Class of 2020 Applicants

[SummerTheLynx]

Penn, Ohio state, Kansas, and Wisconsin.

Two things. If cost is an issue to you, why r u applying to Kansas over Missouri? Not saying that Kansas is t a great school, bc I absolutely love the faculty that was there when my sister went, and think it's a phenomenal school...it's just soooo expensive compared to other vet schools. Also, just want to give you a heads up that Wisconsin is currently raising it's tuition 5 thousand dollars each year for the next 3 years (4 if you include this upcoming year), so your money calculation may be a bit off unfortunately if you were applying to it for it's inexpensive nature (that's why I applied to it and was very disappointed by this)

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[wheelin2vetmed]

Thanks everyone, I'm steering towards including it because my experience hours will be quite a bit less than other applicants. I did mention the experiences in my personal statement as well.

Last two questions:

1. For hobbies and extracurriculars that began prior to high school and continue until present day, should I mention those early start dates? For me, I began playing competitive club soccer very young and continued that through high school, and started playing music very young as well and am still a musician.

2. In 2013 I received a full-on, badass service dog. I will include the intensive training where I lived at the center for 2 weeks as animal experience, but can I include time spent maintaining training and caring for this animal as more experience? I follow protocol from the service dog organization and do a lot more than the average person does with a standard pet dog, but I don't know if schools will frown upon that and consider it application filler.

By the way, I'm applying to Davis, Cornell, Colorado, Tufts, and Royal College. I'm the dude in the wheelchair from the other thread.

 

[WildZoo]

Two things. If cost is an issue to you, why r u applying to Kansas over Missouri? Not saying that Kansas is t a great school, bc I absolutely love the faculty that was there when my sister went, and think it's a phenomenal school...it's just soooo expensive compared to other vet schools. Also, just want to give you a heads up that Wisconsin is currently raising it's tuition 5 thousand dollars each year for the next 3 years (4 if you include this upcoming year), so your money calculation may be a bit off unfortunately if you were applying to it for it's inexpensive nature (that's why I applied to it and was very disappointed by this)

You stole my comment

 

[LadyOtheFarm]

Thanks everyone, I'm steering towards including it because my experience hours will be quite a bit less than other applicants. I did mention the experiences in my personal statement as well.

Last two questions:

1. For hobbies and extracurriculars that began prior to high school and continue until present day, should I mention those early start dates? For me, I began playing competitive club soccer very young and continued that through high school, and started playing music very young as well and am still a musician.

2. In 2013 I received a full-on, badass service dog. I will include the intensive training where I lived at the center for 2 weeks as animal experience, but can I include time spent maintaining training and caring for this animal as more experience? I follow protocol from the service dog organization and do a lot more than the average person does with a standard pet dog, but I don't know if schools will frown upon that and consider it application filler.

By the way, I'm applying to Davis, Cornell, Colorado, Tufts, and Royal College. I'm the dude in the wheelchair from the other thread.

CSU said to include any training you personally do. I asked because I trained a therapy dog and owned him for 11 years. I never got him certified (lady in my area was a jerk and said she'd only certify him if I sold him to her) but he was used at elderly homes and with autistic kids. She said don't count the every day stuff, but if you did it, list it. But explain what hours you are counting so they don't assume it's just "hours of owning a dog."

 

[LadyOtheFarm]

List them all
From the instructions:

In this section, you are to enter information concerning all tests you have taken. Add one entry for each time you’ve taken each specific test.

• GRE: General Test (V,Q, W) is the test given between April 2002 and July 2011. The Revised General Test (V,Q,W) is the test offered as of August 2011.
• IELTS
• MCAT
• TOEFL

Sorry, reading through the whole forum and plucked this from awhile ago:
What about tests that were over 5 years old? My first GRE was in 2006. ETS doesn't have a record of it anymore so they can't send the scores... It would show my consistency in score despite a gap and taking both tests with little forewarning and under very stressful circumstances (My daughter had heart surgery 2 days prior to the most recent test). But since I can't verify it, should I put it on my application?

 

[Tonkspaws]

I would definitely list it as employment because thats what it is.

