LOW VERBAL SCORE, Chance of Acceptance????!

[mnhockey7]

Hello everyone, I would appreciate serious comments only if possible.

VERBAL SCORE PROBLEM

I recently received my MCAT score back for the second time and scored a 8,4,10 (PS,VR,BS). I am not worried about my sciences scores, but clearly the verbal score is a problem. I am aware that some schools have a cut off and MD schools are completely out of the picture for the most part.

My question is, as are many peoples I assume, is there ANY hope/chance of possible acceptance to DO schools?????? My GPA is a 3.5, I have a fairly extensive resume I would like to think including ER scribing, Cardiovascular Research, volunteering, Mission trips, medical device development, etc...

Of note, I am not going to take the MCAT again, especially the new one as I don't have the endurance and mentality to do so again plain and simple, this is my choice.

Again let me know what you think! Thanks.

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[cabinbuilder]

That verbal is WAY too low. Medicine is 90 % charting, documentation, etc. You need to get that score up. Don't waste your money applying until you do.

 

[mnhockey7]

That verbal is WAY too low. Medicine is 90 % charting, documentation, etc. You need to get that score up. Don't waste your money applying until you do.

I am aware of the charting as I am currently an ER scribe as "documenting and charting" is my job which poses no issue for me what-so-ever. So what you are saying is there is no chance?

 

[sundancing]

It's not just your verbal, though. Your composite is 22 - that's below the acceptable threshold for most schools. Right now you have a shred of a chance of the lowest tier, newest DO schools, but to expect anything better than that you need to retake the MCAT.

 

[Deranged Medic]

I am aware of the charting as I am currently an ER scribe as "documenting and charting" is my job which poses no issue for me what-so-ever. So what you are saying is there is no chance?

Unless you have discovered a cure for cancer, you have literally no shot of an acceptance with a 4 in VR. I had a 7 in VR and was terrified about how low my score was. If you don't retake the MCAT, you might as well start pursuing other career options.

The MCAT sucks—this is true. However, if you really have the passion to become a physician, I would think you would rather embrace the suck than spend the rest of your life not being a physician.

 

[Major]

I am aware of the charting as I am currently an ER scribe as "documenting and charting" is my job which poses no issue for me what-so-ever. So what you are saying is there is no chance?

Making that comment right back to a Physician, who is trying to help you, makes my troll alarm bells start sounding

 

[mnhockey7]

Making that comment right back to a Physician, who is trying to help you, makes my troll alarm bells start sounding

It wasn't meant to be malicious or anything, I was just expanding on what he/she commented on. An actual verbal comment would have sounded better then how it may have been interpreted.

 

[samac]

I am aware of the charting as I am currently an ER scribe as "documenting and charting" is my job which poses no issue for me what-so-ever. So what you are saying is there is no chance?

Yes. There's no chance. Even at the low tier schools that would accept a 22, it is wayyy too low of a sub score. You would be better off with a 7/7/7 and getting a 21. If you have any chance it's the smallest chance in the world. Study and retake.

 

[High_protein_diet]

Making that comment right back to a Physician, who is trying to help you, makes my troll alarm bells start sounding

You have troll alarm bells? I need some of those.

 

[cabinbuilder]

I am aware of the charting as I am currently an ER scribe as "documenting and charting" is my job which poses no issue for me what-so-ever. So what you are saying is there is no chance?

That's not the point. The point is you are expected to have a minimum standard score and a 4 in VR is too low. There's really no question about it. You will have to retake.

 

[Stlblues17]

Of note, I am not going to take the MCAT again, especially the new one as I don't have the endurance and mentality to do so again plain and simple, this is my choice.

This is not compatible with wanting to be a physician. If you won't retake, you really don't want it. And what about the mental strain/endurance of medical school exams, need I mention boards!

Not a snowballs chance in hell if you don't retake. I know the new MCAT sucks, but if you want to be a physician (and not just say you do) retake the test, you can do it.

Wish you the best

 

[mnhockey7]

This is not compatible with wanting to be a physician. If you won't retake, you really don't want it. And what about the mental strain endurance of medical school exam, need I mention boards!

Not a snowballs chance in hell if you don't retake. I know the new MCAT sucks, but if you want to be a physician (and not just say you do) retake the test, you can do it.

Wish you the best

That was my second time taking it of note. But yes, that will be something I have to consider, I was hoping it wouldn't come to that.

