Am studying enough - or is everyone else overdoing it?

[ttac]

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Originally posted by Street Philosopher
wow there is a verbatim transcription service? that's pretty awesome! it would save me a lot of time, that's for sure. we don't have fast forward on our videos... we use stupid ass realmedia. 🙁

i'm gonna start going to lectures more now, and change my sleep "schedule" to allow it. medical school started yesterday for me.

Students get paid 50$ for each lecture hour... as a result, this scribes service costs like 200$/semester, but it's totally worth it to get every single word spoken in lecture (pretty much).

Actually, I think it's pretty much impossible to skip class and do well if you don't have some sort of verbatim transcription service. I actually thought that most schools have this sort of service... maybe it's one of the side benefits of going to such a large school (there are enough student scribers to cover all the lectures, and there is a large enough subscriber basis to where total revenue is sufficient to offset the 50$/hour fee, while still keeping overall scribes costs ~200$)

Our streaming video comes up in Windows media player... it's not really fast forward, but more like the program refreshes the screen every ten seconds or so... since each slide is up for at least a minute, the difference is pretty much moot.

ttac

 

[Street Philosopher]

Ahh I see. I suppose I could do that with real player too. Actually we have the powerpoints to download so that's not a big issue. I was hoping you could fast forward the video and sound because some people talk too slow 😛

We have a note service here, which is run pretty much the same way you described. I think i'd prefer a verbatim transcription though... it'll be easier to figure out what they're saying. Most are in outline form but they use full sentences so I dunno what the point of that is...

 

[8744]

Not to beat the dead horse, but I hardly ever skipped lecture. I think in two years I only missed ten lectures.

Some people who claim to study eight hours per day might be counting study time while they skip class. (Which doesn't count as "study time" for the purposes of this discussion which I take to be study time after class.)

We had a note-taking service but with use of Power-point lectures and their dissemination on the web I think NTS is becoming redundant.

I think it was more important when instructors used 35mm slides or wrote on the chalk board. (Remember those? It's the big flat thing behind the projector screen)

I hardly ever took notes. First because most of the testable stuff is on the power-point slides and second because I can't write and listen at the same time.

 

[pathdr2b]

Originally posted by Panda Bear
When we did renal, for example, the course directors provided us with a four pound syllabus full of densly packed information, a long list of required readings from Guyton and Robbins, and pages and pages of power point lectures.In fact, I only read Guyton or Robbins when I was either bored or could just not find something mentioned in the lectures in the BRS books.

I just had to jump in here. Panda Bear, that's some great advice you gave about studying and I think I'll apply it to this pathology course I'm taking that has it's foot up my arse!! And with all the references I keep seeing to Robbins, I sure one day I'm going to be REALL happy I had this background before medical school.😀

 

[ItsGavinC]

Originally posted by DW
god bless you panda bear 😀

Here here. Couldn't agree more. People freak out when they see me skipping class, but it's become one of my best allies.

It isn't good for everybody, but it's what I have to do in order to have time for my wife, kids, church functions, and activities I enjoy.

 

[aphistis]

You're a churchie, Gavin? Awesome. 😀

 

[8744]

Originally posted by pathdr2b
I just had to jump in here. Panda Bear, that's some great advice you gave about studying and I think I'll apply it to this pathology course I'm taking that has it's foot up my arse!! And with all the references I keep seeing to Robbins, I sure one day I'm going to be REALL happy I had this background before medical school.😀

But make sure you have a good grip on all the stuff in the review books. My point is that it is more efficient to learn the stuff in a condesnsed, no B.S. format then to wade through hundreds of pages of trivia trying to guess what is important to retain.

I am not advocating blowing off learning or slacking off.

You know, even though I didn't get every question right on Step 1 (but I got a respectable 219) there were not too many that I couldn't have answered if I had the appropriate BRS book in front of me. Most of them (98%?) rang a bell somewhere and even if I didn't know the exact answer I knew that I had read about it in either First Aid or the BRS books.

The best way to prepare for Step 1 is to go to class, pay attention, and use the review books as your primary textbooks.

By the way, the "Blueprint" books are excellent for third and fourth year. Almost everything you are expected to know is covered in sufficient detail in these books. This has been my experience, anyways. Especially now that I am doing medicine.