I thought that if it was employment with animal/vet experience we list it as that

 

[PittPreVet]

Two things. If cost is an issue to you, why r u applying to Kansas over Missouri? Not saying that Kansas is t a great school, bc I absolutely love the faculty that was there when my sister went, and think it's a phenomenal school...it's just soooo expensive compared to other vet schools. Also, just want to give you a heads up that Wisconsin is currently raising it's tuition 5 thousand dollars each year for the next 3 years (4 if you include this upcoming year), so your money calculation may be a bit off unfortunately if you were applying to it for it's inexpensive nature (that's why I applied to it and was very disappointed by this)

Do you find this stuff on each school's website? And I'm not applying to Missouri because I might be missing a prereq like animal nutrition and I just didn't have an interest in Missouri...

 

[PittPreVet]

So from what I'm gathering... You're supposed to put all sorts of stuff in your experiences section dating back to high school? Or when should I stop? I just had my ten animal/vet experiences there as of right now.

 

[WildZoo]

Sorry, reading through the whole forum and plucked this from awhile ago:
What about tests that were over 5 years old? My first GRE was in 2006. ETS doesn't have a record of it anymore so they can't send the scores... It would show my consistency in score despite a gap and taking both tests with little forewarning and under very stressful circumstances (My daughter had heart surgery 2 days prior to the most recent test). But since I can't verify it, should I put it on my application?

You still enter those scores even if they aren't the ones you'll be sending.

 

[deleted676737]

Are you applying as an IS? If so do you know your score? Your score can be a good indicator for how you do in the application process (the score you get is out of 40, the other 60 points comes from the interview/experience). I could be wrong on this, but if I recall, most if not all mizzou IS students that have all required prereqs get interviews, which is definitely nice.

Best of luck. I hope to see you next year! if you have any questions, don't hesitate to ask, although until I start classes, I will be much more helpful with application process questions then actual school questions

Yes, I've calculated my academic score ahead of time, and it is quite a bit below the average (which I believe is in the 20s), mostly due to the fact that I receive very few points for cumulative GPA and that is what comprises the largest fraction of it... it's just over 3.2.

That is one of the nice things about being IS, though, I suppose. Knowing that an interview is guaranteed so I at least have a shot to try to rock the interview and make up for a paltry objective score. I have a decent amount of vet experience (~1200 hrs) split up in multiple areas (SA, SA holistic/alternative, zoo, avian, and soon some equine as well). So I think I am at least okay on that front...? The only "major" area I am lacking in is LA which I have had a heck of a time finding; the few vets I have found seem to cite liability concerns and say no. But I do know people have gotten in without LA so long as they show variety in other ways. I also have research experience with two projects, so I'm hoping that helps.

I guess I'm just very nervous about the way they calculate that academic score. I know it's not even really half of the application, but at 40%, it is pretty dang close and definitely has the potential to really affect decisions, I'd imagine. I do kinda wish Mizzou would at least consider pre-req/science GPA, because my poor grades aren't in pre-reqs or sciences, but rather classes I took my first year and a half of undergrad when I was pursuing a different career - classes that I thought wouldn't be worth the time and money to retake. Meh. It is what it is. Hopefully the IS pool isn't too competitive this year.

Thanks for the well wishes! I've been to Mizzou many times before; it is a fantastic school and I would love to be there! I guess I will just have to wait and see!

 

[heyyimhayley]

Sorry guys its stupid question day for me.... But is there any way VMCAS could tell if you were missing a transcript if you didn't list it as an institution attended and credit did not show up on any other transcripts from other institutions?

EDIT: I think you all are misunderstanding my intentions here.

 

[LuckySpartan]

Sorry guys its stupid question day for me.... But is there any way VMCAS could tell if you were missing a transcript if you didn't list it as an institution attended and credit did not show up on any other transcripts from other institutions?

Doubtful. But if you did attend an institution and you omitted the information on your application... ethically, it would be dishonest.

 

[LuckySpartan]

I thought that if it was employment with animal/vet experience we list it as that

In my opinion and from what I have gathered.... If your direct supervisor is a vet not a office manager.... then it would be veterinary experience. If it is an office manager supervising you and you are receiving compensation for your work... then its employment In my opinion that is.

 

[WildZoo]

In my opinion and from what I have gathered.... If your direct supervisor is a vet not a office manager.... then it would be veterinary experience. If it is an office manager supervising you and you are receiving compensation for your work... then its employment In my opinion that is.

