The **NEW & IMPROVED** official low gpa thread...

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Regarding post bac classes, is it frowned upon to take 3 classes instead of the normal 4?
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common man said:
not if you get all A / A- ...;)
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Disagree - it depends what your situation is, whether you are working or not; whether you are doing ECs or not

If you did nothing else, and took 3 classes - then yes thats looked down upon even if you get a 4.0. It just shows you can get a great GPA in below undergrad course load, which doesnt show that you can handle the med school course load

Summary: Situation specific
 
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DrMidlife said:
Hi -

First, breathe. You're going to be okay.

Second, don't compare your path to med school to anybody else's path. Your path will be different. You're on an URM GPA comeback. There are just not very many people on that path with you. So don't hold up other premeds as a ruler to measure yourself by - the units don't match.

Third, take a look at premed programs for disadvantaged students. I made a list of them here, category 5, and that list is pretty old, so there might be new programs as well. You should be able to get into a program that is designed to help you build the skills that will get you to where you can represent an underrepresented physician demographic. These programs tend to be inexpensive and very, very supportive.

Fourth, expect that you'll need to invest a few more years of preparation before you take on applying to med school. This is a good thing. You have time to figure some things out. The world will not end because you're 25 and not in med school yet, for instance. If you spend an extra year or two working on your academics & test taking skills, it will be worth it. I recommend slowing down, adding years to your premed career, to anybody with a sub-3.0. Getting in isn't the hardest part: doing well in med school will suck if you're not prepared.

Fifth. find mentors like this one. Find physicians or med students who came from a similar background, who can understand your family's concerns and can understand how it feels to be fighting against the dominant rich white kid demographic.

Lastly, this is all going to come down to how hard you want to work, and simply not quitting. When you get overwhelmed or depressed at the extent of what you're trying to do, don't use that momentary feeling to quit or stop. Take a break, sure, get help, sure, just don't quit and don't stop working really hard.

Best of luck to you.
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Thank you so much for those kind words. I'm glad that there's a community out there that knows that people make mistakes and that past errors shouldn't be the only factors to consider. I'll apply to some of these programs and keep you in the loop. You've probably answered this already but how does gpa get averaged into a post-bac/smp program? Does it add itself to the old gpa? Or is it a new gpa altogether? I'm probably kind of annoying right now but I'm a little curious. I graduated last month and I'm taking a year off, working. When should I apply to post-bac/smp programs? Thanks again for tolerating my ignorance.
 
gunito said:
Youre MCAT score is good, so you have that working for you. A post bacc would help, but that would take at least two years. Im pretty sure 2.75 is the MINIMUM gpa to receive a secondary app, so I dont know why you would apply with such an abysmal gpa. My gpa was right around what you have and I am up to a 2.73 after a year (gotta love grade replacement). How did you get into a masters program with a gpa like that? If you want to go to med school, then you'll fight through the rough patches and get there. I hope you didnt actually apply with a 2.31. Even with a 45 MCAT you probably wouldn't get in. Patience and persistence are your friends.
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It was pointless to even apply - I know, but I figured my grad gpa would help out at least some, and show a sign of maturity.
 
sublm128 said:
Thats my amcas GPA. My school gpa is s3.2 and c2.87... By these stats im pretty sure im competitive for do with a 30R and a publication, shadowing, clinical experience, and research.
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If your AMCAS GPA is:
BCPM 2.65
overall 2.31

But your school's GPA is higher - then I'm guessing its because of re-takes. Therefore, you should calculate your DO GPA.

But you have zero chance at MD. But depending on your DO GPA, it might be a diff story
 
robflanker said:
If your AMCAS GPA is:
BCPM 2.65
overall 2.31

But your school's GPA is higher - then I'm guessing its because of re-takes. Therefore, you should calculate your DO GPA.

But you have zero chance at MD. But depending on your DO GPA, it might be a diff story
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They seem to lump my grad gpa with my undergrad, so my overall was 3.01 and sci was 3.26.

is there anything necessarily wrong with becoming a DO? I want to specialize too though. Im just not too big on the OMM and all that stuff.
 
Hey everyone,

I've been following the last 18 months of this thread and it's great to hear that there are other people in the same boat as I am. I posted earlier in the 'what are my chances?' thread but everyone there seems to ignore your post if you have less than a 3.5. I was wondering if anyone could impart some sound advice.

Profile:
I am a 1st generation high school and soon-to-be college graduate of Caribbean heritage. In other words, I fit the AMCAS disadvantaged criteria to a T. In addition, I am going into my last year at a top 15 school with a full scholarship.

This is where my story starts to nosedive.

