OMFS Programs Overview

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Squished Rat

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The purpose of this thread is to be a resource for future applicants to OMFS. I wanted to post about each program I interviewed at; what I thought the strengths/weaknesses of each program were. I am hoping other applicants/residents will do the same for the programs they are familiar with. I am trying to do this while most of the programs are still somewhat fresh in my mind as interviews weren't that long ago although I already don't remember as much about programs from the beginning of interviews compared with the end of interviews. My hope is to remain somewhat objective and when I am not objective, I will at least post why I felt any certain way. I will post about each program in a reply to this post so that when another applicant or resident has something to add about a program, they can just quote the reply about that specific program. I will also pull things current residents have said about the programs I interviewed at in previous threads if I can find anything. I'll be adding to this thread as I have time. Other applicants and residents should feel free to add to it as well.
 
I cut and pasted this assesmet from TiggerJSA, a current 2nd yr resident at UAB.

UAB 6 yr

Strong: Get to touch upon every aspect of OMFS, tons of trauma, tons of orthognathics, tons of dentoalveolar (sedations run everyday in the dental school clinic, thirds comin out the eyeballs, probably place at least 100-150 implants before you're done), a good amount of TMJ, a good amount of cosmetics, a fair amount of craniofacial (mostly secondary cl/p repair w/ICBG), and a fair amount of cancer (rotate for a total of 2-3 months w/Dr. Holmes Dierks/Potter trained). Non-call days almost always get out at 5pm. Don't need to round on the weekends if you aren't on call or post-call. 40 months OMFS service, 20 months med school, 8 months General Sx, 4 months Anesthesia (done during your General Sx year... big plus). Can moonlight and do very well. Very strong faculty. Excellent hospital technology (all CT, radiographs, pt info on computer). Nice location, small radius of hospitals to cover that's all in walking distance.

Weak: Can be very anal in the sense that things need to be done in very specific ways. Often find yourself being scolded for more scut-type situations rather than anything else. Otherwise, very little to complain about.

I can't say too much beyond what Tigger had to say about the program. Dr. Louis gives a little sedation course near the beginning of residency and then the interns are doing sedations which I thought was cool. Didactic instruction Wednesday afternoons if I remember right. Residents were cool. Program seemed very well rounded and well respected.
 
Virginia is a 4 yr program w/ MD option at the end. They have 5 full time attendings. Residents do most of the operating with 3 of them. The other 2 are mostly undergrad teachers although you will occassionally do stuff with them and they cover clinic. When they do operate, attendings hold sticks. I externed here and was impressed at how much of each operation was done by residents. I would say 90-95% of each case was done by the residents i.e. orthognathic cases were each chief does half and the attending stands at the head and holds sticks. Residents have an outpatient clinic (OPC) which is their clinic. They do lots of point and pull in this clinic. They also do lots of GA's for thirds or arch bars in this clinic. They do a lot of LMA's. I think they have 3 OR days and then add-ons for trauma and such. Trauma call is approximately every third week, sometimes every other due to plastics not being able to take hand call and face call at the same time. Plenty of trauma to do. Very broad exposure to OMFS. They do plenty of orthognathics, TMJ, trauma, sleep apnea (repose genioglossis advancement and hyoid suspension or MM advancement), alveolar clefts, recon, etc. Every yr they go on a mission trip to the same third world country but I cant remember which one...Mexico maybe? where they do lots of primary lips and palates, this past year they did a bunch of skin grafting for a burn victim. In the dental school clinic, the opprotunity to do cosmetics is there but is chief dependant. Strauss told me he has had chiefs graduate with 40 cosmetic cases in the past and chiefs graduate with none. Very friendly residents. Everything is in one hospital. No malignant pathology. It seemed like the implant exposure there wasn't high as other places I visited. Call is in-house. Call room was one of the nicer ones I saw on the interview trail. Overall, I think this is one of the best 4 yr programs around. Very well rounded, plenty of attendings, plenty of operating to do with a healthy balance of procedures.

I forgot to add that for the 4 yr w/ MD option at the end, you have until December of your chief yr to decide if you want to do the MD. I don't think you can do it after that. I think a small # (13?) of residents in the past have gone on to do the MD. You can also do your PGY-1 in anesthesia instead of general surgery if you want.
 
Knoxville is also a great 4 yr program. They work out of one hospital so they are always in the same place. This is probably one of the busiest programs, if not the busiest I interviewed at. They are the only head and neck trauma service for the hospital so they are on trauma 24/7/365. They do see a lot of trauma which means lots of operating and early on too. I think they mentioned at the interview one of their 2nd yrs has already turned a bicoronal flap. They also do a ton of pathology both beneign and malginant. Dr. Carlson said they did about 100 neck dissections last year. They will be adding a fellow this upcoming yr. They seemed to get decent exposure to orthognathics, Dr. Hudson does pediatric craniofacial (clefts) for the program, and with all that path, there is lots of reconstruction to do. The interns go out to the county health dept once a week to do 3rds under local. There are several private practice guys who come in and staff clinic once a week and bring their own pts as well. They have a couple of plastics guys who are their attendings for trauma and I think they get some exposure to cosmetics through them as well. Dr. Carlson is a big draw to come to this program. He is very dedicated to education and teaching the residents. Didactics are in the morning so if you aren't on call, you are almost always out between 5-6. Post call they attempt to send you home at noon the next day if possible although that doesn't always work out. Residents were very friendly and stick together. The dept sends everyone to any one conference/class of their choice yrs 2-4. Externing here is harder than the actual residency in terms of hours since you take call every night. I externed here and slept a combined 8 hours the first 4 nights I was there. I think they do a decent amount of dentalalveolar but not a ton. I get the feeling they don't do tons of implants although I think they do some. Overall, a great program with tons of OR time.

I forgot to mention that this is a 4 yr program with the MD option at the end. The MD is a 27 month option. You do med school yr 2, 3 and a bit of 4. Dr. Carlson said graduates of the program can come back for it at any time in the future, 10-20 yrs down the road if they feel so inclined. I don't think anyone has done the option here.
 
