2013-2014 Washington University in St. Louis Application Thread

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gettheleadout

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Supplemental Essay 2014

(optional) Do you have unique experiences or obstacles that you have overcome that were not covered in your application about which you would like to inform our Admissions Committee? (maximum 3000 characters including spaces)

Good luck to everyone applying! :luck:

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Bumpy bump. Surprised no posts here. Good luck everyone! :luck:

meh, i dunno, I'm scared by the high stats. i don't think I'll apply here, despite a high LizzyM score my gpa is in wustl's toilet. good luck to everyone else who is applying, though!
 
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I'm a rising first year at Washington. Though I can't give as good a perspective as those that have already completed an academic year (or more), I'm more than happy to answer questions as fully as possible. I love Washington and cannot wait to start in August. Best of luck to everyone applying!
 
I'm a rising first year at Washington. Though I can't give as good a perspective as those that have already completed an academic year (or more), I'm more than happy to answer questions as fully as possible. I love Washington and cannot wait to start in August. Best of luck to everyone applying!

I've got a few questions, if you've got the time:


What drew you to Wash U?

What's the school culture like?

Do you think the school's reputation as a "stat-*****" is deserved?

Is there anything they particularly seem to look for outside of numbers?


Thanks for the help, and congrats on a successful cycle!
 
Again, take anything I say with a grain of salt, but here goes . . .

What drew you to Wash U?

So many things. The way Washington treats its students is truly exceptional. Facilities and educational opportunities are top-notch, and student research is easier to become involved in here than at any other institution I visited. Dean Chung, Associate Dean for Medical Student Research, helps students with summer research, year-out opportunities, and dual degrees. She, like everyone else, is extremely personable and friendly. The curriculum is more traditional (2 years pre-clinical, 2 years clinical). I'm not a huge fan of PBL so that was a plus. First year is P/F and second year is currently an uncurved H/P/F scale, based solely upon a percentile. This means if every student scores above a threshold, e.g. 90%, every student is eligible to receive honors, thereby eliminating competition. There is no curve against your peers. Washington also has very generous financial aid packages. Barnes-Jewish Hosptial, St. Louis Children's Hosptial, and the Center for Advanced Medicine are all amazing places to learn. Once all the dust had settled, I thought I would be happiest spending the next few years of my life in St. Louis.

What's the school culture like?

I can comment more on this in a few weeks and months, but from what I have seen so far I love it. During Second Look I met many interesting and accomplished people, and everyone seemed to be academically driven. However, they also had a good life balance. We were shown around the Central West End and the surrounding St. Louis area by current students and the area is great for the student lifestyle. Some students enjoy outdoors, and nearby Forest Park offers an escape from the city in that respect. The first year is P/F (and quite possibly the second year in the future) and I think it is key to creating the relaxed environment I saw amongst the students.

Also, one thing I saw at Washington I didn't see at some other schools was a wider variety of geographical backgrounds amongst its students. Many other schools I looked at were in the Northeast. Washington is in the Midwest and there I met matriculating students from California, Texas, Minnesota, New York, North Carolina, and Florida, to name a few states. This could be due to the more central location of St. Louis or it could be a subjective observation. Either way, I think it's interesting and adds something unique.

Do you think the school's reputation as a "stat-*****" is deserved?

From the standpoint of metrics, Washington has some of the highest scores for accepted students in the country. My question is how does this differentiate them from any of their peer institutions? Washington may value scores but this certainly does not mean it ignores other characteristics.

Is there anything they particularly seem to look for outside of numbers?

This is speculation because I'm not associated with admissions but I would say well-rounded individuals. For example, I know of one applicant that received an interview and was not offered an acceptance. His/Her lack of clinical exposure played a role in this decision. It's not just about excelling in the classroom but in many different facets.

If you were to press me to name something, I would probably say research. There is an emphasis on research at Washington though it is by no means a requirement. The majority of students I encountered at Second Look had conducted research, and many medical students do research during the academic year or the summer between first and second year. It is not a requirement but is encouraged. The research opportunities at Washington are unbelievable and played an essential role in my decision.

Thanks for the help, and congrats on a successful cycle!

Thanks!
 
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Rising third year here. Just finished a year out to do a masters. Also happy to answer questions and be of help in any way.
 
