Why the emphasis on volunteering?

[jhmmd]

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^^which, again, is why volunteering is a good idea

 

[Radishguy]

My hot take: there should me a more emphasis on volunteering for lower income applicants. Being low SES doesn’t make a person automatically more altruistic, in fact I would argue the opposite. They are more likely to feel wronged by society, and have a “screw you, I got mine” mentality and be more financially motivated than people who were born into money.

Higher scores too. All those low SES kids probably had teachers who felt bad for them and gave them good grades just because. By having a higher score requirement, it levels the playing field for all the traditional MD students who got through their undergrads and applications the old fashioned way—high-priced tutors, private schools, cushy shadowing with daddy’s fraternity brother, a nice LOR from mom’s sorority sister that’s an AdComm for a T5 school, and you know, just some tried and true nepotism. I think you’re on the right track.

 

[Princeton Medical Student]

Those are a lot of “shoulds”. Not all colleges do. The colleges filled with rich kids do have prehealth societies, excellent prehealth advising, and well connected volunteer offices. If you can’t afford one of those schools, you’re SOL. More structural barriers for the have My hot take: there should me a more emphasis on volunteering for lower income applicants. Being low SES doesn’t make a person automatically more altruistic, in fact I would argue the opposite. They are more likely to feel wronged by society, and have a “screw you, I got mine” mentality and be more financially motivated than people who were born into money.

It’s less about altruism and more about opportunity to genuinely do so. Boils down to if you find a 515 from someone whose parents bought them all the resources, paid for 200/hr tutoring, supported them financially through the process more impressive then a 510 from someone who had zero support, was a first generation student, and had to study during breaks at work.

Personally I find the latter more impressive.

 

[Princeton Medical Student]

They are more likely to feel wronged by society, and have a “screw you, I got mine” mentality and be more financially motivated than people who were born into money.

I am not sure if this one is funnier or not. I seriously hope both of you get some perspective before you begin treating patients. Not far from what Id expect on SDN.

 

[Princeton Medical Student]

If you feel called out just say so instead of going with the overused passive aggressive “you won’t be a good doctor” response. I’m sure everything you are advocating for is completely for the greater good and 0 self-interest.

If you think that poor people and physicians are more likely to be selfish and self serving I highly suggest expanding your personal social circles. If anything your post supports my argument of out of touch children of rich ass docs becoming similarly out of touch physicians.

 

[Radishguy]

I am not sure if this one is funnier or not. I seriously hope both of you get some perspective before you begin treating patients. Not far from what Id expect on SDN.

Mine was sarcasm? Thought that was kind of obvious by, well, the entire content. Do people really think that?

 

[Princeton Medical Student]

Mine was sarcasm? Thought that was kind of obvious by, well, the entire content. Do people really think that?

Sarcasm is hard to detect over the internet. Im sorry 🙁

 

[doomer_md]

If you think that poor people and physicians are more likely to be selfish and self serving I highly suggest expanding your personal social circles. If anything your post supports my argument of out of touch children of rich ass docs becoming similarly out of touch physicians.

Clearly evidenced by the fact that robberies and theft are more common in affluent areas. Also, I’m not rich.

 

[Goro]

It’s less about altruism and more about opportunity to genuinely do so. Boils down to if you find a 515 from someone whose parents bought them all the resources, paid for 200/hr tutoring, supported them financially through the process more impressive then a 510 from someone who had zero support, was a first generation student, and had to study during breaks at work.

Personally I find the latter more impressive.

The road travelled is an EC in and of itself. That's why someone with a compelling story can get admitted despite lower stats, much tot he wialing and gnashing of teeth from the hyperacheivers.

 

[Radishguy]

Clearly evidenced by the fact that robberies and theft are more common in affluent areas. Also, I’m not rich.

I like the robberies and theft reply. So, here’s a true story from when I was a cop in one of the US’s top 10 most dangerous cities—lots of robberies and thefts. I was called to a shooting. Guy’s head got basically disintegrated by a shotgun at close range. Normally these sorts of crimes go straight to the unsolvable bin without passing go and without collecting $200 because no one is going to look our way, let alone talk to us. However, this happened to happen in the middle of the road on a day after it had snowed pretty substantially. The road was plowed, but two blocks away from the scene I found some fresh footprints and after a couple hundred feet, the footprints had a small amount of blood in them—jackpot! The best part about them were they had a distinctive concentric circle pattern that meant whoever shot the headless victim was wearing Air Force Ones.

So, I followed the prints until I got to a house where they clearly walked into. The house was a double—upper/lower—and only the lower had any sign of people living in it. So I knocked on the door and a late-twenties woman lived there with her son. At first, I was like drats, foiled again by some pesky kids, given her age, her son is probably in diapers. I was about to leave, but then she said, you want to talk to him? At first, I thought, what type of intelligence can I get from a toddler, but I was a dumb cop, so I said sure. She yelled for him and after a few minutes he came to the door, all 200+ lbs of this 15 year-old giant. Back to jackpot. He had to be the shooter.