 

[roady]

G-D Damn It F*&^ This Stupid Post!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I am so F*&$*& Sick of Medical School I am ready to stand up and scream at the lecturer, "Shut the F(*^*& Up" , and have restrained myself on a few particularly low self-control situations induced by cramming and lack of sleep.

Look. I F(*&*& (YES! My favorite word has become F^*k!!) have studied my a$$ off the first year. It was hell. I just passed B-chem. Then physio. What a piece of sh(*& year it was. I can't begin to tell you how many times I fell asleep in my chair while studying, how many times I went to lecture on 3 hours sleep and fought like hell to stay awake, how many times I gave it EVERY OUNCE OF MY WILL I COULD MUSTER..............just to crawl across. I mean like # 94 of 97 or something. Totally pathetic. Totally heroic? Totally impossible.

I don't know what the hell is wrong with me. I just have no brains for this stuff. I thought I wasn't that dumb a guy until I tried this crap. Holy freakin' cow. There has been little I could say to explain how incredibly hard this has been...And in comparison to others in this post (I read like 2/3s, and then went especially balistic after reading Pandas wise and calm stuff...I AM SO JEALOUS! I CAN'T do that and still PASS!!).

I think I am only here because of sheer willpower. I have a goal, and I also have the prospect of being left behind for a year/kicked out. In our current class, there are several people held over from last year, and more might have flunked out.

The most difficult part is, it's getting harder. It might get harder yet. F(&^(*& This ****! The only thing I can do is attend every hour of lecture (virtually), every damn lab, then review it all at least once, and then try to review it all again once before the test. Then comes the waiting to see if I narrowly passed. When it's this painful, the temptation is to just let it slide for once. That might be the hardest part--there's no break, there's no day off--there's no room for error. None (but you still take time off because it just gets too crazy sometimes). If there was one really bad test, for me, it might not be possible to make it up again for the whole year. Great! Just f*^*& great. Look, the analogy is I already have my pedal to the metal, and this baby is just barely cranking out the mph I need to get up this hill. And it's getting steeper...

If you can do it on 2 hours a day, bless you. I wish I could too. My post summary: studied/study all the time to just barely pass (sometimes), struggling to hang on and just barely make it through while the foundation crumbles just under my feet. G-d help me and you, and say a prayer for me (and I say one for you).

Goodnight, and joy be with you (I do what I can on that account, believe it or not).

P>S> F*^(% all the critical and non-understanding people who are going to read this post and say something stupid about it in advance. A$$ Os. ("Forgive them, for they do not know"...OK, I'll try).

 

[GoodMonkey]

i'm sorry you're having such a hard time, roady. 🙁 wish i had advice. i'm a wee m1 who is just getting things figured out for herself.

 

[8744]

Originally posted by roady
G-D Damn It F*&^ This Stupid Post!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I am so F*&$*& Sick of Medical School I am ready to stand up and scream at the lecturer, "Shut the F(*^*& Up" , and have restrained myself on a few particularly low self-control situations induced by cramming and lack of sleep.

Look. I F(*&*& (YES! My favorite word has become F^*k!!) have studied my a$$ off the first year. It was hell. I just passed B-chem. Then physio. What a piece of sh(*& year it was. I can't begin to tell you how many times I fell asleep in my chair while studying, how many times I went to lecture on 3 hours sleep and fought like hell to stay awake, how many times I gave it EVERY OUNCE OF MY WILL I COULD MUSTER..............just to crawl across. I mean like # 94 of 97 or something. Totally pathetic. Totally heroic? Totally impossible.

I don't know what the hell is wrong with me. I just have no brains for this stuff. I thought I wasn't that dumb a guy until I tried this crap. Holy freakin' cow. There has been little I could say to explain how incredibly hard this has been...And in comparison to others in this post (I read like 2/3s, and then went especially balistic after reading Pandas wise and calm stuff...I AM SO JEALOUS! I CAN'T do that and still PASS!!).

I think I am only here because of sheer willpower. I have a goal, and I also have the prospect of being left behind for a year/kicked out. In our current class, there are several people held over from last year, and more might have flunked out.