Louisville is a 6 yr program. The residents here are very approachable. They all talked about how attendings don't yell at the residents. Everyone works hard and gets along well. The residents called the attendings by their first name so I think everyone is pretty familiar with each other there. Trauma is every third day and they get tons of trauma when on call. They have 3 full time attendings. Dr. Tiwana is craniofacial fellowship trained. They get all the primary lips and palates before plastics does at the hospital. They also do plenty of orthognathics. The only thing Dr. Tiwana said he wasn't getting a lot of was synostosis cases and I think that is more a function of the actual number of cases around than noteing able to do them. He did say he would continue to seek them out until they started coming in. Alpert and Kushner were for lack of a better word country gentlemen. They do what Kushner calls gentlemen's cancer. I took that to meant small lip or skin lesions, but no neck dissections or anything like that. Your intern yr you are on Q2 call for the first 2 months. During med school, you get paid $6000 a yr with no tuition and you only have to come back on service a few weeks at Christmas to relieve the guys on service. They also allow you to moonlight during your whole residency, not just med school. I think they do want to keep track of how much you moonlight to make sure you aren't doing too many hours or something like that. They take a ski trip every yr and take the residents that can get away and pay for them to go. They have all these pictures up on the wall of them in Aspen, Park City, Vail, etc. Although I can't remember as much now, I seem to recall them getting plenty of dentalalveolar and implants in their clinic. I think they don't do a whole lot of cosmetics although I think that was somewhat chief dependant. It seemed like a very resident run program. Overall, a great program and I know several applicants who told me they would be ranking it #1 on their list.
 
I took this from MAXFAC, a current 4th yr at Case.

Case 5yr OMFS/MD
Med school: 13 months for only core clerkships, all 4th year med school electives done on OMFS service. You get to moonlight during that time if you have a dental license.
Gen Surg: 4 months core gen surg. 8months between 2m ENT, 2m Plastics, 3m OMFS and 1m Neurosurg , you get certificate of Gen Surg internship.
OMFS: 34 months.
Anesthesia: 5 months, 2 months 1st yr, 3 months 3rd yr.
Foreign elective: 2 months England, Australia, Sweden, Mexico.
Private practice rotation as a chief for 3-4 months.
Chairman: Head and Neck cancer Michigan fellowship trained.
Program director: Cosmetic Sx fellowship trained.

Scope:
DA SX: from day one, you are expected to get good at it very quickly, sedation/ GA from day one. Wizzies, as chief you are expected to run a GA clinic of about 10-12 patient between 8:00a-10:00a as training for private practice, 10-15min per case surgical time.

Implants: 30-50 as an intern at the VA hospital,another 30-50 as a third year, > 200 as chief at the dental school clinic. in addition to the autogenous grafting that goes along, rarely we use bottled bone aka MAGIC DUST. Tibia, cranial bone grafts in the clinic.

Cosmetics: Resident cases staffed by attendings as well as private practice i.e. attendings patients. You cut no matter what.

Craniofacial: lots of alveolar clefts, secondary palates, Hemifacial microsomia, cleft orthognathics.

Orthognathics: 150 cases last year, residents cut the whole case.

Head and Neck Path: benign and malignant, ablative and recon. so far no free flaps, but it's coming soon, we do regional and local flaps.

Trauma: decent amount although we split it with ENT and Plastics, no anatomical restrictions.

TMJ: tons,Cleveland is full of nuts, Scopes, Open and full joint replacements, I hate TMJ sham surgeries but I don't mind total joint replacements.

Weaknesses:
-Med school tution is a bit high but you get paid for 4 out 5 years of residency.
-You have to take USMLE step I before you start on 7/1.
-Cleveland weather is a Biatchhh!!!!!!!

To add my impressions to what maxfac wrote, you pay med school tuition yrs 2 and 3. You get a stipend yrs 1, 3-5. You are encouraged to moonlight. The program director actually encourages it so you aren't rusty at removing teeth when you get back on service. The program director is cosmetic fellowship trained and I think you do a lot of cosmetics here compared to most places. The dept chair is new and michigan cancer fellowhsip trained so I would expect the malignant path numbers to go up. They do a lot of dentalalveolar and tons of implants...probably the most implants of anywhere I interviewed. You do have to take Step I before starting your intern yr but you get 3 shots at it so if you fail it the first time, you can try again. The hospital is super nice...like a private hospital. The clinics are going to be renovated soon according to the dept chair. I felt like the weakest area of the program was probably trauma. Case is a level 2 trauma center so the really big cases aren't going to end up at Case, but rather at Metro down the street.
 
I interviewed at Vanderbilt for the 4 yr. They have both 4 and 6 yr and take 2 6 yr and 1 4 yr per yr. They currently have 2 full time attendings and are looking for a third. Dept chair Dr. Mckenna has been there many yrs. Dr. Press their other attending has been there about 1 yr. Dr. Press was in private practice for about 10 yrs and also did an oral path residency at UNC. Based on my impressions from the interview, they are fairly trauma heavy. I think it gets split every third day, but it seems like OMFS does more than half of all the facial trauma coming in. Last yr i think they had 550 hard and soft tissue trauma cases (I think these are OR numbers, but I can't remember anymore, it's just what I wrote down at the interview). They do a fair amount of orthognathics. I don't think they do many malignacies or cosmetics. They do 2ndary cleft grafting (about 12 last yr). 143 recon cases last yr. They do read out a lot of their own slides per Dr. Press' training. For path last yr, they did 210 cases including TMJ and infections. For TMJ, they do a modified condylotomy for almost all their opertive TMJ cases and claim it has an excellent track record. They seemed to get good dental alveolar and implant experience. They do an away rotation at the VA which is 30 miles south of Vanderbilt. They get didactic lectures on Thursday from 2-6pm. They have a head and neck anantomy lab that they can do surgical procdures on. I think one of the biggest drawbacks of this program is that you have to do 3 yrs of med school and it costs a ton of money...around $120k for 3 yr tuition. On the plus side, the plating reps treat the residents very well there in taking them out to dinner, etc. One of the reps paid for our interview dinner at a very nice steak house. Residents were down to earth and friendly and seemed to get along well. I think this program will give you excellent exposure to the traditional scope of OMFS with lots of operating room cases.
 
That's all I have in me for tonight. I'll post about the rest of the programs I interviewed at tomorrow.
 
Nashville's VA is not 30 min. away. It is actually attached to Vanderbilt, as is Children's. They are all on one campus. They do have one resident one half day a week at the VA in Murfreesboro however. Vanderbilt also has one resident at a clinic called the Interfaith Clinic which is a private clinic for the working poor where you run the show, doing lots of sedations/thirds.

Vanderbilt's medical school is expensive but very impressive and the 6 year guys there really know their stuff. Another strength of the program is that the interns (4 yr guys) were both getting a lot of experience both in the OR and the clinic. Interns routinely did half of the trauma cases when I externed there early in their second month. They also got to take out a good deal of thirds in the clinic. The clinic is run like a private practice. Faculty see every patient, no matter how big or small. Even for dentoalveolar, faculty are present in the room. There is no point and pull crap going on there however. Everything is referral based basically.

One of the best thing about the program is the fact that the faculty and residents are all so close. Dr. McKenna trained at Vandy and has a ton of pride in the program. He works more hours than any resident and it isn't close. He works very hard to make the program strong. Dr. Press is a favorite of the residents. He will operate on anything and lets the residents do almost the entire case, frequently holding sticks or even not scrubbing in.