My cGPA right now is 3.22 and my sGPA is 2.93. I have no explanation for these grades except that the sciences at my school are really tough. For example, the mean grade for an INTRO Bio class was a 'low B' which translated to B-, or a B if you're lucky. In addition, with the average GPA of undergrads hovering between 3.0 and 3.4, I don't think I've made too bad of a showing. However, it's not enough for medical school. Instead of feeling proud of myself for making it thus far without very little familial and financial support, I am made to feel like I've, for lack of a better phrase, 'f*cked up' and need to spend the rest of my young adulthood fixing whatever I did wrong.

Herein lies my problem: I am graduating next year and within that time I hope to retake Physics II (I received a C- after being hospitalized a couple of days before the final) and take about 4 upper division bio courses to finish up my concentration. Hopefully I will have pulled up my sGPA to at least a 3.0 by the end of that year. I've already decided to take time off after undergrad, but I haven't decided 1) how much time to take, and 2) what I should do with the time off.

I think I'm ineligible for most postbaccs because I will have taken all the basic science courses as well as some upper division bio courses. I hear SMP being thrown around a lot, but as of now I'm not sure if that's the best thing for me. I've also been recommended to Georgetown's GEMS, a program specifically for URMs who need that extra umph, however, I feel like I'm done with the undergrad portion of my life and I would to get a Masters for any more formal studying I do.

I haven't taken the MCAT as yet, which I am told would make or break me at this point, and I have so-so ECs (spent all my free time doing work study).

Sorry this is so long, but I wanted to give a (sort of) complete picture to anyone willing to help me.

Thanks so much!
 
First things first, you will need to take an MCAT. A low to average score will make you a good candidate for post-baccs. There are programs designed for URMs that will help you get into med school. Some (all?) require that you apply and be rejected to med school like Ohio State Medpath.

With a high enough MCAT score along with the URM status may overcome your low GPA and you may get accepted to a med school provided that you apply broadly.

SMP should be a last resort.
 
Isoprop said:
First things first, you will need to take an MCAT. A low to average score will make you a good candidate for post-baccs. There are programs designed for URMs that will help you get into med school. Some (all?) require that you apply and be rejected to med school like Ohio State Medpath.

With a high enough MCAT score along with the URM status may overcome your low GPA and you may get accepted to a med school provided that you apply broadly.

SMP should be a last resort.
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Thanks for your advice. I'm currently studying for the MCAT and am aiming for a Jan 2012 date. However, I'm very confused as to why an SMP is a last resort? And why a postbacc would be preferred if I've taken/will have taken all the prereqs and upper level science course by the time I graduate?
 
Well I am well underway with my post-bac, but just got my ochem grades back. B in lecture and only a B+ in lab. I got a 3.91 last semester taking the intro bio and chem classes which was nice, but this ochem class was rough on me. Are there any people who did a post-bac who got into allopathic med schools without all A's in the pre-reqs? I have ochem 2 this fall along with cell bio, physics, and calculus. Brutal but I can do it. At least I still have some more time, I was just aiming for perfection with this whole post-bac thing

Darn low GPA gives me no room for error. Im at 3.2 now... 3.65 post-bac to date. MCAT still a ways away.
 
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I am just seeking advice on how to proceed. I know I am not getting into a US MD school, but maybe a DO or caribbean MD school down the line.
I graduated with a 2.68 GPA, not sure about the science. have taken 18 credits of graduate studies and have a 3.45 GPA. overall to this point have a GPA of 2.86 with a science GPA of 2.58. Of the last 40 credit hours taken my GPA is 3.32.
I take the MCAT in a week and anticipate a score between 24-29.
I have worked at a genetics institute for the last two years doing research and have over 130 hours of volunteer hours.
I plan on taking 1 or possibly 2 (if my schedule permits) graduate classes in the fall.

Any criticism or advice would be greatly appreciated. Just wanting to make sure I am setting myself up for the best opportunity of getting in to a medical program wherever that may be.
 
So... here goes. I've had extenuating circumstances with my father's health since 10th grade of high school and it's been downhill since. Taught myself a lot of what I know (this'll be important in a minute).

I have a Ugrad cGPA of 3.09 (3.1???)
Science Ugrad GPA... never really calculated it. I should do that.

So... since I missed a lot of schooling, somehow my graduate advisor saw something in me that got me a Masters degree...

Masters of Science, February 2011 - Areas of Concentration; Exercise Physiology, Energy Metabolism, Endocrinology
Masters Thesis track.
GPA: 3.6 (which means **** to med schools)

TEACHING RESPONSIBILITIES:

Graduate Teaching Assistant, Kinesiology Department, University of ******
Kinesiology 110, Human Performance & Nutrition, Fall 2009-Fall 2010

Graduate TA/Online Lecturer, Kinesiology Department, University of ******
Kinesiology 110, Human Performance & Nutrition, Spring 2010-Fall 2010
I am taking the MCAT in December or January. Going to sign up for it ASAP.

