35-45 mins too far from campus?

[bommer1389]

I’ll be starting med school next year (deferred acceptance). My main question- Is it manageable to live 35-45 minutes from school (in a suburb)? I would greatly appreciate all the advice I can get considering all the details below:

-I am married; I have a newborn who will be ~1 yr old when I start.
-We’d be moving in w/ my parents (or my spouse’s parents); we’re from the same city.
- Lots of family support (no need for daycares, etc.) if we live at home.
-Currently active duty, so I’ll be taking the HPSP scholarship.

As you can imagine, our parents and siblings are thrilled we’ll be coming home for the next ~4 years. While it’s exciting to have all the family support, especially with a young child, I already have hesitations about moving in w/ them (mainly because of the distance). The other option is getting a 2-bedroom apartment in the very urban city near campus. Not sure I want to expose my wife and child to that environment for 4 years. Also don’t want to move in with my parents, then find out it’s not going to work for whatever reason mid-semester. I could use the advice and perspective of anyone who is aware of some potential issues of which I am probably ignorant. Thank you!

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[futuremdforme]

If you didn't have the kid, I'd say no, not worth it. But if it means no daycare, that's a huge advantage! Daycare would probably add a huge amount to your plate - having to get back by a specific time, and making alternative arrangements if your kid is sick (which he/she will be in daycare, apparently it is worse than the plague). You can always move after 1st year.

I think it might be harder in 3rd year though, not sure how it will work.

 

[blub1212]

Unless you download your lectures and listen to them in the car to study while you are driving (only really applicable during first 2 years), that is 70-90 minutes of completely wasted time every single day. 70-90 minutes every day that you could be spending with your family that you aren't. Studying has to take priority, it is just the nature of the career you have chosen, so you can't reduce the time you spend studying. The only real flex time you will have is your free-time (i.e. time with your family). So start from if you are willing to sacrifice that time with your family. After you and your wife have made that decision, you already know what to do.

 

[Taddy Mason]

I’ll be starting med school next year (deferred acceptance). My main question- Is it manageable to live 35-45 minutes from school (in a suburb)? I would greatly appreciate all the advice I can get considering all the details below:

-I am married; I have a newborn who will be ~1 yr old when I start.
-We’d be moving in w/ my parents (or my spouse’s parents); we’re from the same city.
- Lots of family support (no need for daycares, etc.) if we live at home.
-Currently active duty, so I’ll be taking the HPSP scholarship.

As you can imagine, our parents and siblings are thrilled we’ll be coming home for the next ~4 years. While it’s exciting to have all the family support, especially with a young child, I already have hesitations about moving in w/ them (mainly because of the distance). The other option is getting a 2-bedroom apartment in the very urban city near campus. Not sure I want to expose my wife and child to that environment for 4 years. Also don’t want to move in with my parents, then find out it’s not going to work for whatever reason mid-semester. I could use the advice and perspective of anyone who is aware of some potential issues of which I am probably ignorant. Thank you!

A number of my classmates (a few with young kids) lived in a city an hour away for the first 2 years. Its definitely doable if your school doesn't have too many mandatory things, you have good time management, and good support (which it sounds like you do).

 

[backside_attack]

I'll be doing that starting this summer - it isn't ideal, but it's what worked for my spouse and I given our current mortgage and his job situation. I am planning on using the time in the car to listen to my lectures, but I know it is passive at most and will mean some wasted time. What makes it more feasible is my school's daily schedule and being done by noon. It will be hard but I'll just have to make it work.

 

[WilliamofOckham]

Unless you download your lectures and listen to them in the car to study while you are driving (only really applicable during first 2 years),

Not really true. MedEd Online is a decent driving resource for M3.

 

[WheezyBaby]

I'm extremely adverse to sizeable commutes, but you have compelling financial and personal reasons, and the commute isn't THAT obscene (my cutoff there would be 1 hr each way). In your situation, I would plan on making the commute and only move if it became particularly detrimental to you performing academically (this may happen 3rd year on busy rotations - it may be worth living apart from your family on gen surg, obgyn, ai's, etc)

 

[sliceofbread136]

It will be very annoying 3rd year

 

[seminoma]

I’ll be starting med school next year (deferred acceptance). My main question- Is it manageable to live 35-45 minutes from school (in a suburb)? I would greatly appreciate all the advice I can get considering all the details below:

-I am married; I have a newborn who will be ~1 yr old when I start.
-We’d be moving in w/ my parents (or my spouse’s parents); we’re from the same city.
- Lots of family support (no need for daycares, etc.) if we live at home.
-Currently active duty, so I’ll be taking the HPSP scholarship.