The most difficult part is, it's getting harder. It might get harder yet. F(&^(*& This ****! The only thing I can do is attend every hour of lecture (virtually), every damn lab, then review it all at least once, and then try to review it all again once before the test. Then comes the waiting to see if I narrowly passed. When it's this painful, the temptation is to just let it slide for once. That might be the hardest part--there's no break, there's no day off--there's no room for error. None (but you still take time off because it just gets too crazy sometimes). If there was one really bad test, for me, it might not be possible to make it up again for the whole year. Great! Just f*^*& great. Look, the analogy is I already have my pedal to the metal, and this baby is just barely cranking out the mph I need to get up this hill. And it's getting steeper...

If you can do it on 2 hours a day, bless you. I wish I could too. My post summary: studied/study all the time to just barely pass (sometimes), struggling to hang on and just barely make it through while the foundation crumbles just under my feet. G-d help me and you, and say a prayer for me (and I say one for you).

Goodnight, and joy be with you (I do what I can on that account, believe it or not).

P>S> F*^(% all the critical and non-understanding people who are going to read this post and say something stupid about it in advance. A$$ Os. ("Forgive them, for they do not know"...OK, I'll try).

No, I understand totally. That's how I felt the first couple of months of first year and exactly how I felt the first couple of weeks of third year starting out on surgery. But you can only go so long in a "freaked out state" before you either adapt or have a breakdown.

I presume you're a first year? Trust me, it's going to get better. I know we are beating a dead horse again, but you really need to look at both what and how you are studying. Maybe you need to, paradoxically, limit your study time to five hours per day and get some sleep once in a while.

I'd be curious to know what school you are attending and what their first year pass rate is.

 

[daisygirl]

The only thing I can do is attend every hour of lecture (virtually), every damn lab, then review it all at least once, and then try to review it all again once before the test. Then comes the waiting to see if I narrowly passed. When it's this painful, the temptation is to just let it slide for once. That might be the hardest part--there's no break, there's no day off--there's no room for error. None (but you still take time off because it just gets too crazy sometimes). If there was one really bad test, for me, it might not be possible to make it up again for the whole year. Great! Just f*^*& great. Look, the analogy is I already have my pedal to the metal, and this baby is just barely cranking out the mph I need to get up this hill. And it's getting steeper...

Panda's advice is on target. However, to specifically point out some things: do you have to go to class? if class is optional- have you tried reading transcribed notes (if you have a noteservice), syllabi, and using texts as references? Do you have access to old exams so that you may confirm that you really are getting what you're reading?

I barely survived first semester med school. I earned the bare minimum to pass biochem and I completely freaked out by the end of the semester so I didn't even take the anatomy final until summer of first year. It wasn't until second semester that I started PASSING my classes, and by the end of second semester I was able to honor classes. So, it took me a year to learn how to study 😱 . I didn't do well in classes until I stopped going to them- completely. Now, I sit at home and cram as much crap into my head as humanly possible while still spending time with my husband and dogs. Passively sitting in class while having factoids thrown at me just doesn't do it- I don't remember a damn thing that was covered in class. I literally read things like ten times, on my own, in order to retain the stuff.

Good luck and try to hang in there. Patience and perseverence will pay off. Medical school is 99% patience in planting your arse in a chair for long periods of time.

 

[galactica2001]

Originally posted by daisygirl
Panda's advice is on target. However, to specifically point out some things: do you have to go to class? if class is optional- have you tried reading transcribed notes (if you have a noteservice), syllabi, and using texts as references? Do you have access to old exams so that you may confirm that you really are getting what you're reading?

I barely survived first semester med school. I earned the bare minimum to pass biochem and I completely freaked out by the end of the semester so I didn't even take the anatomy final until summer of first year. It wasn't until second semester that I started PASSING my classes, and by the end of second semester I was able to honor classes. So, it took me a year to learn how to study 😱 . I didn't do well in classes until I stopped going to them- completely. Now, I sit at home and cram as much crap into my head as humanly possible while still spending time with my husband and dogs. Passively sitting in class while having factoids thrown at me just doesn't do it- I don't remember a damn thing that was covered in class. I literally read things like ten times, on my own, in order to retain the stuff.

Good luck and try to hang in there. Patience and perseverence will pay off. Medical school is 99% patience in planting your arse in a chair for long periods of time.

