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Working more than 24 hrs?

Discussion in 'General Residency Issues' started by nradsoit3, Mar 11, 2007.

  1. nradsoit3

    nradsoit3 Senior Member
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    Are there any jobs aside from being a resident where one works more than 24 HRS STRAIGHT? Honestly, I can't think of any??? Can you?
     
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  2. EtOHWithdrawal

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    Firemen
     
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  3. colbgw02

    colbgw02 Delightfully Tacky
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    soldiers and other military types do it all the time, and not just when they're deployed
     
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  4. medgator

    medgator Senior Member
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    a new parent?
     
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  5. awdc

    awdc Senior Member
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    EMT's and paramedics have 24-hour shifts which might go over.
     
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  6. dynx

    dynx Yankee Imperialist
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    Having your rhetorical question shot down with legit answers reminded me of this scene from the life of Brian which I feel is hilarious...So I thought I would share:


    EG: They've bled us white, the bastards. They've taken everything we had, and not just from us, from our fathers, and from our fathers' fathers.

    LORETTA: And from our fathers' fathers' fathers.

    REG: Yeah.

    LORETTA: And from our fathers' fathers' fathers' fathers.

    REG: Yeah. All right, Stan. Don't labour the point. And what have they ever given us in return?!

    XERXES: The aqueduct?

    REG: What?

    XERXES: The aqueduct.

    REG: Oh. Yeah, yeah. They did give us that. Uh, that's true. Yeah.

    COMMANDO #3: And the sanitation.

    LORETTA: Oh, yeah, the sanitation, Reg. Remember what the city used to be like?

    REG: Yeah. All right. I'll grant you the aqueduct and the sanitation are two things that the Romans have done.

    MATTHIAS: And the roads.

    REG: Well, yeah. Obviously the roads. I mean, the roads go without saying, don't they? But apart from the sanitation, the aqueduct, and the roads--

    COMMANDO: Irrigation.

    XERXES: Medicine.

    COMMANDOS: Huh...

    COMMANDO #2: Education.

    REG: Yeah, yeah. All right. Fair enough.

    COMMANDO #1: And the wine.

    COMMANDOS: Oh Yeah...

    FRANCIS: Yeah. Yeah, that's something we'd really miss, Reg, if the Romans left. Huh.

    COMMANDO: Public baths.

    LORETTA: And it's safe to walk in the streets at night now, Reg.

    FRANCIS: Yeah, they certainly know how to keep order. Let's face it. They're the only ones who could in a place like this.

    COMMANDOS: Hehh, heh. Heh heh heh heh heh heh heh.

    REG: All right, but apart from the sanitation, the medicine, education, wine, public order, irrigation, roads, a fresh water system, and public health, what have the Romans ever done for us?
     
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  7. TRAMD

    TRAMD Señor Member
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    I am 14 hours into a 30 hour shift . . . but I am an intern . . . nevermind.
     
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  8. Auscultate

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    I'm sure that any firemen or EMTs that had to work 24 hours straight would be paid for overtime!!

    You can't name me two fields where working 30 hours straight (with no overtime compensation !) is considered to be adhering to work hour regulations.
     
  9. OncoCaP

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    It's probably less common than working say, 100 weeks with more evenly spaced time for sleep. However, it can happen in many fields. For example, some salaried professionals (or even non-professionals paid by a formula) working a deadline:

    1. Salaried plant engineers working a turnaround (they have cots at the plant so that they can sleep there as well when they are not working).
    2. People who work on offshore oil rigs during certain production phases (hey, it's in international waters or offshore a developing country ... work regs don't necessarily apply)
    3. Salaried accountants working some kind of deadline (tax, public disclosure, etc.)
    4. Certain fishermen working the arctic oceans (it took a lot to get there, so they aren't going to sleep through certain precious moments) ... they may get paid by a catch formula rather than hours worked.
    5. Certain trial lawyers working on commission (preparing for a case against a hospital that had a sleepy resident who made an error :eek: ).
    6. Certain actors working on location or with a precious resource.
    7. Biologists trying to observe some obscure event that only happens somewhere in a remote jungle ... fertilization of some rare queen ants or whatever.

    Also, although many professionals can "bill by the hour" the budget doesn't always allow that. My brother worked an engineering job where he averaged 80 hours per week but only got paid for 40 because that is all he was allowed to bill.

