Why you don't get accepted

[FutureDrB]

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I'm sitting here looking over the stats for last year and there were just under 18,000 applicants for the ~6,200 available seats. So roughly 12,000 applicants didn't get in. What can that be attributed to?

Below are the obvious, but did every one of the 12,000 unsuccessful applicants fall under one or more of these?

• Sub-par EC's
• Sub-par GPA
• Sub-par MCAT Score
• Poor Interview
• Applied too narrowly

Or, can you just get unlucky?

For example, let's take Bob. Bob applies broadly to 15 schools with a 3.5 GPA, 27 MCAT, good ECs and has great interviews. Can Bob rest assured that he's getting in somewhere?

 

[keels99]

I would say poor interview applied to a large sum of people. Last year there was a guy at mine who was studying written answers to interview questions during information sessions.

 

[Fargofargo]

I also remember Goro saying that a good chunk of applicants don't even actually meet the minimal admission standards in terms of GPA and mcat. They simply want to test their luck and hope to get lucky. So that raises the likelihood of Bobs acceptance!

 

[nontrad78]

I would say poor interview applied to a large sum of people. Last year there was a guy at mine who was studying written answers to interview questions during information sessions.

This is reassuring in a way. I feel like this is where I can make up some ground on my lower cGPA.

 

[FutureDrB]

I also remember Goro saying that a good chunk of applicants don't even actually meet the minimal admission standards in terms of GPA and mcat. They simply want to test their luck and hope to get lucky. So that raises the likelihood of Bobs acceptance!

Ah, so you're saying you think some of the 12,000 who weren't accepted were applicants who didn't even qualify? I assume you mean they didn't have their pre-reqs done and applied anyway? I didn't think of that. Who would do that, haha?

 

[wdoc]

Just curious, is your statistic based solely on D.O. applications/acceptances, or M.D. as well?

 

[FutureDrB]

Just curious, is your statistic based solely on D.O. applications/acceptances, or M.D. as well?

Just D.O.

 

[Fargofargo]

Ah, so you're saying you think some of the 12,000 who weren't accepted were applicants who didn't even qualify? I assume you mean they didn't have their pre-reqs done and applied anyway? I didn't think of that. Who would do that, haha?

Ya think about it. If a person has 3.3gpa, 25mcat, he is considered acceptable for DO schools. However, he wouldn't stand a chance for MD schools. And if he only wants to go MD schools, he would fall into that category. It's human nature to have that "what if..." Lottery mentality!


And plus, not every applicant has an SDN account and become an informed applicant.

 

[wdoc]

I bet that some of the applicants that apply to DO schools also apply to MD schools, and possibly get into those MD schools. This could account for a portion of the 12,000 that apply and don't matriculate to DO schools/gain acceptance.

 

[FutureDrB]

I bet that some of the applicants that apply to DO schools also apply to MD schools, and possibly get into those MD schools. This could account for a portion of the 12,000 that apply and don't matriculate to DO schools/gain acceptance.

Good point too.

 

[IslandStyle808]

Your personal goals don't line up with the mission goals of the school.

 

[futurexray]

Also, those who apply late might never get reviewed depending on the number of applications received at a school. I think anyone who applies after January 1 or who does not have an MCAT score in by then should kiss an invitation to interview goodbye.

 

[keels99]

Also, those who apply late might never get reviewed depending on the number of applications received at a school. I think anyone who applies after January 1 or who does not have an MCAT score in by then should kiss an invitation to interview goodbye.

I applied in February and got accepted. So this is false.

 

[user3]

The number of matriculants this year was more around 6,500 with the new schools. Also, we don't know the number of acceptances given for these spots.

There are also MANY competitive people who don't get due to not applying broadly enough. If you have a 3.3 and 24 and only apply to CCOM DMU Western PCOM and NSU, don't be surprised when your rejections start rolling in.