I would disagree to an extent. In many vet clinics the office manager is your direct boss, even if you're working as a tech or volunteering. The office manager is usually the one who hired you, determines your hours, gives you your paycheck...and the vet isn't always standing over your shoulder.

I would consider reception work (talking with clients, setting up appointments, being the first person to gather information about the patient) an important part of a veterinary practice, and while your direct boss may be the office manager, you are still working in an animal setting at the very least, and to the extent that you are carrying out the tasks of your job for the vets, you are also getting veterinary experience.

 

[DVMDream]

In my opinion and from what I have gathered.... If your direct supervisor is a vet not a office manager.... then it would be veterinary experience. If it is an office manager supervising you and you are receiving compensation for your work... then its employment In my opinion that is.

Meh. My direct supervisor as a vet tech was an office manager simply because that is the way that most veterinary clinics work. I would still list any work where you are in close contact with or ever directly communicating with a veterinarian as veterinary experience, even working as a receptionist, you have enough exposure to the veterinary profession and the veterinarians that I believe it definitely qualifies as vet experience.

 

[LuckySpartan]

I would disagree to an extent. In many vet clinics the office manager is your direct boss, even if you're working as a tech or volunteering. The office manager is usually the one who hired you, determines your hours, gives you your paycheck...and the vet isn't always standing over your shoulder.

I would consider reception work (talking with clients, setting up appointments, being the first person to gather information about the patient) an important part of a veterinary practice, and while your direct boss may be the office manager, you are still working in an animal setting at the very least, and to the extent that you are carrying out the tasks of your job for the vets, you are also getting veterinary experience.

There are so many grey areas... I agree as well with this perspective. I think in your best interest.... You should contact the VMCAS and ask or ask your 1st choice school. I doubt you would be wrong either way you classify it.

 

[finnickthedog]

In my opinion, since it says that veterinary experience is work supervised by a veterinarian... I would say it depends on whether you are going to put a vet down as your supervisor on the app. If you put someone else as your supervisor it doesn't seem to go along with the description.

But I may just be too literal.

 

[DVMDream]

In my opinion, since it says that veterinary experience is work supervised by a veterinarian... I would say it depends on whether you are going to put a vet down as your supervisor on the app. If you put someone else as your supervisor it doesn't seem to go along with the description.

But I may just be too literal.

This would mean that the vast majority of veterinary technicians wouldn't even have veterinary experience, which is just ridiculous.

I think it comes down to a bit of common sense: Have you been working a veterinary setting learning about the veterinary profession in some way, shape or form? Is there a veterinarian on site that you have direct contact with at times? If yes, then it is veterinary experience.

 

[StartingoverVet]

Old guy time again.....

It seems like the class of 2020 has a bad case of "how should I ......." On VMCAS.

For the overwhelming majority of these questions, the answer is you can do whatever you want, just make sure it is a reasonable interpretation of the rule.

Most importantly, remember this is a marketing document essentially, selling yourself. List things in a way that makes you look the best. If you do something ridiculous, you will look ridiculous. If you have work experience from the womb, list it if it makes you look good. If you worked for Michael Vicks dog training outfit....don't list it,,,etc etc.

There is no 100% right way to do this....(although there are some wrong ways)...

<end old guy giving advice post>

 

[clairebear210]

I hope this hasn't been asked already, but I couldn't find it in the search anywhere. I will be applying this year, and I was wondering if it would be overkill to ask two vets from the same practice for letters? They hardly ever are there at the same time, and I assist one in surgery and one solely in appointments.

 

[WildZoo]

I hope this hasn't been asked already, but I couldn't find it in the search anywhere. I will be applying this year, and I was wondering if it would be overkill to ask two vets from the same practice for letters? They hardly ever are there at the same time, and I assist one in surgery and one solely in appointments.

Doesn't sound like overkill to me, especially if they can talk about different parts of your skill set, experiences, etc.

 

[wheelin2vetmed]

Do you find this stuff on each school's website? And I'm not applying to Missouri because I might be missing a prereq like animal nutrition and I just didn't have an interest in Missouri...

I'm a Nutrition/Biochem student and don't have Animal Nutrition or Public Speaking prereqs, so there's a few schools I can't apply to; oh well.