    That said, a general surgery resident working 100 hour weeks (in a program that doesn't worry too much about the 80 hour rule) is probably one of the toughest jobs out there. There are other tough jobs out there, but it doesn't mean that being a resident is now suddenly "not that bad." Residents have my respect 100%.
     
  10. EctopicFetus

    EctopicFetus Keeping it funky enough
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    FWIW I cant think of anyone who works 27-30 hours in a row and makes 40-45K and that includes any bonus for any of you who want to bring up some other fields.
     
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  11. jpro

    jpro Senior Member
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    Anyone that has served inthe military knows that working >24, and sometimes pushing 36-48hrs is not uncommon. The enlisted folks that work these hours recieve no overtime and make less than 20K. Things could be worse. you could be in a fox hole trying to stay alive for 30hrs instead of trying to keep others alive. One is more stressfull than the other.
     
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  12. Shah_Patel_PT

    Physician 10+ Year Member

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    Dont fireman and police officers get paid overtime when they work those long hours????
     
  13. jvencius

    jvencius Peon
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    no
     
  14. napoleondynamite

    napoleondynamite Keepin' it real yo
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    I work as a paramedic. This may not sound believable, but it is true: I work 48 hour shifts (just got off one actually).

    We get paid overtime for hours in excess of 40 hours a week just like anybody else. I don't get special pay just for working long hours.

    I guess the difference in EMS is that we CHOOSE to work long hours. I could work 12's if I preferred. However, it's a lot nicer to work for 2 days straight and just get it over with.

    The other difference is that, ON AVERAGE, we get more sleep during our shifts than med students/residents do at the hospital on call. However, we sometimes get hammered too and have nights with zero sleep.

    But, these are the choices we make in life. I went into EMS fully understanding this. And then when I got sick of doing it and decided to go to med school, I went in understanding the price involved as well. In the end (I'll be brutally honest), SCHEDULE was my #1 priority in picking a specialty. I fell in love with radonc for other reasons as well, but I would not have picked it if I knew it meant working nights/weekends/holidays for the rest of my life. I have the benefit of a little life experience which helped me to know that this is very important to me.

    During third year I remember being on call during my medicine rotation at the VA. It was my son's 3rd birthday. I was so frickin' depressed I couldn't stand it. I remember sitting there on the dirty damn VA carpet with my wife and kids, singing to him and watching him blow out his candles right as my pager went off. At that time I had wanted to do ER (the sole reason I came to med school in the first place). This experience was watershed for me. I decided that for me personally, I never wanted to work another night, weekend or holiday. I wanted a normal life with normal hours and close to no call.

    Anyway, I ooze with admiration for my classmates who are dedicating their lives to surgery, medicine, ob/gyn or other life-consuming fields. We need people like that. I'm just not one of them. I love my kids too much. Medicine is just a job for me. An important job..but it's not my life.
     
  15. sirus_virus

    sirus_virus nonsense poster
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    You guys have to be out of your minds if you think firemen spend most of their time "working". I hang out with some of those guys and we shoot pool and play basketball on the job, sometimes for 8 hours straight.
     
  16. napoleondynamite

    napoleondynamite Keepin' it real yo
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    HIGHLY dependent on location and whether it is a paid or volunteer system you are talking about. Also, keep in mind it is more competetive to get a job as a fireman than to get into med school.
     
  17. Adam_K

    Adam_K Indentured
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    Investment bankers, on a fairly regular basis. Then again, their compensation doesn't compare to ours.
     
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  18. 8744

    8744 Guest

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    With apologies for beating the dead horse, I worked 50 hours just over the weekend (Friday to Monday morning, actually) and then had to work a regular work week after that. I guarantee that firemen and paramedics may work 24-hour shifts but they probably only work two of those a week and that's all they have to do for their full paycheck.

    Residents work the big shifts and get nothing in return but a hosing.

    There is no comparrison. Even in the Marines there was a legitimate purpose for going without sleep. The only reason we are abused as residents is because we are highly skilled, ridiculously inexpensive labor for the hospital.

    Oh the wailing and gnashing of teeth that must have resulted when the 80-hour work week was implemented.
     
  19. swpm

    swpm Now with extra snarkiness
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    With respect, I don't believe that. What's the basis for this claim?
     
