There are A LOT of fluff degrees out there....and not just in psychology. Education seems particularly prone to "education creep", since teachers get paid more for advanced degrees....regardless of their legitimacy.
     
  22. Kyle3309

    Kyle3309

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    There is a lot of bickering going on between PhD, PsyD, APA, nonAPA, etc. I think we need to unite as a profession regardless of backgrounds, theoretical orientation of programs, who took on more student loans than others, etc. Self emploding within the profession won't do anything to help any of us.
     
  23. erg923

    erg923 Psychologist 10+ Year Member

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    Yes, thats nice and all, but it will never happen. Moreover, I doubt many member of APS want to unite with APA....they specifically made it a point to seperate for a very good reason...that is.....they didnt want to be part of, or associated with, that view. They just have 2 fundammentally difernt views/opinions on the future direction of psychology. I really dont think they should reunite and hold hands. Further, I dont realy want to unite with some peoples views/standard of the profession. Some of them are diametrically opposed to what I belive in and i wouldnt want to be part of psychology if it was defined by them.
     
  24. Kyle3309

    Kyle3309

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    That's the spirit!
     
    Last edited: Nov 12, 2009
  25. psychmama

    psychmama 5+ Year Member

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    I think psychology is a very unique blend of art and science. This can be its greatest asset, but I think it makes these kinds of schisms inevitable. Sigh...:rolleyes: I wish it were otherwise, but I fear erg's view is correct. We'll never be able to all hold hands and sing "Kumbaya.":laugh:
     
  26. Kyle3309

    Kyle3309

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    I never suggested holding hands, singing Kumbaya, or accepting everyone elses views. However, if we can't even agree to disagree and set aside differences so that we can come together as a united front for the betterment of the profession, to advocate for the profession, and to educate the public as to the real value of psychologists... then why should the public, employers, or isurance boards care. But then again, what do I know? Like a special someone informed me through PM, I am just a "stupid unlicensed fella."
     
  27. erg923

    erg923 Psychologist 10+ Year Member

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    :laugh:...was this person a Italian mafia member or something.
     
  28. psychmama

    psychmama 5+ Year Member

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    Actually, I tend to agree with you. It's just that I've been hanging around SDN long enough to see the very real differences within the field of psychology emerge. I'm all for presenting a more united front to the public. As I mentioned in another recent post, why don't we ever see public ad campaigns educating the public about the valuable work psychologists do? All we ever hear about are the pharmaceuticals available to combat everything from depression to athlete's foot!:mad:
     
  29. JockNerd

    JockNerd 5+ Year Member

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    Oh, I'm all for uniting.

    I just think we need to trim the fat first.

    I don't WANT to unite with the prof. school fellow I mentioned in some thread who had never heard of SPSS, and whose theoretical orientation was capturable in a single word.
     
  30. ComeTogether

    ComeTogether

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    Don't rely too heavily on the APA rubber stamp. Remember their recommendation:

    The Commission on Accreditation (CoA) accredits psychology programs; it does not provide qualitative information about programs, nor does it compare or "rank" them. The decision about what program is "best" is up to the individual student.
    The CoA encourages students to look for a program that meets both their professional and personal goals. Ask practical questions such as: Does the program offer the type of training I want? Can I live here? Is it affordable? Is the institution too big/small? Does the program appear to have a faculty and staff with whom I can work? Talk to the faculty, students, and alumni about your questions, concerns, and about your specific interests.
    You can also ask programs about their outcomes, such as the types of jobs their graduates obtain. All APA-accredited doctoral programs are required to provide prospective students with data on their time to completion, costs, internship acceptance, attrition, and licensure (See Implementing Regulation C-20 for details). (see http://www.apa.org/ed/accreditation/about/program-choice.aspx)

    A program might be accredited but how that program is implemented is up to the school itself. For more information see http://www.apa.org/ed/accreditation/about/about-accreditation.aspx
     
  31. Argosy Tampa

    Argosy Tampa Argosy University PsyD.

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    To whom it may concern:

    RE:IN THE CIRCUIT COURT OF THE
    THIRTEENTH JUDICIAL CIRCUIT
    IN HILLSBOROUGH COUNTY, FL

    CASEY HAMEL,
    Plaintiff, CASE NO.: 09 11228
    v. DIVISION K

    EDUCATION MANAGEMENT, LLC a wholly-owned subsidiary of EDUCATION MANAGEMENT HOLDINGS, LLC,
    which is wholly-owned by EDUCATION MANAGEMENT CORPORATION; ARGOSY UNIVERSITY OF FLORIDA, INC.; ARGOSY EDUCATION GROUP, INC.;

    MELANIE STORMS, Psy.D; JAMES HARLOW, Psy.D; JEANNE PETERSON, Psy.D; KATHIE BATES, Ph.D;
    KATHERINE McKay, Ph.D; KRISTEN HUDACEK, Psy.D; CRAIG SWENSON, Ph.D; and MICHAEL FALOTICO, Psy.D.
    Defendants.

