Why psychology?

[Drrrrrr. Celty]

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I've been questioning myself for a while now. I'm a psychology major and personally i love the field dearly. However it to me seems like a field that is cheap, average psychologists in academia make 60k a year and clinicians make maybe 80k a year. While there are many benefits to psychology versus say medicine, I.E the lack of having 300k debt and they both have a great chance of making a lucrative business off the baby boomer demise.

But at the moment I'm left thinking, maybe psychology could be a better field for me then medicine.
So has anyone thought about the question why psychology versus other fields such as medicine. I mean clinical psychology requires a 3.6 gpa+, that easily means that you could get into a position in medicine or dental.
So im just curious what your opinions on this all would be.

As i see it right now.
If i go psychology, i got these pro's : I can double major in history and psychology both strongly interest me, I could opt to graduate in 3 years and try out for PhD programs, I would probably have a decent time talking to people and commit to there therapy.
Cons : Low compensation, I've had some talks with others before and i feel that people are so hard headed you feel like taking a shovel to there heads.
Medicine pros : Higher compensation, a much more lucrative field and wider scope of practice.
Cons : tends to have bad hours and you could be on call. No research ability and academia ability.

So.. post 😀

 

[Wildcat06]

I would say REALLY go back over your pros and cons. No one is in psychology for the money, because, as you said, we are highly qualified people and could all be doing something else much more lucrative if we wanted to. Also, MD's can do research. What year are you in school? I think you need and will have a lot more time to figure out what you want to do.

Why am I a psychologist? Because I don't know how NOT to be one. It's my passion and is in my blood. And believe me I tried very hard to avoid it both in college and after.

 

[Drrrrrr. Celty]

I would say REALLY go back over your pros and cons. No one is in psychology for the money, because, as you said, we are highly qualified people and could all be doing something else much more lucrative if we wanted to. Also, MD's can do research. What year are you in school? I think you need and will have a lot more time to figure out what you want to do.

Why am I a psychologist? Because I don't know how NOT to be one. It's my passion and is in my blood. And believe me I tried very hard to avoid it both in college and after.

I am a second semester fresshy 🙂.
Yah i know thats why im asking question haha. I personally just enjoy social sciences a lot and its such a field that provides me with a lot of interests. However i think the aspect of forever experimenting and learning psychological principles which you can forever continue to apply to your life. That is what i like about psychology. I will agree you wont get rich in psychology, but you sure wont go hungry in it haha. I mean 80k as a clinical psychologist isnt too bad its enough to support yourself and make a decent living and if in a field that you like its a satisfied life.

Im more or less right now bounding back and forth on the benifits of each field. I will intern at hospitals and go work in psychological experiments and get the benefit of both world.

 

[Wildcat06]

I am a second semester fresshy 🙂.
Yah i know thats why im asking question haha. I personally just enjoy social sciences a lot and its such a field that provides me with a lot of interests. However i think the aspect of forever experimenting and learning psychological principles which you can forever continue to apply to your life. That is what i like about psychology. I will agree you wont get rich in psychology, but you sure wont go hungry in it haha. I mean 80k as a clinical psychologist isnt too bad its enough to support yourself and make a decent living and if in a field that you like its a satisfied life.

Im more or less right now bounding back and forth on the benifits of each field. I will intern at hospitals and go work in psychological experiments and get the benefit of both world.

Great you're considering these things so early on 🙂. I would be inclined to say that if you are even considering medicine, do premed know. Premed with a psych major if that's possible at your school. It's difficult if not impossible to go back and get the classes required for med school after college (and quite expensive).

 

[Drrrrrr. Celty]

Great you're considering these things so early on 🙂. I would be inclined to say that if you are even considering medicine, do premed know. Premed with a psych major if that's possible at your school. It's difficult if not impossible to go back and get the classes required for med school after college (and quite expensive).