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  20. Shah_Patel_PT

    Physician 10+ Year Member

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    I think u mean it the other way around.

    If not....please show me some data!!!
     
  21. napoleondynamite

    napoleondynamite Keepin' it real yo
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    No, I had it in the right order actually! I've been through both processes, and trust me, it's true. It is not uncommon for 2,000+ applicants to apply for an open position with a fire department. The odds of getting in are extremely low. :eek: I'm sure you could google this if you really want some "data," but I ain't gonna dig it up for you. I'm just telling you it's true b/c I've been through it. ND.
     
  22. Shah_Patel_PT

    Physician 10+ Year Member

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    I am in the north east...and I see a firestation at almost every block....It's just kind of hard to digest what you say....
     
  23. lowbudget

    lowbudget Senior Member
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    24 hours? Yea the 30 hour shift makes 24 seem like a cinch.
     
  24. Winged Scapula

    Winged Scapula Cougariffic!
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    70% of the fire work force is volunteer. I suspect the user is speaking about PAID positions as a fireman, which are much fewer and more competitive.
     
  25. napoleondynamite

    napoleondynamite Keepin' it real yo
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    Hey, I'm not defending the atrocious work hours in medicine..I detest even the 80 hour work week and agree with your gripes on here. I was simply answering the the original question as to whether there are other professions with long work hours. I do work 48 hour shifts as a paramedic..and fireman can work upwards of 72 hours in a single week.

    But of course you are correct..being a fireman is (IN MANY CITIES..BUT DEFINITELY NOT ALL!!) much cushier than being a med student or resident. There have been plenty of nights I've been paid to sit around the station and play video games or sleep (or, during medical school, study!).

    As to the competetiveness of getting a job as a fireman, you can choose to believe it or not...but what I have said is true. Ask any fireman the next time you see them in the ER just how many applicants there were for their spot. I'll bet they tell you they feel pretty damn lucky to have that job..I know countless EMT's who have tried for years to get a paid position with a fire dept to no avail. I wouldn't judge a profession you don't know much if anything about.. You say you see a fire station on every corner so it must not be competetive...would you think a paramedic or firefighter uneducated if they said "I sure see a lot of hospitals/doctors around..it must be a cinch to get into med school?" :rolleyes: Anyway, do a little homework if you really care about this (I don't see why you would anyway..just to verify that you are in the most competetive thing on earth or...:confused: ) and you will see that what I have told you is the truth.
     
  26. mucha

    mucha Member
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  27. Cuthbert

    Cuthbert DINH
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    Firefighters that I know work one day on, one day off, one day on, 4 days off (something to that extent). Real tough...
     
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  28. napoleondynamite

    napoleondynamite Keepin' it real yo
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    Yeah..they also get paid the big bucks..like 30-40K to put their lives on the line ;)
     
  29. turkleton

    turkleton Capeless Crusader
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    Actors? Seriously? C'mon. Thats like when models whine about how no one respects how difficult their job is.

    As far as competitiveness, fireman may be. But I believe garbageman by percentage is also more competitive. Relax, so what you're not the most qualified 16000 people in the nation.

    "Apparently Heaven is easier to get into than Arizona State" ~ Ned Flanders
     
  30. awdc

    awdc Senior Member
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    Surprising but true, getting to fire academy is way competitive. Heck, it almost made getting into med school look like a cinch. When I was an EMT at a private company out in L.A., almost every EMT and most medics were trying to get into the fire academy. Some have been trying for years. And if you want to join a big city fire dept like LAFD or FDNY... good luck.
     
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  31. 3dtp

    3dtp Senior Member
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    Too right! And it continues to this day.
     
  32. Hurricane

    Hurricane Senior Member
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  33. Ross434

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    I know a fireman applicant (correct wording??), and what napoleon dynamite said is definitely true, there there are hundreds of applicants for each spot - However, you have to consider the fact that anybody and their brother who takes a course or 2 at a community college or has some EMT or volunteer fire experience can apply for those jobs. Med school applicants, on the other hand, have all completed rigorous 4 year degrees with top grades. And as far as nobody else working a 24 hour shift? How about basically *anyone* in the competitive business world. Anybody who is serious about starting their own business probably pulls serious hours, and *many* people involved in deals and contracts in the corporate world probably pull all nighters at the office when deadlines approach.
     

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