Argosy Updates

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DynamicDidactic

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I've been asking around and keep hearing bad stuff.
  • Apparently, students still haven't received their funds. No one knows where the money is and no sign of getting the money.
  • Mass exodus of faculty
  • Concerns that teach-outs will not be possible
  • Serious stress for students, food drives being put together
I remember when the Forest Institute in Springfield, MO closed down. There was no word of any such problems.

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The one here had been constantly trying to recruit faculty, particularly in neuropsych in the past two years. They pretty much spammed recruiting boards and such. They've been silent these past several months.
 
I went to an Argosy from 2008-2013. The faculty turnover rate was nuts. In general though, it seemed that poor instructors were being replaced with more competent instructors so I didn't really mind.
 
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Checking indeed and glassdoor reviews. There appears to have been mass layoffs since Semptember. Admissions and back end people as well as some faculty.
 
It is a truly spectacular sign when the individual overseeing receivership refers to the institution as "the titanic"....multiple times. To students.

Per the article, it seems there just isn't the cash flow to keep it afloat. Due to receivership, they are now required to front the loan money to students and receive reimbursement from the federal government. They clearly do not have the cash to do so. I am not sure there is an out in this situation barring a bailout from someone.

Where is Argosy University students' money? Nobody seems to have a clear answer
 
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It is a truly spectacular sign when the individual overseeing receivership refers to the institution as "the titanic"....multiple times. To students.

Per the article, it seems there just isn't the cash flow to keep it afloat. Due to receivership, they are now required to front the loan money to students and receive reimbursement from the federal government. They clearly do not have the cash to do so. I am not sure there is an out in this situation barring a bailout from someone.

Where is Argosy University students' money? Nobody seems to have a clear answer

NO NO NO.

The article says The Department of Education sent around $13.5 MM in January to Argosy. The DOE says it became aware that Argosy hadn't dispersed the money to student at the end of January and instructed Argosy to immediately disperse the money.

Argosy is saying the money never got there. Or that it was immediately used to pay payroll and vendors and is gone. Or....


I'm inclined to believe that the DOE knows when and where they sent the money.
 
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OMG. Sen. Dick Durbin literally called company that formerly owned Argosy a , " ...predatory for profit company..." in his letter to the DOE!!!!!!!!!!!!
 
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Looks like we're finally calling it like we see it. Wonder when Devos will come in and defend the company

She's been interfacing with her brother, who is trying to get a contract for border security.

(seriously)
 
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That family's corruption is no surprise to me. Growing up in Michigan, we saw it for decades.
Did you listen to the podcast The Dream? I’m not from Michigan, so it was extremely informative
 
I doubt this will happen, but IF the whole thing gets closed down and students are hung out to dry (100k+ in loans, no institution left to grant them a degree and stuck trying to start over elsewhere) I would seriously hope APA takes note.

Yes, APA accreditation is not about accounting (and shouldn't be). However, the fact that these campuses still have APA's seal of approval while this is going on is shameful. We have a bankrupt organization that appears to be <literally> stealing rent money from its students...and our major professional organization has not taken action. I'm not on all the various listservs...but has this even been acknowledged or discussed by APA leadership? I haven't heard a peep.
 
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An Argosy student who also trains at our institution was being evicted due to the lack of funds (because they were withheld by Argosy). Thankfully, supervisors here have found a very practical way to support the student, but this is definitely a terrible situation for all involved. Every day that APA fails to formally reprimand them and demand accountability from its accredited programs is another day I'm not a member.
 
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I doubt this will happen, but IF the whole thing gets closed down and students are hung out to dry (100k+ in loans, no institution left to grant them a degree and stuck trying to start over elsewhere) I would seriously hope APA takes note.

