Medical School Admissions: Special Circumstances

Madame · Jun 26, 2007

whu282 said:
When I was in high school, I took 4 classes at a community college during one summer. Due to family emergency, I needed to leave the country and as a result, had 4 "Ws" on my transcripts. These 4 "Ws" put me on "Lack of progress probation" for that community college. I recently graduated from a top university with a 3.75 GPA. I am applying for medical schools right now and I have three questions regarding my situation. First, how will medical schools consider these four Ws? Second, do I need to explain these 4 Ws on my AAMC application? Third, in AAMC application, it asks if I have ever had any institutional probation. Should I check "yes" for this question? Thank you very much for your help!

You absolutely must report the instutional action of having been on probation. This is actually a plus because it gives you a place to explain the Ws on your transcript without gumming up your Personal statement which can focus on your positive attributes and your interest in medicine.

Yes, you were on probation due to the failure to progress. This failure to progress was due to the 4 withdrawals that were necessitated by the family emergency that led you to leave school before the end of the term. Close your paragraph on the Institutional Action with a sentence about how you focused your efforts when you got back to school.

Madame · Jun 27, 2007

cridecoeur00 said:
Hi Guys-

Here's my story. I was in a combined medical program, after after the three years I left to do an internship and work as there were some financial problems with my family. The following fall, I was granted admission to a DO school and matriculated after tremendous family pressure. I soon was overwhelmed, and unfortunately withdrew on a leave of absence after failing biochemistry and anatomy.

This was just under seven years ago. Since then, I completed a Masters and have been working in an unrelated industry continuously since. The situation has changed, and though I never wanted to leave medical school in the first place, I want to resume that path I had started.

I wasn't sure how this situation would impact my AMCAS application or future prospective applications to medical school. Any advice on this would be appreciated.

Thanks,
Cri

At the very least, you will need to provide the transcript from DO school and list the coursework on your AMCAS. Whether DO school "counts" in the question concerning "previous matriculation" is something you may want to check with AAMC.

Doodledog · Jun 28, 2007

LaCasta said:
I have 7 EX grades on my transcript, which are the equivelant of W's at my school. They do not affect my GPA, and by the time I graduate I will be able to have a GPA of 3.5 or slightly above.

I know it is a lot of excused grades, but if I am able to keep my GPA close to 4.0 for the rest of my two years in undergrad and in my pre-req classes, how much of a negative impact will they have on the adcoms?

Also, I was able to get a lot of these grades excused as I had to drop a couple semesters due to my father's health problems. I got letters from three of my dad's doctors and showed them to some professors and they submitted the grade changes. Is it acceptable or customary to send the letters from my dad's doctors explaining his severe health problems to the medical schools I apply to, or am I suppose to just write about it in my personal statement only?

Thanks for any advice

It would not usually be expected to provide such letters on an application. Certainly you should be able to explain the situation in your essay or other application material and your letters of recommendation may be of help.

Professor Plum · Jun 29, 2007

dochoov said:
I recently submitted my primary application. In my work and experiences sections, I included a very small tidbit of information indicating that I would do something in the future, that I now know I will not be able to do, due to several reasons. I regret this action and now understand why doing this--no matter how certain I may be of a pending event--is unacceptable. Is there typically a section in the secondary application that will provide me with the opportunity to fix this error and clarify the situation, by explaining what happened to change my plans, for example? The mistake I made is small and will undoubtedly be overlooked by most if not all of the ADCOMS that may see my application. However, I don't want any discrepancies on my application.

First check to see if AMCAS will allow you to amend your activities on your application; I'm not sure whether they will. If not, then you might try writing a brief paragraph to explain that you were not able to participate in that activity after all, and send it to each school yourself as a file update.

Miss Scarlett · Jun 30, 2007

royalstumble said:
This is an update to my existing problem (page 2

My GPA would have been an Overall -3.47 and a BCPM of 3.7, but AMCAS calculated classes i took at a community college for summer school when i was 13 and they are 3.26 and 3.37 respecitvely. No, they were not anything crazy (pre algebra classes), I just saw these summer classes as informal and my family would even go on vacations for the finals so I never took any of them and subsequently did poorly. My parents probably should have audited them or something, but i don't think they knew what that was nor did they know it was going to affect me now (medicine is a relatively recent endeavor).

I know that it's nobody's fault but my own, but It's hard for me to put in perspective.

In addition, my 3.46 university GPA is coupled with a strong upward trend with 3.9+'s in all my 3rd and 4th years in both science and non science classes. My father's cancer came out of remission my 2nd year of college and it brought my GPA down a little.

My MCAT is a 35 (13 BS, 12 PS, and 10 VR)

As an ADCOM what would you think of my application based on the information presented?

Thank you so much for your time!

Your MCAT score is very good and an upward trend in your GPA is always better than the opposite. Some secondary applications will ask if there is anything else you would like the admissions committee to know. That might be a good place to explain the situation with the community college classes.

Best of luck to you.

Professor Plum · Jul 2, 2007

mlee8 said:
I am a relatively recent college graduate with a degree in Biology. I plan on applying to med school in June '08. I have been working the past 6 months as a Research Associate at a medical school at home. In college, I liked the research that I did so I thought that getting a job in research while I was waiting to apply was a good idea - the problem is that I hate it. I really just don't like it, to the point where I almost dread going to work every day. At first, I just thought it was the lab I am in but I think it's just bench research in general that I don't like. I volunteer at the hospital a couple of nights a week and I can't wait to leave work to go there. Basically, I would rather be doing anything but research.

I guess my question is this. Is it worth it to stay in a job that I am miserable in? Would med schools frown upon leaving a job before a year is up? And would my lack of interest in research make me an undesirable candidate? I love science, so I would really like to find a job that I enjoy. I was thinking clinical research perhaps? I still have two years before I can matriculate (hoping I get into med school on the first try!), and I would really like to find a job that I enjoy. Please Help! (Thank you in advance)

Have you thought things out thoroughly and explored your other options? In other words, if you quit your current job now, do you have another job you can start instead, or are you potentially going to be sitting around doing nothing for a year? I think if you do quit your job, you need to have a plan about what you're going to do to support yourself this year and to replace this job. Don't quit your current job before you have a new one lined up. Also, if and when you do quit, don't burn any bridges. Science is a small world, and you never know when you might run into your bosses again. Give your supervisor two weeks notice and offer to finish any outstanding projects or train your replacement if they need you to. Good luck.

Doodledog · Jul 2, 2007

johnstonburg said:
Hi and thanks for your time,

A few of my friends have suggested to me that I have ADD over the past year or so. I looked into it, but never really thought it was a big enough deal for me to seek treatment. I've always thought that I've been a bit of an underachiever, but my MCATs really nailed the point down for me a few days ago. I have a 3.33 but an MCAT of 38.

I haven't yet gone to see a campus psychiatrist, but plan to do so this upcoming week. I'm not looking to explain away three years of mediocre grades, but I do think that I should at least finally see if medical help though counseling or medicine would help me to be able to study more like most other pre-med students.

These questions are somewhat hypothetical in that I have yet to be diagnosed with anything but: if I am diagnosed with ADD or some other learning disability, should I mention it in an interview or on a secondary application? Should I even suggest that it might have been a part of the reason why I've been underperforming in school? Does it look like I'm merely trying to avoid taking responsibility for my underperformance or does it look like I'm being responsible and trying to correct it?

Thank you again

I don't think anyone can answer hypotheticals such as this. In general, I recommend that people think very carefully before revealing personal medical information of any type. In the hypothetical situation you describe, it is likely that there would be a range of responses among adcom members, including some negative reactions. Nonetheless, it is impossible to know how that might affect your application without seeing your letters of recommendation and essays.

