* * 2012-2013 Secondary Applications Thread!! * *

[angldrps]

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A similar thread was in the pre-allo. forum, so thought about asking the same question to all of those who applied to osteopathic medical schools

Please share how long on average you spent on finishing each secondary? and how many did you have to do?

 

[limoncello]

The first few ones took me the longest, but then you can re-use some answers for other secondaries, which saves some time. On average I would say, I spent a full 1 day on each secondary. I completed about 7 secondaries.

 

[NeuroLAX]

Of the 8 or 9 that I ended up completing, I'd say on average it took me about a day or two per secondary. I was also writing a manuscript at the time so the longer ones were definitely around two days. Some of them took me literally a couple hours (essentially just entering my credit card info after a little copy+paste from AACOMAS EC section )

Like limoncello stated, some questions are pretty much the same for a few of the secondaries so for those it was mostly just rewording to fit the particular prompt or add/subtracting sentences to meet the word cut-off.

 

[MedPR]

An entire day? Really? Damn.. Is it important to avoid redundancy with your PS?

 

[limoncello]

I think that it's important to highlight as much of yourself as possible so I would avoid redundancies, but if the questions asks about something that you already discussed in your essay, I think that it should be okay to repeat the experience/point in the secondary as long as you re-word it.

 

[Whosis]

An entire day? Really? Damn.. Is it important to avoid redundancy with your PS?

It's not jut the avoiding redundancy, but also almost every school asks a "Why Us" question which means you have to address an answer to them. They also each tend to ask their questions in different ways so as to make you tweek every cut and paste section. So why they all may say Why do you want to be a DO, Pikeville may ask Why do you want to be a DO in the mountains of eastern KY; while NYCOM may ask why you want to practice in the underserved inner city. And they all do this....

 

[angldrps]

bump

 

[michow87]

Just go to old school specific threads and if you notice that the secondaries remain the same year to year, get a head start. Simple as that. I'm a reapplicant (unless I get off the darn waitlist) and I've already redone all my secondaries to the schools that I applied to. Couldn't hurt!

And like everyone else said, there is a bit of redundancy.

 

[tide11189]

Depends entirely on the school and you. The minute I received my secondaries I did them and tried to submit them that day.

 

[DrWily]

I tried to get them done within 1-2 days. I just needed that extra time to have my fiancee proofread for me. However, once you start getting 3-5 a day, I said I would get them all out within 10 days. My longest was 14 days. I didn't pre-write any of them.

 

[ShyRem]

New year, new thread for EVERYTHING secondaries. Post all your secondary app questions here. Threads made on their own related to secondary apps will be merged into this thread.

Game on and good luck, folks!!! Let's crank 'em out!

 

[MedPR]

Can anyone from last years cycle chime in on secondaries for the schools you received invites from?

 

[jon stewart]

anybody know which schools do not have essay secondaries? I know that nova does not. I have searched and found a thread for MD schools but not DO.

Thanks all

 

[itsokimadoctor]

anybody know which schools do not have essay secondaries? I know that nova does not. I have searched and found a thread for md schools but not do.

Thanks all

lecom

 

[drshark]

does that mean they skip secondaries all together and just invite for an interview based on gpa/mcat etc?

 

[Iliketoytles]

does that mean they skip secondaries all together and just invite for an interview based on gpa/mcat etc?

No. By "no secondary", it means there isn't an essay portion of the secondary.

I think all DO schools have at least some form or online thing to fill out. LECOM requires you to login, and just confirm this little thing. Takes like 20 seconds... but you still gotta do it. Only then will they look at your app.

 

[jon stewart]

does that mean they skip secondaries all together and just invite for an interview based on gpa/mcat etc?

im pretty sure EVERY school has a secondary. Some of those that do not require essays just have you do other tasks such as list your previous activities, or verify biographic info etc...

so there are secondaries for all schools but some schools have secondaries with no essay.

 

[drshark]

Oh ok I see! thanks for clarification guys! 🙂

 

[user3]

DMU and touro nv have no essays... Also WVSOM only sends secondaries to people invited to interview.

 

[poopyhead]

Nsu-com

 

[NeuroLAX]

Also WVSOM only sends secondaries to people invited to interview.

I didn't apply to WVSOM so I had no idea they did this. Interesting.

 

[K31]

No. By "no secondary", it means there isn't an essay portion of the secondary.