As you can imagine, our parents and siblings are thrilled we’ll be coming home for the next ~4 years. While it’s exciting to have all the family support, especially with a young child, I already have hesitations about moving in w/ them (mainly because of the distance). The other option is getting a 2-bedroom apartment in the very urban city near campus. Not sure I want to expose my wife and child to that environment for 4 years. Also don’t want to move in with my parents, then find out it’s not going to work for whatever reason mid-semester. I could use the advice and perspective of anyone who is aware of some potential issues of which I am probably ignorant. Thank you!

HPSP = rolling in $$$$. All the HPSP kids at my school bought brand new cars and a bunch of other expensive stuff during MS1 and MS2. A lot of them bought books then sold them back.. definitely ripping off the government, but whatever that's their problem in the future.

If your school has mandatory lectures, then you should move closer and pay for child care. If there are optional lectures, then stay where you are because you won't have to go to school very often.

That said, one of the other posters is correct that kids very commonly contract plague-like diseases from daycare.

 

[bommer1389]

Thanks for all the insight!
I know lecture isn't mandatory, but anatomy lab and maybe a few other things are. And how is listening to lectures accomplished in the car? Can lectures be downloaded or only streamed?

 

[Stagg737]

Thanks for all the insight!
I know lecture isn't mandatory, but anatomy lab and maybe a few other things are. And how is listening to lectures accomplished in the car? Can lectures be downloaded or only streamed?

Depends on your school. My school has downloadable podcasts of our lectures. There are quite a few students in my class that live 20+ minutes from campus and it's been nbd for them. I live about 20 minutes away without traffic, and driving to and from campus has been a nice time for me to decompress and just listen to some music or podcasts as a break. Clinical years could be tougher, especially for rotations where you're on call, but you can always just move after 2nd year if that's an issue.

 

[Crayola227]

this can work preclinical but would be frankly dangerous on a surg or ob/gyn rotation, not to mention in general for the clinical years

 

[CherryRedDracul]

this can work preclinical but would be frankly dangerous on a surg or ob/gyn rotation, not to mention in general for the clinical years

I did fine with a 35 minute commute for general surgery and OB/GYN (got at least 6 hours of sleep/night as well), but then again, I didn't have a kid.

 

[WilliamofOckham]

this can work preclinical but would be frankly dangerous on a surg or ob/gyn rotation, not to mention in general for the clinical years

Meh. There are ways to play the game.

Surgery and even Ob/Gyn need not be quite as painful schedule-wise as they're made out to be.

 

[Mr Roboto]

I have a friend who lives 35 minutes from his school in NY, because his SO works in the city. It's worked fine for them through the first two years (but they don't have a kid).

 

[ortnakas]

I know people that pulled off that kind of commute for the first two years and it worked for them. Up to you if the financial savings is worth the loss in time (I suspect with how expensive childcare is, especially in major cities, it might be).

You will probably want to re-evaluate for the clinical years; commuting 1 hour each way after a 14-hour shift is a different story than commuting after a half-day of lectures. Still MIGHT be worth it, but that's something for your end-of-second-year self to decide.

 

[futuremdforme]

Meh. There are ways to play the game.

Surgery and even Ob/Gyn need not be quite as painful schedule-wise as they're made out to be.

Details please!

 

[WilliamofOckham]

Details please!

You'll probably figure it out.

First things first: get your responsibilities done quickly and early. If you're on Surgery, that probably means seeing a few patients in the morning, writing a basic SOAP note, and being sure to have the vitals and relevant overnight details for your intern. After morning rounds, at my hospital, it was mostly a free-for-all WRT which surgeries we watched. I'd go to one surgery most days - two at the maximum - and spend the rest of my time until PM sign-out studying for the NBME in the lounge. We had lectures too, of course, but there was a fair amount of free time to study during the day. And yes, read up on the surgeries for which you're considering scrubbing. As soon as I heard that Whipples were seven-hour procedures, I made a mental note to always have an excuse if ever asked to scrub in on one.

Ob/Gyn... similar tactics. I used the "lecture" excuse more on that rotation.

Now, am I advocating skipping out on these rotations entirely? Absolutely not. But I see little value in watching any more than three lap choles or hernia repairs if one knows that (s)he has no interest in doing Surgery. Ditto for Gyn clinic ( ) and Ob/Gyn.