Professor Plum · Jul 3, 2007

BirenJ said:
Ok, so I thought I had this figured out but now I'm reevaluating my situation. I've been told that I'm in a very grey area so maybe you folks can help me out.

My overall GPA is 3.4 with a strong upward trend (i've been getting closer and closer to 4.0 since soph second semester) while my science (this just takes into account my bio classes and NOT chem/physics) GPA is 3.0. If it helps, all As five chem/physics classes (orgo 1/2, biochem, phys 1/2) and two Bs gen chem classes.

My story is that I was a little immature with my study habits and I lacked academic dedication the first two/three semesters of college. Apparently screw ups in those 3 semesters are coming back to haunt me with the overall/bio GPA. I have one more year to go till graduation with 5-6 possible bio classes still left to take.

I have not taken the MCATs yet mostly because I'm not 100% prepared and probably won't be either until Sep or Jan. I want to take it just once and make sure that I kick ass at it.

I don't have strong ECs mostly because I've had to work full-time non-medical related jobs. However, I'm starting to shadow few physicians and am going for my EMT license so I can start volunteering for a local ambulance company. I was in a frat for a whole year and held few positions including VP.

I thought that if somebody like me did an SMP after undergrad, it would tremendously help my application since I'm on a borderline GPA and possibly borderline MCAT. However, I was advised that with my credentials I may not have to do an SMP at all. Now I'm totally lost. I am somewhat financially strained so I want to make sure that I'm spending money in a smart and efficient manner rather than "oh i'll apply to x number of schools - shot in the dark", understand what I mean?

Best route: apply this cycle/take the sept MCAT with the so-so ECs? wait till senior grades come in and apply next cycle/jan MCAT with EMT experience under belt? OR do an SMP next year regardless of MCAT/senior GPA?

Thank you for taking the time.

You should make an appointment with your premedical advisor; we really can't answer this question. But definitely try not to take the MCAT in September of the year when you apply, because it will make you a very late applicant.

Professor Plum · Jul 3, 2007

chickenlittle84 said:
Hi! I have a question about whether it is necessary to frame an upward trend in the optional secondary essay that many schools have available ("Is there anything else we should know?"). My science gpa has an upward trend, 2.5 freshman year, 3.1 sophomore year, 3.3 junior year, and 3.7 senior year from a competitive school. The overall result is still not so good, especially because I didn't take a lot of extra science classes as I am a non-science major.

In any case, is it necessary/recommended for me to say something about this upward trend? And by say something, I guess I would just acknowledge that my earlier performance was poor, but that I have taken responsibility for this by performing well in upper level classes...? I have trouble framing this because it is nobody's fault except my own, nothing bad happened to me, etc. And I want to make sure it is clear that I am fully aware of the fact that it was my responsibility and that I did not live up to it. But I am not the same person that I was 5 years ago.

Any thoughts? Thanks!

I think you can say more or less what you just said here. Try to keep your essay positive and focus on the learning experience aspect rather than being defensive or trying to make excuses for your poor grades freshman year. Good luck.

All4MyDaughter · Jul 4, 2007

Do you need assistance figuring out how to enter your work or activities in AMCAS? There is a fantastic thread in pre-allo that addresses just that. Check there first before asking your question here. You may just find what you are looking for!

Entering Work/Activities into AMCAS

Doodledog · Jul 4, 2007

Misty said:
Hi everyone

I graduated in May '05 with a degree in psychology and a minor in biology. My undergrad has a pre-health committee that compiles LOR's on behalf of all applicants, and it is headed by a professor that I had a falling out with during my senior year. Without going into details, the committee chair made some very derogatory comments to me and I ended up going to the dean (who sided with me) to make sure this would not become an issue with my committee letter that year. In the end, I decided not to apply until this year and now find myself having to deal with this issue all over again. It is now 2 years later and am wondering if I should have my recommenders send in letters to the schools directly instead of dealing with this issue again. I called the chair this afternoon to ask if I'm still able to request the committee letter. She said I would be able to but I could definitely tell she was not very happy to speak with me, giving me the impression that all is not forgotten. So I was wondering what adcom's might think about an applicant who chooses not to use the committee letter knowing that they are definitely preferred over individual letters. Is this a smart move on my part, or will it raise a lot of red flags?

If I should use individual LOR's, I know that some schools require that you submit a letter saying why you chose not to go through the committee, and I really do not want to mention anything about this issue. Could I explain that 2 years have passed and that I am living in a different state now and feel that the letters from the committee would not be as beneficial to me as those that I could get now?

I am really upset about this whole situation and I would really appreciate hearing any advice you can give me.

🙁

In terms of the rules that schools have, then clearly you would need to write to each school and see what they say. However, I think you are asking for a more general comment on how we might see the absence of a committee letter from a graduate of a school we know to have such letters.

Personally, and I know I am not alone in this, I do not like committee letters and have, at times, felt they did the applicant a disservice. This is especially true of committees that actually have an interview process. Inevitably those interviews are harder than ours and the report we get not very useful. Especially for an applicant who has graduated more than a year previously, it would be hard to see the value of a committee letter. Of course, YMMV and some adcoms must like them or else why do they still exist?

I would not even think about why an applicant didn't have such a letter, but I think if it was a large school and the places you were applying were used to seeing these letters, a very brief email or other note indicating that you "chose" to forgo that process for the reasons you described about time and distance would suffice. If adcoms want more info, they can ask you. I bet they don't in most if not all cases.

Never have someone write a letter, committee of otherwise, that may include something "bad" in it. These red flags can greatly harm an otherwise good application. Better to have a few folks ask why you didn't get a committee letter.
Try to have a letter from someone who has worked with you in a scientific or medical capacity since you graduated.

Good luck and don't stress about this issue too much. I know that if committee letters disappeared completely I'd be thrilled.

Doodledog · Jul 4, 2007

FlStudent said:
Question for those who have been on an adcom:
I failed to list a course on my AMCAS app (already verified) that I plan to take in the future (this Fall) and it is a prerequisite course. I am afraid that schools will see that I do not meet their requirements and dismiss me automatically. (http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showthread.php?t=82360 , posts 3-5) How should I best rectify this situation? Would an email from me informing the adcoms of my intentions to take the course help or would another avenue be better? AMCAS will not allow me to add current and future courses.

thanks.

I doubt that schools will automatically dismiss your application for this. It is certainly best to directly communicate any issue such as this with each school. Email or phone call should be a good start.

Doodledog · Jul 4, 2007

foreverLaur said:
I had a 2.5 my first two years of college for no real good valid reasons (didn't know how to study, didn't enjoy my major, didn't enjoy my college). However, I switched schools and majors (to microbiology) and I have had a 4.0 ever since as well as a 3.85 science GPA.

What would be a way to shed some sort of positive light on this very very poor GPA and the major upward trend? I'm not really sure how to address this issue in my PS and in interviews (hopefully).

There's no magical approach. Schools will see the trend and you may be asked about it. As we have suggested in the past, be brief in mentioning this issue in essays. Don't make excuses (meaning don't whine or complain about bad profs, etc, just give a simple explanation) and focus the essay not on past problems but on why you now are the person the medical school wants to interview. At interviews, take the same approach. Simply indicate that you were not prepared for college but that you rapidly improved and have demonstrated your ability to handle the medical school curriculum. If they invited you for an interview then they fundamentally believe this about you anyway, but may question you about it to see how you respond.

montessori2md · Jul 7, 2007

Tildy edit: I'm leaving this part of montessori2md's post up so everyone can see how cute the avatar is!

Doodledog · Jul 7, 2007

montessori2md said:
Thanks! In advance...

Because my university was on quarters, and my post-bacc institution is on semesters, I am currently .7 credits short in general chemistry, even though I have completed chem I and chem II. I am similarly short in bio, but that is an easy fix, as I plan on taking microbiology in the fall and that should qualify.