I think all DO schools have at least some form or online thing to fill out. LECOM requires you to login, and just confirm this little thing. Takes like 20 seconds... but you still gotta do it. Only then will they look at your app.

And, most importantly from the schools' perspective, you send them money. Seriously, secondaries are such a huge scam.

 

[virtuoso735]

What do DO schools do with LOR's that are sent in after the primary is submitted but before secondaries are in? I know that LOR's should be sent along with the secondary, but my school's premed committee sends letters to all schools its students apply to in early July, so this would be before most secondaries are even sent out or complete. Do the schools keep them on record and then read them when secondaries come in? Will they toss them if secondaries aren't in yet, and then ask the student to resend? Anyone know?

 

[NeuroLAX]

I can't comment from experience, but I don't think it would be a problem. You should check the school's website or call admissions to double-check.

 

[CopToEM]

What do DO schools do with LOR's that are sent in after the primary is submitted but before secondaries are in? I know that LOR's should be sent along with the secondary, but my school's premed committee sends letters to all schools its students apply to in early July, so this would be before most secondaries are even sent out or complete. Do the schools keep them on record and then read them when secondaries come in? Will they toss them if secondaries aren't in yet, and then ask the student to resend? Anyone know?

Typically as soon as the school gets a piece of paper with your name on it they make a file for you - either electronic or physical hard file. It doesn't matter if this is AACOMAS, Secondaries, or LORs, you will get a file. They're used to this kind of thing. I believe my secondary and LORs both probably arrived at DCOM before my primary, for example. Not a big deal.

 

[angldrps]

Out of all my EC experiences, i picked some of the most meaningful ones to discuss in my PS. After looking at the secondary questions thread, i realized that i would answer many questions by discussing how these same experiences that i have already talked about in my PS motivated me towards medicine and make me a good candidate.

Is it ok to do this? How many of you had overlap with the experiences mentioned in PS and the ones mentioned in secondaries? I do have additional experiences that i can discuss in my secondaries but i think i can write a stronger secondary essay by discussing the experiences that have been the most meaningful to me/the ones already in my PS.

 

[angldrps]

bump for more input

 

[angldrps]

so, are there any more schools other than WVSOM,Nsu-com, DMU, touro nv, LECOM that have no essays in their secondaries??

 

[psychgirrrl]

Hello everyone, you all are helpful folks and I need help.

Currently, I am in LoR hell (stupid LoR). I did everything right, talked to my professors more than once about these letters, carefully constructed a CV and sent it to them along with deadlines and have been giving them updates now and then (with new MCAT scores and finalized PS). So here is the problem: my school does not have a stupid pre-med committee but my adviser loves me and is going to write a fabulous letter on my behalf however my second science professor seems to have bailed on me. She is leaving on sebatical so I cannot for the life of me get a hold of her.

My options are as follows: ask one my introduction to bio professors to write me a letter (I have kept in touch with her but this was rather limited) or cry and die.

Another question: do letters have to be submitted with secondaries or are they submitted with aacomas? I asked my adviser and she said they need to be submitted with the primaries...is this correct?

I appreciate any of the help you guys can give me, I am currently like this

 

[nirvikalpa]

No, LOR's are not submitted with primary applications, they are sent in when you fill your secondaries and are sent directly to the schools themselves, not AACOMAS.

As for your situation... did you exhaust all of your options with the teacher that is supposed to write you a letter? Did you email her, email her with an URGENT title, call her office, search for her on yellowpages... ok, maybe not the last one, but to be completely honest that's how I contacted my one LOR writer. Or, if both your one teacher and your advisor talk to each other... think you can ask your advisor what's up?

Worse comes to worse: send an email to your introductory bio prof and explain the situation you're in. It's always best to be honest... I am sure she would help you out. Maybe cry, but don't die. But seriously, that sucks your professor bailed on you... 🙁

 

[dsoz]

Hello everyone, you all are helpful folks and I need help.

Currently, I am in LoR hell (stupid LoR). I did everything right, talked to my professors more than once about these letters, carefully constructed a CV and sent it to them along with deadlines and have been giving them updates now and then (with new MCAT scores and finalized PS). So here is the problem: my school does not have a stupid pre-med committee but my adviser loves me and is going to write a fabulous letter on my behalf however my second science professor seems to have bailed on me. She is leaving on sebatical so I cannot for the life of me get a hold of her.