Yes, APA accreditation is not about accounting (and shouldn't be). However, the fact that these campuses still have APA's seal of approval while this is going on is shameful. We have a bankrupt organization that appears to be <literally> stealing rent money from its students...and our major professional organization has not taken action. I'm not on all the various listservs...but has this even been acknowledged or discussed by APA leadership? I haven't heard a peep.
This is yet another reason why we repeat again and again here that APA Accreditation is not sufficient for making determinations on training. But you're right - this should be worthy of big discussion at APA and within the listservs. I haven't seen that, however.
 
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With the new owner of Argosy University under Federal Receivership and all of the student lawsuits and State AG lawsuits resulting in millions of dollars of settlements and loan forgiveness, my guess is Argosy will close. Seems that when this happened at Forest Institute several years back many former students and alumni were in shock when the school was closing. Forest was a non-profit entity so they probably had some protections due to non-profit status. EDMC the former owner of Argosy was a for profit entity and Goldman Sachs owned 41 percent of EDMC. The Dream Center that bought Argosy University last year is a non-profit Christian-Based agency so they may have some protections that EDMC did not have.

As a Argosy Alumni graduating in 2013, all of the negative publicity seems to appear as if all of Argosy graduates are profiled as somehow not capable or having inept training resulting in a negative confirmation bias towards Argosy graduates. Although I completed a ASPPB-NR approved program, APA accredited internship, passed the EPPP, completed a two-year postdoctoral neuropsychology fellowship, approved for Candidacy Status or Board Eligible by ABPP CN, Approved for Registration as a Health Services Psychologist, and I am licensed as a Psychologists in eight states, and have worked as a licensed psychologist for five-years, when I am asked about where I graduated from due to past negative interaction, I now refrain from telling people due to rejection I get. After six-years since graduation, my income is now in the six figures, but when I apply for openings in Medical Centers, Universities, or other higher status facilities, it is only my guess that my application is put on the bottom of the list.

It seems that the problems with Argosy was the administrators and they should be blamed for developing a system where they were greedy and sought out student loan money to bankroll Goldman Sachs and investors. The Federal Government should be held responsible for allowing Billions to Trillions of dollars of Tax payers money to be used for student loans. The students at Argosy should not be held responsible for wanting to advance their education and professional opportunities, but it appears we are being held responsible. We had to take out loans unless we were wealthy to pay $1000 or more per hour tuition over a five to eight-year time line. Loan servicing companies such as Sallie Mae or Navient should bear some responsibility as they are making Billions off of student loan interest. With interest rates, 200,000 in student loans can double in a five to six-year period to the point most have to go into Default resulting in collection, garnishment of wages, and negative marks on credit ratings. It seems that the students were the victims of a dysfunctional system set up by greed to make money for investors. The Federal Government has allowed this to go on and it only seems to me that the investors and Goldman Sachs should bear some responsibility and pay back the Federal Government and tax payers money rather than claim it is the students fault as they are the victim of this system.
 
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I doubt this will happen, but IF the whole thing gets closed down and students are hung out to dry (100k+ in loans, no institution left to grant them a degree and stuck trying to start over elsewhere) I would seriously hope APA takes note.

Yes, APA accreditation is not about accounting (and shouldn't be). However, the fact that these campuses still have APA's seal of approval while this is going on is shameful. We have a bankrupt organization that appears to be <literally> stealing rent money from its students...and our major professional organization has not taken action. I'm not on all the various listservs...but has this even been acknowledged or discussed by APA leadership? I haven't heard a peep.

I can somewhat understand where you’re coming from, but students in this organization are going through enough, without having to worry about APA accreditation being pulled. The institute is financially irresponsible. That does not mean that the students going are not trained properly or to APA standards. Let’s not forget the students being dragged around by this issue, and what they need to continue on in their careers, given the amount of time and effort they’ve put in.
 
I can somewhat understand where you’re coming from, but students in this organization are going through enough, without having to worry about APA accreditation being pulled. The institute is financially irresponsible. That does not mean that the students going are not trained properly or to APA standards. Let’s not forget the students being dragged around by this issue, and what they need to continue on in their careers, given the amount of time and effort they’ve put in.
I don't disagree with your concern for the students, but is the traditional outcome one that is largely considered representative of the field or sub-par? (Hint, sub par). This doesn't make an easy case for what to do for the student but the issue becomes which should we weight more heavily, tbe students or their clients? Even on this forum the response about training from argosy clients suggests a substantial deficit and major room for concern when it comes to clinical practice.....
 