But for gen chem, at what point in the application process should I ask the various admissions offices what my choices are for making up that credit? Is this an email question, or a telephone question? : ) Interested primarily in protocol, obviously I need to deal with this before I schedule spring classes.

What I hope to do is convince various adcomms to accept biochem for that little bit I am short, and failing that, to do a research project in chem for a credit hour. Would prefer that to inorganic or p-chem.

I would do it at the time of sending in secondary applications or at latest when scheduling interviews if one is offered. Email or phone is fine.

But the real reason I answered this is that assuming your avatar is your kid, s/he is really cute and Tildy sure hopes they have a dog to play with 🙂. If you are a Montessori teacher, make sure to talk about that in your essays, etc. It'll be a unique conversation topic for interviews!

Doodledog · Jul 9, 2007

Hi Mentors,

I'm applying to medical school next year. A large part of my motivation to apply is due to the fact that several members of my family, including my mother, have active TB. I myself have latent TB.

Would you discourage me from discussing my TB status in my application? I pose no health risks to anyone as long as my TB is latent, and I will undergo a course of antibiotics beginning in August.

I hope to conduct infectious disease research as part of my medical career, and wish to explain the evolution of my interest in the medical field as truthfully as possible.

Thank you for your thoughts.

Unless you are asked a question about it specifically by a school, or are specifically asked a question about ongoing medical treatment, I woudn't bring it up during the application process. There are better ways to discuss your interest in ID. If you are accepted, you should discuss it with the school health officer.

I have deleted your name as I don't think it's needed for this post. If you would prefer your name back here, post and I will put it back in.

The CookieMonster · Jul 11, 2007

Hi Everyone,

I'm a little unsure if this is the right place to do this, but here goes:

I'm a somewhat recent (2004) graduate of a small liberal arts college with degrees in chemistry and religion. I applied once unsuccessfully (2004) and decided to take some time off to improve my application. I applied this past year and I am happy to finally say that I will be attending medical school this fall. Since SDN has been such a great resource for me during college and both my application cycles, I'm here to help pre-meds, and in particular, re-applicants any way I can. I'm pretty much an open book, so barring any inappropriate personal questions, anything is fair game -- PMs are welcome! 🙂

Doodledog · Jul 13, 2007

EagerToBeMD said:
Hi. I'm a nontraditional student who returned to school after a 5 year absence. I took the pre-med prerequisites for the very first time and I got A's in all of them. The problem I've been told recently is that I only took 8 credits at a time because of other commitments. I'm told this is a problem because I was trying to make up for a poor undergraduate GPA and they say that it doesn't show I can handle the rigors of med school.

Is there anything I can do to improve my chances by next year short of quiting my job to take on a full load in the Fall? Do adcomms view nontraditionals differently in that they know that sometimes they have family and work commitments that keep them from taking 15 credit hours a semester, especially since all 15 hours would be science classes?

If it weren't for reading SDN, it would never have even occurred to me that there was something less than optimal in terms of demonstrating academic capability about working or caring for a family while taking a partial course load. I never have thought of it as an issue nor heard it considered as one in any discussions of which I have been part. I don't think giving up a job or abandoning your family just so you can prove you can go to school full time is a good thing for schools to expect and I doubt that most do. If you can get A's in the classes while holding a job or raising a family (and studying for the MCAT and doing well on it) I have no concern about your ability to handle the class work of medical school. But, obviously somewhere, some adcoms must care. Or so I've heard on SDN.

Doodledog · Jul 14, 2007

minitwinkie said:
I was born with a profound hearing loss in both ears. I grew up wearing hearing aids and speech/sign language. I skipped 9th grade to attend the IL Math & Science Academy. I graduated at age 16. I got a cochlear implant at age 18 in 2005. I will be a senior this fall, graduate this spring at age 20, and I plan on doing an SMP or Masters to allow me to "catch up" in age and improve my academic credentials.

I plan on using my deafness as one of my "advertising" points. Having grown up with hearing parents and knowing a few Deaf friends with hearing parents, I see there is often a communication barrier. I want to be a pediatrician because I think that the communication barrier existing between a Deaf child and hearing parents (or a hearing child and Deaf parents) can be detrimental to the health of the child. Since I have been blessed with the ability to communicate via both spoken English (I took Spanish in high school but I am terribly rusty now) and sign language, I believe that I can bridge the communication gap to ensure optimal care and have both the hearing and Deaf audiences trust that they can understand me through my multiple avenues of communication.

I have been receiving advice from both corners of the ring. Some say I should get in on my own credentials and not mention my hearing loss at all. Some say I should definitely point it out because it makes my credentials "look that much better".

I know I want to be a doctor. I am doing undergraduate research this summer in microbiology and I definitely have learned that research is not my calling. I would appreciate suggestions as to how to approach AdComs with my hearing loss. Should I mention it in my essay or wait until I get to interviews? Should I not mention it at all? Thank you for any comments you can offer.

This is not a simple question and ultimately only you can make this decision. First you have to decide whether this is something you want to discuss. You do not have to mention it in your essay. Assuming that it will be apparent during your interview session, then you will likely want to discuss it then, but even at that point it isn't necessary.

But the real question is whether you wish to describe your route towards medicine and your careeer plans by including your experiences with hearing loss. If so, then include it in your essays and be prepared to discuss it at the interviews. If you feel these are completely separate, then don't.

In general, medical schools cannot use your hearing loss in evaluating your application. In my experience, this type of thing has relatively little impact one way or the other on your application. However, as with anyone, if what has gone on in your life related to hearing explains an important part of your passion for medicine, then you are doing yourself a disservice by leaving it out of your application.

In summary, from what you have written and the appearance of comfort you have with discussing your hearing, I would describe your path to medicine in the essay and include your hearing issues and how that affects your future. But do so only to the degree that you feel comfortable doing so, not based on how it might affect your application.

oxeye · Jul 20, 2007

miracle4eva said:
I have a 3.87Gpa chemE, 2yr research, some volunteering at a hospital. My mcat is 24O😳: 7bs,9ps,8vr. I know i can do better since my practices were higher. The seats for the sept mcat is filled and now i'm left with this score

I just wanted to know wat u guys think abt my stats and if i even a shot by applying this cycle considering that i am also URM.

I'm sorry, but our mentors are not able to answer these types of posts. I would suggest asking in pre-allo or pre-osteo:

Pre-allopathic: What are my Chances/Where to Apply?
Pre-osteopathic: What are my chances?

Doodledog · Jul 20, 2007

flyingcircus109 said:
I am not sure if this is the proper thread for this question, and if it is not please feel free to redirect me/my question to a more appropriate thread. However, I will start here. I plan to spend a year between graduation and medical school working via Americorps at an organization that includes a homeless shelter/food bank/job and rehabilitation services, a clinic, tutoring, and a plethora of other services for migrant workers in southern Colorado. I took an orientation/service trip there through my university and fell in love with the organization, its objectives, and the people it serves, and vowed (to myself) to return for a full year at some point in my life (Preferrably with better Spanish skills)! I feel that the best time to do this might be after I complete my undergraduate degree. However, I don't want medical schools to see this as a lack of excitement about entering medical school or being a doctor. Should I postpone the Americorps endeavor? If I do go ahead and do it after I graduate, would it be wise to apply to medical school during my junior year and ask for deferred admission or apply during my senior year for matriculation a year later?

Pick the pathway that you would like to do. There is no race to get into or through medical school and schools will not look down on you for spending time with a group like Americorps. By spending time doing activities that provide service to others, enrich your experiences, and hopefully help you develop some independence and maturity, you are making yourself a stronger applicant. Medical schools will not criticize that. Try to continue some medically-related shadowing or the like while working, but this is not absolutely critical. I would generally not recommend applying with the intent on deferring since there is no guarantee you will be allowed a deferral, especially if you are accepted off a wait list.