 

[Goro]

Concur. Fix the deficit, and then retake.

That verbal is WAY too low. Medicine is 90 % charting, documentation, etc. You need to get that score up. Don't waste your money applying until you do.

 

[j4pac]

Yeah...unless you are getting 12-15 on your science scores...your verbal is going to be your coup-de-grace.

Verbal is the easiest to fix...just get better a better test taking strategy and plow through passages. If you get a 7 on verbal....I think that you can gets some invites with 9+ science scores.

 

[UBC2014]

If you had stronger science scores, I would have said it was more possible but the weak composite doesn't really help. I would prepare for the new test and aim to do much better on your science scores first and foremost. Those will improve with practice. And pray you can get the vr up a few points, but if that doesn't work out at least you would have strong science scores to even it out. Maybe look into DO linkage programs but I think an mcat retake would still be required.

 

[emkayveedee]

Look into buying the Examkrackers verbal reasoning book. They have as solid approach to that section of the test. But I agree with everyone else, a re-take seems inevitable.

 

[mnhockey7]

Look into buying the Examkrackers verbal reasoning book. They have as solid approach to that section of the test. But I agree with everyone else, a re-take seems inevitable.

I used it for the last test.

 

[ortnakas]

Another vote for a re-take. I don't think there's any way around it.

I personally liked the Princeton Review approach to verbal, and the ExamKrackers approach to everything else. Definitely do something new-to-you for your retake studying though.

 

[burntorange]

Something everyone has yet to ask - what was your first MCAT score? Was your verbal higher the first time you took the test? Perhaps the overall composite is higher than the most recent.

 

[mnhockey7]

Something everyone has yet to ask - what was your first MCAT score? Was your verbal higher the first time you took the test? Perhaps the overall composite is higher than the most recent.

It was the second time @burntorange with an abysmal 16 for the first go, verbal being the lowest as you can tell. I struggled with verbal the first time I took the test, and studied for roughly 5 months in between with slight improvement, although I can't seem to get a grip on the verbal. It has always been a struggle through schooling with very dense readings blah blah blah, haha.

 

[MLaura]

It was the second time @burntorange. I struggled with verbal the first time I took the test, and studied for roughly 5 months in between with slight improvement, although I can't seem to get a grip on the verbal. It has always been a struggle through schooling with very dense readings blah blah blah, haha.

The biggest thing with verbal is to complete a lot of practice passages but afterwards, it is extremely important to look at every question afterwards, regardless of whether you got it wrong or right. Once you figure out what kinds of questions you're getting wrong, it gets a little easier to bring up your score.

For example, I think Princeton (maybe some of the other test preps) give a list of the "types" of questions you will receive. So one of the biggest issues I was having was "reference" questions, which are just questions whose answer is literally in the passage. I was being lazy and wasn't looking back at the passage to make sure I had the right answer. Once I figured out what I was doing wrong, I tried to fix that habit of not looking at the passage.

I brought up my score by 5 points just by doing that (not just the reference question, every question I got wrong I looked back to see what I was doing incorrectly). I hope that helps you and good luck!

 

[Deranged Medic]

If you get a 7 on verbal....I think that you can gets some invites with 9+ science scores.

This was pretty much my story, and I did quite well this cycle. I would have felt much more comfortable this cycle had I had an 8 in VR, although one of my friends did get an acceptance to WVSOM this year with a 6.

 

[burntorange]

It was the second time @burntorange with an abysmal 16 for the first go, verbal being the lowest as you can tell. I struggled with verbal the first time I took the test, and studied for roughly 5 months in between with slight improvement, although I can't seem to get a grip on the verbal. It has always been a struggle through schooling with very dense readings blah blah blah, haha.

I felt the same way about verbal. I would get overwhelmed with the passages and let it get to my head - causing me to lose focus and read passages without really ever "reading" them. I just went through the motions even though I was oftentimes lost and clueless as to what the passages talked about. I ended up having to take the MCAT 3 times because of verbal (with one time scoring a 4), but fortunately ended up with a 10 my last go around.

Practice, practice, and more practice on verbal is key. Do it everyday in the morning and at night, do it when you are tired, when you are distracted with noise/other things. Figure out your weak points and hone in on your strengths. I am sure you can manage a 6+ just through that process alone. If you can get a 10 on bio (which is becoming more and more like the verbal section), then you can do that. Just don't get discouraged when you do have a bad day or week with verbal.