 

[IslandStyle808]

The number of matriculants this year was more around 6,500 with the new schools. Also, we don't know the number of acceptances given for these spots.

There are also MANY competitive people who don't get due to not applying broadly enough. If you have a 3.3 and 24 and only apply to CCOM DMU Western PCOM and NSU, don't be surprised when your rejections start rolling in.

Or you just don't get a rejection letter because they forgot about their pile B students (the "I'll save you for later pile").

 

[Awesome Sauceome]

Yea you would be surprised how many people apply who are severely under qualified.

Think about people from your undergrad. For every superstar applicant you knew, there were 5 people who you felt that have absolutely no place applying to med school. These people usually weren't serious enough to have really done their homework. So they spent their time partying, not getting good grades, and then applying to Harvard and upenn because they want to go somewhere prestigious.

 

[db4277]

Yea you would be surprised how many people apply who are severely under qualified.

Think about people from your undergrad. For every superstar applicant you knew, there were 5 people who you felt that have absolutely no place applying to med school. These people usually weren't serious enough to have really done their homework. So they spent their time partying, not getting good grades, and then applying to Harvard and upenn because they want to go somewhere prestigious.

Going to an informational event at my local COM was one of the most reassuring things I've ever done. I was nervous to meet the "competition" but quickly realized that the other attendants were naive, mediocre, and generally ill-prepared. It made me really glad to be a non-trad applicant.

 

[pollos]

How large of a role does personal statement play in all this? I've always been curious since the focus is always on numbers and ECs.

 

[hawruh]

How large of a role does personal statement play in all this? I've always been curious since the focus is always on numbers and ECs.

It depends on who's reading it. There was a Q&A on here a while ago with an Adcom member who was asked this. He said the majority PS's that he reads are interchangeable, but that there's a few each cycle that are really compelling and stand out. So I guess those could really benefit the applicant, but that seems like the exception. The Adcom said that he knows other Adcom's that don't even read them.

 

[baxt1412]

Yea you would be surprised how many people apply who are severely under qualified.

Think about people from your undergrad. For every superstar applicant you knew, there were 5 people who you felt that have absolutely no place applying to med school. These people usually weren't serious enough to have really done their homework. So they spent their time partying, not getting good grades, and then applying to Harvard and upenn because they want to go somewhere prestigious.

someone a year below me got a 23 on his MCAT and was "still going to give MD a chance"... dude.... white male from rich KC suburb lol. no chance 😛

How large of a role does personal statement play in all this? I've always been curious since the focus is always on numbers and ECs.

I don't think your PS will ever make up for extremely subpar numbers. If you are a point below, maybe so... but miracles basically don't happen haha.

 

[Goro]

There is no "unlucky". Failed applicants can have very identifiable deficits. One is omitted from your list: applied too late. Nothing is assured; I would predict that Bob will get lots of IIs, it's up to him to ace them and get accepted. I'll add that Bob is a highly competitive candidate.

I'm sitting here looking over the stats for last year and there were just under 18,000 applicants for the ~6,200 available seats. So roughly 12,000 applicants didn't get in. What can that be attributed to?

You'd be surprised. My school (and gyngyn's MD school) get's apps from people with single digit MCAT scores. Not in each category...for the entire exam!!!). I have no idea what goes through their minds...there's probably a good paper for a psych journal there.
Interestingly we see the same thing for faculty job searches. About half of the applications for, say, an anatomy position are from people who have no business applying, like Drosophila geneticists or microbiologists.


Ah, so you're saying you think some of the 12,000 who weren't accepted were applicants who didn't even qualify? I assume you mean they didn't have their pre-reqs done and applied anyway? I didn't think of that. Who would do that, haha?

 

[studentp0x]

There is no "unlucky". Failed applicants can have very identifiable deficits. One is omitted from your list: applied too late. Nothing is assured; I would predict that Bob will get lots of IIs, it's up to him to ace them and get accepted. I'll add that Bob is a highly competitive candidate.