Its actually quite easy, at my school a Psych major is 36 credits, pre-med is basically 21 credits and general education is about.. 50 credits. Basically its not really difficult for me to do both, and at my school we have a interesting concentration for psychology called psycho-biology. So I'm pretty well in the pre-reqs for medicine and with a psychology major hahaha. Its one of my ways of getting a good looky at both worlds.

But yah i wouldnt need to do a post-bacc

 

[phillydave]

Why am I a psychologist? Because I don't know how NOT to be one. It's my passion and is in my blood. And believe me I tried very hard to avoid it both in college and after.

4 of the best lines I've ever read on this forum. I couldn't have said it any better.

 

[Drrrrrr. Celty]

4 of the best lines I've ever read on this forum. I couldn't have said it any better.

My social psych teacher says everyone is a psychologist in a way that we all possess theories about human behaviors. I think that one of the reasons why I'm compelled towards psychology is because i enjoy coming up with theories and the whole school of philosophy behind theory making is a passion of mine. I guess that actually proving(assuming) your theory with research might also be fun i guess .

 

[MegglesPhD]

Why am I a psychologist? Because I don't know how NOT to be one. It's my passion and is in my blood. And believe me I tried very hard to avoid it both in college and after.

definately have to agree with this. choose what you think will make you happy. I mean yeah, money is great and you would like to be compensated for your hard work but in the end figure out whether psychology or medicine is something you can't live without. From there you will quickly find out what you are meant to do and what you will be happier doing.

 

[Drrrrrr. Celty]

definately have to agree with this. choose what you think will make you happy. I mean yeah, money is great and you would like to be compensated for your hard work but in the end figure out whether psychology or medicine is something you can't live without. From there you will quickly find out what you are meant to do and what you will be happier doing.

More research and soul searching must be done before i can answer that . Personally i think for me i'd end up taking a shovel and beating in someones skull if i was a psychologist because I know way to many hard headed people that simply wont listen to the voice of reason. I simply find the inability to actually do anything in that situation to provide the biggest limit to psychology.

But yah i'll need to do a lot more interning and research to figure that out.

 

[Buzzwordsoldier]

Why psychology... Hmmmm... Because the only logical alternative is beating someone's head in with a shovel? Or because it's the only way to change my ways before winding up in the first wave of those whose heads get beaten with a shovel?

 

[Drrrrrr. Celty]

Not very persuasive are ya?

 

[DrMaxPsyD]

4 of the best lines I've ever read on this forum. I couldn't have said it any better.

I want to make a difference and go home everyday knowing that I am working towards change in my client's lives and also a broken system.

 

[deleted176373]

Personally i think for me i'd end up taking a shovel and beating in someones skull if i was a psychologist because I know way to many hard headed people that simply wont listen to the voice of reason. I simply find the inability to actually do anything in that situation to provide the biggest limit to psychology.

Being a clinical psychologist isn't about giving advice or imposing your will on others. I think you might do well as a surgeon.

Often times, therapy is about helping others develop insight, this is done through a variety of means, none of which require you to give your opinion or to impose your values on others. The changes, emotional and intellectual, are from the insight gained and not from "advice." I might add, clinical psychology is far more than just therapy.

Mark

 

[lamorena]

Personally i think for me i'd end up taking a shovel and beating in someones skull if i was a psychologist because I know way to many hard headed people that simply wont listen to the voice of reason.

eek..😱 i think you should consider another field. it doesn't sound like psychology is for you. i mean that in the nicest possible way.

 

[psychmama]

4 of the best lines I've ever read on this forum. I couldn't have said it any better.

+1👍

 

[Drrrrrr. Celty]

eek..😱 i think you should consider another field. it doesn't sound like psychology is for you. i mean that in the nicest possible way.

Lol it was kinda a epiphany I had. I was arguing the importance of getting blood tests and std tests with someone.( part of a project). The guy didnt believe that those things are important or should be done. I basically was profanely compelled to take a shovel to his head.

Usually im much more articulated and able to talk with someone.

 

[Drrrrrr. Celty]

Being a clinical psychologist isn't about giving advice or imposing your will on others. I think you might do well as a surgeon.