All I needed to do was match the shoes and I’d have my killer. So I told him to get me his shoes, and he nodded to the ground, where two pairs of the same sized women’s sneakers sat. One pair looked like it was run over by a semi then dropped into a garbage disposal, but they were clearly women’s and clearly about three sizes too small for that strapping chap. Nice try, I said, and then the mom said, “It’s true. He’s been growing so quick, I can’t afford to keep buying him shoes.” I still didn’t believe it, because come on. So I asked for permission to search the house for other shoes (and a shotgun or some bloody clothes) and they said sure thing. First thing I noticed while searching was that the only source of heat was a space heater in the mom’s room, and the burners on the stove top which were all on full-blast. Second thing I noticed was that there was absolutely no food in the house (fridges, toilets, cupboards, and washing machines are like the most common places to hide guns for some reason). Third thing I noticed was the two sets of shoes were the only shoes in the house.

I still had my doubts though, so I asked the 15-year-old to put on “his” shoes. He struggled a bit, but managed to shove his massive feet into the shoes. I didn’t have anything to go on, so I took down the info and left, but I still had my doubts, so I came back early the next day and staked out the house. Eventually the kid walked out the front door wearing —you guessed it, the mom’s old shoes. That’s the day that I realized, no matter how rough you have it/had it someone else has it worse. I grew up poor as hell, but I never had to wear my mom’s shoes.

So, when you say things like, which communities have more thefts and robberies, of course the poor ones do. Some of them don’t have food, or heat, or shoes, is it surprising that some might resort to stealing? The really messed up part is that the affluent communities have any theft at all considering all the stuff they already have. Stealing in a rich community is about greed or boredom. Stealing in a poor community might be about greed, but it’s probably about survival.

 

[doomer_md]

I like the robberies and theft reply. So, here’s a true story from when I was a cop in one of the US’s top 10 most dangerous cities—lots of robberies and thefts. I was called to a shooting. Guy’s head got basically disintegrated by a shotgun at close range. Normally these sorts of crimes go straight to the unsolvable bin without passing go and without collecting $200 because no one is going to look our way, let alone talk to us. However, this happened to happen in the middle of the road on a day after it had snowed pretty substantially. The road was plowed, but two blocks away from the scene I found some fresh footprints and after a couple hundred feet, the footprints had a small amount of blood in them—jackpot! The best part about them were they had a distinctive concentric circle pattern that meant whoever shot the headless victim was wearing Air Force Ones.

So, I followed the prints until I got to a house where they clearly walked into. The house was a double—upper/lower—and only the lower had any sign of people living in it. So I knocked on the door and a late-twenties woman lived there with her son. At first, I was like drats, foiled again by some pesky kids, given her age, her son is probably in diapers. I was about to leave, but then she said, you want to talk to him? At first, I thought, what type of intelligence can I get from a toddler, but I was a dumb cop, so I said sure. She yelled for him and after a few minutes he came to the door, all 200+ lbs of this 15 year-old giant. Back to jackpot. He had to be the shooter.

All I needed to do was match the shoes and I’d have my killer. So I told him to get me his shoes, and he nodded to the ground, where two pairs of the same sized women’s sneakers sat. One pair looked like it was run over by a semi then dropped into a garbage disposal, but they were clearly women’s and clearly about three sizes too small for that strapping chap. Nice try, I said, and then the mom said, “It’s true. He’s been growing so quick, I can’t afford to keep buying him shoes.” I still didn’t believe it, because come on. So I asked for permission to search the house for other shoes (and a shotgun or some bloody clothes) and they said sure thing. First thing I noticed while searching was that the only source of heat was a space heater in the mom’s room, and the burners on the stove top which were all on full-blast. Second thing I noticed was that there was absolutely no food in the house (fridges, toilets, cupboards, and washing machines are like the most common places to hide guns for some reason). Third thing I noticed was the two sets of shoes were the only shoes in the house.

I still had my doubts though, so I asked the 15-year-old to put on “his” shoes. He struggled a bit, but managed to shove his massive feet into the shoes. I didn’t have anything to go on, so I took down the info and left, but I still had my doubts, so I came back early the next day and staked out the house. Eventually the kid walked out the front door wearing —you guessed it, the mom’s old shoes. That’s the day that I realized, no matter how rough you have it/had it someone else has it worse. I grew up poor as hell, but I never had to wear my mom’s shoes.

So, when you say things like, which communities have more thefts and robberies, of course the poor ones do. Some of them don’t have food, or heat, or shoes, is it surprising that some might resort to stealing? The really messed up part is that the affluent communities have any theft at all considering all the stuff they already have. Stealing in a rich community is about greed or boredom. Stealing in a poor community might be about greed, but it’s probably about survival.

Touching. But you just proved my point.

 

[Sartino404]

... has this thread really circled around to "actually it's rich people who are disadvantaged!"

 

[Radishguy]

... has this thread really circled around to "actually it's rich people who are disadvantaged!"

It appears that way. As the OP, I fully endorse shutting the thread down

 

[gyngyn]

It appears that way. As the OP, I fully endorse shutting the thread down

Your wish is my command.