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I don't disagree with your concern for the students, but is the traditional outcome one that is largely considered representative of the field or sub-par? (Hint, sub par). This doesn't make an easy case for what to do for the student but the issue becomes which should we weight more heavily, tbe students or their clients? Even on this forum the response about training from argosy clients suggests a substantial deficit and major room for concern when it comes to clinical practice.....

I agree that if the question is training, APA needs to step in. But the issues going on, while absurd and ridiculous, do not *always* indicate or lead to poor/insufficiently trained psychologists. To lump financial issues with ability is where the issue seems to be. APA doesn’t give accreditation lightly, and it’s in place to prevent incompetent professionals in the field. To assume all students from one overarching program are lesser than or poorly trained due to behind-the-scenes business workings is improper logic. I think it’s safe to say there are those from even the most prestigious universities who are not benefiting their clients. The idea of accreditation is to guide universities in field-specific training, and that’s exactly what it does. Some do very well, and some eek through by the skin of their teeth. It’s not fair, but it doesn’t only happen at “lesser named” institutions or those badly handled from higher up management. Chastising students who are actually working their butts of for their degree in an APA accredited program, due to other factors completely outside of their control, isn’t the way to encourage caring and supportive future psychologists.
 
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I agree that if the question is training, APA needs to step in. But the issues going on, while absurd and ridiculous, do not *always* indicate or lead to poor/insufficiently trained psychologists. To lump financial issues with ability is where the issue seems to be. APA doesn’t give accreditation lightly, and it’s in place to prevent incompetent professionals in the field. To assume all students from one overarching program are lesser than or poorly trained due to behind-the-scenes business workings is improper logic. I think it’s safe to say there are those from even the most prestigious universities who are not benefiting their clients. The idea of accreditation is to guide universities in field-specific training, and that’s exactly what it does. Some do very well, and some eek through by the skin of their teeth. It’s not fair, but it doesn’t only happen at “lesser named” institutions or those badly handled from higher up management. Chastising students who are actually working their butts of for their degree in an APA accredited program, due to other factors completely outside of their control, isn’t the way to encourage caring and supportive future psychologists.
Based on some of the terrible programs that have APA accreditation, it sure does look like the APA gives out accreditation lightly. Joking aside, APA accreditation is not some kind of gold standard, it's a minimum bar. Thus, it's fallacious to argue that simply attending an APA accredited program means that students are being trained properly and/or that students with the aptitude to be psychologists are attending those programs (i.e., those poor quality, unfunded programs have poor quality control in admissions).

People here arguing that Argosy programs are bad are not doing so based on financial issues within those programs. Their arguments stem from the quantifiable outcome statistics (e.g., poor internship match and EPPP pass rates) and their own experiences with their graduates in the field. It's quite intellectually dishonest to argue that the existence of grads from "prestigious universities" who are poor clinicians means that we should not judge the graduates of Argosy and other poor quality programs. You're comparing outliers to modal outcomes. This is not to say that there are no very talented graduates from Argosy, but rather that they succeeded in spite of their institution and its training, not because of it. If I had to bet on who is better trained and who I would want to provide care for me or my family, I'll pick the graduate from the "prestigious university" over the Argosy grad any day of the week.

Finally, hard work does not mean that someone is qualified to be a psychologist or that they have been trained properly. A person can work incredibly hard and still be insufficiently prepared to be a psychologist.
 
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To assume all students from one overarching program are lesser than or poorly trained due to behind-the-scenes business workings is improper logic.

At face value, this makes sense. However, structural factors that are integral to the business model (eg, large cohort sizes, relaxed admission standards) also have an effect on student training and outcomes. In other words, it is precisely because of the business workings of Argosy's parent company that an education at Argosy looks different from an education at State U.