    From: The Hamel Family
    Although we remain convinced that our daughter was not treated fairly by Argosy University Tampa, after considerable time, expense, and effort, we have been unable to document or uncover any pattern of abuse of students or other wrongful conduct on the part of the Tampa campus or the University as a whole.
    Although our daughter's experience was not a positive one, it appears that her experience was not typical, and we apologize if we dissuaded any potential students from considering Argosy based on our postings to this site.
     
  32. RileyG

    RileyG School of Hard Knocks 5+ Year Member

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    yeah, it's not surprising the family wasn't able to document any other such evidence regardless of whether or not abuse was happening. if i were a current student there and was still hoping to eventually get a degree i would keep my mouth shut too. understandably, the students have probably invested too much (in time and financially) in their own futures to do what's right for the program as a whole. too bad for the hamel family. regardless of the outcome of this particular lawsuit, i still would never consider going to argosy-tampa (or any other argosy campus) nor would i let anyone i considered a friend attend argosy.
     
  33. Markp

    Markp Clinical Psychologist 7+ Year Member

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    I am unsure who the poster above is (Tampa Argosy), and I don't know if the case has seen resolution, although I would doubt it as it was only filed last year.

    It is still troubling to read other accounts online like this: "Please please do not consider Argosy for your Graduate degree. My daughter invested alot of money to receive her PsyD in psychology only to fail her CCE twice after all her course work was completed. This was after she turned in her written CCE, received great feedback and was given the green light to present it. Now she is 100 thousand dollars in debt and has no degree. This is a bright student who graduated with honors from the University of South Florida. There is something extremely wrong here. I am passing this by word of mouth so no other person has to go through this devastating experience."

    Something about the Tampa campus appears to be not quite right. The letter appears to be aimed at limiting the families legal liabilities and not to clear Argosy of wrong doing.

    Mark
     
  34. RileyG

    RileyG School of Hard Knocks 5+ Year Member

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    this is a much better way of saying what i was thinking. i hope you could "sense" me rolling my eyes the whole time i was writing that though...
     
  35. aequitasveritas

    aequitasveritas PhD 7+ Year Member

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    ...anyone ever hear of a student suing Harvard, Yale, Michigan, Columbia, or other big name over their psych degree?

    Sometimes the occurrence of contention makes a court decision superfluous.
     
  36. PsychGraduate

    PsychGraduate 2+ Year Member

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    Yes actually I have heard of this happening.
     
  37. nononora

    nononora Dis Member Moderator Emeritus 10+ Year Member

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    O.J. Simpson. That is all.
     
  38. student til 30

    student til 30 7+ Year Member

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    .
     
    Last edited: Sep 6, 2012
  39. aequitasveritas

    aequitasveritas PhD 7+ Year Member

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    ...right:rolleyes:. perhaps once in a blue moon...but they didnt hold congressional hearings as a response
     
  40. Student4Life0

    Student4Life0

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    I am ready to pick up the phone next time this joke of a "school" calls me, and scream lots of explicit things at the annoying woman on the other line.

    Before I did my research, I considered Argosy Tampa. After a day spent doing some online research, I crossed them right off of my list. I made the mistake of putting my phone number and name into one of their "I want information about the school" lists on the website. They have been calling me for over a month..consistently. Sometimes they call in the early morning. I finally picked up and firmly said that I was not interested in the school. They harrassed me and kept asking why, so I flat out told them that their internship rates were not what I expected, and that they are not competitive enough..that their entrance rates are very high. The women LAUGHED at me and rudely said "Clinical psychology programs are very competitive." I FINALLY got myself off the line. They did not stop calling. So I blocked the number. Now they just called me from a new number, and I picked up and said "I am NOT interested. TAKE ME OFF OF YOUR CALL LIST."

    I can't believe how persistently they recruite students. I feel bad for any student that has gotten conned into attending.
     
  41. Therapist4Chnge

    Therapist4Chnge Neuropsych Ninja Faculty Moderator Emeritus 10+ Year Member

    21,090
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    The Beach
    Faculty
    I was curious about the captive internship they have in their Hawaii program, so I contacted them using the online chat thing to ask a few questions. They were quite pushy about getting me in contact with someone on the phone. I knew better than to provide a phone number, so I just logged off.
     
  42. Argosy Parent

    Argosy Parent

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    Jul 29, 2009
    To whom it may concern:

    IN THE CIRCUIT COURT OF THE THIRTEENTH JUDICIAL CIRCUIT IN HILLSBOROUGH COUNTY, FL

    CASE NO.: 09 11228
    DIVISION K

    CASEY HAMEL,
    Plaintiff,

    v.

    EDUCATION MANAGEMENT, LLC a wholly-owned subsidiary of EDUCATION MANAGEMENT HOLDINGS, LLC,
    which is wholly-owned by EDUCATION MANAGEMENT CORPORATION; ARGOSY UNIVERSITY OF FLORIDA, INC.; ARGOSY EDUCATION GROUP, INC.;

    MELANIE STORMS, Psy.D; JAMES HARLOW, Psy.D; JEANNE PETERSON, Psy.D; KATHIE BATES, Ph.D;
    KATHERINE McKay, Ph.D; KRISTEN HUDACEK, Psy.D; CRAIG SWENSON, Ph.D; and MICHAEL FALOTICO, Psy.D.
    Defendants.

