angry at girls

[Redneck]

Smilemaker100,
I feel for you. I had an old mean stray cat die on me when I was teenager and yup, I balled for that evil little thing. It's understandable since we can love them, but they will still never be able to love us. And yes, this isn't what the thread is about, but I think the thread topic has been covered already.

Bananaface,
Yes, I would agree to the statement that children love falsely too. But because their children and still developing cognitively its okay. Don't get me wrong the little buggers are awesome and do care for people but they don't fully comprehend and to do so willingly, with time they will - adding to the rewards of parenting.

---

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[applicant2002]

I can easily say that a dog's love is false love. A condition of love is free will, to willingly love someone or something. A dog lacks free will. They are conditioned to do what they do and run off of instinct. Real love is based on choice- on devotion. If you stop being a slave to your dog by no longer feeding them, walking them, grooming them, petting them and the other things you listed, would a dog still stay with a person? No. That is not love. They are basic beasts going off their instincts and selfish needs. A human will stay with some one who is terminally ill and take care of them and possibly receive no affection in return but will do so out of their own free will and devotion. That is love. A dog simply completes the business transaction of getting food, water, shelter, and massages, by giving back lower BP, a cute furry animal to stare at, and something to give the impression of love.

.[/B]

So I have no vested interest or deep emotions about the whole issue of a dog's love, but...to play the devil's advocate...
Haven't you heard stories about how faithful dogs can be in very dire circumstances. They can be very loyal and do things analogically similar to humans staying with someone who is terminally ill and receiving no affection in return...I have heard of numerous stories..two quick examples:

from http://www.historic-uk.com/HistoryUK/HistoryofScotland/Greyfriars-Bobby/

"Greyfriars Bobby

John Gray, a gardener, together with his wife Jess and son John, arrived in Edinburgh around 1850. Unable to find work as a gardener he avoided the workhouse by joining the Edinburgh Police Force as a night watchman. To keep him company through the long winter nights John took on a partner, a diminutive Skye Terrier, his 'watchdog' called Bobby. Together John and Bobby became a familiar sight, trudging through the old cobbled streets of Edinburgh. Through thick and thin, winter and summer, they were faithful friends.

The years on the streets appear to have taken their toll on John, as he was treated by the police surgeon for tuberculosis. He eventually died of the disease on the 15th of February 1858 and was buried in Greyfriars Kirkyard. Bobby soon touched the hearts of the local residents when he refused to leave his master's grave, even in the worst weather conditions. The gardener and keeper of Greyfriars tried on many occasions to evict Bobby from the Kirkyard. In the end he gave up and provided a shelter for Bobby by placing sacking beneath two tablestones at the side of John Gray's grave.

Bobby's fame spread throughout Edinburgh. It is reported thst almost on a daily basis the crowds would gather at the entrance of the Kirkyard., waiting for the one o'clock gun that would signal the appearance of Bobby leaving the grave for his midday meal. Bobby would follow William Dow, a local joiner and cabinet maker to the same coffee house that he had frequented with his now dead master, where he was given a meal.In 1867 a new bye-law was passed that required all dogs to be licensed in the city or they would be destroyed. Sir William Chambers (the Lord Provost of Edinburgh) decided to pay Bobby's licence and presented him with a collar with a brass inscription "Greyfriars Bobby from the Lord Provost of Edinburgh 1867 licenced". This can be seen at the Museum of Edinburgh.

The kind folk of Edinburgh took good care of Bobby, but still he remained loyal to his master. For fourteen years the dead man's faithful dog kept constant watch and guard over the grave until his own death in 1872.

Baroness Angelia Georgina Coutts, President of the Ladies Committee of the RSPCA, was so deeply moved by his story that she asked the City Council for permission to erect a granite fountain with a statue of Bobby placed on top.

William Brody sculptered the statue from life, and it was unveiled without ceremony in November 1873, opposite Greyfriars Kirkyard. And it is with that, that Scotland's capital city will always remember its most famous and faithful dog.

