Another moonlighting thread

[Sea_Bass]

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[Crayola227]

I am a PGY-1 carib grad at a program that is moonlighting friendly.

I want to moonlight as much as possible 3rd year and possibly even a bit in my 2nd year. According to the following table, I live in a state that allows a US grad "initial licensure" after 1 year, but an IMG needs 3 years:

https://www.fsmb.org/licensure/usmle-step-3/state_specific

What does this mean in regards to moonlighting? Does it mean I can't moonlight until I'm done with PGY-3? Or does this chart not apply to my situation?

I have asked my senior residents and program coordinator about this, but no one seems to be able to give me a straight answer since I'm currently the only IMG in the program. I've been told that if I can find moonlighting opportunities on my own, my PD will sign off on it. First I guess I gotta figure out if it's even possible for an IMG like me.

um, can you just contact your state licensing board? I have a feeling the might have some idea about what you're allowed to do in the practicing of medicine with your license in their state, since you know, that's a thing they do

EDIT: sorry, making a joke at your expense, but really, just wanna help. They will know better than us, and it's safer to be sure you're following the med board's rules than anything we might say

 

[Sea_Bass]

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[Crayola227]

um, yeah, cause large bureaucratic state agencies are always so willing take your questions, and the random people who answer the phone are just full of accurate information.

sorry to make a joke at your expense, but I think a simple question like this could easily be answered on this forum. Surely there's SOMEONE out there who is an IMG that's moonlighted (moonlit?) and can answer this question.

you yourself note that it varies state to state, yet have not told us what state that is

also, did you use the SDN search function? given how long these sorts of restrictions have been around I'm surprised if it hasn't already come up, unless of course the answer is we can't answer

to be fair, my medical board is very responsive. Was just checking to see if you had already attempted contacting yours. If I were you and thought an answer would take a while I would call/email now. I also wouldn't feel comfortable moonlighting without the go ahead of my state licensing board, no matter what advice I got here.

 

[the argus]

The only way you can moonlight without a license is "internal" moonlighting. Many hospitals have opportunities in-house for residents which do not require a license as you are doing it at your training facility and technically under the auspices of your residency program.

If you are looking at outside, traditional per diem moonlighting gigs, then you must be licensed. Unfortunately if you're in a state that requires 2 or 3 years of residency for IMGs to get a license, as many do now, you are out of luck.

 

[AdmiralChz]

The only way you can moonlight without a license is "internal" moonlighting. Many hospitals have opportunities in-house for residents which do not require a license as you are doing it at your training facility and technically under the auspices of your residency program.

If you are looking at outside, traditional per diem moonlighting gigs, then you must be licensed. Unfortunately if you're in a state that requires 2 or 3 years of residency for IMGs to get a license, as many do now, you are out of luck.

Agree with this. But if you really want to moonlight externally you will need to review your own residency policies and procedures - several (including my own) strictly prohibit external moonlighting. I am allowed to moonlight internally through other departments (CCM, ER) if they are willing to have me, but I still have to get approval from my program director. Much of this has to do with making sure you aren't going over duty hours, and moonlighting is absolutely factored in.

 

[hamstergang]

um, yeah, cause large bureaucratic state agencies are always so willing take your questions, and the random people who answer the phone are just full of accurate information.

When I called they were helpful and friendly. Have you even tried? After all, what we say doesn't actually matter, it's what the state says that counts.

 

[gutonc]

If your program/institution requires that you have a full, unrestricted license in order to moonlight internally, then no, you can't moonlight until you finish PGY3 and get such a license. This is equally true for external moonlighting.

Some programs allow internal moonlighting with only a training/limited license. This is a question that your PD or GME office should easily be able to answer.

 

[nlax30]

um, yeah, cause large bureaucratic state agencies are always so willing take your questions, and the random people who answer the phone are just full of accurate information.

They are still the governing and licensing body for your profession so I would hope they would be helpful to some extent. Have you even contacted them yet or checked their website for this information?

Like others have said it will depend on the state and if you are able to get a full license after 1 year.

 

[rokshana]

I am a PGY-1 carib grad at a program that is moonlighting friendly.

I want to moonlight as much as possible 3rd year and possibly even a bit in my 2nd year. According to the following table, I live in a state that allows a US grad "initial licensure" after 1 year, but an IMG needs 3 years:

https://www.fsmb.org/licensure/usmle-step-3/state_specific

What does this mean in regards to moonlighting? Does it mean I can't moonlight until I'm done with PGY-3? Or does this chart not apply to my situation?

I have asked my senior residents and program coordinator about this, but no one seems to be able to give me a straight answer since I'm currently the only IMG in the program. I've been told that if I can find moonlighting opportunities on my own, my PD will sign off on it. First I guess I gotta figure out if it's even possible for an IMG like me.

no, you cannot do any external moonlighting...since you will need a full unrestricted license to do so...the chart does apply...

that being said, you can do internal moonlighting if your program has that in place (usually means doing a resident's job when say there isn't a resident available to do the job)...or if you live near a state that does allow an IMG to get a full license in the 2nd or 3rd year, then you can do moonlighting in that state...

 

[rokshana]

you yourself note that it varies state to state, yet have not told us what state that is

also, did you use the SDN search function? given how long these sorts of restrictions have been around I'm surprised if it hasn't already come up, unless of course the answer is we can't answer

to be fair, my medical board is very responsive. Was just checking to see if you had already attempted contacting yours. If I were you and thought an answer would take a while I would call/email now. I also wouldn't feel comfortable moonlighting without the go ahead of my state licensing board, no matter what advice I got here.

really? you have found the Mass Medical Board to be responsive?? you either have not really had a huge need with the board (like say, applying for a full license), or are the LUCKIEST person EVER.

 

[Crayola227]

really? you have found the Mass Medical Board to be responsive?? you either have not really had a huge need with the board (like say, applying for a full license), or are the LUCKIEST person EVER.

Uh, you mean Mass as in location or just an adjective?

Yeah, really, not gonna give out location, but they answered my email that had inane questions within 48 hours. It was even semi helpful.

And as for calling them and getting a human, and whatever voicemails back and forth for the most routine of things, it was like probably resolved in a week on a separate occasion.

I was as shocked as you are!

The point being for anyone reading this, when in doubt, even if they're a PITA, you should always check with your board, and at least get the ball rolling, you don't want to be asked why you didn't come to them sooner, because your answer "you're slow and you suck" is not going to cut glass with them.
DON'T EVER **** WITH THE LICENSING BOARD.
I don't care how long you have to be on hold on the phone or how unhelpful they are, you need to appear proactive in communicating with them.
Don't avoid them because they're a PITA.
"They can always hurt you more."

 

[rokshana]

Uh, you mean Mass as in location or just an adjective?

Yeah, really, not gonna give out location, but they answered my email that had inane questions within 48 hours. It was even semi helpful.

And as for calling them and getting a human, and whatever voicemails back and forth for the most routine of things, it was like probably resolved in a week on a separate occasion.

I was as shocked as you are!

The point being for anyone reading this, when in doubt, even if they're a PITA, you should always check with your board, and at least get the ball rolling, you don't want to be asked why you didn't come to them sooner, because your answer "you're slow and you suck" is not going to cut glass with them.
DON'T EVER **** WITH THE LICENSING BOARD.
I don't care how long you have to be on hold on the phone or how unhelpful they are, you need to appear proactive in communicating with them.
Don't avoid them because they're a PITA.
"They can always hurt you more."

you have already posted where your location is...

 

[Crayola227]

you have already posted where your location is...

when? where? well, you got it wrong is all I can say. can you answer this question for me by PM and not in this thread?