My options are as follows: ask one my introduction to bio professors to write me a letter (I have kept in touch with her but this was rather limited) or cry and die.

Another question: do letters have to be submitted with secondaries or are they submitted with aacomas? I asked my adviser and she said they need to be submitted with the primaries...is this correct?

I appreciate any of the help you guys can give me, I am currently like this

If MD, LORs are with the primary.

If DO, LORs are with the secondary.

I have a theory about this... AACOMAS does this because Interfolio charges $6 per LOR packet delivery. AACOMAS is powered by Interfolio. Is there a money connection?

AMCAS collects all the LORs and sends them out with their primary ap for free. But it will cost an additional $6 per school if you send your LORs by Interfolio to each DO school you apply to.

If you are only applying to one or two schools, then Interfolio does not make sense. You can bug your profs about sending out two letters. But sending out nine letters? twenty letters? that may be asking too much from someone. That is when you pay for the Interfolio account.

I am rambling and ranting. Sorry.

dsoz

 

[psychgirrrl]

Thank-you for your input.

I am trying to remain civil, I sent her an e-mail last night with updates on my app (finalized personal statement) so I am trying to remain a calm and giving her the day to respond to me. I am going to call the Chemistry office and ask if she is still in the country (she's going abroad to do research) and if so I am going to give her a call on Friday if she doesn't get back to me by the end of today (I have sent her a grand total of 3 e-mails over a span of a month and none were answered and the status on interfolio remains unchanged)

I have already contacted my bio professor, do you really think I should be that honest with her? I dont wanna make her feel like she is unimportant and whatnot, I want her to know that I value her opinion of me but this is kinda really important and that I appreciate her help.

Stupid LoRs!!!!

Thank-you for your input about the secondaries, so let me get this straight: when you send secondaries is when you send LoRs. I might have a last resort if my bio teacher says no because I am taking Biochem this summer...I can try to ask a letter from that professor but really don't want to do that.

 

[psychgirrrl]

If MD, LORs are with the primary.

If DO, LORs are with the secondary.

I have a theory about this... AACOMAS does this because Interfolio charges $6 per LOR packet delivery. AACOMAS is powered by Interfolio. Is there a money connection?

AMCAS collects all the LORs and sends them out with their primary ap for free. But it will cost an additional $6 per school if you send your LORs by Interfolio to each DO school you apply to.

If you are only applying to one or two schools, then Interfolio does not make sense. You can bug your profs about sending out two letters. But sending out nine letters? twenty letters? that may be asking too much from someone. That is when you pay for the Interfolio account.

I am rambling and ranting. Sorry.

dsoz

Okay, that must be what my advisor is thinking of then. That makes me less stressed out. I am applying to like 17 schools so interfolio makes good sense for me. Only like 3 MD schools around my town and that's it and frankly I am not that worried about that part of the app because those are my super reach schools anyway.

 

[BNHWC2009]

Out of all my EC experiences, i picked some of the most meaningful ones to discuss in my PS. After looking at the secondary questions thread, i realized that i would answer many questions by discussing how these same experiences that i have already talked about in my PS motivated me towards medicine and make me a good candidate.

Is it ok to do this? How many of you had overlap with the experiences mentioned in PS and the ones mentioned in secondaries? I do have additional experiences that i can discuss in my secondaries but i think i can write a stronger secondary essay by discussing the experiences that have been the most meaningful to me/the ones already in my PS.

I would say if you're going to use the same experiences talk about different aspects of them than you did in your PS. The admissions committee will have both your PS and secondaries so it doesn't help you to write the same things. Use the opportunity to show them more of yourself. Do not cut and paste as that will just make you look lazy (I bet you're not, so don't give them a reason to think you are). Also, try to tailor your answers to each individual school as much as possible. Hope that helps! 🙂

 

[hmainn]

I would say if you're going to use the same experiences talk about different aspects of them than you did in your PS. The admissions committee will have both your PS and secondaries so it doesn't help you to write the same things. Use the opportunity to show them more of yourself. Do not cut and paste as that will just make you look lazy (I bet you're not, so don't give them a reason to think you are). Also, try to tailor your answers to each individual school as much as possible. Hope that helps! 🙂

Agreed. Use the extra space to go into more detail. There is going to be overlap in parts of your application because it is about you. Just use it wisely 🙂

 

[hmainn]

bump for more input

I took less than 2 weeks for mine, but I dragged one out for a month. If I had been less busy during the summer, I would have completed them earlier. I did get interviews at all the schools though 🙂

I would try to complete within a week. You want to spend a good amount of time to look over and revise your essays. I know that people tend not to spend as much time on these secondaries as they do on their primary essay, but I would try to put in a good effort.