Bobby's headstone reads "Greyfriars Bobby - died 14th January 1872 - aged 16 years - Let his loyalty and devotion be a lesson to us all". "

and...since we're somewhat on the topic of anne of green gables, how about the story in rilla of ingleside(one of the sequels) with the story of little dog monday:

"One spring day, when the daffodils were blowing on the Ingleside lawn, and the banks of the brook in Rainbow Valley were sweet with white and purple violets, the little, lazy afternoon accommodation train pulled into the Glen station. It was very seldom that passengers for the Glen came by that train, so nobody was there to meet it except the new station agent and a small black-and-yellow dog, who for four and a half years had met every train that had steamed into Glen St. Mary. Thousands of trains had Dog Monday met and never had the boy he waited and watched for returned. Yet still Dog Monday watched on with eyes that never quite lost hope. Perhaps his dog-heart failed him at times; he was growing old and rheumatic; when he walked back to his kennel after each train had gone his gait was very sober now–he never trotted but went slowly with a drooping head and a depressed tail that had quite lost its old saucy uplift.

One passenger stepped off the train–a tall fellow in a faded lieutenant's uniform, who walked with a barely perceptible limp. He had a bronzed face and there were some grey hairs in the ruddy curls that clustered around his forehead. The new station agent looked at him anxiously. He was used to seeing the khaki-clad figures come off the train, some met by a tumultuous crowd, others, who had sent no word of their coming, stepping off quietly like this one. But there was a certain distinction of bearing and features in this soldier that caught his attention and made him wonder a little more interestedly who he was.

A black-and-yellow streak shot past the station agent. Dog Monday stiff? Dog Monday rheumatic? Dog Monday old? Never believe it. Dog Monday was a young pup, gone clean mad with rejuvenating joy.

He flung himself against the tall soldier, with a bark that choked in his throat from sheer rapture. He flung himself on the ground and writhed in a frenzy of welcome. He tried to climb the soldier's khaki legs and slipped down and groveled in an ecstasy that seemed as if it must tear his little body in pieces. He licked his boots and when the lieutenant had, with laughter on his lips and tears in his eyes, succeeded in gathering the little creature up in his arms Dog Monday laid his head on the khaki shoulder and licked the sunburned neck, making queer sounds between barks and sobs.

The station agent had heard the story of Dog Monday. He knew now who the returned soldier was. Dog Monday's long vigil was ended. Jem Blythe had come home. "

and i'm sure you can find numerous other stories with a more detailed google search.

dogs can be much more loyal and loving than people can be...

 

[Smilemaker100]

So I have no vested interest or deep emotions about the whole issue of a dog's love, but...to play the devil's advocate...
Haven't you heard stories about how faithful dogs can be in very dire circumstances. They can be very loyal and do things analogically similar to humans staying with someone who is terminally ill and receiving no affection in return...I have heard of numerous stories..two quick examples:

from http://www.historic-uk.com/HistoryUK/HistoryofScotland/Greyfriars-Bobby/

"Greyfriars Bobby

John Gray, a gardener, together with his wife Jess and son John, arrived in Edinburgh around 1850. Unable to find work as a gardener he avoided the workhouse by joining the Edinburgh Police Force as a night watchman. To keep him company through the long winter nights John took on a partner, a diminutive Skye Terrier, his 'watchdog' called Bobby. Together John and Bobby became a familiar sight, trudging through the old cobbled streets of Edinburgh. Through thick and thin, winter and summer, they were faithful friends.

The years on the streets appear to have taken their toll on John, as he was treated by the police surgeon for tuberculosis. He eventually died of the disease on the 15th of February 1858 and was buried in Greyfriars Kirkyard. Bobby soon touched the hearts of the local residents when he refused to leave his master's grave, even in the worst weather conditions. The gardener and keeper of Greyfriars tried on many occasions to evict Bobby from the Kirkyard. In the end he gave up and provided a shelter for Bobby by placing sacking beneath two tablestones at the side of John Gray's grave.

Bobby's fame spread throughout Edinburgh. It is reported thst almost on a daily basis the crowds would gather at the entrance of the Kirkyard., waiting for the one o'clock gun that would signal the appearance of Bobby leaving the grave for his midday meal. Bobby would follow William Dow, a local joiner and cabinet maker to the same coffee house that he had frequented with his now dead master, where he was given a meal.In 1867 a new bye-law was passed that required all dogs to be licensed in the city or they would be destroyed. Sir William Chambers (the Lord Provost of Edinburgh) decided to pay Bobby's licence and presented him with a collar with a brass inscription "Greyfriars Bobby from the Lord Provost of Edinburgh 1867 licenced". This can be seen at the Museum of Edinburgh.

The kind folk of Edinburgh took good care of Bobby, but still he remained loyal to his master. For fourteen years the dead man's faithful dog kept constant watch and guard over the grave until his own death in 1872.