The clinic is nicer than average but is being totally renovated in the next year anyway. Vandy has tons of money and the hospital is one of the most high-tech around. Everything in the hospital and clinic is digital, from Rx's to X-rays to notes to whatever. These can also be accessed from home.

They have two dedicated OR days but operate on most days due to the large number of trauma cases.

Weaknesses: No cancer. No cosmetics. Limited craniofacial (alveolar cleft grafts). As of interview time, no propofol in the clinic although McKenna said they would be getting it soon b/c they had to go through some hoops w/ the anesthesia dept.
 
Dr. Baur seems to be a great addition to Case. They operated a good number of cases before he got there when they only had 1 full time faculty member so he effectively doubles their capacity. With cancer/recon and cosmetics trained faculty, I think Case has a lot of potential and is already strong in the core of OMFS.

Major weakness is trauma. Did about 50 mandibles last year and a handful of midface stuff. Mostly isolated facial fractures. Plus side of this is at home call and family friendly feel to the program. 5 years for an MD negates the high price tag.
 
Correct me if I got anything wrong (it's all a blur in my head at this point):

Highland is a county hospital serving 11 bay area cities and more than 1.6 million people. Residents also work out of Kaiser Hospital and Children's Hospital in Oakland as well as UOP Dental School in San Francisco. Residents also work with Dr. Indresano's patients at California Pacific Medical Center.

Highland is defined as a level II trauma center but my experience there and after flipping through the log books they get a very good trauma experience - comparable to a level I. They also get a good mix of midface and mandible -- there are no ENT or PLS residencies at Highland. They operate 2 scheduled days out of the week and additional days if needed. I believe they take head and neck trauma call everyday of the year. They treat fractures of the entire maxillofacial complex and are not limited by anatomy. Residents can take call from home, q3d (the frequency depends on what year resident you are). The OS clinic gets lots of 3rd IVSA cases and have a strong dentoalveolar experience. Prisoners from San Quentin and other local prisons come to Highland OS clinic for treatment of facial fractures, abscesses, ect. I feel like they get a great experience in pathology and secondary recon due to the patient population. Residents get some craniofacial experience on mission trips to South America during their chief year.Weakness: I think cosmetics isn't a strong point, but there is the opportunity to get exposure. Also, they don't do the more complicated malignant pathology cases.
Implants are done at Highland and UOP dental school. Dr. Bedrossian brings in complex implant cases and likes to use Zygomatic implants. The didactic program for implants is strong and the opportunity to see unique implant cases is possible due to Dr. Bedrossian's presence.

At Kaiser residents get a solid experience in orthognathics. They do all the work up, but then they get to cut a lot of the case. They are there for 4 months in both their 3rd and 4th years.

The faculty challenge the residents constantly and push them to be excellent. I think the faculty there are intense, but very good. They are not malignant by any means. I would trust Dr. Indresano to give me a good education and to make me a great surgeon. The residents get along, work well together, and aren't dorks (maybe that guy from Temple . . . 😉). The incoming chiefs are all would be great to train under. They have formal teaching rounds Tuesday - Friday, Grand Rounds once a week, an Implant seminar every Monday, and I think that's it.
Other pros: best salary and benefits in the country; its in the Bay Area; great, well rounded program. That's all I remember -- anyone who wants to add, go for it.
 
Here's my best shot:

Carle Clinic is a level I trauma center that serves over 1 million people in 45 surrounding counties. It's a college town that fluctuates in population according to the time of year. The twin cities hold about 100,000 people or more during school time. Residents work out of the main hospital and a satellite clinic across town (across town = 2.6 miles without any traffic). I believe residents also work with private practice OMFS in the community if they so choose. Also, they make their yearly trip to South America to "get their craniofacial on". I interviewed and externed at Carle.

Dr. Bailey, the PD was trained in oncology and microvascular recon at Maryland. He heads the Tumor Board and Cleft Lip and Palate team. OMFS is the main player of CL&P cases in the hospital. I think they get a phenomenal craniofacial experience at Carle. Also, there are no surgical specialty residencies at Carle, so OMFS takes head and neck trauma call every day of the year. They are very busy and thus, get a great experience in trauma. They have 3 dedicated OR days, if I remember correctly. Residents got to cut everything. In the clinic in Carle Hospital as well as at the satellite clinic, residents take out a ton of 3rds under IVSA. They don't have a walk-in clinic and most of their patients are referred from GD in the community. So you get a private practice experience. Weaknesses: cosmetics, if you are interested.

They take one resident per year. The residents are all cool, they get along great, and they work hard. The upcoming-chief has an incredible work ethic, is a cool guy and would be awesome to train under. Dr. Bailey and Dr. Sabol, the other full-timer, are great surgeons and very likable. The hospital provides great benefits. Residents take call from home. You can buy a home close to the hospital. Cons: Their football team got their sh** kicked in by USC yesterday👍.

I'll write more later
 
Hands down, Carle is probably one of the best 4 year OMFS programs in the country (although not very well known... its a sleeper program in many respects). Their heavy case-load and very broad scope probably gives a better experience than at many (if not most) 6 year programs as well.

They take ALL Craniomaxillofacial Trauma 365 Days/ Year.

They Run/Head the Cleft Lip/Palate and Craniofacial Team... They do a boatload of stuff from primary lips to VPI surgery, cleft orthognathics and distraction as well as cranioplasties in conjunction with Neurosurgery. Now they have the mission trips as well.

Head and Neck Cancer... plenty of it to go around. They do more of it than ENT does. Bailey is fellowship trained in Oncology and Microvascular Recon from Maryland under Ord. They also do a few thousand Skin Cancers on the head/neck and many times on other body parts....

They are the primary service for the ICU's in providing Tracheostomies.

Call can be pretty wicked (even from home), but the ER is pretty good about only calling you in for major stuff.

The only residency programs at the hospital are Internal Medicine and Family Practice.... so when you go off to Anesthesia, General Surgery, Plastics, ENT, Ophthalmology, Trauma Surgery and Emergency Medicine you are the PRIMARY RESIDENT working one on one with an attending. To me that means you get a better rotation than being a rotating PGY 1 in a program with 5 years of General Surgery residents above you getting priority.

Sabol is awesome... Great with Trauma and a Real Master in Dentoalveolar Surgery/Implants.

Great program. Overall the attenings are incredible from their knowledge and surgical skills to their beside manner and the way they treat their residents. Truly excellent role-models. And yes, the incoming chief resident for next year will probably be a very very very great Chief Resident (despite being from Arkansas! :laugh::laugh::laugh: )
 
This was taken from Battlesign, a 2nd yr resident at Mayo.