5 Scholarly Contributions...
3 Abstracts and posters
2 publications (first and second author) 1 in press, 1 in prep still

Plan on applying to a number of schools... Drexel, SUNY Downstate, Einstein, Temple, ...


SHADOWING:
-Orthopedic Medicine (Current) 100 hrs
-Neurology 80 hrs
-Cardiology 80 hrs
-Hematology 40 hrs
-PCP, DO (25-30 hours) - Already set up, just need to start

Volunteer:
Cardiac Rehab (I am an exercise physiologist) Hoping to exceed 500 hrs (current)
Nursing (Aide @ a Private hospital) 40 hrs

TRAVEL:
Spent 1 year in Israel studying abroad in a Private Institution (Religious Studies)
Open to Travel/New Cultures


I am literally about to apply to the Harvard Extension Program and hoping to earn sponsorship. I'm about to quit my job and take out more loans... enough to pay this and support myself part-time for the year. I'm hoping to rock this all out within a year and summer. I'm paying the 100.00 app fee (with money I don't have) hoping I can be successful in sponsorship for federal aid.

My problem is I have a BS and MS... but I am missing a few core pre-reqs for Med School (I was on a track that didn't require Ochem i and ii) nor do I have a second bio semester.

From research (PhD track) to medicine (MD or DO)... let's have some fun! Cannot wait. Application is finished... tomorrow is the day. :)


wish me luck???

Any advice?

My father, after 11 years of trial and tribulation with heart problems and further complications arising from the cardiac ailment (not a simple bypass, but a heart valve prolapse that was repaired... into congestive heart failure and cardiomyopathy)... and a pericardectomy 3 weeks ago... my father is recovering and doing well! A lot of pressure alleviated thanks to 2 brilliant cardiac specialists in the Northeast!! <3 Love you dad <3

I want this.
 
I have 3.3 in gen chem 1, 2 and 3 (quarter system). Should I be retaking these? Im doing a post-bacc in the fall anyway, but im not sure about gen chem?
 
Spikebd said:
Well I am well underway with my post-bac, but just got my ochem grades back. B in lecture and only a B+ in lab. I got a 3.91 last semester taking the intro bio and chem classes which was nice, but this ochem class was rough on me. Are there any people who did a post-bac who got into allopathic med schools without all A's in the pre-reqs? I have ochem 2 this fall along with cell bio, physics, and calculus. Brutal but I can do it. At least I still have some more time, I was just aiming for perfection with this whole post-bac thing

Darn low GPA gives me no room for error. Im at 3.2 now... 3.65 post-bac to date. MCAT still a ways away.
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Of course there are people who didn't get A's in all the prereqs. Ochem hurt me pretty bad, and that's fairly typical.

Take those B's and move on - get as many A's as you can. If you want to do more for your GPA, then take upper div science such as biochem.

Best of luck to you.
 
Chaos81 said:
I am just seeking advice on how to proceed. I know I am not getting into a US MD school, but maybe a DO or caribbean MD school down the line.
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If it takes you years to get into a US med school, that would be better than going Carib.
Chaos81 said:
I graduated with a 2.68 GPA, not sure about the science. have taken 18 credits of graduate studies and have a 3.45 GPA. overall to this point have a GPA of 2.86 with a science GPA of 2.58. Of the last 40 credit hours taken my GPA is 3.32.
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Grad & undergrad aren't mixed. Undergrad stands alone, and being below 3.0 is a disaster. An unimpressive grad GPA hurts your story.
Chaos81 said:
I take the MCAT in a week and anticipate a score between 24-29.
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Then don't take it. A 24 is a waste of time. If you want to do the test for practice, then void your score. With your GPA, you can't have an average MCAT - you have to be well above average. Average for DO is like 28, for MD 31.
Chaos81 said:
Any criticism or advice would be greatly appreciated. Just wanting to make sure I am setting myself up for the best opportunity of getting in to a medical program wherever that may be.
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Here's my sub-3.0 comeback recipe: http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showpost.php?p=11083370&postcount=3.

Best of luck to you.
 
mdhopeful1000 said:
I have 3.3 in gen chem 1, 2 and 3 (quarter system). Should I be retaking these? Im doing a post-bacc in the fall anyway, but im not sure about gen chem?
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I can't think of any reason to retake a B+.
 
rgerber85 said:
Any advice?
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Get all A's in a lot of classes. Take undergrad upper div science as well as the prereqs.

Be smart about the MCAT. Schedule yourself so that you have your best score in hand by June 1 so that you can submit early. That means you need to take the test by April at the latest. If you can't do really well on the test by April 2012, then take another year. "Really well" for US MD schools means above average which is 31+.

Best of luck to you.
 