 

[LetItSnow]

Old guy time again.....

It seems like the class of 2020 has a bad case of "how should I ......." On VMCAS.

For the overwhelming majority of these questions, the answer is you can do whatever you want, just make sure it is a reasonable interpretation of the rule.

Most importantly, remember this is a marketing document essentially, selling yourself. List things in a way that makes you look the best. If you do something ridiculous, you will look ridiculous. If you have work experience from the womb, list it if it makes you look good. If you worked for Michael Vicks dog training outfit....don't list it,,,etc etc.

There is no 100% right way to do this....(although there are some wrong ways)...

<end old guy giving advice post>

Best advice ever.

Every year I get amused at how bent out of shape we all get (don't worry, I'm not mocking.... we all did when I went through, too) about how to categorize stuff. It's like there's this deep-seated fear that if it isn't absolutely 100% perfect the application will get thrown out.

Categorize as makes the best sense. VMCAS rules are there to help you. If you inadvertently put something in a category that a school thinks makes more sense elsewhere, they'll just view it as such. They won't count it against you unless you're obviously trying to mislead them or adding in clearly inappropriate stuff. Just do your best to put things in the category that makes the most sense.

 

[Cephal0pod]

Old guy time again.....

It seems like the class of 2020 has a bad case of "how should I ......." On VMCAS.

For the overwhelming majority of these questions, the answer is you can do whatever you want, just make sure it is a reasonable interpretation of the rule.

Most importantly, remember this is a marketing document essentially, selling yourself. List things in a way that makes you look the best. If you do something ridiculous, you will look ridiculous. If you have work experience from the womb, list it if it makes you look good. If you worked for Michael Vicks dog training outfit....don't list it,,,etc etc.

There is no 100% right way to do this....(although there are some wrong ways)...

<end old guy giving advice post>

Best advice ever.

Every year I get amused at how bent out of shape we all get (don't worry, I'm not mocking.... we all did when I went through, too) about how to categorize stuff. It's like there's this deep-seated fear that if it isn't absolutely 100% perfect the application will get thrown out.

Categorize as makes the best sense. VMCAS rules are there to help you. If you inadvertently put something in a category that a school thinks makes more sense elsewhere, they'll just view it as such. They won't count it against you unless you're obviously trying to mislead them or adding in clearly inappropriate stuff. Just do your best to put things in the category that makes the most sense.

Guilty as charged.

Thank you both-- you said quite a few things that I needed to hear.

 

[SummerTheLynx]

Do you find this stuff on each school's website? And I'm not applying to Missouri because I might be missing a prereq like animal nutrition and I just didn't have an interest in Missouri...

It varies. I would just ask on the specific pages for each school, and a current student can usually give you the current scoop

 

[missdarjeeling]

Question for all those non traditional-second career folks... How far back did you go for your employment/volunteer/ animal experience (not veterinary)?

Im 30 and graduated college in 2008. I feel as though my undergrad employment isn't relevant since I worked professionally for 7 years. Opinions please

I'm class of '08, too!

I've included everything going back to high school. That's what the admissions people I talked to at two schools said to do.

 

[zinhle]

Hey guys, I have a question regarding experience: How should I enter all the volunteer work done through the Pre Vet club at my school? we did volunteer work at different organizations for about 5 hours each time. As an officer I had to attend quite a lot of those... so it seems ridiculous to make a single entry for each, yet they are very varied, some with primates or wildlife, others with horses etc. should I just make an entry listing the pre vet club as the "organization" and then just list the places in the description section? or make an entry for each single thing?? thanks !!!

 

[thelemonzest]

Sorry guys its stupid question day for me.... But is there any way VMCAS could tell if you were missing a transcript if you didn't list it as an institution attended and credit did not show up on any other transcripts from other institutions?

So I used to temp as a transcript verifier for the company partnering with VMCAS - the short answer is no, unless it appeared in any form on any other transcript. So yeah it's not hard to do if you are certain it doesn't show up anywhere else, but ethically, probably not the best idea.

 

[Caiter92]

Sorry guys its stupid question day for me.... But is there any way VMCAS could tell if you were missing a transcript if you didn't list it as an institution attended and credit did not show up on any other transcripts from other institutions?

Even if VCMAS can't, wouldn't schools be able to because they'll have your SSN?

