Are Accelerated PharmDs really Accelerated?

[Hapworth]

Hello all,

Newbie here, although I've done a lot of research on pharmacy already. I've also thoroughly read the FAQ, which was really useful. Still, there are so many PharmD programs with so many variations (some want folks straight out of high school, some prefer in-staters, some programs are accelerated, some are not, some want applicants to hold a bachelor's, some just care that you've done pre-requisites, etc.) that I've become a bit confused and have a dumb question. Okay, so there are accelerated three-year programs, but are they really accelerated? I ask because--unless I'm misreading--programs like West Virginia University's PharmD (I live in SE Ohio right next door) show a four-year curriculum: two years of pre-coursework and two years of pharmacy coursework. I've seen similar schedules at other programs (Connecticut, I think).

I guess I'm confused on how many years are involved. 0-6 programs take six years (from the moment a high school student enrolls to the time she finishes the PharmD program), but why would one enter a 0-6 program if some schools show a four-year curriculum?

Maybe someone can steer me through the confusion. Like many, I'm a BA holder (and MA holder) who thinks he missed the wrong calling in life. I studied--get this--literature, so I'd need to focus on pre-requisite courses and then pharmacy coursework. I'm not looking to cut corners. I just want to know what I'm facing. Two years (or more, depending on when classes are offered) of pre-req work and two years of pharmacy work seems reasonable. If I'm looking at a six-year timeline, well, that would certainly influence my decision.

Thanks in advance,

Hapworth 16, 1924

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[lgooden]

For 0-6 year programs the first 2 years are generally for the prerequisites and the 3rd year is the beginning of the "professional" years. If you have not taken any of the prerequisites, it will take at least 5 years if you go to an accelerated 3 yr program and 6 years for a four year program to obtain a pharmd. If a site only shows 2 years of prereqs and 2 years of pharmacy work, it is because the 2 yrs of pharm work are year around and the last year is always for rotations. So this would still be a 5 year program.

 

[ultracet]

the 0-6 year programs are not accelerated. the 3 year pharm D schools are. i would recommend taking your prereqs and then applying to pharmacy school (either a 3 or 4 year program)

 

[skp]

the 0-6 year programs are not accelerated. the 3 year pharm D schools are. i would recommend taking your prereqs and then applying to pharmacy school (either a 3 or 4 year program)

with much respect for bbmuffin , i wish i would have done a 0-6 program...it has been quite a headache being my own advisor, trying to get all my pre-pharm prereq's done (had to go to 2 diff. schools), and having no guarantee of admission [insert more whining here]. some 0-6 schools will guarentee your spot if you maintain a certain gpa - which is quite low (3.0ish depending on school) compared to what you need to transfer after your pre-pharm (3.5ish avg.).

with regard to the op -
5 years is worth it, but imo so is 6.
also, in-state is a big deal at many public institutions. these may provide your best chance of getting in.
just keep the questions coming - we can help you out.
aacp.org has a list of pharmacy schools - what about OSU?

-skp

 

[jdpharmd?]

H I ask because--unless I'm misreading--programs like West Virginia University's PharmD (I live in SE Ohio right next door) show a four-year curriculum: two years of pre-coursework and two years of pharmacy coursework. I've seen similar schedules at other programs (Connecticut, I think).

From a quick glance at their website, it looks like WVU is a true 4-year school of pharmacy. I.E. you would need 2 years of pre-reqs (chem/bio/math/stats/etc), and then 4 years of pharmacy school (=6 total). You might be able to skip a few pre-reqs since you already have an undergrad degree, but chances are you're looking at 5-6 additional years of school, minimum.

