Articles I read tend to leave the profession of pharmacy in question

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PrincessSnow

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Article I have been reading makes it seems as though the future role of pharmacist is really unknown and that pharmacist are going to be competing with nurses for jobs. I am both a pharmacist and a nurse. The pharmacy students coming through my workplace are saying that pharmacist "nitch" is medication reconciliation and to advocate for pharmacist to be paid for patient counseling. The place I work is probably 10 years behind the times and I was hoping to get insight on what roles the pharmacist does at the places where everyone works currently and what is "clinical" at the place where you work. Are all the pharmacists where you work required to be board certified to work in a hospital? Are staff pharmacist being replaced with automation and pharmacy technicians? As a nurse I was the one who did medication rec and patient discharge (This could also be done by a LPN instead of a RN and med history can even be done by a pharmacy tech as well) but it appears that I am not qualified to do med rec and patient discharge as a pharmacist unless I am board certified even though I could do this job as a nurse. I will see if I can attach some links to this for all to read and opinions. It also seems that in the USA we are going toward a value based team based care model more like other countries. Canada pharmacist can you give any opinions on this model with accountable care organizations and patient centered medical homes and how this affected the profession of pharmacy in your country with pharmacy techs taking on more roles. In other countries like England the pharmacy tech do medication passes instead of the nurses and well and antibiotic stewardship, coumadin dosing, therapeutic interchanges and other roles that was originally done by pharmacist. How has the pharmacist in primary care model taken off in other areas of the USA? Also in places where other pharmacist work are you seeing more LPN's being hired to use less RN's? California pharmacist are you prescribing based off a diagnosis from a provider for all diagnosis?

Walgreens Doubles Down on Care Team Integration
The future of post-pandemic pharmacy operations — 5 Qs with CPS' COO
PAI 2030 Focused Initiatives

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Competing with nurses? I wish. Pharmacists are going to be competing with machines/software. There just isn't that much we do that won't be automated in the not distant future. Sure pharmacists are better at med rec than nurses (and nurses are better than less skilled intake persons), but the whole process is only necessary because the current record keeping technology is so poor (even in countries with health systems less fragmented than the US). I predict we'll be somewhat necessary for the next decade. I don't expect this profession to exist as we know it in 20 years.
 
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two more articles. Do you think provider status will happen by 2026 as predicted?
I started pharmacy school in 2009. Back then my professors were telling us about how provider status would revolutionize the profession. I'm pretty sure people on this very board back then told me about how their professors said the same thing in 2002.
 
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Look - we just need to honestly see, understand, and internalize the writing on the wall.

The wall I’m looking at says, “the party is over, pack up and go home”. So - honestly, it’s not really all that abstract.

However, the packing up process takes some time and those of us still clinging onto a job worth keeping are keeping it until the wheels fall off. I would speculate that in about 15 years we will no longer be holders of a skill that is in any sort of demand anymore and the jobs will likely net you a very low end middle class income.

I’m sick of the debate - the conjecture - and the rationalization. 80% of pharmacy is no longer a reasonable career anymore. This is the bottle line and it will not change. I do not need any articles to help me predict. All I really need to see is how the public perceives us and how valued the skill is that we offer. And unfortunately, the public in large has decided to view our skill as “super cool but not something I would pay for”.

And no - the opportunities are not doublin’
 
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Article I have been reading makes it seems as though the future role of pharmacist is really unknown and that pharmacist are going to be competing with nurses for jobs. I am both a pharmacist and a nurse. The pharmacy students coming through my workplace are saying that pharmacist "nitch" is medication reconciliation and to advocate for pharmacist to be paid for patient counseling. The place I work is probably 10 years behind the times and I was hoping to get insight on what roles the pharmacist does at the places where everyone works currently and what is "clinical" at the place where you work. Are all the pharmacists where you work required to be board certified to work in a hospital? Are staff pharmacist being replaced with automation and pharmacy technicians? As a nurse I was the one who did medication rec and patient discharge (This could also be done by a LPN instead of a RN and med history can even be done by a pharmacy tech as well) but it appears that I am not qualified to do med rec and patient discharge as a pharmacist unless I am board certified even though I could do this job as a nurse. I will see if I can attach some links to this for all to read and opinions. It also seems that in the USA we are going toward a value based team based care model more like other countries. Canada pharmacist can you give any opinions on this model with accountable care organizations and patient centered medical homes and how this affected the profession of pharmacy in your country with pharmacy techs taking on more roles. In other countries like England the pharmacy tech do medication passes instead of the nurses and well and antibiotic stewardship, coumadin dosing, therapeutic interchanges and other roles that was originally done by pharmacist. How has the pharmacist in primary care model taken off in other areas of the USA? Also in places where other pharmacist work are you seeing more LPN's being hired to use less RN's? California pharmacist are you prescribing based off a diagnosis from a provider for all diagnosis?