Mayo was my first choice and would still be today. We get great training. The program has changed from what I heard it used to be like. Our volume is fantastic. The only time you wear a suit is the two half days a week that you are doing consults, other than that you wear scrubs.
From the structure it makes it look like we are only on service two years of the six. In reality during medical school you are in med school for 6 weeks and then back on service for 2 weeks. We do 2 years and 3 months of medical school in total.

Like most programs we share face trauma with plastics, ENT and OMFS. We all take three weeks at a time. When we ar on what ever comes in we do. When plastics is on we do any lefort1-3 and mandibles. Therefore, our service does most of the facial trauma. Patients come form all over to get surgery. This new structure is only 1 year old. It used to be anatomical specific, but that has all changed. We do three months in Jacksonville to get the knife and gun club trauma.

We do alot of elective surgery as well. From neck dissections, orthognathics, reconstruction, cranial facial and much more.

Our out-patient clinic is busy tons of thirds, implants, single tooth extractions, cosmetics and much more. We don't do a ton of point and pull on prison inmates and hookers. If you like that this is not your program.

The attendings are great. Having three of the five staff Mayo trained is not a weakness, nor is it that unusual. Most programs have attendings that are trained at the same program they stay on with. The Mayo trained surgeons are very strong. We have a cancer scope with our cancer surgeon.

Life is great at this program. It is no country club, we bust our balls. Long hours and alot of work. It all comes in waves like any where else.


To add to what he said, my impressions as an applicant is that it is an outstanding program. Facilities are second to none. Van Ess put up the case numbers for the year and they were not weak...all I can remember is 400something pathology cases last year. I also remember that they weren't as weak in trauma as I thought they would be. Of course they aren't in Atlanta or Dallas, but I think the trauma numbers were pretty good. The attendings were all very nice. The residents were some of the nicest I've met. This year is the start of a new format for incoming residents. They only do yrs 2 and 3 of med school. Med school costs 10k/yr but you get paid 30k/yr in med school. You are back on OMFS quite a bit in med school. The med school goes for 6 weeks and then usually has 2 weeks off for elective time which is when you go back on service. The med school experience also seems excellent...small classes and you are treated well. They have structured the general surgery years so you now get credit for 2 yrs of general surgery although actual time spent on general surgery during those times looks to be about 8 months total. You do 3 months in Jacksonville as alluded to earlier where they put you up in an apt and give you a car. They have set aside OR time for 1.5 OR's/day 5 days a week for scheduled cases. That's a lot in my opinion as I don't think trauma cases are scheduled. Those are add-ons everywhere I've externed. Seems like to you get a lot of private practice type of stuff i.e. 3rds and implants, orthognathics, as well as some crazier path cases. My impression was cosmetics is probably a weaker area here although I have heard Dr. Rieck is outstanding at cosmetics...just hard to drum up lots of cosmetic business in Rochester, MN. I know several guys who are rankig this program #1. I think this is a great program. I forgot to add that total time spent on OMFS is 177 weeks so about 40 or 41 months are spent on OMFS even while getting 2 general surgery years.
 
squished rat. you rock! thank you for doing this. This is long overdue.
 
Do you guys know anything about Indiana University OMS? Does anyone interviewed there? Thanks for any input.
 
I think one of the highlights of the program at Louisville is the fact that the faculty let the residents do 99.9% of the case. All of the faculty stand at the head and guide the residents who do the cutting. They showed us some cool case pictures with residents doing some good stuff. Also, 2 people who externed there confirmed to me that the residents do all the cutting.

Big plus is the fact that you have only 2 year of med school and no classroom years. This means lots of time on service. Surgical experience sounded like it was pretty back loaded meaning most of the experience is gained in the chief and fifth years. Interns don't sedate at Louisville but they take out tons of teeth in the clinic and I was told that they can take out impacted thirds, etc. with local if the patient will go for it.

My biggest question coming out of Louisville was surgical volume. It sounded like they were busy but I was not presented with any numbers. Strong traditional scope program with bonus of good craniofacial.
 
This is the other 5 yr MD program. You do intern OMFS, then about 1.5 yrs med school, OMFS/anesthesia, General surgery year, and OMFS chief year. Half of the general surgery year is spent on the head and neck service whose chief is an OMFS doing malignant path, salivary glands, etc. 34 months total time on OMFS. You spend 6 months of your chief year at clarkson west medical center in a private practice office doing teeth, titanium, orthognathics, and cosmetics. One of the attendings at the private practice is cosmetic fellwoship trained. I asked him if he thought you needed to do a fellowship to do cosmetics afterwards and he said no. He did it because they didn't have cosmetics training at that time, but he felt that what the residents get now is enough to be credentialed at any hospital. Residents were real nice guys. Dept chair is Leon Davis who has been in the academic game a long time and is well known in the academic OMFS community. He is the main operator at university. Miloro was program director but has left and they are searching for a new director. Dr. Desa, a recent grad will be joining faculty to help in the mean time as well as 2 guys from the big private practice. They appear to get plenty of orthognathics, teeth, titanium, pathology and associated reconstruction as well as malignant pathology, and cosmetics. Areas they are probably weakest in are trauma and craniofacial. I don't think they do lots of clefts or anything although I was told by a faculty during my interview that he was going to be starting a craniofacial center with a local plastics guy so that may improve over time. I think they get adequate trauma, but they definitely aren't getting the crap that happens in miami or atlanta...it is nebraska after all. Med school tuition is 20k/yr for 2 yrs as an instate resident which everyone gets. You get paid a stipend yrs 1, latter half of 3, 4, and 5. Overall I feel like this is a very strong program, especially given the 5 year MD. Only thing to add is nebraksa gets dang cold in the winter although housing is the most affordable I have seen anywhere.
 