DrMidlife said:
Get all A's in a lot of classes. Take undergrad upper div science as well as the prereqs.

Be smart about the MCAT. Schedule yourself so that you have your best score in hand by June 1 so that you can submit early. That means you need to take the test by April at the latest. If you can't do really well on the test by April 2012, then take another year. "Really well" for US MD schools means above average which is 31+.

Best of luck to you.
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Wow... thanks!

I was expecting you to rip me out of the water.

That is encouraging!!!

I've already begun studying for the MCAT.... :)
 
rgerber85 said:
Wow... thanks!

I was expecting you to rip me out of the water.

That is encouraging!!!

I've already begun studying for the MCAT.... :)
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I have an overall 3.09, and I just got an MD acceptance after a bunch of years of not giving up. So I can't really rip you for a 3.09. Also, you seem to be pretty well educated about what you're in for.
 
DrMidlife said:
I have an overall 3.09, and I just got an MD acceptance after a bunch of years of not giving up. So I can't really rip you for a 3.09. Also, you seem to be pretty well educated about what you're in for.
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About to quit my job... take out huge loans to pay for my post-bacc and part-time living. Move back in with my parents for the time being (so lucky my girl is doing her MSw in another state) doing the long distance thing. heh. Study full time for the MCAT + Post-Bacc classes until I am in Med school.

Thanks sir. :thumbup:
 
rgerber85 said:
About to quit my job... take out huge loans to pay for my post-bacc and part-time living. Move back in with my parents for the time being (so lucky my girl is doing her MSw in another state) doing the long distance thing. heh. Study full time for the MCAT + Post-Bacc classes until I am in Med school.
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If those huge loans are private, read the fine print. If you only get 4 years of deferral for grad/professional school, then an SMP counts against that deferral...and you'll have to make payments during your 4th year of med school. Also private loans don't play nice with any of the repayment plans that make residency possible.
rgerber85 said:
Thanks sir. :thumbup:
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That's ma'am.
 
DrMidlife said:
If those huge loans are private, read the fine print. If you only get 4 years of deferral for grad/professional school, then an SMP counts against that deferral...and you'll have to make payments during your 4th year of med school. Also private loans don't play nice with any of the repayment plans that make residency possible.

That's ma'am.
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Oops :oops:


Thanks Ma'am :)

And I'm hoping I get sponsorship so I can get federal aid
 
Okay Guys~
Brace yourselves!
Because here comes the sad story of the day :p

So I graduated from Virginia Tech on May 2011 with Psychology degree.
I was a biology major but switched during 2nd year because I didn't feel as though it was something I was interested. (Even though, dentistry is totally different from biology in my opinion)

Overall GPA: 2.9
Science GPA: 2.2

:mad::mad::mad::mad: I know. Isn't it horrible?!? My in-major GPA is all good and well except I totally ruined everything by taking biology classes / Ochem!!!

Now, I am wondering if I have any chance at all.
Because I am planning to take upper biology class at Harvard Extension School coming this fall. I want to prove once and for all that I can indeed take biology courses and do well.

Can anyone give me some advice???
Will one year of upper biology class be enough to get into dental school if I get super duper awesome DAT scores???

Thanks in advancEE!!:oops:
 
I think i need some basic clarification about postbaccss...

Is the difference between taking a la carte post-bacc and doing a second degree that you actually get a degree AND raise gpa, vs just raising your GPA? If that is true then what is the benefit of doing a la carte post-bacc?

Also, do all postbacc programs, formal or do-it-yourself, get added to your undergrad gpa?

Also, for someone who has already taken the science prereqs, what is the benefit/purpose of redoing them, if you are only going to get the average of the two grades? (for example, lets say you repeat a bio class you got a 2.0 in. Even with a 4.0, the average is still way below an A .

And final question; do sub-3.0 gpas sort of get automatically screened out by med admissions? in other words, --dont even bother applying with anything below a 3.0 because = waste of time and money, true?

thanks for any help!
 
OK Hi everybody:hello:.
Please Brace yourselves...

I graduated from Maryland 1 year ago with a degree in Microbiology.
cGPA: 2.7
AMCAS: 2.65
BCHM: 2.53 :thumbdown:thumbdown

I ran into quite a few problems in life that spilled into college most if not all were out of my control, primarily problems from aftermath effects of cancer treatment.(2x survivor:cool:). My biggest mistake I made in my life was giving up on this in the middle of undergrad out of frustration.

I have been working in a Cancer research lab at Georgetown University, giving me time to my life in order. And I'm ready now for what is probably going to be a long road... I have already started studying for the MCAT (9/10) and I hope I can get into an SMP in fall of 2012 but I've been having a hard time finding ones with such low acceptance requirements. Does anybody have any advice for me or am I pretty much on track ? I would very much appreciate any help.
 