And if they find out you purposefully omitted info (I'm assuming this is because of grades?), that's not exactly going to put you in a positive light.

 

[Minnerbelle]

Hey guys, I have a question regarding experience: How should I enter all the volunteer work done through the Pre Vet club at my school? we did volunteer work at different organizations for about 5 hours each time. As an officer I had to attend quite a lot of those... so it seems ridiculous to make a single entry for each, yet they are very varied, some with primates or wildlife, others with horses etc. should I just make an entry listing the pre vet club as the "organization" and then just list the places in the description section? or make an entry for each single thing?? thanks !!!

I would just list it as a single entry, and put the deetz in the description with a breakdown of hours.

I did that for all the little on-campus jobs I had.

 

[LadyOtheFarm]

This is what I've been looking for:

www.aavmc.org/data/files/vmcas/geninfo.pdf

I hope it helps for anybody looking at the cost/ class size/ IS-OOS ratio etc for decision making.

 

[battie]

Started scrolling through here to get a feel for what you're all talking about.
Am I crazy for applying to 3+ schools? Lots of you are dead set on 1,(IMO) and that just seems too scary for me. Second, how's everyone prepared for GRE? I still need to schedule it. I feel like I'll kill the quant and suck on the verbal and writing, just usually my style.

I'm one of those applying to 8 schools. My first application cycle, I applied to 5, waitlisted at 1. My second cycle, I applied to 2, "waitlisted to waitlisted" at the same one. This one is distinctly my last go around, depending on what happens. So I knew I was applying to my in state, the school that has waitlisted me, and then the schools I have the best chance at. I researched each school starting with prerequisites, and then went onto the schools where I had the best chance of getting in. I was originally only going to do 7, but i decided it was worth it to try for the school that i was on the fence about.

 

[wheelin2vetmed]

This is what I've been looking for:

www.aavmc.org/data/files/vmcas/geninfo.pdf

I hope it helps for anybody looking at the cost/ class size/ IS-OOS ratio etc for decision making.

Vet school is expensive. I'm at the University of Arizona right now, and last September I was asked to speak at the Board of Regents meeting where they ended up approving the UA Vet School. At this point, they're waiting for the AVMA accreditation walk which, I believe, takes place in January 2016. If everything's approved, the first class will start Fall 2016. I have no idea how the application cycle will work, but it will be very fast.

The key selling point is cost. From what I've heard, the entire program will cost ~$110,000 over 4 years. I would rather stay here and spend considerably less money, and also don't really care that I'll be the part of a school's inaugural class (I'm all for it, really). It will be SO MUCH CHEAPER!

 

[DVMDream]

Vet school is expensive. I'm at the University of Arizona right now, and last September I was asked to speak at the Board of Regents meeting where they ended up approving the UA Vet School. At this point, they're waiting for the AVMA accreditation walk which, I believe, takes place in January 2016. If everything's approved, the first class will start Fall 2016. I have no idea how the application cycle will work, but it will be very fast.

The key selling point is cost. From what I've heard, the entire program will cost ~$110,000 over 4 years. I would rather stay here and spend considerably less money, and also don't really care that I'll be the part of a school's inaugural class (I'm all for it, really). It will be SO MUCH CHEAPER!

I am cringing so hard right now. I would seriously reconsider your thoughts on being a part of an inaugural class because of words and things I have heard within the veterinary community. Just a word of advice/caution.

 

[WildZoo]

Didn't realize UA was so close to getting accredited and everything. Sigh.

 

[wheelin2vetmed]

I am cringing so hard right now. I would seriously reconsider your thoughts on being a part of an inaugural class because of words and things I have heard within the veterinary community. Just a word of advice/caution.

Can you elaborate?

 

[DVMDream]

Can you elaborate?

-Nobody knows how these graduates will turn out, you are a guinea pig, when faced with who to hire.. the guinea pig from the new university or the grad from an established school you are at a disadvantage.

-There are still many minds that don't feel teaching for a couple years at one school to ship students off to other schools and locations for clinics is a good thing. They actually strongly disagree with it. There is a negative stigma on those students. UA will not be building a veterinary clinic (as far as their current plan) they will be shipping students out to other locations for clinics.