UNC has a very strong reputation in the OMFS community. Dr. Turvey is the chair, Dr. Blakey is the program director. They are the 2 big OR guys for the program although there are 2 other faculty who do some OR and 1 of them is likely to be in the OR more in the future as referrals start coming in. Dr. White is faculty but realy is there halftime and then for research. I don't think he staffs cases. That being said, it is easy to get involved in research with him here and just about every resident I have ever met from there has presented at AAOMS at least once. UNC does both 4 yr and 6 yr. Typically, they take 1 6 yr and 2 4 yrs although they are taking one of each this year according to interviews. The 6 yr program is intern yr, 18 months med school, 6 months OMFS, 1 yr general surgery, then yrs 5 and 6 OMFS. UNC is known for being an orthognathic program. I'd guess they do 250-300 cases a year. Dr. Blakey does the path cases and all the NC state prison trauma. Dr. Blakey also does sleep apnea cases with genioglossus advancement or maxillomand advancement. Trauma call is q3 months. The trauma at UNC is kinda weird. When they are on trauma, they are on mandible call although one of the interns told me they do the full gamut. Probably some of both as I have seen Turvey turn a bicoronal for a frontal sinus. In spite of this, the residents rotate in Asheville to get their midface trauma experience. There is usually an intern and an upper level resident there at all times. They are the only residents at that hospital so they see and do whatever comes in. Fonseca attends in Asheville, but i am not sure if he covers trauma with the residents or not. I know they do some of their trauma with ENT attendings. Dr. Turvey has an interest in craniofacial and does the occassional synostosis case. Dr. faulk, one of the new attendings, was brought on to do TMJ since Zuniga left. she also has an interest in cosmetics, although i don't know if she is doing much at this point. I think it's hard to get lots of referrals for that in the beginning as a single degree surgeon. They get decent implant and wisdom tooth exposure although the program is "primairly a hospital based program" according to Turvey. They residents are very busy here. OR schedule 4 days a week. When not on trauma, weekends are often free. Chapel Hill is a nice small town with lots of college sports. They do no malignant path here. I felt like the weaknesses were cosmetics, TMJ, and malignant path. This is the only place I interviewed where the general surgery year was actually an entire year on general surgery ie burn, vascular, etc.
 
That is all the programs I interviewed at. I am hoping servitup, doncorleone, JakeD, yahtzee, brycethefatty will continue this thread by talking about programs they interviewed at that I didn't. I hope this thread will be useful to future applicants.
 
Squished Rat said:
That is all the programs I interviewed at. I am hoping servitup, doncorleone, JakeD, yahtzee, brycethefatty will continue this thread by talking about programs they interviewed at that I didn't. I hope this thread will be useful to future applicants.
Click to expand...

I apologize but at this point, everything is a blur. I can post my rank list if anyone would care to see that?
 
Oh, no takers? Ok. Maybe some other time....
 
In all seriousness, I'm a 6-year, "sexy surgery" guy so I can post what I remember about those programs, which I will tonight.
 
This needs to get stickied badly. This is one of those threads that can be used year and year again, and if the sticky doesn't happen I'm definitely warehousing the link on my computer somewhere in my OMFS folder.
 
jake waited for you all night. Quit being a slacker. Anyone have Parkland, UCSF, Houston, MGH, Oregon. And this is by far one of the best threads sdn has but up in quite some time
 
OHSU is a great 6 year program. They have two primary sites: OHSU (the Hill) and Legacy Emmanuel. At Emmanuel there's no clinic, just OR, so you operate tons -- last year's chief graduated with 1000 cases (ish). On call q2, though that may eventually change to q3 as they're ramping up from 1-2 residents per year (incoming chief is the last year with just one). You work there with several attendings who have a private practice together and are dual trained (in fact, Diercks actually headed an ENT residency at one point). Fridays you go to their practice to do trauma follow-ups (a recent change). There are no ENT or plastics guys at the hospital, so you do it all. In the weeks I was there, I saw cosmetics, MMAs, lots of trauma (from frontal sinus fracture to scalp avulsion), benign and malignant resections and reconstructions (there IS a cancer fellow -- so he's in charge of medical management of the cancer patients, though Diercks ensures everyone gets a chance to follow at least one patient start to finish), orthognathics (Bell trained at UNC and is the son of orthognathics guru Bell), skin grafts, and lots of other stuff as well. Attendings at both sites are extremely approachable (Assael hosts journal club at his lake house) and let residents do a lot. Most of them teach tons while they operate. The Hill has dental school affiliations, so you cover the school's clinic and also work in the faculty clinic (where they're around but let you do your thing) at a different location, doing teeth and sedations and TMJ/secondary cleft consults. It seems a bit more mellow here vs Emmanuel. Med school gets good reviews, plus most residents moonlight to cover costs and keep sedation/dentoalveolar skills sharp. Head and neck anatomy course with the other specialties and some other didactics (the standard stuff -- CPC, M&M, etc). Biggest weakness is lack of implants; Arce is working on it supposedly.
 
brycethefatty said:
The faculty challenge the residents constantly and push them to be excellent. I think the faculty there are intense, but very good. They are not malignant by any means. I would trust Dr. Indresano to give me a good education and to make me a great surgeon. The residents get along, work well together, and aren't dorks (maybe that guy from Temple . . . ). The incoming chiefs are all cool and very intelligent. They should be great to train under.
Click to expand...
Dr I said he won't make the same mistake twice so I think I ruined it for you already. Also, what's that brown stuff on your nose?😉

armorshell said:
This needs to get stickied badly. This is one of those threads that can be used year and year again, and if the sticky doesn't happen I'm definitely warehousing the link on my computer somewhere in my OMFS folder.
Click to expand...

Looks like someone already "stickied" all over this thread...😱
 
Does anyone know about Columbia/Harlem Hospital? I interviewed there and knew almost nothing about the program before hand due to lack of available info. Chief resident was cool, and said that he has the scalpel in his hand 99.9% of the time in the OR. Lots of trauma and implants. Busy ambulatory clinic. Full scope. Didnt learn about electives. I don't know how much influence Columbia has at Harlem Hospital but the programs do have an affiliation. The clinic is small but Chief res told me that they can get anything they want as far as equipment is concerned. This may be cool if you want to try diff implant systems. He also told me that he had placed about 65 implants already(as of the beginning of Jan). Didnt get to see much of the rest of the hospital nor the OR because they got you in and out pretty quick after the interview(like a car wash). I want to know what other info may be out there about this spot? New Yorkers may know the answer to this???
 
I also liked this program, however, I may be a little cautious with the rank position of this program...through the grapevine I have heard they are strongly "courting" one of their intern for the one spot...take this with a grain of salt.
 
Parkland is a good program for someone looking to operate a lot. Med school is 3 year worth of tuition at around $10k/year. Program is back loaded with experience as most time on OMFS is spent durinng 5th and 6th years. Parkland has 4 rotations which divide your time equally b/t 5th and 6th years.

1. Parkland Hospital - Trauma central. Residents take all mandibles and split the rest of the face q3d. Ellis also likes to operate on many of his private patients at Parkland b/c the OR staff has all his stuff and knows him well. They have dedicated OR time all day 5 days/week here. Mondays I think are in the ambulatory surgery center and are mostly the interns doing FMX, etc. The rest of the week is mostly trauma but I think some path also but not sure about that. The clinic at Parkland recently "went digital" w/ digital radiographs, etc. but overall the facility is pretty sparse. No assistants, go get your own instruments, point and pull stuff most days with some fmx, alveoplasties, etc. on certain afternoons. Fridays at Parkland are sedation days. Implants @ Parkland=0.