I have no idea what BCHM is or why you called it out. Biochem?
Godson20 said:
Does anybody have any advice for me or am I pretty much on track ? I would very much appreciate any help.
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I think you're jumping the gun, by a couple of years, in thinking about the MCAT and SMPs. You can "use" a cancer story to bring some depth to your app, but you can't use it to get past a way-below-3.0 (sorry if that's too cold of an analysis, but I just did all this). At best you have a good explanation for your GPA, but that doesn't spare you from the basic proof of mettle. You have to prove you can handle academics. You need to show what a high undergrad GPA shows: that you can perform well over the long haul. So you need a long haul (like a 2nd bachelors or whatnot) and you need a good performance on that long haul (like a 3.7+). Hopefully that gets your cumulative undergrad GPA over 3.0. Then you need a well above average MCAT (31+ is average for MD, 28-ish for DO). Then if you want to go MD you probably still need an SMP.

In theory, you could do a traditional masters, but I wouldn't go that route unless you publish while doing something very reputable, and unless you have evidence that your MCAT will be ridiculous. Such evidence could be a 35+ on more than one practice test. A traditional masters against an average MCAT and a wicked low undergrad GPA doesn't get it done - grad programs aren't standardized.

Fundamentally I doubt that you're set up to succeed on the MCAT or in an SMP with that GPA. If you had great semesters interrupted by not-great semesters, then maybe you have an easier case to prove. But generally with a way-below-3.0 you didn't learn the material that's on the MCAT, and you're not ready for the rigor of an SMP.

I think if I were in your shoes I'd try to find an interesting job, like working on disease surveillance for the CDC, or pretty much anything you want to do, for a couple of years, before going back to school. I don't think the Peace Corps lets cancer survivors in, otherwise that's my usual first suggestion. But you might be able play your "cancer card" to try to open some doors that might otherwise be closed. Give yourself a break - med school will be there for you when you're ready to work your way in.

Best of luck to you.
 
Some reputable grad programs are beyond standardization. My MS program was 98% research oriented, 1% teaching, and 1% classes. Yet, in a number of graduate program rankings... we were always top 5 for edu-ma-cation (I know, I'm not funny), research, etc..

Good luck!
 
DrMidlife said:
I have no idea what BCHM is or why you called it out. Biochem?

I think you're jumping the gun, by a couple of years, in thinking about the MCAT and SMPs. You can "use" a cancer story to bring some depth to your app, but you can't use it to get past a way-below-3.0 (sorry if that's too cold of an analysis, but I just did all this). At best you have a good explanation for your GPA, but that doesn't spare you from the basic proof of mettle. You have to prove you can handle academics. You need to show what a high undergrad GPA shows: that you can perform well over the long haul. So you need a long haul (like a 2nd bachelors or whatnot) and you need a good performance on that long haul (like a 3.7+). Hopefully that gets your cumulative undergrad GPA over 3.0. Then you need a well above average MCAT (31+ is average for MD, 28-ish for DO). Then if you want to go MD you probably still need an SMP.

In theory, you could do a traditional masters, but I wouldn't go that route unless you publish while doing something very reputable, and unless you have evidence that your MCAT will be ridiculous. Such evidence could be a 35+ on more than one practice test. A traditional masters against an average MCAT and a wicked low undergrad GPA doesn't get it done - grad programs aren't standardized.

Fundamentally I doubt that you're set up to succeed on the MCAT or in an SMP with that GPA. If you had great semesters interrupted by not-great semesters, then maybe you have an easier case to prove. But generally with a way-below-3.0 you didn't learn the material that's on the MCAT, and you're not ready for the rigor of an SMP.

I think if I were in your shoes I'd try to find an interesting job, like working on disease surveillance for the CDC, or pretty much anything you want to do, for a couple of years, before going back to school. I don't think the Peace Corps lets cancer survivors in, otherwise that's my usual first suggestion. But you might be able play your "cancer card" to try to open some doors that might otherwise be closed. Give yourself a break - med school will be there for you when you're ready to work your way in.

Best of luck to you.
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Wow thank you for the analysis ! My bad I meant BCPM. Probably dosen't make a difference but In my healthiest year and a half I had a 3.7 GPA in those years I took 75% science courses. But the damage was already done in my Freshman year with a horrible GPA of around 2.0. Once my problems got worse junior year is when I gave up on the dream like an idiot and I bottumed out.

So do you think I should just stop studying for the MCAT and wait to take it later down the road ? I have two options.

A) take a job offered to me by a friend that has nothing to do with Science (Pays well though). Would this be looked down upon ? My dad says if I get out of the science field it will be hard to get back in... Money is nice but I already know what it feels like to work a miserable job.