 

[TheBoneDoctah]

Take the verbal seriously. I started with 6's and after doing all the EK and TPR passages, I scored a 9 on the real thing.

Honestly, verbal is different for everyone. You either get it or dont. I didn't at all. I would read side by side with my friend who scored a 13 on VR and we would both do they questions together so that I could try to get in his head about how he looked at the passages. When I was done with the reading, I would tell him what I thought the answers were and it was way off from what he thought.

 

[Nesmall2]

Take the verbal seriously. I started with 6's and after doing all the EK and TPR passages, I scored a 9 on the real thing.

Honestly, verbal is different for everyone. You either get it or dont. I didn't at all. I would read side by side with my friend who scored a 13 on VR and we would both do they questions together so that I could try to get in his head about how he looked at the passages. When I was done with the reading, I would tell him what I thought the answers were and it was way off from what he thought.

Pretty much the same story here. I scored a 6 on my MCAT, did all of the Berkelely, ExamKrackers and Princeton while reading the Economist, and was able to improve my score to a 9. Practicing passages is key. Every morning, I would do 3-4 passages in a row, and then I would take a look at the answers and mark which ones were wrong. In the night, I would re-read the previous days passages to see if I was better able to analyze it. Practice is key to improving verbal score

 

[TheBoneDoctah]

Pretty much the same story here. I scored a 6 on my MCAT, did all of the Berkelely, ExamKrackers and Princeton while reading the Economist, and was able to improve my score to a 9. Practicing passages is key. Every morning, I would do 3-4 passages in a row, and then I would take a look at the answers and mark which ones were wrong. In the night, I would re-read the previous days passages to see if I was better able to analyze it. Practice is key to improving verbal score

Agree. You aren't going to jump from a 4 to a 12. But a jump from 4 to 8 or 9 is doable. Anything over 11 I feel is just "feel". I think these testers read a ton and just "get it" if that makes sense. Me, I dont "get it" lol

 

[mnhockey7]

Agree. You aren't going to jump from a 4 to a 12. But a jump from 4 to 8 or 9 is doable. Anything over 11 I feel is just "feel". I think these testers read a ton and just "get it" if that makes sense. Me, I dont "get it" lol

Exactly how I feel!

 

[user3]

That's not the point. The point is you are expected to have a minimum standard score and a 4 in VR is too low. There's really no question about it. You will have to retake.

last year VCOM-CC accepted two people with 4 (24 overall) and 3 vr (22 overall). The person with the 3 also got into ACOM.

However, I would also recommend a retake in order to give OP more flexibility with school choice.

 

[chizledfrmstone]

last year VCOM-CC accepted two people with 4 (24 overall) and 3 vr (22 overall). The person with the 3 also got into ACOM.

However, I would also recommend a retake in order to give OP more flexibility with school choice.

People w/ MCAT around 24 or lower don't exactly do well in Medical School or the boards.

 

[user3]

People w/ MCAT around 24 or lower don't exactly do well in Medical School or the boards.

uh oh...statements like these do not end well.

prepare to be attacked.

 

[biancarubin27]

Eek, lol prepare to be attacked is right. There have been studies disproving that

 

[Drrrrrr. Celty]

Eek, lol prepare to be attacked is right. There have been studies disproving that

Actually most studies provide ample evidence that adequate preparedness for the medical school and the boards does require a balanced score and around a 25-28 before it results in a plateau.

The problem is that people forget the reality that entrance stats aren't only designed to provide information to admissions people. They're also meant to inform you whether or not you have a real chance of success in medical school.

So yes a person with a 23 or less for example will likely struggle more than a person with a 27 or higher.

 

[user3]

Actually most studies provide ample evidence that adequate preparedness for the medical school and the boards does require a balanced score and around a 25-28 before it results in a plateau.

The problem is that people forget the reality that entrance stats aren't only designed to provide information to admissions people. They're also meant to inform you whether or not you have a real chance of success in medical school.

So yes a person with a 23 or less for example will likely struggle more than a person with a 27 or higher.

I don't understand why more schools don't screen by MCAT more aggressively. Most of the more competitive schools could easily afford to auto-reject anyone with scores < 25, and save those people their time and money.