Rock those shelf exams. Far more important these days (unfortunately). But to reiterate: there's no excuse for not taking care of your actual responsibilities. On IM, for example, I was often done for the day by lunchtime, because I'd made sure to finish all of my patient notes in the morning. As a resident, I see no reason to keep students any longer than they need to be there. Work hard for a few hours and earn your timely release. Hehe.

 

[WilliamofOckham]

So in other words, "luck" out into a hospital with sh**y clerkships and supervision, then be a wallflower. Foolproof plan there.

Clerkships are what one makes of them. For you to call a flexible clerkship "sh**y" is very presumptuous of you. I had friends in the same hospital who scrubbed into every surgery they could and happily took call with their residents. Others of us focused our efforts elsewhere. Med school is not a one-size-fits-all process... particularly with the increasingly kick-the-can-down-the-road training approach. Surgery and Ob/Gyn will still require that a student be in by 5:00 AM or so (a late day for me on Surgery), but how the day goes after morning sign-out can be rather flexible, depending on the site. I understand that some sites assign students specific cases, but not all do. Regardless, I'm certainly not advising the OP that living 40 minutes away will be easy on Surgery; just that I wouldn't go so far as to call it "dangerous."

 

[WilliamofOckham]

Nope sorry. A clerkship that lets you hide out in the lounge all day, get away with lying about lecture schedules, and pick and choose cases by how much of your precious free time they will steal...is a sh***y clerkship. That's not presumptuous, it's calling a spade a spade.

A good clerkship is one that offers students the opportunities to see a variety of cases. Which was the case at my hospital. Everything from neurosurgery cases to ophtho cases. And there was a log we were expected to submit, with a mimimum number of cases scrubbed on over the course of the rotation. So, if a student wanted to, (s)he could pack a few cases a day in for a week, then coast the rest of the rotation. Good for them, I say.

If students aren't actively being assigned to cases, it means that those cases will proceed just fine without them. And contrary to what surgeons may think, retracting the abdominal wall for three hours is not exciting.

Residents who are cool know that "lecture" is frequently code for "I'm not doing anything here except studying on my phone, so if that's all I'm gonna do for the next three hours, I might as well be drinking a coffee and sitting down. " And they play along with it - provided that the student has done everything (s)he was supposed to.

 

[WilliamofOckham]

I'm not going to defend lying of any sort... when I look back, I wish I'd been more up-front about it. But I haven't forgotten what it's like to be a medical student, unlike many of my colleagues.

 

[kmp0410]

I think it'll be fine atleast for the first two years. People commute further to work all the time. Especially considering the money you'll save. Finally, assuming you can watch lectures online (recommended) then you are not going to class every day. I drove 30 mins first year and it wasn't bad. Left usually 45 early to account for parking. If you have to go to campus you can leave at different times and just study there if you have free time.

I wouldn't worry about the listening to things in your car part. That's not that far of a drive to do that, doubt you'll get much from it anyways. Not every waking moment needs to be spent studying especially first year. Even with a kid.

Sent from my iPhone using SDN mobile

 

[Crayola227]

@WilliamofOckham , you have actually forced me to side with @SouthernSurgeon and like his posts

I didn't say it earlier, because it's just dumb on its face to think that the average med student is going to have control over whether or not their surg or ob/gyn days are 12-16 hours long vs short days.

I am nowhere near surg/ob/gyn adjacent, and I think surgeons are crazy people who meet criteria for addiction to their field. They remind me of the workhorses from Animal Farm, Orwell's book. They are the workhorses of medicine, as Cesar Milan the Dog Whisperer might say, the "high energy dogs." I think most are a lot of fun to grab a beer with ironically, but I don't like working with them. Diametrically opposed personalities you could say.

Anyway, despite all that, I'm the first now to defend everyone in medicine getting a decent amount of surgical experience. In AND out of the OR. For the vast number of MD grads and where they end up, there's a lot of things you'll need to know.

Morning rounds were much more educational than I thought. The dressing changes - that's when I probably learned the most about wound care and healing, learning to distinguish a "good" looking stoma takedown (none of them look good is my point, that's why you need this exposure) that's healing well, post-op dehissence, etc. (**** did I spell that right?). How much erythema is normal and how much is concern for infection? People skip their post op follow up all the time, and while it's not supposed to be your job, it's good to have a feel when you can take those staples out.