Those are just two, but the judgement against students from new schools is definitely out there and a very distinct disadvantage. Up to you whether you want to risk that or not, but I personally would not risk it hearing the things I have heard recently.




I could get into the crap about how absolutely unbelievably stupid it is for universities to keep opening up vet schools for no reason other than $$$$$$$$$$$$, but that isn't the point.

 

[wheelin2vetmed]

-Nobody knows how these graduates will turn out, you are a guinea pig, when faced with who to hire.. the guinea pig from the new university or the grad from an established school you are at a disadvantage.

-There are still many minds that don't feel teaching for a couple years at one school to ship students off to other schools and locations for clinics is a good thing. They actually strongly disagree with it. There is a negative stigma on those students. UA will not be building a veterinary clinic (as far as their current plan) they will be shipping students out to other locations for clinics.

Those are just two, but the judgement against students from new schools is definitely out there and a very distinct disadvantage. Up to you whether you want to risk that or not, but I personally would not risk it hearing the things I have heard recently.




I could get into the crap about how absolutely unbelievably stupid it is for universities to keep opening up vet schools for no reason other than $$$$$$$$$$$$, but that isn't the point.

I do see your points, and they mirror some from others I talked to. But, with that said, isn't anything new and different seemingly up against pushback and possibly disadvantaged at first? Arizona's model could be touted as the next best thing since sliced bread in a few years. Not to say it will, but it could be great.

From what I've heard (and it's not like I know a lot), not building a teaching college and utilizing the current medical school, farms, and local clinics saves a whole lot of money, hence one of the reasons why it'll be that much cheaper. When I was at the Regents meeting, a lot of older vets, farmers, and industry folk begged the board to approve the vet school. There's a big shortage of veterinarians, especially large animal, in Arizona. So I don't know if it's just about the money, but I'm sure part of it is.

It's a decision I'll make early next year, if the AVMA accredits UA. I'm still applying this VMCAS cycle anyways, and I may choose not to attend UA if given the opportunity.

 

[DVMDream]

I do see your points, and they mirror some from others I talked to. But, with that said, isn't anything new and different seemingly up against pushback and possibly disadvantaged at first? Arizona's model could be touted as the next best thing since sliced bread in a few years. Not to say it will, but it could be great.

From what I've heard (and it's not like I know a lot), not building a teaching college and utilizing the current medical school, farms, and local clinics saves a whole lot of money, hence one of the reasons why it'll be that much cheaper. When I was at the Regents meeting, a lot of older vets, farmers, and industry folk begged the board to approve the vet school. There's a big shortage of veterinarians, especially large animal, in Arizona. So I don't know if it's just about the money, but I'm sure part of it is.

It's a decision I'll make early next year, if the AVMA accredits UA. I'm still applying this VMCAS cycle anyways, and I may choose not to attend UA if given the opportunity.

This is a large crock of BS they keep feeding people to get approval for these schools that are not needed. There is NO shortage of large animal vets anywhere. There is a shortage of money needed to support large animal vets in these small areas. Think about what that means in AZ. That means working in some very small town in the middle of nowhere. This means making around 45K per year, if even that. (I am a native Arizonan). There is no way to pay back loans (even 110K) off of that measly of a salary.

It is all BS. It is a lie to keep making these schools in order for the college to bring in $$$. They do not give a rat's ass about any "shortage" of vets, they care about making money. That is it.

And no, shipping off students to local clinics for learning is never going to be looked upon as a good thing. There is no standard for them to maintain, no way to know if their students are learning what they need, getting the skills they need, etc. It is a piss poor way to organize a veterinary program and the only reason they want to create it is to bring in the tuition money. As you stated, they will have to put out very little $ in order to start the vet school and they will bring in a whole lot of money in comparison to what they put out.

 

[StartingoverVet]

And no, shipping off students to local clinics for learning is never going to be looked upon as a good thing. There is no standard for them to maintain, no way to know if their students are learning what they need, getting the skills they need, etc. It is a piss poor way to organize a veterinary program and the only reason they want to create it is to bring in the tuition money. As you stated, they will have to put out very little $ in order to start the vet school and they will bring in a whole lot of money in comparison to what they put out.

Interesting comment from someone who almost went off to Western

I kind of disagree with your general take on this though.
Is there going to be a bit of a stigma? Sure.
My response is: so what.
In the case of 2 people applying for a job, perhaps the one from the more traditional school may get the job. But it is not so certain.