Professor Plum · Jul 21, 2007

dandelion1123 said:
Hello and thank you for reading this:

I am a recent graduate and am applying this cycle. I was subject to disciplinary action in my freshman year, and have since grown and become more self-aware. I have the support of my university and committee letter, and have received a number of secondaries from universities that screen.

My question is: on secondaries that ask for additional information, or anything else that the adcom should know--should I elaborate on what I have already put in my amcas app?

Thank you for your help.

My opinion is that if you've already explained your disciplinary action once, and the school still sent you a secondary, then there's no reason to flog yourself a second time for the same offense. Unless there's a question on the secondary that explicitly asks you to explain your disciplinary action in further detail, I'd talk about something else. Use that space to tell the adcomm something positive about yourself that they can't get from reading your AMCAS. If they want more clarification about your disciplinary action, they will ask you about it at your interview.

Tildy or Madame, will one of you weigh in on this one also?

Adcom2 · Jul 21, 2007

Hi everyone,
I'm a new moderator for admissions, a third year medical student who just spent a year on my school's committee as a voting member. I have special expertise in non-traditional students and students with challenging undergraduate records.

Standard Questions.
1. Why did you choose your field of study?
I'm not sure why I wanted to be a physician back in high school, if in fact I really did. I started college as a pre-med, but quickly gave up after nearly failing organic chemistry and calculus. After sliding through two successful but un-looked-for careers, I went back to school to get credentialed in my second career. I did well in courses I had really bombed as an undergraduate in the 80s, and decided that as long as I was paddling my canoe, I may as well be paddling it toward a long-held goal. I'm fascinated by the doctor-patient relationship, and like the triple aspect of the career: patient care, scientific advancement and teaching.

2. Where do you see yourself in 10 years?
In practice. Possibly emergency medicine, or anesthesia. I'm just starting third year and leaving my options open.

3. What advice do you have for students planning to enter the field of medicine?
Be sincere, get some good experiences, study hard, and play the game. It takes both, I think. Good luck!

(cross posted for your safety 🙂)

Doodledog · Jul 22, 2007

dandelion1123 said:
Hello and thank you for reading this:

I am a recent graduate and am applying this cycle. I was subject to disciplinary action in my freshman year, and have since grown and become more self-aware. I have the support of my university and committee letter, and have received a number of secondaries from universities that screen.

My question is: on secondaries that ask for additional information, or anything else that the adcom should know--should I elaborate on what I have already put in my amcas app?

Thank you for your help.

I agree with Professor Plum's answer but I'm not entirely sure anyone can tell you what to do based on this information. For each school, you need to provide a complete explanation of what happened and why you are not the "same person" now. Optimally, at least one of your letters of recommendation should address this issue. If this has been done in your AMCAS or in other information sent to the schools, then you do not need to write the same things again on secondaries.

Doodledog · Jul 30, 2007

artaxerxes said:
Hi, this doesn't really belong here, but its the closest matching thread I can find🙂

My question that I would like an ADCOM member to answer is how the committee views exposure and experience in complementary and alternative medicine. Specifically, I'm talking about Complementary medicine, which includes acupuncture, traditional herbal medicine, that generally have state/federal regulatory bodies. Now does this sort of exposure/interest detract from the application? is it dangerous to mention? and will it invite questions of "why medical school"? any advice would be appreciated.

This is an interesting question. I don't really know how different adcom members would feel about it. I think some would find it worth talking about, some would challenge you about it, and others wouldn't say much but might think less of you. What the proportion of each of these is can't be even guessed at!

My recommendation is to go carefully with this area. Indicate an interest in considering using these techniques or at least studying them. Be prepared to explain why you think they have value. Make sure you indicate that you will focus on standard allopathic/osteopathic techniques. In general, there is more risk than likely benefit to you in saying too much about this. However, if it is important to you, then you should talk about it. Just be cautious and emphasizes integrated care including standard medicine and you may make some friends on the adcom and avoid alienating anyone.

One final point relevant to this. Make sure you phrase things positively. That is, do not say things like "Physicians don't know what they are doing" or "Most doctors use too many medications." You are applying to medical school and do not have the basis for these opinions, in addition to the obviously bad idea of criticizing those who are interviewing you.

Professor Plum · Aug 5, 2007

lucy said:
I would appreciate any advise that anyone would give me. I am trying to decide that best way to make myself a better candidate. I have a BS in Biology form 1978 with a gpa of 2.9, an AAS in Nursing and a BS in Electrical engineering with a gpa of 2.6. I worked in the EE field and was laid off when the dotcom's went bust. I subsequently lost everything. I had to go back to nursing just to survive. I had always aspired to become a physician and got side tracked due to finances etc. I would like to pursue this goal at this time. I repeated the prereq's via independent study, after consulting with several ADCOMS, who told me it was alright to due provided that I had taken the classes with labs. My purpose was to review for the MCAT. I have taken the Kaplan review course and scored 36 on the practice exams. Also, the gpa for the repeated prereq's is 3.8.

I have several options at this point. They are as follows:

1. A post-bac at Hunter

2. ALM at Harvard at the extension school

3. MS in Biology at St. Joseph's in Conn.

My thinking process is the proceeding>

Taking more undergrad classes will not raise my gpa that much higher at this point and when finishing the program, I will have nothing to show for it.

An ALM at Harvard would be excellent, expect there is the thesis. I was told that the program is usually completed in 3-4 years, with the thesis taking 9 months. Time is an issue at this point, but if my chances are better, then the sacrifice is well worth it.

A MS from St. Joseph's is an alternative because one can opt out of the thesis. In this case the program can be completed within 2 years.

I am at a stand still because I don't know which route to take. Any advise would be very much appreciated.

Thank you

I'm sorry, but I don't think we can tell you what to do either. You really should contact one or two of the medical schools where you want to apply and arrange a face-to-face meeting with someone from the admissions staff who has all of the facts in front of him or her and can give you the right advice. Good luck.

Professor Plum · Aug 5, 2007

sheiboro said:
MY MCAT scores are not competitive enough for direct admissions. I have taken the MCAT four times and have consistently scored 14O. I recently met with a health advisor who suggested that I may have a learning disability and suggested that I get tested. I met with a specialist and was diagnosed with dyslexia. My question is that if I take the MCAT again (for the fifth time) and achieve a competitive score, will I have a chance of going to medical school?

Sorry, but we can't answer WAMC questions.

Professor Plum · Aug 5, 2007

MedStudentWanna said:
Hey, guys! I have a question about letters of recommendation. I did my pre-reqs at a community college so most of my science teachers had Master's, not PhD's. Will this be a problem? I only had one teacher with a PhD, but I'd like my two science letter writers to be two teachers I know will write good letters. Both have Master's though. Are they viewed less valuable?

Why don't you just get all three of them to write you letters? Most schools will allow you to submit up to six letters.

Professor Plum · Aug 5, 2007

joydee said:
I am a Nurse Practitioner with special circumstances. I initially attended a community college to become a registered nurse then transitioned to a masters program for the nurse practitioner program. I do not have a bachelors degree and the grading system in my graduate program was H-P-L (high pass, pass and low pass). I have started taking the pre-reqs for medical school at a local university but I am not sure how my GPA will be calculated since I did not attend a formal undergraduate program. Can someone assist me with how to best proceed in this situation and tell me how an admissions committees will view my circumstances. Thanks in advance for a reply. - Joydee

Many applicants take some classes P/F, and AMCAS will allow you to enter your HP/P/F grades into their system. Before you apply, you will need to obtain an unofficial copy of your transcript from every school that you have ever attended. Enter the coursework from each transcript on your AMCAS application EXACTLY as it appears on the transcript. AMCAS will then check your transcripts against what you entered into their system, and they will automatically calculate a GPA for you based upon your graded work.