Generalists, PCPs, hospitalists, and ED docs, etc will all see patients in various stages of healing (or not healing, post op). We're not experts but we need to be able to recognize post op complications as much as the next doc.

Lastly, us other docs are usually the ones referring people for surgery, we're usually the first "gatekeepers" on the way to the OR if you will. We need to recognize surgical problems and refer. Also, we need a healthy respect for surgery and what that puts a patient through. People seem to think that surgery goes down as cleanly and precisely as taking apart and putting back together Lego blocks - when the truth is it has more in common with the last time you skinned and pieced out a whole chicken than it does Lincoln Logs. Anyone that has gone under the knife will not emerge the "same" even if the goal was just to correct pathology. Things don't come back together all that cleanly. We need to see the surgical chaos and respect it as a last resort not an easy fix.

Those 3 hours holding the retractor is when you will be present to see an artery get nicked and dealt with. That's when you'll see an unexpected anatomical variant lead to a nicked nerve and some post op symptoms. That's when you'll get a chance to see how a hemorrhage is controlled. You'll see how easy it is for things to go wrong and appreciate the difficulty. You'll understand the uncertainty that surgeons deal with.

I've come around to the view that this is valuable knowledge for all MDs to be running around with which is why I support really putting on a surgeon's cap and walking a mile in those shoes for a few weeks. I've cleared patients for surgery, risk stratified, referred, called urgent surgical consults, and managed patients medically pre and post op, and relied on surg recs to manage patients. I need to understand their "language" and thought process and notes. It's all ****ing relevant.

I think we need to do a better job of explaining why surgery rotations matter to non-surg bent students. Point out what they can be getting from those hours in the OR watching. If nothing else it should teach you some hefty respect for surgery.

Anyway, what was described does not sound like a good approximation of walking a mile in a surgeon's shoes. Studying for the shelf isn't enough IMHO to get what you should be getting out of the rotation.

TLDR:
med students don't have much control over their schedules, SS is right trying to have a "light" surg rotation is likely to backfire
need to learn respect for the surgical process and understand where you fit into it no matter what field you go into
take it from someone who hates all things surgical, those rotations are relevant to all MDs in one way or another IMO
read the above for some ideas on what you should be getting out of the rotation as a non-surg bent person

 

[seminoma]

For MS3 the primary issue is weather in the winter and early morning rotations (OB and surgery mostly). Depending on where you live that 30-45 minute commute could easily turn into 60-90 minutes if the roads suck. You're not going to want to leave at 330am to get to the hospital at 430am to preround. Then again, maybe you don't go to a school that makes the med students preround, then go to resident sign-out from 530-6am, then round with the residents, then round again at 7am with the attending. Pretty dumb stuff.

Prerounding isn't bad when you have residents that let you show up as early or late as you want as long as you get all your work done and are ready before rounds. It sucks when residents make you show up at xyz time no matter what.

 

[WilliamofOckham]

@WilliamofOckham , you have actually forced me to side with @SouthernSurgeon and like his posts

I didn't say it earlier, because it's just dumb on its face to think that the average med student is going to have control over whether or not their surg or ob/gyn days are 12-16 hours long vs short days.

I am nowhere near surg/ob/gyn adjacent, and I think surgeons are crazy people who meet criteria for addiction to their field. They remind me of the workhorses from Animal Farm, Orwell's book. They are the workhorses of medicine, as Cesar Milan the Dog Whisperer might say, the "high energy dogs." I think most are a lot of fun to grab a beer with ironically, but I don't like working with them. Diametrically opposed personalities you could say.

I'm not telling the OP that he can bank on having easier rotations. All I'm saying is that the frightening tales of Surgery and Ob/Gyn rotations are frequently over the top.

Anyway, despite all that, I'm the first now to defend everyone in medicine getting a decent amount of surgical experience. In AND out of the OR. For the vast number of MD grads and where they end up, there's a lot of things you'll need to know.

Morning rounds were much more educational than I thought. The dressing changes - that's when I probably learned the most about wound care and healing, learning to distinguish a "good" looking stoma takedown (none of them look good is my point, that's why you need this exposure) that's healing well, post-op dehissence, etc. (**** did I spell that right?). How much erythema is normal and how much is concern for infection? People skip their post op follow up all the time, and while it's not supposed to be your job, it's good to have a feel when you can take those staples out.