B) Do a masters in BioInformatics (recommended by my boss) ? But even then wouldn't I have a hard time getting into grad school also ?

Even though it is a harsh reality I really appreciate the advice. Believe I won't give up on this though !!!!
 
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Godson20 said:
So do you think I should just stop studying for the MCAT and wait to take it later down the road ?
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Yes, exactly. I'm suggesting that you want to wait to take the MCAT until you have a body of coursework with a whole bunch of A's. You probably need to retake the prereqs. Also, even if your MCAT is adequate this year, that score will expire before you have time to address GPA.
Godson20 said:
A) take a job offered to me by a friend that has nothing to do with Science (Pays well though). Would this be looked down upon ? My dad says if I get out of the science field it will be hard to get back in...
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If it's interesting and ethically neutral-or-better, why not. With some income you can travel and otherwise take on perspective-expanding activities. Getting back into the science field is only an issue if you want to keep working in a lab long term.
Godson20 said:
B) Do a masters in BioInformatics (recommended by my boss) ? But even then wouldn't I have a hard time getting into grad school also ?
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That won't do a thing for your med school app. If you're passionately interested and you want to pursue a bioinfo career, sure. But even if you want to do this program, take some more undergrad first to figure out what you need to do to get A's.

For reference: http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showpost.php?p=11083370&postcount=3
 
Thank you! :)
 
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Hey guys-
This almost seems like a confessional, so I'll begin. Long time lurker here, and I have been doing my own thing for the past few years. I have kept my history to myself, because I've been too ashamed of the past. Please let me know what you guys think.

Here's my story-

-Throughout my college career, I had been wandering aimlessly. I entered with an engineering degree, and when that didn't go well, I went to biology. I still wasn't sure what I was doing. I eventually graduated UCI in 2008, with cGPA of 2.49 (majored in Biology). I haven't calculated my sGPA, although I should.
-Immediately after graduation, I started working at a lab because I didn't know what else I could do.
-After gauging my situation and reading these boards, I figured the only way to determine if I remotely had a chance at med was to take classes.
-So, last summer I uninformally enrolled in classes at UC Berkeley Extension because I don't have the GPA for the formal post-bac. I dedicated myself to the classes. I completed 10 upper division science classes at Berkeley Extension with a 3.9 and I regained my academic confidence.

However, I'm at a fork because I'm running low on funds. I'm not sure how to proceed at this point - take my MCAT and take more classes? Apply to SMP? Or do another year of classes and then apply to schools?

Let me know what you guys think - because I'm not sure if I'm doing this correctly. Thank you all for your time reading.
 
I am....ahem....35. and a ugrad non trad FRESHman. Yeah...so all you fine individuals who think 25 is too old...stop. I have heard many horror stories about low gpas and poor (relative) MCAT scores, but when you get in, even if you're at the bottom of the class, they still call you "doctor"...keep your collective heads up and lets have some mental and emotional jockstrapping here!
 
Oh I missed this part, my bad:
Unbreakable said:
-So, last summer I uninformally enrolled in classes at UC Berkeley Extension because I don't have the GPA for the formal post-bac. I dedicated myself to the classes. I completed 10 upper division science classes at Berkeley Extension with a 3.9 and I regained my academic confidence.
Click to expand...
Now that's how to do it.

I think the very next thing is to figure out what your cumulative GPAs are, combining Irvine & Berkeley. Know your numbers. There are a variety of calculators around, but it's not really hard to make your own spreadsheet. You're probably a bit over 2.75.

Here's the problem with going into an SMP now. Unless you get into a school like EVMS or Cincinnati, you're still going to have to answer for your undergrad GPA despite how well you do in the SMP. I don't think Cincinnati takes sub-3.0's, and EVMS might but not likely out of state. There's no question that with a lower GPA, you need a rock solid MCAT (32+) to get considered at good SMPs.

In theory you could just take the MCAT and go DO. If your MCAT is MD-competitive (32+), you might do okay w/DO admissions, based on your recent performance.

I think what I'd do in your shoes is get a job (maybe one that pays tuition), and crank out a couple classes per term at night, keeping that GPA really high. Maybe in 2 years you'd have enough to get your GPA up over 3.0. I think you can mostly do non-science, since you just smoked 10 upper div science classes. And then with a solid MCAT I think you'd have a case for any SMP, and possibly for MD admissions. By then there could be some indication of how well the USC program is doing with getting its grads into UC's, which could be sweet.

It's definitely going to be multiple years to get this thing done from a 2.49, but holy cow you started well. From here you pretty much have to just not quit.

Best of luck to you.
 
CAM31509 said:
I am....ahem....35. and a ugrad non trad FRESHman. Yeah...so all you fine individuals who think 25 is too old...stop. I have heard many horror stories about low gpas and poor (relative) MCAT scores, but when you get in, even if you're at the bottom of the class, they still call you "doctor"...keep your collective heads up and lets have some mental and emotional jockstrapping here!
Click to expand...