Baroness Angelia Georgina Coutts, President of the Ladies Committee of the RSPCA, was so deeply moved by his story that she asked the City Council for permission to erect a granite fountain with a statue of Bobby placed on top.

William Brody sculptered the statue from life, and it was unveiled without ceremony in November 1873, opposite Greyfriars Kirkyard. And it is with that, that Scotland's capital city will always remember its most famous and faithful dog.

Bobby's headstone reads "Greyfriars Bobby - died 14th January 1872 - aged 16 years - Let his loyalty and devotion be a lesson to us all". "

Thanks, for that VERY touching story, applicant 2002. That reminds me of the descriptions of the master-dog relationship which were written by Jack London . I really enjoyed reading "The Call of the Wild" and "White Fang" several times as a young girl. Here is a segment from chapter 6 ,"For The Love of a Man" of London's "The Call of the Wild":

This man had saved his life, which was something; but, further, he was the ideal master. Other men saw to the welfare of their dogs from a sense of duty and business expediency; he saw to the welfare of his as if they were his own children, because he could not help it. And he saw further. He never forgot a kindly greeting or a cheering word, and to sit down for a long talk with them--"gas" he called it--was as much his delight as theirs. He had a way of taking Buck's head roughly between his hands, and resting his own head upon Buck's, of shaking him back and forth, the while calling him ill names that to Buck were love names. Buck knew no greater joy than that rough embrace and the sound of murmured oaths, and at each jerk back and forth it seemed that his heart would be shaken out of his body, so great was its ecstasy. And when, released, he sprang to his feet, his mouth laughing, his eyes eloquent, his throat vibrant with unuttered sound, and in that fashion remained without movement, John Thornton would reverently exclaim, "God! you can all but speak!"

Buck had a trick of love expression that was akin to hurt. He would often seize Thornton's hand in his mouth and close so fiercely that the flesh bore the impress of his teeth for some time afterward. And as Buck understood the oaths to be love words, so the man understood this feigned bite for a caress.

For the most part, however, Buck's love was expressed in adoration. While he went wild with happiness when Thornton touched him or spoke to him, he did not seek these tokens. Unlike Skeet, who was wont to shove her nose under Thornton's hand and nudge and nudge till petted, or Nig, who would stalk up and rest his great head on Thornton's knee, Buck was content to adore at a distance. He would lie by the hour, eager, alert, at Thornton's feet, looking up into his face, dwelling upon it, studying it, following with keenest interest each fleeting expression, every movement or change of feature. Or, as chance might have it, he would lie farther away, to the side or rear, watching the outlines of the man and the occasional movements of his body. And often, such was the communion in which they lived, the strength of Buck's gaze would draw John Thornton's head around, and he would return the gaze, without speech, his heart shining out of his eyes as Buck's heart shone out.

For a long time after his rescue, Buck did not like Thornton to get out of his sight. From the moment he left the tent to when he entered it again, Buck would follow at his heels. His transient masters since he had come into the Northland had bred in him a fear that no master could be permanent. He was afraid that Thornton would pass out of his life as Perrault and Francois and the Scotch half-breed had passed out. Even in the night, in his dreams, he was haunted by this fear. At such times he would shake off sleep and creep through the chill to the flap of the tent, where he would stand and listen to the sound of his master's breathing.

But in spite of this great love he bore John Thornton, which seemed to bespeak the soft civilizing influence, the strain of the primitive, which the Northland had aroused in him, remained alive and active. Faithfulness and devotion, things born of fire and roof, were his; yet he retained his wildness and wiliness. He was a thing of the wild, come in from the wild to sit by John Thornton's fire, rather than a dog of the soft Southland stamped with the marks of generations of civilization. Because of his very great love, he could not steal from this man, but from any other man, in any other camp, he did not hesitate an instant; while the cunning with which he stole enabled him to escape detection.

For more on this book, here is the free online version: http://london.thefreelibrary.com/The-Call-of-the-Wild

 

[bananaface]

I'm glad we didn't start randomly talking about fish.

 

[Redneck]

applicant2002,
You say you have no vested interest? Bah hum bug. You just tore my argument apart. I'll concede that dogs are capable of showing real love and it isn't impossible, but only to the point that it is the exception. Not the norm. I'm still skeptical though.

 

[applicant2002]

applicant2002,
You say you have no vested interest? Bah hum bug. You just tore my argument apart. I'll concede that dogs are capable of showing real love and it isn't impossible, but only to the point that it is the exception. Not the norm. I'm still skeptical though.