Often times, therapy is about helping others develop insight, this is done through a variety of means, none of which require you to give your opinion or to impose your values on others. The changes, emotional and intellectual, are from the insight gained and not from "advice." I might add, clinical psychology is far more than just therapy.

Mark

Hmm.. interesting.. thanks for your comment =)
I didnt have a good insight into clinical psychology.. seems that it really is just examining people and treating diseases... sounds boring.. Oh well i was aiming for social psych annyway..

 

[Buzzwordsoldier]

Wait! Don't go! There really is a place in clinical psychology for those skullsplitting fantasies of yours! It's called countertransference analysis. Check out work done by Harold Searles. There's also a rich tradition of psychoanalytic activism to learn about. Keep the dream alive! You may be a brilliant psychoanalyst in the making.

 

[deleted176373]

Hmm.. interesting.. thanks for your comment =)
I didnt have a good insight into clinical psychology.. seems that it really is just examining people and treating diseases... sounds boring.. Oh well i was aiming for social psych annyway..

Well social psych can be about imposing your will on others, and you'd find that the principles of social psych can be extraordinarily powerful... that might be a great fit. Seriously.

Clinical psych, ummm, not boring. I think military clinical psychology is a great field. Much of what I hope to do is work with a healthy population who find themselves in abnormal circumstances. Far from "examining people" and "treating disease", certainly there is that aspect as well, but there are many niches in psychology that do not deal with pathology.

Mark

 

[Drrrrrr. Celty]

hmm nice comments..
keep them coming lol.

i was curious about how grad school is like. I mean you spend 2 years learning and doing research on things like everyone else. Then 3 years doing dissertation research?

 

[Drrrrrr. Celty]

Wait! Don't go! There really is a place in clinical psychology for those skullsplitting fantasies of yours! It's called countertransference analysis. Check out work done by Harold Searles. There's also a rich tradition of psychoanalytic activism to learn about. Keep the dream alive! You may be a brilliant psychoanalyst in the making.

hmm interesting..

 

[IT514]

i was curious about how grad school is like. I mean you spend 2 years learning and doing research on things like everyone else. Then 3 years doing dissertation research?

In clinical psych, the course of study varies on where you go to school, who you work under, and what you want to focus on. This is the largest difference, structurally speaking, from medical school in my opinion. You'll find a lot of similarities in foundations courses, but that might be about it. For me, a 2nd year Psy.D student, heres what it looks like on a year by year basis:

1st year, 13 credits each semester (9 in summer) while working as a psychometrician.

2nd year (now), roughly 10 credits each semester, a little less in the summer. Doing a neuropsychological assessment practicum at a VA hospital...seeing mostly outpatient dementia and TBI, and inpatient referrals mostly from neurology. Doing research on dyslexia.

3rd year: 10 credits each semester (i think). Therapy practicum at a childrens hospital or rehab clinic (behavioral med/health psych working with chronically ill/physically disabled). More research...cognitive effects of epilepsy, agenisis of the corpus collosum are some topics I'm kicking around right now.

4th year: fewer credits, working mostly on dissertation. Advanced practicum in pediatric neuropsychology (mostly peds since my first neuro site was at a VA).

5th year: Internship...national match...crazy system...a whole other topic.

6th and 7th year: Post doc in neuropsychology

As you can probably tell, my focus is in neuropsych, so my coursework is loaded more heavily in neuroanatomy/neuropathology and assessment. Ask 10 others on this forum and you might get 10 different responses depending on the type of program they attend and what they focus on. Generally, after first year, you're looking at coursework, clinical practicum, and research at the same time. Its a lot of fun if you have good supervisors and mentors. Hopefully this answers your question to some degree.

 

[Cigolon]

4 of the best lines I've ever read on this forum. I couldn't have said it any better.

+1.

if it's a question, if any job is, find something that isn't.