 

[afablej]

Pittsburgh sent me a letter a few months ago on a brand new pharmD. accelerated program that is a "Weekend Program" for 20 students only...it's 3 years i think but only on the weekends obviously...and i think Florida has some kind of online program maybe you might want to look into that.....just wanted to let you know since you already have a degree and might be working already

Hello all,

Newbie here, although I've done a lot of research on pharmacy already. I've also thoroughly read the FAQ, which was really useful. Still, there are so many PharmD programs with so many variations (some want folks straight out of high school, some prefer in-staters, some programs are accelerated, some are not, some want applicants to hold a bachelor's, some just care that you've done pre-requisites, etc.) that I've become a bit confused and have a dumb question. Okay, so there are accelerated three-year programs, but are they really accelerated? I ask because--unless I'm misreading--programs like West Virginia University's PharmD (I live in SE Ohio right next door) show a four-year curriculum: two years of pre-coursework and two years of pharmacy coursework. I've seen similar schedules at other programs (Connecticut, I think).

I guess I'm confused on how many years are involved. 0-6 programs take six years (from the moment a high school student enrolls to the time she finishes the PharmD program), but why would one enter a 0-6 program if some schools show a four-year curriculum?

Maybe someone can steer me through the confusion. Like many, I'm a BA holder (and MA holder) who thinks he missed the wrong calling in life. I studied--get this--literature, so I'd need to focus on pre-requisite courses and then pharmacy coursework. I'm not looking to cut corners. I just want to know what I'm facing. Two years (or more, depending on when classes are offered) of pre-req work and two years of pharmacy work seems reasonable. If I'm looking at a six-year timeline, well, that would certainly influence my decision.

Thanks in advance,

Hapworth 16, 1924

 

[jdpharmd?]

Pittsburgh sent me a letter a few months ago on a brand new pharmD. accelerated program that is a "Weekend Program" for 20 students only...it's 3 years i think but only on the weekends obviously...and i think Florida has some kind of online program maybe you might want to look into that.....just wanted to let you know since you already have a degree and might be working already

This sounds IMPOSSIBLE. First, it's condensed into 3 years, which pretty much means zero time off even with a full time program (no summers off, no long christmas breaks, and sometimes no time off for christmas at all, speaking from experience).

Second, it's "weekend only?!" I would guess that we're in class (or rotations) for maybe 220 days/year x 3 years = 660 days over 3 years. Soooo, that's like 7 years of weekends-only?

When is the profession going to learn that we can't accomodate every pansy's schedule who "sort-of" wants to be a pharmacist, but doesn't have the dedication or, to be frank, skills to become one.

Oh, you don't want to take exams? Ok, no exams... Oh, you don't want to come to class? Ok, class is online-only. Oh, you can't drive 30 minutes to campus? We'll build one for you in your home town. (How many states need 5+ pharmacy schools?!)

We're killing our own profession by letting these shady programs slip by. Soon it will just be like those correspondence schools that offered degrees in "gunsmithing, auto repair, legal assistant, etc... or get your GED.. or, NEW, Doctor of Pharmacy"

Truly an embarrassment to those who earned their degrees.

 

[kwakster928]

in my humble opinion all these online degrees and weekend program is disgrace to the our professional education. these schools make the whole school feel like online MBA program. come on! what's wrong people in ACPE accrediting this? obviously they dont know a thing about it. i am starting to get really pissed off.

 

[TCB]

kwakster928: I believe that those programs are also for licensed pharmacists who would like to get a PharmD to further their educations and get into different arena of pharmacy.

 

[off2skl]

Perhaps the weekend only program is for Bs Pharms to obtain their PharmD???

 

[Hapworth]

From a quick glance at their website, it looks like WVU is a true 4-year school of pharmacy. I.E. you would need 2 years of pre-reqs (chem/bio/math/stats/etc), and then 4 years of pharmacy school (=6 total). You might be able to skip a few pre-reqs since you already have an undergrad degree, but chances are you're looking at 5-6 additional years of school, minimum.

Yeah, I think you're right. I'm embarrassed I didn't catch this. When I saw the four-year breakdown, I thought the department was outlining the entire route one should folow. When I looked closer, though, I realized that only the four-year PharmD curriculum was being outlined. Doh!

Hapworth 16, 1924

 

[jdpharmd?]

Perhaps the weekend only program is for Bs Pharms to obtain their PharmD???

Doesn't look like it according to their website. It's the "full ticket" PharmD.