Professor Plum · Aug 5, 2007

premeddick said:
I have been working full time for the past year since graduation. I have had many experiences and I have been a part of many unique opportunities because of my job. I am currently applying and I have been filling out many secondaries. Is it particularly bad to talk a lot about my job? It seems fairly relevant because it is basic science research with some clinical exposure and I have some leadership positions and I get to publish. It is a great job but I don't want it to be the only think I talk about in my essays even though its played a big part of my life for the past year. Thanks for your input.

If your job influenced you to go into medicine, then by all means, discuss it. Are you applying M.D./Ph.D.? If so, then it is definitely important to discuss your research experiences. Good luck.

Professor Plum · Aug 5, 2007

dadasolee said:
Hi, I am a premed student who is looking into Texas medical schools. Considering that Texas schools require four, not two, semesters of biology as well as one semester of calculus (hard to get by with AP credit), how do they perceive an applicant who lacks one or two pre-requisite courses at the time of submitting applications? Does the majority of the applicants fulfill all of the required courses before applying? If this is not looked down upon as something negative, does that mean you can send your full (meaning, with all of your pre-requisite course grades) transcript as late as the spring semester after the summer you have submitted the application? Thank you for your guidance.

Most people do finish all of the basic pre-requisites before applying because you need to take them before you sit for the MCAT. But you're talking about extra pre-requisites, and I think as long as you have a plan to get them all done before you matriculate into medical school, you should be ok. You might want to contact a few of the TX schools and double check with them.

Adcom2 · Aug 6, 2007

Hershi said:
Hi. I will be a 2nd yr pre-med student in the fall. Over the past year, I have dealt with being diagnosed with hypothyroidism leading to depression [some what] and the of course obstacles of time management and transition of hs to college. For this reason, I finished with a horrible first year , and Cs in biology/chemistry and physics I. I understand and upward trend will help as well as a good mcat score, but what should I do? Also how should I go about with explaining this? Should I include it in my personal statement when I apply or should I do it by other means?

It's too early to be thinking about that question. Do well this year, focus on learning, medical and volunteer experience, and also having a life outside of school. And don't worry about medical school admissions, at least for another year 🙂

Doodledog · Aug 9, 2007

mmcnam said:
Hello,

I am an applicant for this current cycle. I am hoping to be very competitive - I have a 3.9, a liberal arts major and hopefully a good MCAT score (my practice test average was about a 37 and I took it yesterday for real). I am very much hoping to get into UCLA, which is where my fiance is attending graduate school this fall. Is there anything I can do to absolutely maximize my chances at getting into this one school? I am an out-of-state resident, but I'll be moving to Los Angeles and working in some kind of a research position at the university or medical school for the interim year.

Thanks!

There is no magic in this, even for strong applicants. I'm not sure your MCAT is going to be available in time for you to apply early decision to UCLA, but you could check with them about this. Failing that, and recognizing that there is more than one medical school in southern California, you should apply to a range of schools in the general area. Only you can decide if you wish to tell the schools in your secondary applications about your fiance. It may or may not help any, but it probably won't hurt. They'll know you're serious about their school (eg UCLA), but that doesn't necessarily mean they will look more favorably on your application than they would otherwise.

Doodledog · Aug 25, 2007

FurmanJon said:
Hello mentors,

I have a question about my unique situation. First, some background: I graduated in 2004 with a BS in Exercise Science and due to several missteps--almost entirely in the first two years--ended with a cumulative of 2.75. Now, I am in a state where the school to which I am applying views my UG school as significantly more rigorous and adds 0.5 to applicants' GPAs from this institution (now, several on SDN have contested this and I certainly agree that it seems far-fetched, but I assure you it's true). Between 2004 and the present, I unfortunately had some graduate experiences that did not turn out well due to "life" circumstances. These I partially explained in my PS, and am prepared to do so in my interview. My AMCAS GPA turned out to be 2.67, sadly. This gives me a 3.17 in the medical school's eyes.

My question involves my MCAT. I did not take the pre-requisities (this medical school does not require the normal litany of pre-reqs; they assert that a good MCAT score presupposes you've had the courses. This makes perfect sense to me). I have only had Physics I, A&P, and I received AP credit for 2 semesters of General Chemistry. Having a natural ability in the sciences and also an innate, honed reasoning/comprehension ability, I signed up for and took the July 24th MCAT. I scored a 32 R (10PS, 10VR, 12BS). The Question: how would an adcom react to someone who has an above-average MCAT who did not take the pre-req science courses? I taught myself the material in which I was deficient before the exam. My contention will be such that I am highly capable intellectually, have superb critical thinking skills, steely determination, and a natural penchant for the sciences, and this is how I accomplished the feat. The overall hope is that this will help validate my argument that the GPA/grad program mishaps were highly circumstantial, do not reflect my true ability, and will not be repeated.

That last part is the goal--how might an adcom view this? I'm not asking for "my chances."

Thank you for reading that novel, and thank you in advance for your seasoned advice.

An interesting question. The problem is that you are directing your efforts towards one or two schools with some unusual policies (these are not schools I am at). Since most schools do not add GPA points or allow one to omit prereqs, it is impossible to assess how someone at a school that does those things would look at the application. Although I personally make absolutely no attempt to consider the relationship between an MCAT score and what classes an applicant took (we have no idea if an applicant took prep courses, etc), that might not be true at the schools to which you are applying. All you can do is apply and hope that they see it in the way you wish them to view it.

MSmentor028 · Aug 29, 2007

dancingdoctor said:
Hello! First off, thank you very much for your commitment to helping with this forum, we really do appreciate it! Secondly, I apologize if my message seems redudant and long winded but I just want to make sure all of my concerns are mentioned.

Im an entering 5th year senior at a state university, majoring in Biology. My cumulative GPA is ~2.66 and BCMP ~ 2.14. Now, I want to consider all of my options as far as taking more courses to prove that I am not a joke. My last semester GPA was ~3.7, so Im atleast beginning an upward trend. I would like to know which of my options sounds best as far as really proving an upward trend in my undergrad coursework and breaking the 3.0 barrier (or beyond).

My options that I can think of are:

- Graduate in May 2008 (I started in 2003, so it puts me on the 5 year track already) Do a formal post-bacc at the Harvard Extension School where I would retake basic science undergrad coursework, taking only about 32 credits in 2 years to hopefully scrape the 3.0 mark.

- Remain at my state university as an undergrad, continuing into my *6th year, if permitted! Spend only 1 year to retake 32 credits of basic science courses (as opposed to 2 years in the post-bacc) More possibly obtaining higher grades here due to less rigorous coursework. Then, maybe consider taking some upper level courses in a 1 year distance education program at my state university or perhaps through Harvard Extension.

- Any other reasonable options/pathways? Am I missing anything? Please inform me! (I however dont want to consider a Masters Program since its GPA doesnt factor into undergrad. What about 1-year certificate programs?)

So, again, my main concern is that I want to be able to take a sufficient number of credits to convey an upward trend to the admission committee, and also break that 3.0 barrier (and hopefully go further).

I am feeling overwhelmed at this point! Ideally, I want to restore my GPA in the smallest amount of time possible while making myself competitive enough for med school acceptances (provided I apply broadly).

Thank you very much for your time and assistance. 🙂 Sorry again for the long winded message!

To begin with, you need to realize that there is no quick fix for what you are trying to achieve. And while your cumm. GPA is close to 3.0 and in the competitive level, your BCMP is quite low.

You need to ask yourself, what can you do to properly raise your GPA without sliding back down. If this takes more than a year so be it. Your best bet maybe a post bac program. Contact the post bac program that you are interested in and speak to the councilors there to discuss your personal situation.