Walgreens Doubles Down on Care Team Integration
The future of post-pandemic pharmacy operations — 5 Qs with CPS' COO
PAI 2030 Focused Initiatives

Nurses and LPNs are definitely not qualified to do med rec. They don't know **** about drugs.
 
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two more articles. Do you think provider status will happen by 2026 as predicted?
It’s been happening for the past 25 years. Even if it it does, pharmacists will work for the same wages and won’t be compensared more. Don’t like it? There’s 15,000 others in line needing to pay their loans they can pick out of a hat.

Too much more to go into detail. But what do you expect, it is the worst projected profession and constantly ranked last in healthcare. Schools now teach suicide prevention in the curriculum for a reason. Applications have decreased from 73k to 39k from 2017-2021, still 15,000 students being pushed out by the schools with a 90% acceptance rate. No bachelors, no PCAT, just a loan and a pulse. 150-200k debt and 6-10 years of schooling to make 75-80k as a new grad. You can imagine what type the ones taking up the schools on this crossroads deal are like. Do you truly expect more given this? It’s not news, it’s been happening for at least 6+ years but everyone thought it’s just “haters” and that opportunities are doubling (lol), now they realized they’ve ruined their life, have 150-200k debt with 6-10 years of opprtunity cost in the worst ranked and projected profession, while their friends are making 100-150k with their 2/4 year degrees or trade school.
 
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I started pharmacy school in 2009. Back then my professors were telling us about how provider status would revolutionize the profession. I'm pretty sure people on this very board back then told me about how their professors said the same thing in 2002.

Not in my case. I got the professor who told us the story about how pharmacy leadership refused provider status as it was not financially correctr and that you make your money now and get out before those Minnesotan idiots get us all overworked and underpaid.

And Op, do you actually practice at all in either? It should be self-evident on the problems of both of them (nursing has physical demands as well as regulatory risk that pharmacy just doesn't, pharmacy has always had issues with piecework in the distributive function).
 
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Don’t choose the harder path. If you want to become a clinician, then become a nurse practitioner if you don’t have the grades or time for med school. You will have the authority to write prescriptions and to see patients. Don’t waste your time in pharmacy school.
although I agree you shouldn't waste time or money on pharmacy school- NP's are getting saturated, I personally work with two that graduated and can't find jobs and went back to their old RN position.
 
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I have been working at a hospital as a staff pharmacist. I have not worked in nursing in several years but still have my license. I knew that many things were not seeming right when we had a student about 3 years ago talking to someone else and I over heard them saying that the pharmacy school was freaking out. I thought this does not sound good then I did my research and found out about how in Idaho the pharmacy techs can take phone scripts and transfers, give vaccines (everywhere now), discuss issues with providers, do product verification. Also I saw online where Texas was pushing for this as well as well as as not pharmacist to tech ratio. I heard management a few years ago telling students that "pharmacist did not prove their worth" and I heard management talking with each other about how they went into the wrong profession. They keep asking me if I want to go back into nursing. I applied for some PRN nursing work when they were doing $80.00/hr but only if you are contract temp worker. PRN not contract pay was about $22.00/ hr from talking to HR. Not so good around here, No wonder all the nurses are leaving and traveling. I received my Board of Nursing quarterly newsletter in the mail yesterday and it talks about NEXT generation state boards for nursing kind of like they are doing in pharmacy. Following the money of what the government is paying for population heath, chronic disease state management, prevention services. They are only wanting to hire 20 year olds for these "new jobs". Management told me that she will only need 2 pharmacists for the whole pharmacy over time (we usually have about 120 patients in house) and that all the other jobs will be "clinical". I see the VA has all sorts of clinical pharmacist jobs posted. Management says if we want to have a chance of having a job at all we have to be board certified. (think the ACO and PCMH requires this). I was thinking about getting maybe a nursing certification instead of pharmacy with the ways things are going. Appears that the VA pays nurses based on an education scale and I have multiple degrees so this may be a good future option for someone like me. I think that pharmacist may compete with nurses for some jobs like the article I posted about pharmacist-physician collaboration mentions in the article from Drug topics I think (see above) because both pharmacist and nurses are "incident to billing" as clinical staff in the primary care offices. We can bill the same.



 
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