I know people in MD programs with modest GPA's... 2.9-3.4 +/- .3; MCAT scores of 29-33 +/- 2 and some decent EC's... (n = 8... so probably not a solid power analysis, but still a comforting thought that out of the 17 people I know in med school.. nearly half are in my situation. Schools like buffalo, suny downstate, temple, etc...) (And I'm not confusing DO AND MD... they are in MD programs.

If someone with a 29 MCAT and a 2.9 GPA and just shadowing experience can get in... i'm not that bad off... and probably neither are some of you. you just have to prove to the interviewer and adcom you want it... and that you can excel in their programs.
 
rgerber85 said:
If someone with a 29 MCAT and a 2.9 GPA and just shadowing experience can get in... i'm not that bad off... and probably neither are some of you. you just have to prove to the interviewer and adcom you want it... and that you can excel in their programs.
Click to expand...
I'm calling BS on that.

The avg matriculant GPA is 3.67 for 2010 (https://www.aamc.org/download/161690/data/table17-facts2010mcatgpa99-10-web.pdf.pdf ) with a STD of 0.26. Therefore, someone with a 2.9 is approximately 3 STD below the average GPA. This would indicate that they they are in the bottom 0.1% of GPAs of all accepted medical students. That might be the case if they had a 44 on the MCAT, but they didn't.

So BS to that statement.

Below 3.0 does not get you into many SMPs, let alone an MD school

EDIT: Furthermore, look at this grid (https://www.aamc.org/download/157450/data/table24-mcatgpagridall2008-10.pdf.pdf) and look at the percentages of 29 and 2.9s have of getting in. 16% of the applicants got in, but that represents 0.29% (166/56255) of all accepted medical students. And thats not factoring in the URM aspect of things. So, in conclusion - you are in not in a good position if you at 29 and 2.9, and planning on applying to MD schools
 
rgerber85 said:
If someone with a 29 MCAT and a 2.9 GPA and just shadowing experience can get in... i'm not that bad off... and probably neither are some of you. you just have to prove to the interviewer and adcom you want it... and that you can excel in their programs.
Click to expand...

robflanker said:
I'm calling BS on that.
Click to expand...
I second that BS call. You don't have visibility into what got your friends into med school, and they're clearly leaving something out of the story. Usually something that requires genetics or multiple additional prep years or both.

If you want to relax and expect everything to be rosy without getting anywhere near average stats, have fun with that. Let us know how it works out.

Meanwhile, every year, 70,000 people take the MCAT, 45,000-50,000 people apply USMD, about 20,000 get into USMD, and about 10,000 reapply.

Best of luck to you.
 
DrMidlife said:
I second that BS call. You don't have visibility into what got your friends into med school, and they're clearly leaving something out of the story. Usually something that requires genetics or multiple additional prep years or both.

If you want to relax and expect everything to be rosy without getting anywhere near average stats, have fun with that. Let us know how it works out.

Meanwhile, every year, 70,000 people take the MCAT, 45,000-50,000 people apply USMD, about 20,000 get into USMD, and about 10,000 reapply.

Best of luck to you.
Click to expand...

I guess I'm f'd then, huh?
 
DrMidlife said:
In theory you could just take the MCAT and go DO. If your MCAT is MD-competitive (32+), you might do okay w/DO admissions, based on your recent performance.

I think what I'd do in your shoes is get a job (maybe one that pays tuition), and crank out a couple classes per term at night, keeping that GPA really high. Maybe in 2 years you'd have enough to get your GPA up over 3.0. I think you can mostly do non-science, since you just smoked 10 upper div science classes. And then with a solid MCAT I think you'd have a case for any SMP, and possibly for MD admissions. By then there could be some indication of how well the USC program is doing with getting its grads into UC's, which could be sweet.
Click to expand...

Thanks for the advice. So if I get this right - at this time you're saying I could have a chance at DO admission, as so long as I have a solid MCAT?

Additionally, are you saying that in order to gain SMP/MD admittance, I need to put in more classes?
 
Unbreakable said:
Thanks for the advice. So if I get this right - at this time you're saying I could have a chance at DO admission, as so long as I have a solid MCAT?
Click to expand...
I think you have a chance with DO, despite your probable 2.75 cumulative number, because a 3.9 over a bunch of recent science coursework is likely to get noticed, if you have a high MCAT score. Basically, they'll see 2.75 and your app will be on the way to the trash, but they'll see your MCAT score and look a little harder, and see that 3.9 and want to talk to you. IMHO.
Unbreakable said:
Additionally, are you saying that in order to gain SMP/MD admittance, I need to put in more classes?
Click to expand...
Yes, the competition for MD is substantially greater. I suggest a minimum 3.0 cumulative undergrad GPA to proceed toward MD.