Doodledog · Nov 8, 2007

murdoc said:
This is my first post on the site, so I'm sorry if I messed up...

I have a couple of questions regarding an arrest that occurred during my undergrad junior year. Near the end of the first semester, I was arrested with a "friend" (he no longer bears that title 🙂, and was charged with two felonies. I had not actually done anything wrong, but was pointed out by someone as being an "accomplice," and was immediately arrested. Long story short, I went back and forth to court for about 6 months before the charges against me were finally dropped.
This was a difficult time for me, to say the least, and I had the great luck of having these court dates, lawyer meetings, etc., coincide with the most difficult class schedule I had during my undergrad career. I ended up with a C+ in Ochem II, and about an overall 2.8 for the semester. However, I was able to bounce back during my senior year, both with my grades (~3.8, 3.6 overall UG) and MCATs (35)
I did not have to report this incident on the original AMCAS application, because I never went through any trial, and I was not found guilty of anything. I will probably have to talk about it with the schools that specifically requested arrest information on their secondaries, and that is the basis for my first question.

1. Do you have any advice as to how I should talk about what happened, if asked about it (details about the actual incident, the process I went through, the outcome for myself and the person I was arrested with, etc.).

My second question is in regards to the schools that do not know about what happened. If I had a choice, I would not bring it up at all. However, this played a big part in causing my poor grades during the semester this all took place - and the schools may ask me what went wrong during this semester.

2. I would like to know if I should just attribute the cause for this problem semester (if asked) to "personal problems" and a difficult class schedule, and leave it at that - or if I should go into it and explain the entire situation.

Thank you for reading my post, and appreciate any help you can give me.

These are difficult questions and there is no absolute answer. My general sense is that if you were completely cleared of all responsibility that this is something you should be very up-front about in your essays. If you do discuss this episode in any essays it will be fair game at interviews though, so be prepared for that. I think "personal problems" will not sound good and it would be better to not say anything about that semester UNLESS you are going to be completely honest about what happened (as I personally recommend).

If and when you do tell the story, try to do so in a way that makes it clear that although you did nothing LEGALLY wrong, you recognize that you made mistakes from which you have learned. Provide evidence, via letters of rec, grades, volunteer service of the type of person you are and that the episode did not reflect on you as a person. This type of contrition will get you farther than attempting to only blame the other person, etc. Remember, an interview is not a court of law. Contrition and using the experience as a learning experience will get you the farthest.

QofQuimica · Nov 24, 2007

FutureERDoc2013 said:
My heart is set on pursuing a career in medicine,😍 but attending medical school seems to be a bit more than I thought. I graduated with a 2.3 GPA. I retook a few classes but that only brought me up to a 2.5👎. I know that GPA and MCAT scores are the dominant factors in admissions to even look at your application. Will they pay attention to the fact that I have a 3.8 GPA👍 in grad school (MHA), or I the fact that have a LPN 👍 and have been working in a nursing home to gain healthcare experience? I've tried to see someone at my undergrad school, but no one is available to speak with to help me. I am not looking apply till end of 2008. But a lot of money will go into retaking the classes that may not even boost my GPA up if I'm taking the class for the second time. I used the AAMC grading, not good. Can someone give me some advice, alternatives😕😕. I'm thinking of nursing but my heart isn't in it, it would be settling for the next best thing in my eyes. 🙁

I took a look at your profile; with a 2.5 GPA and a 15 MCAT, your academic profile is currently too weak for you to apply to medical school successfully. I suggest that you start by thinking long and hard about what you want to accomplish. Is an MD or DO really necessary to do it? What other options (ex. RN, PA, NP) are open to you that would allow you to accomplish your career goals? If you decide that you really do need an MD, what about going to medical school offshore? In addition, you should get some counseling about what you can do to improve your study habits and earn all As and Bs from here on out. Regardless of what kind of program you wind up choosing, improving your study habits will be essential. If you cannot get counseling from your college, look into hiring a professional career counselor who can help guide you.

Best of luck to you. 🙂

QofQuimica · Dec 9, 2008

I am reviving this thread for those of you who are interested in asking about how to explain special circumstances on your apps to adcoms. I am a third year nontraditional med student and a student adcom with full voting privileges.

Rules:

1) Please read the first post on this thread before posting a question to make sure that your question hasn't already been answered.

2) Please do not PM questions to me or any of the other adcoms who answer questions in this thread. If you have an unanswered question that is worth asking, other people will want to know the answer too. So please post it here.

3) I am an adcom, not a fortuneteller. So please, no "what are my chances" (WAMC) posts. There is a subforum especially for WAMC threads that is even called the WAMC subforum. You can find it listed under the pre-allo forum.

4) Please respect the time of those who are trying to help you. No one wants to read your entire PS and secondary essays in order to answer your question. So please decide what the salient features of your issue are, and only post a *brief* message. To me, a brief message is one normal-sized paragraph, maybe two at most. If you can't explain your issue in that amount of space, you probably need to go make an appointment with your premed advisor.

Best of luck to all the applicants. 🙂

QofQuimica · Dec 22, 2008

During my first semesster in college I was sexually assualted bya fellow student, my older brother was killed in a car accident at the ahnds of a drunk driver, and I was diagnosed with testicular cancer. (I am now cancer free thank god!!!) I am still trying to figure out who I pissed off to end up with the first semester/year of college I did. Unsurprisingly, I essentially failing and was placed on academic probabtion by the school. I have since withdrawn from the school and enrolled in the CC in my town. I plan to transfer out this summer to XX State (tons of AP credits). I know that I am a capable student despite these circumstances and or my label as a URM. I am trying as hard as I can to rebound from these circumstances. I am volunteering as a court advocate/ first responder/speaker as well as orgainizing a fundrasier with a county Sexual Assualt and Domestic Violence Prevention oganization. I have also recently gotten involved with Students Against Drunk Driving and a number of organizations that deal with issues that have occured over my short lifetime. I am also still continuing to spend time in the hospital to further solidify my desire to pursue medicine. I have questions about the CC issue and how to go about explaining these circumstances on the AMCAS. I also wanted to know whether or not I should apply as a disadvantaged student?

Any input from an adcom or administrator would be greatly appreciated!

To say you've had a rough first semester is an understatement, and it sounds like this was fairly recent. I think you should slow down and take things one step at a time. Make sure that you are healthy both in body and in mind, and don't take on too much before you are ready to handle it. It's great that you are trying to help others cope with their problems based on your experiences, but I hope that someone is also helping you!

First, it's fine for you to be at a community college for the semester. I don't think anyone who knew about your circumstances would begrudge you withdrawing from your first school after all you went through there. That being said, transferring to your state U is a good idea when you are ready.

Second, what you explain on AMCAS is entirely up to you. It is not necessary for you to give all of the details; you can simply say that you had an illness as well as some major personal and family issues that all came up at the same time. Remember that anything you write in your essays or on your app is fair game come interview time. If you feel unable to discuss things like your cancer, your brother's death, and the sexual assault with a perfect stranger, you might want to consider *not* discussing these events on your app.

Finally, disadvantaged status is usually based on your family's income level. You didn't provide any info concerning your family's finances or other significant difficulties you may have had before you got to college, so I don't know if you'd qualify as disadvantaged or not.