My opinion is that at this point, getting your secondary in a few days earlier but not as polished, is not a good trade-off.

 

[CopToEM]

This is one of the biggest things I advocate for when proofreading personal statements. You cannot divulge so much information in your personal statement that you end up tying your hands in secondaries and interviews. Ideally, in the PS, you would just mention the experience and what you got from it. In the secondaries, you would go into further detail about how those experiences led you to medicine. In the interview, you would share your personality and humbleness for who you've become as a result of them - which is hard to get across in writing.

Unfortunately this is a situation many, many people fall into. I was only lucky enough to have an experienced reader tell me the same things I've said above. The PS becomes so detailed and wordy that when they get secondaries they're like, "Gosh, I've already talked about all of this...."

Do not simply restate your personal statement at this point - you will be 'beating a dead horse' so to speak. If the question is something about, "tell us the experiences that led you to medicine," share other details about those experiences (as has been suggested above) or talk about how those experiences impacted you in different ways. Alternatively, you might take a different approach and talk about how those experiences will contribute to the diversity of the class or how they will help you excel in medical school and your career.

As you read your secondaries try to think like an AdCom member who has just read your PS. If you feel like they'll say, "yeah, we already know all that," just keep working with it.

The secondaries should be easy to write. 1 to 1.5 pages max - one of mine was barely a page.

 

[CopToEM]

Ask any professor with whom you've had a positive relationship with. Explain to them the sabbatical issue, which they already know about I'm sure, and that you need assistance. Many educators enjoy nothing more than playing a part in students going on to the next academic level. That is, they'll be tickled to death to write you a recommendation letter. All you have to do is ask.

Avoid waiting for the Biochem professor if you can because that may roadblock your entire application process.

Lastly, for any others who stumble across this thread, I remind you of this: there are parts of your application that you have no control over. Arrival time of letters of recommendation, arrival times of transcripts, MCAT grade release dates and verification times are all examples. Strategically plan for these and make sure you're ahead of the curve. Recommend letters at the beginning of the Spring semester before the Summer you will apply. Otherwise you'll become one-in-many who have requests sitting on that professor's desk.

 

[MedPR]

If MD, LORs are with the primary.

If DO, LORs are with the secondary.

I have a theory about this... AACOMAS does this because Interfolio charges $6 per LOR packet delivery. AACOMAS is powered by Interfolio. Is there a money connection?

AMCAS collects all the LORs and sends them out with their primary ap for free. But it will cost an additional $6 per school if you send your LORs by Interfolio to each DO school you apply to.

If you are only applying to one or two schools, then Interfolio does not make sense. You can bug your profs about sending out two letters. But sending out nine letters? twenty letters? that may be asking too much from someone. That is when you pay for the Interfolio account.

I am rambling and ranting. Sorry.

dsoz

LORs are secondary for MD also. AMCAS will submit them for you, but not until secondaries come out.

 

[MedPR]

Typically as soon as the school gets a piece of paper with your name on it they make a file for you - either electronic or physical hard file. It doesn't matter if this is AACOMAS, Secondaries, or LORs, you will get a file. They're used to this kind of thing. I believe my secondary and LORs both probably arrived at DCOM before my primary, for example. Not a big deal.[/QUOTE]

How did you send a secondary before primary? Did you just use the previous year's prompt and send it in?

 

[angldrps]

This is one of the biggest things I advocate for when proofreading personal statements. You cannot divulge so much information in your personal statement that you end up tying your hands in secondaries and interviews. Ideally, in the PS, you would just mention the experience and what you got from it. In the secondaries, you would go into further detail about how those experiences led you to medicine. In the interview, you would share your personality and humbleness for who you've become as a result of them - which is hard to get across in writing.

Unfortunately this is a situation many, many people fall into. I was only lucky enough to have an experienced reader tell me the same things I've said above. The PS becomes so detailed and wordy that when they get secondaries they're like, "Gosh, I've already talked about all of this...."