😕
I never had such problems at all. I study about 10 h/week during the semester (mostly preps for labs), only before tests I study about 8h/day (that sounds bad doesn't it? But it really isn't because I stay within the course and I manage to put things in perspective much better than if studying little by little)
I noticed that some of my classmates study regularly. That's fine. The funny thing, however, is that they know stuf by heart. They're totally inflexible in thinking. Twist the question a bit and they're totally confused.😕
I think us docs shouldn't be such nerds, but instead have some capabillity of critical thinking and understand stuff more, not just learn by heart (that's such a waste of time...)

G.

 

[daisygirl]

I think us docs shouldn't be such nerds, but instead have some capabillity of critical thinking and understand stuff more, not just learn by heart (that's such a waste of time...)

It's a bit presumptive of you to assume that people who study differently than you are nerds who are able to 'binge and purge' information without acquiring critical thinking skills- maybe you've come across fellow students like this, however, don't assume this applies to people you've had no contact with.

One of the things that has stood out to me in med school is that people have a VARIETY of ways in order to learn the immense volume of information thrown at them. My method works very well for me and it took me quite a bit of time to figure out what works best for me. Not everyone makes a smooth transition into school.

 

[lola]

Originally posted by Panda Bear

Maybe you need to, paradoxically, limit your study time to five hours per day and get some sleep once in a while.

I'd be curious to know what school you are attending and what their first year pass rate is.

i think this is GREAT advice. i never used to follow it in undergrad and managed to get through, but now i'm too old for that ****. i need to be fully awake in class AND fully awake when i study. if i'm tired it takes me at least twice as long to study/retain information. maybe you should try studying 3-4 hrs/day and getting some sleep?? or maybe you have already tried that? i dunno, it seems to help me a lot when i've had enough sleep. it's fine to skimp on sleep the day before an exam or something (at least for me), but most people need at least 6-7hrs of sleep/day to have their brains functioning well.

my original post certainly isn't meant to make it seem like med school is a breeze. i learn soooo much stuff last minute it is not even funny. like if i cut my amount of study time by 4 hours the night before the exam i would probably fail, but those few extra hours give me a big boost over that pass/fail line. do you have old exams you can study? even though this isn't the best way to learn info for the boards, i find that going over those helps me answer at least 1/4 of the questions on the test. so even though i'm not necessarily learning information that is imprtant, it helps me feel less stressed, which is very important to me!

i find it incredibly difficult to retain the large amount of info we're required to know for the exams. for me, this means that studying throughout is not necessarily the best thing. it does help some with long term retention, but even if i study throughout i'm gonna have to last minute cram anyway. so i've started studying a little throughout to make sure i understand everything, and working really hard the few days before the exam. there is no point overdoing it initially and then having to relearn all that stuff again right before the exam. this strategy definitely helps prevent me from burning out.

one more thing.... TAKE A BREAK!!! even if you feel like you can't afford one, it feels sooooo good to take the night off after an exam. besides how much can you possibly learn after an exam when your brain is fried from no sleep and having so much info crammed into it???

 

[ttac]

Originally posted by roady
G-D Damn It F*&^ This Stupid Post!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Some thoughts...

1. Anyone who gets into med school is smart... they are probably at least 95th percentile in intelligence, as compared to the rest of America. Don't lose sight of that (but don't let it get to your head, either)

2. My 2-hour per day studying plan is not enough for AOA. I realize that. I'm close, but I'm going to have to kick it up a few notches in the upcoming months. FYI, for every person I know in med school who studies 2 hours per day, I know 10 people who study 10 hours per day (including class attendance)

3. For those of you who think you're smart, realize that it's all relative. I go to an average medical school... MCATs 29.5-30 or so. If I went to a school with an average MCAT of 35, my current studying techniques would result in me getting my ass handed to me. Big ups to all the med students slugging it out in the trenches at any of the top 5 med schools (or similar). Not to take anything away from my classmates...they are all smart, but it is clear that those med students are facing a level of competition that I am not facing.

4. What you are describing is almost exactly like how it felt to be at MIT. I remember taking quantum chemistry and biophysical chemistry and getting destroyed by geniuses from Turkey who were five times smarter than I would ever be... heck, they were five times smarter than I would ever be even with one lobe of their cerebral cortex tied behind their back. Trust me, I know what it is like... you just gotta keep plugging away.