I'm sitting here looking over the stats for last year and there were just under 18,000 applicants for the ~6,200 available seats. So roughly 12,000 applicants didn't get in. What can that be attributed to?

You'd be surprised. My school (and gyngyn's MD school) get's apps from people with single digit MCAT scores. Not in each category...for the entire exam!!!). I have no idea what goes through their minds...there's probably a good paper for a psych journal there.
Interestingly we see the same thing for faculty job searches. About half of the applications for, say, an anatomy position are from people who have no business applying, like Drosophila geneticists or microbiologists.


Ah, so you're saying you think some of the 12,000 who weren't accepted were applicants who didn't even qualify? I assume you mean they didn't have their pre-reqs done and applied anyway? I didn't think of that. Who would do that, haha?

Whats the lowest range of GPAs you see? (or that you have heard)

 

[Goro]

Someone posted that some fool applied to U MI with a 0.75 GPA. In retrospect, that might have been a hoax, because I can't imagine a university letting someone graduate with a GPA < 1.0!

My school has a floor of 3.0.

Whats the lowest range of GPAs you see? (or that you have heard)

 

[FutureDrB]

Whats the lowest range of GPAs you see? (or that you have heard)

According to the report, 200 people applied with a sub-2.0 science GPA and 31 with a sub-2.0 cGPA.

 

[keels99]

According to the report, 200 people applied with a sub-2.0 science GPA and 31 with a sub-2.0 cGPA.

.... Seriously?

 

[FutureDrB]

.... Seriously?

My thoughts exactly.
Here's the link to the reports if anyone wants to view them: http://www.aacom.org/data/applicantsmatriculants/Pages/default.aspx

 

[CUNYguy]

This thread makes me feel a lot better for not getting that 3.5 (though I am disappointed that I didn't.........).

I would expect everyone to be at least a 2.75 applying, since med school is notorious for their intensity.


Sent from my iPad using SDN Mobile

 

[CanadianHopefully]

wow those are some interesting facts!! I wonder what it would take to get 0.75, lol.

 

[Jwalker]

He would have to blow at interviews if he didn't get in. Making your interviewer laugh goes a long way!

 

[nontrad78]

This thread makes me feel a lot better for not getting that 3.5 (though I am disappointed that I didn't.........).

I would expect everyone to be at least a 2.75 applying, since med school is notorious for their intensity.


Sent from my iPad using SDN Mobile

Agreed. I stay pretty nervous about my GPA, but by looking at the matriculant data, I see that I'm just above the average sGPA and roughly 1 SD below the average cGPA, while being over 1 SD above the average MCAT. I've applied broadly, and don't really have any red flags.

Thanks for the the link @FutureDrB

Makes me a little more patient while waiting to hear back on secondaries.

 

[abolt18]

You'd be surprised. My school (and gyngyn's MD school) get's apps from people with single digit MCAT scores. Not in each category...for the entire exam!!!). I have no idea what goes through their minds...there's probably a good paper for a psych journal there.
Interestingly we see the same thing for faculty job searches. About half of the applications for, say, an anatomy position are from people who have no business applying, like Drosophila geneticists or microbiologists.

Honestly this blows my mind. I feel like you would have to INTENTIONALLY get questions wrong to get single digits.

 

[kthxbai]

You'd be surprised. My school (and gyngyn's MD school) get's apps from people with single digit MCAT scores. Not in each category...for the entire exam!!!). I have no idea what goes through their minds...there's probably a good paper for a psych journal there.
Interestingly we see the same thing for faculty job searches. About half of the applications for, say, an anatomy position are from people who have no business applying, like Drosophila geneticists or microbiologists.

One of my responsibilities on the job is to review resumes for our research positions. We may get between 600-1000 applications for an entry level position, but only a couple dozen people are seriously considered at all. When we indicate "excellent academic record," we do NOT mean the 3.0 and unders of the world. People have a way of filtering themselves out, I suppose.