 

[Drrrrrr. Celty]

I don't understand why more schools don't screen by MCAT more aggressively. Most of the more competitive schools could easily afford to auto-reject anyone with scores < 25, and save those people their time and money.

I imagine when it comes down to it schools know how to select for the needs if their specific class. Who knows. It's probably complicated.

 

[user3]

I imagine when it comes down to it schools know how to select for the needs if their specific class. Who knows. It's probably complicated.

I just wonder sometimes how high schools could really increase their averages if they selected for numbers more closely. Nova and PCOM receive 6 and 8k+ apps apiece, yet have averages only in the 3.4-3.5/27-28 range-- I just find that perplexing.

 

[Drrrrrr. Celty]

I just wonder sometimes how high schools could really increase their averages if they selected for numbers more closely. Nova and PCOM receive 6 and 8k+ apps apiece, yet have averages only in the 3.4-3.5/27-28 range-- I just find that perplexing.

I don't think it's perplexing at all. You've got most of the class with high end stats and then the rest is buffed down a bit with students with legacy status or major callings for osteopathic medicine. Essentially that's why it's not a 30 at most places for example. And to break a 30 is impossible simply because by then almost the majority of your applicants are being accepted to MD schools or etc.

 

[MedNation907]

Of note, I am not going to take the MCAT again, especially the new one as I don't have the endurance and mentality to do so again plain and simple, this is my choice.

This is concerning to me, mental endurance is basically what medical school is all about.

I averaged a 30 on my AAMC practice tests, even breaks for the most part. My results, although an even break, were much lower. I applied with a lower MCAT because my application otherwise was exceptional but I still planned to retake if things didn't pan out.

I am by no means saying you can't get in with a 4 in VR, I don't have the knowledge to say either way. However, medical school is nothing but long tests that require critical thinking. If you can't summon yourself to rise to the MCAT, I would strongly reconsider what you're getting yourself into.

Now granite I really enjoyed biochemistry in undergrad, but I was actually excited to face the new MCAT. I enjoy studying, critical thinking, and the pleasure of learning complicated theories in science. I think in some way you need to enjoy this lifestyle to excel in medical school.

Just food for thought.

I am aware of the charting as I am currently an ER scribe as "documenting and charting" is my job which poses no issue for me what-so-ever. So what you are saying is there is no chance?

I too am a medical scribe. I just wanted to point out that many hospitals use different systems for charting. Just because you're familiar with one system doesn't mean you'll be fluent with others. This is certainly a leg up though, you now have a better understanding of the billing/coding aspects of healthcare. It sucks, doesn't it?

 

[TopTomato]

I don't think it's perplexing at all. You've got most of the class with high end stats and then the rest is buffed down a bit with students with legacy status or major callings for osteopathic medicine. Essentially that's why it's not a 30 at most places for example. And to break a 30 is impossible simply because by then almost the majority of your applicants are being accepted to MD schools or etc.

If Touro can break 30, PCOM definitely can. They get the most apps out of all the DO schools. If your applying to Touro, there's a good chance you applied to PCOM as well. PCOM does tend to have one of the higher MCAT scores, however they are definitely weird with their admissions at times. Also PCOM is a huge legacy school. 15% of students admitted to PCOM during my year were the kids of PCOM grads. Think about that, that's ONLY PCOM grads, that doesn't include people whose parents came from other DO or MD schools. From what i've seen at PCOM i'd say that about 1 out of 4 students have parents who are doctors MD/DO. Also there's the biomed program here. More often than not the people in the biomed program who get accepted to the DO program tend to have a lower MCAT score than the rest. These 2 reasons alone attribute to PCOM not breaking the 30 mark.

 

[Drrrrrr. Celty]

Touro breaks 30s because they're in CA and NY.

 

[YourMD]

Hello everyone, I would appreciate serious comments only if possible.

VERBAL SCORE PROBLEM

I recently received my MCAT score back for the second time and scored a 8,4,10 (PS,VR,BS). I am not worried about my sciences scores, but clearly the verbal score is a problem. I am aware that some schools have a cut off and MD schools are completely out of the picture for the most part.

My question is, as are many peoples I assume, is there ANY hope/chance of possible acceptance to DO schools?????? My GPA is a 3.5, I have a fairly extensive resume I would like to think including ER scribing, Cardiovascular Research, volunteering, Mission trips, medical device development, etc...