Do not simply restate your personal statement at this point - you will be 'beating a dead horse' so to speak. If the question is something about, "tell us the experiences that led you to medicine," share other details about those experiences (as has been suggested above) or talk about how those experiences impacted you in different ways. Alternatively, you might take a different approach and talk about how those experiences will contribute to the diversity of the class or how they will help you excel in medical school and your career.

As you read your secondaries try to think like an AdCom member who has just read your PS. If you feel like they'll say, "yeah, we already know all that," just keep working with it.

The secondaries should be easy to write. 1 to 1.5 pages max - one of mine was barely a page.

Thank you for such a helpful response. My PS focuses on two of my ECs. One of the experiences I discuss in my PS is a very specific interaction I had with a patient while working as an intern. This leaves room for me to talk about all the other experiences I gained during my internship. In my PS , I also discuss being a tutor. I am not sure how i can add more to this. I still have more ECs left that i don't discuss in PS- shadowing, research, working in free clinic, etc.

 

[CopToEM]

How did you send a secondary before primary? Did you just use the previous year's prompt and send it in?

Theirs hasn't changed in years from what I've seen. In addition, the website says, "After submission of the AACOMAS application the applicant should complete the LMU-DCOM Supplemental Application online or print the PDF version and submit it to..."

In addition, they also told my undergrad on an admissions tour that the minute we hit submit on the primary we should go to the website, download the secondary, fill it out, and send it in. That reinforces what's said on the website. Plus, the Dean of Students has a YouTube video where he says the exact same thing.

Read the application/secondary website for schools very carefully. DCOM isn't the only one who just wants you to go ahead and send it without waiting for an invite.

 

[CopToEM]

Thank you for such a helpful response. My PS focuses on two of my ECs. One of the experiences I discuss in my PS is a very specific interaction I had with a patient while working as an intern. This leaves room for me to talk about all the other experiences I gained during my internship. In my PS , I also discuss being a tutor. I am not sure how i can add more to this. I still have more ECs left that i don't discuss in PS- shadowing, research, working in free clinic, etc.

In that case, with more ECs in your pocket, I recommend discussing OTHER things. Add more to your story than you've already shown them. You want to present yourself as a diverse candidate as having tremendous diversity in your experiences is golden.

 

[Sunnydidi]

What are some of the common and school-specific questions to be expected on the secondary applications? Would love to get a head start. I'm assuming questions such as "Tell us why you want to be a physician", "Why DO", "Why our school" would be the usual. Anything else?

 

[CopToEM]

What are some of the common and school-specific questions to be expected on the secondary applications? Would love to get a head start. I'm assuming questions such as "Tell us why you want to be a physician", "Why DO", "Why our school" would be the usual. Anything else?

Tell us about experiences that led to your decision to pursue medicine is a big one.

 

[MedPR]

Theirs hasn't changed in years from what I've seen. In addition, the website says, "After submission of the AACOMAS application the applicant should complete the LMU-DCOM Supplemental Application online or print the PDF version and submit it to..."

In addition, they also told my undergrad on an admissions tour that the minute we hit submit on the primary we should go to the website, download the secondary, fill it out, and send it in. That reinforces what's said on the website. Plus, the Dean of Students has a YouTube video where he says the exact same thing.

Read the application/secondary website for schools very carefully. DCOM isn't the only one who just wants you to go ahead and send it without waiting for an invite.

Thanks! Going to check on that right now.

 

[Sunnydidi]

*

 

[hmania]

Just reading Campbell's website and does not mention anything about secondary application. Has anyone else emailed the school or called to see if this is true?

 

[Ravizzle]

From the college information book

" Supplemental application required: Yes Sent to: Screened Applicants URL: N/A Supplemental Application Fee: $50

Fee waiver available: Yes Waiver conditions, if offered: AACOMAS waiver Supplemental app. earliest filing date: 6-1-2012

Supplemental app. latest filing date: 3-15-2013"

 

[MedPR]

Last year's first question was

Are you acquainted with an osteopathic physician (e.g., family physician, relative, or close friend)? If so, please provide name, relationship to physician, institution and date of graduation and where they earned their osteopathic degree.

If the only DOs I am acquainted with are the two I shadowed, should I put them in for that question? Or are they strictly looking for people we know on a somewhat personal level?

Also isn't the institution they graduated from going to be the same place they earned their osteopathic degree? Redundant question (yes, it is "and where" not "of where")?