2. Private Practice - The resident on this service basically tends to whatever needs to be done for the faculty in their practices. My understanding is that this involves doing a lot of sedations for faculty while they take out teeth, etc. It appears that running the sedation and taking out the teeth simultaneously is pretty uncommon although it is faculty-dependent and if they trust you with their patients you get more chances. The resident on this service also goes to the OR with the faculty on their private patients I think.

3. VA - The VA rotation is probably the best VA rotation in the country. True full scope service working closely with sleep med doctors treating sleep apnea. Also do a fair bit of skin cancer stuff here I think. VA is the place where most implants get done also as I understand it.

4. JPS - County hospital in Fort Worth, ~30 min. from Parkland. Work with faculty who run their private practice out of JPS. Take trauma call as well. The faculty at JPS have a really cool practice where they each bring something different to the table as far as surgical interests. Stella does a lot of orthognathic, including many complex cases ie 4 piece Le Fort's, etc. Warner does a lot of TMJ. Zide does a lot of basal cell recons, etc. They have a new guy, Sherry, who is a former resident and is cosmetic trained. I was told this rotation is where the residents get to run sedations and take out thirds simultaneously. There is a clinic at JPS but I think it is mostly run by the interns there so the residents can focus on the surgery.

Other: Dr. Sinn still operates with the residents on Tuesdays I think doing a lot of craniofacial and TMJ stuff.

Strengths: Many faculty, tons of operating experience, strong tradition of placing residents into academic positions. When I was there, the residents did almost all of the cutting but with so many faculty members, each one is different I am sure. Very diverse operating experience. Gen Surg program at Parkland is very strong so that year should be good.

Weaknesses: Sedation/implant numbers are low. Ellis said the residents sedate for the faculty so the program can meet the sedation requirements for accreditation. Toofache said he placed his first implant his chief year.

Other: Residents here are a pretty diverse group. Some married, some single. Some east coast, Some west coast.

Conclusion: Excellent program for someone looking to operate a lot and see full scope OMFS minus neck whacks, free flaps, etc. That said, I would bet they will bring in another cancer guy soon (Toofache?) as they have had one before (Arce).

Here are the numbers I wrote down when I was here from 06-07

O/P Visits: Parkland 9440
Affiliated 8246

O/P Anesthetics: Parkland 157
Affiliated 834

Admissions: Parkland 680
Other 464

Fractures: Mandible 286
LeFort 18
Zygoma 40
NOE 5

Cysts/tumors 99
Bone Grafts 64
Rhinoplasties 101
Bleph/brows 20
Implants 193

Orthognathic: Mandible 92
Genio 24
Max 167 (could be 107 but i can't read my writing)
 
Baylor is a lesser talked about program on SDN but I really liked it. Baylor is very strong in the core of OMFS in my opinion but also provides exposure to more broad scope surgery. Med school is at Texas Tech in Lubbock and the first 2.5 years are spent there before moving to Dallas. While in med school, residents receive a stipend which more than pays for tuition and moonlighting is allowed. Also, residents have no responsibility to come back on service during med school breaks. Anesthesia training is done at Parkland.

BUMC is a very nice hospital as I recall and the resident clinic which is in the dental school across the street was one of the nicest I saw. While on service, the residents take all facial trauma at BUMC (lvl 1 trauma center) 3 weeks out of 4. Call is in-house.

The residents do a lot of orthognathic surgery, trauma, and benign path in the OR. In the clinic, they do 10-15 sedations per day every day. There is a maxillofacial prosth with his office in the clinic and the residents do almost all of the implants for Baylor COD. I was told the residents finish w/ 300-500 implants each including many complex cases w/ the prostho. The prostho even interviewed us.

In addition to the on service stuff, the residents do a few nice rotations. They spend about 6 months with Larry Wolford doing complex TMJ/orthognathics. Wolford told me he often does orthognathic surgery and TMJ recons simultaneously. The residents do ~100 joints and ~100 orthognathic cases/yr w/ Wolford. Also another ~100 cases/yr on service of orthognathics. Schow told me they do about 500 cases/year total at Baylor so I guess trauma, path, recon, teeth make up the difference.

They spend 2 months w/ a H&N Cancer surgeon (non-OMFS) as his only resident to get malignant path exposure. They spend 1 month w/ an oculoplastic surgeon as his only resident doing blephs, skin cancer, etc.

Weaknesses: Most would argue that med school in a different city (especially being Lubbock) is a weakness. Also, there is some uncertainty as Schow/Triplett are stepping down from their roles as PD/Chair but both are staying on clinically for the foreseeable future. Cosmetic surgery is not very prominent except for the 1 month oculoplastic rotation. Wolford has a fellow that you have to share with so that takes away some experience from his rotation.

Biggest weakness: 2/3 of the residents went to Baylor COD. I can't blame the students for wanting to stick around but too many from one school IMO.

Overall, excellent all around program in my opinion. Should get more pub than it does.
 
UF-Jacksonville is a literally full scope OMFS program doing big time cases all the time. In the past 2.5 year since Fernandes joined the faculty, Jax has more than doubled its OR case load to over 900 cases last year.

OMFS takes face trauma 24/7/365 at this hospital which sees a lot of knife and gun club stuff. In addition, they have multiple fellowship trained surgeons covering the gamut of cosmetics, craniofacial, and oncology/microvascular. Fernandes harvests microvascular flaps for other services like ENT, ortho, etc. As an example for how broad scope this place is, Fernandes told me was going to do some local flap for a penis recon in the near future:laugh:

The program just transitioned to a 6-yr only program. After an intern OMFS year, residents do 1 year of med school in Gainesville, then come back and finish med school and gen surg in Jax.

The hospital is in the absolute hood but it is very nice. Sedations, oddly, are done in an outpatient OR as the clinic is just a few consultation rooms. The call room is by far the nicest I have seen. LCD TV. Computer w/ printer in the bedroom. Lounge right outside w/ Flat screen TV's and couches as well as a workout room w/ treadmills, ellipticals, bowflex, etc. Good thing too b/c these residents put in some serious time with trauma call.

Weaknesses: OMFS basics, ie. orthognathics, sedations, implants. Residents here will be fearless no doubt but right now the program does not offer much experience in core OMFS. Also, Fernandes now has a microvascular fellowship. This year, his fellow is harvesting all of the free flaps and is even doing all of the resections. This dilutes resident experience.