5. Although this may be a small consolation, realize that the time until third year starts is finite, and rapidly dwindling. I am living in total fear of the first day I hit the floors in surgery. Right now I'm used to not going to school, going mountain biking almost every day, and sleeping in if I feel like it. I honestly don't know where I'm going to find the discipline to get up at 0400 every morning during those rotations. OTOH, med students who are used to working hard will find that the transition isn't that bad. (small consolation, I know)

ttac

 

[scootad.]

I feel so blessed to have gone to a school that transcribed every single word uttered in class. Basically, I hardly ever went to class but read all the transcripts. It saved me so much time and prevented me from burning out as going to class did nothing for me but make me tired and bitter. I honestly dont know if I'd make it through the 1st 2 years if I had to go to class.

 

[ttac]

Originally posted by scootad.
I feel so blessed to have gone to a school that transcribed every single word uttered in class. Basically, I hardly ever went to class but read all the transcripts. It saved me so much time and prevented me from burning out as going to class did nothing for me but make me tired and bitter. I honestly dont know if I'd make it through the 1st 2 years if I had to go to class.

Amen.

 

[dan0909]

Originally posted by Doctor Octopus
I study constantly in secret and then tell everyone I never study to seem cool. Then, after the exam I tell everyone how I'm sure I flunked because it was soooo hard. Then when I get honors, I make sure to brag about it a lot to everyone, even strangers. I AM VERY POPULAR.

HAHA! That was a fantastic post!

 

[ItsGavinC]

You know, I'm not in med school, but rather dental school, but my advice to Roady is this:

Don't stress so much. Above all, realize that the grades you receive say very little about the type of physician you will be, and even less about the type of person you are.

Don't tie your personal worth to the grade you receive on an exam. It's a false notion and simply isn't worth it.

Once I let go of that notion here in dental school, I let a real inner peace into my life. I'm FAR less stressed out then I was earlier in the semester.

Good luck.

 

[Elysium]

Although I won't start school until next year I just wanted to say that I think it's really cool that fellow med students are so supportive and understanding of each other. I think that's really cool.

Don't give up roady. I know this all seems like a hella amount of **** right now but know that everything (eventually) comes to an end. I hope you find your way through this.

Tiffany

 

[8744]

Originally posted by GoodMonkey
just out of curiosity, panda, what specialty are you thinking of going into?

my world is similar to yours, except insert "working" for "family." i keep a part-time job (~15-20hrs/week), at a company where i worked full-time prior to coming to school, so i don't have to pay for my mortgage all out of med school loans. outside obligations force you to be an effective time-manager, that's for sure. 🙂

Man, I feel your pain. One of the Luxuries of first and second year for me was that for the first time since I graduated college I was working only about a forty hour a week.

When I was a Civil Engineer, sixty hour weeks and weekend work were the rule rather then the exception. My last 18 months of work I was taking the medical school prerequisites at my local university on top of working full time.

Maybe this is why peope who work or have worked at "real" jobs adjust better to the rigors of medical school. If you treat it like just another eight to five job then your stress level goes way down.

Again, no disrespect meant to younger people. But in college, as I'm sure you'll agree, you get sort of used to sleeping in, being your own boss, and dragging posterior into class in your own good time. There is no real penalty for being late and nobody really has a full eight hours of class a day anyways. Medical school can be quite a shock if you are not used to being in one place for the whole day.

Third year kind of hit me hard because I had gotten used to living the relatively easy life of first and second year. Even though I never skipped class, I always knew that I could if I wanted to. Besides, eigt o'clock is a civilized time to start the day and I got plenty of sleep.

Now, unfortunantly, 6:30AM rounds are quite common which means that you have to get in at hours like 5:45AM or 4:00AM for some surgical specialties. (It's a bad sign when your's is the only car in the student parking lot.)

And we stay late too on many rotations. And "skipping" is not an option.

I'm hoping to do Emergency Medicine. Still a little early to decide. I really like OB-Gyn.

 

[roady]

Just wanted to throw out a thank you for all the good things people had to say in response to my recent letter-of-utter-frustration.

Not one dumb comment--that's amazing and such a nice surprise.

So here comes another test Monday...feels like pass/fail is going to be determined in the next 55+ hours for me as usual...Well at least I get 1 hour back Sunday, heh.

Anyway, thanks--I'll continue searching for a better way through this, and I'll keep your experiences and ideas in mind.