The cheap cost of schooling can very much outweigh the slight disadvantage of being a new class. In fact, you can afford to perhaps take a lower paying job that you prefer because of it. That is a pretty big consideration as well.

As for the sending out to clinics thing, people criticized Western at first, but their graduates got jobs, and there is no sign they are doing any worse than any other vets.

We may not like all the new schools being set up, but the "it doesn't really matter where you go to vet school" was never 100% true, but it hasn't really changed much either. For the most part, it doesn't. Once you get a job, it matters very little, and I do think finances can really affect which jobs you are willing to take.

 

[DVMDream]

Interesting comment from someone who almost went off to Western

I kind of disagree with your general take on this though.
Is there going to be a bit of a stigma? Sure.
My response is: so what.
In the case of 2 people applying for a job, perhaps the one from the more traditional school may get the job. But it is not so certain.

The cheap cost of schooling can very much outweigh the slight disadvantage of being a new class. In fact, you can afford to perhaps take a lower paying job that you prefer because of it. That is a pretty big consideration as well.

As for the sending out to clinics thing, people criticized Western at first, but their graduates got jobs, and there is no sign they are doing any worse than any other vets.

We may not like all the new schools being set up, but the "it doesn't really matter where you go to vet school" was never 100% true, but it hasn't really changed much either. For the most part, it doesn't. Once you get a job, it matters very little, and I do think finances can really affect which jobs you are willing to take.

I never "almost" went off to western.

And there is still stigma out there about western, something that's recently become apparent to me. Whether it is a deserved stigma or not depends on who you talk to.

I've heard a lot of things recently by vets. That's why I posted what I did. You can disagree if you want, but those are some of the opinions out there currently. Do they suck? Of course, but they exist for a reason.

Yes, lower tuition is great but I would highly consider if that matters if the stigma against these schools is what it is.

If I were considering applying for one of these schools, I'd want someone to warn me of the current stigma against them, not someone to go, "meh, it's not a big deal" because it very well could be a big deal.

 

[wheelin2vetmed]

I never "almost" went off to western.

And there is still stigma out there about western, something that's recently become apparent to me. Whether it is a deserved stigma or not depends on who you talk to.

I've heard a lot of things recently by vets. That's why I posted what I did. You can disagree if you want, but those are some of the opinions out there currently. Do they suck? Of course, but they exist for a reason.

Yes, lower tuition is great but I would highly consider if that matters if the stigma against these schools is what it is.

If I were considering applying for one of these schools, I'd want someone to warn me of the current stigma against them, not someone to go, "meh, it's not a big deal" because it very well could be a big deal.

I'll preface this by saying that I do not know enough about the politics of vet school and am not trying to pretend like I do. I have heard, for example, that a stigma exists for vet students that go to the international schools on the islands. Maybe it exists, but students continue to go there, and I have to believe that most leave perfectly qualified for the jobs they land (naive thinking maybe).

I don't think the AVMA just accredits schools willy nilly, and from what I've heard Arizona has been fighting to get a public vet school for quite awhile (Midwestern is private, yes?). At the end of the day, if the curriculum passes and the governing body believes it can fulfill and maintain standards of education, then why should it matter if I'm learning X, Y, and Z from a local veterinarian who's been doing it for years, learned from an AVMA school, and was carefully picked to be a part of this program? From what I've read, those clinics and DVMs involved won't just get a call on Saturday night to let them know they start teaching on Monday morning.

Maybe saving the $140,000 isn't worth it, but maybe this school could be great. Again, I don't know enough, and sorry if I've lead this thread off topic

 

[StartingoverVet]

I never "almost" went off to western.

And there is still stigma out there about western, something that's recently become apparent to me. Whether it is a deserved stigma or not depends on who you talk to.

I've heard a lot of things recently by vets. That's why I posted what I did. You can disagree if you want, but those are some of the opinions out there currently. Do they suck? Of course, but they exist for a reason.

Yes, lower tuition is great but I would highly consider if that matters if the stigma against these schools is what it is.

If I were considering applying for one of these schools, I'd want someone to warn me of the current stigma against them, not someone to go, "meh, it's not a big deal" because it very well could be a big deal.