Numbers

Trauma: Mandible 248
Orbit 486
Frontal sinus 10
Trach 43
Lacs 400

Path: Resections 163
Neck dissections 19

Dentoalveolar: Implants 105
Deep Sedations 243

TMJ 30

Recons: Free flaps 31
Non-vascular 77

Cosmetics: Rhino 28
Neck/face lift 9
Blephs 12
Botox/chem peel 12
Scar Revision 12
Laser resurfacing 10
Genio 6
Malar 5

Orthognathics: Lefort I 14
BSSO 11
IVRO 2

OP Visits 6615.
 
UF-G is a good program for someone interested in traditional scope OMFS. The program starts w/ 3 year of Med school. In year 1, you get a $15000 discount on med school to compensate a little bit for out of state tuition. After year 1, you get in state tuition. You are paid a stipend all 6 years but it is not a full stipend during med school. The stipend as presented to us for next year is Yr 1 = $23600, Yr 2 = $24320, Yr 3 = $37938. After year 3, the stipend is the usual house staff stipend.

Residents do 6 months of anesthesia at UF instead of the usual 4 and Gen surg is in the 5th year instead of the 4th so after med school, you do a year on service before gen surg. UF is a level 1 trauma center but trauma is not heavy. OMFS takes q3 weeks and all call at UF is at home, though there is a call room in case.

Residents have their own clinic which is nicer than average. They are very busy w/ sedations doing ~9/morning every day and occasionally in the afternoon. They operate daily as they have 5 full time faculty who all operate.

Weaknesses: No expanded scope, ie craniofacial, cancer. I was told they would like to do more implants but apparently it is more of a scheduling problem than a matter of not having enough patients.

Overall, good traditional scope program. Dolwick is great and said he plans to stick around until he is 70 health permitting (currently 63 yo).

Numbers:
OP visits 9868
Sedations 1081
Admissions 322 inpatient, 429 o/p
Trauma 189
Orthognathic 135 (cases, not jaws)
Path 64
Recon 134
TMJ 32
Cosmetics 44
 
I will do a few more another day.
 
I'll do this while it's fresh in my mind:

The program takes 3 residents/year and occasionally has a 1-year intern (last year they had someone in this position), but it's not a position filled consistently from year to year.

Resident get a stong OMS core experience of 37 months. They do 4 months of gen surg, 4 months anesthesia.

The program claim to do 700 major OR cases per year. A logbook that I flipped through (which was a logbook of one of the chief residents so far this year) showed a good scope of procedures, in my opinion. Strengths were orthognathics, trauma, and cleft lip & palate related procedures. Trauma was above average, in my opinion, but not overwhelming. They did very few teeth in the OR, at least according to the logbook that I explored. Faculty touted the program as one of the biggest cleft lip and palate programs of OMS in the country. They definitely do a lot, or it seemed that way to me. Dr. Smith cuts most of those cases, but he assured me that if a resident shows interest and preparation, they are able to get their hands dirty to some extent.
Residents get a strong experience in a variety of TMJ surgical cases as most TMJ patients from the community are refereed to the program for surgical treatment.
The program claims to place 200 implants per chief per year. Most implant cases come from referrals from the dental school. Residents work with dental students for the restoration. Thursday mornings are divided between a didactic and clinic implant session.
Dr. Sullivan and Dr. Smith have a very nice private practice that is on the hospital grounds, but not associated with the hospital. This made me nervous that the residents don't get to touch Smith and Sullivan's patients, but the residents assured me that this is not the case. In addition to their private practice, the residents have their own clinic where they see patients independent of Dr. Smith and Dr. Sullivan's patients, so they get some extra autonomy there. They do very little "point and pull" (only Friday afternoons they do 'point and pull'). In the resident clinic, they are mainly doing sedations and 3rds and dentoalveolar procedures. Their patients from this clinic are coming from the dental school.
Residents take call q3d and split it with ENT and PLS. Residents assured me that any cases they get/find while on call, they keep (meaning isolated orbit or nasal fractures aren't "defaulted" to ENT or PLS). I think residents mostly took in-house call, but I'm not sure if it's required or not.
Almost all the residents owned a house or condo within 20-30 minutes of the hospital. Residents have to pay a premium for health insurance. The faculty said the program is very busy, and call can be demanding, but it is not overwhelming like some programs. Sullivan and Smith have young kids and they mentioned they like to get home early enough to spend time with them. They also encouraged the residents to do the same and they feel that they get a chance to do it often.
Weaknesses: no cancer. Also, cosmetics seem pretty limited, but Dr. Miyaki is their cosmetics guy and it sounds that if residents are truly interested, they can get some cosmetic/PLS cases under their belt.
Sullivan also mentioned these cons:
-very busy
-very little research
-the didactic component is diluted due to clinical-based curriculum
My opinion: residents were all very cool, down to earth, and likeable (how could they not be likeable -- like 60 percent of them were mormon!). The faculty were pleasant and seemed very intelligent.

If I've said anything that is inaccurate about this program or you can add anything at all, feel free.

And yes, I might have brown-nosed a little in my last couple of posts, but come on, look at my picture . . . don't I look like a kiss-@ss?
 
Also, I would just like to mention one thing about this thread -- I think people who get on here and read our little essays about these programs should read with caution. I have interviewed at some programs and absolutely hated them, while other people at the interview crap their pants because they are so in love with the program. It's hard to write these things 100% objectively. Also, it's hard to get an accurate read on a program by just interviewing there for one day. I mean, there's no way to find out all the cons just by going one day (usually, you get all the pros shoved down your throat, so they are hard to miss).

Also, I would look at numbers carefully too. Some programs have higher numbers, some have lower in the same areas . . . numbers only tell you how many of a certain procedure are being done. For one thing, it doesn't tell you how much of the case the residents are cutting. They could be holding sticks for 99% of the case. Or they could be cutting all of the case. Or they could just be opening and closing the case. Or they could be shagging the surgical tech during the downfracture.

Just thought I'd rant a little before I went to bed.😳
 
I'll second what bryce said. The idea of this thread is to give some details about wha teach program is about so those who apply in the future will know a little more about each program or ideally, if a program sounds great here to you, you will apply to extern there. I agree that some programs impressed me less than others, though I don't think I gave away my rank list in this review of programs. I would encourage others who have different points of view on the programs reviewed to share your thoughts. It always helps to hear another point of view.
 
servitup said:
I think the number is probably closer to 150-175. At most 200.
Click to expand...

Blakey told me he did about 125-150 a year. I know Turvey does at least what Blakey does. Whether or not that bears out in the logs, I have no idea. I was just repeating what Dr. Blakey told me some months ago.
 
Reposted to eliminate redundancy
Xigris14 said:
This note is comming from a recent resident of the Gainesville OMFS program. I have read certain posts about the program which are untrue or not accurate. Let me honestly give you a 2008 update on this program.