So many things. The way Washington treats its students is truly exceptional. Facilities and educational opportunities are top-notch, and student research is easier to become involved in here than at any other institution I visited. Dean Chung, Associate Dean for Medical Student Research, helps students with summer research, year-out opportunities, and dual degrees. She, like everyone else, is extremely personable and friendly. The curriculum is more traditional (2 years pre-clinical, 2 years clinical). I'm not a huge fan of PBL so that was a plus. First year is P/F and second year is currently an uncurved H/P/F scale, based solely upon a percentile. This means if every student scores above a threshold, e.g. 90%, every student is eligible to receive honors, thereby eliminating competition. There is no curve against your peers. Washington also has very generous financial aid packages. Barnes-Jewish Hosptial, St. Louis Children's Hosptial, and the Center for Advanced Medicine are all amazing places to learn. Once all the dust had settled, I thought I would be happiest spending the next few years of my life in St. Louis.

Great. A few additions:
1a) Funding for summer research here is more plentiful than other places I know of. I'm getting more than friends at Harvard, Hopkins, the NIH. Everyone gets funded, and you don't have to beg your PI for money. That gives you ultimate flexibility on where you want to work and what kind of research you want to do (basic, clinical, public health). Some choose to do projects abroad or at other institutions domestically (like me). There are very few rules/requirements. There is no research requirement, no thesis, no scholarly project, etc. You be an adult and do what you want. WashU is about flexibility.
1b) A number of students every year (10-15?) other than the MSTPs take extra time to do research. This number is not so large that you will feel pressured to take a research year just to keep up with your classmates, as is the case at some of WashU's peer schools. It is also not so small that you're forging new territory. The support is plentiful for those who want to do an extra year at WashU or elsewhere, or earn a master's of whatever, or possibly transfer into the MSTP. WashU is about flexibility.
2) The fourth year is completely elective; this is relatively uncommon among schools. There are no requirements for some arbitrary extra clerkship or sub-internship. You craft your own plan of study to explore your specialty interests. WashU is about flexibility.
3) The curriculum being traditional means it's largely lecture-based (major exceptions are a few small groups/team based learning a month, anatomy and histology labs, clinical skills small groups, practice of medicine small groups). Being lecture-based mostly means attendance is optional (except when patients are presented). You choose to learn in what manner you feel you learn best. Play lecture videos from home at your own pace or not at all. You don't get this at schools that are PBL-based and tutorial-based, you also don't get this at schools that for whatever reason don't have the technology to podcast videos that can be conveniently played at 2x speed, and you don't get this in programs that are so small (30) that they require attendance at lectures. WashU is about flexibility.
4) WashU has a lot of money that includes research funding, financial aid (merit and need-based), school-sponsored social events, and student activities. There's apparently the equivalent of 16 full-tuition scholarships (some are broken up to give to multiple people). Deans at other schools are sometimes shocked to hear how much our student affairs budget is. I run a student group here; we get about $5k a year to cover community service programs, student educational and social events, and travel to conferences for a small number of students. My friend at HMS leads the same group; they get $1k a year. My counterparts at St Louis U tells me they get $500 a year. Money gives you freedom to do the things you want to do. WashU is about flexibility.
5) WashU second year is H/HP/P/F. Among top 25 schools, only WashU, Penn, UTSW, and UNC still have non-P/F for some part of the preclinical years. This is not about flexibility. It's about inertia and status quo bias and beliefs that students need constant extrinsic motivation to learn. I have high hopes it will be changed by the end of this year. Committee meetings addressing the issue are ongoing.
6) Re: "amazing places to learn." Consider how WashU medical center (Barnes-Jewish and St Louis Children's) is the major tertiary referral center for a 300-mile radius. It's also the only non-profit hospital left in the city of St. Louis. You see the crazy interesting cases from the region, country, and world as well as the local medically indigent and the gun shot wounds. It has more beds than the Mayo Clinic, Mass General, or Hopkins. Barnes Jewish is ranked #6 on the US News honor roll of adult hospitals and Children's is ranked #6 among children's hospitals as well. There are only four medical schools that have both their affiliated adult hospital and their pediatric hospital on the USNWR honor roll and the medical school itself is ranked in the top 15 in research: WashU, Harvard, Penn, Hopkins. The only thing at WashU that is not nationally ranked is its rehabilitation hospital. For a different patient population and system, you can also rotate at the VA hospital. You're not forced to rotate at the VA, you're not randomly assigned and forced to do your clinical year at one affiliated hospital over another (e.g. BIDMC over MGH). (However, you are forced to do a primary care rotation in the community during the medicine clerkship.) Flexibility??
7) Re: "amazing places to learn." Every preclinical student gets their own study carrel (desk and cabinets). You can have your own study space with the people you want to study with. When you want to separate home and school, and the library is too quiet or impersonal, you've got flexibility; you've got the carrels. This is rare among med schools. The building where medical students have lectures, study, hang out and drink post-exams, have small groups, and do simulations, the FLTC or Farrell Learning and Teaching Center, is this magnificent six story postmodern structure connected to the hospitals and dorms by skybridges built in 2005 by the architect that designed the National Air and Space Museum.