Generalists, PCPs, hospitalists, and ED docs, etc will all see patients in various stages of healing (or not healing, post op). We're not experts but we need to be able to recognize post op complications as much as the next doc.

Couldn't agree with you more, and I would never advocate that a med student try to skip out of rounds on any rotation.

Lastly, us other docs are usually the ones referring people for surgery, we're usually the first "gatekeepers" on the way to the OR if you will. We need to recognize surgical problems and refer. Also, we need a healthy respect for surgery and what that puts a patient through. People seem to think that surgery goes down as cleanly and precisely as taking apart and putting back together Lego blocks - when the truth is it has more in common with the last time you skinned and pieced out a whole chicken than it does Lincoln Logs. Anyone that has gone under the knife will not emerge the "same" even if the goal was just to correct pathology. Things don't come back together all that cleanly. We need to see the surgical chaos and respect it as a last resort not an easy fix.

Those 3 hours holding the retractor is when you will be present to see an artery get nicked and dealt with. That's when you'll see an unexpected anatomical variant lead to a nicked nerve and some post op symptoms. That's when you'll get a chance to see how a hemorrhage is controlled. You'll see how easy it is for things to go wrong and appreciate the difficulty. You'll understand the uncertainty that surgeons deal with.

Yes, and it's great to want to see one or two examples of a given type of surgery. But beyond that, I considered it a personal waste of time.

I've come around to the view that this is valuable knowledge for all MDs to be running around with which is why I support really putting on a surgeon's cap and walking a mile in those shoes for a few weeks. I've cleared patients for surgery, risk stratified, referred, called urgent surgical consults, and managed patients medically pre and post op, and relied on surg recs to manage patients. I need to understand their "language" and thought process and notes. It's all ****ing relevant.

I think we need to do a better job of explaining why surgery rotations matter to non-surg bent students. Point out what they can be getting from those hours in the OR watching. If nothing else it should teach you some hefty respect for surgery.

Anyway, what was described does not sound like a good approximation of walking a mile in a surgeon's shoes. Studying for the shelf isn't enough IMHO to get what you should be getting out of the rotation.

TLDR:
med students don't have much control over their schedules, SS is right trying to have a "light" surg rotation is likely to backfire
need to learn respect for the surgical process and understand where you fit into it no matter what field you go into
take it from someone who hates all things surgical, those rotations are relevant to all MDs in one way or another IMO
read the above for some ideas on what you should be getting out of the rotation as a non-surg bent person

You've radically misunderstood my posts. I'm not saying that students going for psych or pathology shouldn't be invested in their Surgery rotation. Of course they should. But for every hour spent daydreaming in the OR, there is a proportionate cost. And I, for one, have no problem with students calculating that they'd rather devote a couple of hours for shelf studying here and there.

 

[Psai]

Gotta go with southernsurgeon for this one. Surgery shelf is pretty straightforward if you've had medicine and read pestana + nms. There's more value in learning how to manage postops and seeing surgery than reading review books over and over again. This is how shelf exams have bastardized the learning process. Haven't you read enough during the preclinical years? You need to see how medicine is actually practiced in the real world

 

[WilliamofOckham]

Gotta go with southernsurgeon for this one. Surgery shelf is pretty straightforward if you've had medicine and read pestana + nms. There's more value in learning how to manage postops and seeing surgery than reading review books over and over again. This is how shelf exams have bastardized the learning process. Haven't you read enough during the preclinical years? You need to see how medicine is actually practiced in the real world

I actually had my surgery rotation first. Whatever, I guess it comes down to personality differences. If a student is doing his job on a rotation, I don't really care whether he decides to completely immerse himself in the field.

 

[Psai]

I actually had my surgery rotation first. Whatever, I guess it comes down to personality differences. If a student is doing his job on a rotation, I don't really care whether he decides to completely immerse himself in the field.

I think the student's job is to immerse themselves in the field. That's the whole point of rotations. A solid understanding of what other physicians do is key to being a great physician. It's one of the glaring absences in midlevel training which is why they consult so damn much

 

[ananasmed]

Did a 30-45 minute commute for my first year and plan to do it for second year, too. I have no regrets and don't feel that the 60-90 minutes spent in my car had any impact on my grades, although 7am exams did have me question my life choices a few times hah. I never listened to lectures in my car and instead opted for various audio entertainment, but listening to lectures would be plausible if you feel especially guilty about the downtime. I'm not married/don't have kids but I think those are reasons why this living/commuting situation would be even more beneficial for you.