Of note, I am not going to take the MCAT again, especially the new one as I don't have the endurance and mentality to do so again plain and simple, this is my choice.
Again let me know what you think! Thanks.

There is hope OP! I got a 3 in VR the first time I took the MCAT. After doing Princeton review hyperlearning 2-3 passages per day until i finished the book and the AAMC verbal self assessment. I was able to increase my score to an 8. A whopping 5 point increase! When using these materials do the check your answers after each question and try and pick up at least one technique from each passage. Search SDN for the self assessment answers that way you can check the passages as you complete them. PM me for more information. Good luck!

 

[TopTomato]

Touro breaks 30s because they're in CA and NY.

I find that doubtful, especially from the things that i've heard from Touro students. Personally I think that touro selects only applicants with high MCAT scores, while other DO schools give more leeway.

 

[user3]

Touro breaks 30s because they're in CA and NY.

I agree with Tomato. I think most people would pick PCOM over the Touro's. Vallejo and Harlem/Middletown aren't such great locations anyway.

 

[Buck Winters]

Exactly how I feel!

One thing I did to help in verbal was to read a passage, then first try to write a short biography of the author. Many questions require the reader to go off of the "tone" of the passage, and in that case, you should be able to at least glean the author's opinion about the topic, and from there make up a bio. It sounds stupid, but it seriously helps. After doing that, now that a minute or two has passed since you finished the passage, try to summarize the passage and jot down any major claims, facts, or points that the author provided. Being able to do these two things will help you to mindfully read the passages in a way that can help you answer the questions.

These strategies worked for me, I was able to do well in verbal throughout my preparation. However, this brings up another point - diligence is key to verbal. I got overconfident (was averaging just over 13 on practice tests in verbal, ended up with a 9 on test day) and I was less diligent in my practice towards the end. Sure, I can blame test day nerves, but I think it was a lack of diligence that caused the drop in performance. I think it can be said that a diligent, consistent effort can help raise your score. It won't be the number of passages you read that will determine your score. I think the way you approach each passage will be more important.

Hopefully you can be at peace and be successful with whatever decision you make, but I also vote on a retake to give yourself a chance at interview invites.

 

[user3]

@TopTomato what is your opinion on the guy with 3 vr / 22 landing two acceptances-- you seemed to scoff at the mere possibility of it, but it really did happen.

 

[chizledfrmstone]

@TopTomato what is your opinion on the guy with 3 vr / 22 landing two acceptances-- you seemed to scoff at the mere possibility of it, but it really did happen.

Not to be an a**hole but I was getting 22-23 by GUESSING. My VR was 8 WITHOUT any prep.

Good luck to that person in med school. They sure as hell wouldn't make it past our exams. Some of our questions are RIGHT from boards review books.

 

[user3]

Not to be an a**hole but I was getting 22-23 by GUESSING. My VR was 8 WITHOUT any prep.

Good luck to that person in med school. They sure as hell wouldn't make it past our exams. Some of our questions are RIGHT from boards review books.

http://forums.studentdoctor.net/threads/what-is-the-chance-of-5-on-vr.1120722/#post-16187921

 

[chizledfrmstone]

http://forums.studentdoctor.net/threads/what-is-the-chance-of-5-on-vr.1120722/#post-16187921

I have a feeling our questions are slightly harder than the ones at ACOM.

 

[TopTomato]

@TopTomato what is your opinion on the guy with 3 vr / 22 landing two acceptances-- you seemed to scoff at the mere possibility of it, but it really did happen.

I did scoff at the possibility of it, and i'm still skeptical. I think for 99% of the people who score a 3 will have no chance of setting foot into medical school. However if true, this one individual must have had something else to get them into ACOM. Like I said IF this is true than the school is doing more harm than good. A score of a 6 or a 7 in VR is not a good score, a score of a 3 is down right pitiful. Accepting a person with such a low score puts them at a very high risk of never completing medical school or passing boards.

 

[Drrrrrr. Celty]

I find that doubtful, especially from the things that i've heard from Touro students. Personally I think that touro selects only applicants with high MCAT scores, while other DO schools give more leeway.

Idk, I lived in NYC or CA I would do everything to stay.

 

[IslandStyle808]

I have a feeling our questions are slightly harder than the ones at ACOM.

This year they are getting picky about who to interview (not sure it was the same before). If you don't meet either a 3.3 GPA or 26 MCAT, they won't give you one. It is not like they don't have standards.