I'd love to see a remedy for these specific students that shifts the risk burden and pain points back to the DoE (that is, after they've gone after Argosy for every penny they can get back). If there's one thing more ill advised than spending a fortune on tuition at a mediocre program, it's lending someone the money to do so.
 
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I'd love to see a remedy for these specific students that shifts the risk burden and pain points back to the DoE (that is, after they've gone after Argosy for every penny they can get back). If there's one thing more ill advised than spending a fortune on tuition at a mediocre program, it's lending someone the money to do so.

Yeah, but they have covered themselves by making these loans non-dispersible in bankruptcy. Short of leaving the country, it is with you for life. I have a feeling is going to be a sad story for some argosy students and a caveat emptor lesson for everyone else. Maybe the courts will work something out in a decade or two.

The smart ones cash out of the pyramid scheme before it collapses and EDMC is smart.
 
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I can somewhat understand where you’re coming from, but students in this organization are going through enough, without having to worry about APA accreditation being pulled. The institute is financially irresponsible. That does not mean that the students going are not trained properly or to APA standards. Let’s not forget the students being dragged around by this issue, and what they need to continue on in their careers, given the amount of time and effort they’ve put in.

Oh I wasn't necessarily suggesting APA should immediately pull accreditation or anything like that - at least in the short term. Moreso that I think they bear some blame for accrediting these institutions in the first place and the responsible thing for them to do would be to step up. At the absolute barest minimum, I hope some backroom discussions are going on about how to make sure this sort of thing never happens again through a major overhaul of the accreditation process. Given APA loves issuing blanket "statements" about things of much less direct relevance to their role, it would be nice to see them step up, admit mistakes and offer some token support to those impacted - even if just in the form of a statement. I (personally) don't even expect I would agree with whatever statement or support they might offer. I just found it kinda gross our major professional organization appears to be ducking their heads. Which kinda confirms my beliefs about them.

As for the broader issue...many of us on this board have believed for years these institutions should never have been accredited in the first place. A lot of folks feel that way. Its part of why we're seeing other accreditation systems forming, because of APAs perpetual refusal to raise the bar. That doesn't mean all the students are incompetent - as with everything involving humans, we're dealing in distributions. However, virtually all evidence points to their training quality being...a bit of an outlier, shall we say. And this certainly relates to the financial issues. The exact circumstances may be a surprise, but I don't think anyone is shocked that <something like this> happened. It was just a matter of time. And I hope it causes APA to do some serious introspection about its processes and begin to change the way it does things. .
 
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Doesn't APA receive donations/money from many of these diploma mills?
Oh I wasn't necessarily suggesting APA should immediately pull accreditation or anything like that - at least in the short term. Moreso that I think they bear some blame for accrediting these institutions in the first place and the responsible thing for them to do would be to step up. At the absolute barest minimum, I hope some backroom discussions are going on about how to make sure this sort of thing never happens again through a major overhaul of the accreditation process. Given APA loves issuing blanket "statements" about things of much less direct relevance to their role, it would be nice to see them step up, admit mistakes and offer some token support to those impacted - even if just in the form of a statement. I (personally) don't even expect I would agree with whatever statement or support they might offer. I just found it kinda gross our major professional organization appears to be ducking their heads. Which kinda confirms my beliefs about them.

As for the broader issue...many of us on this board have believed for years these institutions should never have been accredited in the first place. A lot of folks feel that way. Its part of why we're seeing other accreditation systems forming, because of APAs perpetual refusal to raise the bar. That doesn't mean all the students are incompetent - as with everything involving humans, we're dealing in distributions. However, virtually all evidence points to their training quality being...a bit of an outlier, shall we say. And this certainly relates to the financial issues. The exact circumstances may be a surprise, but I don't think anyone is shocked that <something like this> happened. It was just a matter of time. And I hope it causes APA to do some serious introspection about its processes and begin to change the way it does things. .
 