 

[ActinicKeratosis]

I commute 30 minutes one way to and from my third year clinical rotations. It works fine for me.

 

[WilliamofOckham]

I think the student's job is to immerse themselves in the field. That's the whole point of rotations. A solid understanding of what other physicians do is key to being a great physician. It's one of the glaring absences in midlevel training which is why they consult so damn much

The point of a rotation is to get continuous, daily exposure to the specialty for a couple of months. Not, in my view, to spend every waking moment changing bandages and reading FHR monitors. I had an outside life during every single one of my rotations as a med student, and I assure any medical students of this: it hasn't made me a sub-par doctor.

 

[wxman393]

I’ll be starting med school next year (deferred acceptance). My main question- Is it manageable to live 35-45 minutes from school (in a suburb)? I would greatly appreciate all the advice I can get considering all the details below:

-I am married; I have a newborn who will be ~1 yr old when I start.
-We’d be moving in w/ my parents (or my spouse’s parents); we’re from the same city.
- Lots of family support (no need for daycares, etc.) if we live at home.
-Currently active duty, so I’ll be taking the HPSP scholarship.

As you can imagine, our parents and siblings are thrilled we’ll be coming home for the next ~4 years. While it’s exciting to have all the family support, especially with a young child, I already have hesitations about moving in w/ them (mainly because of the distance). The other option is getting a 2-bedroom apartment in the very urban city near campus. Not sure I want to expose my wife and child to that environment for 4 years. Also don’t want to move in with my parents, then find out it’s not going to work for whatever reason mid-semester. I could use the advice and perspective of anyone who is aware of some potential issues of which I am probably ignorant. Thank you!

I commute that distance daily. I am military with a military spouse (we live on post). A few kids in daycare/school. Mandatory attendance at my school unfortunately. No issues through the first year. I enjoy listening to the available podcasts.


Sent from my iPhone using SDN mobile

 

[Yung Kelso]

I go to school in a major city. For my MS1 year. I stayed in the suburbs and commuted to campus. the length of my commute was dependent upon the time I chose to go to campus. Our classes typically started at 8am and were a mixture of mandatory and non mandatory classes. So I either was forced to leave the house at 6am and have a commute of 35 minutes or leave during rush hour and have a commute up to 1hr & 20 minutes (one way). needless to say, after a while I only ended up going to campus for mandatory events. If I could do it over again, I would have paid the extra money and moved closer because I missed out on a lot of events: social gatherings, study sessions, interest group meetings, research presentations, etc... that I would have attended if I lived closer. So I felt pretty isolated most of the time, but the length of the commute did not affect my academic performance (to my knowledge). The pressure to stay away from campus or leave campus early was always there, lest I have to deal with rush hour traffic. You, however, have additional considerations that I did not have,I was single, you have a family, and a child, so if you don't care about missing out on social functions, and a few interest group meetings I would go with the longer commute from the suburb at least for your first two years. I think the pros of having free childcare (by family no less) and free housing are HUGE pros. They will reduce your cost of attendance, your mind will be at ease that your child is being taken care of properly, so you can focus on your studies. When you have to do rotations though, you may need a different dynamic.

 

[TheFutureFatMan]

I did that for the first few months of my SMP. It wasn't exactly like medical school, obviously, but still high intensity. It was difficult, but doable. Primarily this was because they were a little looser-goosey on attendance. I would not suggest it if you have to be there every day. That would add up to a lot.

Financially speaking, having daycare covered at home is pretty fantastic. I do not miss those bills.

 

[sloop]

I can confirm that a commute that an ~30min commute with traffic (most of my driving was at rush hour because I always went to group/lecture) is totally manageable the first two years. 45 minutes would be a little harder but I think that would also be totally manageable.

Things get tougher during the clinical years but, honestly, I had about a 45 minute commute on one rotation by car and for most other rotations I also had about a 45 minute commute but took public transit for most of it and it was doable. The only exception is that surgery and ob got really exhausting with this commute.

It's really all about how to spend and manage your time. I didn't live near the school the first two years so I didn't hang out with classmates much outside of school (other than going out to lunch/a bar every once in a while after an exam). I would go home, study, do my own thing, and hang out with non-med school friends according to when I had time. Worked out fine.

 

[abn632]

My school only does streaming, no downloadable lectures. But...there are free screen capture programs that you can use to "record" the lectures and thus get around the non-downloadability. When you're commuting, you can at least listen to the audio (I advise against watching the video while driving). Open Broadcaster Software is one that is pretty user-friendly, free, and not chock full of viruses.