Honestly... no vested interest ...hope you have no hard feelings ...i don't really like dogs up close...if i had one it would be a big dog for protection purposes...never had one and always was partial to cats...who i don't really like either now...it was just too good of an opportunity to win an argument ...i always like a good debate

but since we're on the topics of dogs...
i was on the dateline website because i was bored and was going through the stories...dogs may end up one day saving your life by diagnosing cancer:
http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2005/06/23/60minutes/main703845.shtml

and Happy Holidays!

 

[Redneck]

Awesome. A new unit in every hospital. It would be called FLU- four legged Unit. There would be several dogs for patients on an annual screen. They would walk by each of like 8 dogs and if at least one goes crazy you get tested. Assuming the most effecient breed would have been determined, selectively bred, and only use of the best dogs in a litter. Considering these are cheap to care for and purchase and the money they would save it would be incredibly feasible. Heck one mammagram machine costs what a minimum of 100,000? Not to mention the service contracts, film, radiology reports and who knows what else i'm missing. Essentially if these mutts are viable they would be an impressively cheap, easy, fun/enjoyable, medical screen. It would potentially reduce the demand on traditional personnel and machinery - reserving them only for positive dog tests (PDT). Plus hospitals could let the mutts be used to lift the spirits of inpatients when not doing cancer screens. I can see it now. There would even be a need for a FLU tech. Imagine that...

 

[Smilemaker100]

Awesome. A new unit in every hospital. It would be called FLU- four legged Unit. There would be several dogs for patients on an annual screen. They would walk by each of like 8 dogs and if at least one goes crazy you get tested. Assuming the most effecient breed would have been determined, selectively bred, and only use of the best dogs in a litter. Considering these are cheap to care for and purchase and the money they would save it would be incredibly feasible. Heck one mammagram machine costs what a minimum of 100,000? Not to mention the service contracts, film, radiology reports and who knows what else i'm missing. Essentially if these mutts are viable they would be an impressively cheap, easy, fun/enjoyable, medical screen. It would potentially reduce the demand on traditional personnel and machinery - reserving them only for positive dog tests (PDT). Plus hospitals could let the mutts be used to lift the spirits of inpatients when not doing cancer screens. I can see it now. There would even be a need for a FLU tech. Imagine that...

Alright, now the subject of this thread has taken a VERY different tangent, I might as well add my two cents worth too.

Yes, dogs are very useful to humans for various reasons: seeing eye dogs,sniffing out bombs, drugs, sensing the oncome of a seizure in epileptics and according to a recent study I heard about in a newscast: helping diabetics.

"Diabetic Alert Dogs" are particularly useful in those afflicted with Type I Diabetes (Insulin Dependent Diabetes). They can detect hypoglycemia by virtue of the scent of ketones in the breath or hyperglycemia by smelling a "fruity" breath.

"As my background is in medicine/science and I currently work as a regulatory affairs/quality assurance specialist in pharmaceutical and medical device companies, I was skeptical to say the least, but as indicated also desperate. I opted to try this process. I can attest, with objective evidence, that alert dogs trained through the Heaven Scent Paws (HSP) process do work and do alert diabetics of impending low blood sugars."- William Dillenger, a patient

http://www.diabetes123.com/services/maisey.htm

http://www.heavenscentpaws.com/

http://www.allpurposecanines.com/alert.html

 

[myfavred]

Awesome. A new unit in every hospital. It would be called FLU- four legged Unit. There would be several dogs for patients on an annual screen. They would walk by each of like 8 dogs and if at least one goes crazy you get tested. Assuming the most effecient breed would have been determined, selectively bred, and only use of the best dogs in a litter. Considering these are cheap to care for and purchase and the money they would save it would be incredibly feasible. Heck one mammagram machine costs what a minimum of 100,000? Not to mention the service contracts, film, radiology reports and who knows what else i'm missing. Essentially if these mutts are viable they would be an impressively cheap, easy, fun/enjoyable, medical screen. It would potentially reduce the demand on traditional personnel and machinery - reserving them only for positive dog tests (PDT). Plus hospitals could let the mutts be used to lift the spirits of inpatients when not doing cancer screens. I can see it now. There would even be a need for a FLU tech. Imagine that...

I am scared of dogs I will suit the hospital that ever brings a dog close to me.