Oh I wasn't necessarily suggesting APA should immediately pull accreditation or anything like that - at least in the short term. Moreso that I think they bear some blame for accrediting these institutions in the first place and the responsible thing for them to do would be to step up. At the absolute barest minimum, I hope some backroom discussions are going on about how to make sure this sort of thing never happens again through a major overhaul of the accreditation process. Given APA loves issuing blanket "statements" about things of much less direct relevance to their role, it would be nice to see them step up, admit mistakes and offer some token support to those impacted - even if just in the form of a statement. I (personally) don't even expect I would agree with whatever statement or support they might offer. I just found it kinda gross our major professional organization appears to be ducking their heads. Which kinda confirms my beliefs about them.

As for the broader issue...many of us on this board have believed for years these institutions should never have been accredited in the first place. A lot of folks feel that way. Its part of why we're seeing other accreditation systems forming, because of APAs perpetual refusal to raise the bar. That doesn't mean all the students are incompetent - as with everything involving humans, we're dealing in distributions. However, virtually all evidence points to their training quality being...a bit of an outlier, shall we say. And this certainly relates to the financial issues. The exact circumstances may be a surprise, but I don't think anyone is shocked that <something like this> happened. It was just a matter of time. And I hope it causes APA to do some serious introspection about its processes and begin to change the way it does things. .

I completely agree APA should have standards set high enough that this sort of thing (or poor training overall) does not occur. There will always be exceptions/outliers, and I think that goes toward the case of training students at institutions like Argosy; not all are great and not all are bad. Taking into consideration as well that the practical training experiences come from outside of Argosy (ie practica), “poor training” cannot necessarily be lumped in to the “Argosy” training argument. Here, as I said before and still believe, is where those hard working students receive dividends from their work. Classroom training isn’t the same as real life experience, and this is where the thought that this type of program just “pumps out incompetent psychologists” (as another poster stated) is unsupported (from my view).

For me, the bottom line issue here, which I think we agree on, is the fact the institution of Argosy/EDMC/Dream Center has been insufficiently run and business/money making was always their first thought, not education. I think this can be said for a lot of institutions; some (many lol) are just better at business than Argosy, so it doesn’t come to the same conclusion.

In the end, (again, most) Argosy students have committed as much time and energy as any other (that much APA assures, independent of the other issues of lackadaisical approach to addressing issues such as this) and should be given respect based on that fact. Judge the person on their work, not on the school they came from.

However I do agree APA needs to step up and engage in this conversation actively. Though you’re right that it’s unlikely and even if it did, we wouldn’t necessarily agree with their handling of the situation. Overall, this is just a bad situation for all involved. :-/
 
I completely agree APA should have standards set high enough that this sort of thing (or poor training overall) does not occur. There will always be exceptions/outliers, and I think that goes toward the case of training students at institutions like Argosy; not all are great and not all are bad. Taking into consideration as well that the practical training experiences come from outside of Argosy (ie practica), “poor training” cannot necessarily be lumped in to the “Argosy” training argument. Here, as I said before and still believe, is where those hard working students receive dividends from their work. Classroom training isn’t the same as real life experience, and this is where the thought that this type of program just “pumps out incompetent psychologists” (as another poster stated) is unsupported (from my view).

For me, the bottom line issue here, which I think we agree on, is the fact the institution of Argosy/EDMC/Dream Center has been insufficiently run and business/money making was always their first thought, not education. I think this can be said for a lot of institutions; some (many lol) are just better at business than Argosy, so it doesn’t come to the same conclusion.

In the end, (again, most) Argosy students have committed as much time and energy as any other (that much APA assures, independent of the other issues of lackadaisical approach to addressing issues such as this) and should be given respect based on that fact. Judge the person on their work, not on the school they came from.