 

[Goro]

Our weakest students have gotten away with this in the past. We now keep a very close eye on them closer to home.

Nope sorry. A clerkship that lets you hide out in the lounge all day, get away with lying about lecture schedules, and pick and choose cases by how much of your precious free time they will steal...is a sh***y clerkship. That's not presumptuous, it's calling a spade a spade.

 

[TheFutureFatMan]

Did a 30-45 minute commute for my first year and plan to do it for second year, too. I have no regrets and don't feel that the 60-90 minutes spent in my car had any impact on my grades, although 7am exams did have me question my life choices a few times hah. I never listened to lectures in my car and instead opted for various audio entertainment, but listening to lectures would be plausible if you feel especially guilty about the downtime. I'm not married/don't have kids but I think those are reasons why this living/commuting situation would be even more beneficial for you.

Ya that exam schedule there is pretty rough...

 

[TheFutureFatMan]

Nope sorry. A clerkship that lets you hide out in the lounge all day, get away with lying about lecture schedules, and pick and choose cases by how much of your precious free time they will steal...is a sh***y clerkship. That's not presumptuous, it's calling a spade a spade.

That's the opposite of what I want in my clerkships. Also. Best avatar ever.

 

[AMEHigh]

I lived 35 minutes away from my campus in med school and I had no complaints. My school wasn't in an interesting place to live and I'm glad I made the decision to live where I did. No regrets as my personal life has always been important to me. If living 35 minutes away will make your personal life better, I think it's 100% worth it.

 

[sliceofbread136]

Nope sorry. A clerkship that lets you hide out in the lounge all day, get away with lying about lecture schedules, and pick and choose cases by how much of your precious free time they will steal...is a sh***y clerkship. That's not presumptuous, it's calling a spade a spade.

God forbid we miss out on driving the camera...

 

[Psai]

God forbid we miss out on driving the camera...

Mad about not getting to do stuff, mad about getting to do stuff
Make up your mind

 

[sliceofbread136]

Mad about not getting to do stuff, mad about getting to do stuff
Make up your mind

I'm not mad about not getting to do stuff, not sure where you got that from (my school is fairly well known for getting students involved). I do however think too much time is spent in the OR since it has little value for a non-surgeon.

If I was king of clerkship design I would make surgery ~4 weeks. 1 week would be in the OR where it would mandated that the student places any IVs, central lines, foleys and intubate the patient whenever possible. They would also help close to practice suturing. The next week would be spent in the trauma bay, where they would do the above tasks in non-emergency patients and also run the level 3s. The next 2 weeks would be spent seeing consults so we could learn to identify a surgical patient.

Imo this would be a significantly better use of time than spending 90 hour weeks driving the camera to watch surgeons clean gallbladder fascia. Positively useless.

 

[ThoracicGuy]

The point of a rotation is to get continuous, daily exposure to the specialty for a couple of months. Not, in my view, to spend every waking moment changing bandages and reading FHR monitors. I had an outside life during every single one of my rotations as a med student, and I assure any medical students of this: it hasn't made me a sub-par doctor.

It is attitudes such as this that made me not care about those med students on my rotation. They would end up with mediocre evaluations as a result. If they showed at least some interest, I'd go out of my way to make their experience as good as possible. Perhaps you don't feel you are sub-par even though you sub-par'ed your med school rotations, but your experience and insight is likely not as good as those that welcomed a chance to learn about a specialty that they wouldn't be spending their life doing...

 

[Psai]

I'm not mad about not getting to do stuff, not sure where you got that from (my school is fairly well known for getting students involved). I do however think too much time is spent in the OR since it has little value for a non-surgeon.

If I was king of clerkship design I would make surgery ~4 weeks. 1 week would be in the OR where it would mandated that the student places any IVs, central lines, foleys and intubate the patient whenever possible. They would also help close to practice suturing. The next week would be spent in the trauma bay, where they would do the above tasks in non-emergency patients and also run the level 3s. The next 2 weeks would be spent seeing consults so we could learn to identify a surgical patient.

Imo this would be a significantly better use of time than spending 90 hour weeks driving the camera to watch surgeons clean gallbladder fascia. Positively useless.