 

[ultracet]

i liked being my own advisor and dictating what i was going to be doing and when i was going to be doing it... i'm a control freak and thought i was smarter than my advisors....

just to let you in on my personality and why i did 2 +4 instead of 6

 

[afablej]

here's the website:

http://www.pharmacy.duq.edu/weekendprg.html

i agree i was surprised when i heard it was only on the weekends, even though it's year-round...but my family friend that liked the idea is quite the overachiever, and he has accomplished some crazy things ... perhaps its a program for those kinds of ppl, really good at information management, already in a good career point, and just want to utilize a pharmacy degree to help them in a career they are in right now instead of being a straight-up pharmacist. Like,...a lawyer at a pharmaceutical company who wants to learn about pharmacy itself to help him really understand the company, its trademarks, etc...or a person who has a nursing degree and is a pharmaceutical sales representative and wants to learn even more to help her in her career. I'm just saying hypothethically ...even though i know people in these careers, i don't really know their exact aspirations..but i'm sure there are people like them and stuff.. the 20 people that will be enrolled in the program may not be the everyday average Joe who wants to get a quick degree that will change his or her life. haha i hope that made some sense..?

Doesn't look like it according to their website. It's the "full ticket" PharmD.

 

[ultracet]

here's the website:

http://www.pharmacy.duq.edu/weekendprg.html

i agree i was surprised when i heard it was only on the weekends, even though it's year-round...but my family friend that liked the idea is quite the overachiever, and he has accomplished some crazy things ... perhaps its a program for those kinds of ppl, really good at information management, already in a good career point, and just want to utilize a pharmacy degree to help them in a career they are in right now instead of being a straight-up pharmacist. Like,...a lawyer at a pharmaceutical company who wants to learn about pharmacy itself to help him really understand the company, its trademarks, etc...or a person who has a nursing degree and is a pharmaceutical sales representative and wants to learn even more to help her in her career. I'm just saying hypothethically ...even though i know people in these careers, i don't really know their exact aspirations..but i'm sure there are people like them and stuff.. the 20 people that will be enrolled in the program may not be the everyday average Joe who wants to get a quick degree that will change his or her life. haha i hope that made some sense..?

is this thing accredited??

talk about degrading the profession...

we already have enough trouble convincing other health care providers that we have adequate schooling to be doing clinical interventions.....

i can already hear it "pharmacy is just like a MBA you can do one of those on the weekends while working a REAL job"

 

[Roxicet]

is this thing accredited??

It looks like it's part of Duquesne University, which has been around since the late 1800s; it is accredited......and it also looks like it is a post-bacc pharmD program. You must have a bachelor's degree, but not necessarily a bachelor's in pharmacy?

http://www.pharmacy.duq.edu/pdfs/weekend_prg/cirriculum.pdf
http://www.pharmacy.duq.edu/pdfs/weekend_prg/key_points.pdf
http://www.pharmacy.duq.edu/pdfs/weekend_prg/intro.pdf

 

[dgroulx]

It looks like it's part of Duquesne University, which has been around since the late 1800s; it is accredited......and it also looks like it is a post-bacc pharmD program. You must have a bachelor's degree, but not necessarily a bachelor's in pharmacy?

http://www.pharmacy.duq.edu/pdfs/weekend_prg/cirriculum.pdf
http://www.pharmacy.duq.edu/pdfs/weekend_prg/key_points.pdf
http://www.pharmacy.duq.edu/pdfs/weekend_prg/intro.pdf

I looked at the cirriculum and there seems to be a lot of stuff missing. I'd love only 1 semester of med chem instead of 4. Is pharmacology included in their therapeutics classes? Where are the other disease states? I didn't see any pathophysiology either. I had 2 semesters of A&P as a prerequisite, so I could understand the 2 semesters of pathophysiology in pharm school. Does Duquesne expect you to learn that on your own?

 

[WVURxGal]

ask because--unless I'm misreading--programs like West Virginia University's PharmD (I live in SE Ohio right next door) show a four-year curriculum: two years of pre-coursework and two years of pharmacy coursework. I've seen similar schedules at other programs (Connecticut, I think).