 

[HVD2011]

I doubled majored with psychology and pre-med. I was accepted into med school, however, decided on the psychology route as this was my passion. 7 years later and almost at the end of my PsyD program I regret not seriously considering the financial ramifications. Back then at 26 years old 60K seemed a lot to me as I was only making $8/hour at the time. I now earn around 60K and I am truely annoyed after the blood, sweat and tears that went into earning my doctorate that the financial return seems minimal compared to my expertise level. Physician Assistants with less training make more money. So think about it very carefully because money does make a difference especially as you mature and have a family.

 

[hamsterpants]

4 of the best lines I've ever read on this forum. I couldn't have said it any better.

me too. I totally get this. and it is partly why I am applying in my 30s, I tried to make other paths work and I just kept coming back to this.

 

[somaticpsych]

Being a clinical psychologist isn't about giving advice or imposing your will on others. I think you might do well as a surgeon.

You b*stard, you just made me blow pepsi out my nose. That is the funniest thing I've ever read on SDN.

 

[hamsterpants]

4 of the best lines I've ever read on this forum. I couldn't have said it any better.

You b*stard, you just made me blow pepsi out my nose. That is the funniest thing I've ever read on SDN.

My little brother is a surgeon and he is so not like this. But there are a lot who are and he's been told he is too nice by older surgeons.

 

[psich]

I doubled majored with psychology and pre-med. I was accepted into med school, however, decided on the psychology route as this was my passion. 7 years later and almost at the end of my PsyD program I regret not seriously considering the financial ramifications. Back then at 26 years old 60K seemed a lot to me as I was only making $8/hour at the time. I now earn around 60K and I am truely annoyed after the blood, sweat and tears that went into earning my doctorate that the financial return seems minimal compared to my expertise level. Physician Assistants with less training make more money. So think about it very carefully because money does make a difference especially as you mature and have a family.

Funded or unfunded PsyD?

 

[deleted176373]

Funded or unfunded PsyD?

Doesn't matter. $60k is not a lot of money when you have a s/o, house, car, kids, dogs, etc. Is it enough to survive, sure. I wouldn't want to live on that little again though.

Mark

 

[lamorena]

I doubled majored with psychology and pre-med. I was accepted into med school, however, decided on the psychology route as this was my passion. 7 years later and almost at the end of my PsyD program I regret not seriously considering the financial ramifications. Back then at 26 years old 60K seemed a lot to me as I was only making $8/hour at the time. I now earn around 60K and I am truely annoyed after the blood, sweat and tears that went into earning my doctorate that the financial return seems minimal compared to my expertise level. Physician Assistants with less training make more money. So think about it very carefully because money does make a difference especially as you mature and have a family.

you earn $60K and you havent finished your doctoral program yet? are you ABD?

isn't that just the starting rate though? APA's 2009 salary survey reports salary for licensed clinical psychologists for most positions (sans community mental health--and after some experience of course) is in the 75K-95K range. that honestly doesn't sound too bad to me! its not medical doctor salary, but its good nonetheless! not to mention, as compensation for doing something you (I) love, even better 🙂

 

[edieb]

Unless you live in a very expensive area, you can live VERY well on $60K as a single person

 

[psychmama]

Unless you live in a very expensive area, you can live VERY well on $60K as a single person

I think the point is that each of us differs on how much is enough to comfortably live on. For me, the bottom line is that psychologists usually don't make as much as many comparably educated professionals, so you'd better love the work enough to make it seem worthwhile.

Otherwise there's med school, business school or {Gasp!} law school. Not for me, thanks.

 

[psich]

Interestingly, for me it was always between psychology or law. Guess what I'm doing now? lol

 

[Drrrrrr. Celty]

I doubled majored with psychology and pre-med. I was accepted into med school, however, decided on the psychology route as this was my passion. 7 years later and almost at the end of my PsyD program I regret not seriously considering the financial ramifications. Back then at 26 years old 60K seemed a lot to me as I was only making $8/hour at the time. I now earn around 60K and I am truely annoyed after the blood, sweat and tears that went into earning my doctorate that the financial return seems minimal compared to my expertise level. Physician Assistants with less training make more money. So think about it very carefully because money does make a difference especially as you mature and have a family.