I can comment more on this in a few weeks and months, but from what I have seen so far I love it. During Second Look I met many interesting and accomplished people, and everyone seemed to be academically driven.

With the highest selectivity of any med school (by MCAT+GPA), you're going to get academically driven students.

However, they also had a good life balance. We were shown around the Central West End and the surrounding St. Louis area by current students and the area is great for the student lifestyle. Some students enjoy outdoors, and nearby Forest Park offers an escape from the city in that respect.

On AreaVibes, the 63108 zip code (Central West End where the med school is and almost everyone lives) has a livability rating of 75 ("extremely livable"), with amenities rating of A+. Compare with 02115 (Harvard med: 72, "very livable"); 21205 (Hopkins: 63, "somewhat livable"); 19104 (Penn: 68, "somewhat livable"). Granted, people often don't live in the bad areas at some of those schools, but that just means you have to commute and people don't live near each other, which is detrimental for social activities; or people live in crappy dorms, which makes med school more like an extension of college than a step towards the real world, right?

Also, one thing I saw at Washington I didn't see at some other schools was a wider variety of geographical backgrounds amongst its students. Many other schools I looked at were in the Northeast. Washington is in the Midwest and there I met matriculating students from California, Texas, Minnesota, New York, North Carolina, and Florida, to name a few states. This could be due to the more central location of St. Louis or it could be a subjective observation. Either way, I think it's interesting and adds something unique.

The geographical distribution might be subjective, but anyone curious can check out where all WashU students are from (undergrad and hometown) at this website. My only feeling is that the students at WashU are less coast-biased than the student bodies at schools that are on the coasts are. Most people don't choose to come to WashU for the location (even the ones that went to WashU for undergrad); they choose it because it's WashU.

From the standpoint of metrics, Washington has some of the highest scores for accepted students in the country. My question is how does this differentiate them from any of their peer institutions? Washington may value scores but this certainly does not mean it ignores other characteristics.
Just a gut feeling, but I'd say WashU students are probably less diversely-ambitious than its peer schools. Like fewer Rhodes scholars and Soros fellows or something. But whatever. Everyone's still really smart and focused. The dean of admissions is changing next year and student stereotypes may be totally different in a few years.
 
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how friendly is washington university to OOS students? Also whats their avg mcat and gpa? thx!
 
how friendly is washington university to OOS students? Also whats their avg mcat and gpa? thx!

WashU is a private school, and does not give preference to in-state students. Their median gpa/MCAT for accepted applicants is 3.93/38.

In the future, please try finding the answer for yourself before posting a question here. It would have taken you less than a minute to find the answer on your own.
 
a 38 mcat? DAM!!!! off the list.

Yep, and their 90th percentile is a 41, which means that 10% of the people they admit are in the 99.9th percentile of MCAT test takers. For perspective, there were only 86 people who scored a 41+ last year.
 
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Yep, and their 90th percentile is a 41, which means that 10% of the people they admit are in the 99.9th percentile of MCAT test takers. For perspective, there were only 86 people who scored a 41+ last year.

Out of everyone who wrote the MCAT that year? Wow...makes me feel pretty special :D
 
Out of everyone who wrote the MCAT that year? Wow...makes me feel pretty special :D

Yep. From the data I saw, there were about 86,000 people who took the test, and the 99.9th percentile is a 41. So, 1/1000 people scored 41 or higher, which is 86000/1000, which is 86.
 
Yep. From the data I saw, there were about 86,000 people who took the test, and the 99.9th percentile is a 41. So, 1/1000 people scored 41 or higher, which is 86000/1000, which is 86.

Give or take, considering rounding of the percentiles and number of test takers. It's probably <100 but can't be pegged at exactly 86.
 
Anyone else get a letter/pamphlet in the mail from WUSTL encouraging them to apply? Good sign?
 