I agree with you that sounds like a good plan

 

[njtrimed]

I have a family and plan to commute from the suburbs. It's about 25-30 minutes without traffic, up to an hour with traffic. While I envy the kids who live basically on campus and can easily get to any activity with minutes' notice, I also think that 30-45 minutes is a very reasonable commute. That's been my commute for work for years, and while I was doing both grad school and work full-time this past year. It's completely doable, and unless you have major issues living with family, the whole live-in childcare and minimal living expenses thing sounds pretty ideal to me!

 

[Brahnold Bloodaxe]

Consider also that by regularly commuting such long distances, you're contributing to Climate Change. Every time you get in that vehicle and crank out 50 miles, you're helping make the world warmer. Or perhaps colder. We just don't know.

Save the whales, brah. Save the mfkn whales.

 

[njtrimed]

HPSP = rolling in $$$$. All the HPSP kids at my school bought brand new cars and a bunch of other expensive stuff during MS1 and MS2. A lot of them bought books then sold them back.. definitely ripping off the government, but whatever that's their problem in the future.

If your school has mandatory lectures, then you should move closer and pay for child care. If there are optional lectures, then stay where you are because you won't have to go to school very often.

That said, one of the other posters is correct that kids very commonly contract plague-like diseases from daycare.

Ripping off the government? In the greater NYC area, HPSP barely covers basic living expenses and probably wouldn't cover daycare for one child, let alone more than one. And that scholarship requires several years of service as well as a GMO tour, in addition to sacrificing your chosen career path to opting for residency positions dictated by the military. You should be thanking OP for committing to service that most of us are unwilling to do.

 

[seminoma]

Ripping off the government? In the greater NYC area, HPSP barely covers basic living expenses and probably wouldn't cover daycare for one child, let alone more than one. And that scholarship requires several years of service as well as a GMO tour, in addition to sacrificing your chosen career path to opting for residency positions dictated by the military. You should be thanking OP for committing to service that most of us are unwilling to do.

I was referring to my classmates who, during MS1 and MS2, bought "required" textbooks with HPSP money (I guess they get reimbursed or something?) and then resold them and used the money for other crap like a new car payment, electronics, or other random stuff. I don't know if HPSP takes into account cost of living, but I know there are ways to access more money than HPSP allocates for certain things (i.e. buying and returning/reselling books) like child care or whatever. That was my only point.. that OP might not have to worry about child care costs as much as he thinks.

And yeah, obviously HPSP people are willing to commit to a service I'm unwilling to do, but diverting govt funds is ripping off the govt regardless lol. Robin hood was a cool dude for giving money to the poor, but he was still a thief.

 

[Redpancreas]

I’ll be starting med school next year (deferred acceptance). My main question- Is it manageable to live 35-45 minutes from school (in a suburb)? I would greatly appreciate all the advice I can get considering all the details below:

-I am married; I have a newborn who will be ~1 yr old when I start.
-We’d be moving in w/ my parents (or my spouse’s parents); we’re from the same city.
- Lots of family support (no need for daycares, etc.) if we live at home.
-Currently active duty, so I’ll be taking the HPSP scholarship.

As you can imagine, our parents and siblings are thrilled we’ll be coming home for the next ~4 years. While it’s exciting to have all the family support, especially with a young child, I already have hesitations about moving in w/ them (mainly because of the distance). The other option is getting a 2-bedroom apartment in the very urban city near campus. Not sure I want to expose my wife and child to that environment for 4 years. Also don’t want to move in with my parents, then find out it’s not going to work for whatever reason mid-semester. I could use the advice and perspective of anyone who is aware of some potential issues of which I am probably ignorant. Thank you!

I'm not married and suspect I come from a different cultural background so take that with a grain of salt. I have finished two years of medical school, and with regards to education, figure out how often required events are and consider that in your decision. My initial inclination is to advise you to live separately. This is because choosing to do that, and then realizing it doesn't work and then moving in with your family is better than moving in with your family and then causing chaos and then having to move out. Also, I was actually born when my dad was completing his masters and was living in an apartment in Detroit and I think I turned out fine. Another thing to consider though is your spouse and what he/she does for a living and what s/he's willing to put in terms of house work and child rearing. In medical school, on some days you won't be able to do anything but just study and sleep. If they're a homemaker, things will be fine as long as they know that sometimes you're going to be their second child, but if he or she is also a busy professional, I highly recommend taking advantage of familial support in these next 4 years so your spouse doesn't get overworked. That coupled with not seeing you often would be enough to stress any relationship.