I'll have to admit the fact that a trained psychologist will make significantly less then other well trained individuals is a turn off..
Neh i get the feeling that i could always go to medical school today and maybe when i get bored of being a doctor get a phd in psychology

 

[psich]

lol Becoming a doctor is not a short (or easy) route. Neither is getting a Phd in Clinical Psychology. But hey, there's nothing wrong with doing both! It seems to me the question is: which is more important to you, your personal interests or financial security?

 

[somedude14]

I'll have to admit the fact that a trained psychologist will make significantly less then other well trained individuals is a turn off..
Neh i get the feeling that i could always go to medical school today and maybe when i get bored of being a doctor get a phd in psychology

that's a good plan. getting a phd in psychology isn't that complicated as doesn't take very long esp. after you spent 8 years in med school

 

[lamorena]

I think the point is that each of us differs on how much is enough to comfortably live on. For me, the bottom line is that psychologists usually don't make as much as many comparably educated professionals, so you'd better love the work enough to make it seem worthwhile.

Otherwise there's med school, business school or {Gasp!} law school. Not for me, thanks.

ugh. i can't imagine anything more boring than business and law school and their subsequent careers. not to mention the fact that you basically need to sell your soul in order to function in those professions. and medicine is too much of a time commitment.. when do you have time for life and family when you are an MD? they are definitely not for me either!

 

[positivepsych]

Listen to your elders.

Jon Snow is an academic/neuropsychologist.
HVD2011 is almost done with their PsyD.
I'm almost done with my PhD.

We all say: go to med school if you can. It takes just as long to go through grad school (including internship and post-doc, which is becoming almost requisite) as it does med school + residency. Despite the lack of debt, you will be given 1/3 of the salary, 1/3 of the respect/privileges, and 1/3 of the job opportunities/mobility.

 

[manko7]

that's a good plan. getting a phd in psychology isn't that complicated as doesn't take very long esp. after you spent 8 years in med school

A PhD will take as long as your doctoral committee demands. Since it's a mentored approach in the PhD you the timeframe will vary. But keep in mind, the quicker you get out, the more you will realize that you are competing with others who took more time to craft a distinguished vita.

 

[manko7]

Neh i get the feeling that i could always go to medical school today and maybe when i get bored of being a doctor get a phd in psychology

With the debt you will accrue in medical school? No, psychology will likely not be an option after your medical school investment.

 

[manko7]

Listen to your elders.

Jon Snow is an academic/neuropsychologist.
HVD2011 is almost done with their PsyD.
I'm almost done with my PhD.

We all say: go to med school if you can. It takes just as long to go through grad school (including internship and post-doc, which is becoming almost requisite) as it does med school + residency. Despite the lack of debt, you will be given 1/3 of the salary, 1/3 of the respect/privileges, and 1/3 of the job opportunities/mobility.

My friend, you have no idea how much your advice resonates. I'm 29 and will be done with my PhD in clinical psychology next Spring, 2011. I'm actually thinking of going back to school for medicine immediately and scrapping post-doc plans. I love the current crop of students in psychology. They are motivated and keen to advance the field. But the leadership (i.e. the mentors over the last 20 years) left such a poor legacy for the profession that I admit, of late nights I sometimes think of the field with such contempt. The lack of respect for the PhD is almost too much to bear after all these years of toil.

 

[Drrrrrr. Celty]

With the debt you will accrue in medical school? No, psychology will likely not be an option after your medical school investment.

I meant when im retired or something around the lines of age 50..

 

[Drrrrrr. Celty]

Listen to your elders.

Jon Snow is an academic/neuropsychologist.
HVD2011 is almost done with their PsyD.
I'm almost done with my PhD.

We all say: go to med school if you can. It takes just as long to go through grad school (including internship and post-doc, which is becoming almost requisite) as it does med school + residency. Despite the lack of debt, you will be given 1/3 of the salary, 1/3 of the respect/privileges, and 1/3 of the job opportunities/mobility.