Anyone else get a letter/pamphlet in the mail from WUSTL encouraging them to apply? Good sign?

I got one congratulating me on my strong performance on the MCAT. Don't know if it means anything....
 
I got one congratulating me on my strong performance on the MCAT. Don't know if it means anything....

I got one but "only" with a 37. Their average is a 38. I imagine they might be sending the letter to anyone above their lower quartile score. Also you have to imagine the 38 factors in the URMs they take in, so the ORM/white average might be a 39 or 40.
 
I got one but "only" with a 37. Their average is a 38. I imagine they might be sending the letter to anyone above their lower quartile score. Also you have to imagine the 38 factors in the URMs they take in, so the ORM/white average might be a 39 or 40.

That might be the mean for accepted students if you got it from MSAR. FYI, the mean MCAT of matriculating students was 36.9 last year. The highest was 37.5 three and six years ago.
 
And here's the essay for this year:
(optional) Do you have unique experiences or obstacles that you have overcome that were not covered in your application about which you would like to inform our Admissions Committee? (maximum 3000 characters including spaces)

Supplemental app opened on June 20th, can be accessed at https://wumsapply.wustl.edu/
 
I have a question about this part of the secondary application:

Certification by Current Dean of Students: Certification form(s) must be submitted on your behalf by an official at each undergraduate or graduate institution listed on your AMCAS application from which you have received or expect to receive a degree in addition to any other school in which you were enrolled and were involved in a disciplinary or
institutional action.

I have only ever attended one degree program, my undergraduate alma mater. However, I did an informal post-bacc picking up classes at multiple schools, so I have several additional schools listed on my AMCAS.

Do I only need to get the certification from the school that gave me my degree? I'm confused by the wording 'in addition to any other school in which you were enrolled and were involved in a disciplinary action'. Does that mean that if I was *not* involved in any disciplinary actions, I don't need to certification from my additional post-bacc schools?
 
And here's the essay for this year:
(optional) Do you have unique experiences or obstacles that you have overcome that were not covered in your application about which you would like to inform our Admissions Committee? (maximum 3000 characters including spaces)

Supplemental app opened on June 20th, can be accessed at https://wumsapply.wustl.edu/

There's also a pseudo-essay for post-grads:

If you have already completed your education, if your college or graduate education was interrupted, or if you do not plan to be a full-time student during the current year, describe in chronological order your activities during the time(s) when you were not enrolled as a full-time student. (maximum 1800 characters including spaces)
 
I have a question about this part of the secondary application:



I have only ever attended one degree program, my undergraduate alma mater. However, I did an informal post-bacc picking up classes at multiple schools, so I have several additional schools listed on my AMCAS.

Do I only need to get the certification from the school that gave me my degree? I'm confused by the wording 'in addition to any other school in which you were enrolled and were involved in a disciplinary action'. Does that mean that if I was *not* involved in any disciplinary actions, I don't need to certification from my additional post-bacc schools?
I read that as "you need Dean's Certification from each of your degree-granting schools" + "you need Dean's Certification from non-degree granting schools if you were involved in disciplinary action in any of them". I may be wrong though.

I'm actually confused about the whole certification thing. What is it exactly? And what if one of your degrees is from a foreign schools, which barely provides transcripts, let alone certifications?
 
Should I have received notification that the secondary opened already? My AMCAS was verified last week. Is it ok to just start filling out the secondary even if we haven't been contacted?
 
Should I have received notification that the secondary opened already? My AMCAS was verified last week. Is it ok to just start filling out the secondary even if we haven't been contacted?

I mean you should be fine to fill it out but I would wait until the data transmission day on the 28th to submit
 
So for the optional essay are people gonna answer it? I feel that I have an experience that is rather unique (lived in a different country for most of my life) but I haven't had any serious obstacles (i.e. disadvantaged). Is it more of an disadvantaged essay?
 
So for the optional essay are people gonna answer it? I feel that I have an experience that is rather unique (lived in a different country for most of my life) but I haven't had any serious obstacles (i.e. disadvantaged). Is it more of an disadvantaged essay?

It says experience OR obstacle, so I feel like that would be fine to talk about. Might not necessarily have to be a disadvantaged essay.
 
Just submitted my secondary app. I figured earlier the better. Applying with a 4.0/ 37 stats. Hoping for an interview at least! Good luck everyone!
 