Best of luck to you.
 
I received a letter from Dr. Fixsen, director of Harvard's Extension Program. In a nutshell - he told me to stick my head between my legs and kiss my ass goodbye.

Basically... a ugrad GPA < 3.2, even with outstanding Post-Bacc grades, extensive research/publications, strong clinical work, volunteer, etc... it is nearly impossible to gain acceptance into an American Medical School.

Dr., I am so going to prove you wrong. And many here have. :rolleyes:
 
rgerber85 said:
I received a letter from Dr. Fixsen, director of Harvard's Extension Program. In a nutshell - he told me to stick my head between my legs and kiss my ass goodbye.

Basically... a ugrad GPA < 3.2, even with outstanding Post-Bacc grades, extensive research/publications, strong clinical work, volunteer, etc... it is nearly impossible to gain acceptance into an American Medical School.

Dr., I am so going to prove you wrong. And many here have. :rolleyes:
Click to expand...

It's ironic that they use the GPA as an indicator of being able to handle the course work, and yet just after you show them you can handle the course work via post-bac, they'll come back and say your gpa is too low. :confused:

I graduated with a 2.62 cgpa, and I'm on my way into an acceptance into a US MD school. Nothing is impossible.
 
bkprodigy said:
It's ironic that they use the GPA as an indicator of being able to handle the course work, and yet just after you show them you can handle the course work via post-bac, they'll come back and say your gpa is too low. :confused:

I graduated with a 2.62 cgpa, and I'm on my way into an acceptance into a US MD school. Nothing is impossible.
Click to expand...

:love:

Thanks mon ami!

It's amazing .. I'm competitive enough to get into an MS/PhD program @ a VERY competitive research university (#3 in the US for research in its respective field)... but I get this. finished the MS, not the PhD.
 
Howdy

After going through this entire thread I am ready to post about my situation

I graduated from Drexel (hang on, its relevant) in 2009 with an undergraduate degree in Biology. A less than stellar performance coupled with 3 Fs (sci classes) because I did not withdrawl from courses in time left me with these numbers

2.8 AMCAS cum
2.5 BCPM

I had always had med school in mind throughout high school and most of college. Towards the end I was less certain about that plan and my lack of enthusiasm was reflected in my grades. Not content to just hang around while I pondered my future I applied to and subsequently joined the Peace Corps. This is where I find myself now. I am one year into my service and after some soul searching have decided to pursue medicine after all.
As a volunteer in southern Africa I am working in two schools in a very rural area. In addition to working with educators here I am coordinating HIV/AIDS-related activities within my community. Besides Peace Corps I have a number of health and education related ECs (hospital volunteering, shadowing, peer mentoring).
Realizing that I am in a less than ideal position to get into an allopathic med school I contacted my prehealth advisor at Drexel. He recommended applying to PostBac programs in January after taking the GRE in November. I have already begun studying for the test and plan on killing it (if I don't then that will be a pretty clear message that medicine is not for me).
My old prehealth advisor recommended applying to Drexel's postbac. I am also looking at UPenn and Temple (I know they are both a stretch) as well as schools in Chicago (Dominican U and Rosalind Franklin). Planning to finish my service in summer '12 and matriculate that fall.
Really, my plan is to hope that my experience in the Peace Corps and a great GRE will get me in the door at one of these schools (being a Drexel alum gives me hope for Drexel's program too). After that, well, one step at a time I suppose.
Thanks in advance for any feedback!
 
postbacPCV said:
Thanks in advance for any feedback!
Click to expand...
You definitely get admissions cred for being an RPCV. Unfortunately, not enough to get you past that GPA, and your GPA says you're not ready for the MCAT or for an intense program. Thus I strongly recommend that you do a year or more of preparatory work before you dive into one of the programs you're looking at. More specifically, I very strongly suggest that you need to figure out how to get A's, and get a bunch of them, before you get too excited about med school. A lot of times people find that maturity makes them a better student, but not always.

Drexel's postbac programs are very profitable, and Drexel will be more than happy to collect your tuition, without necessarily moving you towards med school. A single-year program that lets you in despite your undergrad GPA, regardless of a GRE score, is an irresponsible program. Anybody who makes it sound like your path to med school from a 2.8/2.5 is going to be straightforward is selling you something. I'm not saying it can't be done. I am saying that from a way-below-3.0 you do not fit any mold of any kind, and advisers don't typically get paid well enough to understand that.

Here's a general orientation to nontraditional premed-hood: http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showthread.php?t=532079

And here's a thread specific to way-below-3.0 comebacks: http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showthread.php?t=827879

Best of luck to you.
 
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