Like everyone else said, 4 year means 4 years in the *program*, plus all the pre-reqs (which take about 2 years for WVU, about 16-17 credits/semester)

But the real reason I'm replying is because you mentioned WVU Are you in the Belpre/Parkersburg area? If you do your prereqs at WVU-P, it's just as good as doing them at WVU as far as in-state consideration goes. WVU prefers to take in-state students, but they consider out-of-state students that study in-state with the same weight. Also, WVU-P is a much better school than WVU from what I understand. My boyfriend had an organic chemistry class with 11 people in it! On main campus, mine was at least 150, probably more.

Oh, as a comment on the Pitt thing... I also got that postcard a while ago, but I didn't really read it. I saw that it was a weekend program that was starting this August... but then I saw "Pitt" and said "eeeeeew" and threw it out (sorry Pitt people... you know how it is. I've got nothing against you individually, but I will light your couch on fire after a game if need be )

 

[Hapworth]

But the real reason I'm replying is because you mentioned WVU Are you in the Belpre/Parkersburg area?

Nope, I'm in Athens, Ohio...and even that's not completely true right now because I'm abroad in Spain for a year. I've been to Parkersburg often, though. I like Allegheny books! I've also been to Morganstown a couple times. I'm that rare type who enjoys Appalachia (I'm originally from Chicago).

Hapworth 16, 1924

 

[chloejane]

St. Louis College of Pharmacy accepts student directly from highschool. the first two years are basically their pre-reqs. then they begin their 'real' pharmacy course work. they are a 6 year program (last I looked) but if you dont' have a bachelors in science, this might not be a bad route. best of luck!!

 

[WVURxGal]

Nope, I'm in Athens, Ohio...and even that's not completely true right now because I'm abroad in Spain for a year. I've been to Parkersburg often, though. I like Allegheny books! I've also been to Morganstown a couple times. I'm that rare type who enjoys Appalachia (I'm originally from Chicago).

Isn't that the best book store ever? LOL, except I'm afraid of heights, and those old stairs give me the creeps sometimes. Still, you could get lost in that place for hours.

I too am the rare type that enjoys Appalachia; I'm originally from Philadelphia. I plan on living in Parkersburg as long as the job market there is good (my boyfriend already knows he wants to work at Camden Clark MH, and I'm hoping I can find a job at St. Joe's or a hospital across the river, I think Marietta has a decent sized hospital...)

Oh, I totally envy your studying abroad in Spain. I was a Spanish minor until I found out that at WVU professional majors can't have minors. What area are you in?

 

[Delphi80]

For all these Pharmacy students that are disgraced by Duquesne's program, maybe they should try reading the simple website before running their mouth. First off, Duquesne has the first post-bac program in the nation. And in my opinion, since you have all sounded off enough, that is where the profession should be headed. 23 year olds know nothing about life to be already dispensing medication and advice in pharmacies. Especially since they have done nothing but take pharmacy classes...Even physical therapists need an undergrad degree and pharmacy should not be excluded! That being said it has to be a science degree including A&P I and II and Biochemistry I&II with labs. The weekend thing was done to attract a different type of student NEVER encouraging that you should have a full time job and go to school part time. They reinforce the fact that during the week you need to be going over what was done in class from 8-6 twice a week and that it will be harder this way. The program is accredited as well. So I would relax and worry about your own careers...and everyone I tell thinks I am even more dedicated for giving up my weekends for the next TWO years (3rd year is rotations during the week) to the profession of Pharmacy.

 

[BiOGoly]

I agree with the consensus...this is an embarrasment. Can anyone even conceive of an MD or DO program that would operate this way? The board at ACPE must be on the 'ludes. Heck, I've never even heard of an online/weekend Chiro program!

I've got news for ya, most people entering PharmD programs today already HAVE a BS degree (I have two), so the idea of a "postbacc" pharmacy program is a little redundant. A program that condenses a 4 year professional education into three years should be intense enough, but to make it a weekend class is laughable. Even "night" law school meets throughout the week...