Best wishes for your recovery and lots of luck to you. 🙂

QofQuimica · Jan 4, 2009

Last winter I was a junior at XXX College when I found out I was pregnant. I thought I had a supportive boyfriend until I discovered that he contacted the police and the college to accuse me of raping him. I was treated horribly by the college and called a rapist. I was 20, he was 22, and I did not have a weapon. I felt like the school's actions were caused by racial biases, like since I'm a black female it is possible for me to rape a white male twice my size... I don't know maybe that wasn't the reason. I had no idea why my school's administration would support such an awful, false allegation. I became angry and impulsively took the boy's computer from his room and hid it in a bathroom. He found out, pressed charges, and I was arrested and criminally charged with "receiving stolen property." My record won't be expunged for three years. I was so traumatized that I moved to Spain for almost a year (working as an au pair, teaching english, studying in Barcelona) and now I have returned to the States. Even though I hate the administration and do not trust them at all, I will be returning to XXX soon as a junior (again). I would like to continue with my dream of becoming a doctor, but I don't believe that I am competitive enough to even try now. Before the incident I was a typical pre-med student with lots of ec activities, good grades, neuroscience major, research, good relationships with profs, etc. I am planning on taking the MCAT in May, but I honestly dread being further humiliated by the medical school admissions process. I also don't want to waste money that I don't really have on applications if I can't get admitted.

Can someone please give me advice on whether or not I should continue to pursue a medical career and if so, what could I do to improve my terrible record? Will medical schools be understanding? I can't believe one mistake should change the course of a person's life. I have been working toward becoming a doctor since I was 7 when my little sister got pneumococcal meningitis and I started "living" in hospitals with my parents. Nurses live in my home 24/7 to help my parents take care of my deaf/blind/vegetable like little sister. I have worked so hard for this I know I can be a great doctor and I don't want to give up now. Thank you so much for any help.

First, I am very sorry to hear about what happened to you; I think anyone would be traumatized if they were falsely accused of rape.

Unfortunately, I don't think any of us can answer your question about how "understanding" med schools will be. I am trying to imagine how I would react if I had your app in front of me and read that you had been accused of rape and charged with receiving stolen property, and I honestly don't know what I would think without seeing your entire app and having more details about the circumstances.

It's also not clear to me whether you have any criminal record of being accused, charged, or convicted of rape, or only for stealing the computer. The situation is a lot more difficult if you were convicted of rape, particularly if it was a felony conviction. Regardless, you will have an opportunity on your secondaries to explain any criminal record.

In the meantime, you cannot go back and change the past, but you still have control over what you will do now. You already know the importance of having a strong academic record, ECs, and faculty relationships, and you should continue doing all of these things. I am a little concerned though that you don't trust your school's administration and yet you are going back there. I wonder if it might help you to transfer to another school where the environment would be more supportive for you, especially if a lot of people at your old school know about the accusations and believe that you are a rapist. You could be in for a very long year and a half under those circumstances. If your ex-boyfriend is still in school there, I suggest thinking even more seriously about going somewhere else.

Best of luck to you. 🙂

QofQuimica · Jan 25, 2009

I started at a CC with a 4.0 while I was in HS, then tragic family circumstances significantly affected my GPA. I almost dropped out of college, but decided that somehow I had to drag through the CC even though I didn't want to be there anymore (had no other choice due to circumstances - couldn't transfer). Anyway, after several years my GPA dropped to 2.5 mostly because of some Fs in higher math courses. I also got some Cs in Ochem (including one repeat). I stopped going to CC altogether, worked for a year, and took a couple of courses at a top 5 school with a B+ average. Then I just transferred to a UC because I could finally do it. My GPA here so far is 4.0 in a very heavy science load - physics and neuroscience.

The reason I am in a tough situation is because I took too many semester units at a CC, which amount to about 240 quarter units after close to five years of attendance (only 2 years full time)!! I was very lambasted when I found out that AMCAS calculates all the repeat grades. I thought that my CC grades weren't even going to count. Anyway, based on the huge number of units I have taken at the CC, I am looking at an overall cGPA and BCPM of around 3.0 even if I continue maintaining close to 4.0 full time (15-20 unites per quarter+summer) in all BCPM courses at a UC. I am working very hard since I also have several demanding ECs: two jobs (legal assistant + NASA), research, a very special volunteering program where I do rotations through departments like OR and ER and really perform vital duties, help a non-profit organization that is increasing funds to build a Buddhist monastery in India, and next quarter I will likely start a research in med school based on my own proposal.

I never waiver about my goal, but sometimes I do have depressing moments about reality - is there any chance that med schools will judge me based on my more recent record at the higher ranked schools, just like the adcom above suggested? Would you recommend retaking a class like OChem (I got a C in CC) at the UC?

Because of my goals, my dream has been to attend some of the top medical schools in the US, but right now I dont even know if these schools will even look at my application. Frankly, I dont even know if I will get into any US MD school. I know that SMPs are an option, but because of the expense and the extra time required, I am really trying to at least attempt one cycle to see if I am successful. Being from CA doesn't help either. I intend to meet with counselors from all CA schools before I apply. If you have any additional suggestions, please let me know.

I'm not sure exactly what your goals are that require you to go to "some of the top medical schools in the US," but you should realize if you don't already that even many stellar candidates do not attend these schools for various reasons. My main advice for you would be to focus on getting into medical school *period.* Unfortunately, no one, even if they look perfect on paper, has the luxury of insisting on attending a particular school until the acceptance is in hand. In addition, there is nothing you can accomplish at a school highly ranked by USNWR that you can't do at any medical school. If your future school somehow does not offer the opportunities you want, you can still choose to do away rotations and research at other institutions as a visiting medical student.

How medical schools will evaluate your record is probably school-dependent. My school is "non-trad friendly" in the sense that a high post-bac GPA will be taken into consideration even if your old grades and overall GPA are below our averages, especially if you have a competitive MCAT score. (You didn't mention whether you've already taken the MCAT, but getting a good score, ideally 33+, would be very helpful for you.) On the other hand, giving the impression that you mainly want to attend this school because of its "prestige" would be a turnoff to many of the adcoms, including me.

Ok, so what would I do if I were in your position?

1) Apply to DO schools as well as MD schools. Especially if you are retaking classes you did poorly in the first time, you can replace lower grades with better ones and raise your GPA to a competitive level much more quickly.

2) Continue to maintain a 3.8+ GPA in your post-bac. Consider taking some upper level science classes to demonstrate academic capability. Prepare thoroughly for the MCAT and aim for a 33+. You could do an SMP if you want, but I personally don't think it's necessary if you have good post-bac grades. Other adcoms may disagree.

3) Your ECs sound interesting and worthwhile. The only concern I have is that you may not have enough clinical exposure. Do you shadow physicians or otherwise interact with them during your rotations?

4) When you go to apply, make sure to apply *broadly.* Go through the MSAR and pick schools that you think would be good fits and that take residents of CA. You are coming from a very competitive state, and there would be no guarantees of getting into a CA school even if you didn't have a (hopefully) rehabilitated academic record. Also, my personal advice is to focus on schools in the Midwest and South. Many premeds prefer living on the coasts, and there are a lot of great schools in the middle of the country that don't get nearly as many apps as schools located in CA, NYC, Boston, etc.

Hope this helps, and best of luck to you. 🙂

QofQuimica · May 2, 2009

Hi,

I guess I'm a very special case experiencing very difficult personal situation. I would appreciate any advice regarding what and if should I put the following information into my personal essay:
- my husband and I will fill for divorce. My husband has a pending case for family violence so I can not continue this relationship, however it will put me in the very difficult position as I will stay in the beginning of May with 2 children (4 years and 1 year old) on my own.
- my MCAT is scheduled for June 18th, but I really have little chances to study, therefore I'm at high risk not to score high
Would it serve as a reasonable explanation if I score low, is there no explanation for low score?

or should I may be talk about that with the academic adviser?

I am very sorry to hear about your situation. My advice is that you postpone taking the MCAT until a time when you feel better prepared to take it. Consider also that anything you put on your application is fair game for interviews. Ideally, you would avoid discussing anything about this situation on your app. But if you do choose to tell the adcom about it, you must be prepared to discuss it at your interviews as well, which could potentially be awkward or uncomfortable for you. Hope this helps, and best of luck to you.