I agree there is a stigma, I just don't agree that it is having a material impact on the graduates. A little impact? Yes. But it's not like there is an unemployment line for a particular school .

But you will hear negative stuff about any school.
I heard a ton of negative stuff about UCDavis in California.
I heard a lot of negative stuff about the arrogance of Penn grads from many docs.
etc etc.

People have biases. No getting around that.
I just think that most of what will matter in a person's career is the individual and some luck.

and really? If you didn't get off the waitlist you wouldn't have gone?

 

[LetItSnow]

Yes, lower tuition is great

The cheap cost of schooling

I'm only half following this thread, but I'm confused.... the poster said something about the Arizona tuition cost being $110,000 for all four years....

Is that really any cheaper? I mean... if average debt among students who have debt is around $140-$160k ..... then it sounds like Arizona's cost is fairly average by the time you add in cost-of-living. Maybe a bit less, but not like some major paradigm shift.

What am I missing?

 

[PittPreVet]

I'm one of those applying to 8 schools. My first application cycle, I applied to 5, waitlisted at 1. My second cycle, I applied to 2, "waitlisted to waitlisted" at the same one. This one is distinctly my last go around, depending on what happens. So I knew I was applying to my in state, the school that has waitlisted me, and then the schools I have the best chance at. I researched each school starting with prerequisites, and then went onto the schools where I had the best chance of getting in. I was originally only going to do 7, but i decided it was worth it to try for the school that i was on the fence about.

This is my first app cycle and I'm aware vet school is super competitive but I just don't know what I'll do if I don't get in so I feel as if I need 3+ schools being my in state and places where I have a chance...have you considered the Caribbean , or UK? Why do you think you're having trouble?

 

[LetItSnow]

Again, I don't know enough, and sorry if I've lead this thread off topic

Don't apologize. These kinds of topics are super relevant to today's veterinary world. Might as well start talking about them now. Maybe this isn't the <perfect> thread for it, but so what.....

 

[wheelin2vetmed]

I'm only half following this thread, but I'm confused.... the poster said something about the Arizona cost being $110,000 for all four years....

Is that really any cheaper? I mean... if average debt among students who have debt is around $140-$160k ..... then it sounds like Arizona's cost is fairly average by the time you add in cost-of-living. Maybe a bit less, but not like some major paradigm shift.

What am I missing?

Maybe my numbers are wrong, but at the moment Arizonans have to go out of state and pay a lot more, except for a small percentage that get a WICHE spot.

 

[PittPreVet]

Arizona has Midwestern University now but even its accreditation isn't 100% solid yet from what I've read.

 

[LetItSnow]

Maybe my numbers are wrong, but at the moment Arizonans have to go out of state and pay a lot more, except for a small percentage that get a WICHE spot.

Ok. So they meant just from the perspective of Arizonans. Got it. That makes sense.

It's kinda dejecting to hear these same arguments for a new school trotted out, though. (The whole: "We need more rural LA vets!") Some rural LA vet fresh out of school isn't going to make enough to pay off their school debt, even with in-state costs ... which translates to them shifting out of LA medicine and into SA medicine in a more urban/suburban setting ... which translates to more supply of those vets ... which translates to less demand ... which translates to stagnate wages.

The problem is not "supply of vets". It just isn't. If there was truly an economic demand for LA vets then the salaries for LA vets would go up and people would move to Arizona seeking those higher-paying jobs. That's basic economics. People continue to make the mistake of thinking that a lack of LA vets in certain communities means that there's an economic demand for one. People might WANT to have a LA vet in their community (in particular, longtime practitioners who want to sell out their practices because that's what they were counting on for retirement), but if the community can't pay for one then all the wanting in the world doesn't matter.

 

[battie]

This is my first app cycle and I'm aware vet school is super competitive but I just don't know what I'll do if I don't get in so I feel as if I need 3+ schools being my in state and places where I have a chance...have you considered the Caribbean , or UK? Why do you think you're having trouble?

I would start considering back-up plans, honestly. Not saying you won't get in. But relying on this being your only option isn't a solid life choice. It's better to be prepared for the worst.

I have not considered any international schools for several reasons, including long term cost, closeness to family, and others.

I know for a fact I am having trouble due to grades. I have a 3.2/3.3. That's not competitive.