    From: The Hamel Family
    Although we remain convinced that our daughter was not treated fairly by Argosy University Tampa, after considerable time, expense, and effort, we have been unable to document or uncover any pattern of abuse of students or other wrongful conduct on the part of the Tampa campus orthe University as a whole. Although our daughter's experience was not a positive one, it appears that her experience was not typical, and we apologize if we dissuaded any potential students from considering Argosy based on our postings to this site.

    AND REFERENCE TO POSTING MADE 7/15/2010: Argosy Tampa
     
  43. Argosy Parent

    Argosy Parent

    5
    0
    Jul 29, 2009
    In attempting to respond to this thread Argosy Parent was displayed but the author of the initial thread ExpressYourself was not picked up. This statement is made in response to any and all references to the Hamel v Argosy EDMC lawsuit made in the Student Doctor Network Forum, Psychology Forum, Clnical Psychology (PsyD/PhD), etc:

    To whom it may concern:

    IN THE CIRCUIT COURT OF THE THIRTEENTH JUDICIAL CIRCUIT IN HILLSBOROUGH COUNTY, FL

    CASE NO.: 09 11228
    DIVISION K

    CASEY HAMEL,
    Plaintiff,

    v.

    EDUCATION MANAGEMENT, LLC a wholly-owned subsidiary of EDUCATION MANAGEMENT HOLDINGS, LLC,
    which is wholly-owned by EDUCATION MANAGEMENT CORPORATION; ARGOSY UNIVERSITY OF FLORIDA, INC.; ARGOSY EDUCATION GROUP, INC.;

    MELANIE STORMS, Psy.D; JAMES HARLOW, Psy.D; JEANNE PETERSON, Psy.D; KATHIE BATES, Ph.D;
    KATHERINE McKay, Ph.D; KRISTEN HUDACEK, Psy.D; CRAIG SWENSON, Ph.D; and MICHAEL FALOTICO, Psy.D.
    Defendants.

    From: The Hamel Family
    Although we remain convinced that our daughter was not treated fairly by Argosy University Tampa, after considerable time, expense, and effort, we have been unable to document or uncover any pattern of abuse of students or other wrongful conduct on the part of the Tampa campus or the University as a whole. Although our daughter's experience was not a positive one, it appears that her experience was not typical, and we apologize if we dissuaded any potential students from considering Argosy based on our postings to this site.
     
  44. Student4Life0

    Student4Life0

    531
    0
    Jul 7, 2010
    Poor Argosy Parent. Don't worry...I still believe that this school is a joke.
     
  45. Jon Snow

    Jon Snow Senior Member 10+ Year Member

    3,009
    281
    Aug 5, 2005
    Yep, and it's far more widespread than just Argosy Tampa. There's been a few exposes on this recently (private colleges). The student loan system is the next real estate bubble. Sorry for your difficulties Argosy Parent.


    Any school that recruits so actively (callers!!!) is likely not a good school.
     
  46. cara susanna

    cara susanna 7+ Year Member

    5,196
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    Feb 10, 2008
    East Coast
    Edit: Nevermind.
     
    Last edited: Oct 13, 2010
  47. Jackson Sensei

    Jackson Sensei

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    0
    Jan 15, 2011
    I don't get all this talk of the APA refusing to accredit professional schools. The APA is a scientific body. It operates according to scientific consensus and the bi-laws that were passed and are maintained by its members. It has clear, publicly stated (and very high) standards for accreditation. Schools qualify for accreditation on merit (or not).

    Get the latest edition of the APA's Graduate Study in Psychology and take a look. The majority of doctoral programs are unaccredited. That includes hundreds of public universities.

    Your alma mater's "street cred" may impress some people, but your skills as a clinician are all that matter to your clients.
     
  48. Student4Life0

    Student4Life0

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    Jul 7, 2010
    The majority? That just cannot be true. Where can I find this list?
     
  49. Jon Snow

    Jon Snow Senior Member 10+ Year Member

    3,009
    281
    Aug 5, 2005
    How does a "client" assess that?
     
  50. Therapist4Chnge

    Therapist4Chnge Neuropsych Ninja Faculty Moderator Emeritus 10+ Year Member

    21,090
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    Oct 6, 2006
    The Beach
    Faculty
    How many of those programs are within the field of psychology, are applied, AND meant for licensure? Within those programs, APA-acred. is the standard. APA-acred. does not apply to the remaining programs, thus they shouldn't be used for comparison.
     
  51. Phipps

    Phipps Post-Doctoral Fellow 5+ Year Member

    467
    117
    Jan 11, 2011
    Yup. I had a similar experience with Walden U., Ph.D. in Clinical. Put my phone number down and that consistently called for quite some time. I never picked up though
     

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