Hopey1984 · May 11, 2009

Hi, it'd be great to receive some feedback about my situation.

I'm 24 years old, and still have not completed my undergrad.
I have switched universities, from an okay/mediocre school to an ivy league.
My majors are psychology and biology.
I have not completed my undergrad and have taken multiple semesters off/never taken full course load because:
1) My mother was ill with and passed away from cancer and took time off to be with my family/returning to school after her death, but with reduced course load.
2) I have struggled with an eating disorder and took time off for treatment.

Thus, I have to account for my Ws, random semesters of disappearing, and perhaps why I switched universities midway my education.

My questions are twofold:
[1] I know I can explain in person, but how do I even get the opportunity to explain in an interview if (some? all?) adcoms will automatically say "oh, she never took 5 courses per semester, so she's out!"
Will they even read my personal statement even if they don't like the looks of my transcript? (For what it's worth, my GPA is 3.87; I have not yet taken the MCAT)

[2] What SHOULD I say? I have to present myself as the less mentally stable one in fear of reducing my chances. ( I have not recovered from my eating disorder but continue to live with it so that it's not interfering with my life like it once was, and I don't want to wait for "the magic day" when it vanishes, because I don't think that will happen... (I want to continue to work towards my goal of being a GREAT DOCTOR! which I firmly believe that I can be if my disorder is under control even if it's not *gone*, and I believe that time in itself will continue to help me.)
Granted, these experiences have definitely shaped who I am as a person and have influenced my desire to be a physician: (I have always wanted to be a doctor but it is with my own personal experiences that I have actually narrowed my focus and internalized the desire to help others...)

So I'm thinking, just account for ONE thing (and not appear like a headcase with a gazillion issues), namely what is less of a stigma: my mothers' illness.

What do you guys suggest?? Sorry for being longwinded, I tried to describe what IS a complicated situation, in as much of a simplified was as possible. 😳

Torongo · Jul 31, 2009

Hi,

I was arrested for shoplifting in 2006 and I had to take a class to get it removed from my record. Now, do I have to say 'yes' to the question of have you even been convicted of a misdemeanor...? If yes, then how much will it hurt my application? I am really tensed about this situation and my other stats are average! So I am really worried about this situation, please give me an advice.
Thanks

Ichiro · Oct 27, 2009

Hello,
I plan to apply for medical school in the next application cycle and I have a misdemeanor conviction for receiving stolen property. I really have no idea that the property was stolen but according to the DA I SHOULD'VE known. I did serve 30 days of community service for the charge. Now I would appreciate it if anybody can tell me how medical school admission committee view applicants with prior record. Would they deny me admission solely based on the fact that I was convicted or would they look at the circumstances as well and give me a chance to explain myself?

Ichiro · Oct 29, 2009

Hello,
I plan to apply to medical school in the next application cycle but I was charged with a misdemeanor for receiving stolen property recently. A former friend used stolen credit card to buy things and use my house as a shipping address. Would medical schools reject my application because of this or would they give me a chance to explain myself in the interview (if my stats are strong enough to get me an interview of course)? I also have some concerns about medical licensing boards; I did some research for CA medical boards and it looks like that if the charge is not durgs, alcohol, or violent then they would give you a chance to explain yourself. Can anybody help me with my situation?

slalom skier · Nov 11, 2009

I am a junior at an Ivy league UG. I started off in the engineering school as a bio engineer and did so for the first 3 semesters. As a freshman i took 5 and 6.5 classes in my fall and spring semesters respectively with 10.5 of them being math sciences classes with 5 labs. As a result of taking these classes so early on and all at once my gpa is less than ideal (plan to have about a 3.4 science and a 3.45 regular gpa by the time I apply). I have since switched out of engineering and into the honors program for neuroscience which involves two semesters of independent research and I am on course to recieve a chem minor. I worked full time this summer at the neuro dept of the Childrens Hospital of Philadelphia where I will continue my research and have been published.

I also do EMT work with ample volunteer hours and have logged hours in the ER and shadowing, so I figure research and clinical experience should be fairly strong aspects for me. I also have athletics leadership and foreign language fluency, and I tutor inner city kids in chess which I figure can't hurt. I plan to take the MCATs this spring, but I'm curious as to what score I should aim for. I understand that every school has different requirements but to be a competitive applicant at a mid level school. I guess what this really boils down to is that I am unsure as to the extent to which my engineering begining and my UG school will be taken into account for GPA, and how much I must make up for it on the MCAT.

Is it worth it to take a year off? I have mostly filler classes left to take senior year so my gpa would be higher if I took a year off, but I have already completed most all of the science classes so I don't forsee any significant change in my science GPA, so I am reluctant to do so.

I appreciate any input you may have.

9876543210 · Feb 10, 2010

Hello,
I took the DAT July 2009 and did not score at a competitive level (18AA 19TS 20PA), so I decided to pursue my backup plan, which was optometry. I applied to numerous optometry schools and was accepted to all. Currently I'm a first year optometry student and have regretted my decision to ever attend. I've come to realize that my true passion and desire has always been dentistry and because of the pressure I felt from my family to not take a year off inbetween undergrad and professional school, I applied. I'll be finishing up my 2nd quarter and want to leave the program.

My questions are: I'll be leaving the program regardless, but should I leave after I've completed my first year or after I complete this quarter? I'd be willing to take an SMP or Master's program will continuing to shadow dentists in the meantime. I know professional programs frown upon students already applying or attending other programs, so will this have a major impact on my applications to dental school or just result in complete rejection?

ncase1016 · Apr 22, 2010

Hi,
I am not sure if I should post here to ask someone in the Military Medicine section, but here is my current situation.
I am 20 years old, married, and have a 2 month old. I had to grow up very young due to family circumstances, was emancipated at 16, went to Germany for a year as an exchange student, and ended up staying there till last year. I started going to school at UCF spring of 2010.
My grades are not perfect, mainly because I had my daughter while going to school and made things a little tough. I have and will continue to take more classes than my peers and classes during the summer to catch up. Is that a bad thing? Should I slow down and get As? or continue at a fast and strenuous pace will raising a child and get Bs and As?
I plan on going to USUHS (Uniformed Services University of Health Sciences) in MD, and want to go into Ortho. I also currently volunteer at the Orlando VA Hospital and I go on medical missions and help run a pharmacy off the Amazon and Black rivers in Brazil with my in laws. (They are missionaries)
So basically, what should I do to improve my chances and what in your opinion do I need to do with volunteering, gpa, and mcat?
Any help would be greatly appreciated.
Thanks!

JulianaW · May 16, 2010

Here's my story:

Solid 4.0 at strong research university for first two years of college
Spring semester of junior year, struggled with eating disorder and had to withdraw all my classes and leave on medical leave. This put me on academic probation.
Continued to senior year and had problems with eating disorder again. I had no choice but to withdraw/drop all classes for fall semester and was asked to leave school for awhile (since once you are on academic probation you HAVE you get off it the next semester).
Remained out of school for spring semester (of my original senior year) and returned the following fall. Finished school that year and I'm graduating tomorrow with a 3.88 in Biology. Eating disorder is CONQUERED!

I'm not sure of a few things. First, my school's request that I take time off is not on my record and never was. Is this something that I need to report in applications? I feel like it is but my registrar says no. Is this going to look terrible if it's on my app?/How should I explain this?

Second, I have to take my MCAT this August (my previous score expired). Since I have a spotty record, would you advise waiting until next year to apply so that I can get my apps in early? Or will having a 2 year gap between med school and undergrad look even worse since I was already out of school for medical problems?

Medical School Admissions: Special Circumstances

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