However I do agree APA needs to step up and engage in this conversation actively. Though you’re right that it’s unlikely and even if it did, we wouldn’t necessarily agree with their handling of the situation. Overall, this is just a bad situation for all involved. :-/

Where I disagree is that outside training in practica cannot be blamed on Argosy. My program had 10 people and all the practica choices were pre-arranged with supervisors familiar to the DCT (often former grads) and students were matched to practica based on interests as closely as possible. There were often more practica choices than students. I doubt Argosy had this kind of quality control or personalized matching due to their size. Their size was due to their financial goals. Add that to students that may have had less experience in the first place and what happens? It is not just about students not working hard or having motivation. Some just won't know what they never got.
 
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Doesn't APA receive donations/money from many of these diploma mills?

Yup. Convention sponsorship. Gross.

I completely agree APA should have standards set high enough that this sort of thing (or poor training overall) does not occur. There will always be exceptions/outliers, and I think that goes toward the case of training students at institutions like Argosy; not all are great and not all are bad. Taking into consideration as well that the practical training experiences come from outside of Argosy (ie practica), “poor training” cannot necessarily be lumped in to the “Argosy” training argument. Here, as I said before and still believe, is where those hard working students receive dividends from their work. Classroom training isn’t the same as real life experience, and this is where the thought that this type of program just “pumps out incompetent psychologists” (as another poster stated) is unsupported (from my view).

For me, the bottom line issue here, which I think we agree on, is the fact the institution of Argosy/EDMC/Dream Center has been insufficiently run and business/money making was always their first thought, not education. I think this can be said for a lot of institutions; some (many lol) are just better at business than Argosy, so it doesn’t come to the same conclusion.

In the end, (again, most) Argosy students have committed as much time and energy as any other (that much APA assures, independent of the other issues of lackadaisical approach to addressing issues such as this) and should be given respect based on that fact. Judge the person on their work, not on the school they came from.

However I do agree APA needs to step up and engage in this conversation actively. Though you’re right that it’s unlikely and even if it did, we wouldn’t necessarily agree with their handling of the situation. Overall, this is just a bad situation for all involved. :-/

Trying not to get pulled too far into a tangent on the broader issue of professional school training, which I actually view as somewhat tangential to the thread. However, I will say that I strongly disagree with many of your arguments regarding the schools. Sanman hits on one point RE: the issue of practicums. There are many others. I think it is a dangerous argument that as long as <some> graduates are competent, they should be allowed to continue - which unless I'm misunderstanding is what you are suggesting. Again, averages. My experience and that of many others has been that the average Argosy graduate has received mediocre-to-bad clinical training and their research training upon graduation is often below what would even be expected for admission to a university program. Are there exceptions? Sure. Are there bad graduates from schools I do respect? Of course. Are the distributions different? Wildly different based on everything I've seen. And from what I have seen of their curriculum and heard from their graduates...<maybe> equal time, but I disagree that their students have put in as much energy as university graduates. PsyD graduates average fewer clinical hours than PhD graduates and professional schools (which admittedly includes many besides just Argosy, though they are the prototype) unquestionably drive the bulk of that statistic just through sheer numbers. The dissertations at these institutions are laughable and many would not be acceptable for a master's degree or possibly even an undergrad honor's project at most traditional programs. Its tougher to assess the coursework directly, but in talking with graduates it certainly appears to have been less rigorous. Practica seem hit or miss - largely because of the need to accommodate enormous numbers of students. And we have literally dozens of threads about students wanting to attend because of either convenience or because they lack the qualifications to get into a university program...so there is a problem on the front end too. In the end, in my eyes its simply a lesser degree. I will still try to judge an individual on their work and not their training. I view their grads in much the same light of a master's level counselor/clinical social worker because I genuinely believe their degrees to basically be mislabeled and their training far closer to these degrees than a proper psychology doctorate. There are plenty of master's level folks I have enormous respect for...but I am usually a bit more skeptical at first.