1)They now have two 6 year spots and one 4 year spot. The case load is way more than enough to bring another resident. So we did.
2)There are 5 full time OMFS attendings with the near future of adding another. We are thinking a Cosmetic Trained Attending soon.
3)We practice full scope with some malignant path/recon. Tons of benign. Some cosmetics. Now I am not saying we come out ready to do cosmetic surgery or microvascular surgery. But I feel comfortable doing Blephs,Fillers,Lipo.
4)Regarding Malignant path and recon. We rotate with ENT/Surg Onc/Plastic and get enough exposure in OR doing all microvascular surgery/reconstruction. I know the principles and understanding of the surgical skills of these procedures and how to do them. So what, if you can go to a program and do a ton of malignant path. Will you be doing these procedures and anastomosis in practice. Probably not. You need to do a fellowship. So the point I am making is that this program gives you the right amount of exposure to this surgical field that most residents desire. So we dont have a fellow trained oncologist, o well. I dont feel that we are lacking in malignant path as others would say. Unless you expect to do this weekly.
5)We do enough trauma. We actually do all of the plastics/ENT difficult panfacial cases. We are known in this hospital to be the best at Trauma.
6)We sedate 5 days a week AM/PM 10 cases average a day. Mainly 3rds and path,trauma,implants. Some FMX but not overwelming.
7)There is enough implants to go around. The rumor is false that we lack in implants. The problem is that we operate 5 days a week and at 2 hospitals that there are not enough residents to run the implant center. If you make time you will place plenty of implants. But adding another resident is going to take care of that problem.
8) We do lack in cosmetics. Everyone knows that. The ENT Plastics attending is great about allowing us to operate with him or supervise. We also will be hopefully looking for a cosmetic trained attending soon. We dable in cosmetics but mainly limited to fillers,lipo,cervicplasty, and post traumatic wound/surgical revisions.
9)Orthognathic surg/TMJ more than enough. Way more than enough. We come out doing these procedures blindfolded.
Craniofacial-lots of 2nd clefts, few primary palates,few distraction, and Lefort3. Lots of hemifacial microsomia and condylar hyperplasia. Enough costochondral grafts which we harvest ourselves. We go to craniofacial clinic weekly. They are also starting to work with Dr. Ruiz in orlando doing craniofacial cases.
10)Resident operates as junior/Cheif. Not much retracting like I have personally seen at other programs. Here you dont have to wait unitl chief year to feel what steel feels like. Year 1-6 you operate, except when your physically in med school.
11) There have been recent changes to stipend and out of state tuition. More attractive now and affordable.

So in conclusion the program is great and will continue to improve with the addition of new attendings,and another resident as a 4 year. I am not saying it is the best program out there and full scope. But most programs are not and are lacking in numbers somewhere. You need to figure out in the future what you want in a program and apply based on that. If you want a program strong in cosmetics dont apply here. But at least understand what each program as to offer. I hope this has helped.
Click to expand...
 
Can someone please review LSU-NO, LSU-Shreveport, Maryland, and UCSF.
 
Med School: Right now, residents are paid all 6 years at UMKC but they also do a lot of med school. It seems to be structured in such a way that they go on service for a few months, then some med school, then some service, more med school, etc. They start off w/ 6 months on service however. Now that said, Dr. Ferguson told me that starting THIS year, residents will not be paid all 6 years but will only have to do 2 years of medical school. A second year resident told me that he was told the same thing 2 years ago so who knows.

Training: UMKC OMFS takes all the facial trauma at Truman Med Center which is a busy level 1 trauma center. I got the impression that the vast majority of their OR time is spent doing trauma. That said, they also do approximately 40 orthognathic cases/year as well as a fair amount of TMJ. Dr. Poon is fellowship trained in oncology and is doing cases regularly as well. Dr. Ferguson told us that they do "500 faces/year". There is a parttime attending who is cosmetic trained who said he would like to get the residents more involved in his cases. Dentoalveolar training seemed pretty good here. The residents have their own clinic in the hospital and also go over to the dental school to do implants. The residents at UMKC were all really nice and seemed pretty laid back.

KC has an extremely low cost of living. For $200,000 you can get an unbelieveable house. The city seemed like a fun place to live as well with lots to do.

Weaknesses: Light on orthognathics. Seems like trauma is the main thing going in the OR.

I was very impressed w/ Dr. Ferguson in my interview with him and feel that he will make sure that the program graduates are well prepared.
 
Penn is located in the University City area of Philly. Most of the residents rent apartments in the vicinity and the area has a very urban feel to it as you would expect. Med school is 2.5 years here and the school itself is very impressive. It is very expensive but the residents are paid a full stipend throughout medical school which offsets the cost of tuition. In return, they take call 1-3 times/month and they said that the call schedule is made so they won't be on call the night before exams, etc.

Gen surg is a cool set up here as the residents do 6 months of PGY 1 and 6 months of PGY 2 to fulfill 2 year GS requirement in PA. This means lots of operating and less scut work b/c you spend half the time as a second year GS resident.

The program has a large faculty. They do more TMJ recons here by a long shot than anywhere else I know of. Multiple Lorenz recons/week w/ Quinn who was one of the principle designers of the prosthesis. The residents also do a lot of orthognathic surgery and trauma.

Weaknesses: I believe dentoalveolar/implants is a little low here but it was hard to get a good feel for the exact numbers.

Overall, a very good program for someone who is interested in city living and likes TMJ surgery. Faculty seemed excellent and residents were all very welcoming. People are always asking on here about good East Coast programs and I think Penn qualifies.
 
I would like to add that the residents at Penn are really a great group of guys. Also, the facilities at both the Hospital and Dental School were very impressive.
 
Any thoughts on Costello's program?
 
This thread came so far...keep it going. Anybody have any experiences with any of the programs less commonly talked about in the forums?

Now I'm just fishing for more info.
 
servitup said:
Parkland

Weaknesses: Sedation/implant numbers are low. Ellis said the residents sedate for the faculty so the program can meet the sedation requirements for accreditation. Toofache said he placed his first implant his chief year.
Click to expand...

In the past, this was perhaps one of the weakest points in the program. The new administration is making changes to alleviate this. This year, the 5th years have begun placing implants. I'm a 3rd year now, and I've placed a couple myself this year. :meanie:
 
Could someone do a write-up on Columbia, Cornell and USC? I would really like to know how these programs compare to some of the more popular programs. Thanks!
 
Columbia07 said:
Could someone do a write-up on Columbia, Cornell and USC? I would really like to know how these programs compare to some of the more popular programs. Thanks!
Click to expand...

Why doesn't someone just copy and paste the entire list of accredited programs and let people edit the list with information about programs they are familiar with.

... that is of course if you really want a comprehensive resource for all programs. Maybe we can even publish a OMS residency selection guidebook. 🙂
 
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