 

[Delphi80]

Thats's not news to me. Hence my belief it should be mandatory! And obviously the board would not be accrediting the school if didn't pass the standards.

You guys sound like really open people to me..the idea that you will be non-judgemental pharmacists is laughable to me.

 

[Glycerin]

For all these Pharmacy students that are disgraced by Duquesne's program, maybe they should try reading the simple website before running their mouth.

It's easy to say this when you dig up a thread that's over a year old. If this had been a current discussion, then I could see how you'd be upset.

 

[Delphi80]

Last time I started a new thread on something that had already been discussed I was told to search first. Now I search and I get told the thread is too old. Can't win on this thing can you? Oh well, it's been nice to read everyone's stories during the pre-pharm phase...I'm out...

Best of luck to y'all!

 

[Glycerin]

Last time I started a new thread on something that had already been discussed I was told to search first. Now I search and I get told the thread is too old. Can't win on this thing can you? Oh well, it's been nice to read everyone's stories during the pre-pharm phase...I'm out...

Best of luck to y'all!

I never said the thread was too old. What it appeared like to me is you were scolding people's opinions on a year-old topic as if the topic was currently being addressed. I wouldn't have thought this if your post had been simply an update or your thoughts on the accelerated program at Duquesne as a way to reintroduce the topic and get newer opinions. It just seemed that right away it was an attack on old opinions. Hope this clarifies things.

 

[Caverject]

For all these Pharmacy students that are disgraced by Duquesne's program, maybe they should try reading the simple website before running their mouth.

Are you insinuating everyone that has responded negatively is ******ed? The links to the "simple website" have been posted

First off, Duquesne has the first post-bac program in the nation. And in my opinion, since you have all sounded off enough, that is where the profession should be headed.

Duquesne is not the first post-bac program in the nation. However, they are the first ones to offer a PharmD degree on a weekend basis without any previous pharmacy experience. It sounds to me that you feel the profession of pharmacy should be headed into schools like ITT Tech or the University of Pheonix. The thought of it just makes me want to laugh my ass off.

23 year olds know nothing about life to be already dispensing medication and advice in pharmacies. Especially since they have done nothing but take pharmacy classes...Even physical therapists need an undergrad degree and pharmacy should not be excluded! That being said it has to be a science degree including A&P I and II and Biochemistry I&II with labs.

You're assuming. Many students work or have worked in the past in some sort of pharmacy. I've been working in pharmacy now for 8 years as a technician and an intern. I'm pretty sure I know how a pharmacy works by now.

I don't disagree with your point of making a BA required and I doubt most here would. (and for the record, I do not hold a BA or an MA)

The weekend thing was done to attract a different type of student NEVER encouraging that you should have a full time job and go to school part time. They reinforce the fact that during the week you need to be going over what was done in class from 8-6 twice a week and that it will be harder this way.

Yeah, it attracts a different type of student for sure. However, like everyone else here, I think the program format is a disgrace to the profession. As Dana mentioned earlier you are also missing quite a bit in your education that you would get else where. I can't even begin to imagine trying to earn an MD going to a school like this.

The program is accredited as well.

ACPE is keeping a close eye on Duq's program due to issues. What those issues, I have no idea but one can assume....

So I would relax and worry about your own careers...and everyone I tell thinks I am even more dedicated for giving up my weekends for the next TWO years (3rd year is rotations during the week) to the profession of Pharmacy.

So you only care about the opinions of those that agree with you since EVERYONE thinks your more dedicated for giving up weekends for 2 years, which is laughable in its own right. Would you like a cookie or something? Are you trying to prove how much more dedicated you are by doing the weekend program? It all comes down to how bad you want it. It seems to me that its more of a convenience for you than something you really want to do.

 

[Aznfarmerboi]

I agree with everybody, this program is a disgrace to the profession of pharmacy. Does anyone know what are the criteras for a program to be accredited?

 

[PharmD0412]

Does anyone know a good 3 year pharmacy program that does not require the PCAT?

 

[GrapePropel]

Does anyone know a good 3 year pharmacy program that does not require the PCAT?

LECOM. Also is the cheapest 3 year.