Anyways, we could discuss that issue for days but there are already 200+ threads on the board questioning the training these institutions provide based on both anecdotes, actual outcome data for their graduates, and other considerations. Pay more. Get less. Now perhaps...get nothing at all besides 200k loans with nothing to show for it. I don't like the schools, but empathize with the students. Its an awful situation. Even when I advise against attending programs like that...it is now potentially headed towards an even worse outcome than I would have envisioned.
 
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I know some programs are receiving multiple emails from Argosy students inquiring about whether they consider transfer students outside of the traditional application process. Looks like some are starting to look into their options for next year.
 
What a train wreck. I feel really bad for the students. I’m glad they’re not going to be able to exploit any more people in the future though.
 
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What a train wreck. I feel really bad for the students. I’m glad they’re not going to be able to exploit any more people in the future though.
The question becomes 'should potential for exploitation be a criteria for accreditation / consideration as a legitimate training program' . To me the answer is clear, but it's pretty silent about this major occurrence everywhere I can see.
 
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The question becomes 'should potential for exploitation be a criteria for accreditation / consideration as a legitimate training program' . To me the answer is clear, but it's pretty silent about this major occurrence everywhere I can see.

It’s a major discussion amongst training directors. I’d like to hear APA be more vocal about it.
 
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Another article
Education Department boots Argosy campuses from federal student aid program

Department officials also found Argosy had been locked out of its Phoenix location and was holding classes at an unauthorized location. And Dottore, the receiver, had terminated Argosy's chancellor and almost 100 faculty and staff members despite assuring the department that step would not be taken.

That process was so disruptive, department officials wrote, "that professors were called out of classrooms while they were teaching and their employment terminated."
 
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It’s a major discussion amongst training directors. I’d like to hear APA be more vocal about it.
Good to hear. I was talking to a training director this morning about this and they noted they hadn't seen it being discussed on the listserv. Where are you seeing those conversations pop up?







On a related note, does national conference sponsorship still hold up in the company is bankrupt? Asking for a friend...
 
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Well, I imagine that this is going to a mess at a lot of training sites as well. I'm curious to see the responses of placements left high and dry without students to do the work at training sites. I think we have an Argosy student placed somewhere at my VA. Can't recall though.
 
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Good to hear. I was talking to a training director this morning about this and they noted they hadn't seen it being discussed on the listserv. Where are you seeing those conversations pop up?







On a related note, does national conference sponsorship still hold up in the company is bankrupt? Asking for a friend...

On the UCC training director listserv.
 
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I wish this happened 20 years ago, but it needed to happen. Hopefully the effected students can get sorted and have CSPP and Alliant campuses go next.


What happens when the effected students get sorted at CSPP or Alliant and those campuses go? They are the only ones that MIGHT be able to accommodate the volume of students from Argosy. Really, let them go and take the loan forgiveness/cancellation option that they have. It will balance out internship and post-doc issues present.
 
What happens when the effected students get sorted at CSPP or Alliant and those campuses go? They are the only ones that MIGHT be able to accommodate the volume of students from Argosy. Really, let them go and take the loan forgiveness/cancellation option that they have. It will balance out internship and post-doc issues present.

I guess the was thinking the students would get their loans forgiven and they would have to re-apply to programs. I figure some would/could look at mid-level options too. There is money to be made, so I guess CSPP et al. would want in on that.
 
I guess the was thinking the students would get their loans forgiven and they would have to re-apply to programs. I figure some would/could look at mid-level options too. There is money to be made, so I guess CSPP et al. would want in on that.
I'm sure some will opt to have loans forgiven and do something else. However, there is a business case to be made for the other for profits allowing transfers with partial credit. Soak the students for an extra year of tuition that way and cash in on the hole in the market.
 
So what happens to the students who might have matched this year for an internship next year, if their campus closes? Damn. Hot. Mess. Express.
 
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So what happens to the students who might have matched this year for an internship next year, if their campus closes? Damn. Hot. Mess. Express.

That’s part of the unknown. Also unknown is what happens to the students on internship this year who haven’t yet finished their dissertation.
 
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