 

[toofache32]

I am scared of dogs I will suit the hospital that ever brings a dog close to me.

Sue based on what?

And why are you scared of dogs? Bad experience as a child?

 

[Redneck]

Don't worry. They'll be paperwork!! Just like every thing else you'll fill out some forms and on them thre will be some questions regarding the 'personnel' of the FLU. You know simliar to allergy questions, just check the box.

 

[myfavred]

Sue based on what?

And why are you scared of dogs? Bad experience as a child?

based on the fact that they allowed the dog near me that caused me fear and made me suffer. I am just very scared of dogs. I don't know if it was a bad childhood experience (I don't remember it) but I have always been very scared of dogs. Even if I see someone walking with a watchdog, I go around them so I don't have to be close to the dog.

 

[bananaface]

What about teeny tiny dogs or puppies?

 

[tupac_don]

fun\

(i've been hunted, teased, and shot-down by different girls)
\)

That is one funny quote. HAHAHAAHa

 

[tupac_don]

Wow! You've been doing your "homework", goodrain. Very impressive. Were you a psych major at one point in time?

How about if I simplify all the verbiage and tell a_student the following:

-treat women as human beings first, not sex objects
-treat women with the same respect you would accord to other female relatives, unless they give you a good reason not too
-most good looking girls who aren't vain will like being complimented on their charm/personality/intelligence/talents because otherwise if you gush too much about her looks, she will think you are solely interested in her for superficial reasons
and yes, last but not least, the keyword is: LISTEN

Good luck!

Question, why do girls talk and talk and talk ad nauseum about their problems and want you to listen. Why don't they just do what we do, make a decision stick with it and move on. Instead of wasting time on all that uneccessary talking. I'd say 99 percent of time they have their mind made up and they just wanna discuss it and get you to agree with their decision, not really give them opinion on what you think.

 

[Stroganoff]

Crap. I thought I clicked on DC or Lounge or something, and I ended up in this happy-lovey thread.

 

[myfavred]

What about teeny tiny dogs or puppies?

I am scared of them too, even puppies and sometimes its get so embarrassing.

 

[bananaface]

I am scared of them too, even puppies and sometimes its get so embarrassing.

Awww.

 

[funshine]

Once again I say with confidence four leggeds give false love.

I bet you go to shopping malls for the sole purpose of telling little kids santa claus doesn't exit! Dogs may indeed give "false love"--I don't really care to argue over what love really is since IMO there are so many different types and there is never really "pure love"--but what matters is that YOU end up loving them as a member of a family. And yes, they "love" you because they are dependant on you. That's how it goes, even in many human relationships (family, anyone?)

 

[Redneck]

I bet you go to shopping malls for the sole purpose of telling little kids santa claus doesn't exit! Dogs may indeed give "false love"--I don't really care to argue over what love really is since IMO there are so many different types and there is never really "pure love"--but what matters is that YOU end up loving them as a member of a family. And yes, they "love" you because they are dependant on you. That's how it goes, even in many human relationships (family, anyone?)

Did you even read the rest of my posts on this topic before responding???

 

[Smilemaker100]

I bet you go to shopping malls for the sole purpose of telling little kids santa claus doesn't exit! Dogs may indeed give "false love"--I don't really care to argue over what love really is since IMO there are so many different types and there is never really "pure love"--but what matters is that YOU end up loving them as a member of a family. And yes, they "love" you because they are dependant on you. That's how it goes, even in many human relationships (family, anyone?)

Yes, I suppose I could agree that dogs love you because they are dependant on you. I think the same can be said about babies and children- they are just like dogs ! They love you because they depend on you for shelter, food and emotional needs.

 

[CircleTheDrain]

Question, why do girls talk and talk and talk ad nauseum about their problems and want you to listen. Why don't they just do what we do, make a decision stick with it and move on. Instead of wasting time on all that uneccessary talking. I'd say 99 percent of time they have their mind made up and they just wanna discuss it and get you to agree with their decision, not really give them opinion on what you think.

Answer Guys talk about a problem to try and find a solution and then forget about it! Girls talk about a problem to resolve how they feel about it and will continue to talk about it until they have resolved how the feel.

 

[toofache32]

My dog can lick himself in some impressive places. I sometimes wish I could do that....but I'm scared he might bite me.

 

[Redneck]

My dog can lick himself in some impressive places. I sometimes wish I could do that....but I'm scared he might bite me.

That's bad!