Hmm.. well at least im getting some honest responses..

 

[KillerDiller]

Unless you live in a very expensive area, you can live VERY well on $60K as a single person

Sure, but many of us are not single. Furthermore, I would venture to say that very few want to remain single and childless forever. The answer to surviving with a family on a doctoral level salary should not be "marry rich".

 

[Annakei]

ugh. i can't imagine anything more boring than business and law school and their subsequent careers. not to mention the fact that you basically need to sell your soul in order to function in those professions. and medicine is too much of a time commitment.. when do you have time for life and family when you are an MD? they are definitely not for me either!

*raises glass*

I agree with this. Admittedly I have considered medical school but I very much value work/life balance and it isn't something I would want to commit to for the sake of *respect* or prestige of having an MD. I know too many lawyers who absolutely hate their jobs, burned out and ready to give up on themselves. It is an absolute myth that if you go to law school that you come out making 160k-automatically. Perhaps for some, but not many these days. My neighbor's daughter is in medical school and the process is just not a lifestyle I really want for myself. With psych I have many more opportunities to balance my family and professional life without giving up my soul for more money.

I have my own career path/plan which doesnt include working for the VA so Im not too concerned about the money, especially since I am licensed and able to practice now without many limitations except for assessment privileges.

 

[Annakei]

Unless you live in a very expensive area, you can live VERY well on $60K as a single person

Yea, not around these parts Furthermore, many of us at this stage in life aren't single or at least dont plan to be single living on $60k.

 

[IT514]

Listen to your elders.

Jon Snow is an academic/neuropsychologist.
HVD2011 is almost done with their PsyD.
I'm almost done with my PhD.

We all say: go to med school if you can. It takes just as long to go through grad school (including internship and post-doc, which is becoming almost requisite) as it does med school + residency. Despite the lack of debt, you will be given 1/3 of the salary, 1/3 of the respect/privileges, and 1/3 of the job opportunities/mobility.

Three psychologists say go to med school. Who cares. I can find you three physicians who would say go psych. The point is: use your undergrad experience to help you discern which path is right for you (if either), and know that you have a few years to make a good choice based on good reasons for doing what you decide to do. You have to decide for yourself what those reasons are. If you do that, no matter what you decide, you'll likely be able to weather the pros and cons of your chosen field and have a sense of joy in what you do at the end of the day.

 

[summerssun]

Yea, not around these parts Furthermore, many of us at this stage in life aren't single or at least dont plan to be single living on $60k.

A third of the country is below the poverty line. I'm quite sure anyone with basic knowledge of budgets can live just fine on $60k, unless you're planning on septuplets...

 

[Psychology 76]

Three psychologists say go to med school. Who cares. I can find you three physicians who would say go psych. The point is: use your undergrad experience to help you discern which path is right for you (if either), and know that you have a few years to make a good choice based on good reasons for doing what you decide to do. You have to decide for yourself what those reasons are. If you do that, no matter what you decide, you'll likely be able to weather the pros and cons of your chosen field and have a sense of joy in what you do at the end of the day.

+1 👍

 

[Drrrrrr. Celty]

Three psychologists say go to med school. Who cares. I can find you three physicians who would say go psych. The point is: use your undergrad experience to help you discern which path is right for you (if either), and know that you have a few years to make a good choice based on good reasons for doing what you decide to do. You have to decide for yourself what those reasons are. If you do that, no matter what you decide, you'll likely be able to weather the pros and cons of your chosen field and have a sense of joy in what you do at the end of the day.

Very good point. You see im looking for a career field which is interesting, i mean psychology in terms of training gets paid way to little. But Medicine provides to many cons as well, however is relatively better paid.. for the time being. But yah... Psychology sounds more chill and pleasant a career choice. But then again i get the feeling im the type of person that just loves studying something and understanding it well.

But yah.. i can always purse a phd in psychology when im old .