Just submitted my secondary app. I figured earlier the better. Applying with a 4.0/ 37 stats. Hoping for an interview at least! Good luck everyone!

I think you'll be taking my interview spot haha; sGPA 3.3, cGPA 3.3, gradGPA 3.85, 30S, nontrad.
 
Does anyone know if there is a way to view and print the entire supplementary app (to proofread it) before submitting? Thanks!
 
When creating a login account what did you guys put for "Indicate below the address where you will be residing during the current academic year." ?

Did you list where you WILL be in the Fall semester or where you are right now?

I am home right now but will be going to school in a different state in the Fall.
 
When creating a login account what did you guys put for "Indicate below the address where you will be residing during the current academic year." ?

Did you list where you WILL be in the Fall semester or where you are right now?

I am home right now but will be going to school in a different state in the Fall.

I just listed my home address. Figured it was easier that way and my parents will tell me if I get anything.
 
Just submitted my secondary app. I figured earlier the better. Applying with a 4.0/ 37 stats. Hoping for an interview at least! Good luck everyone!

Haha that's actually really freaky considering my situation is pretty much exactly the same as urs (0.04 off ur 4.0 :p). Canadian applicant here too, though I go to WashU, so we get a slight advantage (a.k.a. guaranteed interview :))

Good luck in the app process!
 
When creating a login account what did you guys put for "Indicate below the address where you will be residing during the current academic year." ?

Did you list where you WILL be in the Fall semester or where you are right now?

I am home right now but will be going to school in a different state in the Fall.

I believe you can update the information if your address changes either directly through the portal or indirectly by emailing admissions.

If it's any help, I only recall receiving two mailings from Washington in the fall - a general packet of information on the program ~July/August and then my acceptance letter in November/December. Quite a few more came in the spring/summer.
 
Secondary is officially out now - got the email while in the weight room. Guess that means I'm safe to submit.
 
Secondary is officially out now - got the email while in the weight room. Guess that means I'm safe to submit.

Probably. I got one too but I haven't been verified yet and probably won't be for a few weeks. I'm guessing I should wait until after I'm verified to submit mine?

Also are you guys doing the optional essay? I don't really have any unique experiences I don't walk about in my PS and I don't want to waste their time with something that is probably meaningless.
 
Secondary is officially out now - got the email while in the weight room. Guess that means I'm safe to submit.

Same :) saw it after leaving Monster University (which by the way was GREAT). More writing for the weekend!
 
Probably. I got one too but I haven't been verified yet and probably won't be for a few weeks. I'm guessing I should wait until after I'm verified to submit mine?

Also are you guys doing the optional essay? I don't really have any unique experiences I don't walk about in my PS and I don't want to waste their time with something that is probably meaningless.

You're probably safe if you do want to submit it. It seems like they have a checklist of things they need before they look at your app, so you'll just be missing a verified primary for a while. Also, I skipped the optional essay.

Same :) saw it after leaving Monster University (which by the way was GREAT). More writing for the weekend!

Totally want to see that! Today has been about 90% essay writing (and SDNing, of course), but I'm making progress, which is great.
 
So I got an email from WashU for a the supplemental application but I have not even started the verification process yet. However, I think WashU does know my MCAT score because they sent me one of those pamphlets through mail. Anyone else in a similar situation?
 
So I got an email from WashU for a the supplemental application but I have not even started the verification process yet. However, I think WashU does know my MCAT score because they sent me one of those pamphlets through mail. Anyone else in a similar situation?

I submitted on the 19th but I haven't been verified yet (and won't be fore a while) and they sent me a secondary this afternoon. You got a pamphlet in the mail! Jealous! :thumbup: Why didn't I get one? :(
 
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I saw your mdapplicants profile and you have crazy stats! I don't really know how they pick who to send the pamplets to.
 
So I got an email from WashU for a the supplemental application but I have not even started the verification process yet. However, I think WashU does know my MCAT score because they sent me one of those pamphlets through mail. Anyone else in a similar situation?

Are you talking about the SOM brochure and letter thing they sent? I got it after getting my MCAT back but that was months ago so I'm not sure if it's the same thing. Re: the secondary email, it seems that some schools are sending secondaries to unverified applicants so I think you'd be safe filling it out.
 
I have been teaching in Africa for the last couple years and I have had a hell of an experience doing it. I touched on this in my PS, but not much. I want to use this for the secondary essay. How does it sound?
 
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